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Opinion Big Pharma is Evil: Serotonin Theory of Depression Debunked

Cosmic Charlie

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Psilocybin or 4-AcO-DMT works way better as an antidepressant for me than any SSRI ever has. And it's like a spot treatment because personally I don't get depressed all the time it just hits me really heavily sometimes when my bi-polar swings in that direction. Then I just take a moderate dose and by the time the trip is over I am walking on a cloud. I have an acute afterglow for days but the positive benefits can last months if not longer, this is just my personal experience.
 

Neuroborean

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Just as an example, my gf has been medicated for a loooong time, I'm pretty sure she has DID because I saw serious crisis that cannot be pinpointed as anything else, but... she has a MDD diagnose. Not to say she is not depressed, she probably is, but due to a misdiagnose and not looking into her trauma. Now she is heading her life right so she is less depressed. What's sure is that I tried several herbs/supplements with her and kratom works million times better than any of the synthetic shit she has been offered.
If she has a crisis, or bad mood, kratom takes her out of the hole at least 85% times, strongly for 5 hours and more or less good for another 4. SSRIs are useless after the first 1-2 months of effective treatment, they only work for a while , and then: you're addicted.
 

nznity

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It's all natural too unlike these ssri's and anti psychotics that just make people fat and emotionless

Bro you should try olanzapine lol it's crazy how much damage it does in less than a year :p
I have, 10mg Zyprexa every night for 2 months. It'd knock me the fk out every night and it made me feel stupid.
 

Xorkoth

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SSRIs are only somewhat more effective than placebo in the majority of people. They CAUSE depression in others. And for some, they work great. Certainly serotonin plays a role in depression, but so does dopamine. For most people depression is situational, and it's the brain's way of telling you "hey, something about your life isn't working". Big pharma wants people who need to take their drugs for life, and as a result, doctors are trained to treat depression with pills, rather than work on the underlying causes. Of course, not all doctors do this.

Some people have mental imbalances that result in treatment-resistant depression However, most people who are depressed, are depressed because of underlying reasons, whether that be trauma (which is much more difficult to treat), or because of situational factors like a job they hate, lack of friends, or a bad relationship. To try to treat that sort of depression primarily with pills is a disservice to patients.

I was crushingly depressed for years. It was because I was in an abusive relationship. Once I got out of that relationship, I had years that were the happiest, most fulfilled, and best of my life. if I hadn't gotten out of that relationship, I would still be depressed, if I was even still alive. I was fantasizing about dying for the last year or two of it.
 

Robi

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my psychiatrist recently said no to me asking him to increase the remeron, he said it will make you too groggy, for some reason in my heart i felt he didnt want me on it, he seems so different that others that pushed loads of different antidepressants, i bet he knows all this shit , being in medicine near 50 years
 
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Skorpio

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Dxm for me has a very unique effect compared to (non-SSRI) arylcyclohexylamine dissos. I feel especially numb and serene after trips. I usually plan a light day after and enjoy the headspace— I feel like I understand why SSRIs are used— they are calming without being compulsive.
 

Neuroborean

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for @Skorpio , kanna varies a lot in terms of quality... I didn't understand kanna so much so to speak, but I used it quite a lot during some time so I started to get what it's about,
if you find good quality batches it seems to be pretty euphoric and uplifting, specially extracts. I know some vendors that are well known for offering good quality kanna, they have a lot of different rapé's too...
Some people like nasal ROA extracts so much, to the point that some people compare it with a mdma come-up.
For me the herb alone it's too spacy to be useful, never tried extracts.
 

Skorpio

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for @Skorpio , kanna varies a lot in terms of quality... I didn't understand kanna so much so to speak, but I used it quite a lot during some time so I started to get what it's about,
if you find good quality batches it seems to be pretty euphoric and uplifting, specially extracts. I know some vendors that are well known for offering good quality kanna, they have a lot of different rapé's too...
Some people like nasal ROA extracts so much, to the point that some people compare it with a mdma come-up.
For me the herb alone it's too spacy to be useful, never tried extracts.
Like what is your ideal use case for kanna? Do you use it during contemplation, or is it a way to unwind, or is it a social drug? I've honestly only tried it socially and it didn't really seem useful in that context for me.

What ROA are you familiar with? I have only tried nasal kanna and not extracts.

Is it a drug you redose during a session or is it a one and one type thing?
 

jpgrdnr

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the other kicker for me was that dopamine isn't reward


I think there was another Huberman interview where I guess its what leads you to reward, a pre-state or chemical release that drives you to whatever it is you are looking for

I mean we always talk about how getting drugs was almost better than actually doing them, and I think thats part of it. The other key element which we know is that the longer you wait the bigger the payoff will be
 

Neuroborean

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Like what is your ideal use case for kanna? Do you use it during contemplation, or is it a way to unwind, or is it a social drug? I've honestly only tried it socially and it didn't really seem useful in that context for me.

What ROA are you familiar with? I have only tried nasal kanna and not extracts.

Is it a drug you redose during a session or is it a one and one type thing?
I've tried nasal (very painful and disgusting), tea and sublingual. For me sublingual works better, but "sublingual" is putting a lot of kanna in your mouth, like 0.5-1.5 grams for example, and start moving it inside your mouth, with a chewing gum for example. It needs to be quite a looong time inside your mouth, like at least 15 minutes, better 30, then you start feeling the rush, which is probably the best effect when it hits right..
tea/oral is more sedating and you need larger doses
nasal seems specially spacy but a bit dysphoric (for me) but seems the best ROA for extracts as I've read. It's not as round and complex as with sublingual, IME, and I think you lose quite a lot of unabsorbed plant matter/alkaloids.

You can redose, specially with nasal roa and people do redose with extracts, I only redosed a couple times and it was not worth it, the effects last quite a while when properly done.

Not sure about the ideal use.. I think I would like to use it for going outside, but alone, I don't feel particularly social but some people DO feel much more social, I see it to unwind, but outdoors, probably need to try it in different contexts. It was quite odd to be in a mall with my gf and looking to people in that state, it seems to create a super-sight kind of, like you are very aware of every movement, something that makes total sense with the traditional use: for hunting.
 

Xorkoth

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I didn't find nasal kanna to be painful at all, but it does have a somewhat dysphoric effect during the rush portion. A good quality extract I picked up recently has a better effect, but it's still a bit much, nasally. The sublingual effect seems to be more balanced and pleasant, and with this extract the dose is tiny, like 25-30mg.
 

Fertile

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BUT SSRIs were never marketed as anything other than symptomatic treatment.

So if they do help the symptoms, don't stop taking them without asking your doctor.
 

Cream Gravy?

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I’ve been saying for years that serotonin reuptake inhibition is 100% placebo for depression/anxiety. SSRIs/SNRIs are easily the most uncomfortable and miserable substance I’ve ever put in my body. I will never again for the rest of my life let a doctor put those poisons in me.
 

Fertile

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Any given SSRI/SNRI/SNDRI will work for about 40% of patients. For some people, none of them do. Doctors, however, do seem to like those classes because overdoses aren't dangerous. chloripramine is, by some margin, the most effective (i.e. highest success rate) but it's a tricyclic so doctors are more careful. You would think that if 2 SSRI/SNRI/SNDRIs failed, they would TRY a tricyclic.
 
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