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    Different Shades of MDMA Powder/crystals 
    #1
    Hey All,

    I have recently been spoilt for choice for uncut MDMA crystals but there have been 3 very distinct types that I have been able to get my hands on.

    I havant tried all 3 but from my inspection they only appear to differentiate in colour. They are all reasonably chuncky crystals which need to be crushed before snorting.

    Type 1)
    Almost white crystals and it isant piperzine which I have also had in the past.

    I havant had this type but the person I get it from tells me they had issues sleeping on it. As a side note I have had plenty of speed in the past and this didnt look like speed.

    Type 2)

    Light brown. I have had this and its deffinately MDMA. Wasant as mind blowing as I was hoping though.

    Type 3)

    A deep dark brown. Similar looking crystals to 1 & 2 just very dark.



    Can people give me there opinions on what they look for in good MDMA. Based on my experiences from other drugs I have found the deeper the colour the stronger the gear. Does this apply to MDMA?

    The Dark stuff is reportedly off tap but I havant had it yet.

    Any way let me know what you peps think.

    Sabitor
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    #2
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    The best mdma crystals I have had have all been a white/clear colour.
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    #3
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    Mdma in its purist form is only about 83% so it all depends on the process in making it as too what colour it turns out..

    Correct me if im wrong.
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    #4
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    Get a reagent test kit from the new Aussie guy and then you'll have a better idea of what your buying.
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    #5
    Please check previous Mdma discussion threads located in this Aussie section a few pages back and it will explain peoples experiences with mdma http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/6...cussion+thread
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    #6
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    PURE MDMA is only 83% as nin015 said, but you can pretty much ignore that as thats due to the way it synthesises, it can only be 100% in oil form so doses that recommend 120mg as a good dose are based on it being 83% pure (I'm pretty sure)
    83% Pure MDMA will be white, but this is extremely rare. It can easily be off colour (commonly off brown/tan) without affecting the overall strength all that much (can be anywhere from a couple of % to alot).

    In short, if you are certain that the white stuff is MDMA and been tested as such (Because they're is countless white RC's that stimulate some MDMA affects). I'd be taking the white because it has the potential to be stronger than the others but it's certainly no guarentee.

    However if you have access to a test kit, I'd test each of the batch's and see which is quickest to react, that would be a more accurate way to check purity. Good luck, and I'm glad you found some tasty tasty molly... JEALOUS!
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    #7
    Bluelighter Sustanon's Avatar
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    If we want to be precise the maximum purity for MDMA would be 84%. The color does not meant too much like mentioned above it really depends on the manufacturing process. The end product technically should be white if it has been cleaned but it can range from amber, brown, purplish etc etc. The color wont tell you the quality unless your getting it tested. There are a few types of molly circulating at the moment and I have had just as good experiences on brown/purplish MDMA as white crystals.
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    #8
    Bluelight Crew footscrazy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sabitor
    Can people give me there opinions on what they look for in good MDMA. Based on my experiences from other drugs I have found the deeper the colour the stronger the gear.
    What drugs does this apply to? Off the top of my head I can't think of any drug which a stronger colour means it's more pure, in most cases a colour is an impurity, though even a tiny percentage of impurity can cause a significant colour change, hence colour rarely being a good indicator of purity.
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    #9
    Bluelighter grugz's Avatar
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    Im with footzy with this one. More colour usually means whoever cooked it isnt getting the pureist of ingredients or they are skipping a rinse step
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    #10
    Administrator spacejunk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verybuffed View Post
    Get a reagent test kit
    ^ this. any other means of telling your 'molly' from a random powder or research chemical are merely guesswork - especially if you have been sold piperazine as molly (or pills) previously.
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    #11
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    and while your at it see to a shave, short haircut, and get yourself a goddamn job!
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    #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by laugh View Post
    and while your at it see to a shave, short haircut, and get yourself a goddamn job!
    damn straight
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    #13
    And what is with this 83-84% business. Forensic chemists do not quote the percentage of MDMA freebase in a particular batch of powder but the percentage of MDMA-HCl. The same goes with meth. All the dosages we have ever spoken about, whenever dosage is mentioned, are MDMA-HCl. That is the drug, just like any other drug in any other pharmaceutical; 30mg Pfed-HCL in the cold and flu tabs anyone??

    It is rarely over 80-85% because of the very significant hassle in purifying it any greater than that percentage. It is so difficult, that most wouldn't bother. Meth is the same. Government chemists in controlled conditions are battling to do over 90%, even with a lot of time spent on purifications.
    Last edited by Biscuit; 09-09-2012 at 19:18.
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    #14
    Bluelighter futura2012's Avatar
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    MDMA - Molecular Mass 193.2
    Hydrochloric Acid - Molecular Mass 36.46
    MDMA HCL - MDMA Molecule Mass - 84%

    The 84% max purity is caused by the weight of the acid molecule.

    The colouration is normally caused by the final separation, filtering and cleaning process.

    Many claim the brown MDMA has a stronger effect (the impurities from the synth can effect the high). More balls to the wall experience. Only a tiny trace of an impurity is all thats needed to knock the colour off.

    A lot of MDMA crystal we see on ED is white.

    All the dosages we have ever spoken about, whenever dosage is mentioned, are MDMA-HCl. That is the drug, just like any other drug in any other pharmaceutical; 30mg Pfed-HCL in the cold and flu tabs anyone??
    The question of how dose is measured is an interesting debate.

    Is a 120mG pill on ecstasydata 120mG MDMA Molecule + Acid Molecule or is 120mG on edata only 83% of 120mG? Curently unconfirmed. It will depend on if their GC/MS kit can detect the bond. I read a GC/MS cant detect it. I have emailed them and await a response.

    What about MDMA Tartrate or MDMA Phosphate? Maybe ecstasydata are only reading the MDMA molecule from the GC/MS. Currently I dont know what they are measuring.

    We assume MDMA HCl but the only setup out there testing for mG is Ecstasydata (at least for europe). All our dosages are based on this and shulgin reports. Does Shulgin consume 120mG MDMA + Acid Molecule or 120mG of MDMA molecule? Know one really knows.

    I have started a thread on ADD discussing this very thing as I dont know? Would be interested to find out if someone does

    Can people give me there opinions on what they look for in good MDMA.
    References from others. Good source. Marquis Test result.

    Based on my experiences from other drugs I have found the deeper the colour the stronger the gear. Does this apply to MDMA?
    Sometimes the darker the gear the more "stoned" and "off the wall" it isnt necessarily the MDMA causing this. It might be to do with how the MDMA reacts with the impuritie in your body. Its a bit of a grey science this one. But.. the brown shit can be known to be stronger. Not always..



    MDMA Tartrate (Max purity of MDMA Tartrate approx 60% )
    Last edited by futura2012; 10-09-2012 at 07:42.
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    #15
    Bluelighter 8ft-Sativa's Avatar
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    ^ Your a machine on the subject, you have some fantastic posts in ED.

    I've had brown, White, Pinkish and have not been able to tell a difference. I always go for "rocks" though. It's easy to step on powder but way harder to step on chunky crystals.
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    #16
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    The molly I get offered always has a yellow tinge to it, and that smell certainly not clear but its potent stuff!
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    #17
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    generic "i've only seen them with a tan colour from dude" or "white" from pictures i've looked at. haven't decided to use molly as yet, given the opportunity has only arisen.
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    #18
    Futura2012 - you raise an interesting point and I too will look into this.

    However, I know someone who has seen hundreds upon hundreds of lab test results from seized pills and the MDMA in the pills is always MDMA-HCl. Of course MDMA crystal/powder, which seems to be more available than it ever was, might routinely come in different salt forms. I cannot recall how the purity of the MDMA is expressed and whether it is expressed as MDMA or MDMA-HCl.
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    #19
    Bluelighter futura2012's Avatar
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    I've had brown, White, Pinkish and have not been able to tell a difference. I always go for "rocks" though. It's easy to step on powder but way harder to step on chunky crystals.
    Valid point about going for rocks. The only thing you have to watch there is fake rocks in the mix.

    The smell is usually liquorice or aniseed smell from the safrol oil. Its such a powerful smell it survives throughout the synth processes.

    Be warned you can easily fake this smell with anise aromatherapy oil. I have heard a few stories now on ED with users reporting "moon rocks" stinking of "safrol" and they are confused when "they dont do shit"

    Quick squirt of this and the most revolting Research Chemical will smell like a fresh batch of MDMA.

    I was reading this article about a Super Super Lab bust in Aussie for another ED Lab thread.

    http://www.hawkesburygazette.com.au/...er/442011.aspx

    I tried to figure out the quantity of tablets they had in regards to confiscated MDMA crystal and freebase.

    I estimated it came out to be 482 million 500 thousand tablets. Fairly impressed was a mild understatement.

    I was always under the impression pills in Aus there are a lot of bunks like in USA. I have never seen a recorded E lab on this scale before. Maybe times have changed.

    I would appreciate it if someone can confirm if this theory about pills there is right or wrong?

    Judging by this lab you have as many super pills as Holland
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    #20
    Bluelighter futura2012's Avatar
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    Futura2012 - you raise an interesting point and I too will look into this.

    However, I know someone who has seen hundreds upon hundreds of lab test results from seized pills and the MDMA in the pills is always MDMA-HCl. Of course MDMA crystal/powder, which seems to be more available than it ever was, might routinely come in different salt forms. I cannot recall how the purity of the MDMA is expressed and whether it is expressed as MDMA or MDMA-HCl.
    Hello Biccie

    Interesting you say this. Which lab reports do you see that say they contain HCL? Edata wont report the salt because of DEA restrictions. On our pills of the 90s thread on ED someone suggested a "Defqon DANCE" might have an alternative salt. Why does it contain only MDMA yet is errm for a better word "dancey". Maybe not a coincedence there is DANCE stamped on the back of them but they only contain MDMA no adulterant.

    Just out of interest if Edata only measure the salt (ie MDMA molecule + Acid Molecule) and report this. If you made a pill with a heavier Acid salt such as say Acetate or Posphate then the pill report would work in your favour as the MDMA could only be approx 50-60% pure.

    Unfortunately the ADD thread got closed (dunno why) but they all agreed with you Biccie and said always assume HCL.

    One comment on there pointed out that due to the potency factor of MDMA is relatively low (ie not like LSD or DOM) then + or - 16% makes no difference. This was a valid point.

    However a different salt at + or - 50% would be a different story.

    The crazy thing is if a defqon was say an acetate and all this fuss with superpill status at circu 200mG it may only be 100mG and its a "Placebo Superpill" LOL
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    #21
    Administrator spacejunk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by futura2012 View Post

    I was always under the impression pills in Aus there are a lot of bunks like in USA. I have never seen a recorded E lab on this scale before. Maybe times have changed.

    I would appreciate it if someone can confirm if this theory about pills there is right or wrong?

    Judging by this lab you have as many super pills as Holland
    the article you linked was from 7 years ago, when top-notch pills were easy to come by in australia. these days it's very hit-and-miss from what i read on these boards. if somebody offered me a pill, i wouldn't even consider it without having tested or at least researched the pressing.
    things seem to be a little better in 2012 than they were in the 3 or so years prior, but all the same - research chems and piperazines abound.
    i haven't taken ecstasy in over 5 years, but in the 7ish years before then, i never came across a dud pill - and this is before i had discovered the world of pill reports websites and so on.
    ecstasy became a really common drug in australia in the late 90s/early 2000s. i used to know a lot of people that would never take drugs who would happily drop an e. i mean people that had never smoked pot, who were scared of acid and had every media stereotype firmly implanted in their minds about things like heroin. the risk for these sorts of people seemed low, because most pills were reliably good - at least in my experience.
    the bust in the article was probably one of the things that contributed to the drought australia experienced. that and the australian federal police busting a safrole harvesting operation in cambodia. (http://www.afp.gov.au/media-centre/n...odia-drug-burn)
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    #22
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    Interesting read, am I the only one who caught on to this

    Quote Originally Posted by http://www.hawkesburygazette.com.au/news/local/news/general/biggest-ecstasy-lab-ever/442011.aspx
    Around 4.20pm on November 9, firefighters responded to a call of smoke coming from a unit in a factory complex on Wellington Road.
    Wishing i had some greenery right about now :P
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    #23
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    he bust in the article was probably one of the things that contributed to the drought australia experienced. that and the australian federal police busting a safrole harvesting operation in cambodia.
    hello space thanks for all the info and link. That factory must have been supplying a large chunk of Australia. The scale of the equipment just in the background looks like the Mexican Superlabs that feed the USA with Meth.

    Strange choice to make however operating on that scale. I am sure it would be quite difficult to lie low. The number of staff etc would all contribute to risk. In mexico it makes sense with the corrupt government but in Australia knocking out that quantity just seems crazy.

    What is the deal there? Bunk pills are normally driven by harsh law enforcement. I assume getting caught in Australia making Bart Simpson pills loaded with piperazine would present less of a sentance than a manufacturing and pressing MDMA lab. I am amazed that things cant be smuggled in as you are effectively a monster island seems like there would be a lot of coast to get supplies in.

    I guess if Asia dont make it you rely on Europe smuggling and its a long way by boat

    I watch an Aus customs doc here in UK. Looks like the customs are switched on although tv could mean anything.

    Seems you have a big meth problem there also. I see lots of P2P being smuggled in sofas, bean cans and the like.

    I also notice a lot of vendors of silk road refuse to post to aus. Not sure if i would fancie my chances being an SR supplier from Aus. Would feel like a bit of a sitting duck and the demand I could only imagine what it would be like. It would be like holding a giant cow dung amongst a swarm of flys
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    #24
    Administrator spacejunk's Avatar
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    i don't know, there are a lot of contributing factors.
    meth is profitable in australia due to high demand and very high prices. it seems like there are ongoing turf wars between rival gangs in a couple of our major cities (melbourne's underworld went ballistic about a decade ago, sydney is doing the same at present) which i suppose has something to do with the huge amounts of money these organisations stand to make.
    there are rival groups, from ethnic gangs to bikers that play a big part in the australian drug scene.

    as for the idea that people would get a lighter penalty for pressing up piperazine pills; i'm pretty sure this is not the case.
    if you are passing something off as 'ecstasy', you are likely to be charged with manufacturing/supplying/possessing MDMA. i might be wrong about this, but i am pretty sure it is the case.

    we do have a lot of uninhabited coastline, but there are also enormous distances to be covered. i'm sure plenty of things are smuggled in by sea in this way, and there have certainly been busts of this nature -
    http://articles.cnn.com/2001-07-28/w...?_s=PM:asiapcf
    and
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pong_Su_incident

    it's hard to say what happened to MDMA in this country (and so many others). my guess is that the increased squeeze on precursor chemicals by law enforcement - in combination with the rise in availability of cheap, easily sourced research chemicals - has made the risks of manufacture too great for many people.
    our customs and quarantine are amongst the strictest in the world - hence internet vendors being reluctant to send things here.
    i guess from an organised crime point of view, the glory days of ecstasy are over because there is easier money to be made in other areas.
    anyway, we are getting majorly off-topic here.

    the rise of MDMA in crystalline form seems to be a response to the demand but also the downfall of pills as a trustworthy form for selling the drug. people who were introduced to this drug in brightly coloured, logo-bearing pills are faced with the choice of gambling on what they know (risking a cocktail of god-knows-what) or seeking out molly.

    the message of "get a testing kit" may have become a harm minimisation cliche, but it's never been more essential.
    we've had a couple of people die after allegedly taking pills (PMA?) in recent times, and we know that there are some greedy, unethical people out there looking to make a quick buck. not everybody who manufactures drugs has good intentions - and there is no quality control or regulation whatsoever. at the end of the day it is every one of us (drug users) who have to take responsibility for our actions.
    eating random pills in 2012 is really reckless.
    Last edited by spacejunk; 10-09-2012 at 17:24.
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    #25
    Bluelighter futura2012's Avatar
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    ^^ words > great post.

    thanks for taking the time to write that spacejunk very interesting for me.

    You are right however I digress.

    Let us now help our friend out the OP Mr Sabitor

    For test kit info:

    For all tests:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categor...sting_reagents

    For MDMA esk tablets

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pill_testing

    Im from ED so I dunno how EZ and DS fare for posting stuff to Aussie but both sites will give you an idea. I am sure someone here can advise you about Aussie kit purchase better than I.

    In regards to other colours of rocks or better still salt crystals. MD-P2P is yellowey brown, Nitromethane is yellowey, safrol oil is yellowey brown and sassafras oil is sort of yellowey sometimes brown also.

    As you can see lots of yellows and browns in the mix. Funny that huh

    Heres a few illustrations to make my point.



    Where the MDMA road usually begins aka Sassafras Bark
    (I think you have Sassafras in Aus wow lucky Aussies)



    Sassafras Oil - The chemistry begins I think its smacked bottom time if you
    have a bottle of this on you in Aussie



    Confiscated Lab Liquids:
    A likely hotch potch of Camphor Oil, Nitromethane, Safrol,
    MDMA Freebase, MD-P2P, MDMA to name a few



    Nitromethane & MD-P2P in jars



    A mixture of Roasted Aluminium Nitromethane & MD-P2P
    + few other nasties to make a nice thick brown sludge
    I read this is called Reductive Amination of MD-p2P using Mercuric
    Chloride Nitro Methane and Scrunched up Balls of Aluminium Foil



    Some MDMA Freebase seperating out of the Brown Sludge

    At this magical point in the MDMA synth process the chemist now has
    to make a decision.

    Do I knock up some Hydrochloric Acid, Toluene and freebase fuck the
    cleaning process and make something that looks like this:



    Dirty Brown (Synth) Molly. This is the stuff that can blow
    your head off not for good reasons I might add.

    The chemist may decide this is a little irresponsible and clean up
    his product a bit and make something that looks like this:



    MDMA HCL with a soft brown tint

    The chemist may be a grad student doing a little something on the side
    or may just be a Drug Gang clan chemist with a morally obliging personality

    In which case the perfectionist chemist takes the seperation, cleaning and
    washing to clinical perfection and makes something like this:



    Clean White MDMA HCL
    Some say this is a clean high with a nice smooth come down.


    So there we have it Mr Sabitor a pictorial guide of why your MDMA may be white may be light brown and could even be slightly yellow. Its all in that final cleaning process whilst the freebase gets bonded with the Hydrochloride and is then finally crystalized into that yummy party substance.

    And dont forget.. regardless of what that shit looks like buy a test kit and drool over that purple puddle you create for yourself. Once this task is completed grab a hot girl place her on your arm and head off to your local rave.

    MISSION COMPLETE

    I am hoping and praying one of the Aussie Bluelighters phase_dancer might add his 2 cents to this thread as I am sure he may have a few wise words to add.

    Respect Mr phase_dancer, Mr Sabitor & Spacejunk

    Respect to all the Aussie Crew. Respect to all Bluelighters

    Please come and debate with us on ED sometime.

    Futura..
    Last edited by futura2012; 10-09-2012 at 21:42.
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