Now we all know to take media reports on drug use and effects with a grain of salt because we are armed with scientific knowledge and scientific facts. We can explain the dangers and benefits of drug use, and we scoff at people who make sweeping generalisations about drug users.
So does anyone have any proof of drug squad coppers recirculating drug busts. I'm starting to get sick of peoples attitudes that all drug officers go around busting dealers taking their stash and reselling them without any proof, other then the odd bent copper.
So if you know drug squad officers who do these illegal practices or have conducted an investigation into the disposal of illegal drugs then go easy on the coppers.
Remember this forum is to info people of the facts and to stop pedalling hear say and rumors.
A close friend to me was stopped in their car and searched last month....the two cops gave them a notice to appear for two pills when they had actually busted them with 18...personal use or resale these cops were bent.
When i was younger my oldr step brother would often come over with his mate off their chops...they would get up to all kinds of shit and this mate was a copper...this copper even cased houses when he was called out for work and would later break in and nick stuff... true stuff.
I'd say for their sake that this was a good omen, I'm sure to the judge 2 pills look much better than possesion of 18.
Do I think police are corrupt?
Graft probe picks more Vic cops
Set-up fears blew drug sale: dealer
Smoker tells of lost pot stash
Witness tells of drug haul
I know I'm using examples from newspapers and most of us don't trust what we read in the media. But come on, they have been caught so many times and there is so much evidence against them it seems pretty clear to me. Thereís a royal commission into the corruption of police running at the moment isnít there?
It's really because the bad ones stick out so bad. I mean, "POLICE OFFICER DOES DRUG BUST AND DOESN'T KEEP ANY FOR HIMSELF" isn't really a compelling headline is it?
I have faith in the police force, and that a majority of its members are good.
Hrm...how to say this.
Most rumours are based on some degree of truth. All cops are fuckwits but that doesnt mean theyre all crooked. Consider tho that the majority of people who actually want to be police are exactly the sorts of people who like to go on powertrips and flaunt the law because they can. It follows then that theyre also the kind of people who's greed is likely to get the better of them after years on a public service salary makes them bitter. And when it comes down to it, there are people with money out there willing to make up the difference in exchange for the sorts of things a dirty cop is able to provide.
But to put it simply, there are people around with shady enuff pasts to have worked with dirty cops and thats why rumours start.
I heard a story about 7 years ago where some ppl I knew were driving their car through adelaide with a boot full of weed...
Cops knew about it (somehow) and pulled them over and they were issued with summons... In court, the judge says, "how do you plead to having 50 grams of weed?" or words to that affect..
I dont think this guy would have said, "nah man, I really had 50 kilos" now do you?
I knew a guy who use to buy large amounts of an ex cop, he left the police force because I think they started to catch onto him. He always had pretty good stuff, and my mate said he was a dodgie as they came. No matter what there will always be genuine and dodgie police...can't do much about it.
If I got busted with a heap of pills I would want the cops to take most of them for themsleves for sure, I wouldn't be complaining. I know it wrong, but better for the person who got busted...
[quote]Originally posted by RobertRollie:
Hrm...how to say this.
All cops are fuckwits but that doesnt mean theyre all crooked.
I have to disagree with the fuckwit statement. There are crooked people everywhere, so it's fair to say that the law of averages would place a percentage in the police force. It would be completely naive to think otherwise....but they certainly aren't all fuckwits
I also don't agree with this:
[quote]Consider tho that the majority of people who actually want to be police are exactly the sorts of people who like to go on powertrips and flaunt the law because they can
It's all a matter of perception.
[ 13 September 2002: Message edited by: samadhi ]
Some cops are crooked, some aren't, it's like a lot of groups in our community - the sins of a few tar the (for the most part) good name of many.
Priests for the most part are good, honest, god-devoted people, there are some who molest children.
Athletes work for years, train every day from 4am, eat right, etc and never even make it to the olympics, some take steroids and win gold.
Some members of the lebanese community are pillars of manners, dignity and respect, some pack-rape women.
It's only a relatively small sample. There are dodgy people everywhere, but when it's police, the shock and anger are compounded because of the position of police within the community, the protectors of truth, upholders of justice, etc they are entrusted with our welfare to be uncorruptable.
But, temptation must run high. Police bust drugs worth maybe 15 times what they see in a year in a single swoop. A male officer may pull over an attractive female motorist for speeding and she seems to be insinuating that there may be an option to expedite the situation without paying a fine or paper work. Some asshole punches you and spits on you, calls you "pig scum", it would be easy to hit this person in the head with your torch. You find someone lying over their beaten wife and child covered in blood, controlling your emotions to maim might need restraint you don't possess.
Where does the line of "crooked" begin? Police are there to mop up society's roadkill, they have a pretty hard task, and i can imagine it would be, at times, an extremely difficult profession. Sure you might say, "if you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen", but it isn't always black and white, and i think it's pretty insulting to say [quote]All cops are fuckwits .
Cause i've read in your profile RR, that you are an IT worker, it's like saying, "all IT workers are uber-geek l337 wannabe hackers who download anime porn and play MUDs and live in their parent's basements masturbating til they get carpel tunnel". I know that's not true... not all IT workers like MUDs .
But, see my point, the sins of a few doesn't lead to a generalisation that all cops are fuckwits. If they stopped you getting shot, or talked you out of a hostage situation, or pulled you out of a car wreck, i think you'd have a different appreciation. They are mostly pretty average joes (and joannes ) trying to do a job, that is more than likely, a lot more stressful and ethically challenging than your current line of work.
Yes cops can be crooked - (if you want a good story, a FOAF used to buy 8balls of coke from police HQ carpark) - but don't use that as ammunitition to cut down the mostly good work that they do.
Sllip - if your original question goes to a culture of corruption, MHO is that most police will bend the rules a little (i also think that comes as part of the effective adminnistration of justice), but i don't think that if you picked a random policeperson off the street they would be selling you illegal drugs and robbing people's houses.
Some "drug users" are desperate junkies with no self-control, who break into houses to steal dvd players to finance their out-of-control addictions which they can't afford but can't quit... but not all "drug users" are.
Most police never come into contact with large amounts of drugs. But some do. That doesn't mean the ones who do are crooked, or even tempted. One bad apple need not spoilt the whole damn bunch.
[quote]Some members of the lebanese community are pillars of manners, dignity and respect, some pack-rape women.
It's only a relatively small sample.
Dude, I'd have to disagree with you there.
At least half the Lebanese community are pillars of manners, dignity and respect.
In the situations denialworks4me and mayday mentioned, what would happen to the investigation if it came out the cops had kept the majority of the drugs for themselves? If nothing else, their credibility would be put in doubt. The fact it is now known they have a stash of an illegal substance should be enough for some sort of disciplinary or legal action.
Or would they just say "Yeah, 2 in one bag, 16 in another" and that would be that?
As with 99% of all ppl, all cops THINK they're good ppl, and most cases most of the time they think they're doing the RIGHT thing, however its the age old question of 'who will police the police?', they are certainly in a good position to take advantage of situations they come come acrross, and that would be tempting to ppl who think like that when considering a career. Of course then who would police those who police the police, and so on. Its just another fact of life that will always be a hot topic for discussion. Mostly because ppl feel that it is worse for the law to be broken by those who should be upkeeping it
The Coast Guard?
There is this book I saw at Polyester (Fitzroy, Melbourne) entitled "Victorian Police Corruption"
There were actually two volumes, both almost three inches thick!! So if you want proof, read them. They are jam packed full of cases ranging from money laundering to paedophila. To think that such a massive amount of info on police corruption only focuses on one state is mindblowing! After reading this, you will realise that police corruption is rife in Australia.
Cops are a bunch of cunts, 'nuff said.
AHA is it by that Hoser fellow?
^^ Yup that's him. I bought his last two books when he came into my bar selling them. I usually throw out hawkers but I recognized him, shook his hand, and bought what he had. Got them signed as well.
He is a dead set Aussie legend. Mad as a cut snake but still a legend. If even 10% of what is in those corruption books is true then the police is mightily corrupt.
But that aside, all you have to do is look at The Age articles i keep posting here to see whats going on. Somewhere up above in this thread someone says "well why should we believe the media, they always lie". Errr they don't often mess with the facts when it comes to court reporting. Get one of those stories wrong and it's straight to jail for the reporter!
Fact: A senior member of the Victorian Drug Squad is being charged with all sorts crimes after he was busted trying to sell 20,000 MDMA pills to a criminal group, pills which had been previously seized in other raids. The reports on the case mention that this was not an isolated incident, and that it was only one of many such large amounts that had gone "missing". (thread here)
But that said this is only a small proportion of police involved in such things. The average police officer on the beat I would trust to do their job, which is to serve and protect. It is only when the temptation of large amounts of money turns up that the problems start. Go anywhere in the world and you'll find much the same thing. Drug squads are constantly being tempted by the amounts of money involved in the illegal drug trade.
I also suggest that you have a look at another book, 'Neddy' by Arthur Stanley Smith, a man who had the NSW Police Force in his pocket.
I think many of you are severely understating this problem. In my earlier days, when I lived in Perth, my friends and I were often held with no charges by the local police, would get the shit beaten out of us, then be dumped somewhere a few km's away. (By the way, I have dark skin, and so did many of my friends)
And anyone wondering why we didn't make complaints has no idea about the way things really work.
Since moving to Melbourne, I haven't really seen this sort of thing, probably because the cops are not as bored as they are in Perth.
But as far as Melbournes heroin problem goes, can anyone really believe that the cops don't have a hand in it? I mean seriously, there are NEVER any big heroin busts here, they just get the small-time street dealers. To think the cops are not deeply involved in the heroin game here is extremely naive.
I wasn't going to mention this, but fuck it. A friend of mine (she is a heroin addict) was stopped by an unmarked car with 3 men in it in Smith St (Fitzroy) at about 3:00am one night. A man in the front showed her a badge and told her to get in the car. They drove in to an alley, and then gang-raped her. I swear this on my mothers grave.
I have a deep hatred of the police, I have never been helped by them, nor any of my friends. They constantly abuse their power, and yet people still have faith in them. (Does anyone remember the S11 protests when 9/10 of the cops removed their name tags? This is illegal, by the way)
As far as I am concerned, the only good cop is a dead cop.
No cop has ever done wrong by me. As long as I do right by them they do right by me. This doesnt mean arse kissing, but when they ask me for my driver's licence I hand it over, no questions asked. In my opinion, it's the smart-arses that get their car searched, roadworthed, etc.
To say that 'all cops are fuckwits' and 'the only good cop is a dead cop' is total and utter ignorance / stupidity. I'm sure there are bad cops, im not doubting that, but I believe that cops do a much better job in society then people realize and give credit for.
SteveElectro, how would you like it if I said 'all darked skinned people are petrol sniffing theives'? A huge generalization I think. I dont want to turn this into a racist post, it is just an example to get my point across.
So what would everyone here do if they were a cop who had just made a bust? I know I'd be tempted to pocket a few... Yeh I reckon police are corrupt but faced with a few thousand pills who wouldn't be?
i wouldnt go as far as the generalisation that all cops are fuckwits. so be it, ive never encountered the police in any situation, good or bad. yet id still go straight to the police if a situation arose and id still trust them to do the right thing.
nor would i disagree with the fact that some police are involved in illegal activities. activities mentioned above, ie gangrape, well thats wrong in any account, police or not. but the same as police mightve done it, so could anyone... the fact is a policeman is only slightly different from any other man on the street with an average job. except theyve exchanged a lot of freedom to get the job, and one day, may have to put their lives on the line for people theyve never met. i know i could never be a police officer. i dont have the balls, nor the discipline.
say youve got a family, say both you and your partner are on average wages, youve got kids, and youre struggling a little. say the opportunity arises where you could make some extra money that may allow you to pay off the morgage, or keep the electricity running. you telling me that youre not going to take the chance? if i was struggling, and i busted a car full of drugs, and i figured i could take some for myself and make some money, then fuck it, i probably would, and chances are that you would too!
In the two experiances I've had with the police, (one on either side of the fence might I add) I've found them to be polite, decent people who are trying to do (a very hard) job.
It's everones loss of respect for the police that makes them turn to the corruption. That and the money. And sometimes the drugs...
[quote]Originally posted by melancholic:
but the same as police mightve done it, so could anyone... the fact is a policeman is only slightly different from any other man on the street with an average job. except theyve exchanged a lot of freedom to get the job, and one day, may have to put their lives on the line for people theyve never met. i know i could never be a police officer. i dont have the balls, nor the discipline.
I disagree. They are abusing a position of power, much like a paedophile teacher or priest.
This is the worst kind of abuse.
[quote]Originally posted by SteveElektro:
theyre abusing a position of power, much like a paedophile teacher or priest.
that is a totally incorrect generalisation. the police force and the law, while sometimes flawed, are an incredibly important part of the world - and without the laws we have today the world would revert to chaos, and war between political/religious/racial groups, ala mad max style.
i would agree that some police get the job because they intend to abuse the power, and maybe some police officers become corrupt over time, but corrupt police are still a minority. there are corrupt people everywhere. if you get on a reasonably full bus, youre staring at a smorgasboard of people, and for all you know every single one of them could be corrupt or participating in illegal activities that in involve abuse of power/authority. but if you look at a busload of police, i would think there'd be a much lower percentage of corruption.
if a police officer takes some drugs from a dealer for himself, as far as im concerned its a victimless crime - if nobody knows it cant hurt anyone.
oh, and on another note, dont you agree that everybody bends the rules of their profression/job to help out either themselves or friends? people at maccas give free food to their friends at the expense of the company. ill bet similar activities like this exist in virtually every profession where its possible to do so. its a very illegal activity to give out free food, its classified as stealing, and some people abuse the position so much that if caught theyd be facing a hefty fine/sentence (for instance every year at david jones 8 million bucks worth of stock disappears). do you think your friend is corrupt when he gives you a free cheeseburger? or at the cd store when you buy a cd, take it home and burn it, and then successfully return it claiming dislike? i think not. sure police are in a slightly different position to the maccas worker but theyre the same fucking people with the same human tendencies.
[ 19 September 2002: Message edited by: melancholic ]
[ 19 September 2002: Message edited by: melancholic ]