• Select Your Topic Then Scroll Down
    Alcohol Bupe Benzos
    Cocaine Heroin Opioids
    RCs Stimulants Misc
    Harm Reduction All Topics Gabapentinoids
    Tired of your habit? Struggling to cope?
    Want to regain control or get sober?
    Visit our Recovery Support Forums

Benzos ⫸Benzo Guide v.1⫷

nakita71

Greenlighter
Joined
May 31, 2016
Messages
3
Can someone tell me how long it takes for a 1mg Clonazepam ODT to work? Have panic attacks and it was prescribed to me
 

fsociety

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
15
The bioavailability of Zolpidem should also be noted: "The reported aqueous solubility of zolpidem tartrate is 23 mg/ml (Merck Index)." Also, due to the high intranasal bioavailability, numerous delivery methods have been patented for methods other than insomnia, as noted in the following patent, https://patents.google.com/patent/US8034371B2/en. It also lists numerous ways to increase the aqueous extraction using multiple methods ranging from changing the PH balance to simply adding additional compounds.

From personal experience, I have also noted that long term use of Benzodiazepines also affects the tolerance level to Zolpidem, if not all imidazopyridine class with nonbenzodiazepine properties, although it also reacts on the GABAa receptors on the same area as benzodazepines do, which would support my theory that tolerance to benzodizepines would indeed lessen the effect of Zolpidem. I have also taken thirty 10mg Zolpidem at one time and noticed no different in effect from five. This is a medication I was prescribed for multiple years as an adolescent when it was only recommended for short (10-14 day) prescriptions for insomnia. I have a personal friend who has a been on Zolpidem 10mg 1 x nightly for over 12 years and psychologically believes she cannot sleep without it. As a military veteran with panic disorder and agoraphobia, I've often noticed more efficient relief of panic attack symptoms from Zolpidem, possibly due to it's quicker onset, which is as little as five minutes when taken on an empty stomach.

A danger that is noted in the side effects can be the insomnia and well documented D.U.I.s, uncontrollable eating during the night, etc... while this has never been an issue, even with extremely high doses and methods of use such as intranasal, no side effect ever occurred, with the exception of mild withdrawal accompanied with increased anxiety. Even when mixed with alcohol, no negative side effects ever occurred, except mood stabilization, especially anger became more prevalent and easier to trigger.

One new years, an ex-friend attempting to isolate me from my fiance while I played pool started buying me drinks and placing Alprazolam and Zolpidem in these drinks. As I already had a high tolerance to benzodazepines due to my own prescription of Alprazolam. While I was not currently prescribed Zolpidem, I had been for years in the past. After hours of drinks continually provided with an unknown official dosage amount (the jail didn't perform the blood test in time to catch the maximum levels of Zolpidem), the ex-friend then started telling me about these other men at the club talking very negatively about me. (This was false as security tapes later proved.) I became extremely agitated beyond control and started yelling racial words I have never even thought of calling anyone in entire life. My ex-friend got what he wanted, which was a me against everybody brawl that ended quite quickly when a cop grabbed me from behind. Myself in fight or flight mode, not knowing this was an officer and of course military trained with additional MMA training quickly threw an elbow to my assailant attacking from the rear, rendering the FEMALE police officer unconscious. Now please, remember, I had no idea who I had hit. I was attempting to fight these three men, not a female police officer. I didn't regain mental consciousness (my actual mind and logical reasoning returning to my body) until approximately 5 hours later, where I learned I was in the drunk tank at the city jail with two charges, felony assault II against a police officer and misdemeanor resisting arrest. Now, needless to say, police don't treat people who attack their own very well. Myself, a first time offender, never arrested as an adult, was on a 72 hour solitary confinement hold with no knowledge of what I did or what had happened. During this time, I try to to inform the nurse of my absolute positivity that I had been drugged and needed a substance level detection performed as soon as possible. I was only provided a basic panel blood toxicology showing 2.1 alcohol along with "critical levels of benzodiazepines" which I knew my own dose could cause and would be useless in course. I then tried to inform the nurse of my impending health concerns, including my benzodazepine withdrawal. She informed me this was not a cause of seizures and that Phenobarbital or Lorazepam wasn't warranted for an Alprazolam dose of 8mg daily. She gave me a Celexa and told me this would prevent my seizures, lol. I later learned my fiance and mother were calling and trying to inform them of the same issue at hand.

When my 72 hours of solitary had ended, I was transferred to the county prison and placed in the violent offenders population, wearing the same color as my cellmate who had murdered his wife "by mistake while they were fighting over his handgun he left out after going to the gun range earlier that day during an argument." Minutes before being placed in my cell, I had received my first phone call 96 hours after my initial arrest. The nurse also was not concerned with my benzodiazepine withdrawal, which my fiance had done what she was told and brought them a copy of the prescription, but I was reminded that I "assaulted a police officer." Luckily, being less than 25% of ethnic divide in a prison for a city consistently ranked top eight nationwide for murder and a very severe civic rights past that our generation had long put behind us, but being in Birmingham, Alabama, you get people that lived in some places where they didn't have or know how to read a book to begin with. Luckily, my cellmate, who had informed me he was servicing 25 to life at only 28 years old, showed me who to avoid (child molesters or child murderers) who were apparently already marked for death by the overwhelming Gangster's Disciple gang presence, accompanied by a presence of the Crips, who actually get along with G.D.'s because of their combined hate for the bloods and Aryan Brotherhood. He always knew why I was here before I asked, "You the former Navy SEAL that knocked that cop out while fighting over 10 people, right?" This sounded like nothing I wanted to try to correct or explain my behavior for, plus, all I knew was what I had been told. The one thing I knew for sure was I was a Navy veteran, but I was not a SEAL. I had no reason to correct that detail and was thankful the corrections officer must have mistaken my Navy Rescue Swimmer emblem pinned in my wallet (which is spec ops, but not as badass as a SEAL by; any means...), "Yeah, those drugs and liquor don't mix with assholes.", I weakly answered. He then noticed I was looking awfully sick. "You coming off dope?" I informed him of my Alprazolam withdrawal, but my more obvious Methadone withdrawal that had finally hit it's peak. He then showed me how he used our pathetic excuse for sheets/blankets to make a pretty decent sleeping bag. I got there right when they closed the common area, which I was thankful. He explained to me how it worked in the morning, I was lucky I was in there for hurting a cop and everyone had heard I was a SEAL, so I would be OK for a couple days until someone tried to actually size me up. I told him I was waiting on my bail and girl so I could get out of there hopefully within the hour. As I started out the tiny window, he said, "Don't keep looking, if your family said they're coming, they're coming." My intercom went off two hours later saying grab my shit and follow whatever color line on the floor. I got my clothes back. Got in the car at 4 A.M., then had my fiance and my mother confirm the worse thing I could imagine. I really did hit a cop and it really was a female cop who was hospitalized with broken jaw.

By the time I could get a toxicology for Zolpidem, was out of my system. With the baseline of my regular doctor visits used with the baseline of the benzodiazepine levels from the city jail, as well as the knowledge of the person's prescriptions (90 1mg Alprazalam, 30 10mg Zolpidem), it was estimated I ingested 250-280mg of Zolpidem and including my own 2mg Alprazolam I took before I began drinking that night, 40-60mg of Alprazolam. The reports were useful in course, along with the security footage of the accused "drugger" pulling out prescription bottles repeatedly at both bars attended each time he got up to bring me a drink. He quickly moved to Atlanta, GA right before that and disappeared. Due to the security footage showing I had no way to know it was a police officer who grabbed me from behind and the super expensive lawyer I paid for his connections just to be safe, I ended up having my charges knocked down to misdemeanor assault and one year unsupervised probation. For those who care, this guy thought if he kept me away all night and showed my fiance I was a complete drug addicted slobbering idiot, she would leave me for him. Thankfully, she knew my normal behavior, even when I had drank too much and acted like a normal asshole on Alprazolam and liquor.



TL;DR - The reported water solubility of zolpidem tartrate is 23 mg/ml (Merck Index). There are numerous ways to manipulate the water solubility using PH balance and other substances Zolpidem tolerance appears to be directly related to benzodiazepine tolerance, although it's a drug with nonbenzo properties residing in the imidazopyridine class due to it's reaction on the GABAa receptors. This has been observed by others who watched me ingest 260mg of Zolpidem orally and 40mg nasally, 4mg Alprazolam, 1.5 Liter of Moscatto Wine (11% Alcohol by volume). My theory to this dangerous usage was due to my panic disorder I felt an overwhelming desperation to achieve the anxiety calming effects associated with Zolpidem, however tolerance had been achieved and I was unwilling to increase alcohol intake due to previous experience.

High doses with alcohol cause extreme inability to control emotions such as anger, much more so than normal alcohol use with large doses of Alprazolam and other benzodiazepines (I have drank until blackout in the Navy many times and as well as binge drinking while on high doses of multiple benzodiazepines, including while mixing different benzodiazepines and never experienced loss of control with zero memory due to the over 10 years of prescribed use of extremely high doses of Alprazolam, Clonazepam, Diazempam, Midazolam, Temazepam, Lorazepam, including recreational usage of Flunitrazepam without ever suffering compete memory loss. This often occurred mixed with other families of drugs as well.) Zolpidem has a high water solubility, meaning it is more effective when insufflated. The coating must be removed with light moisture and a paper towel or shirt. It burns briefly, but quickly subsides as well as the near instant onset quickly makes your attention of the pain dissipate and you will do more without hesitation. Zolpidem based nasal mist medications have many pending patents for nasal sprays for numerous uses besides insomnia including Parkinson's disease, stroke, and numerous other brain traumas. Source: https://patents.google.com/patent/US8034371B2/en

Alcohol increases the common insomnia side effect as so with benzodiazepines, however it is almost as if Alcohol and Zolpidem deactivates common sense and moral reasoning based on my experience as well as the multiple reports of wrecks and D.U.I.s reported while under the influence of Zolpidem. I once heard someone refer to Alcohol and Zolpidem as a truth serum due to the power of suggestion the user becomes susceptible to under these conditions.
 

fsociety

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
15
Also, all the oral information on Zolpidem is based on it's directions of ingesting on an empty stomach.
 

fsociety

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
15
I also was wondering as I read this thread. You stated the interest in drugs with the reaction of the GABA receptors, which causes me to wonder how would you relate GHB? I know it's primarilly a psychoactive, it hits GABAb receptors, while not primarily, but it is legally prescribed in many countries for insomnia and legally created for use in others. Also like many of the Benzodiazepines listed, it has and still is used as an anesthetic. I know this is probably outside the spectrum you're collecting this valuable information, plus the information would have to be verified that it's based on pharmaceutical grade GHB and the information isolated from the many stigmas surrounding a beneficial drug due to it's use as a date rape drug, just like Flunitrazepam. I feel if Zolpidem Zopiclon, and Zaleplon are included, alternatives should be considered that serve the same desired purpose.. My reasoning would be the positive and negative affects on R.E.M. sleep, with studies on GHB leading the way of the three with the least amount of side effects, most accurate natural sleep patterns, no increase in tolerance.

Also, many of us who are prescribed benzodiazepines for everyday function also many times also require a medication for sleep such as myself with Zolpidem.

I know I'm new, however I've used this forum for over 16-17 years for drug information and advice. I feel I finally owe the community to contribute back. If I post something discussed in a different thread and I'm repeating information, I appreciate your correction. I'm doing my best to read the entire thread before submitting a post.

Thanks,
fsociety
 

Lorne???

Bluelight Crew
Joined
May 3, 2014
Messages
2,544
^ Hey and welcome to BL

Let me first state, I am the de facto commander of this thread; Scrofula posted the "official " stuff, based mostly off my research and knowledge, though some of it needs to be corrected

Ghb is interesting, though outside of the scope of what we (to my knowledge) are establishing in this thread, though certainly there are places to discuss it

My focus is on benzodiazepines, and anything that hits the same receptor subunits, so Z drugs,(like ambien, Lunesta, which is just an evergreen of Sonata) although of course a bit different, count and info is appreciated. Thienodiazepines are, or at least should, be included, as they are almost identical it seems, although etizolam is the only common one of any kind atm

Your post is interesting and an f'ed up story, though that is something more for our dark side forum, or social or something; Thus thread is to focus on benzodiazepines, and get the most information and best information as practical, and post it accurately, and hope people like you use it

Thank You for using the forum and joining after more than a decade; I too remember not being legal drinking age and using BL :)

Anyway, yours truly has a lot of problems and other things going on, though shall try to update eventually

To you and everyone else, sourced information is always appreciated, although I pretty much am an expert and know far too much about the pharmacology of benzodiazepines (some of the very complex thins are of little interest, and my chemistry is basic, so Chemistry related things can help)

I lost access to a great list with reliable solubility figures for the common benzos, so that would be a help

Anyway hope this can become a more commonly used resource; I also do opioids, my original doc

Luck too you all, and Live Long and Prosper - Lorne

To
 

fsociety

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 12, 2017
Messages
15
Thanks, Lorne.

Sadly I know and have been on Xanax for more of my life than off of it, so it's one of those things I hate that I know. Ambien is also something I have taken for long periods of time, but I haven't studied into the "nonbenzodiazepines" as much as I have the actual benzos. I have a chart around here somewhere of all the different solubility levels for the most popular benzos somewhere. I also have a list I made of which ones are closest related to which chemistry wise, which is mostly based on age of discovery, tbh.

Thanks for the feedback.
 

MGLA

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 9, 2015
Messages
88
Has anyone tried Rambaxy Terapia benzo's i used to love benzo's but iv got 100 of these because iv been put on Vyvanse and need something to calm me down at night, dont remind me of how good valium used to be at all, they came blistered
 

Thomas29

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
1,503
Why has no one mentioned the disturbing effect Etizolam has on Increasing Prolactin Levels? That And the Blepharospasms are the only reason I have not used any yet. It is Prescribed in certain countries And I know it has A small amount of research done it at the very least.
 

Lorne???

Bluelight Crew
Joined
May 3, 2014
Messages
2,544
^ Becuase it has been proven to be more effecticive long term on benzodiazepines on anxiety, (or rather research suggests it) and the prolactin increase isn't something I've read into deeply.

Glad to note it though, erizolam needs more reswaech
 

Thomas29

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
1,503
^ Exactly if I knew more about Etizolam I might use it for example I know the Human Growth Hormone Benzodiazepines cause in Non tolerant users is blunted in tolerant users which is one of the ways they know if your tolerant or not to Benzos in Hospitals least Or maybe it was for A different reason they did it I don't remember.


But I NEED to know how long the Prolactin Levels stay elevated for And how High of an Increase which I remember coming across some Research into A startling Increase of like 33% in Prolactin Levels after using Etizolam And I could only IMAGINE how high the Prolactin Levels Increase would be in High Tolerant Benzo with A Cross Tolerance individuals such as myself that would need Higher Doses then A non tolerant person.


I would think that it would be beneficial to everyone and not just myself if that information was made clear to any potential Users And the KNOWN Statistical Data of the chance of developing blepharospasms And if they vary in severity.


The point is Etizolam is not some Brand New And never been Prescribed before Medication without any Research done into at all so considering the fact it has 6x stronger Anxiolytic Effects than Diazepam from what I Read And it has been shown to be better for Long-Term Anxiety relief better then other Benzos/GABAergics similar to Clonazepam And how it retains it's Anti-Anxiety Effects And has Serotonin Increasing Effect making it A very Unique Effect for A Benzo which is ironic if you think about it how Etizolam has Unique Effects too.
 

Lorne???

Bluelight Crew
Joined
May 3, 2014
Messages
2,544
Your talking rare side effects man, I don't recall ever coming across that in my research
 

Lorne???

Bluelight Crew
Joined
May 3, 2014
Messages
2,544
Scrofula was format man, I'm not sure what do to in his absence about making it prettier. CFC is great with that kind of think
 

Thomas29

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
1,503
Rare? It is literally inevitable that Prolactin Levels are Increased by using Etizolam. If your talking about the blepharospasms being rare it was A question And not at all a statement if I did not word it clearly sorry. But I have Read people experiencing it but I have no idea how rare it is, Most likely because that information is not available which is obvious and needless to mention Or... at least it should be.


But Information on Prolactin Levels that it Increases should be available to some degree at least. Etizolam has a lot of promise for my specific uses/needs and is something I would use but with My Testosterone Levels Lower due to Methadone Maintenance the last thing I need is to be producing more Prolactin. Not to mention with My high Benzo Cross-Tolerance I would likely need extremely high doses of Etizolam.
 
Last edited:

Thomas29

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
1,503
Can anybody find any Links to Sources for the effects of Etizolam induced Prolactin Levels being Increased as I might be forced to use Etizolam to avoid severe and deadly Withdrawal Symptoms from other Benzos I Am using right now?
 

Jekyl Anhydride

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Jul 23, 2016
Messages
5,412
Location
In a xenon pit
Are you panning on using Etizolam for years at double digit mg doses per day? I think the risk of hyperprolactinemia from Etizolam is very rare and progressive with time, amount of use and genetics.. if it's even plausible. It's not like catching Hep c, it's a slow progression and should be way down on the list in comparison to the immediate issue of your risky benzo taper.

There's only anecdotal evidence out there anyways while some countries still prescribe it. If it was the kingpin drug of hyperprolactinemia I'm sure there would be at lest one peer reviewed paper on it vs just some reddit speculation.

You can always get a blood test to confirm your status after you stop using the Etiz but I highly doubt you'll be lactating after a few weeks use.


-----------
hyperprolactinemia is caused by many drugs besides just Etizolam:

Dopamine receptor blockers
*Atypical antipsychotics: risperidone
*Phenothiazines: chlorpromazine, perphenazine
*Butyrophenones: haloperidol
*Thioxanthenes
*Metoclopramide
Dopamine synthesis inhibitors
*α-Methyldopa
Catecholamine depletors
*Reserpine
Opiates
H2 antagonists
*Cimetidine, ranitidine
Tricyclic antidepressants
*Amitriptyline, amoxapine
Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors
*Fluoxetine
Calcium channel blockers
*Verapamil
*Estrogens
*TRH
________________________________________________________________
There are Dopamine agonists like Cabergoline that can treat it though.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10404830

And some non drug solutions:

"These results show that vitamin E treatment lowers prolactin levels"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1490755

"Zinc: an inhibitor of prolactin (PRL) secretion in humans"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2753470
 

FnX

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 8, 2009
Messages
749
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8329784/

This is to demonstrate that dosage form can effect rate of absorption;

On the same page, is a link saying that the pharmacokinetic parameters were altered with daytime vs nighttime administration, which is just weird

(Temazapam Tmax 1.2-1.8 in study, can be longer though)

How can the Tmax be significantly shorter while Cmax (and AUC) remains relatively same for both formulations? If the rate of absorption is faster, which would explain a shorter Tmax, it should change Cmax to a higher value too, no? If the elimination rate was faster on the other hand, shouldn't we observe changes in AUC? Don't have access to the whole study so can't check the details, but the different Tmax value in this case might not accurately reflect a difference in the rate of absorption. By using different measurement for the rate of absorption they might have concluded it similar too:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1592542 - Comparison of absorption rates in bioequivalence studies of immediate release drug formulations

Curiously, the supposedly faster acting 7.5mg capsules are mentioned along with their specific brand, while the similar yet somehow slower acting 30mg capsules remain anonymous. Almost like an attempt at a sales pitch.
 

Thomas29

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
1,503
That's what I thought... But the point is it most likely produces more Prolactin at first and less later as u use more and get a tolerance to the "production" of it and I do plan to use it and then get myself tested simply as a science experiment. I conquer with what u said about you would need to use it daily and in high doses but I will most certainly 100% be posting back with my findings as I take a Testosterone, DHEA And Estrogen Test once a year and I haven't done it yet this year as I been busy but I do it because I'm on Methadone and the daily Opioid use decreases testosterone and dhea and I just figure I should test and keep an eye on Estrogen just in case.


Don't forget everyone is different some are more sensitive to the small amount of prolactin release than others but I have used Cimetidine which probably increases Estrogen more then Etizolam since it has and does cause gynecomastia and other issues from Estrogen increase but I have never experienced problems from it mainly since I only ever used it in a 1000MG potentiating Dose at one time and to lower stomach acidity before taking things like oxycodone until I read about the Estrogen release so I don't know if I would of got problems from daily use no doubt my levels of Estrogen would increase but like I said every is more sensitive to estrogen release and Cimetidine which increases Estrogen enough of increase in Estrogen to cause gynecomastia and it OTC in America but in Canada I needed to drive over the board to get it since it is Prescription only here most likely for that reason lmfao!


You guys actually made me smile today thanks for that. :) The oxymoron of blind trust in the F.D.A of countries that vary with the certain drugs like Lormetazepam which I believe is not prescribed in canada and u.s. for what ever reason and the amount of RDA for like Vitamin And mineral daily requirements like for vitamin K most recently for example. :)


I will post back with my Bill Nye the Science guy results lol I think I am high off this shatter extract i just vaped in my volcano I haven't been able to breathe in any vapor weed for a long time and the huge doses I need from edibles are ot expensive and i dont got any made at the moment this post is just funny no matter what right now rofl!
 
Top