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CHS caused directly by long term cannabis use

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DrumTripper

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Sep 13, 2018
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A bit of background first, to make the case of relevancy and tie the findings to my own experience.

I’ve been consuming cannabis daily for over 30 years now. First two decades mostly smoked, some oral. Last few years of third decade, I’ve switched entirely to dry-vaped (not carts) flower.
Starting 2 years ago, I began having episodes of severe vomiting - out of nowhere. Every 4-5 weeks it’d be an evening like any other, only I’d begin to feel nauseated, then sweating, then vomiting for up to 12 hours. This leads to dehydration and can tax the renal system and contribute to fattening one’s liver. Not as benign a drug or plant as I once thought.

So after months of digging, I’ve found a syndrome congruent with these effects - CHS, or Cannabinoid Hyperemesis Syndrome.

It turns out there’s a wealth of information on this, yet no one seems to hear of it.

It can and has killed in some cases. I know I thought I was going to die and had to visit the ER twice for this. It gets worse over time.
Anyway, I encourage all users to do some research into CHS and be cautious. It is different for everyone in how or when it presents, and it seems only about a third of users who use more than once weekly develop and suffer from these episodes, but that is a statistically significant portion.

Cannabis is around 15 times more potent than in the 60s. Now with dabs and shatter and butters, triple that and you’re getting 30-45 times more THC in the blood than one received from the feeble 60s weed.

Maybe like anything, moderation is key!
But this is one to know about, especially if it starts happening to you.

It’d be great, though, if a study could cover the question of government-grown vs old genetic strains with regard to CHS incidence. The few folks I know in their 70s who’ve been smoking all their lives have always grown their own and they don’t get this syndrome.

Here’s one article, there are many: https://epublications.marquette.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1427&context=nursing_fac
Sorry, the link-maker wasn’t working for me today!
 
From what I know about CHS although not much, is almost like an autoimmune disease. The thing that prevented nausea now causes it. I admit that scares the crap out of me being a daily smoker. Although it is never really more than a few pulls off a pipe a day.

So to preserve myself I am looking for the ounce of prevention (no pun intended). The things a person can do to prevent this. I know someone that also ended up with CHS. He did however eat and smoke more weed than anyone I knew. And then even after time he seems to be able to smoke again and has not had issues so it does not seem to be a total bust.. So this really confuses me.

Thanks Drum Tripper. time for people that smoke and use cannabis to learn about CHS and see how to prevent. The fact that you experienced this is making me take note.
 
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I mean, I want to THINK that it’s dose dependant (among other factors), hence leading one to the natural conclusion that it’s then best to avoid high-concentrate forms of cannabis.

But my own experience is hard to weigh for myself.
I did go through a period just when this started to happen to me, where I was exclusively on some budder flakes from a local illegal dispensary (many such shops were open in Van for years before and after legalization).
It did get kinda cracky (more-ish, cravey) for me after a few months,then the store got shut down by the RCMP and I moved back to government dry flower.
I feel that during that period, in reflection, that the budder, which always appeared suspect in tase, color, texture, and even effects, was most likely some kind of synth cannabinoid. It was too cheap to be real extracted-from-bud budder, but I was like “hey it gets me rocked, kills my pains, and it’s cheap.” $35/g CDN is cheap fir concentrates.

So that’s an anecdotal hope that my particular case may have been exacerbated by the heavy use of that possibly synthetic cannabinoid budder.

I did also have a few vape carts in August during camping (forgot about those!) which again, are high concentrates. This may have pushed me over a threshold.

Either way, I’m taking a long break, starting last night.
Wish me luck, folks! ;)
 
is this that weird condition which is only alleviated by taking a hot shower?

How much cannabis/THC are you consuming?
 
DrumTripper said:
So that’s an anecdotal hope that my particular case may have been exacerbated by the heavy use of that possibly synthetic cannabinoid budder.
Click to expand...

That is a good piece of information. Just something to consider. Maybe some type of overload of the receptors causes that notion of the body attacking itself. Either THC or synthetic.

Good luck DT. Keep us posted, hopefully you can stop without issue. When I set dates and did it I had no issues. Even sleep came easy when I was ready. On the other hand when I was not quitting, ran out of bud and could not get bud due to a timing issue I was miserable.

I had heard the hot shower thing too. Never dug in much to the topic though.
 
I have cyclic vomiting syndrome which has close ties with CHS. It’s absolute hell but I found I got it pretty much completely under control now after diet changes, mainly getting rid of sugar.

In my teens and early 20’s I’d sometimes have an episode as often as once every 2 weeks. The strange thing is the headspace, it’s almost like I’m dissociated as I vomit and shit everything (and I mean everything) out over 12-24hrs.

People that don’t know me and have seen me go through always contemplate calling emergency services cuz it looks that bad.

-GC
 
I was just posting about CHS in another thread....i have a friend who's had to go to the hospital twice for it and we both believe it's from using neem oil for pest control

"Cannabis Hyperemesis Syndrome" (CHS) is actually Azadirachtin (neem) poisoning! — Steemit

Azadirachtin (C35H44O16) is the active compound in the oil from the neem plant. (from Wikipedia) Farmers have… by drutter
steemit.com steemit.com


if you can get your herb from somebody that you know that doesn't use it, try that

neem oil is allowable in the recreational market and im sure they use it a lot since they're more limited in what they can use for a pest control
 
Snafu of the Forest said:
is this that weird condition which is only alleviated by taking a hot shower?

How much cannabis/THC are you consuming?
Click to expand...
Yes, but after the shower, symptoms return quickly.
For me, I’m nuts - no alcohol- but an 1/8th per day of top bc bud dry vaped.
Or bouts of hitting shatter or budder pretty hard like 1/2 gram per day.
So way excessive, yes, but others who’ve reported far less frequency (as low as once weekly) have had episodes.

Not fear generating here, just providing a balance and info for anyone who has gone thru this.
I loved cannabis, never wanted to stop - but my body’s deciding otherwise for me!

Thanks everyone for the support and info!
 
I’ve spent days living in my shower. Idk what I’d do without it to be honest it’s the one modern amenity I very much appreciate, nothing alleviates the nausea quite like it. But as DrumTripper said soon as you get out you can get worse again real quick.

One time I got hit by an episode soon as we got to a venue and I dosed MDMA. My internal chemistry must’ve been really fucked cuz it hit me like it was MDA even though I’d tried that batch many times for years. Spent the whole night puking/shitting and laying on a couch feeling like I’m freezing so was bundled up but was actually frying. We were 4 hrs from home and the group was relying on me to drive us home cuz they were all tripping. Spent 3-4 more hours of then watching me puke and nearly die in the car before I got it together enough to drive 20min increments with lots more puking mixed in. Still feel bad about that.

I do believe I used to get hyperemesis too when I was younger and would smoke massive bong hits. Now I smoke smaller amounts and try to do so less often, and it’s no longer a problem.

-GC
 
Yes, test for ourselves - mss-info is ripe these days. Filtration needed!

Now I’m thinking the times in the last 3-4 years where I’ve taken lysergamides and had huge puke fests (never happened in 30 years of lsd use) may have been spurred on by this. Hmmmm.
 
Mr. Krinkle said:
beardbrospharms.com

FACTS vs. FICTION: Is Cannabis Hyperemesis Syndrome (CHS) Caused by Neem Oil? - Beard Bros Pharms

Is Neem Oil to blame for what appears to be a recent upsurge in cases of Cannabis Hyperemesis Syndrome? Or is the answer right beneath our belts?
beardbrospharms.com beardbrospharms.com


these guys kinda say no it's not from neem....but i really don't know....you'd have to really just test things out yourself

it is bizarre tho and really weird that ive only heard about this the last 5 or so years
Click to expand...
Still good info to throw out. It could be something in the bud rather than the bud itself. I guess we can only hope that is true and we find out what it is. LIke what is the common denominator for all of the cases. Certainly we should be able to pinpoint that..
 
It's rare but not the first time I've heard about it. The unknowns leave a lot to be speculated.

We discussed this topic about 10 years ago here and several people suspected PGRs (common toxic chemical growers use to increase harvest weight considerably) to be the culprit. The black market is littered with this type of bullshit.

My own speculation on the matter is that it's THCs fault. So far that's the only common denominator we can be 100% sure about.
 
most synthetic PGRs have been taken off the market and pulled from shelves - and then there's natural PGRs like alfalfa and kelp and bat guano and those have all been used for thousands of years

the black market is NOT littered with PGR weed
 
Thanks for the replies, folks.
I hope we keep this to a discussion that the mods don’t have to shut down.

I hear both your points.

It must be true in the middle; there must be some toxicity from harvest/flowering/pesticide products, whether rife or rare.

The blackmarket in the UK found 29 people with lead poisoning from powdered lead being added as a weight enhancer.
Now that’s just plain evil, but prolly the outlier.

THC (heavy chronic use) mucking with the CB1 receptor and eventually reversing its mode to cause temp disregulation hasbeen found. When you administer capsaicin salve to the belly, the malaise is reduced. So there may be something at play with thc and that or other receptors.

For me, during my taper period, I’m moving to more balanced flower (more cbd, less thc) to see how that reacts. As I ween down already (day 3), I’m feeling much better already. It will take a month to be fully better, but then I’ll hopefully be able to stay away from it, and if i return, it will be for occasional use - which is not indicated as associated with CHS.

TODR; cut down a bit if you;re a mega toker!
 
If your anything like me, try to cut out sugar near completely. That’s how I keep my CVS/CHS? in check. (I had it long before I smoked bud but it could make it worse.)

I’ll eat a piece of fruit 5 days a week and maybe like 2 days out of the week I’ll eat a homemade sweet that I made out of honey, coconut sugar or maple syrup.

Anytime I fuck up it slowly builds up in my system and I can actually feel when I’m about to have an episode most times.

-GC
 
Its probably good to point out the sugar is far and away the most addictive drug you are using, with the worst side effects.

We are quick to blame our weed because we have been conditioned by our society to think we are slightly inferior humans using this drug. Getting sugar intake under control is a huge issue. We need glucose for mental activity, your brain only eats glucose and uses 14% of your food intake so you need a fair amount of starch or sugars. Too much and you're on your way to diabetes, too little and you slow your ability to think. Marijuana adds dopamine to the mix and improves mental clarity. Balancing these two high profile brain foods can be difficult.

Because i work with food at an ingredient level im always very aware of what im eating, 12 years of marijuana use with only minor issues. I see the fear that is created by the spectre of CHS but im very slow to say its caused by regular flower use. Synthetic cannabinoid products seem to be the culprit in most cases ive been aware of. Im also glad to say in the 100s of weed smokers i know none have experienced CHS its only been something ive read about being experienced by people ive never met.
 
I’ve not met another in my 30+ years of daily toking; but go through it and find that this is distinct from a glycemic reaction.

I’m a few days into a SERIOUS taper-off and switched to a balanced cbd/thc strain and feel no ill effects whatsoever.
Whether it’s dosage, among myriad other variables, I’m becoming more convinced that this is in any case hugely exacerbated by potent extracts of thc.

I bet it won’t happen to me again on balanced flower.

I totally dig the diet and hydration issue as well.
For those of us who aren’t as careful with what they ingest (fast-food lovers, for one example), this may be far more of a concern.
 
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