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Thread: Amphetamine Potentiation

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    Amphetamine Potentiation and Or Interactions 
    #1
    Capsule
    I have a couple of questions for the general Bluelight public, and would appreciate any advice/answers anyone has.

    1) What is the easiest way to prolong the half life of amphetamines?
    2) Is Orange Juice (and other products with citric acid) actually sufficiently
    acidic to interfere with amphetamine absorption/excretion?
    3) What potential interactions/synergy/paradoxical reactions are possible from a combination of:

    20 mg. Amphetamine/Dextro-amphetamine mix (Generic Adderall)
    400 mg. Wellbutrin (Bupropion SR)
    100 mg. 5HTP
    150 mg. Effexor XR


    Looking foreword to hearing from you guys.

    Thanks!
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    #2
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    at first I was gonna point out that 5-htp wouldn't effect amphetamine too much as amp tends to work on the dopamine system rather than the serotonin, which is what 5-htp supplements, however on a search I found the 5-htp wikipedia article stating this :

    "Reductions in serotonergic tone are partially responsible for cognitive deficits (memory loss) resulting from tetrahydrocannibinol (THC, the active component in marijuana). Similar deficits have been observed in long term/high dose psychostimulant users. Such deficits are especially apparent in those who have used amphetamine and methamphetamine. Amphetamines and to a lesser extent, cocaine, can damage serotonergic neurons in the CNS. When given to rats, 5-HTP can significantly attenuate THC-induced memory impairment. Similar benefits have been seen in those with cognitive deficits resulting from psychostimulant use. "

    the wording is a bit strange and I cant tell for sure if it means only thc+amphetamines or thc as well as amphetamines (sounds like the latter), but it seems like supplementing later may help some after effects on the memory?

    if anyone knows more about this I'd be curious (as an occasional amphetamine user)

    anyway to do my best at answering your questions

    1. you could try getting an RX or taking smaller doses and spanning them out, but as far as I'm aware your body will break things down at its own rate and theres not much you can do to change the half life...
    2. ADD forums has a thread on avoiding all acidity in foods and everyone in that thread seemed to have their medication work better, at the same time however I've had orange juice + milk (both acidic) for breakfast, took some amp straight after and didn't notice much difference in the high.. I'm thinking there is probably a minor difference noticeable more likely by people who are taking a regimented dose to keep from WDs etc than by recreational users...
    3. I dunno about wellbutrin or effexor as I've never had the pleasure, however 5-htp while on amphetamine in doses not too huge would probably make things happier while high as you'd be filling your serotonin up (same goes for sober use), but it shouldn't change the effects too drastically and you'll likely be more tired but probably less edgy when you come down from the amp (I'll often take it just before it wears off for sleep and end up getting effects like that)

    also, I read a study where ginkgo biloba will prevent some neurotoxicity caused by oxidization in amphetamine use, and apparently magnesium slows down tolerance and some toxicity as well (I'll always take both just to be on the safe side ) so you might wanna grab some of each if you're going to be using more than once or twice

    anyway, I hope this helps to some extent or another and maybe others can fill in what I left out (if its not answered elsewhere on the forums). Good luck and have fun
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    #3
    More Adderall potentiates amphetamines very well!
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    #4
    Quote Originally Posted by prurigro
    "Reductions in serotonergic tone are partially responsible for cognitive deficits (memory loss) resulting from tetrahydrocannibinol (THC, the active component in marijuana). Similar deficits have been observed in long term/high dose psychostimulant users. Such deficits are especially apparent in those who have used amphetamine and methamphetamine. Amphetamines and to a lesser extent, cocaine, can damage serotonergic neurons in the CNS. When given to rats, 5-HTP can significantly attenuate THC-induced memory impairment. Similar benefits have been seen in those with cognitive deficits resulting from psychostimulant use. "

    the wording is a bit strange and I cant tell for sure if it means only thc+amphetamines or thc as well as amphetamines (sounds like the latter), but it seems like supplementing later may help some after effects on the memory?
    It's saying that memory loss caused by THC use is also seen in long term amphetamine use. Also, that 5-htp helps with memory impairment caused by THC as well as amphetamines.
    Last edited by daily_amphetamine; 29-01-2007 at 03:49. Reason: wanted to add another point
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    #5
    You got it the wrong way round, taking amphetamines with acidic substances will decrease the half life. If you want to extend it then you need to take it with a base, like baking soda. If you basify your urine it makes it more difficult for your kidneys to excrete the amphetamines from your blood into your urine, so the amphetamines stay in your blood longer.

    I read that in my pharmacology textbook when i was at uni and was skeptical it would actually work. So mixed 3 teaspoons of baking soda into a glass of water, drank it down and then smoked 50mg of meth.

    10 minutes later i was feeling kinda sick, went and spewed up a bunch of white foam, and was like crap i spewed up all the baking soda. But obviously had absorbed enough cos 11 hours later i was still half wired off the meth, when normally it wouldn't have lasted longer than 3-4 hours. So i would agree that this method works.
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    #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by daily_amphetamine
    It's saying that memory loss caused by THC use is also seen in long term amphetamine use. Also, that 5-htp helps with memory impairment caused by THC as well as amphetamines.
    ahh, kk thats sorta what I thought it was saying (otherwise I wouldn't have posted) but wasn't sure, thanks -- very interesting tho, I wonder to what extent you should be using 5-htp for amphetamine related memory loss- tho honestly I wasn't aware of a memory loss from them to start with, perhaps down the road 5-htp will be more beneficial than it is now... anyone have any idea if it would be protecting damage to preload in the same way it does for mdma?

    btw, I hope this isn't hijacking the thread- it seems mostly on topic as far as combining 5-htp goes...
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    #7
    Thanks for all the great answer's guys. Concerning the Adderall, I do have a prescription however and take it correctly, but I find that the Immediate Release preparation is too short acting. 10 mg. twice a day is my current dosage. I've tried splitting the dose up into multiple 5 mg. doses , but I find that this dosing is simply too low to be effective. The reason I asked the potentiation questions are because I don't want to look like I am seeking drugs to my Dr. I am currently being treated for alcoholism and polydrug abuse, so I got lucky getting an Adderall prescription AT ALL. I do not abuse it, but I feel as if I complained than it would look awful. I tried the XL and I felt as if I had taken nothing. Tough Situation, however thank you for the good advice guys.
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    #8
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    why not try an XR, the amphetamine mix for me does bad things, but if you find adderall works, then note that I took one XR at 7 in the morning after a breakfast of orange juice and milk and I was still wired at 10pm-- it just goes and goes (another reason I didn't like adderall)

    anyway, the reason I'm bringing this thread back up is because I tried the 5-htp-amphetamine combo (amp being dex here) and the acid/base test after getting curious (had to wait till I needed to study to try it)-- in the morning I took amphetamine with milk and orange juice (both acidic) in large quantities and I noticed a significant drop in effectiveness compared to usual- I was stimulated, but it felt like a lower dose than I had taken and I was still unfocused in work- half way through the morning I took a 5-htp. in the afternoon after the first dose had worn off I took a second with a glass of baking soda (yuck!) and my god the effects were amazing, I was doing work like crazy and felt amazing (but not in the way where I couldn't focus)... so in large quantities of both it seems like acid and bases may have some effect (tho its impossible to tell for sure since this was all done in one day.. but try it to see for yourself)-- the 5-htp didn't seem to do much for most of the day, but near the end of the second dose I started getting mild hallucinations and a very abstract psychedelic almost state of thinking- without so much insanity, this lasted all through the comedown and stopped around when I started feeling sober- it was very enjoyable and I've never had this before (comedown for me is usually just an enjoyable relaxed feeling, which I got along side of this)

    anyway, 5-htp does seem like it might bring out some interesting aspects of amphetamine (could it act on the serotonin system mildly? it is a phenethylamine afterall), tho this is one case and you cant know for sure until the experiment is repeated by different people and in different circumstances right.

    As for the acid/base thing, I'd say definitely give it a go- I hope it works out for you so you dont have to make your doctor uncomfortable

    good luck
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    #9
    same. i take 5htp and amphetamine and i've heard that 5htp makes amphetamine weaker and i beg to differ. when i mix the two the euphoria is much more intense and my focus is as well...i don't feel as jittery but all around it makes amphetamine feel more comfortable. amphetamine does have mild serotonin releasing effects and i can guess 5htp would encourage this to a certain degree
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    #10
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    All I know is that Lithium Carbonate reduces the effects of amphetamines. I actually got off it so I could speed faster and roll harder.
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    #11
    Quote Originally Posted by bluecloudsky4
    I have a couple of questions for the general Bluelight public, and would appreciate any advice/answers anyone has.

    1) What is the easiest way to prolong the half life of amphetamines?
    2) Is Orange Juice (and other products with citric acid) actually sufficiently
    acidic to interfere with amphetamine absorption/excretion?
    3) What potential interactions/synergy/paradoxical reactions are possible from a combination of:

    20 mg. Amphetamine/Dextro-amphetamine mix (Generic Adderall)
    400 mg. Wellbutrin (Bupropion SR)
    100 mg. 5HTP
    150 mg. Effexor XR


    Looking foreword to hearing from you guys.

    Thanks!
    sorry i haven't any tips on potentiating amphetamines, but i can tell you that taking 5-htp and effexor at the same time is contraindicated. taking both could lead to serotonin syndrome, an unpleasant and sometimes fatal condition.
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    #12
    Question
    Now, reading all this, I wonder if the pH of the water used to solute the amphetamines for injection have any effect on the err.. effect?
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    #13
    What would you guys estimate to be the largest, yet still safe, amount of baking soda to consume over the period of a couple of days?

    I have 2 tests in about 40 hours, and I'm going to be using Ritalin SR to help me study. I don't have as much as I'd like to, so I'm going to swallow a tablespoon of baking soda and then pop the first Ritalin SR about 45 minutes later.

    Assuming I will be awake and studying on Ritalin SR for most of the time, how much and how often should I consume more baking soda to keep the potentiation going? I'll probably be redosing the Ritalin SR about every 6-8 hours. Can/should I consume baking soda before every redose? How much baking soda can I safely ingest in the 40 hour timespan.
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    #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluecloudsky4 View Post
    I have a couple of questions for the general Bluelight public, and would appreciate any advice/answers anyone has.

    1) What is the easiest way to prolong the half life of amphetamines?
    2) Is Orange Juice (and other products with citric acid) actually sufficiently
    acidic to interfere with amphetamine absorption/excretion?
    3) What potential interactions/synergy/paradoxical reactions are possible from a combination of:

    20 mg. Amphetamine/Dextro-amphetamine mix (Generic Adderall)
    400 mg. Wellbutrin (Bupropion SR)
    100 mg. 5HTP
    150 mg. Effexor XR

    1. Urinary-alkalizing agent such as furosemide in combination with 1-2 tbsps of sodium bicarbonate with a lot of water [until you burst literally] and around 500-1000mg magnesium oxide.
    2. Yes.
    3. High blood pressure and Serotonin syndrome, do not expect otherwise. Paradoxic reaction can be hunger, enjoyment of nicotine, craving for caffeine, and clear judgment.
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    #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by prurigro View Post
    I've had orange juice + milk (both acidic)

    acidic milk?


    what country is this in?
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    #16
    Quote Originally Posted by 66z View Post
    Now, reading all this, I wonder if the pH of the water used to solute the amphetamines for injection have any effect on the err.. effect?
    i shoot methamphetamine and have never noticed a difference between saline solution or boiled tap water.
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    #17
    same here, whether I use various mineral water, water from tap or sterile water for injections.. not a noticeable difference of the high however I'm kinda interested what goes on in the blood and body
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    #18
    Sorry to bring this old thread back up, but I wanted to let everyone know that fluoxetine injection 20mg during amp (adderall) comedown kicked me right back up, even felt like i was rolling.
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    It's good to take an interest 
    #19
    -In neurology, however it is not a subject which you should act on if your only source is the internet, based on a few studies looking at very specific things. Keep in mind in vitro and in vivo results can contradict each other. I wouldn't personally take that combination of drugs. Just review the Effexor website list of warnings to start. Yes we should be educated as to what the drugs we take do, but that does not by any means give us all the adequate knowledge to start mixing concoctions as no one really knows about your specific diet, health, medical conditions etc. Serotonin does not have a specific function wherein an increase in all levels of serotonin is a beneficial thing. One of Effexors actions is as a serotonin re-uptake inhibitor, serotonin does not degrade as quickly as other neurotransmitters and supplementing with a serotonin precursor could possibly induce the sometimes fatal serotonin shock syndrome. Serotonin neurons are diverse some act as inhibitors to other neurotransmitters or modulate their activity, some are inhibitory. There is no such thing as the serotonin paradigm wherein an increase will mean x and decrease mean y in all cases. I suggest to start learning the roles of all the neurotransmitters, how they interact, what the LD50 means and what the IC50 stands for. Most drugs do not have a single mechanism of action and affect more than one system as well as have break down products which has still further effects. The question you are asking is horribly complex and should not be left to neurology hobbyists like myself. Wikipedia is a good introduction to start research to get a feel and your local library is bound to have books in this subject, maybe not this specific question, but the tools for a better understanding. If you find you are scrolling down to see the results of a online research paper, you are on the wrong path. The best way to make amphetamines more effective is to take regular breaks. Vitamin C does decrease intestinal absorption of amphetamines. Tums increases absorption, however at least from anecdotal stories this does not increase effectiveness. Wellbutrin is in the same family called phenylethylamines as amphetamines it differs form methamphetamine by an oxygen and two methyl groups. Ephedrine differs from amphetamine by a single oxygen double bonded to the carbon ring. So while Wellbutrin may share some characteristics, chemicals can be vastly different with the addition of a single atom. Wellbutrin in studies for ADHD scored on par with amphetamines. I suppose they could be synergistic but I'm not sure if it is a good combination as Wellbutrin can also cause heart arrhythmia and has a high rate of seizure incidence I think 1 in 1000, which is relatively high, mostly effecting people prone to seizures, point being for all I know they could be synergistic in that way. Some people see no problem with mixing alcohol and amphetamines, however I'm guessing that the over worked dopamine neurons combined with the oxygen depleted areas of the pre-frontal cortex is a very bad combination and could cause even worse memory impairments than either abused alone. I'll try to clarify any questions and am an expert by no means.
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    #20
    Quote Originally Posted by futurama140 View Post
    Sorry to bring this old thread back up, but I wanted to let everyone know that fluoxetine injection 20mg during amp (adderall) comedown kicked me right back up, even felt like i was rolling.
    yeah, fluoxetine inhibits the CYP2D6 liver enzymes and somehow allows more absorption of the drug, i'm not an expert at this kind of thing but yeah i read this today while looking for ways to potentiate adderall.

    just out of curiosity, what gave you the idea to shoot up prozac?
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