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Post a chemical that you think has some serious potential to become a winner in the RC market

simstim

simstim

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Apr 20, 2021
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Post a chemical structure that isn't on the market that you truly believe has the potential to become a minor or major success. Whether it's something new that has never been released, or something old that is unscheduled, forgotten, and deserves to have the dust blown off of it for a new generation.

This should be something that you would order a custom synth of yourself if you could afford it. It should also be something you would be willing to be the first Guinea pig of.

Something you would actually bet money is a worthwhile investment for someone to produce and you would like to see it happen in your lifetime!

Please, refrain from posting wild conjecture structures and theoretical SARs in this thread. Serious posts only!
 
BO4MM.jpg

Beta methoxy 4-methylmethamphetamine

This is possibly less cardiotoxic than 4-MMC itself.
It should not produce the highly cardiotoxic 4-methylephedrine as a metabolite in large quantities (this is huge).
It's likely longer acting than 4-MMC.
It's likely to be less neurotoxic to dopamine neurons similar to 4-MMC and 4MM (when compared to Meth, Methcathinone, and MDMA)

Proposed name:
BO4MM
(Beta methoxy per Shulgin BOx series, 4MM the name given to 4-methylmethamphetamine in a recent research article I read comparing neurotoxicity of various substituted amphetamines and cathinones).

After trying BOD recently I really believe in the potential of this one! Also, what little I have read about beta methoxy methamphetamine makes that sound worthwhile as well.

I actually believe this has the potential to be as good as 4-MMC, also the potential to be less cardiotoxic, and for sure the primary metabolite won't be the highly cardiotoxic 4-methylephedrine.

*EDIT*
I found a paper on various substitutions to the structure of amphetamine and how they affect amphetamine's affinity as an MAOi. Apparently the addition of the beta methoxy does a pretty good job of GREATLY diminishing MAOi activity (beta keto and beta hydroxy are pretty good for that, too). So that is another way in which BO-4MM would be superior to it's non methoxy amphetamine counterpart. It's pretty much guaranteed to be FAR less potent as an MAOi.
 
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Anyone have any idea what this user in this reddit thread may be speaking about?


They are talking about easily turning buprenorphine into a highly potent full agonist with very little steps.

I'm curious in what ways the buprenorphine molecule could be changed or tinkered with and if any of it could be done easily.

Looking for input from those who are curious. I think buprenorphine would be more a helpful drug if it were more like a full agonist or closer to feeling like traditional opioids.

Do a ctrl + f search for "N-phenethylnorbuprenorphine" and read these users comments.

If this is possible, then it's pretty crazy.

I'm kind of a laymen and don't know much chemistry & know some pharmacology, but i'm interested in learning more. And if there were a way to make buprenorphine better, I think it could help those who struggle on it. Thanks for anyone's time.

I don't mean to derail the thread. I was directed here and told chemistry talk was ok. If this were possible, it would be easy to synth new opioids from bupe though, so it's still kind of part of the discussion.

LINK :

 
mad_scientist said:
pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

1-(3-Fluorophenyl)-2-(1-pyrrolidinyl)-1-propanone

1-(3-Fluorophenyl)-2-(1-pyrrolidinyl)-1-propanone | C13H16FNO | CID 131490467 - structure, chemical names, physical and chemical properties, classification, patents, literature, biological activities, safety/hazards/toxicity information, supplier lists, and more.
pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Click to expand...

i have to dissmiss this idea, a flourine on the ring would totally destroy the nice taste of any of the pyrrolidine ketones. thats why i alaymost always vape them. it contributes much to the rush the drug produces.- all in all i went through ca 340g of mainly a-pvp and a-pihp, masochistic times were these. today i only use a benzo/php mix which works just fine.
bachk on opic: i had 4f-aPVP once, it was such a waste of time, hard to vape, discguisting taste and the effects where the lamest i found for any psychostimulant i tried (and i tried many...)
i dont believe that there would be any use for the compund you describe...


btw: nice to see you here mad_scientist, thought id never hear from you again after the closing of blacklight.
 
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DeathIndustrial88 said:
I think buprenorphine would be more a helpful drug if it were more like a full agonist or closer to feeling like traditional opioids.
Click to expand...

It takes on that character if administered IV (kind of, no rush but definitely a full agonist-type character for the high itself)
 
Burnt Offerings said:
It takes on that character if administered IV (kind of, no rush but definitely a full agonist-type character for the high itself)
Click to expand...
For real? I always figured bupe IV would probably feel just like every other route, except possibly coming on faster. How does it compare to plugging and is it worth it? I've seen and heard horror stories about IV subs being really bad for your veins and the citric acid & artificial flavorings attracting more bacteria than usual. But then again I've also heard that sub strips also have the least amount of binders compared to most other meds & would be safer to inject than say, a pill.

Don't get me wrong, it's definitely possible to achieve full agonist-type effects through different ROA and depending on your tolerance. But the euphoria / anti-depressant / energizing / mood stabilizing effects aren't as great as a full agonist and then once you hit the ceiling dose (which seems to vary amongst people), it's pretty much impossible to bring it back without having to stop for several days. Which IMO is horrible for 'craving maintenance' cause how do doctors expect people to stay 'craving free' if they can't even feel their meds anymore? lol Other days I might feel my meds, but it's only just the side effects of being on a potent opioid (small pupils, constipation, nodding, etc..) except there's zero euphoria or mood lift at all. In fact, it can be rather dysphoric at times and irritating.

I keep hoping some one is gonna discover a way to easily manipulate this molecule so that it becomes something a little better one day though. lol
Thanks for the response tho, Burnt Offerings!
 
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Well first off, I'll just preface this by saying that I'm not a chemist, pharmacologist or scientist of any sort really. These are all just my personal experiences. This post is not intended to diagnose, treat or prevent any disease, don't do drugs kids, etc etc yada yada yada

with that being said...

yes ime it absolutely does induce a full agonist effect. I've only ever used the gel strips for this, never tablets. I see some people post on here about the same thing, including loading ridiculous amounts of buprenorphine into a shot...one individual even said that they loaded a whole strip into a single shot! Which is absolutely absurd imo. To give some context about how little you need, in a hypothetical scenario in which you're doing one shot a day, a single 8 mg strip should last you over 10 days imo. You should be using an amount small enough that, when you draw the solution into the barrel of the syringe, it does not really have a visible tint and instead just looks like a shot of water. That's how strong the drug is when administered this way...IV buprenorphine when given in a legitimate medical setting like a hospital or ambulance is measured in micrograms. When used in such a fashion, it takes on the effect of a powerful narcotic with an onset of less than 10 minutes.

I'm not sure where you're at, but where I live, buprenorphine is BY FAR the least expensive and most available opioid drug. It's dirt-cheap, pretty much. I haven't done it in a long time, but back when I used to, I'd usually do one shot before bed, watch TV for an hour or two, and drift off to sleep in an opioid haze that's roughly equivalent enjoyment-wise to the plateau phase of a dope high. I calculated it out once, it was a drug habit that cost me about a dollar a day and had the added benefit of never having to be exposed to fentanyl or any other harmful adulterants. All my veins are still in perfect working order and I've never experienced a use-related complication, despite having administered hundreds, perhaps thousands of shots lol. I've never been involved in a Suboxone program or anything like that, I always just purchased them on the black market for a bit of recreation and fun.
 
Burnt Offerings said:
Well first off, I'll just preface this by saying that I'm not a chemist, pharmacologist or scientist of any sort really. These are all just my personal experiences. This post is not intended to diagnose, treat or prevent any disease, don't do drugs kids, etc etc yada yada yada

with that being said...

yes ime it absolutely does induce a full agonist effect. I've only ever used the gel strips for this, never tablets. I see some people post on here about the same thing, including loading ridiculous amounts of buprenorphine into a shot...one individual even said that they loaded a whole strip into a single shot! Which is absolutely absurd imo. To give some context about how little you need, in a hypothetical scenario in which you're doing one shot a day, a single 8 mg strip should last you over 10 days imo. You should be using an amount small enough that, when you draw the solution into the barrel of the syringe, it does not really have a visible tint and instead just looks like a shot of water. That's how strong the drug is when administered this way...IV buprenorphine when given in a legitimate medical setting like a hospital or ambulance is measured in micrograms. When used in such a fashion, it takes on the effect of a powerful narcotic with an onset of less than 10 minutes.

I'm not sure where you're at, but where I live, buprenorphine is BY FAR the least expensive and most available opioid drug. It's dirt-cheap, pretty much. I haven't done it in a long time, but back when I used to, I'd usually do one shot before bed, watch TV for an hour or two, and drift off to sleep in an opioid haze that's roughly equivalent enjoyment-wise to the plateau phase of a dope high. I calculated it out once, it was a drug habit that cost me about a dollar a day and had the added benefit of never having to be exposed to fentanyl or any other harmful adulterants. All my veins are still in perfect working order and I've never experienced a use-related complication, despite having administered hundreds, perhaps thousands of shots lol. I've never been involved in a Suboxone program or anything like that, I always just purchased them on the black market for a bit of recreation and fun.
Click to expand...
Lol no worries. :p

Yeah buprenorphine is highly potent. I've been on it for years now though, so I'm wondering if the IV affect would still even be present if I'm already tolerant to it then? I definitely wouldn't use more than 1mg if IV, I'd think. And even then, that'd be too much for one without a tolerance to it.

I mostly likely won't try this ROA right now, at least not without micron filters. But yeah, bupe can definitely get one feeling good if they're using it recreationally or every once in awhile. I actually did this in the past in between heroin binges & found that I got a better bang for my buck and did not go into withdrawal as fast. But of course, I was getting effects back then even through the normal sublingual route. Some times I actually preferred bupe because heroin was too variable and the same amount of money could have me feeling well for weeks, rather than a few hours. lol

I appreciate your experience though!! Thanks! :)
 
these phenanthrene type opioids will never come to the rc marked, they belong to the fucking pharmacies, nothing you can do there...
 
6-APB, Methylone and Pentylone --4 MEC has got to be so excellent compared to any Cocaine that I would love to have that by the Ton! 😍
 
simstim said:
sketcher.png

Beta methoxy 4-methylmethamphetamine

This is possibly less cardiotoxic than 4-MMC itself.
It should not produce the highly cardiotoxic 4-methylephedrine as a metabolite (this is huge).
It's likely longer acting than 4-MMC.
It's likely to be less neurotoxic to dopamine neurons similar to 4-MMC and 4MM (when compared to Meth, Methcathinone, and MDMA)

Proposed name:
BO4MM
(Beta methoxy per Shulgin BOx series, 4MM the name given to 4-methylmethamphetamine in a recent research article I read comparing neurotoxicity of various substituted amphetamines and cathinones).

After trying BOD recently I really believe in the potential of this one! Also, what little I have read about beta methoxy methamphetamine makes that sound worthwhile as well.

I actually believe this has the potential to be as good as 4-MMC, also the potential to be less cardiotoxic, and for sure the primary metabolite won't be the highly cardiotoxic 4-methylephedrine.

*EDIT*
I found a paper on various substitutions to the structure of amphetamine and how they affect amphetamine's affinity as an MAOi. Apparently the addition of the beta methoxy does a pretty good job of abolishing MAOi activity (beta keto is pretty good for that, too). So that is another way in which BO-4MM would be superior to it's non methoxy amphetamine counterpart. It's pretty much guaranteed to be less potent as an MAOi.
Click to expand...
Seems Cathinone and Amphetamine are so close that explains the similarity of all the Methyl attachments to Cathinone and effects so similar to each other. Made statement that I did the so called piss strip test to Real MDMA and BK-MDMC and guess what? --always showed up identical. Just get little weaker effect from MDMC than MDMA. But Shulgin was fond of both and one can still have great party on both?
 
1-(6-methoxynaphthalen-2-yl)-2-pyrrolidin-1-ylpentan-1-one, 1-(6-methoxynaphthalen-2-yl)-2-pyrrolidin-1-ylhexan-1-one, their N-ethyl analogues, and arecoline based naphthalene substituted drugs like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/N,O-Dimethyl-4-(2-naphthyl)piperidine-3-carboxylate, which is similarly just four simple reactions.

I don't get why mephedrone analogues are held in such a high regard, but I posted my opinion and explainations on this (and others "mystified" drugs like 4-MAR) here and elsewhere, more or less detailed.

People who buy mephedrone analogues do so, because they chase a lost memory.
That has not much at all to do with the real effects, but rather with nostalgia about the time they felt those effects.
Thats mephedrone-specific though.
Even the purest and cleanest mephedrone does not give any of those who miss "it" so much all the time, "this" back.
Its gone.
And the purity of the drug does not change or even influence this result much.

Thats like chasing the magic of MDMA by taking more and more MDMA, whenever you can get your hands on.
A not very smart move, that is.

Do not waste your time with this waste of time and fried brain cells.
Mephedrone might be nice for many at first, especially in excessive amounts, but everything is nice the first five times, even while it is actually frying your brain.... frying your brain barely ever feels bad for the person being fried.

One thing that needs to be more concentrated on: ß-naphthyl analouges of known stimulants.
Not alpha- though, those are much less active, up to just a tenth of the beta analogues.
6-MeO as said, are worthwhile.
Unsubstituted ones likely fall under analogues laws whereever you are.
 
mephedrone is a toy for toygamechildren, if used riight its the funniest du there is, noth that deep but nothing makes more fun taking it.
 
izo said:
these phenanthrene type opioids will never come to the rc marked, they belong to the fucking pharmacies, nothing you can do there...
Click to expand...
I'd say they belong to no one and/or all of us.
But I guess I understand your sentiment.

Are you saying that guy was lying about synthing an etorphine-level opioid from bupe? I mean he could have been, which is why I came to ask people more knowledgeable than me about chemistry topics.

It's amazing to think bupe could hold the potential to become a full agonist with some steps.

I was just curious is all. And enjoy learning, so no need for hostility.


I've read that mixing acetic anhydrous with almost any opiate/opioid changes it into another obscure opioid. Is this true/possible? And would acetic acid in vinegar be sufficient or are we talking needing lab grade equipment and chemicals?


Sorry for my ignorance. :p
 
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