Bluelight

  • Bluelight: We are not about 'sourcing drugs'

    The Journal of Substance Use recently published a paper which represented the international harm reduction community Bluelight.org as a website used for sourcing drugs.

    Yet this article’s conclusions were based only on two case studies, with no attempt to review the existing literature regarding Bluelight. Many in this community would be aware of these studies which show that most people come here to learn how to use drugs more safely, that our members actively disseminate information to warn people of highly dangerous adulterated drugs, and that we regularly collaborate with researchers to provide a leading-edge source of data for monitoring new drug trends. Bluelight is regularly cited as a valued source of harm reduction information for people who use drugs.

    Bluelight goes to great lengths to avoid hosting discussions about drug sources. Moderators delete all discussions that could be related to sourcing drugs as quickly as they can.

    Our response to this journal article has recently been published in the Journal of Substance Use.

    We would like to remind all our members that sourcing discussion is strictly prohibited, as per our User Agreement.

    We would also like to address all journalists, researchers and others who may wish to write about Bluelight or are considering utilizing Bluelight content. We are excited that you are interested in what we do. We respectfully request that you contact us directly to get our perspective if you are writing about us. We also direct you to our User Agreement which also governs your use of our website. Importantly, you are not permitted to re-purpose or re-use our content. Please contact us to discuss your proposal or project.
    Comments 31 Comments
    1. RDP89's Avatar
      RDP89 -
      Wow, that's messed up. At least they published Bluelight's response, but you would think they would do more research before misrepresenting the community like that.
    1. Whosajiggawaaa's Avatar
      Whosajiggawaaa -
      This is unfortunate. BL provides a lot of HR all day every day, one just needs to browse through "Other Drugs" or "Basic Drug Discussion" to see this on any given day really.

      Bluelight exemplifies the epitome of the harm reduction philosophy. To couch Bluelight as a place for sourcing drugs and overlook all the HR contributions would be a travesty, anyone who's even browsed (let alone posted) on the site for a few days would know that sourcing is strictly prohibited.
    1. TheBlackPirate's Avatar
      TheBlackPirate -
      That quantity of misinformation results in people being fired.
    1. Tranced's Avatar
      Tranced -
      I, along with many, many others, contribute information on a near daily basis which would otherwise (if not contributed), result in people getting hurt/dying.

      Taking psychoactive chemicals is dangerous. It is markedly less dangerous if people know what they are doing. Bluelight takes on the role of providing this information.
    1. YellowNikes's Avatar
      YellowNikes -
      That is messed up. Blue light has never helped me source drugs but has definitely given me priceless information and advice that has helped me avoid harm and has probably saved my life.
    1. poodle448's Avatar
      poodle448 -
      I've been on blue light for years. Back when I first started trying new drugs, I would always read about it on Erowid, then head over here to find out as much information about the drug and how to stay safe in any way while taking the drug; I constantly am on blue light looking at new threads. Numerous times a day, for the last six months and I cannot say I have ever seen a single sourcing thread pop up.
    1. Tronica's Avatar
      Tronica -
      It's great to see everyone's support for our community here in the comments. I don't yet know whether the researchers will 'reply' to the letter to the editor... perhaps they will. My sense is that researchers and others don't expect Bluelight to have its own voice in these debates. But we are monitoring how Bluelight is described and discussed and we will do our best to set things right!
    1. andyturbo's Avatar
      andyturbo -
      For such a large international community, i am discusted too see such ammature journalism. From a legal perspective (this will vary slightly depending on ones country) This would be sufficient grounds for a civil case against the publisher. For the followingreason. Upon joining the bluelight community a condition of agreement (guideline) that is bound too you from day one of your membership is a section specificly and clearly acknowledging that no members are permitted in any way shape or form (including private messages) to sell or source drugs (including referencing to any websites)

      Under Australian law, there have been two sperate civil laws that have been infringed from that publication. Im sure most of the bluelight community would agree to not bother and let it go. Howeever my point is the jouralist should know this and i suggest they or any others following the advice from above posters and think about use of wording next.

      That is for your own protection (we're a harm reduction forum so beside the fact it has false and negative aspect towards us, its still out of good nature and harm redcution concept to remind and/or inform you in hope it may save something similar occuring in the future where the comunity arnt as good natured as we are.

      A.T
    1. Pibolar's Avatar
      Pibolar -
      Bluelight helps many people (both users and non-users) on a daily basis; and on many occasions, readily discourages hard drug use for the sake of safety. It provides harm reduction for those who seek it; it's filled with very helpful information that hundreds of people read everyday. It has been of much help to me and I have learned a lot from it. It's a shame someone wasted their time twisting the intentions of this website.

      On the plus side, hardly anyone will read that pointless article.
    1. Ksa's Avatar
      Ksa -
      I need to remind the author of that article that every single allegation made against Bluelight is against the rules of Bluelight. Some members may do it but it is not allowed, and if they are caught, they are banned. In that sense, Bluelight is no different from any other forum. So I invite the author to read the rules of this website, before making such allegations. The truth is, our web site makes drug use safer. People who use this site as a source of information have decreased rates for overdose and other drug related health problems, lowering costs to society. That article is a direct attack against access to information, aimed to obscure drug use by:

      - By continuing to declare that drugs are dangerous by nature, and not due to the drug users' lack of a safe modus operandi. When this website provides a safe modus operandi, it invalidates their argument.
      - By undermining the exchange of information between those who know and those who don't, so that those who don't end up hurting themselves, and validate the above argument that drugs are dangerous by nature.
      - By picking black sheep from our community and publicly portraying them as model examples of Bluelight users. We are aware of this strategy you are using and we will make sure that your efforts will never amount to anything.

      The true value of this website is given by members like myself and 100s other users and moderators, who can combine:

      - extensive university studies in science, chemistry, biochemistry, pharmacy and other drug related disciplines to:
      - extensive Internet research on how drugs interact with the human body, to:
      - personal drug use (legal, prescribed medication) and safe modus operandi development that for some of us is measured in decades, to:
      - a will to help others and become an invaluable, life saving resource;

      A normal person with a slight bias against drug users may think "Wait, so these drug addicts can just access this website where experts teach them how to take drugs and not die or become ill?! That's encouragement!" I agree with them when they say that, making someone's drug use safe with the help of experts on this site, might encourage their habit, but I need to remind them, that:

      1) An encouraged drug habit is a far better sentence than death.
      2) An encouraged drug habit bearing no health consequences is far less costly to society than having an increased waiting list on liver transplants, kidney transplants and other health related issues.

      While there is a strong social ambition to maintain the opinion that drugs are dangerous by nature, and whoever touches drugs is doomed, whoever he might be, the truth and absolute truth is that:

      1) Death or physical harm due to drug use is entirely avoidable through access to information via the Internet.
      2) Only a negligible minority of well informed drug users die due to drug use. Their deaths can be explained by the dangerous nature of drugs, as inattention and mis-calculation can occur despite any knowledge or safety measures.
      3) The vast majority of deaths cannot however be attributed to the dangerous nature of drugs, but to lack of information, lack of a safe modus operandi, the absence of resources or support and jail sentences.
      4) There are endless documented cases where members of this website became productive members of society, after coming here in a dysfunctional state, and being set on the right tracks by our hard-working team.

      To conclude, the author's alleged use of this website is in violation of the rules of the website itself, and all result in a permanent ban.
    1. CfZrx's Avatar
      CfZrx -
      The minute someone sources, they get reprimanded. Sourcing is the fastest way to get banned. That, and posting triggering content in The Dark Side.
    1. schnapple's Avatar
      schnapple -
      Disgusting. Not only from the journalistic perspective that should make them embarrassed, but more importantly to bluelighters for their stab at one of the pillars of accessible harm reduction information. This site provided me with the information that made me toss out the idea of doing a giant Hollywood line the first time I tried white, that let me I.D. an NBOME tab sold as LSD, that told me to remove the tourniquet before slamming the plunger. Without BL I would have found and done the exact same drugs. It just would have hurt me so much more.

      It's bad enough half the universe thinks information that makes users less likely to kill themselves encourages use, as if making use as dangerous as possible will suddenly make me stop, or would've prevented me from trying. To now say it's fuelling the spread of drugs... Makes me sick. BL saves lives.
    1. yepyepwoah's Avatar
      yepyepwoah -
      There is a good chance I would have died over the last twelve years without the information found on Bluelight.
      Shame on journalist with agendas who tell lies.
    1. spacejunk's Avatar
      spacejunk -
      Not a journalist, so much as a researcher.
      I don't think any malice was intended towards Bluelight - it was a matter of not fact-checking the results of their research interviews, and taking people's reports of online drug-seeking at face value.
    1. Gretch12's Avatar
      Gretch12 -
      I'm new here it has helped me to not shoot dangerous substances thank you bluelight
    1. andyturbo's Avatar
      andyturbo -
      Quote Originally Posted by spacejunk View Post
      Not a journalist, so much as a researcher.
      I don't think any malice was intended towards Bluelight - it was a matter of not fact-checking the results of their research interviews, and taking people's reports of online drug-seeking at face value.
      Professional Neglect at lowest.
    1. FuckinAcidMan's Avatar
      FuckinAcidMan -
      Shitty journalism is shitty, this doesn't surprise me especially something that's looking for targets like the Journal of Substance Abuse.
    1. spacefacethebassace's Avatar
      spacefacethebassace -
      If you read the abstract referred to in the link, the paper doesn't really suggest that Bluelight is involved in sourcing at all. The authors report on two cases wherein Craigslist was used as a platform for the marketing and sale of heroin. In the first case they report that Bluelight was referred to in some of these Craigslist ads as having information regarding the location of open air drug markets in NYC. I'm assuming dealers were using the ads to indirectly notify people of their general location so as to drum up business. And it's true that occasionally the location of open air drug markets is discernible from BL posts that do not apparently violate the User Agreement. In those threads, the mods do remove overly specific geographic references as violating the anti-sourcing rules, but a general overview can still be gleaned.

      I'll admit that the authors' treatment of Bluelight seems unfair, but if you read the summary, it's the patient that implicated Bluelight as a tool used by Craigslist posters.
    1. Tronica's Avatar
      Tronica -
      Quote Originally Posted by spacefacethebassace View Post
      If you read the abstract referred to in the link, the paper doesn't really suggest that Bluelight is involved in sourcing at all. The authors report on two cases wherein Craigslist was used as a platform for the marketing and sale of heroin. In the first case they report that Bluelight was referred to in some of these Craigslist ads as having information regarding the location of open air drug markets in NYC. I'm assuming dealers were using the ads to indirectly notify people of their general location so as to drum up business. And it's true that occasionally the location of open air drug markets is discernible from BL posts that do not apparently violate the User Agreement. In those threads, the mods do remove overly specific geographic references as violating the anti-sourcing rules, but a general overview can still be gleaned.

      I'll admit that the authors' treatment of Bluelight seems unfair, but if you read the summary, it's the patient that implicated Bluelight as a tool used by Craigslist posters.
      Not quite. The authors of the paper in the main article do refer to Bluelight as a site for sourcing drugs. They report data from an interview with a patient who reports using Bluelight to find out about open air markets in his local area, which helps him to go and find drugs. I am not accusing the authors of this research of fabricating data, and I imagine that this sort of thing does occur on Bluelight occasionally. But, it's important to give balance, and in this case, we have strong anti-sourcing policies and we do the best possible to avoid publishing information of this kind. We are not perfect but we should be represented in a balanced way, and that was not done by these researchers, likely simply due to ignorance rather than any malicious intent.

      If anyone wants to read the full text of the article, PM me and I'll send it to you!
    1. wayoutofdarkness's Avatar
      wayoutofdarkness -
      I got an "infraction" today for asking about legit websites to find a legal substance. So if I ask for recommendations about coffee shops if I'm visiting Seattle, am I going to get kicked off because the implication that I am seeking CAFFEINE, an often overused and abused CNS stimulant? Go ahead and banish me from posting. No loss here.