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Global Events Prisoner Swap.. Ill give you an arms dealer for a supposed spy and a basketball talent that was silly enough to luggage personal karts into Russia.

neversickanymore

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babysitting the argument in my head

Well we all know that, while in a just and logical world we should be able to safely and securely travel from one interesting fucked up place to the next different and interesting fucked up place with our substances.. we should be very cautious as we stand the risk of getting arrested by some freak show government like the Russians or by my freak show government, the Americans,

Then we go from a harmless stoner basketball star to sitting in a Russian can waiting on an International super power agent swap.

I think cannabis makes the people who don't use it crazy.
 
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lonelyDude

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they should send the arms dealer back with a bomb surgically implanted in him.

they should fill the bomb with some kind of nerve agent as that is Kremlin style and really it would be poetic justice.

might be our best chance to finish the poo tin once and for all.

on a side note do you think gremlin and kremlin have anything to do with each other.
 

6am-64-14m

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Yeah she undoubtedly was given strct packing instructions but refused... entitlement, imo.
Dont believe the "accident" bs.
Everyone else has to pay for their indiscriminate actions.
Fuck swapping an arms dealer who isnt these days?
USA is the biggest dealer in arms today.....
 

Dropperneck

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This was only done bc of their idpol revolution. She’s lucky she’s a bipoc, otherwise she would be looking at serving the time. At least the establishment stays somewhat consistent, they stuck behind Ray Epps rather than just suiciding him and that’s sort of amicable.
 

SvnLyrBrto

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Or maybe Americans could just stop acting so tiresomely entitled when traveling overseas. It's hardly a secret that plenty of nations have much stricter drug laws than our own... even just for pot. Some which are somewhat lax internally will still drop the hammer on you if you try to smuggle anything in through customs. And still others go easy on their locals but will go after foreigners. (Or vice versa.) Hell, just domestically, there are plenty of areas of the US where the locals will still take a very dim view on outsiders bringing in drugs.

Is it really that hard to, when you travel and especially internationally, also take a vacation from getting high and leave the drugs at home? Hell, when I go on vacation I even check if any of my prescriptions or OTC medications will potentially be issues (Fun example: Leave any Sudafed or Vicks inhalers at home if you goto Japan.) and work out alternatives with my doctor when necessary. And I for one don't care to burn away my limited vacation time stuck on a couch stoned and eating Cheetos, or sleeping off an ecstasy comedown, when I'm somewhere new and there are things to see, places to go, and things to eat that I've never had the opportunity to experience before and may not get the chance again.
 

Dropperneck

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Or maybe Americans could just stop acting so tiresomely entitled when traveling overseas. It's hardly a secret that plenty of nations have much stricter drug laws than our own... even just for pot. Some which are somewhat lax internally will still drop the hammer on you if you try to smuggle anything in through customs. And still others go easy on their locals but will go after foreigners. (Or vice versa.) Hell, just domestically, there are plenty of areas of the US where the locals will still take a very dim view on outsiders bringing in drugs.

Is it really that hard to, when you travel and especially internationally, also take a vacation from getting high and leave the drugs at home? Hell, when I go on vacation I even check if any of my prescriptions or OTC medications will potentially be issues (Fun example: Leave any Sudafed or Vicks inhalers at home if you goto Japan.) and work out alternatives with my doctor when necessary. And I for one don't care to burn away my limited vacation time stuck on a couch stoned and eating Cheetos, or sleeping off an ecstasy comedown, when I'm somewhere new and there are things to see, places to go, and things to eat that I've never had the opportunity to experience before and may not get the chance again.
Amerilards have to have their weed vapes, it’s for their health!!!
 

Cream Gravy?

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Yeah I’m sorry but I have no sympathy for anyone dumb enough to smuggle personal amounts of weed into Russia. What the fuck was she smoking? Oh yeah, weed. Yet somehow even though I smoke weed… I would never smuggle it into RUSSIA 🤔
 

deficiT

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I think it was a dumb move but honestly she shouldn't be imprisoned for it in another country.

Substances function as medicine for many people, some don't have the luxury to just leave shit behind. I don't think that is necessarily the case for her, just speaking generally. America should care when their citizens are imprisoned unjustly. But of course, we do enough of that at home through prohibition.
 

Cream Gravy?

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America should care when their citizens are imprisoned unjustly. But of course, we do enough of that at home through prohibition.
As such it feels very hypocritical trying to secure her release. According to U.S. law she's a felon, concentrates are a no no.
 

Vastness

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Seems like an extremely poor deal for America, was my initial reaction, but on finding out who Paul Whelan is, I expect Griner was just thrown into the deal as an afterthought, since without her it's a direct swap of 2 (alleged) agents of rival states - which seems more conventional for this sort of thing. Although if she wasn't a famous athlete I expect she would just be forgotten about, which would obviously be highly unjust and unfair despite that being how the world works.

Yes, it is hypocritical and yes, it was stupid of her to import drugs into Russia. That said - it is still, IMO, the right and morally correct move to attempt to secure her release. 2 wrongs don't make a right and while her celebrity status no doubt gives her unfair value and an incentive to negotiating her release, compared to the average nobody, and even though there are countless people unjustly incarcerated or with criminal records for bullshit drug "crimes" in the US - these are, for the most part, separate problems that need to be dealt with.

While it would definitely make it easier to represent the moral high ground if Western nations got their own shit in order as far as properly ending prohibition within their own borders first, I think, hypocrisy or not, where it is possible to pressure nations with absurdly punitive legal systems into releasing American citizens (or, indeed, citizens of any other nation with the geopolitical standing to exert such influence) when they have been incarcerated for things that are not real crimes - it is morally correct and just to do so.

In this specific case, of course, I don't really think questions of objective ethics came into it at any point. Griner was arrested because she gave Russia the opportunity to use her as leverage, whereas in more peaceful times she might well have got away with a fine or a slap on the wrist. Her release is potentially on the cards because to America, she is a revenue-generating popular figure, it's both economically and politically likely to be favourable to secure her release - and from Russia's perspective, this was the primary reason for arresting her - to use her as leverage, likely in exactly the kind of prisoner swap that is now being discussed. None of these things are really ethically defensible behaviours, but despite that sometimes the right thing is done for the wrong reasons. I don't know if this is exactly the right thing to do in this specific situation, but if we reduce it just to whether or not it's right to try to secure the release of citizens incarcerated for fucking stupid nonsense by tyrannical regimes - then to me it is right, even if it would not be how things play out for so many other people, or in so many variations of this scenario, and really just illustrates the monumental unfairness of the world as it exists today.
 

Cream Gravy?

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