Social The mentality and thinking in being a sex-worker - ?

[JohnBoy2000]

There's never any premediation it. I do initially feel for them. I generally do give more benefit of doubt then the average person because of all the intentional lack of understanding I've experienced. But it never becomes a situation that provides anything useful for me actually. I usually end up more in debt. I don't even enjoy fucking them. Ive had to become the master of pleasing myself. Idk wtf I've been doing..

I have only been in 4 relationships. But they were long relationships cause there's children involved so I gave it my all. This is actually the longest I've been single in my life. The first one was the worst but I think me being a hooters girl during that time sabotaged a lot plus he was an asshole lol



I don't know how to say this without sounding arrogant but I think it plays a part. It's never been hard for me to have a man's full attention. But that kind is usually superficial. I don't want someone that's at my beckon call or that would let me walk all over them. Make me wonder. Let's play tug of war lol. Give me just enough to make me lean into you. Idk. I don't think my type exists. Maybe it's because I am too fucked up. So I think what happens is I end up trying to heal all the assholes.

I don't want everything I want. I kinda like being hungry.

And no it's never been to say "fuck you" to anyone else. That's bitter and revengeful. Those are extremely unhealthy and toxic so I try to keep those weeded out

Great post.

"Ive had to become the master of pleasing myself"

Does this mean you don't really experience orgasm or pleasure during sex with these "bad boys" (which based on my contention of physiology, makes perfect sense).

Have you ever experienced really gratifying sex, and with what type of person?


"I don't want someone that's at my beckon call or that would let me walk all over them. Make me wonder. Let's play tug of war lol. Give me just enough to make me lean into you"

Like, a challenge, not someone you could just have easily as you please?

That's probably not an unusual phenomenon:



The emotional physiology under writing this and how it pertains to nerve stimulation (thus sexual gratification) is definitely a hot-topic.


"I end up trying to heal all the assholes"

What does this mean? You don't enjoy fucking them but, there's some kind of allure because..... they seem damaged and perhaps it gives you a sense of purpose (and thus well being) to kind of, come to their emotional assistance?


"I don't want everything I want. I kinda like being hungry."

Again, this pertains to an "emotional challenge" of sorts. From a neurological (nerve stimulation) point of view, this is essentially a necessary component - it stimulates interest.

What I question is, if you're the type that can get a mans full attention, why prioritize the "bad boys", ahead of a good forward thinking man?

Apparently neither are really good in bed (right?).

But the latter contributes to society positively, and to offer companionship, tend to sexual needs and thus contribute to societies well being.......... that has no appeal? (absolutely not judging. I just oftentimes muse on why that doesn't happen more).

As in, really good looking girls it's like, they validate the "bad boys", when they'd be so appreciated by a more productive do-good man.
I figure they either attain a greater sense of excitement with the aforementioned, "bad boys"; feel rebellious by liaising with them, or they take comfort, security and excitement from being with the more bully type..... ?


"And no it's never been to say "fuck you" to anyone else. That's bitter and revengeful. Those are extremely unhealthy and toxic so I try to keep those weeded out"

As to this, there's kind of a cultural cliche that girls can indulge in such behavior due to what is generally referred to as, "daddy issues".

That is to say, they intentionally conduct themselves sexually in a way forward thinking society may typically frown upon;

Perhaps as a means to feel rebellious and glean associated excitation.

 

[JohnBoy2000]

I also don't want the responsibility of someone else loving me

I don't want someone that's at my beckon call or that would let me walk all over them. Make me wonder. Let's play tug of war lol. Give me just enough to make me lean into you. Idk. I don't think my type exists.

So again, this alludes to a man who can basically "make you want him", makes it a competition, a challenge.

This thread started off really to determine the potential sexual gratification female sex workers experience with their clients.

Without question, physiology is consistent across the demographic, regardless of whether a woman is a sex worker or just involved in a regular relationship.

Excitation exists in two realms:
1) neural - meaning propagation of electricity through the nerve, the basis of feeling/sensation, the sex being good. And
2) externalized excitation, mood related (basically when an organism feels externally excited, it's mediated through their nervous system).

My contention is that sex workers with good continuity in the trade find a means to experience sustained "excitation" with their clients, cause without excitation there's no good feeling and they'd just end up hating their job.


In the two above quotation boxes,

The first = an over-dependence of someone else onto you = definitely NOT consistent with presentation of a challenge in attaining their affections.

The second = very distinct description of being challenged, wanting to be challenged, to facilitate arousal.
When it's "too easy" = a passion killer.


That is to say, being emotionally challenged is stimulating, and exciting.

How this ties in with the "bad boys"?

I can only assume on some level there's an additional level of challenge than there is with regular "good" guys..... thus greater excitation, thus potential for better sex.

Excitation can also be mediated by an external sense of "empowerment" (empowerment is mediated through excitation, higher electricity coursing through our nerves emboldens us, makes us stronger/more-powerful - empowers).

Perhaps there's a feeling of rebelliousness associated with being with "bad boys" or bullies even, thus they provide a sense of being emboldend, empowered, thus excited (which possibly stimulate sexual interest, though I your post has also refuted this, saying you've had to learn to self-pleasure).

 

[Shady's Fox]

but what if you want to talk through hand signs? yet both of you are 100 operational, no mental deficit whatsoever

 

[Atomic_Decay]

@JohnBoy2000 I have been a little dubious about some of your theories but yesterday something clicked for me that suggested you might be onto something about the sexuality of (some) sex workers. I can’t quite figure something out and I’m not sure that a hyper sexuality or special kind of nervous system or cognitive make up is the correct answer but I’ll give you the data and see what you make of it;

In the last few months I’ve tripped on LSD with five different Chinese female sex workers whom I have known for some time and with whom I have enjoyed sexual relations but also quite a bit of time just hanging out and talking. Apart from the commercial aspect, the vibe between us is very relaxed, comfortable and friendly. In all cases they enjoyed smoking meth and expressed a curiosity about taking LSD after I visited them while tripping myself and in each case it was their first LSD experience. We tripped in their rooms at work, in the evenings, as part if a very long booking on my part to ensure we had sufficient time for the experience.

Each woman reacted to the LSD in EXACTLY the same way. With other women who are not sex workers, I have never seen a similar reaction. In fact quite the opposite.

Basically, each felt a very strong almost overpowering euphoric comeup from the acid very quickly. They became very animated for a little while and constantly repeated one the Chinese words for ‘beautiful’ which sounds like ‘piao’ in English. They kind of whispered it over and over again in an awe struck voice. Then they started to feel a bit anxious as the LSD came on stronger and they lay down next to me and closed their eyes and kind of vanished for a while. When they lay down they usually put their head on my shoulder and I put my one arm around them gently and held one of their hand with the other in an entirely non-sexual way.

Then, after a little while they started writhing around ecstatically. Ecstasy seems the only suitable word. And to me it appeared to be a highly sexual ecstacy but self- focussed and nothing to do with me as far as I could tell. For the whole period they were in this state they did not open their eyes once. One lady appeared to have a rolling climax for at least half an hour - and was unable to stop thrusting her pelvis into the air for that whole time. Another almost unconsciously grabbed a vibrator and worked her pussy over non-stop for close to two hours with an intensity I really worried would injure her while endlessly crying “my body, my body”. The more I tried to gently calm them and steer the trip towards something less physical and less uncontrollable the more it seemed to inflame them.

In each case, the comeup and this ecstatic period lasted around 2-4 hours after which each lady opened her eyes and recognised me and seemed to move into a normal kind of trip with heavy visual, auditory, and time distortions but each also complaining of severe muscle pain across their bodies and their muscles felt extremely hard and tense to me.

Now, each of these ladies , bar one, was pretty loaded on meth at the time they dropped the trip, so its important to consider the possibility that the LSD connected to the aphrodisiac effects of that drug rather than to something innate in the women. But the consistency of the experience across the 5 women and the fact I have never seen anything like it in non-working ladies I have tripped with has made me wonder what exactly was going on inside them. Of course, LSD in so mysterious we will never really know. One outcome though has been that the nature of my relationship with each lady changed afterwards and it seemed I became much more trusted and credible with them. Although a lot of stuff gets lost in translation between us, several messaged me the next day with a simple message to the effect of ‘Thank you. You are a good man’.

Although a couple have expressed a desire to trip again with me I have decided not to because just observing them as a Tripsitter is too mind-bending and emotional traumatic for me.

 

[JohnBoy2000]

This is super interesting, many thanks for sharing.

So I've quoted the pertinent aspects.

Just coming off an all night amph bender so will return later when I'm more lucid and use the edit-function to fill in the details.

I’m not sure that a hyper sexuality or special kind of nervous system or cognitive make up is the correct answer

I also have no idea.
But it would be interesting to think that's possible. Perhaps that kind of a response caused by LSD is as you say, indicative of some kind of hypersexuality they innately possess.

A function of their neural/genetic make up?

And was it pre-disposed (genetic) or acquired by way of development (neuro-adaptation)?
An acquired thought process (cognitive state)?
Some contend trauma can induce escapist based cognitive states, over indulgence in sexual activity to emotionally pacify?

One lady appeared to have a rolling climax for at least half an hour - and was unable to stop thrusting her pelvis into the air for that whole time. Another almost unconsciously grabbed a vibrator and worked her pussy over non-stop for close to two hours with an intensity I really worried would injure her while endlessly crying “my body, my body”

Again as sexual/feeling response is mediated by neural function, and neural function is determined by a sustained cognitive state (i.e. neural state adapts to the cognitive state), in amalgam or through the lens of the pre-disposed genetic state.

That's a pretty hardcore neural response, it sounds like a convulsion and need for intense stimulation.

So question being, did LSD precipitate some kind of outrageous neural response?
Or expose/accentuate some underlying hypersexuality that's uncharacteristic/unusual outside of sex workers?

My understanding of LSD is it's a cortical downregulator, 5HT2A agonist theorized to increase perceptive gain, but fMRI indicates it inhibits cortical activity (thus executive and cognitive function - thus can initiate a "neural reset" in some cases).

Removal of cortical filtering disinhibits limbic activity - where the limbic system is theorized to be the emotional zone - so it disinhibited their non-cognitive, non-self aware emotional response = convulsive, hypersexual.

So is there there some clandestined, underlying hypersexual urge?

And how did the meth play into it?

complaining of severe muscle pain across their bodies and their muscles felt extremely hard and tense to me

A convulsive response and muscle spasming doesn't seem to me to be unusual.

It's just bizarre that LSD would induce that?

Meth could cause convulsions?
Exacerbated by a disinhibited emotional response?

consistency of the experience across the 5 women and the fact I have never seen anything like it in non-working ladies I have tripped with has made me wonder what exactly was going on inside them

I suppose the non sex-workers weren't using meth/LSD co-administration for comparative purposes?

It could be that, being sex workers, they're cognitively conditioned to fuck constantly, and a kind stimmed up dissociated induced nerve response got under that conditioned thought process (thus neural state) and caused it go into over drive?

i.e. their vagina's obviously get a lot of action, and the drug-combo of emotional disinhibition and stimulation basically started making them do what they're conditioned to do, but in over-drive?

Potentially coupled with their pre-disposed genetic makeup which, if they chose sex work for a living, obviously has little inhibitions about putting their private area to work.


It's interesting.

That drug combo through the lens of a nervous system conditioned to fuck constantly?

Question may be, did they choose sex work cause of a pre-disposed desire to have their vagina's see endless action?

Or did their neural (via cognitive) state adapt and condition itself, given the line of work they do?


Bottom line you seem to be suggesting is, neural states and responses of full-on sex workers clearly respond differently and are conditioned differently to non-sex workers.

There's probably much more to explore.....

 

[AbbeyLee]

This is super interesting, many thanks for sharing.

I guess my replies weren't super interesting seeing as they didn't even get acknowledged.

How about that.. They just disappeared!

Rude.

 

[JohnBoy2000]

I guess my replies weren't super interesting seeing as they didn't even get acknowledged.

How about that.. They just disappeared!

Rude.

I didn't see them?

Except for the one that says, "lets talk about clients of sex-workers".

 

[plumbus-nine]

You can go and have sex on LSD? That fact alone is astonishing for me. Most drugs besides stimulants are absolute libido-killer for me and I've tried a few. Also I had some weird spiritual connections on dissociatives which I never really understood why connection is such an antaginist of sex (physical connection, in some sense, I guess..)

Have to admit that I didn't read the thread in its completeness yet and won't for now because the t opic is STILL too heavy, years after I knew two female sex workers (none of them ever paid, pure coincidence at its best) and had an affair with one of these, an affair which should have a damaging impact onto my life which I never really understood yet.

 

[Atomic_Decay]

You can go and have sex on LSD? That fact alone is astonishing for me. Most drugs besides stimulants are absolute libido-killer for me and I've tried a few. Also I had some weird spiritual connections on dissociatives which I never really understood why connection is such an antaginist of sex (physical connection, in some sense, I guess..)

Have to admit that I didn't read the thread in its completeness yet and won't for now because the t opic is STILL too heavy, years after I knew two female sex workers (none of them ever paid, pure coincidence at its best) and had an affair with one of these, an affair which should have a damaging impact onto my life which I never really understood yet.

In none of these instances did I have sex. I was tripsitting. The sexual stuff was the ladies solo. They I was holding them.

But at other times, and several hours into a trip, I l’ve had sex a few times. It was always weird. But adding meth and cialis to the mix either before tripping or after the comeup has facilitated some great sex a few times. Although in those cases, only I was tripping - not my partner.

 

[plumbus-nine]

If a woman is going to enter into a sexual liaison, she’ll clarify in her own mind the terms of engagement, so that she doesn’t come away after the event, feeling less about herself.

Would you say there are genetical roles for the genders (cause you say woman, in bold), and besides some exception these always predefined?. Or would you say that a man can fit this definition of woman, and vice versa?

Another thing I tried to bend my mind around but with the limited amount of people I've known so well enough that they even bothered to talk seriously about topics like sex.. well, it is too limited so far and I need to figure out whether I myself am in the trapmill of other bad stuff repeating ... but that's another thing.

Just this night I dreamt AGAIN about said girl (more of a woman, in her middle thirties but looked like 22 or so, also used to the fact that she could get almost any man she wanted IF she wanted but she wanted drugs, AND sex, to kill something induced by this exact livestyle.), she's been the 2nd girl ever in my life it's been 5+ years since I've last seen her for good and have no intentions to change this .. enough is enough. But then I kept opening BL and saw this thread, so I had to open it..

 

[arrall]

- This typically involves ensuring the man in question is firmly wrapped around her finger,

= a lapdog.

This comes across as rather misogynistic and I also don’t think that it is true in most cases. Do you have any evidence for this claim?

I'm not entirely sure how sex workers manage this, obviously pick and choose their clients, potentially hold out or remain emotionally withdrawn during an appointment - but it would be I'd imagine the primary consideration.

It seems like you are making the claim that you want to be true and then trying to manufacture/string together flimsy evidence to support your claims. Why not instead look at the facts and make fresh arguments based on what you see happening?

 

[arrall]

Just observation. Bars and nightclubs, girls typically make their man of choice jump through a decent series of hoops.

Depending of course.

Unless he's a serious Casanova and he's calling the shots.

It's not for certain of course, just a rather casual perception.


Examining "the facts" in sex work isn't so straight forward.

Girls could tell a man any or everything to optimize their leverage and outcome in a situation.

There's no obligation for any of their contentions to resemble truths or facts of the matter.

You seem to keep coming back to this narrative that all women have a desire to obtain as much emotional "leverage" and "control" over men as possible. That most women "need to have men wrapped around their fingers like lapdogs." When we ask you for evidence, all you can say is that this is based on "stuff you've seen". 'Stuff I might've seen at bars and nightclubs' is generally not considered sufficient evidence in social science, yet you keep attempting to present your claims as objective fact. How do you know that you aren't subconsciously looking for things that will validate your worldview while ignoring things that go against it?

Misogyny is not permitted in SLR as per forum guidelines. Can you explain to me how your arguments would not be considered misogyny, given that you are prejudicing women and claiming that they will act in certain negative ways based solely on their gender?

 

[plumbus-nine]

You seem to keep coming back to this narrative that all women have a desire to obtain as much emotional "leverage" and "control" over men as possible. That most women "need to have men wrapped around their fingers like lapdogs." When we ask you for evidence, all you can say is that this is based on "stuff you've seen". How do you know that you aren't subconsciously looking for things that will validate your worldview while ignoring things that go against it?

One will find what he seeks, at least in relationships. This is a bit more complicated than attraction between bipolar magnets and yeah, on depressive days I thought quite much about misogynic stuff and yeah, it happens A LOT but from both sides. Guys talk with guys similar just opposite than girls talk with girls, and from both sides I'm sick and tired off. That said, I'm not sure what I prefer. The current loneli-/isolatedness or stereotypic crowds.

 

[arrall]

it happens A LOT but from both sides. Guys talk with guys similar than girls talk with girls, and from both sides I'm sick and tired off.

"Both sides do it" does not make the behaviour permissible. We treat misandry and gross generalizations about men the same way.

 

[plumbus-nine]

I wasn't specifically referring to bluelight here

 

[JohnBoy2000]

You seem to keep coming back to this narrative that all women have a desire to obtain as much emotional "leverage" and "control" over men as possible. That most women "need to have men wrapped around their fingers like lapdogs." When we ask you for evidence, all you can say is that this is based on "stuff you've seen". 'Stuff I might've seen at bars and nightclubs' is generally not considered sufficient evidence in social science, yet you keep attempting to present your claims as objective fact. How do you know that you aren't subconsciously looking for things that will validate your worldview while ignoring things that go against it?

Misogyny is not permitted in SLR as per forum guidelines. Can you explain to me how your arguments would not be considered misogyny, given that you are prejudicing women and claiming that they will act in certain negative ways based solely on their gender?

I could, but I'm about to black out.

I'd prefer to just go back and delete posts that mention such things.

Then avoid them in future.

Sound fair?

 

[arrall]

I could, but I'm about to black out.

I'd prefer to just go back and delete posts that mention such things.

Then avoid them in future.

Sound fair?

Perfect.

 

[Nurse Ratched]

I guess my replies weren't super interesting seeing as they didn't even get acknowledged.

How about that.. They just disappeared!

Rude.

You deleted them yourself at 3:08 and 3:09 AM

 

[JohnBoy2000]

Perfect.

Cool, they were posted on an amphetamine bender.

I'm hanging now so give me a a little while to get my senses back and it will get done.

 

[arrall]

So question being, did LSD precipitate some kind of outrageous neural response?
Or expose/accentuate some underlying hypersexuality that's uncharacteristic/unusual outside of sex workers?

My understanding of LSD is it's a cortical downregulator, 5HT2A agonist theorized to increase perceptive gain, but fMRI indicates it inhibits cortical activity (thus executive and cognitive function - thus can initiate a "neural reset" in some cases).

Removal of cortical filtering disinhibits limbic activity - where the limbic system is theorized to be the emotional zone - so it disinhibited their non-cognitive, non-self aware emotional response = convulsive, hypersexual.

So is there there some clandestined, underlying hypersexual urge?

And how did the meth play into it?

About to go walk the dog, but I will quickly provide a very simplified version of the current scientific knowledge (Which is admittedly rather primitive, as we don't understand nearly as much as we could) on how LSD works on the brain.

Through 5HT2A agonism, LSD and other psychedelics desynchronize the default mode network which is generally active when people are daydreaming/lost in thought. For people with disorders such as Alzheimer's, Autism Spectrum Disorder, ADHD, depression/bipolar, anxiety, Borderline Personality Disorder, dissociative disorders, etc. the DMN is often overactive and extremely dysfunctional. Deactivation of the DNM takes people out of this default state of being where they are excessively self-focused and lost in thought and puts them more in touch with the world around them, their bodies, and their emotions. This could be the mechanism responsible for ego dissolution.

Another mechanism for the neurological changes of psychedelics are the increased connections between many different parts of the brain that are not traditionally communicating with each other (in addition to doing the exact opposite to the default mode network as we just talked about.) This is likely responsible for the hyperemotionality and increased imagination that LSD seems to cause in most people. @Skorpio tends to know more about this stuff than I do, so he can correct me if I've made any missteps here.

While psychedelics CAN cause both muscle tightness/contractions and hypersexuality, I would guess that the effects @Atomic_Decay observed (or at least the intensity of said effects) were most likely due to the combination of LSD with methamphetamine.

Cool, they were posted on an amphetamine bender.

I'm hanging now so give me a a little while to get my senses back and it will get done.

Understandable. I believe I edited out the parts from your past few posts that I found to be violations of the rules. Just try to refrain from generalizations (particularly negative ones) about different groups from now on (e.g. 'Most women' or 'Women' or 'All women'). You should also present your ideas as your subjective opinions rather than objective fact. So 'I notice that some women may have a tendency to do _' instead of 'Women do _'. These discussions are very interesting to have, but it is important to make sure that we aren't prejudicing certain groups in the process.