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Thread: MDMA and Mescaline connection

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    MDMA and Mescaline connection 
    #1
    Bluelighter opiatekrzy's Avatar
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    I have heard from several sources, and people, that either amphetamine (or MDMA specifically) and mescaline are "almost" identical in effects, however they're molecule structure are very far apart, and then oddly, for shits and giggles, out of.boredom I looked up MDMA, and the definition said "a hallucinogen and an amphetamine, related to mescaline ". Can someone explain the situation of mescaline and mdma. Thanks
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    #2
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    I often describe mescaline as being more reminscent of MDMA than LSD/shrooms to people who haven't tried it.
    Mescaline is quite a strong entheogen or empathogen, and is something more like other phenethylamine psychedelics (such as the 2C-x) than tryptamine psychedelics.
    Effects-wise, i find mescaline very rushy and euphoric - but more "composed" (not the wiggling eyes or gurning) than i find MDMA to often be.
    I don't feel edgy or paranoid on mescaline - just kinda warm, buzzy and content - like MDMA, and unlike LSD or tryptamines like shrooms or 4-aco-dmt etc.
    All subjective - i've only had san pedro cactus extracts, never pure or synthetic mescaline to compare.
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    #3
    Flectionshotmeister
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    MDMA and mescaline are both phenethylamines so they're in the same chemical family. The effects are similar in some ways. Both are warm and loving and comfortable. Mescaline is a psychedelic though, so it definitely goes deeper than MDMA. Still, I think it's closer to MDMA than it is to tryptamines or lysergamides like LSD.

    Basically what spacejunk said, except I don't find mescaline to be rushy. I find the experience to be very calm and centered the whole time.
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    #4
    Bluelighter opiatekrzy's Avatar
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    Thanks for the input guys
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    #5
    Bluelighter perpetualdawn's Avatar
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    That was a really accurate comparison/description spacejunk
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    #6
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    mescaline will substitute for situations where you would have taken mdma like a crowded concert where shrooms would have been too much

    you can keep kinda grounded on mescaline. it feels a lot like mdma during come up for about 4 hours then gets trippier at the end.
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    #7
    In terms of pharmacology, there are some pretty significant differences though:
    Psychedelics (like mescaline) work by "agonizing" (i.e. directly activating) specific serotonin receptors
    Empathogens (like MDMA) work by getting your brain to release serotonin

    However, there can be a certain overlap in terms of effects between the two groups:
    Many empathogens (including MDMA) also act as serotonin receptor agonists, meaning they are also psychedelic. At the same time, the way certain psychedelics act on your receptors may result in a state of mind similar to that produced by a stimulating empathogen. This seems especially true for certain phenylethylamine-type psychs, like Mescaline or 2C-B.
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    #8
    Mescaline is 3,4,5-trimethoxy-phenethylamine, MDMA is 3,4-methylenedioxy-n-methyl-amphetamine

    Mescaline is a phenethylamine, MDMA is an alpha-methyl-phenethylamine (amphetamine)

    First, let's describe the difference between a phenethylamine and an amphetamine. A phenethylamine is a benzene ring with a 2 carbon ethylamine side chain ( ph-ch2-ch2-NH2 ), the CH2 groups of the ethylamine side chain are labeled as the alpha and beta carbons, the carbon connected to the amine nitrogen being the alpha carbon. Now, "amphetamine" is short for "alpha-methyl-phenethylamine", so in chemical structure, the difference between an amphetamine and a phenethylamine is a methyl (CH3) grouping attached to the alpha carbon of the ethylamine side chain which is connected to position 1 of the benzene ring.

    Structurally, MDMA and mescaline are both phenethylamines, and share many identical features. Pharmacologically these compounds are fairly unrelated.

    When you take amphetamine, which pharmacologically is primarily a dopamine/adrenoceptor related compound, and place methoxy groups at 2 and 5, or a methylenedioxy grouping at 3 and 4 this dopamine and adrenoceptor pharmacology shifts, now involving serotonin and serotonin receptors.

    MDMA and mescaline are both phenethylamines, and as far as chemical structure is concerned they are closely related, however, mescaline is a true psychedelic, while MDMA is an entactogen/empathogen. So chemically they are related, while pharmocologically and phenomenological they are hardly related at all.

    (There are many drugs with psychedelic features which are not truly psychedelic, like MDMA, THC and cannabinoids, PCP, ketamine, tropane alkaloid deliriants such as those found in datura, and so on, when I say "psychedelic" I am not referring to these compounds, I am speaking of the compounds which are predominantly 5HT2a/c receptor agonists )
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