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Suboxone or Kratom for getting of opiates

t1metoquit

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 22, 2021
Messages
7
Hello there, I’ve been dealing with a nasty habit of the blue pressed M30 pills. Every day for 2 years…escalated from 1.5 to almost 10 per day. It is time, and past time, to quit. I’m assuming they’re laced with fentanyl.

I saw a doc and was prescribed Suboxone. He said to wait 12-18 hours before taking them. I tried the Subs once and immediately got hurled into predicated withdrawals. Very, very unpleasant and I immediately went back to using.

I saw another doctor and he suggested the “Bernese Method”…microdosing with Subs while tapering down the pills. I have also seen a number of people having success using Kratom as a “bridge” to get off opiates and mitigate withdrawals. As info, I also have Clonidine prescribed.

What have your experiences been? What is better to get off pills and opiates, Suboxone or Kratom?
 

Amos2019

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 16, 2019
Messages
63
I encourage the use of Kratom. In MY experience, and this is MY experience, we are all different. In my experience, try RED BALI Kratom. I take a quarter cup of hot water, (i warm a 1/4 cup of water in the microwave for 30 seconds.) and a LARGE heaping tablespoon of powdered red bali kratom and stir till disolved. I always have a chaser ready, coffee, etc and drink my kratom and suck down some coffee behind it right away, as it IS TERRIBLE!! Lol. I feel better in about 10 min and it lasts 8 hours for me. Far less pain, and a general feeling of just feeling better, a little lighter on my feet, so to say. Good luck!

A
 

deficiT

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Mar 7, 2011
Messages
10,146
Location
Baltimore, MD
It is probably best to try kratom first. If you can avoid long term maintenance that would be for the best.

That said, kratom isn't always an effective means of maintenance if you've had a really bad habit. Ime I used kratom for maintenance for 6 years, it can be done. But I ultimately went back to dope.

I have since switched to Suboxone and stayed off dope.

You could always use the kratom as a bridge to the Suboxone as well. That way you won't have to worry about the PWD.
 

t1metoquit

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 22, 2021
Messages
7
It is probably best to try kratom first. If you can avoid long term maintenance that would be for the best.

That said, kratom isn't always an effective means of maintenance if you've had a really bad habit. Ime I used kratom for maintenance for 6 years, it can be done. But I ultimately went back to dope.

I have since switched to Suboxone and stayed off dope.

You could always use the kratom as a bridge to the Suboxone as well. That way you won't have to worry about the PWD.
That’s a great idea. Thank you! I have strong external factors supporting me (great corporate job, wife, two little kids). I desperately WANT to be clean but I am terrified of the withdrawals and missing work. I’m also the sort of a-hole that has a private habit and my family has no idea. I don’t want them to know. I want and need to be free from these pills. I know it is a common story, but I suffered a back injury and had surgery and had oxy prescribed for 6 months. I got hooked. When the doc shut it off, I had a “friend” who had “oxy” that he could sell me…but it was the pressed blue M30s. I thought it was actual oxy and not fentanyl. I had super easy access and ended up taking them for 2 years straight every day. My naive self thought they were actual Oxy until my doctor said they were probably fentanyl, and I tested them and they are, in fact, positive for fent.

I know it will be hard, and I have heard from the folks here that PAWS will be a nightmare, but I am hoping to avoid “maintenance” where I take another substance for months or years. I’m hoping to mitigate the withdrawals for a week or two and then be clean. But maybe take the occasional benzo as needed once I al off all forms of opiates. I am scared of taking opiates and benzos together.

As a question, how much does Kratom help with the withdrawals? If feeling normal is a “1” and full blown withdrawals are a “10”, where do you get with Kratom in terms of mitigating the withdrawals? Can you function and work and just feel like crap? Or are you still curled in the fetal position where every 15 minutes feels like an hour?

I really appreciate the expertise and attitude people on this forum have. I’ve been a long time “lurker” and love what this board is about in terms of supporting people and harm reduction.
 

t1metoquit

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 22, 2021
Messages
7
I encourage the use of Kratom. In MY experience, and this is MY experience, we are all different. In my experience, try RED BALI Kratom. I take a quarter cup of hot water, (i warm a 1/4 cup of water in the microwave for 30 seconds.) and a LARGE heaping tablespoon of powdered red bali kratom and stir till disolved. I always have a chaser ready, coffee, etc and drink my kratom and suck down some coffee behind it right away, as it IS TERRIBLE!! Lol. I feel better in about 10 min and it lasts 8 hours for me. Far less pain, and a general feeling of just feeling better, a little lighter on my feet, so to say. Good luck!

A
Thank you Amos! If feeling normal is a “1” and full-blown withdrawals are a “10”, where do you get to with Kratom? Can you function, and go to work, and just feel a bit shitty? Or is there still an element of “omg am I dying?” and feeling like you can’t drink or eat anything without throwing it up?
 

Opi_Kid_Rock

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
477
Location
Lost. Always have been it seemed.
Thank you Amos! If feeling normal is a “1” and full-blown withdrawals are a “10”, where do you get to with Kratom? Can you function, and go to work, and just feel a bit shitty? Or is there still an element of “omg am I dying?” and feeling like you can’t drink or eat anything without throwing it up?
Everyone experiences Kratom differently in my personal experience. When I was kicking small oxy(real ones), Kratom did F ALL. Suboxone made me feel very comfortable which you say is not the case for you. One has to try Kratom for themselves to know for sure. If Kratom doesn’t work then higher doses of Suboxone or Methadone are other ways of opiates replacement therapy. You’ve probably heard about the risks of Methadone I’m assuming.
 

Pumpkin2021

Moderator: TDS, NMI
Staff member
Joined
Feb 25, 2021
Messages
2,652
Location
Michigan
I love kratom. Mixing meang da with red Bali is the shit 🙂
Interesting you say that as I like that combo as well. Kratom has to do it for me now as it's the only drug I can take ( besides weed ) .

White Thai's also mix well with Bali.....wish they would rename the sleepy red ones. The tree doesn't grow there and I'm not even sure Bali still exports Indonesian kratom.
 

Pumpkin2021

Moderator: TDS, NMI
Staff member
Joined
Feb 25, 2021
Messages
2,652
Location
Michigan
It is probably best to try kratom first. If you can avoid long term maintenance that would be for the best.

That said, kratom isn't always an effective means of maintenance if you've had a really bad habit. Ime I used kratom for maintenance for 6 years, it can be done. But I ultimately went back to dope.

I have since switched to Suboxone and stayed off dope.

You could always use the kratom as a bridge to the Suboxone as well. That way you won't have to worry about the PWD.
:this:
 

deficiT

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Mar 7, 2011
Messages
10,146
Location
Baltimore, MD
That’s a great idea. Thank you! I have strong external factors supporting me (great corporate job, wife, two little kids). I desperately WANT to be clean but I am terrified of the withdrawals and missing work. I’m also the sort of a-hole that has a private habit and my family has no idea. I don’t want them to know. I want and need to be free from these pills. I know it is a common story, but I suffered a back injury and had surgery and had oxy prescribed for 6 months. I got hooked. When the doc shut it off, I had a “friend” who had “oxy” that he could sell me…but it was the pressed blue M30s. I thought it was actual oxy and not fentanyl. I had super easy access and ended up taking them for 2 years straight every day. My naive self thought they were actual Oxy until my doctor said they were probably fentanyl, and I tested them and they are, in fact, positive for fent.

I know it will be hard, and I have heard from the folks here that PAWS will be a nightmare, but I am hoping to avoid “maintenance” where I take another substance for months or years. I’m hoping to mitigate the withdrawals for a week or two and then be clean. But maybe take the occasional benzo as needed once I al off all forms of opiates. I am scared of taking opiates and benzos together.

As a question, how much does Kratom help with the withdrawals? If feeling normal is a “1” and full blown withdrawals are a “10”, where do you get with Kratom in terms of mitigating the withdrawals? Can you function and work and just feel like crap? Or are you still curled in the fetal position where every 15 minutes feels like an hour?

I really appreciate the expertise and attitude people on this forum have. I’ve been a long time “lurker” and love what this board is about in terms of supporting people and harm reduction.
Like others have mentioned, it might boil down to a personal reaction. Some people react to kratom more strongly than others. For me, when I was going through fent/h withdrawal, high doses of Kratom probably got me to a 4-6. Still fairly shitty but not critically so.
 

t1metoquit

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 22, 2021
Messages
7
Like others have mentioned, it might boil down to a personal reaction. Some people react to kratom more strongly than others. For me, when I was going through fent/h withdrawal, high doses of Kratom probably got me to a 4-6. Still fairly shitty but not critically so.
Thank you for the input. Have you tried subs for withdrawal too? I am wondering how they compare. I’m deathly afraid of subs after the precipitated withdrawal experience but I know it works wonders for many people.
 

t1metoquit

Greenlighter
Joined
Oct 22, 2021
Messages
7
Like others have mentioned, it might boil down to a personal reaction. Some people react to kratom more strongly than others. For me, when I was going through fent/h withdrawal, high doses of Kratom probably got me to a 4-6. Still fairly shitty but not critically so.
Hello deficit and Amos…thank you for the advice. I’m now 4 days clean from the “dirty 30” pills and regularly using red vein kratom, Gabapentin, and Clonidine to mitigate the withdrawals. Without I doubt I still feel crappy and have a strong feeling of malaise, but it is worlds better than being curled around a toilet vomiting and shitting for days straight. I know it’s not over yet, but I’m feeling like it’s totally doable. A big thing for me was my connection proactively reached out to me yesterday asking if I needed anything for the weekend….so tempting to say yes and have it delivered to my doorstep in 30 minutes, but I said NO!

So far, I can’t say enough about the Kratom, Gabapentin, and Clonidine combo. It’s a walk in the park compared to “normal” withdrawals. Thank you for pointing me in this direction, as I was about to fuck around with subs again.
 
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