• HEALTH &
    RECOVERY
    🌼 Welcome Guest 🌼
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
  • H&R Moderators: chinup | VerbalTruist | n3ophy7e
  • Bluelight HOT THREADS
  • Let's Welcome Our NEW MEMBERS!

Quitting high dose Kratom habit via taper

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Totbot, I know that fear you speak of all to well. Hardcore withdrawals are soooo much worse than the flu. I?d rather have the flu anyday. In fact I wish it was as easy as the flu. You can do it though!! I feel for your brother and his Xanax kick. Benzo withdrawals are unbelievably painful and traumatizing. So happy we was able to get through that. Just a reminder to those who may read this thinking about doing a benzo kick, benzo withdrawals can be deadly if not done properly. Please seek medical attention if you need to get off Benzos. Same with alcohol. Booze withdrawals can be deadly as well. Get off the shit, but be careful with those two substances and their withdrawal. Totbot, I?ve been taking Kratom by mixing the powdered leaf in a cup with warm water and drinking it down. I hate it. It tastes awful and I can?t wait to not have to ever do it again. When I tried to taper I was decreasing by a couple grams every 3-4 days when I was at higher doses (basically above 25 grams/day. I never made it below that as I just didn?t have the discipline to stick to it and not take more than I needed. I?ve been taking anywhere from 30-60 grams a day lately. I?m officially out of Kratom as of tonight and have no money to buy more so tomorrow will be day one again of cold turkey. I plan to take loperamide, high doses of vitamin c every 2-3 hours, amino acids, black seed oil, and doxylamine and melatonin for sleep. For whatever reason insomnia isn?t too bad for me during Kratom withdrawals. Neither is restless legs. For me the worst symptoms are crippling depression, some anxiety, and extreme nausea and dysohoria. I?m feeling good about it though. Today I woke up in withdrawals and couldn?t access my Kratom supply until mid afternoon. Upon waking up I took loperamide and about 6 grams of vitamin c. Whithin an hour I felt pretty ok. So tomorrow I?ll be doing the same as well as the other supplements I mentioned previously in this post. I?ll update soon with how things are going with the cold turkey. Thanks for all who have posted and those struggling. I?m very grateful for all your sharing, support, encouragement etc. I have a new group of recovery friends from my Outpatient Program, which I completed last week, that I?m in contact with and going to daily AA and NA meetings with. Also have a great support network consisting of friends and family. For all these things I feel very fortunate and greatful. Take care everyone. Here?s to health and sobriety!!!
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Also Totbot, if your schedule or location makes it difficult to get to meetings there are online resources you can access that work similar to meetings. If I come accross those I?ll post some links for you. Perhaps others reading this thread have some ideas or insight into that too. Something I hear at meetings a lot is that if we are willing to do whatever it takes to get sober, which in my experience must be the mindset in order to achieve successful true sobriety, we need to be willing to do put as much time and effort into making meetings as we did trying to access and use our substances of choice. I think that is an essential rule of thumb. I used to spend a lot of time and money and effort feeding my addictions. If I want recovery to work I need to put that same amount of time and effort into my recovery program. At the least. Perhaps more. Recovery is hard work but it?s worth every second. Don?t settle for anything less. If you do that you can get clean and healthy. Sincerely wishing you all the best. May your health improve drastically and your life be filled with healing, sobriety and the amazing gift of life that is a result of your recovery. You deserve it. Remember that you are not a bad person, you?re a great person that has a very serious and deadly disease. You didn?t want nor ask for this, but you must take the responsibility of doing the hard work to get clean. Willingness and open mindedness is all you need to get started. Much love to you.
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Quick update: first day in a few weeks with zero Kratom. Woke up at 9:20 in moderate withdrawals. Took 40 mg loperamide and went back to sleep. Woke up around 10:20, still feeling crappy. Laid in bed until about 11:20. Took 5+ grams of sodium ascorbate (vitamin c) mixed with a small glass of oj. By noon I felt almost normal. Not much appetite, but not nauseus at all. Slight depression and anxiety, but very manageable. Compared to normal full blown withdrawals it?s a 2-3 on a scale of 1-10. I can function just fine. Work. Anything. Took another dose of 5 grams sodium ascorbate at 12:30. Staying on that every 2-3 hours is the plan. If I can keep the symptoms this mild I?m well on my way to freedom. Vit C megadose seems very effective combined with loperamide. I?ll stop the loperamide in 3 days. Maintain C for a week or more. Will keep posting. Thanks
 
Last edited:

Totbot

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
18
Saying prayers for you this morning! I know exactly how bad the depression can be. You can do this. You have so much courage! Hopefully you can have at least a silver lining with the comfort meds you have. Cold turkey and feeling some withdrawl is necessary IMO. And thank you for reminding me of honesty open-mindedness and willingness above all right now. Im getting on NA.org today. Meetings are possible for me.. Just not every day but im making a decision and commitment to get to the ones i can. Im down to 24 grams. Im planning to taper a gram each dose every other day starting Saturday... and taking your list of supplements as needed... Loperamide only when i jump off. Lope can be risky for us so please be careful taking it... Keep it low dose and brief. Im so excited for you Scrillion! And im right behind ya! Eyes on the prize today!!!
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Thanks Totbot and best of luck! Sounds like you have a plan and some willingness and that?s great! Keep it up.

Today I?ve taken 2 5 gram doses of vitamin c and I feel pretty ok. Not completely withdrawal free, but no where near as bad as I?ve felt in the past doing cold turkey. This seems to be working very well. No loperamide today. No need. Feeling very hopeful and encouraged.

Will update again soon.
 

Totbot

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
18
I am praying for you Scrillion. That it's not to much of a struggle and that you have whatever you need to make it through and never look back. I know how hard these first days can be. Ive said a few prayers for you and will continue til you're walking out of the woods.
 

Totbot

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
18
Just wondering how you are doing? Theres no shame in quitting not going as planned if you are in that spot. There's no one among us who doesn't thoroughly understand that! I hope you're making it tho. I haven't even started my taper. I don't know if I'm 100% ready. Close though. I got some comfort meds in case i plan to just quit cold turkey.
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Yeah, I fucked up...again. I made it a few days before I started back on the Kratom. I?ve had some extremely stressful tasks to attend to recently and just couldn?t do them properly while I was in withdrawals. I?m going to get some of these stressful things completed this week and try again, maybe starting Sunday. This is literally my last chance to get through it without loosing my marriage. I?m determined, yet frustrated and depressed. I did get myself a sponsor and started working the steps, so that?s good. Thanks for checking in. I?ll def report back with results/progress. I think I?m going to get the ?flu? this weekend, hole up at my families house, give them my wallet and my car keys, and tell them not to let me leave the house alone. If I can make it through 5 days I think I?ll get to the point that I?ll feel good enough to ride out the rest without screwing it up. Ugh...this s by far the hardest fight I?ve ever battled with this disease. Well, maybe not as bad as my battle with alcohol 8 years ago, but a close second place.
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
I will say that the vitamin c megadose method is extremely helpful. I believe it will be very helpful in this next go at it. Gonna try not to take loperamide. I believe it will just extend withdrawals anyway. So I plan to take 6 grams of sodium ascorbate (powdered vitamin C that?s easier on the digestive tract than the typical C supplement) every 2-3 hours for the first few days, accompanied by lots and lots of water. The amino acids I was taking seem to be helpful too. Glutamine, DLPA, Tryptophan, Theanine, on an empty stomach once or twice a day. Also, Cal/Mag, B Complex, and GABA. I know everyone says GABA doesn?t cross the blood brain barrier, but I recently read an article written by some Dr that said that that theory is typically based on 1 or 2 studies done a long time ago that could be innacurate. Additionally she said she was part of a study that saw oral GABA supplements cross the BBB well. It does seem to help me stay calm, so even if it?s placebo I?ll take it. Tyrosine and Arganine I?ve also taken and could be helpful. Lastly, for sleep I take doxylamine and melatonin to help during withdrawals. I usually sleep pretty much fine during Kratom withdrawals, and for that I am very grateful because I know most people don?t share that experience. I also don?t get the restless legs. For me the toughest symptoms are depression, nausea, and dysphoria. Anyway, those supplements and vitamins seem to help significantly for me. Especially the c megadoses. Oh! I almost forgot! Black seed oil seems to be helpful too. I?ve akso tried agmatine but I can?t tell if it helped or made it worse. I may try that again this weekend. I keep forgetting I have it. Most of what I?ve read says that agmatine can help keep tolerance low, but only if you start taking when your tolerance is still low. Can?t find much about it being used for actual withdrawals.
 
Last edited:

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Ok, just read some more about agmatine. Seems like some people have had good results with it relieving some withdrawal symptoms. I?m gonna try it again. It won?t hurt and if it helps I?ll be glad I did it. But I want to stress that the most relief from withdrawal symptoms I?ve experienced from any supplement is the vitamin C megadose. That shit works.
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Ok, I?m out of Kratom. I had enough to get through the day and go to an AA meeting. Tomorrow will be day 1 of my last ditch effort to kick this bullshit without loosing my marriage. If I can?t get through it this time I?m going to have to go to a medical detox and I will almost certainly get divorced. I have no money to buy more, I?m giving my family my car keys and telling them to not let me leave the house by myself, and I?m stocked up on Vit C and all the supplements I wrote about in my last couple posts. I?m going to do my best to try to keep a positive mindset and remind myself that health and happiness are right around the corner if I can get through this. I?ll keep you guys updated. Thanks so much. ??
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Woke up today feeling the withdrawals. Felt really rough. Took 6 grams (yes, grams, not mg) of vitamin c. Still felt pretty rough an hour later. Took another 6 grams of c. Started feeling significantly better within 30-45 min. About 1 1/2 hours later I took another 6 grams of c. Went for a 20 minute walk. Took a hot shower. Had some lunch. Feeling almost no withdrawals currently. I definitely feel off and not 100%, but compared to this morning or a normal withdrawal day I feel really good. Now, I just need to get through the rest of today without pulling some addict minded shit and getting more Kratom. That?s definitely a concern, but I?m feeling encouraged. Going to a 12 step meeting this afternoon. I?ll update again soon. ??
 

Totbot

Greenlighter
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
18
Sorry i havent been around. You are definately in my positive thoughts. I hope not having any kratom will help. I wish there was something else i could share with you that helps. Kratom fkn takes over and messes with my focus. That along with the obsession is going to make quitting very difficult. Keep meditating on what you want and what is most important first thing and throughout the day. Create the obsession for anything else but using. I would try some st johns wart and gensing or other herbal supplements that help boost energy and mood... Listen to an engulfing audio book. Stay in as many meetings as possible. Hold your wife for hours on the couch in front of the t.v.... go out with recovery homies. Tell yourself no matter what... Just for today im not going to use. I crave so much stability in myself and life and i know we'll both get there. I got some black seed oil yesterday and i have vit c tablets.. 1000 mg. I work out and eat pretty healthy but i think im going to do a cleanse and sweat in a sauna somewhere. Ive got art supplies and a list of new recipes i can spend time on. My goal is to arrange all these things for when i jump. As of right now im down to 20 grams a day. But i am still getting high at least once a day. Turns out they are right when they say with kratom less is more. Anyway... If you can find a sweat lodge... It is a wonderful empowering experience. This is your life. Own it.. Dont let it own you. (my new mantra) keep posting okay!
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Thank you!! Great advice and insight. Just FYI the megadoses of vitamin c will cause you some digestive issues, but it?s a small price to pay for some significant relief. Some people report upset stomach. I didn?t really get stomach pain but I do get gas and diarrhea. Just stay hydrated. I had to take Kratom again because I have a couple extremely stressful business tasks I need to complete today, but I?m going back off tomorrow. There?s no way I could complete those tasks if I was in withdrawals and they absolutely have to get done today. I guess I didn?t really think that through when I decided to try to jump off the other day. I was just so fucking sick of being dependent and I tried to force it when it wasn?t really feasible. Anyway, I?m back off it tomorrow and I?ve got my schedule all cleared out for the rest of the week so I have no more excuses. Told my family that I was still taking it this morning and they are going to help me make sure I don?t go back on it. No money. No car keys. For the rest of the week. I?m out of black seed oil but I?m stocked up on all the other supplements I?ve mentioned. Feeling hopeful. I told my family that this is my last chance to get off it and if I don?t stick it out they will make me go to medical detox and rehab. I?ll also end up divorced. I don?t want any of that to happen so I?m hoping that gives me the will power and resolve to stick it through. I think the first 4 days are going to be pretty tough but I should start to improve after that. Ugh! I?ll continue to update here. Thanks again Totbot. I greatly appreciate your feedback, encouragement, and insight. Good job on getting down to 20 grams!! That?ll make it easier than higher doses obviously. Best of luck to you. I?ll be thinking about you, my anonymous friend.
 

Jshock1313

Greenlighter
Joined
May 19, 2017
Messages
20
Location
Louisville, KY
Stick to it Scrillion, you got this! I've been tapering off a 2.5yr kratom habit of 30+ grams on a low day. I'm down to 9 now and feel like I might be able to beat this finally, and I know you can too. You're story seems pretty similar to mine. Let's beat this together! I just started working some vitamin C into my regimen today to see how it goes. Now most of my withdrawals are mild anxiety, night sweats, and minor shoulder pain. I'm at 3 grams in the morning when my sweats wake me up around 5am, 2 grams between 1-2pm, and 4 grams at 6pm. I've been tapering for a while, and have had multiple slip ups, but the general trend is less and less. I'm hoping that the vitamin c takes care of the bulk of the minor acutes I'm experiencing. I went CT from midNovember-midDecember, but I started drinking to help my first week off kratom in November, which rapidly spiraled out of control (alcoholic). Some cannabis also helped tremendously, but was too risky for me because my job does randoms. One hungover day I decided like an idiot to take kratom to help with hangover. And by January I was back up to over 20g a day. But three weeks ago I started my taper plan and am back down to 9g and haven't touched any other drug or alcohol. If I continue to stick to my plan I'll be clean before the end of February. One thing that's helped me is keeping a log of my tapering and a journal on my phone of how I feel between doses. It helped me look back and see my progress. I'd be more than happy to share it with you if you want. I used stem and vein before I went CT in November. It helped too, but since I've been doing good in January I haven't had a need to buy any yet. I had a weird experience with stem and vein increasing my anxiety which has me wanting to avoid it if I can. I can go into more detail if you want. Didn't mean to get long with this. I just wanted to encourage you. You can and will beat this and it does get better!
 
Last edited:

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
Wow!! Thanks so much for sharing! I really appreciate it. Congratulations on all your progress! Stick with it. I didn?t have the will power/discipline to taper effectively. So glad to hear it?s working for you. That?s frickin awesome. Today I finished some very stressful business crap that I had to get done and I?ll be out of Kratom by the time I go to bed tonight. So it?s on! I?m very determined right now. I have the help of my family for encouragement and support and making sure I don?t relapse before the bulk of the withdrawals are over. Even if I get weak and want to get more I simply don?t have the means, so that?s really good. Of course I am an addict and in the past I?ve lied and stolen and done all kinds of crazy addict shit to get drugs and alcohol so I know I need to be vigilant to make sure that doesn?t happen. I?ve been meeting with my new sponsor every week for the past couple of weeks and going to a lot of AA and NA meetings. That?s been very helpful and encouraging. Thanks again for sharing. Please keep us updated if you can. It?s so amazingly helpful to hear others experiences and successes. I?m really happy for you and rooting for you and everyone else battling this horrible disease. I?ll keep updating. I?ve cleared my schedule for the rest of the week and will be holing up with my family. As I said in previous posts I?ve given them my wallet and my car keys and asked them to not let me leave the house alone for any reason until next week. I?m as ready as I?ll ever be. So here I go!! Let?s do this shit!! Together we can do it!! ????
 

KraziKat

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 30, 2013
Messages
458
Location
Exit 165
Just a quick note about the vitamin c method; you have to take very large doses for it to be helpful. Sodium Ascorbate is a type of Vit c that is easier on the digestive system than the typical c supplemts, which are usually ascorbic acid. Here?s a good article about using c for opiate withdrawal...

https://opiateaddictionsupport.com/how-to-use-vitamin-c-for-opiate-withdrawal/

Question. Is it the kind of thing where you need to be near a toilet at all times, while doing the Vit C mega dosing?
 

Scrillion

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
215
It did give me diarrhea, but I didn?t need to stay close to the toilet at all times. I was able to make it to some 12 step meetings. It?s a small price to pay for getting relief from the rest of the symptoms. My experience was that I?d have diarrhea from the withdrawals anyway.
 

Jshock1313

Greenlighter
Joined
May 19, 2017
Messages
20
Location
Louisville, KY
The vitamin C seems to be working good for me so far! I've been taking around 3-5 grams every three hours or so. I appreciate the link, I'll definitely read up on it. It has give me the runs, but only like 30 minutes after taking it. Then I'm fine until 30 minutes after my next dose. It's helped with motivation and general well-being tremendously. Maybe placebo, but I don't care as long as it works! Since taking it my only acutes have been night sweats and they've even calmed down. I was having to change clothes like 3-4 times a night and I didn't even have to the last two nights. Still not sleeping past 5am though. But anxiety has cleared up almost completely and like I said, I just feel better! I'm so close I can taste sobriety for the first time in over a decade. I'm so motivated and close right now I can't allow myself to slip up. My self control is usually terrible, that's why I've not been able to quit the last few attempts. Not sure how you'll feel about it, but I've prayed and prayed hard everyday for the strength, and it's been coming. I can also say I've experienced the opposite though. Like no matter how hard I prayed nothing got better. Like I was just talking to the ceiling. I had an addict whose been clean for over 5 years tell me that God doesn't help until both knees hit the floor. I took it to mean that he wants you to really want it. The suffering has taught me lessons though. Like how big of an idiot I am lol I truly am powerless over my addictions. But that's okay. I just have to learn to get clean and not put myself back in these types of situations. It really does get better Scrillion! Once I got below 14g, there is nothing to stop me now lol and it will be that way for you too! Keep pushing, keep fighting, and we'll both get out of this hell we've put ourselves in! Addiction is like a jail with an unlocked door. Once we decide to leave the comfort of being high and go open the door, there's a whole world out there to explore! It's all about being willing to get uncomfortable and stepping outside of our comfort zone. It sounds like you have a great support system and I can tell you're a great person! You got this! Now let's kick it's butt and explore the world!!!
 
Top