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Thread: The Big & Dandy Non-LSD Ergoloids Blotter Thread

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    what im tryna say is i have an intuition that when synthesising LSD through different routes and methods with different raw materials and different equipment in different atmospheric conditions (temperature, light quantity, humidity) you can get different byproducts which can contribute to the feel of the experience
    Last edited by huolesoh; 07-06-2011 at 18:43.
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    Bluelighter
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    That's inexcusable that you had to do 20. Insane even. Who with any ethics sells blotter so damn weak that you need 20 for a proper trip? Sad, but I guess with the economy as it is merchants are going to tend to be stingy.
    Yeah, it's fucked up how expensive it is now...and almost nothing on paper is laid over 100mcg anymore...
    I wouldn't describe the 20 hit experience as completely mind blowing, I still had a pretty clear vision of my surroundings and a decent enough logical mind to not do something stupid
    To me, that sounds like some really weak paper.
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    I'd actually say with regards to paper and dosage that things haven't been too bad lately. Around 4 years ago there was some real good strong 150ug blotter circulating, then over the next 3 years or so it became standard 60-90ug doses per blotter, but lately we are back to the good old 150-200ug doses.
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    Quote Originally Posted by huolesoh View Post
    what im tryna say is i have an intuition that when synthesising LSD through different routes and methods with different raw materials and different equipment in different atmospheric conditions (temperature, light quantity, humidity) you can get different byproducts which can contribute to the feel of the experience
    Some people may agree with that, but i have my doubts. There are pretty limited likely synthesis routes for clandestine laboratories, and all of the isomers of LSD have been tested in man in doses far exceeding what would be contained in a dose (or an obscene amount of doses even), and they were all found to be inactive. And lastly, if there were a byproduct that was active, and the LSD was >50% pure, the active byproduct would have to be substantially more potent than LSD, which i'd think unlikely. Even more unlikely that we still wouldn't know about it.
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    Bluelighter DwayneHoover's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by any major dude View Post
    all of the isomers of LSD have been tested in man in doses far exceeding what would be contained in a dose (or an obscene amount of doses even), and they were all found to be inactive. .
    Um... what about the post that started this topic? That referenced published research papers about LSD-related compounds that ARE active at blotter-able doses. So that proves it is possible. You keep repeating and repeating this untrue old nonsense and presumptions, IMO. I dont understand the obsession. Sorry.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DwayneHoover View Post
    Um... what about the post that started this topic? That referenced published research papers about LSD-related compounds that ARE active at blotter-able doses. So that proves it is possible. You keep repeating and repeating this untrue old nonsense and presumptions, IMO. I dont understand the obsession. Sorry.
    There are plenty of ergolines that are active at LSD size doses, plenty are listed in TiHKAL, that's nothing new. i was referring to isomers like iso-LSD & lumi-LSD, which are degradation products of LSD.

    Things like ETH-LAD, PRO-LAD, AL-LAD, ALD-52, have to be made intentionally though. A chemist can't fudge a step & end up with ALD-52, likewise you're not going to leave some LSD blotters in tinfoil on your dash too long & end up with AL-LAD. IIRC standard LSD degradation usually results in either iso or lumi-LSD which are inactive.

    Do things like ALD-52 etc get distributed as LSD? From time to time its happened in the past and i'm sure it will happen in the future. How often does it happen? No one knows. But from what i've gathered, its not terribly uncommon, but certainly not the norm either.
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    Bluelighter DwayneHoover's Avatar
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    ^ thanks for clarifying... that was very informative. I think there is probably an incentive to intentionally produce/distribute "Things like ETH-LAD, PRO-LAD, AL-LAD, ALD-52". I recently read (on BL I believe) about someone who was arrested & charged with LSD for blotters, but after testing revealed it was NOT exactly LSD, and nothing controlled that could be identified, everything was dropped. LE risk-reduction for users as well as producers & dealers. Until some kid freaks out on them and news-hungry journalist sensationalize them and they get sceduled. Stupid twats!
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    ^it could presumably still be illegal to sell it, especially on blotter, as it is illegal to sell unscheduled RCs "in lieu of" LSD
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    Quote Originally Posted by twelvesevndi View Post
    ^it could presumably still be illegal to sell it, especially on blotter, as it is illegal to sell unscheduled RCs "in lieu of" LSD
    ha ha, yes, in the US maybe. But USA is not the world!

    Typical American egocentric thinking.
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    It will be that Perhaps this is an explanation for the differences in "quality" that people speak of in terms of LSD.
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    Bluelighter fly-'s Avatar
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    I wish that Hoffman Ohm 2009 and its supposed LSB or LSP could come back! Now looking back i see how i really liked it because had a hint of dissociation and more euphoria than LSD, and never experienced any other chemical like that (sampled that blotters +30x). good times!
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    Bluelighter DoorsofPerception's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fly- View Post
    I wish that Hoffman Ohm 2009 and its supposed LSB or LSP could come back! Now looking back i see how i really liked it because had a hint of dissociation and more euphoria than LSD, and never experienced any other chemical like that (sampled that blotters +30x). good times!
    YES! those were some of my favorite doses I've ever taken. Makes sense now that they weren't LSD since I've done it a bunch since then, and even before then, and still haven't had quite the trip like those gave me, that was one of the best trips of my entire life.
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    Bluelighter
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    http://countyourculture.com/2011/12/...lsd-ergoloids/
    This site quotes people from this thread, pretty cool huh?
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    Could be 5MEO DALT except the blotter would be the size of a small postage stamp. If you saved the acid -snip- No, if you saved it, you should send it off to a lab for testing. The human brain builds a massive tolerance to it that makes it so although hallucinations might still be present you don't feel anything at all. But acid always works at first even if your tolerance is massive. The duration and amount of stimulus lessens though as soon as you do it twice in a week.

    Again it could just be you. I have taken the same acid that gave me an amazing trip again and again until it turned into a rather boring experience with little emotional effects. I even got up to about 20 doses a day that would only last a few hours as far as i could tell. My friends however said i was a little out of my mind but the feeling goes away unfortunately if you do it too many times in a month or even in a year.

    Another possibility is DOM but that lasts a long time. Its really visual and just seems to never fade. It comes on two sided paper in California usually perforated with a different picture on each side. The DOM must be glued between the sheets so you can get the 1000 mikes needed.

    Yup. In fact anything that effects you like LSD is illegal in the U.S. under the analog act. You could have just hit your head really hard and it's illegal because you are acting like you are on something. Its BS. But with 2CB that's how we got busted because its an analog of MDMA.

    Just a warning, this post is all wide speculation, and is the very reason we don't allow speculation over the ID of a chemical. Please don't take any of it to heart. ~Jesusgreen
    Last edited by Jesusgreen; 15-12-2011 at 16:21.
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    Bluelight Crew Jesusgreen's Avatar
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    Please don't quadruple post. We have an edit button for a reason. Then again, I'm not sure if greenlighters can use it, but really, don't quadruple post.

    Also if you're replying to the main post, it's almost a year old, and the person posting it actually posted it on another forum, not here, so they're unlikely to see your reply, or have any of the blotter left.

    NEVER advise someone to take an unknown substance just to see what it is. That is highly dangerous advice and this is a harm reduction forum. The only way to find out what substance you have is to send it off to a lab for testing, we will not offer ID advice, and we will certainly not advise you to take more if you suspect it might not be LSD.

    Also, further comments:
    In fact anything that effects you like LSD is illegal in the U.S. under the analog act.
    - no. Analogues are structurally similar chemicals, it has nothing to do with the actual subjective effects, otherwise for example the NBOMe series chemicals would also be illegal in the US.
    But with 2CB that's how we got busted because its an analog of MDMA
    2C-B is not an MDMA analogue. It is far closer to Mescaline than any other illegal drug, but even so, still quite far off - even someone with no chemistry knowledge can take a look at 2C-B's structure next to MDMA's structure and see they're not analogous (Other than being phenethylamines of course, but then you'd be better off making the argument that 2C-B is an analogue of amphetamine rather than MDMA)
    Last edited by Jesusgreen; 15-12-2011 at 16:24.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jesusgreen View Post
    no. Analogues are structurally similar chemicals, it has nothing to do with the actual subjective effects, otherwise for example the NBOMe series chemicals would also be illegal in the US.
    I'm pretty sure the USA's analog act include "effects substantially similar to a schedule I drug" as part of its classifications. Also applies to misrepresentation (selling a bag of sugar that's been labelled "COKE" will get you busted for distribution of a schedule I substance). See anecdote.
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    Bluelight Crew Jesusgreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenmeanies View Post
    I'm pretty sure the USA's analog act include "effects substantially similar to a schedule I drug" as part of its classifications. Also applies to misrepresentation (selling a bag of sugar that's been labelled "COKE" will get you busted for distribution of a schedule I substance). See anecdote.
    Yes, selling it as coke would get you busted, just as selling something as MDMA - but not due to it being purely similar in effects, or every grey-area RC would be illegal today, no exceptions. The federal analogue act refers to substances structurally similar, the actual clause is:
    (i) the chemical structure of which is substantially similar to the chemical structure of a controlled substance in schedule I or II;
    It also must meet one (or both) of these clauses:
    (ii) which has a stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system that is substantially similar to or greater than the stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system of a controlled substance in schedule I or II; or
    (iii) with respect to a particular person, which such person represents or intends to have a stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system that is substantially similar to or greater than the stimulant, depressant, or hallucinogenic effect on the central nervous system of a controlled substance in schedule I or II.
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    you can use morning glory seeds and HBWR to become familiar with LSD if you are not sure, and then that way you can tell the difference between a phenethylamine and an ergoline, i think they have different feels

    SKL said on PD social that he spoke to David Nichols and that Nichols thinks there's a difference between batches, but at the end of the day we are all just speculating

    but in other news i read of something called "bunk police" and they were testing for LSD at festivals and they found misrepresentations

    i personally would estimate that the majority of acid out there is LSD, but that's just me
    Last edited by huolesoh; 10-04-2012 at 22:15.
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    Bluelighter DwayneHoover's Avatar
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    More info about these "bunk police" (great idea!!!) Link please?
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    I've never heard of LSP or LSB before this thread, so now I'm intrigued.

    Is there a compiled list anywhere of known Ergoloids with either known to be or potentially psychoactive?

    Would like to learn more about ergoloids now, but Wikipedia is a dead end, with only a reference to the prescription drug Ergoloid...
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    edit
    Last edited by sockpuppet; 19-08-2012 at 20:57.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sockpuppet View Post
    You will find little but rumors as far as I can tell - many of them primarily spread here at BL. I've yet to see any evidence of non LSD ergoloids commercially distributed despite frequent aspersions cast here at certain Euro paper that appears to be considered in Europe to be high quality LSD-25.
    I care far less about whether or not something is available or distributed as LSD, and far more about the learning more about the molecules that may or may not exist in any form of mass production/distribution and are indistinguishable using the Ehrlich Reagent from LSD.

    PIHKAL and TIHKAL exemplify what I want to read about I suppose. I suppose it'd probably be more proper to refer to them as Ergolines, not Ergoloids, as that Wikipedia page actually has more information and a list like I was asking for.

    However it is obviously incomplete, as it doesn't include LSP or LSB in that page, so I am curious if there are others not mentioned in that page. Oh and there are wikipedia articles for LSP and LSB

    LSB: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergi..._2-butyl_amide
    LSP: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergi...3-pentyl_amide

    ... Ah, those are listed under Lysergamides: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergamide

    The Ergolines/Lysergamides seem to me to be almost worthy of being considered a separate class as opposed to being lumped in with tryptamines, since so far there seems to be just as much flexibility similarities in action between them, as there are between substances with a more simple structure and a basic phenylethelyamine or tryptamine backbone?

    EIHKAL or LIHKAL perhaps?
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    yes i've been thinking about it lots and i think someone is bound to be making it ...

    i've read about a variety of chemists, just the other day i heard of another one that i hadn't heard of until then, who had been busted a decade or so ago. it was something along the lines of; he crashed his car and some authorities found a piece of paper with an ingredient to make acid on it, and then they were busted.
    you can read about it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/operation_julie



    and then i also read on here about someone saying a bunch of welsh hippies with a pet chemist (actually that's somewhere in this thread, i just searched it)

    basically i think it has to be out there (or at least an analogue) as there is just a mass following behind acid and there is 7 billion people in the world, and i just think it's inevitable - whether it's made in the basement of a French church or the cliché Chinese laboratory or a caravan in a warehouse in the middle of America - there's a big demand for it, and there are people who feel it's their vocation, people who want to 'change the world' etc, and then there's the cash crop side of it

    personally i reckon there could be a hidden european organisation somewhere, and then a separate bunch of people in america making it. or simply some smart fuck college students. another consideration is simply there must have been billions or so doses acid synthesised in the past, that there could just be some hippie guy with a freezer load who releases a batch every so often, i really dont know im just imagining this - because i read about this brown vial of sandoz acid that someone kept at room temperature and then it was shared at Hofmann's 100th birthday party and no one noticed any change in potency - so the moral of the story is it keeps

    i always find it strange when news articles say "manufacturing LSD" !! like i dont know i just associate that word with factories, as if the kind of thing you would manufacture would be on conveyor belts, like soup cans or car parts

    it does concern me the freedom of availability of these NBOMes though... feel far more comfortable buying novel tryptamines from sites that doesnt sell them at all...

    OK think that's everything. in other news if you are reading this you should really research how Bill Gates is spending his money trying to end malaria in Africa and genetically modifying banans in Uganda to contain more vitamin A so thousands of children don't go blind and other intelligent uses of his insane level of wealth to change the lives of millions in the countries being massively exploited and overlooked by the capitalistic and self-interested western world ❤
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    Bluelighter
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    That was the lsd I took in the mid 70`s. The operation julie stuff. It was 1977 the bust.

    Black micro,brown micro and pink, green and purple pyramid.

    It was the most astonishing thing in my life and 35 years later it still was.

    I bought some mad hatters about a month ago from canada and while they are a strong psychadelic they are NOTHING whatsoever like the richard kemp stuff (thats him pictured above)

    There was not one single thing similar in any way to the lsd I knew and loved. NOTHING.

    I have never in my life had any blotter that even comes close to the microdots.

    Oh and another thing....the effect was the same every single time. There were indeed settings where you would be more/less comfortable and I did have a few bad trips but the effect was always the same and the peak with cev`s would never last more than 5-6 hours.

    I feel privelaged to have had these experiences in my lifetime.

    Jan 26th 1977 was my last time on the REAL stuff. Todd Rundgren Glasgow Apollo Scotland.

    Half tab purple microdot.
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