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Thread: BENZO VS OPIOID/BUPE Long term for anxiety Please Help

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    BENZO VS OPIOID/BUPE Long term for anxiety Please Help 
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    MY STORY(VERY IMPORTANT PLEASE READ):

    I have had debilitating anxiety since 2013 debilitating as in anxious to go out anywhere, anxious to talk on the phone or to anyone, racing thoughts all the time, feeling of complete uneasiness 24/7, had no appetite I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I felt like I was being tortured in my body and mind and it was inescapable. I first went to my doctor during this year of 2013 because I couldn't take it anymore. I was tried on all the main go to SSRIs at varying low and high doses up until 2015 one failing after the other. They all either made me feel sick, more anxious or made me severely depressed. At this time I kinda just gave up on making appointment after appointment I just felt like I was going in circles getting no results. It is now 2015 the last SSRI I got put on was Lexapro I kept taking it considering I didn't get any bad side effects and it couldn't hurt to stay on it because hey maybe it'll magically work one day. Months past I still had day to day anxiety and was still on the Lexapro. I got an ok paying job and became buddies with a co-worker we will call him Fred.Fred was a dealer and asked me if I knew anyone who was looking for Oxy or Spice. I always wanted to try Oxycodone but never had opportunity. We met after work and I bought a few 5MG pills.

    Later that night I took them and a little bit later BOOM. I know this feeling. I didn't feel high or out of it but just felt ok. I felt like what I would imagine "normal" to be ( Its sad because when you have anxiety for years that becomes your normal) I had No anxiety, No racing thoughts my mind became clear. I actually had the urge to go out and the urge to talk. I called up my friend that I didn't talk to in awhile and we had a convo for over an hour. Normally I wouldn't want to talk at all and if I did it would be at the most 10 mins fumbling over words and things to say. After that night I started taking Oxycodone at least once or twice a week I didn't feel like I needed it everyday but as long as I took it every week or two things were good. This continued up until mid 2016 ( so about a year and a half on and off)

    During this time you would think my life would've spiraled downwards getting worse. But It did the complete opposite. A Full 180. During this period I was using Oxycodone I stopped taking Lexapro because I felt I didn't need anything. I was going out every other night hanging with friends, became a social butterfly, got a girlfriend, and got a really good paying job Doing all the things I would've never dreamed off being able to do before. Things were so good I was completely convinced I beat my anxiety and I no longer had it. Towards the end of 2016 I didn't have the want to take the Oxycodone anymore. I felt like it was a hassle buying it, having it and being involved with it. And I was convinced I had beat my anxiety so I felt as if I didn't need it anyway. I slowly stopped taking it over the course of a few months. Until I stopped entirely. After I stopped things were okay for awhile nothing really changed but then slowly over the months bit by bit things started returning to how they were. I slowly stopped going out as much, I started to get slowly get feelings of uneasiness and dreadful anxiety again. I lost my job. I lost my girlfriend. It is now 2017 I haven't took Oxycodone since I stopped and I recently went back to the doctor and tried Lexapro again and after that giving me more anxiety tried Zoloft again which did the same.

    MY SELF RESEARCH/HYPOTHESIS:

    I believe in some people anxiety is more of a factor than just serotonin which shouldn't be hard to believe.
    I have made a list of the things that helped me in some way and why I think the helped me.

    - Opioids: Cured all made me more social more outgoing took away all anxiety (I believe this is either because the increase in dopamine or increase in opioid receptor activity)
    - Alcohol: Made me more social more outgoing and took away most anxiety (I believe This mainly because the increase of GABA or maybe dopamine)
    - Adderall: Made my mind clear and took away most mental anxiety made me a little more social but left me with a bodily anxiety that was horrible (I'm guessing mental clarity is because of dopamine the body anxiety is because of nor-epinephrine)

    Based on the things that helped me I think I could benefit from either a long term benzodiazepine (Dealing with GABA) or a partial opioid agonist like Suboxone.(Dealing with Dopamine/Opioid receptor) It seems most of the things that help have a play with dopamine. I'm willing to stay on which ever i need to for the rest of my life if it means I can get my life back so stopping wouldn't be a problem. I have heard of people using low dose benzodiazepines for years and Suboxone for years with no problems I would personally rather try something like Suboxone first because opioids are the main thing that helped me and the with drawls wouldn't be as horrible as a benzodiazepine
    if it doesn't work and I have to stop.

    MY QUESTIONS:

    1) What do you believe would be most effective for me a long term stimulant, benzodiazepine or something like suboxone.
    2) Do you think my psychiatrist (would is certified to prescribe suboxone) would consider putting me on it if I explain my story and my past use and how it benefited me

    PLEASE I ASK FOR YOUR SUGGESTIONS / OPINIONS ANYTHING IS APPRECIATED I REALLY WANT MY LIFE BACK.
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    #2
    Bluelighter
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    Hey buddy i can completely relate i have a similar situation with the Same type of anxiety issues like exactly as you described. Benzos will be more effective then suvboxone long term and tho alot of people on here may disagree with me, if being on benzos for the rest of your life is whatwhat will make your life functional then do it. You can stay at a reasonable dose and if you don't abuse them they will continue to work. Look into klonopin.
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    #3
    Quote Originally Posted by ovo1024 View Post
    Hey buddy i can completely relate i have a similar situation with the Same type of anxiety issues like exactly as you described. Benzos will be more effective then suvboxone long term and tho alot of people on here may disagree with me, if being on benzos for the rest of your life is whatwhat will make your life functional then do it. You can stay at a reasonable dose and if you don't abuse them they will continue to work. Look into klonopin.
    Thank you for replying. and what makes you think benzos would work better for me than the suboxone?
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    #4
    Bluelighter
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    After a short period of time you will not get any euphoric/anti anxiety effects from the suboxone, you will become dependent on opiates & the subs will only keep you from getting sick/withdrawal. Maintenance pretty much. Benzos keep there therapeutic effects for anxiety for years and years.
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    #5
    Agreed with Ovo.

    There is no need to start a regular opiate habit for anxiety (although I certainly agree they help with anxiety) when benzos are specifically targeted towards that. And keeping it at therapeutic doses will continue to be effective. Yes you will get dependant at some point, but if your anxiety is as crippling as you describe, it’s worth the trade-off.

    I’m honestly a little surprised your doctor didn’t put you on a benzo while you tested the SSRIs
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    #6
    Bluelighter cutlery69's Avatar
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    No matter which one of these drugs you take, the rebound anxiety is going to be absolutely horrendous. These drugs change you into a different person. While they're great at the beginning, the effects stop working over time and you're left with the dilemma of having to get off of them. The anxiety you'll get from the withdrawal of these drugs, especially benzos, will be absolutely horrendous.

    A good idea would be to get on a benzo now for a short period of time (1-2 months). Ask your doctor to try WellButrin. I had been on all and every SSRI for years and none of them did shit for my anxiety. Finally I got a new psychiatrist who suggested I try the WellButrin which works on the dopamine instead of the serotonin. The difference is night and day. My anxiety is practically non-existent anymore.

    Of course, there's no guarantee this will work the same for you, but be real careful of those addicting opiates/benzos/uppers.
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    #7
    just putting it out there - I experience a lot of similar anxiety and over time, I've come to realize it's because most of the adults in the society around me haven't the faintest clue what a hairs breath away from utter ruin they are at any given time, and that absolutely no one is in control/knows anything. I think it's a completely natural response to the world we currently live in. As far as what to do with that, the only thing that has helped me over time is taking control of the only thing I can - me. Doing martial arts, making my own odds for surviving the clusterfuck we call life a little better. It has helped me a lot. I sleep much better now. also - even the best planned/maintained exogenous chemical plan will eventually fail due to tolerance. I have not found a single medication that can treat these problems (benzos, opiates, alcohol, stimulants, psychedelics, dissociatives, weed, anti-depressents etc.) that is viable as a truly long term solution (doesn't leave you UTTERLY dependent to function. WHAT HAPPENS IN A NATURAL DISASTER WHEN THE PHARMACIES CLOSE?? That REALLY kept me up, and was a big reason I cleaned myself up)
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    #8
    Exactly how I see it Im willing to be dependant on something if It means being able to function Im just afraid if I go the route of benzos Ill have to keep increasing the dose to get any benefit from it then be in shitty situation if they stop working
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    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ovo1024 View Post
    After a short period of time you will not get any euphoric/anti anxiety effects from the suboxone, you will become dependent on opiates & the subs will only keep you from getting sick/withdrawal. Maintenance pretty much. Benzos keep there therapeutic effects for anxiety for years and years.
    If I do start a benzo im going to have to take it daily wouldn't that stop them from being effective over a prolonged period of time.
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    #10
    Bluelighter
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    There's conflicting studies that say they never lose there therapeutic effects, others say after so many years of increased dosing they lose there effect. Imo and somewhat experience, if you can start at say 1mg a day (whether in 2 doses of 0.5mg or just 1mg dose a day) and over a long period of time of your doctor slightly increasing your dose if needed never exceed 3mg a day Then you have a good chance of themdoing what they are supposed to in the very long term
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    #11
    Quote Originally Posted by ovo1024 View Post
    Hey buddy i can completely relate i have a similar situation with the Same type of anxiety issues like exactly as you described. Benzos will be more effective then suvboxone long term and tho alot of people on here may disagree with me, if being on benzos for the rest of your life is whatwhat will make your life functional then do it. You can stay at a reasonable dose and if you don't abuse them they will continue to work. Look into klonopin.
    QFT.
    Absolutely agree with Ovo here, and very close to what I would've said. Very good answer.

    And clonazepam (Klonopin) is a wonderful drug. Never found recreational value in it, but goddamn the therapeutic/medicinal aspects beat just about everything when it comes to anxiety of any kind.
    I didn't feel weird or anything like that, but felt completely normal, like a normal person...nearly no anxiety, triggers almost never had an affect, socializing was a breeze, being in public with crowds wasn't quite as bad. And it was SO long lasting. That shit is amazing. But everyone's body chemistry is different so everyone's experience with any particular substance may be different.

    DEFINITELY WORTH A TRY.

    -PA
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    #12
    Thank you everyone for replying I appreciate all inputs I will be looking into Klonopin to see if that helps
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    #13
    Bluelighter cutlery69's Avatar
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    Yeah longer term benzos like clonazepam are the best way to go. Your tolerance shouldn't build up as fast.

    With short term benzos though, your tolerance sky rockets very quickly. The first day I take 0.5mg of alprazolam it nearly knocks me out. The second day it makes me kind of tired. The third and forth day it doesn't make me tired at all. Then the fifth day, it's barely lowering my anxiety anymore. I have to up to 1mg.
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    #14
    Quote Originally Posted by ovo1024 View Post
    There's conflicting studies that say they never lose there therapeutic effects, others say after so many years of increased dosing they lose there effect. Imo and somewhat experience, if you can start at say 1mg a day (whether in 2 doses of 0.5mg or just 1mg dose a day) and over a long period of time of your doctor slightly increasing your dose if needed never exceed 3mg a day Then you have a good chance of themdoing what they are supposed to in the very long term
    My personal experience is that they do lose a large portion of their therapeutic effects/potential after years of use, assuming you aren't increasing your dose constantly. Personally I wouldn't recommend benzos as a long term solution for anything, after 10 or so years of taking 1mg daily clonazepam I feel like it's just a random errand I have to perform every day unless I want to unleash the hell of withdrawal. Also, assuming I hadn't been taking that 1mg for such a long time, they probably could have been a very helpful short-term remedy in a crisis. I suspect that even if I had increased my daily dose to 3mg a day during those 10 years, I would still have been in that "what the hell am I going to do with all this anxiety while already taking a benzo?".

    I am not everyone though, so I won't argue if someone feels like they are getting a long-term benefit from a multi-year steady(ish) benzo regime. I do believe that would eliminate the option of taking a very effective short-term anxiety relief though, unless you suddenly take 2x or 3x of your dose or something for a while, but because you have been taking benzos for years at that point, would you risk getting withdrawals by lowering back to the previous dose?
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