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    Don't understand addiction 
    #1
    Hello, I'm here because there's a part of me I do not understand; or better yet, a part of others I don't understand. A little back ground, I've done just about every class of drug under the sun, even somewhat strange things such as IV methylphenidate; you could call me quite the psychonaut. Some of my all time favourites include Hydromorphone and alprazolam as I'm more of a downer than upper guy. I've done more drugs than anyone I know, but retail a good life with a great job, social connects and make quite the amount of money for my age, all whilst I watch others struggle with drug use around me.(even tho I do more drugs than everyone)

    Anyways, what I don't seem to Understand is how I can't seem to develop an addiction. I've smoked for 2 years now and I will often forget to smoke if I'm not with friends etc. Like now I've gone 4 days without smoking due to being busy with school and smoking simply hasn't crossed my mind not have I noticed any withdrawals that make me want to smoke again. I could sto now forever. Now it isn't just smoking, I have IV'd Hydromorphone though I prefer to snort it, and I've played with it for about 7 months now. I have no desire to do it again anymore than I want to ride a roller coaster again. Sure it would be fun but I won't go out of my way. I could type forever about my self and my lack of addicting personality traits. Why am I like this? Now I know if I do Hydromorphone everyday for a week or two I will have a physical dependence. So what do I do? Not do dilaudid every day. It's so simple to me. Is this because I know all the waning signs and have great knowledge on drugs including the pharmacology side of things? I'm just lost. Is the main thing that gets people addicted lack of knowledge combined with using drugs to cope (which i also don't do, if I'm having troubles I remain sober because I hate the idea of depending on ANYTHING)

    I know to an addict reading this I may seem ignorant, or they may be jealous and wish they had the same experience as me. I'm just looking for answers as addiction seems like it's for idiots. Sorry.
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    #2
    Bluelighter Cdkman's Avatar
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    "I watch others struggle with drug use (even tho I do more drugs than everybody)"my ignorant addict mind has some trouble wrapping my head around this one..i was u once
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    #3
    Wow, you come off as a total douche. Pretty sure a drug board isn't the best place to refer to addicts as idiots.
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    #4
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    Addiction sneaks up on people often even when they are trying to be diligent about avoiding it.

    It's likely (though not definitely) that you will face addiction at some point if you continue to use. Most people don't even see it coming, suddenly they find themselves addicted when a couple weeks ago they thought everything was fine.

    Constantly using drugs (even with regular breaks) has a way of often causing changes to the users mind. The change usually isn't noticed while it's happening; it's mostly not perceivable until it's too late. Just because you've been able to use up to this point without addiction doesn't mean it won't or can't happen if you continue.

    Many of us got addicted by fooling ourselves into thinking we wouldnt or couldnt get addicted. Just something to think about...
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    #5
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    I used to be like that than one day I wasn't.

    Keep being cocky about it. I bet you don't talk to the people you shoot up with like that.

    I get what you are saying though. I used to take 100mgs of oxycodone when I felt like it or if I was sore from skateboarding or had a nasty slam.

    I tried shooting oxy a few times and heroin too and didn't do it for several years.

    Than I got injured and I had a pain rx. Eventually it got to where I had to take it every day not cuz I was addicted at the time but eventually I got really addicted, straight blindsided.

    So even for years I would stop just cuz I could even if it meant agony both pain and withdrawal. Here is the thing I was always addicted to something and honestly I don't like being sober even though I can call myself sober now I still take pain medication everyday but to say I am not a drug addict is bullshit.

    I do know I am a drug addict without a doubt but I can say I am sober because a doctor gives it to me which is just bullshitting my way through real life obstacles. So you wouldn't know I was on drugs if you met me most the time.

    I just really hated my life at that time and never shook the habit of using drugs to cope because of bullshit on top of bullshit. I can stop, I really just don't want to or know how to because realistically I can't fucking cope and I don't want to learn to cope without drugs. Pain just fucking sucks and I don't feel like meditation, accupunture as I prefer something that works.

    So if I stop for a while I am just proving something to myself or the court system. That's addiction. I know exactly when I will do what drug even if I am not strung out I still know I will do it again.

    It sounds to me like you are in denial OP. As other posters have stated it creeps up on you. Look I smoked a couple cigarettes a month and now I smoke a pack a day and I will probably quit again and smoke a few a month which I did for almost a decade.

    You bounce from one drug to the next and shooting hydromorphone is pretty heavy duty. You might not get sick at first but sooner or later you become phsyically dependent.

    You can be addicted to drugs and not have withdrawal. Even though I don't smoke marijuana I am still addicted to it and I honestly really miss it but if I smoke it I go to jail so I don't but I sure know when I will smoke some again.


    Basically the way you use drugs is called chipping and that is using various hard drugs and trying to not get physically dependent.

    I used to chip too.

    I have no delusions about my drug habits and sure don't hide them online.
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    #6
    Bluelighter bomber's Avatar
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    Yeah I used to be kinda proud for my self for doing drugs and avoid addiction. I know the feeling, I realy do. Then I figured that I was closer to addiction than I thought. You are closer to addiction than you think. But, what the hell, people with the fire all the time, so just go on enjoying it. Just keep always in mind that you are closer to get addicted than you think, all it takes is some bad coincidences-then a feeling that nothing realy matters so you stop being carefull or even caring about getting addicted.
    Just quit when you get close to feeling this way.
    I think if there is a way to avoid addiction it is this(not good chanses,though), cause I don't realy believe you would quit while on the honeymoon of using.
    Last edited by bomber; 15-02-2017 at 07:13.
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    #7
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    Sounds like somebody who knows succonsciously that he's on the edge and its speaking to himself rhetorically to convice himself of his invulnerability. There's no judgment, but we've all been there before. Some progress through the stages quicker than others. I don't think you're on Bluelight simply to "do research in the field".
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    #8
    Quote Originally Posted by tylersm View Post
    It's so simple to me. Is this because I know all the waning signs and have great knowledge on drugs including the pharmacology side of things? I'm just lost. Is the main thing that gets people addicted lack of knowledge...?
    HAHA. No.

    Quote Originally Posted by tylersm View Post
    I know to an addict reading this I may seem ignorant, or they may be jealous and wish they had the same experience as me.
    Yes, it does strike me as ignorant. And no, I do not wish I had the same experience as you. I'm not interested in the self-inflated sense of pride you come off as having.

    Pardon my bluntness, but that was pretty irritating for me to read.
    Last edited by Pibolar; 16-02-2017 at 08:39.
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    #9
    Bluelighter Cotcha Yankinov's Avatar
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    It might be prudent to acknowledge the difference between dependence and addiction, although they do intertwine.

    Addiction is considered a disorder of the brain's reinforcement/reward and learning systems - not everyone will be as vulnerable to developing an addiction because of differences in how the brain craves for a drug from person to person.

    There are genes like DeltaFosB that are expressed with the use of drugs of abuse, and over time this can shift your biology further and further towards that of the addict brain.
    Last edited by Cotcha Yankinov; 16-02-2017 at 09:12.
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    #10
    Bluelighter
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    Quote Originally Posted by tylersm View Post
    if I'm having troubles I remain sober because I hate the idea of depending on ANYTHING)
    I've heard this many time.
    Even by addicted high on drugs...
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    #11
    There is this bizarre and differing mechanism of human behavior and predisposition called Genetics, take a science course and maybe your parochial view of addiction may have a chance of being altered in a more sensible view, as opposed to labeling half of the members of this site as 'idiots'. In addition, I do not see how you differ from any other addict out here, just because you didn't make enough money to support your habit and you weren't bedridden as a result has no bearing on whether you're addicted or not. Addiction is not solely factored by the amount or degree of withdrawals you experience (even though that is more prevalent obviously in opiate using individuals).

    You pride yourself on your supposed knowledge, but it seems a little odd to me that is the one thing you are missing.

    After all, you are the guy that started a paragraph with "Anyways".

    In a more constructive tone, I will say this regarding your inquiry. Where I live, Mexicans that have traveled across the border (legally or illegally) have a much higher tolerance to withdraws than their Caucasian counterparts. My experience with them has been that my withdrawals symptoms are much worse by scope and degree of severity. I would not be hardpressed to see the same kind of cultural characteristics expressing themselves genetically in contained societies where opiate abuse is higher. Mexico, is obviously an example, so would Afghanistan or China, you get the idea. I am not sure what your heritage is or your ancestors experience with opiates, but simply put, the role of genetics and generational heritage are worth mentioning here. The fact that you can use certain opiates or narcotics without consequence may be attributed to a genetic factor; were your parents or grandparents known users of opiates?
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    #12
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    Addicts train themselves to become addicted by going through that reward pathway over and over until it becomes ingrained in their psyche. Those who are self medicating an underlying problem are inherently far more likely to become addicted. It sounds like you currently don't have any serious mental or physical health issues, so drugs are naturally less appealing.

    However, everyone can eventually reach a point where they've gone through that reinforcing behavior enough times that they become addicted themselves. Like others have mentioned, it really, really sneaks up on you. Having this attitude that you might be impervious to addiction makes you much more likely to become an addict (IMO)
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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by tylersm View Post
    I could sto now forever.
    But you won't, will you?
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    #14
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    They always say denial is a huge component of addiction. I always would say, "I'm not in denial, I'm a Heroin addict, I work and I'm not ashamed". The problem was, I wasn't in denial about my addiction, I never was, but I didn't truly realize how I was effecting those around me. When you work a full-time job, have a career and also have to score, it can quickly burn you out. I would typically spend either all morning/evening depending on class schedule finding and buying my drugs and then I'd go to work.

    I had no time for my girlfriend, my friends or my family. It took me a little while before I could even see how I was making people around me feel. I had no personal life whatsoever and Heroin was my past-time. Even without theft and screwing over, I still made people feel like shit. I made people who cared about me worry. I really didn't give a shit. Denial is an intersting thing.
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    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Burnt Offerings View Post
    But you won't, will you?
    Would I be considered an addict etc. If I only used drugs on a one week binge one every 5 years or so? I just don't know where the line is drawn
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    #16
    Quote Originally Posted by OrbitalCombustion View Post
    There is this bizarre and differing mechanism of human behavior and predisposition called Genetics, take a science course and maybe your parochial view of addiction may have a chance of being altered in a more sensible view, as opposed to labeling half of the members of this site as 'idiots'. In addition, I do not see how you differ from any other addict out here, just because you didn't make enough money to support your habit and you weren't bedridden as a result has no bearing on whether you're addicted or not. Addiction is not solely factored by the amount or degree of withdrawals you experience (even though that is more prevalent obviously in opiate using individuals).

    You pride yourself on your supposed knowledge, but it seems a little odd to me that is the one thing you are missing.

    After all, you are the guy that started a paragraph with "Anyways".

    In a more constructive tone, I will say this regarding your inquiry. Where I live, Mexicans that have traveled across the border (legally or illegally) have a much higher tolerance to withdraws than their Caucasian counterparts. My experience with them has been that my withdrawals symptoms are much worse by scope and degree of severity. I would not be hardpressed to see the same kind of cultural characteristics expressing themselves genetically in contained societies where opiate abuse is higher. Mexico, is obviously an example, so would Afghanistan or China, you get the idea. I am not sure what your heritage is or your ancestors experience with opiates, but simply put, the role of genetics and generational heritage are worth mentioning here. The fact that you can use certain opiates or narcotics without consequence may be attributed to a genetic factor; were your parents or grandparents known users of opiates?





    I don't think my parents or grandparents ever used any drugs, I am of welsh descent. One thing I forgot to mention that really holds me back on having my life revolve around a substance or any, is my sister was drug addict and I seen what it had done to my family from a young age, this is what got me first researching drugs from when I was around 7 years old, and I still consider "drugs" a hobby of some sort, not doin them but my real interest idk hard to explain. I have even considered switching from my business program to study pharmacology but am in the school searchin process now.
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    #17
    Interesting. I assume by sister you share the same mother and father? If so, what was she addicted to and for how long? I definitely understand using drugs as a hobby more so than a user who relies on them habitually. I started out more or less in that manner of partaking, but later developed a keen craving for opiates and amphetamines.

    You see a lot of 'hobbyists' in the psychodelic realm, where individuals may use various substances to enhance consciousness or perform the weekend warrior type scenario, dropping LSD or 'shrooms, what have you. Of course, attempting a weekend warrior position in the opiate realm would for most people prove futile (from what you've described this would not be an issue for you). I studied Neuropsychopharmacology and found it useful, but honestly the textbooks are fairly dry - especially if you enjoy the lore of drugs you find here and sites like Erowid. If you're into studying LD50's of drugs or exploring the various qualities and effects of substances, you will enjoy it. It's not like in the 70's, when my Philosophy professor told me they synthesized LSD at a Princeton laboratory and performed a guided trip with the teacher. Timothy Leary would be proud.
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    #18
    Quote Originally Posted by OrbitalCombustion View Post
    Interesting. I assume by sister you share the same mother and father? If so, what was she addicted to and for how long? I definitely understand using drugs as a hobby more so than a user who relies on them habitually. I started out more or less in that manner of partaking, but later developed a keen craving for opiates and amphetamines.

    You see a lot of 'hobbyists' in the psychodelic realm, where individuals may use various substances to enhance consciousness or perform the weekend warrior type scenario, dropping LSD or 'shrooms, what have you. Of course, attempting a weekend warrior position in the opiate realm would for most people prove futile (from what you've described this would not be an issue for you). I studied Neuropsychopharmacology and found it useful, but honestly the textbooks are fairly dry - especially if you enjoy the lore of drugs you find here and sites like Erowid. If you're into studying LD50's of drugs or exploring the various qualities and effects of substances, you will enjoy it. It's not like in the 70's, when my Philosophy professor told me they synthesized LSD at a Princeton laboratory and performed a guided trip with the teacher. Timothy Leary would be proud.
    Since I was really young I didn't really know what the exact details, and I'm 20 now and stil don't really. She was my sister as in same bio parents. She was raped and bullied as a child which really led her down the road she went. She started with weed like anyone else really but soon progressed to cocaine and everything that came with it. The crazy cocaine dealer boyfriends, the fights the rage. She really went off the rails mentally after that, like a constant state of psychosis. She soon became a prostitute and I had to deal with watching my parents go through hell every single day. Running to get her out of coke houses all kinds of crazy shit. Had to deal with death threats from biker gangs, harassment etc. She's ran away now and we occasionally get the odd death treat etc. She now does heroin I believe but haven't seen her in 8 years. I had to observe this all from such a young age, and really it shaped me as a person for the better I believe. I or my sister don't even come from a poor household, I just think it's the tragic event that happened what causes it obv. Watching all the hurt and my world and the ones I love turn upside down really pushed me to do well in school and make my mother proud. I could never become a addict because I could not put my mother through that. I know what it's like. All whilst leading a normal life, I became infatuated with drugs and it went from there and now I'm here. I like do to everything like I said, I even have a soft spot for LSD. Once again maybe I'm a fuckin dumbass but I really think the certain situations I've been put through in life gave me a beneficial edge.
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    #19
    And really my facination really comes from the darkness of it all. Sure you can find information on all these drugs online whatever, but you really never know what it's like until you're in the trenches with the junkies. And I never realized how much I never knew disputed spending so much time doing research. And that made me realize experience is an important thing. I like putting myself in the situations because you really see how the illicit trade works, the "mystery" of it all. As well as meeting some colourful people along the way, slimy yes, but colourful. I like experiencing all I can might it be skydiving or seeing things the public never sees. I even keep a journal of it all.
    Last edited by tylersm; 16-02-2017 at 20:47. Reason: Typo
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    #20
    That is quite a story regarding your sister; it is very mature that you learned from your sibling's mistake, I applaud you on that. In many instances, the fact that an older sibling is abusing 'said' substance will create a higher potential for a younger sibling to follow lead, considering the environment is conducive to such measures and the quality of the relationship between the two. Albeit, I do not think this omits you from any potential withdrawal or addiction, that domain is literally hardwired into the neuronal/synaptic composition of the human brain. Like we were discussing earlier, you may have an uncommon gene that greatly reduces your potential to become addicted and even more impressively, to soften the process of withdrawal.

    As far as this competitive advantage you speak of, I certainly agree that the experiences that shaped your perspective of drug abuse in relation to your sister positively resulted in a passion to research and most likely a more level-headed approach than your average user. In that sense, you may be more inclined to use irregularly and not have the debilitating effects others experience.
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    #21
    At the end of the day, despite the fact we're human and share a common genome, we each come from various genetic legacies that individually tune every aspect of our personal condition. The fact that your sister was (and still is?) a user of narcotics doesn't necessarily exclude or include you in the mix, but like you said experience has been proven time and time again to thwart preexisting genotypes. Your situation seems, at least ostensibly, a perfect phenotypic expression due to the environmental influences.
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    #22
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    Thanks for sharing your story, tylersm and I hope you don't go off the rails like your sister. I think every person in my family was addicted to something or another so I shouldn't have been surprised to find my son had a drug problem. It doesn't matter much what's in your family tree or how you rationalize your usage. You need to remain vigilant and check yourself so you don't end up in that place. Wish you luck!
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    #23
    Bluelighter LesFleursDuMal's Avatar
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    It seems as if you're well aware of how addiction works, and the reason why you yourself are supposedly not addicted. Drugs are just a group of "rewards" that the brain treats in a similar way as food and sex. They increase the presence of active dopamine in the brain, and anything that increases it this way can be called addictive.

    You cause sensitization to the part of the brain called the nucleus accumbens through over-exposure every time you routinely use bioavailable routes to take high doses of any 'addictive' drug. You actually do suffer from some degree of addiction even with natural rewards that are not drugs. It is the urge that keeps us returning to certain things and activities because our brain says that they're good and we need to do keep doing them.

    Do you want to tell me, given your past and present recreational use of drugs, that you can quit today or tomorrow and be done with them for life?
    I don't know if you would in good conscience make such claims. If so you are deceiving yourself. I'm a bit defensive when drug users call out other drug users as worse addicts, it's not fair and not true.
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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by tylersm View Post
    Would I be considered an addict etc. If I only used drugs on a one week binge one every 5 years or so? I just don't know where the line is drawn
    It seems like common sense to me that what you are describing is not addiction. I mean, i hate to use the expression "common sense", but come on...of course if you only use once every 5 years you aren't addicted.

    It isn't a difficult calculation bro...if you derive enjoyment from drugs with minimal negative impact on your own life or the lives of others, then go ahead and "indulge"...only you can determine whether it is a "problem" or not, and only you can ultimately decide to make a change.
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    #25
    I think if you only binge a week every 5 years or a day every month what matters is are you planning to do and and are you looking forward to it / counting down the days.

    Anyway what I'm wondering Mr. OP is how old are you? You seem really young to me and you kind of hinted at that.

    I've used drugs since I was 16 but didn't consider myself an addict til about 24-25.
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