Heroin First time heroin user, want to be safe as possible. looking for guidance

[strangemagic]

Firstly I want to say I've read through many heroin posts on here and absolutely understand starting heroin is not recommended. I've made the decision to at least try it so I'm just looking for guidance so I can be safe. I have chronic pain from an incurable illness. My pain is not nerve pain so I don't respond well to kratom/gabapenton/tramadol/etc. I have not found a dr. willing to prescribe me meds because the guidelines are so strict here in the US. I started buying oxy from a very reliable and affordable source 2 years ago. I have effectively maintained self prescribing and anytime my tolerance gets over 100mg a day I taper myself down. I don't use to get high (no judgement for those who do) I just use enough so that I can function in my daily life (clean my house, take a shower, grocery shop etc). Before I started oxy my life was torment. I never slept because of the pain but I also couldn't get out of bed. I fantasized about killing myself constantly just to escape the hell of constant agony. My marriage was deeply effected because no one wants to live with someone in pain and I wasn't able to contribute anything at all due to being bedridden. I don't regret my decision to start self medicating at all, it saved my life. All that being said, since the pandemic started there has been a huge oxy shortage and prices have more than tripled. I can no longer go through my source and have had to buy questionable pills elsewhere. I can't afford to maintain even just 40mg a day use and some of the pills I've gotten don't feel the same/help with pain which is why I say they're questionable. I do not want to go back to a life of pain and agony. I don't want that for me or my spouse. I communicate everything with my spouse, they were very weary of me trying out heroin but after weeks of me bordering on withdrawal and our finances stretched thin we've both decided it might be the best option for right now.

I just want to use enough heroin to control my pain, I'm not looking for a high/euphoria though I know the first few times a high is probably inevitable. I'm going to find a reputable dealer and also use fent test strips. I still need advice on types? What's the difference between afghan and china white? I've never snorted anything or smoked anything besides weed. I definitely don't want to do IV. I've read depending on the type its easier to smoke vs snort. Which type and/or method would be best for starting very slow so that I don't get super high/nod out? Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[JessFR]

What type of heroin you'll realistically be able to get depends on your geographical location.

You said US, but it might be helpful to have a narrower region to get an idea of what heroins you'd likely find.

China white means one of two things in my experience. In your the US context when I hear it it usually refers to fentanyl. Which is going to be a problem in your area since fentanyl is everywhere.

The other thing I know China white to mean is a type of extremely pure (at least at manufacturing level) white heroin that comes generally from south east Asia (the Golden triangle).

Afghan heroin is a brown heroin from Afghanistan (in the Golden Cresent)

Essentially, to very much simplify the heroins of the world, broadly speaking can be subdivided by their region, coming down as white brown or black. I just covered the previous two but black would be tar heroin that shows up in some parts of the US, mainly the west coast iirc. Recreationally speaking all can be good, and all can be bad. Depends on how they've been messed with in the supply chain by dealers. In terms of purity (it being actual heroin), generally white is the closest to pharmaceutical grade, followed by brown, then black tar.

Chances are you will get high doing this (as you said), the quantities of most heroins that would roughly equate to what you're used to are likely to be extremely small.

For what you want, it might make sense to just try swallowing heroin at first. I mean, that's not what any heroin addict I know does, but we're all using it recreationally, for your purposes, if you start very small, just dissolving it in some liquid and swallowing it till you get an idea of what you can handle might make sense given you're looking for analgesia.

It would probably the reduce the risks posed by fentanyl if you make sure to start very small (in the milligram range, you'll want a milligram scale) and make sure anything you take has fully taken effect before taking more (orally most meds take an hour to an hour and a half to reach their peak)

Sorry if I'm a bit all over the place in my reply. Just woke up and I'm also kinda reading your post, thinking of things to write, reading it again and thinking of more stuff.

If there's any other questions I can help with or anything I missed let me know. It's likely some of the others will have something to add soon.

Also welcome to bluelight.

Normally with these questions I also add a word of caution about the dangers of going down the path of heroin. You said you've read a lot here and I suspect you already have heard just about anything I'd say, so I've left this till the end and I'll keep it simple.

Many people with legit pain have ended up full on addicts. I'm not telling you not to go ahead with your plan. Just to keep on high alert for potential signs of addiction going forward. Mainly desiring to use more then you initially intended too, doing things that are dishonest of out of character for you. Addiction has a way of subtly convincing you that what you're doing makes sense.

Again, not saying not to do it, I get why you're going down this road, it sucks that you can't find help from the medical establishment. But assuming you go down this road, I'm just saying to try and keep a check on yourself. Not just your behavior but how you're thinking, addiction can creep on quite subtly.

Other than that I wish you well.

 

[Prettyboy12]

Firstly I want to say I've read through many heroin posts on here and absolutely understand starting heroin is not recommended. I've made the decision to at least try it so I'm just looking for guidance so I can be safe. I have chronic pain from an incurable illness. My pain is not nerve pain so I don't respond well to kratom/gabapenton/tramadol/etc. I have not found a dr. willing to prescribe me meds because the guidelines are so strict here in the US. I started buying oxy from a very reliable and affordable source 2 years ago. I have effectively maintained self prescribing and anytime my tolerance gets over 100mg a day I taper myself down. I don't use to get high (no judgement for those who do) I just use enough so that I can function in my daily life (clean my house, take a shower, grocery shop etc). Before I started oxy my life was torment. I never slept because of the pain but I also couldn't get out of bed. I fantasized about killing myself constantly just to escape the hell of constant agony. My marriage was deeply effected because no one wants to live with someone in pain and I wasn't able to contribute anything at all due to being bedridden. I don't regret my decision to start self medicating at all, it saved my life. All that being said, since the pandemic started there has been a huge oxy shortage and prices have more than tripled. I can no longer go through my source and have had to buy questionable pills elsewhere. I can't afford to maintain even just 40mg a day use and some of the pills I've gotten don't feel the same/help with pain which is why I say they're questionable. I do not want to go back to a life of pain and agony. I don't want that for me or my spouse. I communicate everything with my spouse, they were very weary of me trying out heroin but after weeks of me bordering on withdrawal and our finances stretched thin we've both decided it might be the best option for right now.

I just want to use enough heroin to control my pain, I'm not looking for a high/euphoria though I know the first few times a high is probably inevitable. I'm going to find a reputable dealer and also use fent test strips. I still need advice on types? What's the difference between afghan and china white? I've never snorted anything or smoked anything besides weed. I definitely don't want to do IV. I've read depending on the type its easier to smoke vs snort. Which type and/or method would be best for starting very slow so that I don't get super high/nod out? Thanks in advance for any advice.

My advice is to keep looking for a pain doctor. I too suffer incurable chronic pain from CRPS and Fibromyalgia. I started out snorting the brown street ready H but after a few months I couldnt snort enough to get suffeciant pain relief and started shooting up black tar...i am not a full blown heroin addict.
Its not worth the devestation that follows honey.

 

[JessFR]

My advice is to keep looking for a pain doctor. I too suffer incurable chronic pain from CRPS and Fibromyalgia. I started out snorting the brown street ready H but after a few months I couldnt snort enough to get suffeciant pain relief and started shooting up black tar...i am not a full blown heroin addict.
Its not worth the devestation that follows honey.

It would be better if he could find a doctor to help. But it sure seems like that's hard bordering on impossible these days.

Did you ever find one?

It's such bullshit. People shouldn't be expected to just suffer with endless pain. And they shouldn't have to break the law to have their suffering eased.

As if endless pain to the point of suicide is somehow better than the risks of addiction.

 

[negrogesic]

Firstly I want to say I've read through many heroin posts on here and absolutely understand starting heroin is not recommended. I've made the decision to at least try it so I'm just looking for guidance so I can be safe. I have chronic pain from an incurable illness. My pain is not nerve pain so I don't respond well to kratom/gabapenton/tramadol/etc. I have not found a dr. willing to prescribe me meds because the guidelines are so strict here in the US. I started buying oxy from a very reliable and affordable source 2 years ago. I have effectively maintained self prescribing and anytime my tolerance gets over 100mg a day I taper myself down. I don't use to get high (no judgement for those who do) I just use enough so that I can function in my daily life (clean my house, take a shower, grocery shop etc). Before I started oxy my life was torment. I never slept because of the pain but I also couldn't get out of bed. I fantasized about killing myself constantly just to escape the hell of constant agony. My marriage was deeply effected because no one wants to live with someone in pain and I wasn't able to contribute anything at all due to being bedridden. I don't regret my decision to start self medicating at all, it saved my life. All that being said, since the pandemic started there has been a huge oxy shortage and prices have more than tripled. I can no longer go through my source and have had to buy questionable pills elsewhere. I can't afford to maintain even just 40mg a day use and some of the pills I've gotten don't feel the same/help with pain which is why I say they're questionable. I do not want to go back to a life of pain and agony. I don't want that for me or my spouse. I communicate everything with my spouse, they were very weary of me trying out heroin but after weeks of me bordering on withdrawal and our finances stretched thin we've both decided it might be the best option for right now.

I just want to use enough heroin to control my pain, I'm not looking for a high/euphoria though I know the first few times a high is probably inevitable. I'm going to find a reputable dealer and also use fent test strips. I still need advice on types? What's the difference between afghan and china white? I've never snorted anything or smoked anything besides weed. I definitely don't want to do IV. I've read depending on the type its easier to smoke vs snort. Which type and/or method would be best for starting very slow so that I don't get super high/nod out? Thanks in advance for any advice.

You aren't going to like this but I'd recommend methadone. You'll have no trouble getting it (unlike other pain meds) and its very strong and long-lasting. For chronic pain, methadone should be divided into multiple doses per day if possible.

Heroin in the US is highly contaminated with fentanyl (which frequently kills veteran opioid addicts). This makes it very unsafe. It also makes dosing difficult. You are headed towards inevitable disaster. If if it doesn't kill you, I can guarantee that if you proceed with this heroin idea, one year from now you'll look back and think, damn I should really have listened to the negro-something guy on that drug website.

Try the methadone. You'll be able to increase the dose until your comfortable. This heroin idea is a disaster. Just trying to look after you!

 

[burn out]

What time of heroin you'll realistically be able to get depends on your geographical location.

Yeah, here in Michigan we get 4 o'clock heroin.

 

[JessFR]

Yeah, here in Michigan we get 4 o'clock heroin.

I blame my phone. Anytime I say anything wrong or stupid my phone made me do it.

I'll fix it.

You aren't going to like this but I'd recommend methadone. You'll have no trouble getting it (unlike other pain meds) and its very strong and long-lasting. For chronic pain, methadone should be divided into multiple doses per day if possible.

Heroin in the US is highly contaminated with fentanyl (which frequently kills veteran opioid addicts). This makes it very unsafe. It also makes dosing difficult. You are headed towards inevitable disaster. If if it doesn't kill you, I can guarantee that if you proceed with this heroin idea, one year from now you'll look back and think, damn I should really listened to the negro-something guy on that drug website.

Try the methadone. You'll be able to increase the dose until your comfortable. This heroin idea is a disaster. Just trying to look after you!

The rules regarding methadone in the US as sadly strict. Still this isn't a bad suggestion at all.

There's also buprenorphine which has much laxer rules and it doesn't sound like your tolerance is that high.

 

[negrogesic]

I blame my phone. Anytime I say anything wrong or stupid my phone made me do it.

I'll fix it.



The rules regarding methadone in the US as sadly strict. Still this isn't a bad suggestion at all.

There's also buprenorphine which has much laxer rules and it doesn't sound like your tolerance is that high.

The rules for methadone are actually very lax in the US if you had the ability to pay. I went to an expensive private clinic and managed to get myself on 380mg of methadone a day and, at the end, went in once every few months for a shopping bag full of take homes. Essentially I kept asking for more methadone and they have it to me. But it was expensive, something like $1,600 or $1,800 a month (and this was over a decade ago). It was an extremely private place designed so no patient would ever see each other. Still, if this person can afford large amounts of illicit oxycodone maybe a private methadone clinic would work. She could get all the medicine she wants. Definitely a better solution than trying to treat pain with fentanyl laced (or primarily fentanyl) street heroin.

 

[JessFR]

The rules for methadone are actually very lax in the US if you had the ability to pay. I went to an expensive private clinic and managed to get myself on 380mg of methadone a day and, at the end, went in once every few months for a shopping bag full of take homes. Essentially I kept asking for more methadone and they have it to me. But it was expensive, something like $1,600 or $1,800 a month (and this was over a decade ago). It was an extremely private place designed so no patient would ever see each other. Still, if this person can afford large amounts of illicit oxycodone maybe a private methadone clinic would work. She could get all the medicine she wants. Definitely a better solution than trying to treat pain with fentanyl laced (or primarily fentanyl) street heroin.

Figures. Money talks.

 

[Snafu in the Void]

The rules for methadone are actually very lax in the US if you had the ability to pay.

Has this changed recently? Speaking specifically about, what seems to be, a general shift off methadone and onto subs for US opioid use disorder. I'm not sure if that's in my head or not because I haven't sought any methadone or subs in over a decade.

I see private clinics offering subs everywhere, I haven't seen or heard of methadone in a very long time. (in the US)

 

[negrogesic]

Has this changed recently? Speaking specifically about, what seems to be, a general shift off methadone and onto subs for US opioid use disorder. I'm not sure if that's in my head or not because I haven't sought any methadone or subs in over a decade.

I see private clinics offering subs everywhere, I haven't seen or heard of methadone in a very long time. (in the US)

Private suboxone clinics are everywhere because its very simple for physician to get a waiver to prescribe buprenorphine for addiction purposes. All you really need to do is file the paperwork and take an online exam (which is very easy).

But the regulations to set up a methadone clinic are much more complicated so new ones are rare (especially now given the easy of entry and high profitability of buprenorphine). Buprenorphine has become a way for physicians (particularly psychiatrists) to add some significant cash flow to their business despite not having any experience in addiction medicine. Its a leap for many psychitrists as many aren't used to treating physically ill people. You'd be lucky if your psychiatrist can take you blood pressure.

Methadone clinics are still around, you just have to dig around for one.

The original poster should really consider it instead of street heroin. Methadone is strong, long lasting and feels great (in my opinion).

 

[JessFR]

Methadone is strong, long lasting and feels great (in my opinion).

I'm a methadone patient and I approve this message.

 

[MDPV_Psychosis]

It's so sad. Somebody should be able to go to a doctor and be like "my pain is so bad I'm considering suicide or heroin, please help me" and then get proper help (the actual meds they need at the doses they need, not a fucking lecture, not being labeled a drug seeker, not a fucking suggestion to go to rehab or a psych ward)

the world we live in today is so fucked up in some ways.

I'm sorry OP, good luck. I hope you can find a good pain management doctor or if not then a stable supply of decent quality heroin or meds

 

[strangemagic]

What type of heroin you'll realistically be able to get depends on your geographical location.

You said US, but it might be helpful to have a narrower region to get an idea of what heroins you'd likely find.

China white means one of two things in my experience. In your the US context when I hear it it usually refers to fentanyl. Which is going to be a problem in your area since fentanyl is everywhere.

The other thing I know China white to mean is a type of extremely pure (at least at manufacturing level) white heroin that comes generally from south east Asia (the Golden triangle).

Afghan heroin is a brown heroin from Afghanistan (in the Golden Cresent)

Essentially, to very much simplify the heroins of the world, broadly speaking can be subdivided by their region, coming down as white brown or black. I just covered the previous two but black would be tar heroin that shows up in some parts of the US, mainly the west coast iirc. Recreationally speaking all can be good, and all can be bad. Depends on how they've been messed with in the supply chain by dealers. In terms of purity (it being actual heroin), generally white is the closest to pharmaceutical grade, followed by brown, then black tar.

Chances are you will get high doing this (as you said), the quantities of most heroins that would roughly equate to what you're used to are likely to be extremely small.

For what you want, it might make sense to just try swallowing heroin at first. I mean, that's not what any heroin addict I know does, but we're all using it recreationally, for your purposes, if you start very small, just dissolving it in some liquid and swallowing it till you get an idea of what you can handle might make sense given you're looking for analgesia.

It would probably the reduce the risks posed by fentanyl if you make sure to start very small (in the milligram range, you'll want a milligram scale) and make sure anything you take has fully taken effect before taking more (orally most meds take an hour to an hour and a half to reach their peak)

Sorry if I'm a bit all over the place in my reply. Just woke up and I'm also kinda reading your post, thinking of things to write, reading it again and thinking of more stuff.

If there's any other questions I can help with or anything I missed let me know. It's likely some of the others will have something to add soon.

Also welcome to bluelight.

Normally with these questions I also add a word of caution about the dangers of going down the path of heroin. You said you've read a lot here and I suspect you already have heard just about anything I'd say, so I've left this till the end and I'll keep it simple.

Many people with legit pain have ended up full on addicts. I'm not telling you not to go ahead with your plan. Just to keep on high alert for potential signs of addiction going forward. Mainly desiring to use more then you initially intended too, doing things that are dishonest of out of character for you. Addiction has a way of subtly convincing you that what you're doing makes sense.

Again, not saying not to do it, I get why you're going down this road, it sucks that you can't find help from the medical establishment. But assuming you go down this road, I'm just saying to try and keep a check on yourself. Not just your behavior but how you're thinking, addiction can creep on quite subtly.

Other than that I wish you well.

Thank you for your response, it's very informative. What do you recommend as a starting dose if I take around 10-15mg oxy every 4 hours? I will get a scale like you recommended because I know a little goes a long way when it comes to H. Thank you for explaining white is closest to pharma grade etc, I've known black tar is the least desirable I just didn't know why. I've read white is better for snorting and brown is better for smoking, is that accurate?

I completely understand your advice about watching my thinking patterns, I've done a lot of work to be a self aware person but even then I know I should always watch out for making decisions based on being kind and gentle with myself vs based on enabling unhealthy behavior. So far I believe I've handled the opiate use very well, and even though I have a physical dependence I don't psychologically crave the feeling and haven't used to for emotional coping. But from what I've read on here H can really change that for people so I intend to keep communication with my partner open and honest so that I don't play any tricks on myself if I start straying from responsible use.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

So far I believe I've handled the opiate use very well, and even though I have a physical dependence I don't psychologically crave the feeling and haven't used to for emotional coping. But from what I've read on here H can really change that for people so I intend to keep communication with my partner open and honest so that I don't play any tricks on myself if I start straying from responsible use.

Good luck with that mate...

 

[strangemagic]

You aren't going to like this but I'd recommend methadone. You'll have no trouble getting it (unlike other pain meds) and its very strong and long-lasting. For chronic pain, methadone should be divided into multiple doses per day if possible.

Heroin in the US is highly contaminated with fentanyl (which frequently kills veteran opioid addicts). This makes it very unsafe. It also makes dosing difficult. You are headed towards inevitable disaster. If if it doesn't kill you, I can guarantee that if you proceed with this heroin idea, one year from now you'll look back and think, damn I should really have listened to the negro-something guy on that drug website.

Try the methadone. You'll be able to increase the dose until your comfortable. This heroin idea is a disaster. Just trying to look after you!

I'm part of some forums with other chronic pain patients and most have said methadone and/or subs were not an effective treatment for their pain. Have you used methadone for that purpose and did it help? I see a lot of online sources that support the idea that it's effective but I've never heard someone with chronic pain actually confirm it. I've done my research on methadone in the past because I was considering it, but with the ambivalence of it's effectiveness and how hard it is to get off of it I decided not to go that route.

I agree about the fent, it makes this whole thing so much more scary and stressful. More than anything I just want an empathetic doctor that would be willing to give me my life back but I've just been tossed around to new providers every time an "alternative" pain management method doesn't work.

 

[strangemagic]

It's so sad. Somebody should be able to go to a doctor and be like "my pain is so bad I'm considering suicide or heroin, please help me" and then get proper help (the actual meds they need at the doses they need, not a fucking lecture, not being labeled a drug seeker, not a fucking suggestion to go to rehab or a psych ward)

the world we live in today is so fucked up in some ways.

I'm sorry OP, good luck. I hope you can find a good pain management doctor or if not then a stable supply of decent quality heroin or meds

Thank you

I've wanted so many times to go to a doctor and say those exact words. But you're right, it'll go in my chart as drug seeking and eliminate any possible chance in the future to get consistent pain management if they ever do let up on these strict laws. I've spent more times than I can count crying in a doctor's office because of my pain, it breaks my heart that we have modern medicine that could make my life livable but it doesn't get prescribed because of this bullshit "war on drugs". Even the "lucky" chronic pain patients that get scripts are being prescribed 3 5mg norco a day, it's inhumane. Suicides have gone up since the crackdown, not to mention an increase of ODs because of fent. Cracking down on opiates has done nothing to keep people safer, it's only made safe opiates harder to find. Regardless of why someone uses, none of us deserve to gamble with death just trying to get through the day.

 

[strangemagic]

I'm a methadone patient and I approve this message.

Do you use methadone to treat pain/got in it from an addiction started by treating pain? Like I mentioned above I haven't yet found an chronic pain patients that confirm methadone was effective for them.

 

[negrogesic]

I'm part of some forums with other chronic pain patients and most have said methadone and/or subs were not an effective treatment for their pain. Have you used methadone for that purpose and did it help? I see a lot of online sources that support the idea that it's effective but I've never heard someone with chronic pain actually confirm it. I've done my research on methadone in the past because I was considering it, but with the ambivalence of it's effectiveness and how hard it is to get off of it I decided not to go that route.

I agree about the fent, it makes this whole thing so much more scary and stressful. More than anything I just want an empathetic doctor that would be willing to give me my life back but I've just been tossed around to new providers every time an "alternative" pain management method doesn't work.

I took methadone at very high doses but for purposes of addiction not chronic pain. That said, when i broke my ankle while on methadone they simply gave me more methadone and it really stopped the pain.

For chronic pain methadone should preferably be dosed multiple times a day instead of in a single dose. This is because the pain relieving effect of methadone is shorter acting than its withdrawal surpressing effects.

Its worth a shot (no pun intended) before going straight to heroin (ie fentanyl).

 

[Prettyboy12]

Im fortunate enough to have an amazing pain doctor however I still prefer heroin.