# 2012, the Complete Works



## continuousbeing

I have heard and read a lot about a large scale evolution in or around 2012 to the 4th dimension.  Now, lets just assume that that is true, and that it is not everyone that will ascend.  

My question is, do oyu think that we would see a large influx into our dimension of beings/energy/cosnsciousness from a lower dimension?  Does this even make any sense to anyone else but me?  

one love


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## farscape1

If you are talking about dimensions as in hieght, width, and length, the fourth dimention would be time. 

I don't think a lifeform can move or shift from a two dimentional world to a 3D one.


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## PGTips

Where have you heard this from? No offence but it sounds sort of a hippy-like theory which has used science words to sound plausable. 

We currently exist in a 4 dimensional (at least on a large scale 4d) universe, as Farscape says, 3D space and 1D time. We already have lower dimensions, 1D and 2D space existing within our universe (smaller dimensional spaces can be embedded within larger dimensional spaces). 

Its not thought that 2D universes  (and especially 1D) with life can exist. A 1d lifeform would be confined to a line. Objects would be unable to pass one another, so you can never go from a setup like ABC to ACB, because B cannot move out of C's way to let it past. Hence you can't get much complexity.

A 2D space doesn't have this problem, you're on a plane, but now you generate other problems. Consider our digestive system (or even worse, our circulatory system). Its a long "tube" though us. Thats okay, because its enclosed within our bodies. What about a long tube through a 2D object, it would split the object in half. Hence you can't get objects with overly complicated makeups because they'd fall apart. Not to mention the whole problem about disipation of radiation in only 2D being too "slow".

1D and 2D life forms in our own 3 spacial dimension universe wouldn't happen because it would require things to be confined to 1 or 2d, which doesn't happen.

Of course, if you believe in the whole "ascension, higher planes, conciousness as energy" palarva, then I doubt any of that would bother you. Suffice to say, at the moment, our understanding of physics says "Forget it" when it comes to life anything like our own or even a universe stable enough for life to appear for 1 or 2d universes, hence I don't see how there is a current line of thought that is anything more than philisophical mumbo jumbo which is pointing towards "a large scale evolution in or around 2012 to the 4th dimension" I'm afraid  Nor does anything point to "ascension" in 2012 or any other time.


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## Jimmy the Gun

^what about mayan calenders and the venus transit?  There is also that planet that is supposed to be near us in 2012.  those things point to an ascension...

i won't hold my breath though.


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## PGTips

What about the Venus transit on June 8th 2004? Nothing happened. I remember a few astronomy buffs standing in the middle of a courtyard in the summer using some device to watch it. 

Having browsed through a few sites, it seems the event on that day will be the galactic and solar planes lining up, so at dawn the Sun will be between us and the Galactic core, with the band the Milky Way forms stretching along the horizon. Mayan mythology says that "The Milky Way "sits" on the earth, touching it at all points around, opening  up  the cosmic sky portal".

Personally, I think this is just another cosmic event. Its happened before, it'll happen again. Ancient civilisations considered eclipses or the alignment of certain planets to result in magical things, or that thunder was a gods way of saying "I'm pissed off". If you believe in this kind of stuff, up to you. I just don't see anything "major" about it, other than our interpretation. It'll be a nice view in the morning of Dec. 21st I'm sure, but nothing else.


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## monkeyjunky

what is everyone talking about an "ascension"?
is this some kind of evolutionary jump that humans are supposed to make. 
or maybe that's x-men...
or maybe it's bullshit.
or maybe it's the end of the world.


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## David

Huh? Are we supposed to get invaded or something stupid?


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## Void

Its a theory circulating around newage circles, by people who use crystals and sit in wooden pyramids and such to channel energy from various masters and angels and stuff. 

They claim that the earth is coming to a critical mass sort of situation. Some people moving upto the 6th or 12th or 11th dimension (depending who you talk to), and other versions is that the earth itself is moving up in vibration/dimension and stuff like that. That these changes will bring about a higher consciousness on this planet and the possiblities of various aliens arriving (again, depending on who you talk to). Havent really been keeping tabs on all this, and its not necessarily related to the 2012 prophecies. Fact is that many native prophecies emphasis a dawning of a newage and so you get a lot of different stories going around. It is a pretty 'feel good' community, with an emphasis of certain meditational practices and clearning of the self to prepare for these changes. 

Didnt hear anything about beings of lower dimensions coming in, mainly because these theories emphasis that we are pretty much the lowest dimension around.


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## qwe

lets bring back this thread in 2012, and someone here will be pwned


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## Zet

The theory for 2012 is that a large comet will come by earth and cause who effects. 

research the plasma discharge model made by james mcanney .


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## Void

comet? wasnt it like something about another planet that kinda glides past our solar system every few thousand years or something? I dunnno. Maybe Dr. who will show up and save the day. Overall, people have a shitload of beliefs that some outside inflience (god, jesus, ascention) will show up and fix things for us cause apparently we cant be fucked. Personally I recon we will be a bit more intelligent then that frog that slowly roasted alive in slow to boil water. hopefully anyway.


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## Zet

The planet can be referring to the mythical planet referred to us by the egyptians known as Nibiriu. 

As to the comet reference. It is in fact supposed to be as a large as a planet, and the newest addition to our solar system besides Venus.


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## PGTips

Zet said:
			
		

> *The planet can be referring to the mythical planet referred to us by the egyptians known as Nibiriu.*


 Planet X and all that? Wasn't it _supposed_ to appear in 2004? Or before that 2000? Every time the date of "OMG something major is going to happen!!" comes and goes, it suddenly gets knocked back a couple of years with "oh, sorry, I forgot to carry the 2 in my calculations. Its all explained in my new book, buy it now!"

Having done a search for "plasma discharge model made by james mcanney", I'm unsurprised to find.....he's selling a book. Places like this which say stuff like 


> There is a sufficient quantity of evidence from a number of scientific and historical disciplines .... to make it virtually inconceivable that there will not be major Earth changes within a matter of months or, at most, within a year or two.


are a mixture of scaremongering and bad facts. Strange how the site says it'll happen in a few short months, yet its called "Crawford 2000" (suggesting its been online since 2000) and the guestbook has comments relating to it as far back as 2001. 

Though I didn't read the whole page, their definition of fusion leaves a lot to be desired. If it was triggered by lightning, we'd all be in trouble! That and it doesn't occur in that atmosphere of stars, it happens in the centre!

As I said previously, its a mixture of taped together stories from various religions and cultures with some science thrown in to make it sound vaguely plausable. If James Mcanney wasn't selling a book, he'd have a bit more credibility IMO, and if his ideas were as correct as these places claim they are, they'd have been varified by now, and the "doomsday" predictions been taken a bit more serious, but stuff like "to make it virtually inconceivable that there will not be major Earth changes within a matter of months or, at most, within a year or two." is just plain crap.


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## monkeyjunky

"There is a sufficient quantity of evidence from a number of scientific and historical disciplines .... to make it virtually inconceivable that there will not be major Earth changes within a matter of months or, at most, within a year or two. "

there is sufficient fuckin evidence to prove that everything that that guy has ever said in his life is complete bullshit


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## Ernestrome

I didn't think the 2.0.1.2 thing was supposed to refer to the year 2012.


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## everythinginside

yeah i think it's backwards.. it's supposed to be 2102.

Damn looks like we have to wait another 100 years or so for the space aliens to come say "everything's gonna be alright, you're so special, now we will take you up to a land where nothing is wrong"

what they don't tell us is we will essentially become fungus-like things which will be eaten by 'lesser' space aliens to prepare them for their ascension.

yep..


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## Molybdenum

There are about 500 claims circulating around what will happen in 2012.  It's been picked up by everyone from UFOlogists to biblical apocalyptics to Terrence McKenna to channelers to, well, you name it.

If anything actually happens, I think it will be a shift towards a more expanded awareness, in the eastern sense, among large sectors of the population.  You could call it "ascending to the fourth dimension" or whatever but that seems like an opaque way to put it if you ask me.  This shift won't be readily noticeable for many years, if it happens at all.

There's a good chance that all of this stuff is junk.  Certainly most of it has to be junk since it all conflicts.  Some of the insights from a couple of channeling and chakric healing sites have helped with my meditative practices, true or not...


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## everythinginside

that sounds better


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## mr_p

i think you will see more people skipping down the street naked full of joy for life  .... thats my affirmation ! (if it doesn't happen by 2012, i'll be doing ... lock me away ....... i'm too free...for society)

anyways ..... there is an underground shift in conciousness occurring right this moment .... slowly gaining momentum ... people are waking up from a deep unconcous sleeep 

no more fear ! 

(i'm allowed to dream, and so are you)

this mayan stuff is really interesting ... i wouldn't ride it off as hippy shit .... 

it all has to do with the spherical nature of the universe !


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## applesbliss

Do they have weapons of mass destruction in 2D? If so, we should invade 'them' before they invade 'us'.


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## LAO TZU

No, no, no, Rush made an album about this, its 2112!


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## hazejunk

The relevant connection between the Sun, the Sacred Tree, and the Mayan Calendar is shockingly simple. Researchers have discovered that the end of the Mayan Long Count coincides with a rare alignment between the Earth, the Sun, and the Galaxy.Specifically, the alignment we are talking about occurs when the winter solstice Sun of the year 2012 AD conjuncts the Sacred Tree (formed by the intersection of the ecliptic 
and the Milky Way). To be more precise, the solstice Sun aligns with the ecliptic and thegalactic equator, which is the imaginary line that marks the center of the Milky Way band.Presently, the Milky Way crosses the ecliptic through the constellation of Sagittarius, which also happens to be the direction of Galactic Center.

got this from http://mirrorh.com/timelinep.html

how did the mayans now so much about the rest of the Galaxy?
i mean you gota know something about the galaxy if you know about the galactic equator right?


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## sourlemone

yeah...but you know what happened to the mayans?

they got sacked by some spaniards

i'm fairly sure that just discredits just about everything they ever accomplished right there. ooooh riiiight


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## yougene

sourlemone said:
			
		

> *yeah...but you know what happened to the mayans?
> 
> they got sacked by some spaniards
> 
> i'm fairly sure that just discredits just about everything they ever accomplished right there. ooooh riiiight *



no they didn't

Mayans had disappeared before the Spaniards ever showed up.  I believe it was the Aztec and/or Inca's that got murdered by the Spaniards.

Even if they did get killed off by the Spaniards how would that discredit anything?


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## LAO TZU

Those who *knew*, left before the Spanish arrived


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## WhyzFool

welcome to the fourth dimension...check it out.....http://tetraspace.alkaline.org/ 

if we believe we are less than perfect, and we need something to fix us, we have created our own imperfection.


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## zorn

hazejunk said:
			
		

> *The relevant connection between the Sun, the Sacred Tree, and the Mayan Calendar is shockingly simple. Researchers have discovered that the end of the Mayan Long Count coincides with a rare alignment between the Earth, the Sun, and the Galaxy.Specifically, the alignment we are talking about occurs when the winter solstice Sun of the year 2012 AD conjuncts the Sacred Tree (formed by the intersection of the ecliptic
> and the Milky Way). To be more precise, the solstice Sun aligns with the ecliptic and thegalactic equator, which is the imaginary line that marks the center of the Milky Way band.Presently, the Milky Way crosses the ecliptic through the constellation of Sagittarius, which also happens to be the direction of Galactic Center.
> 
> got this from http://mirrorh.com/timelinep.html
> 
> how did the mayans now so much about the rest of the Galaxy?*


 1) They probably didn't -- some guy probably just made up that stuff about a "rare alignment."  Assuming it's true (and I wouldn't bet on it), alignments of various shit in the sky are not hard to come by -- you can find a bunch of stuff more-or-less aligned pretty much any time whatsoever.  Boosting my skepticism here is the fact that your site refers to the sun aligning with the ecliptic.  The sun is ALWAYS aligned with the ecliptic, that's the fucking definition of the ecliptic!



> *i mean you gota know something about the galaxy if you know about the galactic equator right? *


 Naaah.  Have you ever been outside and looked at the stars on a really dark night?  Noticed the huge fucking glowing band stretching across the sky?  (If you've lived in cities all your life, you may never have seen it, but it's very obvious out in the country away from lights.)  That's our galaxy, the Milky Way.  If you draw a line down the middle of it that's the galactic equator.  

Any human being who looked up on a dark night would know about the galaxy & might well feel it was important in some way.  In fact our word for it comes all the way from the ancient Greeks, who called it _galaxias kuklos_, "milky circle."  Of course no one knew what really it was until Galileo turned his telescope on it in 1610 and saw that it was made up of billions upon billions of stars.



			
				yougene said:
			
		

> *Mayans had disappeared before the Spaniards ever showed up.  I believe it was the Aztec and/or Inca's that got murdered by the Spaniards.
> 
> Even if they did get killed off by the Spaniards how would that discredit anything? *


 Well there are plenty of Mayans around today to be pedantic.... classical Mayan *civilization* collapsed before the Europeans arrived.  Probably as a result of internecine warfare, destruction of their environment (mainly deforestation and depletion of water supplies), and drought.

Anyways there's no good reason for this weird veneration of the Mayans some people have.  They weren't some lovey-dovey 'enlightened' civilization; they were an unpleasant bunch (like most ancient societies), with a rigid social hierarchy and practices including ritual human sacrifice.  They were fairly good at astronomy -- but so were the ancient Greeks (among many others.)  We don't believe ancient Greek religion possessed special mystical truths unbeknownst to the modern world -- there's no more reason to believe that ancient Mayan religion did.


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## sourlemone

I was under the impression the aztecs WERE the mayans, same dif. My bad.


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## Cex

I remember all the furor surrounding the alignment of the planets some number of years ago. Every single planet in the solar system momentarily came into alignment, and there were more than a few predictions along the lines of end of the world, ascension to a higher plane etc.

I remember watching a program with Patrick Moore demonstrating what would happen at the moment of alignment. He took nine pieces of fruit and placed them in a line.

And then calmly sat back and said "that's it".


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## hazejunk

thanks for clearing that out for my zorn
there's so much bullshit on the net!
i bit ago i was reading about the Schumann resonance and zeropoint but that's bullshit as well right?


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## zorn

Well Schumann resonances of the earth-ionosphere cavity and vacuum energy in quantum mechanics are both very real phenomena. (no relation between the two btw.)  I'm guessing what you read about them might have largely BS, though.    Zero-point energy especially seems to be a favorite topic of internet cranks.  Anyways if you remember what it was you read I can tell you if it's nonsense or not.


For anyone who's not sure if something science-related they saw is bullshit or not, I recommend looking at John Baez's crackpot index and Bob Park's article on The Seven Warning Signs of Bogus Science for starters.

http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/crackpot.html
http://chronicle.com/free/v49/i21/21b02001.htm

Excerpts from the latter...


*The discoverer pitches the claim directly to the media.* The integrity of science rests on the willingness of scientists to expose new ideas and findings to the scrutiny of other scientists. Thus, scientists expect their colleagues to reveal new findings to them initially. An attempt to bypass peer review by taking a new result directly to the media, and thence to the public, suggests that the work is unlikely to stand up to close examination by other scientists.

*The discoverer says that a powerful establishment is trying to suppress his or her work.* The idea is that the establishment will presumably stop at nothing to suppress discoveries that might shift the balance of wealth and power in society. Often, the discoverer describes mainstream science as part of a larger conspiracy that includes industry and government. Claims that the oil companies are frustrating the invention of an automobile that runs on water, for instance, are a sure sign that the idea of such a car is baloney. In the case of cold fusion, Pons and Fleischmann blamed their cold reception on physicists who were protecting their own research in hot fusion.

*The scientific effect involved is always at the very limit of detection.* Alas, there is never a clear photograph of a flying saucer, or the Loch Ness monster. All scientific measurements must contend with some level of background noise or statistical fluctuation. But if the signal-to-noise ratio cannot be improved, even in principle, the effect is probably not real and the work is not science.

*Evidence for a discovery is anecdotal.* If modern science has learned anything in the past century, it is to distrust anecdotal evidence. Because anecdotes have a very strong emotional impact, they serve to keep superstitious beliefs alive in an age of science. The most important discovery of modern medicine is not vaccines or antibiotics, it is the randomized double-blind test, by means of which we know what works and what doesn't. Contrary to the saying, "data" is not the plural of "anecdote."

*The discoverer says a belief is credible because it has endured for centuries.* There is a persistent myth that hundreds or even thousands of years ago, long before anyone knew that blood circulates throughout the body, or that germs cause disease, our ancestors possessed miraculous remedies that modern science cannot understand. Much of what is termed "alternative medicine" is part of that myth.

*The discoverer has worked in isolation.* The image of a lone genius who struggles in secrecy in an attic laboratory and ends up making a revolutionary breakthrough is a staple of Hollywood's science-fiction films, but it is hard to find examples in real life. Scientific breakthroughs nowadays are almost always syntheses of the work of many scientists.

*The discoverer must propose new laws of nature to explain an observation.* A new law of nature, invoked to explain some extraordinary result, must not conflict with what is already known. If we must change existing laws of nature or propose new laws to account for an observation, it is almost certainly wrong.


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## hazejunk

hey zorn this is what i read aout the Schumann Resonance and zeropoint...



> Gregg Braden is currently traveling around the United States and in the media, telling of the scientific proof of the Earth passing through the Photon Belt and the slowing of the Earths rotation. At the same time there is an increase in the resonant frequency of the Earth (Schumann Resonance). When the Earth stops its rotation and the resonance frequency reaches 13 cycles we will be at a zero point magnetic field. The Earth will be stopped, and in 2 or 3 days it will start turning again in the opposite direction. This will produce a reversal in the magnetic fields around the earth and so forth.
> 
> Time will appear to speed up as we approach Zero Point. A 24 hour day will seem to about 16 hours or less. Remember the Schumann Resonance (or "heart beat" of Mother Earth) has been 7.8 cycles for thousands of years, but has been rising since 1980. It is at about 12 cycles at present. It stops at 13 cycles.



got that from this site: http://www.2012.com.au/SchumannResonance.html

sounds like BS but i still thought it was interesting....


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## zorn

Yeah, total nonsense, of the "string scientific words together at random" variety.  The "photon belt"?  "Zero point magnetic field"?  No such things.

The Earth's rotation is slowing down, incidentally, but rather slowly -- it takes hundreds of millions of years to change by an hour or so, I think.  What's slowing it is the tides (from the moon.)  So it will never slow to a halt, but only to the point where a day is as long as month, and so the same side of the Earth always faces the moon.  This is called "tidal locking."  It's already happened for the moon's rotation (one lunar day is the same as 1 month) but not yet for the Earth's.


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## egad

*2012 The Global Shift In Consciousness and the 5th Dimension*

Teehee!

It's refreshing to see this topic being discuessed here on bluelight, but also dissappointing to see that so few of you realise what is going on right now 

However, it is all good, for those of us who are here to facilitate this Global Shift in Consciousness, know so, and do so. :D

A very basic way of looking at it is we are awakening to our true selves, our higher selves, our infinite potential as the Creator of All That Is.  

But in order for this to happen we need to do lots of stuff to raise the vibration of the entire planet so that we can manifest as our true multidimensional selves. Because right now the vibratory rate of Earth is far too dense for higher dimensional beings to inhabit.

So thusly, millions of lightworkers (people who consciously fullfil the Creator's will) incarnated over the past few decades (often referred to as Indigo Children and now we are seeing the first wave of Crystal Children as we get closer to point zero) to faciltate this shift. Now these lightworkers are in all walks of life, your local shopkeeper, your local doctor, your local yoga instructor, or even a movie star, we're everywhere. And yes, by simply thinking loving thoughts, we do our work! :D 

There is of course more to it than simply thinking loving thoughts, it is through these incarnations that the Spirit has been laying the groundwork for massive shifts in all aspects of earthly life. This groundwork involves everyone from laywers and politicians to those crazy hippies who sit around smoking pot all day, tripping out and basically manifesting higher dimensional energies and most importanty Love energy! Some of us are more aware of what is we are doing and why than others, some of us are still unconscious but still being guided by Spirit to fullfil our life purpose, and some of are fully conscious. It is through our experiences and actions in life whatever they may be that we lay this groundwork and raise our vibrations.

Now as for 2012 and talk of the fourth dimension etc, yes 2012 is when the Earth will shift dimensions, yes it will be the end of the world (as we know it), yes it will be the end of time, yes it will be the end of illuminati and their new world order, yes it will be a new golden age for humanity, and most importantly of all, for you non-believers, YES IT WILL HAPPEN!  

Something important to note is why this is all happening, for the past 13,000 years the Earth has been a hub of negativity for our galaxy, anything negative that spirit wanted to experience it could come here and experience hence so much pain, suffering and conflict for so long. So basically we've all been part of this grand experiment in negativity orchestrated by the spirit, and facilitated by repltillians/draconians/the illuminati and the script for this cosmic drama is reaching the final act where we will see the dishevelment of these organisations who have controlled us and our world for so long. So basically the spirit has decided it has learnt and experienced what it wanted from this experiment in negativity and so it is time for some upgrades.  

Hence Gaia (Earth) has decided she's had enough of all the negative energy and wants to be balanced again, so she has initiated her own ascension through the fourth dimension and into the fifith dimension (soon to be our new home).So as we are the inhabitants of mother earth and therefore a part of her, we get to ascend to! But in order to ascend we must align our consciousness with the Spirit. This is where the photon belt that zorn scoffed at comes in. Basically the photon belt is a band or higher dimensional radiation reaching out from the galactic center which reprograms everything that passes through it, that includes us and our entire Solar system. We are passing through the photon belt right now! These new programs/upgrades are why everyone (well, many people at least) are always tripping out (figuratively speaking) on all these new concepts, ideas, people, events, and experiences that keep magically appearing in their life, this is often refferred to as Cosmic Synchronicity, everything just falls into place. We are all moving forward towards a unified state of consciousness, in order to manifest Unity Consciousness we must fully awaken to the Spirit within by pulling back the veil of the ego to reveal the beauty of the true self within. In doing so we attain this state of Unified Consciousness with the Cosmic Spirit, with Gaia, with All That Is. This state is often referred to as Full Consciousness too. This is our true state of being, at One with ourself 

As for lower dimensional beings coming up to our dimension, well no, because as someone above already state, we're pretty much bottom of the barrel right now. 

So if you have experienced anything in your life to make you believe in ascension, the global shift in consciousness and 2012 perhaps these words this day will help you on your path to your true self.

I am sure some of you would likely ask the question how do you know all this and why are you so sure  of it all? I would respond that I know and am sure of these things because this is the life i live, this is why i incarnated, this is why i am writing this message. I Am here to experience and to facilitate this global shift in consciousness, and to ascend to higher plane of existence in Divine Unity with the Cosmic Spirit! :D Bom!

Love & Light Always!

PS I am sure many of you will disagree with my words today, and even more will likely discount them entirely, but if even one person reads this today and has shivers up their spine that make their Spirit say "Fuck Yeah!" then my work is done!  As for the others, i am sure if you are a part of the shift you will come to see the light and the truth within in these very exciting coming years. Peace.


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## compact

> we're everywhere


Just once I'd like to see a new age rant which doesn't involve the author being some sort of special Promethian bringer of "secret knowledge". 

Also, just the phrase "photon belt" sounds horribly silly to anyone who, for example, knows what a photon is.


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## Cex

> _egad:_
> *But in order for this to happen we need to do lots of stuff to raise the vibration of the entire planet so that we can manifest as our true multidimensional selves. Because right now the vibratory rate of Earth is far too dense for higher dimensional beings to inhabit.*


I'll ignore the problems I have with the rest of your post for a second, and just concentrate on this bit. What do you even mean by "raise the vibration rate of the planet"? Do we actually have to make the planet physically vibrate? How do you propose we do this? Why do extra vibrations make the planet more acceptable to higher dimensional beings?

Or do you mean some kind of "spiritual" vibrations that normal people can't detect? If so, what form do they take? Why does thinking "loving thoughts" create them? How could we detect them?

I'd appreciate some answers to these questions, as I don't think I understand you at the moment.


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## PGTips

compact said:
			
		

> *Also, just the phrase "photon belt" sounds horribly silly to anyone who, for example, knows what a photon is. *


 Considering all the pseudo-science in Egad's post, I don't think it would matter if he knew what a photon was or not.

As I said in my last post in this thread, its a terribly annoyinh when some people just throw in science words to make their views seem more acceptable or well thought out. If they were well thought out, they'd not use those words where they do.

I've no problem with people having their own ideas about things which are essential stuff they made up, but don't try and pretend its got any scientific basis at all, because to anyone with a decent understanding of those areas will just says "Thats crap" 

Take this link for instance. Just above the jpeg is has in small letters 





> "For more information, see: "Handbook of Atmospheric Electrodynamics, vol. I", by Hans Volland, 1995 published by the CRC Press. Chapter 11 is entirely on Schumann Resonances and is written by Davis Campbell at the Geophysical Institute, University of Alaska, Fairbanks AK, 99775. There is also a history of this research and an extensive bibliography."



I doubt the author of that website has read that book, and I'd bet a lot of money 99.99% of the people who read that site and believe it haven't read that book. Electrodynamics is a terribly complicated topic, never mind _atmospheric_ electrodynamics. If the author were that good at physics, he'd not be saying most of what he says.


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## mr_p

LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE EARTH LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE WE ARE HERE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE AWAKEN LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LET GO OF YOUR EGO LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE FOLLOW THE LIGHT WITHIN LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE 

i'll try and answer your question Cex ... raising the vibration of the planet is to let go of the fear and the unconcioiusness that is so evident when you enter a city ... 

if you walk down the street everyone seems so "conditioned" and fearful... for example ... if one was to skip down the street with no clothes on because they had just realised how beautiful life is and how good it is to be alive (and possibally how hot it is and how much more free and comfortable it is to be naked ... the general reaction would be "wow, someones gone crazy" ... the police would come and take them away ... now that reaction is a low frequency ... the happy naked free one is oozing higher frequencies ... but a little too high for this society 

if you are feeling it or not ... its all happening NOW ! 

100 years ago VERY few people cared for the earth, in the last 100 years just look at what has happened ....

just wake up and look around ... if your ego has a few things to say ... let your higher self observe that it is your ego ..conditioned and tweeked to suit the desires of other ego's that were also tweeked to suit and so on and so on

the more lost you feel the more found you will BE 

LOVE AND LIGHT


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## mr_p

its terribly annoying ?

its horribly silly ?

if egads talking shit ?? then what are you talking


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## PGTips

mr_p said:
			
		

> *but a little too high for this society  *


 Nothing to do with high or low frequencies, I would prefer not to see someone skipping through the streets with their "tackle out". If I wish to see someone naked there are ways. 


			
				mr_p said:
			
		

> *100 years ago VERY few people cared for the earth, in the last 100 years just look at what has happened ....*


 Nothing to do with the "Love mother Earth, Gaia" stuff, we realised if we carried on the way we were going, the Earth would be uninhabitable before long. Its more self preservation than anything else.


			
				mr_p said:
			
		

> *the more lost you feel the more found you will BE *


Sounds terribly familiar to a Christian comment that. I thought all this Gaia stuff was aside from that? There's no "God" been mentioned in any of these ascension predictions.

I bet you can just feel the low frequency vibrates pumping out from me can't you 


			
				mr_p said:
			
		

> *if egads talking shit ?? then what are you talking *


I'm talking about something which has empirical evidence contradiction Egad's comments. "Photon Belt", "Time dilation due to cavity radiation", "Photon reprograming of DNA", "Zero Point Flip". All of those have scientific words in them, but they make no sense. Does "Cheese Elephant" mean anything? No, but then neither does "Zero Point Flip". 

I've a lecture on Cosmology in 25 minutes I've got to leave for now, I'll keep my eyes open for any talk about galactic photon belts


----------



## mr_p

E(GO)


----------



## PGTips

Yes, terribly egotistical of me to point out where people are trying to use words/ideas they do not understand to back up something with no basis other than heresay and conjecture.

If you're a follower of this, can you please explain what a "photon belt" is. Why the Earth stops when the Schumann Resonance hits 13Hz, and why its increasing frequency has resulting in a time dilation effect on Earth where 24 hours is 16 hours.

I've not seen any actual explainations of those effects other than "It's going to happen!", so perhaps you could enlighten me and make my vibrations vibrate a little higher


----------



## Cex

mr_p said:
			
		

> *i'll try and answer your question Cex ... raising the vibration of the planet is to let go of the fear and the unconcioiusness that is so evident when you enter a city ...
> 
> if you walk down the street everyone seems so "conditioned" and fearful... for example ... if one was to skip down the street with no clothes on because they had just realised how beautiful life is and how good it is to be alive (and possibally how hot it is and how much more free and comfortable it is to be naked ... the general reaction would be "wow, someones gone crazy" ... the police would come and take them away ... now that reaction is a low frequency ... the happy naked free one is oozing higher frequencies ... but a little too high for this society*


I'm feeling a little confused - you still haven't explained what these vibrations are, or why thinking happy thoughts (does this sound like Peter Pan to anyone else?) increases them, or why the vibrations need to be bigger for us to move to a higher dimension. You've just talked about making society more accepting - not a bad aim, I'd agree, but I don't see why it has anything to do with vibrations.

For a start, you could explain why they are called vibrations. What's actually vibrating?


----------



## zorn

Right -- if you want to say that people are becoming more loving and society is becoming more harmonious, why not just say that?  Why make up all this BS about "vibratory rates" and "photon belts" and "fifth dimensions"?  I know what those words mean, but it seems you don't.

(Perhaps I'm making an unjustified assumption here, and you can explain eg what a "photon belt" is, what is 'vibrating,' what space it is that's 5-dimensional, and so on; in which case I'd be happy to be enlightened.)


----------



## egad

Cex said:
			
		

> I'll ignore the problems I have with the rest of your post for a second, and just concentrate on this bit. What do you even mean by "raise the vibration rate of the planet"? Do we actually have to make the planet physically vibrate? How do you propose we do this? Why do extra vibrations make the planet more acceptable to higher dimensional beings?
> 
> Or do you mean some kind of "spiritual" vibrations that normal people can't detect? If so, what form do they take? Why does thinking "loving thoughts" create them? How could we detect them?
> 
> I'd appreciate some answers to these questions, as I don't think I understand you at the moment.



LOL, i must say the responses i've received are exactly what i expected. Though i am gad to see one person out there is onto it! :D

As the universe is composed of energy and everything vibrates (exists) at a different frequency, certain dimensions correspond to certain frequencies of energy (think of the different dimensions as different tv stations, each has its own frequency that you need to 'tune into'), right now the earth has a slow vibration, because it is dense and corporeal. Whereas as we move through the fourth dimension (as we are doing right now) we begin to lighten up, and we begin to shed the ego and all that fucked up conditioned programming/limited thinking that comes with having an ego and living on earth in modern society.

And yes, when i speak of vibrations i mean spiritual vibrations, but more specifically i am referring to consciousness vibrations, we raise/expand our consciousness to encompass the cosmic spirit and our true selves, we become god/spirit incarnate as human and fully conscious, thusly completing the cycle of death/rebirth. 

Why does thinking loving thoughts create them? This is the most elementary thing in the entire cosmos... we are love. By thinking loving thoughts you are sending the highest vibration of thought you can out to the world.

Cex, i hope i answered your questions satisfactorily, and don't worry if you don't understand it all, and for some of you others don't get uppity if you don't agree, it is a lot of information to take in, and to most modern day minds it is far too alien to be possible.



> Just once I'd like to see a new age rant which doesn't involve the author being some sort of special Promethian bringer of "secret knowledge" Also, just the phrase "photon belt" sounds horribly silly to anyone who, for example, knows what a photon is..



Where did i claim to be a bringer of secret knowledge? While such knowledge may be kept secret from the public at large by the powers that be on earth atm, it is hardly secret. It is hardcoded into our DNA, and is manifesting itself in every person everywhere, doesn't sound very secret to me. Oh plus there's also the millions of lightworkers all around the world who are constantly spreading the message through whatever means possible. The knowledge is out there, but more importantly it is IN YOU!  You guys need to stop looking outside and start looking inside, as cliche as it sounds, it has never rang more true than now!

As for your claim that anyone who knows what a photon is would think the prospect of the photon belt is "horribly silly", i would turn that around and claim that anyone who knows what a photon is and scoffs at the prospect of the photon belt is "horribly silly". You claim to know what a photon is yet you can't make the basic connection in your lower mind as to why photon energy is related to the shift and the unification of consciousness. I let you figure it out since you guys are so scientifically minded and all that, but the answer to why has already been answered... 



> Considering all the pseudo-science in Egad's post, I don't think it would matter if he knew what a photon was or not.



What pseudo-science are you referring to AlphaNumeric? The only science i have referred to in my previous message was the science of consciousness, something us Earthlings haven't even begun to study, yet you dismiss it automatically because you do not understand it? 



> As I said in my last post in this thread, its a terribly annoyinh when some people just throw in science words to make their views seem more acceptable or well thought out. If they were well thought out, they'd not use those words where they do.



Errr, you realise there is a very good reason why people with 'out there' ideas and concepts tend to include scientific jargon in the reports to average joes. Because if they don't then the information they present will be totally alien and go completely over the audiences head, whereas if they use words/terms/kep expressions that the average person can relate to and understand, then they will actually make some sort of connection with the person. It is a very basic psychological concept, use a pre-existing symbol in a persons mind to tie a new concept into, rather than dump completely new concepts on them with no grounding in their own reality. Fairly simple... 



> I've no problem with people having their own ideas about things which are essential stuff they made up, but don't try and pretend its got any scientific basis at all, because to anyone with a decent understanding of those areas will just says "Thats crap"



You think i simply made all this up in my head? What about the millions of others who speak these same truths all around the world, did they just happen to make up the same ideas right down to the same exact words and same exact dates etc? Or perhaps there is a greater power out there, some magical force that moves behind the scenes to orchastrate this grand stage play, and it is this force that we are tuning into. Hmmm.



> Nothing to do with high or low frequencies, I would prefer not to see someone skipping through the streets with their "tackle out".



The carefress spirit running through the streets naked has a higher vibration because he is full of love (light) as opposed to you who is full of fear (dark). You seem to miss some of the most basic things...



> Nothing to do with the "Love mother Earth, Gaia" stuff, we realised if we carried on the way we were going, the Earth would be uninhabitable before long. Its more self preservation than anything else.



Yup, nothing to do with spirit, that's why we see our governments rushing to help the environment, oh wait, we don't. Who are the one's helping the environment, oh that's right, it's those crazy hippies and carefree spirits, those same types of people who spout on and on about 2012 and the great shift in consciousness. It would seem to me it's pretty plainly obvious that these people have reconnected with the earth and have consciously taken up their role as earth stewards. :D



> Sounds terribly familiar to a Christian comment that. I thought all this Gaia stuff was aside from that? There's no "God" been mentioned in any of these ascension predictions.



It's all the One god, the One Spirit, the Cosmic Spirit, Gaia as our world, is a local representation of that, just as you and I are. God in the christian sense has nothing to do with ascension, Christianity is the epitomy of our seperation from God, ascension is our re-unification with the Cosmic Spirit.



> I'm talking about something which has empirical evidence contradiction Egad's comments. "Photon Belt", "Time dilation due to cavity radiation", "Photon reprograming of DNA", "Zero Point Flip". All of those have scientific words in them, but they make no sense. Does "Cheese Elephant" mean anything? No, but then neither does "Zero Point Flip".



Where is this emperical evidence to dismiss the Creator? All these terms you mention are self explanatory, read them one word at a time, sound the words out if you need. 



> Yes, terribly egotistical of me to point out where people are trying to use words/ideas they do not understand to back up something with no basis other than heresay and conjecture.



It would seem plainly obvious that i do infact understand the words/ideas that i use. And i don't think the Divine Plan can be referred to as "heresay and conjecture", i believe it is most often referred to as "Divine Perfection". 

And yes it is terribly egotistical of you to claim you know better than the Creator of All That Is. 



> If you're a follower of this, can you please explain what a "photon belt" is. Why the Earth stops when the Schumann Resonance hits 13Hz, and why its increasing frequency has resulting in a time dilation effect on Earth where 24 hours is 16 hours.



I already explained what the photon belt is in my previous message... 



> Basically the photon belt is a band of higher dimensional radiation reaching out from the galactic center which reprograms everything that passes through it, that includes us and our entire Solar system.



As for why the Earth stops when the Schumann Resonance hits 13Hz, as already mentioned we are speeding up as we approach point zero, and it is at point zero that the Earth stops spinning, and then reverses its rotation. Why does the increasing frequency result in shorter days? Simple, we are spinning/vibrating faster/higher frequency.



> What's actually vibrating?



Energy is vibrating. Our energy, the earth's energy, all energy. It isn't a matter of thinking happy thoughts, it is a matter of thinking loving and light thoughts, thoughts which transcend duality, thoughts that do not judge bad from good, but merely accept things as is, and love them as such. Thinking such thoughts will raise your vibration, similar to doing yoga or meditation.

The vibrations need not be bigger, they do need to be of a higher vibration though, to create an environment that higher dimensional energy can inhabit. It has to do with recreating yourself in a new form. You must move your consciousness to a higher level of awareness so that you may then channel these higher dimensional energies and thusly manifest your light body.



> Right -- if you want to say that people are becoming more loving and society is becoming more harmonious, why not just say that? Why make up all this BS about "vibratory rates" and "photon belts" and "fifth dimensions"? I know what those words mean, but it seems you don't. (Perhaps I'm making an unjustified assumption here, and you can explain eg what a "photon belt" is, what is 'vibrating,' what space it is that's 5-dimensional, and so on; in which case I'd be happy to be enlightened.)



Yes, you are making an unjustified assumption here.

If i wanted to say "that people are becoming more loving and society is becoming more harmonious" i would have said that, but that is not what this thread was about, this thread was about 2012 and the fourth dimension and thusly its relation to us.

I didn't make up any BS. I lived through an eternity of creation, through all forms of life and reached enlightenment. Rather than just sit around and watch all you guys fosic about trying to find enlightenment yourselves during this momentous time in history, I along with many others descended to Earth to facilitate other's awakenings. This message you are reading right now is a part of your awakening. :D 

As for you knowing what these words mean, it would seem plainly obvious you don't from your first reply where you claimed the term "photon belt" sounds horribly silly to anyone who knows what a photon is. I already addressed these specific terms above.

You claim to know the meaning of these terms yet ask me to explain them for you? While i've already explained the terms photon belt and vibrating a couple of times now, i would have thought the term "the fifth dimension" would be pretty self explanatory. "What space is it that's fifth-dimensional?" Why, that would be the fifth dimension, funnily enough. 

Btw just of note i can answer any questions u guys have, but it isn't likely i'm going to change the hardwiring in your brain, you have to do that yourself, so don't expect me to 'change your mind' so to speak or to bless you with instant enlightenment, as a number of you seem adamant that the way your ego views the world is the way it is, and that's partly what this is all about, letting go of the ego/limited thinking and returning to our unlimited state of infinite potential.

Love & Light Always,

Peace.


----------



## Cex

I'll be honest with you - all this talk of "energy is vibrations", "emotions are vibrations" etc. sounds exactly like someone, somewhere down the line, has read a book on string theory and completely failed to understand it.

I'd ask you for proof of everything that you claim here - or at least some non-anecdotal evidence. Perhaps something verifiable to the vast majority of us?

If you can't provide that, then what you're telling us is not science, but pure speculation.

You say it's "plainly obvious" that you know what you're talking about, but to anyone who knows more than elementary science it's plainly obvious that you don't. The only thing I can think of is that you're using science-related words to mean different things to what convention dictates.

Is this the case? If so, why, and what do you mean when you say things like "vibrational frequency" or "photon" or "zero point magnetic field".

Note: The fifth dimension, should one exist, is not five-dimensional. It is by definition one-dimensional. As a whole, five-dimensional space is five-dimensional but the fifth dimension is not. Since you claim that this fifth dimension exists and is somehow accessible to us, I ask you: Where is it?

Just a few more things that didn't make sense in your response. I'd be pleased if you could answer them.


----------



## PGTips

egad said:
			
		

> *As for your claim that anyone who knows what a photon is would think the prospect of the photon belt is "horribly silly", i would turn that around and claim that anyone who knows what a photon is and scoffs at the prospect of the photon belt is "horribly silly". You claim to know what a photon is yet you can't make the basic connection in your lower mind as to why photon energy is related to the shift and the unification of consciousness. I let you figure it out since you guys are so scientifically minded and all that, but the answer to why has already been answered... *


So you're saying that your "photons" do something completely different to what all photons have ever been seen to do? 


			
				egad said:
			
		

> *You think i simply made all this up in my head? What about the millions of others who speak these same truths all around the world, did they just happen to make up the same ideas right down to the same exact words and same exact dates etc? Or perhaps there is a greater power out there, some magical force that moves behind the scenes to orchastrate this grand stage play, and it is this force that we are tuning into. Hmmm. *


Word gets around easily. I'd never heard of any of this stuff till this thread, but now I have. I imagine numerous ideas _similar_ to this have been around for a long time, and with easier global communication peopel are finding "Oh I heard something like that, it must be true". Loads of people used to think the Sun was about 1 metre across and only a few miles up in the sky. Doesn't make it true.


			
				egad said:
			
		

> *The carefress spirit running through the streets naked has a higher vibration because he is full of love (light) as opposed to you who is full of fear (dark). You seem to miss some of the most basic things...*


The human form can be a beautiful thing, that I do not argue with. However, I still see nothing wrong with not wanting to see naked people all the time.


			
				egad said:
			
		

> *As for why the Earth stops when the Schumann Resonance hits 13Hz, as already mentioned we are speeding up as we approach point zero, and it is at point zero that the Earth stops spinning, and then reverses its rotation. Why does the increasing frequency result in shorter days? Simple, we are spinning/vibrating faster/higher frequency.*


 That doesn't explain anything. I could just as easily say "Tomorrow, the sun will rise, and it will be bright purple. It will be bright purple because of the Earths spin". That is essential what you are saying. You're explaining one non-sensical thing with another non-sensical thing. Exactly why is the Earth's spin slowing down so much? Why is the 12Hz or 13Hz related to this? Why is an electromagnetic field slowing down the Earths spin?


			
				egad said:
			
		

> *Where is this emperical evidence to dismiss the Creator? All these terms you mention are self explanatory, read them one word at a time, sound the words out if you need.  *


 Where did I dismiss the existance of God in my post? As for the words, I'm am very familiar with them. My point was, you use them erroniously, and I want you to explain why you used them there. For instance "Time dilation due to cavity radiation". Explain _properly_ why the frequency of a standing wave causes time dilation? I don't accept "Because it does", or "Its Gaia's will" as answers.


			
				egad said:
			
		

> *You claim to know the meaning of these terms yet ask me to explain them for you? While i've already explained the terms photon belt and vibrating a couple of times now, i would have thought the term "the fifth dimension" would be pretty self explanatory. "What space is it that's fifth-dimensional?" Why, that would be the fifth dimension, funnily enough. *


We ask for explainations because you use words in incorrect places. You say you use those words to save having to redescribe a concept to someone, but you use those words inccorectly, you are describing the wrong things. Your explainations are circular. "What is a photon belt", "It is a belt......made of photons". Yes, but what _is_ that, you have not actucally given an explaination. If you asked us "What is the Sun", we'd be able to tell you in detail its make up, how it works and a lot about it, you'd just reply "Its the Sun". 

Cex's post is a good one. You do not explain yourself properly, and the terms you use could be noticed to be incorrect by high school physics students. All you are saying is just "stories", because without evidence (which you _completely_ lack), thats all they are.


----------



## Red Earth

It seems to me, that anything that has not been labeled concrete truth by modern science, is "hippy bullshit" to you alpha.
I don't know if you know, but it takes a new generation of scientists ( roughly 100 years ), for any old views to change. So it will take around 100 years, until every day folk on the street will find out about any major changes in the old views which were discovered today. This has to do with Scientists themselves. If they discover something new, and it contradicts the old view, they will not change it. They will keep working with their old views and discard anything that's new and contradicts them. Only when new generation of scientists arrives, their minds are not imprinted with all the old stuff. Hence they can make new observations and record them. 

But anyway, there is a scientific proof for the shift of 2012. of course, they do not call it the shift in consciousness. It is known as "Information Revolution", or "Information explosion". 

You can look at it like this. The latest attempt to estimate the rate of information acceleration ( that I know of ) -- the manifestation of coherence -- was made by French economist Georges Anderla for the organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) in 1973. Anderla arbitrarily assumed that all the bits of information possessed by humanity at the beginning of the Christian Era (1 A.D.) could be considered his unit of measurement. He made that information pool one unit in our fund of knowledge.It took until 1500A.D., Anderla discovered, for the accumulation of bits of information to add up to two units in our "fund". 
It required only 250 years more (1750) for our bank of knowledge to double again, to four units. The next doubling took only 150 years and by 1900 humanity had 8 in its information capital account.
The next doubling took only 50 years and by 1950 we had 16 units.
The next doubling took only 10 years and by 1960 we had 32 units.
The next doubling took only 7 yeas and by 1967 we had 64 units. In the next 6 year period (1967-1973), our intellectual bank account again doubled, to 128 units. At this point , Anderla completed his study. Dr Alvin silverstein has estimated that, If Anderla's graph is projected 70 years from now (1980 - 2050) human knowledge should increase a millionfold. That is we should have 128,000,000 times more knowledge then we had in the year of Jesus' Birth.

now, if we were to graph that, having units of knowledge going vertically, and the number of years after 1A.D. horizontally, you would have a rather steady plotted line, going horizontally, until around 2000, where it shoot up directly, and pretty much keeps ascending from there. SO it's making a vertical shift, and no longer goes horizontally. From this graph, you can kind of tell that there is going to be some major changes very soon. 

You might ask what it has to do with the shift of 2012. Well the shift is not just some fairly tale of going into outer space. It is literally a shift in consciousness. A new level of understanding in human culture. 

Some of the things that will also happen, will be shift of Poles. Where the earth gets thrown off its axis, and finds a new place of balance. And those two poles become magnetic north and south. This has already happened many times. They have found the proof for it, in iron pilings. Iron pilings are found in most lava, and these pilings have a different melting point than the lava itself. The pilings harden while the lava is still flowing and, being iron, line up with the magnetic poles. Through this observation, geologists can see exactly where the magnetic poles were at the time the lava hardened. They needed to get samples from only 3 different locations to be able to triangulate and know exactly where the magnetic north pole was at the time the pilings hardened. Then of course, they could radiocarbon-date it, which was the best thing they could do in those days. So they discovered an earlier magnetic north pole that was not where it is now but a long way away, centered in Hawaii. And they estimated the last shift took place around 13,000 years ago.

Now, if you research the mayan calender ( and trust me, it is one of the most advanced sets of mathematics, cos these guys spent thousands of years studying the stars and their relationship to everything. Their culture was an integration of politics, religion and mathematics) you will see, that it takes 25,920 years for a total revolution. From "waking up" to "waking up" again. So as you see, half a cycle is 1260 years. It kind of goes like this. The planet wakes up, and 1260 years later it falls asleep. Another 1260 years on, it wakes up again. And so on, and so on. So, if we consider the fact that the last shift occured 13,000 ago, we're about to hit another shift. I could go very, very deep into this, but I don't think anyone could be bothered reading a a post size of a book. 

This is not just based on a bit of science and the mayan calender. Hindu tradition also speaks of the pole shift. It says that we're coming out of the "kali" yuga. Kali - - illusion, yuga - age. - Age of Illusion. 

All this has to do with the geomagnetism of the planet also. What is known is that for the last 500 years the earth's magnetic field has been continually weakening, and in the last few years it has been doing absolutely bizarre things. 
        The magnetic lines look like straight weaving patterns. They're fixed, but not precise in that idealized kind of way. and there are certain areas where they are stronger, and weaker. These lines normally do not move, but because the field is getting so weak, they are beginning to move and change. The birds, animals, and fish, and the dolphins and whales, and the other creatures use these lines for their migration patterns. So if the magnetic line changes, their migration patterns go ff, which is what we're seeing all over the world right now. Birds are flying to places they're not supposed to be, and whales are beaching themselves on land, where it's supposed to be water as far as their concerned. They're simply following the magnetic line they've followed for centuries, and they're running into land that wasn't on that line before. 

There is also research going on, into effect of magnetism on human mind and emotions. And they're finding that to some degree ( how ever large it is ), our memory is being held in tact by these magnetic grids. So you can imagine what kind of impact the pole shift would have on our consciousness. It is enough to observe the crime rates during the full moon. the day before, on the day, and day after, crime rates are higher than any other time. It doesn't bring out negative emotions. It simply amplify's what's already there. I have a friends who is a doctor, and he says that on the night of full moon, his patients are going more "mental" than ever. There is no sleep, and it's just chaos. 

So, the shift of 2012 is not just some made up shit. There is a lot of scientific proof behind it. 

A for the 4th dimension thing ... In our society, it is accepted that time is linear. Most of the old societies, believed that time was spherical. 
So basically, it was understood, that it's not that Space is standing still, and time is going by. It was the other way around. The time right here and now ( always was), and that space is continuously expanding. 

One of the major spokesmen on mayan calendar, Jose Arguelles, said that 2012 is about moving from space travel into time travel. (please leave any science fiction views about time travel at the door. It's not about traveling into the past or future). It is simply about recognizing that true time is here and now. And that space is what is in constant motion. 

By the way, some science has recognized ( and I say some, because this hasn't made your local newspaper), that on a cosmic scale, everything in the universe seems to be happening at once. 

What connects all of this into one, and orders it, is the universe itself. And we're not talking about some supreme being. we're simply talking about the whole eco system of the universe. It's magnetic relationships, It's planets and their cycles. So the shift, is indeed triggered by something that is happening on a cosmic scale. It's not some out of the blue thing. It's simply planetary motion. 

Someone once said:

'We place no reliance
On Virgin or Pigeon;
Our method is science,
Our aim is religion.'


----------



## PGTips

Red Earth said:
			
		

> *now, if we were to graph that, having units of knowledge going vertically, and the number of years after 1A.D. horizontally, you would have a rather steady plotted line, going horizontally, until around 2000, where it shoot up directly, and pretty much keeps ascending from there. SO it's making a vertical shift, and no longer goes horizontally. From this graph, you can kind of tell that there is going to be some major changes very soon. *


 What you describe is an exponential increase. Unfortunately you are obviously not familiar with an exponential function because at no point _ever_ does it go vertical. I can tell you that immediately, I don't have to plot the graph 


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *Some of the things that will also happen, will be shift of Poles. Where the earth gets thrown off its axis, and finds a new place of balance. And those two poles become magnetic north and south. This has already happened many times. They have found the proof for it, in iron pilings. Iron pilings are found in most lava, and these pilings have a different melting point than the lava itself. *


 I am aware of such shifts, but it seems you due not understand them. The magnetic field of the Earth weakens, disappears, then reappears in reverse. The Earth is not "thrown off its axis". If you didn't know about the Earth's magnetic field, you wouldn't even know it was happening (except perhaps Aura phenomena would happen at more equatorial latitudes).


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *Then of course, they could radiocarbon-date it, which was the best thing they could do in those days.*


Again, you speak of things you do not fully understand because carbon dating is related to living things, due to their processing of carbon dioxide. Lava cannot be carbon dated, because it does not process air, it comes up from underground.


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *There is also research going on, into effect of magnetism on human mind and emotions. And they're finding that to some degree ( how ever large it is ), our memory is being held in tact by these magnetic grids. So you can imagine what kind of impact the pole shift would have on our consciousness. It is enough to observe the crime rates during the full moon. the day before, on the day, and day after, crime rates are higher than any other time. *


Never any problem with the astronauts who went to the Moon and they went into areas of space with an incredibly week magnetic field, far less than anywhere on the Earth has.


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *A for the 4th dimension thing ... In our society, it is accepted that time is linear. Most of the old societies, believed that time was spherical. *


 Would you care to explain how a 1D "entity" can be spherical? Besides, obviously you have never studies General Relativity, it involves time distortion and its riddled with non-linearity.


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *By the way, some science has recognized ( and I say some, because this hasn't made your local newspaper)*


My science knowledge comes from sources _slightly_ further up than my local newspaper......


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *This has to do with Scientists themselves. If they discover something new, and it contradicts the old view, they will not change it. They will keep working with their old views and discard anything that's new and contradicts them. Only when new generation of scientists arrives, their minds are not imprinted with all the old stuff. Hence they can make new observations and record them. *


Some (few) scientists are or were stuck in their ways, but almost none now would keep ahold of an old method of thinking if evidence was shown to the contrary. I get the feeling you say that from pre-conceptions in your head. I can assure you that there are many new ideas and thoughts about how to model things coming out all the time and being incorporated. Just look at String Theory, it was a complete revolution in the physics community, going from point particles to 1d strings. Its been readily accepted because of its versitility.


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *It seems to me, that anything that has not been labeled concrete truth by modern science, is "hippy bullshit" to you alpha.*


I consider it "hippy bullshit" when people use science words erroneously in an attempt to make it sound like their argument has some weight, or more weight than it should do. Given the number of errors in your use of science words in your post, you are slightly guilty of this too.


----------



## Euler

This is great! I've always thought it was obvious that:

The Universe is made of cheese, and we are just bubbles of happiness floating through an ether of spirituality.

Inside the happy bubbles, there are "good vibrations" and "bad vibrations". The bad vibrations are caused by shifts in the 5-Dimensional manifold that forms the bubble, this corressonds to SV waves propograting throughout the bubble. The good vibrations are created by the Beach Boys, who are omnipresent (obviously?).

Anyway, I've got to speak to a couple of leprechauns about dreams and sellotape and suchlike....


----------



## PGTips

^ My god, when its explained like that, it all becomes so clear! What a fool I've been to trust my eyes and ears and the so called "evidence" and "logic" of science! From now on I'll dedicate my life to becoming a Beach Boy and spread "good vibrations" throughout the cosmos.

[/sarcasm]

Red Earth, on a wander through Google I came across this. It has some passages strikingly like paragraphs you posted. Talks about lava flows and "piling", and uses almost, if not exactly, the same words you do. Could you not put your thoughts into your own words?

Besides, on further reading of that page, they blame the UN for creating AIDS to stop population growth, non-human children, believe in Thoth, Nibiru and "The World Secret Government". I wouldn't put any stock in anything that comes from such websites.


----------



## knight_marshall

should I say it?  should I not?   ^  ^
not that I'm saying the above staements are true, but have you ever heard of a secret organisation called the Freemasons?  Secret, and powerfull enough to build Solomon's Temple, I think they 'could' have control of at least a large enough amount of resources to do what ever they want.  But screw all that.

I'm more with Molybdenum on this.  The only accention taking place will be in our minds as we come to some kind of global realisation.  I'm guessing the kind of realisation that another world war would create.

As for the Mayan calander, wasn't it simply a extremely accurate measurement of time?  Why does it have to be anything more than a coincidence?  And wasn't the calander actually supposed to end in like 1975 or something, and not start again until 2012, leaving us in a stage they called 'the apocalypse?    hmm now I can't seem to find it, but either way, I'd say ever since the 80's we've certainly been going down hill, and I was sure that there was scientific evidence of the whole slowing of time resonance thing.  Read about it awhile ago, so its a little hazy.

as for 'they got smacked by some spaniards..." thats gotta be the dumbest thing I've ever heard.  Look at Japan... from being smacked by americans to becoming one of the most technologically advanced cultures on earth... hmmm...

I think the most remarkable thing to consider is that the Mayan Calender, created thousands of years ago, ended up being so damn accurate.  It doesn't mean anything will happen... but we can always hope.
As for the ascention, there's always the hope that everyone will stop lving in fear right?  Maybe after 2012 this will happen once we ALL feel safe, or maybe it will actually take mass destruction, followed by universal love of peace.

Either way, the sad thing is that we could evolve today... why do we have to wait?


----------



## Red Earth

I was posting evidence, not my personal opinion. Hence I used an extract. 
Ok ... So UN didn't create the virus... how come they aired it on national TV ? and showed the documentation for it ? The stuff you've read isn't just made up. It is all backed up. I think you're just scared to admit in existance of things that you havn't seen with your own eyes.
And all this info isn't from the website. The web site extracted the information from a book. A very well written book.


----------



## Euler

Red Earth said:
			
		

> *The web site extracted the information from a book. A very well written book. *


I got my information from a book - does that make it more credible?


----------



## PGTips

Red Earth said:
			
		

> *Ok ... So UN didn't create the virus... how come they aired it on national TV ? and showed the documentation for it ?
> ....
> And all this info isn't from the website. The web site extracted the information from a book. A very well written book. *


"The Lord of the Rings" is a very well written book, they even made a film about it. Does it make it true? The Bible is a very well written book, they even have documentaries and films and debates about it. Does it make it true?





			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *I was posting evidence, not my personal opinion. Hence I used an extract. *


Then you accredit the website you are citing. As for evidence, that is not evidence, because the website makes claims with no evidence to back it up.

I claim "The moon is made of cheese". Is this true? I'm sure I can find a website which says the moon is made of cheese. Does this validate my arguement? No, because the website will just be stating it with no evidence as well. A house of cards built on no foundation.


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *It is all backed up.*


 Please point me to a _reputable_ study of the RNA coding of the AIDS virus or the DNA sequencing of these so called "non-human children" which backs up that webpage. I don't mean antoehr site which says "Its true!" I mean  an actual scientific study. Of  course, I would have followed the links on that webpage to such studies but oh wait, they failed to back up anything they said!


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *I think you're just scared to admit in existance of things that you havn't seen with your own eyes.*


I have never seen a Neutron Star, a single electron or an elephant with my own eyes, but I have seen sufficent evidence from other people to be beyond reasonable doubt that they exist. All this on the other hand, I've yet to see a single peice of evidence other than people saying "Its all true!" 

I'm also still waiting for you to explain why carbon dating would be useful on lava formations, why the Earth's magnetic field is going to throw the Earth off its axis, why astronauts didn't suffer from ill effects in low magnetic fields and how a 1D entity can be spherical. You conveniently forgot to explain all those points I raised after your last post. I didn't learn this stuff from "my local newspaper", so trying to bluff your way through explainations won't work I'm afraid. 

I'm still waiting for Egad to explain all the words and phrases he used in his last post, but it looks like he can't


----------



## sourlemone

Euler said:
			
		

> *This is great! I've always thought it was obvious that:
> 
> The Universe is made of cheese, and we are just bubbles of happiness floating through an ether of spirituality.
> 
> Inside the happy bubbles, there are "good vibrations" and "bad vibrations". The bad vibrations are caused by shifts in the 5-Dimensional manifold that forms the bubble, this corressonds to SV waves propograting throughout the bubble. The good vibrations are created by the Beach Boys, who are omnipresent (obviously?).
> 
> Anyway, I've got to speak to a couple of leprechauns about dreams and sellotape and suchlike.... *



ahaha well, this thread has made me laugh. Red Earth, egad, you guys are great. Brought a tear to my eye. Have fun in the next dimension, dudes, keep on rockin' in the free world


----------



## Red Earth

We already do. 
Alpha... everytime I post, or in fact, anyone else, first thing you ask for is scientific evidence. Do you not have your own brain ? Can you not make a judgment for yourself based on your own expereince? And yes, all this stuff is backed up, the guy gives sources for everything in his books. I think the reason yo guys can't grasp any of this, is because you havn't experienced it first hand. 
       I'm just gonna leave it at that.


----------



## PGTips

Red Earth said:
			
		

> *Alpha... everytime I post, or in fact, anyone else, first thing you ask for is scientific evidence. Do you not have your own brain ?*


I ask for evidence because my brain does not consider something to be true if there is no evidence, or logical reasoning for something. I do not mindlessly accept the word of others, I ask for proof. Is this not using my brain? To think for myself, to question other peoples claims? I would say I am using my brain more than yourself who is accepting the words of others without anything to back it up. Would that not be considered failing to think for yourself? That you have not "scratched the surface" of their claims? To wonder what exactly has made them say such things?


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> * Can you not make a judgment for yourself based on your own expereince?  *


I constantly question how things work and why things occur. Thats why I began learning science, to understand these things. As for my experiences, I ask for evidence so I _can_ experience things to make me understand. Thats what evidence is, something which is repeatable/showable to anyone who asks, so that they can see/experience it for themselves. You offer no evidence, so I cannot experience such things, so I do not beleive them to be true.


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *And yes, all this stuff is backed up, the guy gives sources for everything in his books.*


If these things were true, they'd be too important to be only be proved in a book which you have to buy. If the evidence was freely available, I'd be more inclinced to listen to it, but having to buy a book just smacks of "I'm in it to get money from suckers".


			
				Red Earth said:
			
		

> *I think the reason yo guys can't grasp any of this, is because you havn't experienced it first hand. *


 How can we experience or understand things if when we ask for evidence you fail to provide it?


----------



## zybotelectron

the idea of a grandiose ascension and everything i'm not so sure of either, it may be and all but such a radical shift seems kinda crazy.

i have read some things on the mayan calendar and what the shift in 2012 is supposed to mean.

granted there's not a plethora of scientific evidence and you can say all yo want about the mayan's ignorance.  But as far as the mayan's, their civilization did more or less dissappear, and yes there's still some left but compared to their numbers, it's pretty dismal from my understanding.  The mayan's had more than an accurate calendar, they had advanced mathmatics as well as philosophy as well as other indications of an advanced civilization.  It is a common mistake of modern man to mistake them as 'savages' and such because of certain religious practices that are considered brutal.  Which doesn't mean they weren't brutal practices but that doesn't discredit their knowledge.  And the fact remains that the good ol' spaniards burned their libraries, all texts, melted their ornate gold(which is considered to be some of the best gold work ever, superior to today) and whatever else they did to ravage their culture.  The Spaniards didn't kill them all, and a large portion dissappeared....hmm.......there's plenty of different theories, none i have direct experience or proof of, so i'll leave it at that.

so, on to what the 'shift' could be all about...

from my understanding in the book that i read and various conversations with people that have been pretty into the whole mayan calendar thing, it's a shift in the energy in the sun.  The Earth is an organism as a whole, and it is completely dependent on the energy from the sun to sustain life.  Therefore, from my understanding, what they're saying is that the sun feeds us and we react to the energy given.  There may be times where it is more condusive to different things, ideas, etc.  So the Mayans understood these shifts and calculated how often they occur, and when the bigger changes occur.  Now, so as I've come to see, that our consciousness is alterable by the energy from the sun and our perception as well.  With that, the shift that suppossed to be happening in 2012 is something that hasn't happened in something like 5000 years.  So, that greater shift is a different flow of energy from the sun which is understood to enable us to expand our consciousness, and that's where people bring in other dimensions, since in theory our perception could filter over to other dimensions.  

My own thoughts is that, ok, this is possible since we are definately tied to the suns energy, and even minor shifts could in theory affect our psyche.  The shift that happens in almost 8 years I'm imagining as a kinda "jump" that is hitting us.  The more open to the jump, the more you'll soak up this new perspective, the more closed off, the more you'll stay in your bubble...holding on.  

Now i think people go too far with this stuff at times, but i don't discredit it all together.  Besides the huge knowledge base and advanced mathmatics and such the Mayans had.....it seemes to repeatedly coming up in other areas too....like random predictions, mathmatical models, and elaborate chinese food from madagascar. 

there was a shift that had happened in 1997 that correlates with the calendar as well, it wasn't as big obviously but it happened.  As well as the harmonic concordanance that happened nearly 1.5 years ago in november, where a bunch of things lined up.

jose arguelles is the one who has put out alot of material on this subject, he has several books.  He states that he has been able to decifer their writings and has visions and such.  Reading his book was hard for me since it went from mathmatic to metaphysical a little too easily, however, again there is similer things from other sources, so i don't discredit it.

frankly what i get most from the whole thing is the true connection we have with the sun and we are part of a greater organism that may shift.   For instance, if you give a plant artificial light and it grows from it from day one, and then one day you put it in the sun....it may whither and die if it isn't strong enough, but that pure shift in it's energy may let that plant grow in ways it never imagined.  Cuz plants imagine alot. =0-
so anyways, we need sunlight, it affects us....not only that, it affects everything we eat, it affects the air we breathe and so on.  So a shift may have a profound impact, or it may not...  it's definetly something to think about......well at least for me....

and don't fuck with the sun, it was here before you and all it does is just give give give.....so take a minute and feel it on your face...it's good for your soul...

oh, and keep on jivin'


----------



## IXinX

An entertaining thread. Although i may not agree with the empirical attitude adopted with alphanumeric and such, he is totally allowed to question all these so-called predictions of ascension and apocalypse. 

I have not read much of the information in regards to this 2012 theory, just the discourse in this thread and that in itself was enough for me to ascertain that Red Earth, mr_p have no ground to fight either for or against on.

What they are preaching is akin to religion, probably dreamed up by an individual for their own reasons, not based on anything of scientific or even metaphysical merit. It is baseless and the lack of explanation or answers to AlphaNumerics questions (only countered with more questions, or 'claims' to relevance) proves for me how threadbare this whole theory is. 

If you can't withstand, or appease the questioning of one man with an empirical attitude how can you seek the credence of what you preach?

I thoroughly enjoyed to what amounted to an expose of this theory, thanks alphanumeric!

Don't fuck with the sun, lol, watch out for solar flares!!!!!


----------



## Red Earth

Ok ... Let's clarify a few things. We might have to bring in some other stuff which i posted in my other threads. In various threads, i have done posts about the 8 circuits of consciousness. By no means is it an ultimate truth about human structure. It is simply an attempt at trying to map human awareness. The first 4 circuits, appear on the left lobe. The other 4, on the right lobe. Here's an extract giving a brief summary of the first 4 circuits. 



I. THE BIO-SURVIVAL CIRCUIT
This invertebrate brain was the first to evolve (2 to 3 billion years ago) and is the first activated when a human infant is born. It programs perception onto an either-or grid divided into nurturing-helpful Things (which it approaches) and noxious-dangerous Things (which it flees, or attacks). The imprinting of this circuit sets up the basic attitude of trust or suspicion which will ever after trigger approach or avoidance. 



II. THE EMOTIONAL CIRCUIT
This second, more advanced bio-computer formed when vertebrates appeared and began to compete for territory (perhaps 500,000,000 B.C.). In the individual, this bigger tunnel-reality is activated when the DNA master-tape triggers the metamorphosis from crawling to walking. As every parent knows, the toddler is no longer a passive (bio-survival) infant but a mammalian politician, full of physical (and psychic) territorial demands, quick to meddle in family business and decision-making. Again the first imprint on this circuit remains constant for life (unless brainwashed) and identifies the stimuli which will automatically trigger dominant, aggressive behavior or submissive, cooperative behavior. When we say that a person is behaving emotionally, egotistically or 'like a two-year-old,' we mean that s/he is blindly following one of the tunnel-realities imprinted on this circuit. 



III. THE DEXTERITY-SYMBOLISM CIRCUIT
This third brain was formed when hominid types began to differentiate from other primate stock (circa 4-5 million B.C.) and is activated for the linear left-lobe functions of the brain, determines our normal modes of artifact-manufacture and conceptual thought, i.e., third circuit 'mind.' 
      It is no accident, then, that our logic (and our computer-design) follows either-or, binary structure of these circuits. Nor is it an accident that our geometry, until the last century, has been Euclidean. Euclid's geometry, Aristotle's logic and Newton's physics are meta-programs synthesizing and generalizing first brain forward-back, second brain up-down and third brain right-left programs. 



IV. THE SOCIAL-SEXUAL CIRCUIT
The fourth brain, dealing with the transmission of tribal or ethnic culture across generations, introduces the fourth dimension, time. 
      Since each of these tunnel-realities consists of biochemical imprints or matrices in the nervous system, each of them is specifically triggered by neuro-transmitters and other drugs. 

=====================================================


As you see, you guys keep on asking for rational proof. Scientific proof. Well science operates on the level of rationality. They are the rational mind. "Circuit 3". Something the mind can conceive. But what we're talking about, exists past the first 4 circuits. It is post verbal. It is more concerned with the right lobe, it is experiential. How can we explain post verbal experiences verbally ? We can only give you our attempts at mapping what we're on about. No matter what, it will sound like "hippy bull shit". All we can give you is right brained maps of left brained reality. of course it's going to sound like a croak of shit. To truly understand what we're talking about, you'd have to experience it for yourself. You're saying, Let me experience Neuro-genetic awareness through your words. It's like saying, let me taste this cake, by what you have to say about it. Not going to happen. Sorry.


----------



## PGTips

If you're going to quote websites, link to them. Thats the second time in this thread you've copied and pasted with no mention you are doing so. I could pick apart a few miss used terms in there, but given the origin of that, I don't think the author had much science knowledge other than a passing recognition of a few long science words.....

Okay, I see your "tasting cake" explaination. Now perhaps you'd like to answer the questions I ask in my last paragraph here, which you've ignored for the 3rd or 4th time. So far I see _*zero*_ explaination of any of those things, other than "It will happen because it will happen". As IXinX so rightly says, what you are saying is terribly close to religious, because you offer no proof other than "I say it will" and "I experienced a revelation/experience that makes me beleive.". As you are no doubt aware I don't hold religion in much sted either. 

Example of what you are saying (but with different claims) :

_I claim that in 2050 the sky will turn purple, frogs will suddenly be able to talk, and that Mount Everest will turn into a giant banana triffle. How do I know this? I experienced a dream which makes me beleive this is so._

You can say "What stupid claims, of course that isn't going to happen!", but they are no more outragious than your own claims, and have exactly the same amount of evidence, _zero_ other than personal belief.


----------



## yougene

AlphaNumeric do you have evidence that all observable phenomenon can be backed up with evidence?

The path of the scientific method is a noble one, but is it truly within the method to just assume that if something isn't backed by evidence then it isn't true?  Granted there are plenty of people out there trying to pump other people with what they know is bullshit, but the fact of the matter people have experiences that are seemingly insane yet are on the same level perspective wise with many others.  Assuming all these people aren't just trying to fool the world we have to ask why is this?

I agree that many of the claims posted here seem like nonsense even to me.  But perhaps we should approach this a little bit more open mindedly and take into consideration that what people are trying to communicate may actually be very tricky to communicate with language.

With this in mind it may be easier to take words that already exist and put a new conceptual meaning to them by reading them in context with other information.

Timothy Leary was actually a very well known "scientist" that was a professor at Harvard University.


----------



## Skyline_GTR

> You can look at it like this. The latest attempt to estimate the rate of information acceleration ( that I know of ) -- the manifestation of coherence -- was made by French economist Georges Anderla for the organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) in 1973. Anderla arbitrarily assumed that all the bits of information possessed by humanity at the beginning of the Christian Era (1 A.D.) could be considered his unit of measurement. He made that information pool one unit in our fund of knowledge.It took until 1500A.D., Anderla discovered, for the accumulation of bits of information to add up to two units in our "fund".
> It required only 250 years more (1750) for our bank of knowledge to double again, to four units. The next doubling took only 150 years and by 1900 humanity had 8 in its information capital account.
> The next doubling took only 50 years and by 1950 we had 16 units.
> The next doubling took only 10 years and by 1960 we had 32 units.
> The next doubling took only 7 yeas and by 1967 we had 64 units. In the next 6 year period (1967-1973), our intellectual bank account again doubled, to 128 units. At this point , Anderla completed his study. Dr Alvin silverstein has estimated that, If Anderla's graph is projected 70 years from now (1980 - 2050) human knowledge should increase a millionfold. That is we should have 128,000,000 times more knowledge then we had in the year of Jesus' Birth.
> 
> now, if we were to graph that, having units of knowledge going vertically, and the number of years after 1A.D. horizontally, you would have a rather steady plotted line, going horizontally, until around 2000, where it shoot up directly, and pretty much keeps ascending from there. SO it's making a vertical shift, and no longer goes horizontally. From this graph, you can kind of tell that there is going to be some major changes very soon.




Your refering to what futurologists call the Technological Singularity, however there is divided opinion on whether that point will ever come.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity

In futurism, a technological singularity is a predicted point in the development of a civilization at which technological progress accelerates beyond the ability of present-day humans to fully comprehend or predict. The Singularity can more specifically refer to the advent of smarter-than-human intelligence, and the cascading technological progress assumed to follow. Whether a singularity will actually occur is a matter of debate.

*Criticisms*

There exist two main types of criticisms of Singularity speculation: those questioning whether the Singularity is likely or even possible, and those questioning whether it is safe or desirable.

*The likelihood and possibility of the Singularity*

Some do not believe a technological singularity is likely to occur. Some detractors of the idea have referred to it as "the Rapture of the nerds".

Most Singularity speculation assumes the possibility of human-equivalent artificial intelligence. It is controversial that creating such AI is possible. Many believe practical advances in artificial intelligence research have not yet empirically demonstrated this. See the article artificial intelligence for further debate.

Some dispute that the rate of technological progress is increasing. The exponential growth of technological progress may become linear or inflected or may begin to flatten into a limited growth curve. In this model, instead of an overall acceleration of progress, technological advance jumps forward whenever their is a human "buy in" and stalls whenever there isn't a benefit large enough to profit the technologists, and therefore never gets steep enough to be considered a singularity.


----------



## PGTips

yougene said:
			
		

> *AlphaNumeric do you have evidence that all observable phenomenon can be backed up with evidence? *


Wouldn't the fact something is observable imply that it has evidence. If you can see it, you have evidence of it.


			
				yougene said:
			
		

> *But perhaps we should approach this a little bit more open mindedly and take into consideration that what people are trying to communicate may actually be very tricky to communicate with language.*


I understand there are things out there we do not understand yet, and that many philisophical ideas and new trains of thought are interesting and thought provoking, and questions about the universe are things which interest me a lot. I just have a gripe with people who claim things will happen with zero reason to back it up and then try to use crappy pseudo-science to make it valid. 

Thought provoking theoretical conversations or about things which have evidence and relate to our existance are interesting, except when someone pulls out pseudo-science bullshit which is nothing more than completely made up. I'm more than happy for someone to say "Relativity is wrong" provided they back it up, after all thats what science is about, bettering itself. I've seen enough people spout "hippy bullshit" (I'm using that phrase again because I know Red Earth loves it ) about why Relativity or some other area of science is wrong yet its obvious they don't know what they are trying to argue against. Just ticks me off.


----------



## yougene

AlphaNumeric said:
			
		

> *Wouldn't the fact something is observable imply that it has evidence. If you can see it, you have evidence of it.
> *


That is an assumption I would have to agree with, but it is still an assumption.  I'm talking more specifically about observations within the inner worlds of ourselves.  Granted it may be possible one day in the near future for outside observers to look into other peoples worlds with emerging technologies, but perhaps there is some sort of barrier?  At the moment all we can do is explore this world ourselves and compare notes with others.



> *I understand there are things out there we do not understand yet, and that many philisophical ideas and new trains of thought are interesting and thought provoking, and questions about the universe are things which interest me a lot. I just have a gripe with people who claim things will happen with zero reason to back it up and then try to use crappy pseudo-science to make it valid.*


Well it isn't a very productive approach.  Alot, maybe most of the pseudoscience/conspiracy theory I've ran across is bullshit.  However the purpose of pseudoscience/conspiracy theory isn't validation but communication. 



> *Thought provoking theoretical conversations or about things which have evidence and relate to our existance are interesting, except when someone pulls out pseudo-science bullshit which is nothing more than completely made up. I'm more than happy for someone to say "Relativity is wrong" provided they back it up, after all thats what science is about, bettering itself. I've seen enough people spout "hippy bullshit" (I'm using that phrase again because I know Red Earth loves it ) about why Relativity or some other area of science is wrong yet its obvious they don't know what they are trying to argue against. Just ticks me off. *


understandable


----------



## HammerSmashedFace

*2012*

so yea, there's alot of stories and idea's about the infamous year, and i find them fascinating...
what do u have to say??:D


----------



## orangelicker

whats infamous about 2012..


----------



## Akoto

Earth is going to explode.


----------



## kittyinthedark

How many of these threads are we going to have?

There's a good question for T&A


----------



## L2R

This discussion will peak around about december when mel gibson's new film apocalypto is released.


----------



## michael

orangelicker said:
			
		

> whats infamous about 2012..



how many stupid threads have been devoted to it on bluelight.


----------



## DarthMom

egad! l2r! that will be awful! and i am sure it will be, since it made say _egad!_ blech.


----------



## Belisarius

The second transit of Venus and the presidential elections are the only important things we know will happen.  I can't speculate on disasters, let alone those based on a calendar that is nowadays of purely academic interest.

I hope 2012 gets here quick, so doomsayers can pick another year like 2033 or 2525.

No offense intended to the OP, btw.


----------



## brayne

2012 has a *bit* more credibility than ordinary doomsday-theories...

basicly 2012 is another step in the evolution of planet earth and that which is connected with it, for more information check out secrets of the mayan calendar by Ian Xel Lungold here



i don't blindly believe it will happen though, because i don't want to be disapointed.

but i see there's a big possibility it will happen for various reasons....

i guessw e will soon find out %)


----------



## PGTips

brayne said:
			
		

> basicly 2012 is another step in the evolution of planet earth and that which is connected with it, for more information check out secrets of the mayan calendar by Ian Xel Lungold here


Rearrange these words : 

shit , bull

Search for previous threads on the Mayans for why.


----------



## Church

kittyinthedark said:
			
		

> How many of these threads are we going to have?
> 
> There's a good question for T&A



LOL!


----------



## brayne

AlphaNumeric said:
			
		

> Rearrange these words :
> 
> shit , bull
> 
> Search for previous threads on the Mayans for why.


i did a search and read some stuff, but didn't find exactly what it is what you want me to read. can you point your finger to where i have to look please  




about my previous post in this thread... i just said "something" about "2012", i never said it's the truth.. or that believe in that particular theory...

i believe theress a good chance something big will happen but i don't know what exactly, and if it doesn't it's ok


----------



## Church

Well without reading too much into it, there *is* an astrological event occuring on winter solstice of 2012 (according to the mayan timekeepers, anyway)... precession of the equinoxes. Happens every 26,000 years or so.


----------



## knight_marshall

2012 marks the end of the ratings season for aliens watching the tv show "planet earth"...  we'll be back, but not until ratings season is  :D


----------



## michael

brayne said:
			
		

> 2012 has a *bit* more credibility than ordinary doomsday-theories...



says who and why?



> basicly 2012 is another step in the evolution of planet earth



so is every other year.  why is 2012 different?


----------



## kyanite

I predict the future...

Is 2012 special because...

1)March 19 - Buddha Claimont: Ram Bahadur Bomjon who disappeared in 2006 is believed to return on this date (six years from his departure)?
2)May 19 - Saturday Night Live's contract expires?(oh noes!)
3)July 27 - Opening ceremony of the 2012 Summer Olympics in London, United Kingdom?
4)October 18 - at 4:36 p.m. Eastern Daylight Time, the Earth will be home to 7 billion, according to the US Census Bureau?(wow how'd they come up with that)
5)December 31 - Expiration of the Kyoto Protocol?
6)By 2012, the USA government should guarantee full Health Insurance for all Americans, as urged by a non-partisan advisory panel created by Congress?(cool)
7)2012 is the target date for everyone in India to have access to a toilet, putting an end to defecation in public?D)
8 )This is the year when California's ban on the production of foie gras is scheduled to take effect?
9)100th Grey Cup?(OMG)
10)The 5-year production contract (made in 2006, announced in 2005) for American Idol, ends this year?(I can't wait)
11)The Olduvai cliff will begin and permanent blackouts will occur worldwide, according to "The Peak of World Oil Production and the Road To The Olduvai Gorge" by Richard C. Duncan?(z0mg)
12)It is claimed that unnamed Tibetan monks specializing in remote viewing predict that divine extra-terrestrials will intervene at a point where the world's governments are about to deploy weapons of mass destruction. Adding to this, the Tibetan Monks say that the world is not ready to be destroyed and that our Earth is blessed and being saved continuously from all kinds of hazards of which mankind is not even aware?(...)
13)The Prophecy of the Popes, attributed to Saint Malachy, speculated that Pope Benedict XVI would reign during the beginning of the tribulation of which Jesus spoke, and sometime later a future pope described in the prophecy as "Peter the Roman", the last in this prophetic list, would appear, bringing as a result the destruction of the city of Rome and the Last Judgement(If he lasts that long)
14)Terence McKenna's Novelty Theory, based on a mathematical interpretation of human events, predicts a point of singularity in which humankind will go through a great shift in consciousness?(SICK)
15)A hidden code found within the Torah through the computation of equidistant letters sequences shows signs of a comet within this year producing one of two outcomes: Either hitting and destroying the Earth, or crumbling into pieces. The two codes are found very close to each other within the Torah, and through the use of mathematical shortcut matrices, can be pieced together accordingly. These two statements are, "Comet...5772 [2012 according to the Gregorian calendar]...Earth Annihilated" and "Comet...It Will Be Crumbled, I Will Tear It To Pieces...5772 [2012 according to the Gregorian calendar]."?(SICK x2)
16)The supposed time traveller John Titor predicts some unusual events in 2012, but nothing like the end of the world : his comments are more about something like the Red Sea passage?(fav)
17)In The X-Files, aliens are expected to invade Earth on December 22 and take over the world?

Wikipedia. More fun than you bargained for.


----------



## Tokey-tokerson

That's the year the Chapelle show is coming back.


----------



## zorn

Church said:
			
		

> Well without reading too much into it, there *is* an astrological event occuring on winter solstice of 2012 (according to the mayan timekeepers, anyway)... precession of the equinoxes. Happens every 26,000 years or so.



The equinoxes are _always_ precessing.  It's not an event that "happens" at some particular time, it's a process that's always happening.  Just like the Earth turning.  You wouldn't say that the Earth's rotation "happens" at 3 pm, and similarly you don't say that the precession of the equinoxes happens in 2006 or 2012 or any other date.

"Precession of the equinoxes" just means that the North Pole doesn't always point towards the same spot on the sky, it moves around very very slowly.  Right now it points at the current 'North Star', Polaris.  In 12,000 years the North Pole will be aimed towards the star Vega instead.  In another 14,000 years after that it will have moved back to Polaris again.

---

Why people give a shit about random dates on one of the old Mayan calendar systems is beyond me.   the whole frenzy is because in 2012 CE the classical Mayan calendar year will hit the equivalent of our year 1000.  (Depending on which scholar's calendar reconstruction you use; others have it in like 2002 or something.)  Being obsessed about the year 1000 was dumb when it was our calendar and it's even dumber when it's someone else's.  And God only knows why crazy New Age types fixate on the classical Mayans and not the Greeks or Egyptions or what have you.


----------



## Church

^ Yeah, it's like, big deal that we celebrate our birthdays, because we're ALWAYS getting older with each passing second anyway. I mean, why not just celebrate birthdays every day, even though there is a specific date and time  that certain cycles complete themselves?


----------



## punktuality

2012 is the end of the mayan calendar.
A calendar which was pre-dated around 10000 years (dont quote me on that) but only post dated till 2012. Why would one of the worlds most advanced races do such a curious thing?


----------



## shvender hoot

punktuality said:
			
		

> 2012 is the end of the mayan calendar.
> A calendar which was pre-dated around 10000 years (dont quote me on that) but only post dated till 2012. Why would one of the worlds most advanced races do such a curious thing?


Because the Mayans couldn't count for shit.

The world cannot end for no reason without a catastrophic event....and the likelyhood of such an event occuring anywhere near 2012 is extremely rare


----------



## L2R

^ You know the Mayan society lived with three different calendars simultaneously: solar, lunar and astral.

This alone is one thing our civilisation can't even dream of utilising.


----------



## brayne

shvender hoot said:
			
		

> Because the Mayans couldn't count for shit.
> 
> The world cannot end for no reason without a catastrophic event....and the likelyhood of such an event occuring anywhere near 2012 is extremely rare


try not to judge what you don't know anything about please thanks


----------



## Coolio

Here's the definitive answer to the meaning of 2012:

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&n=2&videoid=823251934


----------



## brayne

michael said:
			
		

> says who and why?
> 
> so is every other year.  why is 2012 different?


watch the video

the guy explains about the secrets of the mayan calendar...

there calendars got a certain system in it that enabled them to predict the future and to describe evolutions in the past, and the knowledge of western science confirmed that their descriptions of the past are correct...

i don't know exactly what they predicted about 2012 i should watch the whole video..; 





Terence mckenna also found "proof" about 2012 which was called timewave zero. 
for more information read this -> http://www.alternativeculture.com/spirit/timewave.htm


----------



## Belisarius

The Mayan calendar is cyclic.  It doesn't "end", any more than history ends at each sunset.


----------



## Makaveli69

I don't know about 2012 being the end of earth as we know it now.  But i have a gut feeling i might live to see some some of the most destructive man made/natural disasters that we know humans have seen...and yes i think its a possibility that the human race may become extinct/nearly extinct, in my lifetime..or not too long after.  I use to believe the mayan calander growing up and shit.. but honestly i don't believe anything unless i experience it myself.. it may be right, who knows.. we will know when 2012 hits.. i have my doubts about it though.


----------



## gloggawogga

2012 will be my 50th birthday. Yikes!!!!!


----------



## PGTips

brayne said:
			
		

> i did a search and read some stuff, but didn't find exactly what it is what you want me to read. can you point your finger to where i have to look please


Stuff like "The magnetic field for the planet will collapse in 2012" or "A skygate will open to the 5th dimension" or that zero point rubbush you just mentioned. The link talks about 'fractal time' which means nothing. You say he found proof. The guy says


> The theory of Timewave Zero was revealed to Terence by an alien intelligence following a bizarre, quasi-psychedelic experiment conducted in the Amazon jungle in Colombia in 1971.


Wow, with credability like that, why isn't the scientific community falling over itself to talk to him 8)


----------



## zorn

Church said:
			
		

> ^ Yeah, it's like, big deal that we celebrate our birthdays, because we're ALWAYS getting older with each passing second anyway. I mean, why not just celebrate birthdays every day, even though there is a specific date and time  that certain cycles complete themselves?


  True.  As you say, there's no metaphysical significance to celebrating our birthdays on any specific day -- in fact, if you were Hebrew or Muslim, you'd celebrate your birthday on a somewhat different day.  (They use primarily lunar rather than primarily solar calendars.)

However, it's even worse than that.  You were born on a specific day.  So there's a vague symbolic rationale, at least, for celebrating a birthday later when it's the same time of year.  The Earth wasn't formed when the North star was in a specific position (it took the Earth a long time to form, _much_ longer than the 10^4 yr timescale of the precession) so there's no sense in which any position of the North Pole is like it was at the 'beginning'.

Now I have no idea how this particular error (the precession of the equinoxes 'happening' in 2012) cropped up -- if you care to provide a reference to where you heard this, I could check it out.  But gold to gumdrops it's just something that some New Ager, with more drugs than neurons in his brain, simply made up, because talking about natural cycles and stuff makes him feel all, like, groovy, man.  :D


----------



## gloggawogga

Actually, I think in much older days, at least in northern climates, people mainly celebrated the coming of spring, because that meant you survived another winter


----------



## L2R

didn't the mayans predict governor arnie's death for a few months back?


----------



## Akoto

Honestly, the Myans werent really THAT advanced.

Like they had a really neat and sophisticated callander, intricate art work, pyramids, religion, and even a primitive form of basket ball, but all in all they were basicly like every bloated dogmatic aristocratic slave-driving civilization, not disimilar to the Egypt or Greece. They were actualy a really savage people with a horribly oppressed populace. (I went to the pyramids in Costa Maya and the area where the pyramids are apparenly only made up 10% of the area occupyed by them, and the rest were slaves. Infact, even 90% of the space inside the city dwellings were purely for personal assistants, and anything non-slave was several feet above anything else.)

Out of all the stuff they made, the only thing of any real significance was the adding of a place-holder (0) to mathematics and, which allows for cyclic counting and things like multiplication, and large numbers that dont take up tons of space.


----------



## StagnantReaction

OMG *Y2K*!!!!!1!! wtf shitballz


----------



## CatcherInTheRye

L2R said:
			
		

> ^ You know the Mayan society lived with three different calendars simultaneously: solar, lunar and astral.
> 
> This alone is one thing our civilisation can't even dream of utilising.



Maybe because it's really useless and confusing?


----------



## bikki_muncher69

Well in 2012 the universe is going to re align itself, last time this happend they mayans just dissapeared off the face of the Earth, Nobody will really know whats gonna happen, Terrance Mckenna had some good points, how do we know that some cataclysmic events might happen?. They say that the enlightened people will ascend this could be the case and to the unenlightened it ay just appear as though we died in whatever disasters occureed around that time. See 2012 is way bigger than any of the other apocolyptic dates, yes there is alot of stuff being written by nutcases on this subject but there is also alot of intelligent information also alot of my friends who through psychedelics and astral travel accessing their higher selfs have gained info on what is going to happen. They all think there is going to be an ascension of some sort and this is more than one person. who says the world wont implode? This plane of existance is here so that our souls can learn and grow, maybee GOD might have thought that we have come to the end of our learning here on Earth anything is infinatly possible.


----------



## L2R

^ your use of passed tense when refering to the future is freaking me out, and your punctuation is just plain silly.


----------



## realm

Coolio said:
			
		

> Here's the definitive answer to the meaning of 2012:
> 
> http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&n=2&videoid=823251934





fuck....head for the hills

great video man thanks for the link


----------



## socko

2012 - It's a way to make money by writing 2012 Dooms Day scenario books.
Maybe I should sell 2012 Survival Manuals or 2012 Care Packages.


----------



## realm

just sell some Bibles telling people to read revelations, it could save their lives...youll make a killing, and put some churches out of business while you're at it...it's a win win situation


----------



## Tranced

I'm sure just "knowing" something "cosmic" is going to happen is very comforting but you're only going to make youselves feel silly when 2013 comes and everythings exactly the same.

Either that or re-schedule.


----------



## elemenohpee

and I think we all know which option they'll choose 8(


----------



## socko

JSX said:
			
		

> A printing device found in the Andes, dated around 1000AD that printed Egyptian-like figures
> A Babylonian tablet describing spacemen landing on Earth, and an Indian text with detailed instructions for building an aeroplane
> A Crystal skull dated to 200,000 BC. People 200,000 years ago couldn't carve crystal.
> The Iron Pillar outside New Dehli, dated to 1500BC, made of an alloy that will not rust, that we can't duplicate today
> Quartz beads found on a Peruvian mummy, with minute holes on them that couldn't be made with any drill around today


Do you have references for these things?  I'm curious and would at least like to see photos.


----------



## realm

Tranced said:
			
		

> I'm sure just "knowing" something "cosmic" is going to happen is very comforting but you're only going to make youselves feel silly when 2013 comes and everythings exactly the same.
> 
> Either that or re-schedule.




I've got 1mil on re-schedule. Who's in?


----------



## camatnurv

Akoto said:
			
		

> Earth is going to explode.



I need an exact date. I want to be on the best roll of my life when it happens.


----------



## wingnutlives

I no longer believe that the world will significantly change in 2012. There is, apparently, an astronomal event set for December 11, 2012, which may or may not affect the planet itself. It's possible that many natural disasters might happen, but I'm not scientifically educated enough to make any assumptions just yet. 

I have some friends who are way into this stuff. They believe that the human race will ascend into the 5th dimension, and that there will be a massive change in consciousness. Personally, I think this would only be possible after millions of years of evolution. I just can't logically see a leap like this happening in six years, it's way too soon. 

But since it's been drummed into me, I do have that deadline set it my head. I think it's quite possible that the American civilization could collapse by then, or at least the economy or political system would collapse. By 2012 I plan to be completely off-the-grid and self-sufficient, so I am not depending on such a faulty system for my everyday needs.


----------



## socko

Thanks for posting those pics JSX. Interesting stuff.


----------



## L2R

JSX said:
			
		

> The Iron Pillar outside New Dehli, dated to 1500BC, made of an alloy that will not rust, that we can't duplicate today



Fascinating as it is, a cursory google search indicates that it's actually from the 4th-5th century AD and made up of a "pure iron" which can be replicate today but only in small quantities. I guess great leaps of scientific analysis have come to pass since the 70's when that book was first published.

The pillar is still amazing that it exists.


----------



## michael

l2r, you are making the mistake of trying to ascribe any kind of serious scholarship to those sources.


----------



## L2R

shhhh aliens are listening


----------



## bikki_muncher69

I have another theory as to why nothing might happen as well. The mayans say that right now the time between 1987 to 2012 is between worlds and its up to us to create the next world which will cross over in 2012 but what we are createing now is exactly the same as what we had in the past so when the time dose come for worlds to cross over were createing something exactly the same so there wont be much change if any at all. I also dunno if tripping on acid would be a good idea during the shift, what happens if we do shift and you get lost that would suck balls i mean eventually you'd end up back at the source but could be fucked up if you ended up in the void for a while lost and confused.


----------



## L2R

bikki, who is "they"?


----------



## bikki_muncher69

mayans say but guess every 2012 website you go to say that.


----------



## bikki_muncher69

socko said:
			
		

> World shift or not, I end up fucked up in the void everytime I take a good dose.




Yah bu if there is no "old" reality to come back to it could get very very fucked up, you never know maybee the people who trip on that day will ascend and all the non trippers will stay in this reality, I dunno what the fuck to think anymore.


----------



## elemenohpee

bikki_muncher69 said:
			
		

> Yah bu if there is no "old" reality to come back to it could get very very fucked up, you never know maybee the people who trip on that day will ascend and all the non trippers will stay in this reality, I dunno what the fuck to think anymore.


yeah, you never know.  Hell, anythings possible...


----------



## bikki_muncher69

found an awsome down to earth website explaing it all http://www.undergrowth.org/the_year_2012


----------



## Mehm

New info:

I'm taking an anthropological religion course at uni right now and my teacher is a scholar of ancient mayan civilization.  He is published and can read their "hieroglyphs (sp?)" himself.  I think he even speaks some of their language.  Basically, he has spent 20 years researching their civilization.

Anyhow, he says that according to all evidence, the mayans made NO predictions for 2012.  The only thing they said is that it is the end of the current cycle of four ages, and on the winter solstice of 2012, we will go back to the beginning of a new cycle.  That's it.

Seeing as they cycles last thousands of years each, 2012 does seem somewhat significant.  However, as far as end of the world predictions go, he summed them up nicely with, "bull shit."

Just thought ya'll might be interested in that.

peace


----------



## L2R

^nice work.

what exactly does an age cycle mean?


----------



## Dyno_oz

Is it just me, or have there been a lot of natural disasters in the past few years ?

I'm not saying this or that.. lets just see what happens.


----------



## zorn

L2R said:
			
		

> ^nice work.
> 
> what exactly does an age cycle mean?


 It's the biggest cycle in the Mayan calendar.  In our calendar, the cycles go as:

year : month : date

Every 30 days, you go to the next month and reset to it being the 1st.  Every 12 months, you go to the next year and reset to it being January.  There's no real cycle bigger than a year, the year # just keeps going up.

In the classical Mayan Long Count calendar, the cycles are:

epoch : baktun : katun : tun : uinal : day

There are only 13 different baktuns in an epoch (what the prof called an "age cycle.")  The baktun # will reset back to the beginning in 2012 (or in 1998, or 2016, etc, depending on which calendar correlation you use.)


----------



## L2R

According to wiki, each Baktun is 395 years long, so 13 of those would be 5135 years.
What would be the purpose of measuring such practically inconsequential measurements of time?


----------



## Son of Samurai

JSX said:
			
		

> They're from a book I was reading, I'll do the scans in a minutes
> 
> EDIT: Here we go.
> 
> This is the book
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/05...740713/ref=sr_1_1/102-2227798-3978541?ie=UTF8
> 
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys001.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys002.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys003.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys004.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys005.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys006.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys007.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys008.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys009.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys010.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys011.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys012.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys013.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys014.jpg
> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y194/jondz3003/mys015.jpg






Ohhh....myyyyy....GODDD!!

The first link that I clicked was the link to page 8 and mate I gotta tell you, I felt like I got the giant stuffed panda at the fun fair by sticking all my balls in the mouth of those scary ball munching clown things.

I spat milk all over my LCD monitor, but it was a joy to clean it up, I haven't laughed that hard at something since I saw a dog shit out one very long strand of spaghetti.

You guys have gotta see the evidence this book shows that the Incas had access to a digital computer....ohhhh boy.

I don't wanna ruin the surprise for ya, just go on and click the link to page 8.
I'll give you a hint though, it ain't evidence of, let's say.....ummmm....powerlines orrrr a generator of electricity, no no, that would be too obvious for this book.  It's like my uncle Chop Chop would say, never let the truth get in the way of a good story. 

BBBUUUAAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!


----------



## elemenohpee

lol, what other possible use could they have had for a wheel besides a digital computer?


----------



## Kul69

This is the third cycle of the mayan calendar and the fourth change of mankind from original intelligent design.

2012 divided into 3 cycles minus 4 changes of mankind = 666.6666666666666666666666666666

This means..  evil


----------



## Tranced

bikki_muncher69 said:
			
		

> Yah bu if there is no "old" reality to come back to it could get very very fucked up, you never know maybee the people who trip on that day will ascend and all the non trippers will stay in this reality, I dunno what the fuck to think anymore.



If I were you I'd try not to think at all, then you might not let your mind run away with these histerical, improbable and completely false ideologies.


----------



## FDRinTRINIDAD

Whats really gona happen is Jimi Hendrix, Kirk Cobaine, Elvis, and Tupac, will all come back and form a SUPER BAND that will fight evil and opression in the world through their powerfull use of rockin tunes and street rap. You'll all see just watch!!!!


----------



## zorn

lololololol....  those scanned book pages are hilarious!  Who even reads this shit?  :D :D :D  Man, not to put too fine a point on it but some folks really need to ease up on the drugs.... a lot.


----------



## rowland2110

This is silly.  

The Myan calender ends in 2012 because thats how far they got into printing it before .,.. i dunno, thier civilization colapsed or something, whatever. 

If you decide to print future calenders your gonna have to end in a certian year eventually.  Unless your immortal.


----------



## Church

Saying the Mayan calendar "ends" in 2012 is a lot like saying the Gregorian calendar "ends" every 365 days on december 31...

Their calendar was cyclical... the big deal with winter solstice of 2012 is that the cycle within the cycle within the cycle within the cycle has finally come to completion, and the circle will continue on into its next 26,000 year revolution.

It doesn't mean the world ends.


----------



## Mehm

ya'll have to admit that it will be preatty cool to witness the end of a 26,000 year cycle though


----------



## nuke

I'm waiting for 2021


----------



## L2R

^why, will you then be allowed to drink legally?


----------



## I Liquor All Night

whats on 2021


----------



## Helios.

zorn,
you should be in middle management.


----------



## DarthMom

ok, so i am a huge fan of conspiracy theories, that is what i read up on when bored. here is another part of the theory on 2012.

_disclaimer, this is for entertainment purposes only, to give you an idea of other theories floating around out there. i do not claim to believe it, nor do i necessarily disbelieve it either though. i am a pure agnostic in every way shape or form. _

as someone mentioned earlier, this is simply the end of another time cycle, not a prediction for the end of the world. 

time should be cyclical, not linear, and the mayans did just that. there are those that believe that 2012 signals a mass change of conciousness, and the world will change massively, going from a male dominated society to one of a goddess culture, with a paradigm shift from a culture of war to one of peace. it is the end not only of the 5k yr cycle, but the entire 26k year one also

personally, this is one silly theory i really want to believe :D

http://www.13moon.com/prophecy page.htm
that page sums it all up well and explains the cycle simply.


----------



## Dyno_oz

is there any major planetary alignment around this time?


----------



## avon lady

yes all the planets align and the north and south pole will swop


----------



## Medatripper Tates

DarthMom said:
			
		

> http://www.13moon.com/prophecy page.htm
> that page sums it all up well and explains the cycle simply.



thanks for that link!  its been a good read..


----------



## shoe70

bikki_muncher69 said:
			
		

> Yah bu if there is no "old" reality to come back to it could get very very fucked up, you never know maybee the people who trip on that day will ascend and all the non trippers will stay in this reality, I dunno what the fuck to think anymore.


Kill yourself.


----------



## Psychedelics_r_best

The world is ending guyzorz! Tie your leg to to a car anxle and drownd yourself doodz or the end is gonna come!


----------



## Floodgear

avon lady said:
			
		

> yes all the planets align and the north and south pole will swop




well thats actually not totally wrong!
The chance that will happen is much bigger than normal. But this is what scientists say (in the media) and me got a believing media problem since I study it's influence on people.
I mean if the north and south pole will chance than at least half of the people will die, so would you tell that to the people when you know chaos would be the answer.

About 2012 itself, I'm a little believer. Since I believe in the things happening these days..


----------



## sexwivgerbils

dleted.  sorry i was trolling


----------



## zorn

This is probably pointless, considering... 


			
				Floodgear said:
			
		

> well thats actually not totally wrong!
> The chance that will happen is much bigger than normal. But this is what scientists say (in the media) and me got a believing media problem since I study it's influence on people.
> I mean if the north and south pole will chance than at least half of the people will die, so would you tell that to the people when you know chaos would be the answer.


 The north and south poles will swap, probably sometime in the next 100,000 or 200,000 years.  But pole swaps are _slow_ processes, it's not like it just happens overnight or in a month or even in a year.  Typically it takes 100 to 200 years at least for the poles to switch.  Second, it won't kill anyone, in fact the only thing that would happen is that compasses would stop working normally.  (They'd act all weird in the centuries while the poles were switching, pointing in different directions in different places.)  There might be more radio interference than usual and crazy northern/southern lights too (due to increased solar wind activity.)

Oh and this has nothing to do with planetary "alignments" either.  Actually the whole notion that planetary "alignments" matter for just about anything is about as loony as it gets; I think you have to be slightly deranged to attach cosmic significance to a bunch of things _lining up._

--Zorn


----------



## Medatripper Tates

^ so you don't believe in any possible 'changes of consciousness' within the next, say 50 years?


----------



## zorn

Depends: what do you mean by "change of consciousness?"  Have there been any "changes of consciousness" in the last 50 years?

I don't believe any mystical processes are going to cause humans' minds to become any different than they've been for the last thousand years; certainly not because some rocks lined up or because we hit year 10000 on some extinct barbaric culture's calendar.  But, human culture and attitudes are constantly changing because of social and technological change.  I think our civilization today, at least in the West, is in many ways significantly better than civilization was in the past -- people are more tolerant, less brutal, more just to one another.  I certainly hope that will continue, and in 50 years we'll have a better society than we do today.  You could call that a "change of consciousness" if you wanted, I suppose.

--Zorn


----------



## specialrelativity

There is an alignment in 2012, yes, which coincides with Mayan Calendar's end-date.  The morning star, Venus, rises with the sun and the galactic center of the Milky Way, at sunrise.  A once every 5000 year or so occurence.  The HUichols, the ones who traditionally use Peyote, have also it seems predicted this alignment in their yarn weavings.  What will it mean?  It's hard to say.  It will alos be a peak in the Sun spot cycle, so that could mean some super-chaotic weather is on the way.


----------



## L2R

zorn said:
			
		

> people are more tolerant, less brutal,
> --Zorn



that's debateable, but this is not the place for that debate.


----------



## Medatripper Tates

zorn said:
			
		

> Depends: what do you mean by "change of consciousness?"  Have there been any "changes of consciousness" in the last 50 years?
> 
> I don't believe any mystical processes are going to cause humans' minds to become any different than they've been for the last thousand years; certainly not because some rocks lined up or because we hit year 10000 on some extinct barbaric culture's calendar.  But, human culture and attitudes are constantly changing because of social and technological change.  I think our civilization today, at least in the West, is in many ways significantly better than civilization was in the past -- people are more tolerant, less brutal, more just to one another.  I certainly hope that will continue, and in 50 years we'll have a better society than we do today.  You could call that a "change of consciousness" if you wanted, I suppose.
> 
> --Zorn



i guess that could be considered a change of consciousness, ill try to be less vague.. 

do you think it _could_ have any effect on people and altered states of consciousness (obe, astral travel, lucid dreaming etc.) and the way we perceive reality?

the only reason im interested in this is because of some of my experiences.  it seems like there is this alternate reality that can be tuned into and its all up to me and becoming more conscious of it!  

and this doesn't have to happen magically all at once, possibly it is an evolutionary thing we have to make the effort to keep up with and be more conscious of, and not get stuck behind.


----------



## zorn

^^^ Do I think _what_ could have any effect on people & altered states of consciousness?

Do you mean the year 2012, reversal of the north&south poles, or some 'alignment' of planets?  Certainly not; none of those could have any effect on the human mind.  It's meaningless when we hit the year 1000 or 10000 on our calendar and it's just as meaningless on some barbaric ancient civilization's calendar; pole reversals have no effect on our minds; and the idea that planets lining up is an important event for mankind is just delusional.

I don't think there will be any change in how people in general 'perceive reality,' or how they have / think of altered states of consciousness.  You might be tuning into an alternate reality more easily as time goes by.  And I'm sure there are other people who feel the same way.  (For anyone doing lots of psychedelics, it's to be expected.)  But there are also people for which the reverse is true -- they used to be into altered states of consciousness, but now are spending more and more time in the normal world.  And most people of course have nothing to do with any alternate reality.

Wanting to think that some tremendous monumental change is about to come over humankind is a standard human urge.  People have been predicting this kind of thing since the beginning of recorded history.  Lots of Christians have been predicting the apocalypse would come _during their lifetime_ ever since there _was_ a Christianity.  There's a similar strand of millenialist thought in Shi'ite Islam.  And this business about an imminent "change of consciousness" and transcendence you're talking about has been around since at least the 1960's; in fact there were way more people convinced of it back in the late 1960's and 1970's.  Yet the world always goes on, as usual, without any apocalypse or transcendence.

I guarantee you a hundred years from now, there will be Christians talking about how the wars & natural disasters fulfill all these prophecies and prove that the end times are right around the bend, and New Age types talking about how people really seem to be waking up and how a shift in our global consciousness is about to take place....


----------



## Medatripper Tates

zorn said:
			
		

> ^^^ Do I think _what_ could have any effect on people & altered states of consciousness?
> 
> Do you mean the year 2012, reversal of the north&south poles, or some 'alignment' of planets?  Certainly not; none of those could have any effect on the human mind.  It's meaningless when we hit the year 1000 or 10000 on our calendar and it's just as meaningless on some barbaric ancient civilization's calendar; pole reversals have no effect on our minds; and the idea that planets lining up is an important event for mankind is just delusional.
> 
> I don't think there will be any change in how people in general 'perceive reality,' or how they have / think of altered states of consciousness.  You might be tuning into an alternate reality more easily as time goes by.  And I'm sure there are other people who feel the same way.  (For anyone doing lots of psychedelics, it's to be expected.)  But there are also people for which the reverse is true -- they used to be into altered states of consciousness, but now are spending more and more time in the normal world.  And most people of course have nothing to do with any alternate reality.
> 
> Wanting to think that some tremendous monumental change is about to come over humankind is a standard human urge.  People have been predicting this kind of thing since the beginning of recorded history.  Lots of Christians have been predicting the apocalypse would come _during their lifetime_ ever since there _was_ a Christianity.  There's a similar strand of millenialist thought in Shi'ite Islam.  And this business about an imminent "change of consciousness" and transcendence you're talking about has been around since at least the 1960's; in fact there were way more people convinced of it back in the late 1960's and 1970's.  Yet the world always goes on, as usual, without any apocalypse or transcendence.
> 
> I guarantee you a hundred years from now, there will be Christians talking about how the wars & natural disasters fulfill all these prophecies and prove that the end times are right around the bend, and New Age types talking about how people really seem to be waking up and how a shift in our global consciousness is about to take place....



well, i cant argue with that.  i really don't know anything about pole reversals, alignment of planets, etc.  thoughts of the apocalypse rarely occur.  all of this is just based on my experiences and hearing of others.

it just makes me wonder if my experiences have some sort of connection with my environment.



> And I'm sure there are other people who feel the same way.  (For anyone doing lots of psychedelics, it's to be expected.)



psychedelics can only take you so far though, the delusion lies in trying to wrap the mind around the experience.  and when you are only using psychedelics, chances are your mind is going to get jumbled up with the experience.  it took me a lot more than psychedelics to experience this 'alternate reality'.  and in no way was this a delusion.  its only a delusion when i try to remember and interpret/express the experience.



> But there are also people for which the reverse is true -- they used to be into altered states of consciousness, but now are spending more and more time in the normal world.



to go any further you are definitely taking your chances with the normal world, and this is what scares people from going any further.  this is a choice everyone makes - keep going or fall back or stay where you are.  i have definitely chosen to work and lead a normal life and abstain from psychedelics.  when its my time to move on im expecting to end up in a psych ward.



> And most people of course have nothing to do with any alternate reality.



how would you know of the others who do experience this though.


----------



## Drug-Alchemist

I have an inkling of what might happen, but I'm not going to tell you. 
All I say is that this is just a character creation phase. The game will begin when the cosmic clock unwinds itself at 23 of December, at 2012. 

It's the end of the world as we know it, and everyone is invited.


----------



## elemenohpee

and who let you in on this little secret?


----------



## shoe70

zorn said:
			
		

> Depends: what do you mean by "change of consciousness?"  Have there been any "changes of consciousness" in the last 50 years?
> 
> I don't believe any mystical processes are going to cause humans' minds to become any different than they've been for the last thousand years;


Basically, this. If you zoom out on the timeline far enough there will always be little 'blips' on the radar that correspond to 'changes in thought/consciousness' but these blips, while seeming like enourmous changes to the people that are living in those times, making them feel like they're alive in the greatest possible time, are largely insignificant in the long run (see: religious awakenings over the past few centuries, the Renaissance, the 60's 8( ). Don't get me wrong, they've all left their mark on history, but they weren't exactly the next step in our evolutionary development.

Realistically speaking, any large-scale changes in consciousness will occur (if at all) over thousands of years, so gradual that they would be completely unnoticeable to the individuals experiencing them. Saying that 'it will all happen' in 2012 is like saying that everyone will start to act like an adult when they turn 18. Growing up is not an overnight change but a gradual process, some people grow up earlier, some later, some not at all. Kind of a bad analogy but you get where I'm going.


----------



## Akoto

shoe70 said:
			
		

> Basically, this. If you zoom out on the timeline far enough there will always be little 'blips' on the radar that correspond to 'changes in thought/consciousness' but these blips, while seeming like enourmous changes to the people that are living in those times, making them feel like they're alive in the greatest possible time, are largely insignificant in the long run (see: religious awakenings over the past few centuries, the Renaissance, the 60's 8( ). Don't get me wrong, they've all left their mark on history, but they weren't exactly the next step in our evolutionary development.
> 
> Realistically speaking, any large-scale changes in consciousness will occur (if at all) over thousands of years, so gradual that they would be completely unnoticeable to the individuals experiencing them. Saying that 'it will all happen' in 2012 is like saying that everyone will start to act like an adult when they turn 18. Growing up is not an overnight change but a gradual process, some people grow up earlier, some later, some not at all. Kind of a bad analogy but you get where I'm going.



You're right, except that there _are_ some very key differences in this time than any other.

Firstly, we now have enough stored energy at out fingertips (namely in atomic bombs) to blow this planet clear out of existance many times over. We also have things like mass communication and mass transportation which make things that used to take decades into things that take only days.

Basically, our technology has outgrown our planet and far exceeded any individual person, so if there is going to be any sudden shift in world concisousness, it will probably be sooner rather then later.

I suppose quite soon we will be at "critical mass", so to speak, where the planet cannot support our current lifestyle anymore and will have to be changed dramatialy, or face destruction.


----------



## shoe70

That reminds me of that part in the movie Waking Life where in one of the scenes there's a professor talking about how evolutionary changes have been speeding up over time and that it's been taking less and less time for new critical advances in technology and thought, and how we're now approaching a sort of vertical tangent during which who knows what's going to happen. It was an interesting idea but I don't know how right he is in taking the idea of evolution by natural selection (which is purely biological and has a lot of definitive evidence) and taking it into a completely different context (which really has little to no solid evidence to support it). It's completely possible that this may be the case with technology (aren't we supposed to have quantum computers with infinite processing capabilities by something like 2020?) but it's hard to say how that will lead to a change in consciousness.

As far as us outgrowing our planet, it really just means that we'll have to look out to space for resources. Although if you're just talking about this whole energy crisis (which I'm not as informed on as I'd like to be), it's not the first one we've had and I think we can manage to get through it without an extreme change in perception. These are all mostly economic/political obstacles rather than 'spiritual' ones.


----------



## ninjadanslarbretabar

2012
yep, 2012... .. .
hum, its the mayan y2k
mayan have a great system, calendar...

"the tao that can be told is not the eterneal tao..."
im not shure if it make sense to name god..
or to place a end of time date

the eschaton, apocalyps thing is a common meme
movie with the "will he make it in time", with the accelerating time at the end, each second is more important than the last...

the singularity,
i understand how it goes,
but im not shure that pointing to a special date is the way to deal with it,
( even if this is the date )

i have been thinking alot about the singularity those last 4 years
its great
but im not shure i want to talk about it under the "2012" name
( its like using a bible to talk about spirituality   )


----------



## StagnantReaction

We're all gonna fucking die.


----------



## budsicle

who knows, its interesting times


----------



## shoe70

ninjadanslarbretabar said:
			
		

> 2012
> yep, 2012... .. .
> hum, its the mayan y2k
> mayan have a great system, calendar...
> 
> "the tao that can be told is not the eterneal tao..."
> im not shure if it make sense to name god..
> or to place a end of time date
> 
> the eschaton, apocalyps thing is a common meme
> movie with the "will he make it in time", with the accelerating time at the end, each second is more important than the last...
> 
> the singularity,
> i understand how it goes,
> but im not shure that pointing to a special date is the way to deal with it,
> ( even if this is the date )
> 
> i have been thinking alot about the singularity those last 4 years
> its great
> but im not shure i want to talk about it under the "2012" name
> ( its like using a bible to talk about spirituality   )


Dude, I'm not trying to flame you, but do you have to type your posts in verse?


----------



## twentysix

I'm taking on the responsiblity of "merging" some threads, in response to the recent closing of yet another "2012" thread:



> _Originally posted by smotpoker:_
> 
> In the past few months I've been very intrested in what is possibly going to be a real apocolypse. I don't have a link but if you type in the above date you will see what I mean.
> 
> Crazy shiit is going to go down on 12-21-12.
> 
> It's the date the Mayan calender ends. 12-21-12. It's the approxomite date the Egyptians think we are all dead. 12-21-12.
> 
> Some of the possible scenarios (keep in mind I'm kinda high right now and I am going to try my best to remember some of the stuff I saw on a tv program from sunday night:
> 
> Polar Shift- this will happen. What will the effects of a polar shift be? Well in a best case scenario all that might happen would be our cell phones would all stop working.
> 
> Worst case- extreme heat and cold. Places that were cold would become hot, etc. Mass extinction of species. Massive loss of crops.
> 
> This will be the 1st time in I wanna say 72,000 years that the sun is going to line up perfectly in the center of the milky way. The sun could appear much closer to us than now. And with the rate of climate change we are experiencing our earth could be suspect to a solar flare from the sun.
> 
> What would a solar flare hitting earth do? Think of the dinosaurs. A solar flare could also wrap earth up in smoke for years.
> In other words, we could be in straight darkness for 15 years if this happens. That would mean no crops,crops need sunlight to live; no light means no crops, which would lead to worldwide hunger and starvation.
> 
> Keep in mind, we just recently discovered that there is a giant black hole at the center of the Milky Way. for years scientists laughed at this notion, except the Mayans said this thousands of years ago.
> 
> 12-21-12. Get ready for it.
> 
> 
> I know this is a mess of a post, and I am pretty high right now. But if there are any Nostradamus nuts here or just people as intrigued with the date as I am, speak up! Would love to discuss this topic! And this is all speculative, but anyone here who think's I'm crazy should do a little research themselves, it's quite interesting!



Well, at least the thread-start. It's a tedious process to weed through all the quotes, if I make it within quotes to begin with.. yada yada. In the future, why not merge the threads to begin with, that way if it does happen to make it to 1000 posts, you won't have a reason to shut new threads pertaining to "2012"?


----------



## alt 14

Dec 21st, 2012 is the first date where time travel is possible (on the timeline we observe).

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=413697 explains my ideas more if anyone cares


----------



## RhythmSpring

^ 
Hey, that's not nice. Be friendly, you know how easily people get enraged on the internet. You're not helping anyone by name calling. EDIT: I'm referring to twentysix's post, by the way.

Hey, shouldn't there be a "Big and Dandy 2012 Thread" like there are in the psychedelics forum? That might solve some issues...

Anyhoo, it's very interesting to read stuff from 2-3 years ago about 2012... It puts things into a little perspective. I wonder if recent world events have informed anybody's view on soon-to-come catastrophes.


----------



## mr_p

why does everyone assume its going to be 'the end of the world' and a 'catastrophe'

where does this information come from ?

most of the myan/rainbow tribe crew back home (northern nsw, australia) seem to believe/feel that its going to be a shift into a higher realm of conscoiusness, and 'heaven on earth' ...

so many polarized perspectives ~ 



i think we can ALLLLLL agree.... never the less... that we DO live in really interesting times ... 

and my feeling is that not many people could really predict how the world will be in 5...10... 15 years with much accuracy.... 

only time will tell, aye....


----------



## twentysix

RhythmSpring said:


> ^
> Hey, that's not nice. Be friendly, you know how easily people get enraged on the internet. You're not helping anyone by name calling. EDIT: I'm referring to twentysix's post, by the way.
> 
> Hey, shouldn't there be a "Big and Dandy 2012 Thread" like there are in the psychedelics forum? That might solve some issues...



I was simply being an asshole back to a certain person. I said they were guilty of asshole behavior. No names were called. Shoot me. They should have the mind to merge some of the threads that were more recent with this one.. which was buried with it's last reply *3 years ago*... but it seems every other 2012 thread was locked without question. It's disgusting, really. I don't see many other "singular" topics being- well, singled out like that.

That alone causes me to "rage". But I didn't name-call.

I do see that you had the same idea as me, with the "Big and Dandy Thread".. but like I said, check out when these posts (to the original thread) were. This thing was buried pretty deep. Took me quite some minutes to find it. There has been a few threads pertaining to "2012" that were perhaps even larger than this one, in the past few years- that were locked without question, at some point. There were some pretty thoughtful responses in those, too. The same mod closed those, and then he has the nerve to "" while closing a more recent one. It's thoughtless, and provocative behavior- if you ask me.

Jamshyd. Just let these threads stay open, merge them as both Rhythm and I have suggested, and let them run their course. You can't control everything, but you _can_ help steer things. 

You said in one of them that you may re-open it in 2012? Why would you do that if this one that I just bumped was still open all this time- and just buried with it's last reply back in _2006_? What logic is this?

It would seem to nullify what the other mods have come up with in your defense (that there _is_ actually a thread still 'open', just buried, and that's why all the others get locked-- oh yea, they should've been merged from the get-go)

Again, to RhythmSpring- I didn't call anyone any names. If I really did, please point this out to me via PM, so I can go back and edit/apologize.


----------



## swilow

> Well, at least the thread-start. It's a tedious process to weed through all the quotes, if I make it within quotes to begin with.. yada yada. In the future, why not merge the threads to begin with, that way if it does happen to make it to 1000 posts, you won't have a reason to shut new threads pertaining to "2012"?



Yeah, I guess it is tedious  Why don't you search for the right thread, so as to avoid needless worry about your own thread getting locked?

My opinion on 2012 wasn't meant to offend you at all, but if it does, you chose it to. I simply think that this date is bot relevant to us at all. Thats my opinion, after reading a lot of the reasoning behind this theory. Terence McKenna's Timewave Zero theory has been proven to be mathematically incorrect for example.


----------



## twentysix

I actually wasn't aware that one was still open. There has been a few that have gone on for longer than this one in the past couple of years, or a few larger threads that were closed simply because there was too much discussion of this 2012 babble.

And yea, I've read the same thing about McKenna's timewave. It still interests me, however- and it interested/interests some pretty established scientists, the last time I checked. It's interested them enough to weed through his calculations, and make corrections. I remember reading somewhere that another made the calculations 'sound', after McKenna's death. Though that could be wrong.

I don't know either way, or any way, about the date. It could be just another point in time, like any other point in time. I do have multiple coincidences in my life that relate to that date. Just a few, but they're kinda significant when held up to certain prophecy, in some form.

The idea is fascinating, to me. Just as is synchronicity.

If acausality is an actual principle of reality, then that means that future events in time effect present events (and in effect, past). This is, from my comprehension, similar to some of the pieces I've read that relate to the universe as perceived by quantum mechanics- For this, that time doesn't exist as we know it, and that all 'times' actually exist simultaneously (whatever that can mean)... by which idea, this type of acausal ordering and prophecy might exist. It would in-fact seem "normal", to me.



This all being said, I want to point out this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8yMXINOh8U (part 1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqyww8hi214 (part 2). I found it entertaining/informative- but somehow I'm still able to retain my interest in the topics surrounding "2012". I don't know about the end of the video, though. I'm not saying anything.

I really only have what I've experienced- myself. I've known about the polar reversal being dramatized, as well as the galactic alignment (though the demonstration on the video made it clearer), and about the time-wave faults. I do think that the Mayan Calendar should be adopted- simply because it's more harmonic than our current one. But again, and again, I have no idea, nor am I proposing anything definite, when it comes to "what will happen" "suddenly and precisely" on "Dec 21st, 2012". I do think they were on to _something_ with their mechanisms of "time".. but we're the ones who've placed the importance on exacts, and of it's ending. It could just be a reference point. But as others have said, and I know this has been said for years, that we are in some pretty interesting times.

Part of me does have a problem with quoting the author of that video for trut", but whatever.. his stuff makes some sense.


----------



## yaesutom

> This all being said, I want to point out this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8yMXINOh8U (part 1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqyww8hi214 (part 2). I found it entertaining/informative- but somehow I'm still able to retain my "interest" in the topics surrounding "2012". I don't know about the end of the video, though. I'm not saying anything.



LOL - i watched the video, and thought it was interesting up until the end, turns out this guy is a bible thumper type lol, i thought that was ironic.

I don't agree with any of this 2012 hype, although I was WAY into it for a couple years, but i have an excuse: I was psychotic during those couple years


----------



## GoddessLSD-XTC

This 2012 stuff & Terrence McKenna seems sooo off-the-wall, illogical, irrational astro-"logical" bunk.

I have a freind who thinks Viliskofski (spelling, hope U know who I mean) has found that the end of the world will happen when Venus is puled out of orbit. Same too of the planet alligning bunkum.

Why do ppl believe this 2012 stuff?! The world will probably end sooner than that when we reach Peak Oil and supplies do not meet demand . . . if not for the lousy state of the economy now, we probably would be having $100+/barrel of oil again.

With world-population spiking, things can not go on as they are:




http://www.flickr.com/photos/666_is_money/3046126937





http://www.flickr.com/photos/666_is_money/3102033734


----------



## twentysix

I really enjoy McKenna, personally. Who am I, and who are you- to say he is crazy?

I think what got Terence so excited was that he extrapolated his timewave from the I Ching, and unknowingly came up with the exact same date for his "0-point/infinity" as the Mayan Calendar's end date. It would get me excited, too. The same types of "coincidences" have happened in my life. 

When his library burnt down I was deep in my own quest, studying "the alphabet". I almost thought it was "my fault"- but that's a God complex for ya..

What you point out is interesting, though.


----------



## Ungoliath

I assume the world AS WE KNOW IT WILL END

There will be massive solar activity, there are records in the 1800's of solar storms burning telegraph wires, and in 2012 its supposed to be much worse

Maybe all our technology will fail? The world will crumble, I plan on taking all my money out of the bank before 2012 and using it to buy REAL goods, I have a bad feeling that the polar shift that is predicted and solar storms will decimate our technology, and all the money on computer screens will vanish, and many people will be broke.

Call me a fool or idiot, but im loading up for this like people did for y2k. THERE IS JUST WAAAY TO MUCH CREEPY STUFF ABOUT 2012 FROM TOO MANY DIFFERENT CIVILIZATIONS NOT TO BE SCARED.

I secretly hope, that the whole thing with the planets aligning, solar maxim and pole reversal will evolve us, will evolve everything on earth, into somehow super beings or something of the sort, it sounds stupid, but I had a dream on the 21st of dec 2012 of at the dawn of that day a tiney bacteria instantly evolving infront of my eye into a walking talking being, and us evolving into a super race where everyone was equal, in shape, form, we had no needs, and our only wants was peace

but thats just a dream...


----------



## L2R

maybe.... just perhaps.... 

the information we gain from the halon super collider may be the spark that raises our awareness of the nature of stuff....


----------



## twentysix

Ungoliath said:


> I assume the world AS WE KNOW IT WILL END
> 
> There will be massive solar activity, there are records in the 1800's of solar storms burning telegraph wires, and in 2012 its supposed to be much worse
> 
> Maybe all our technology will fail? The world will crumble, I plan on taking all my money out of the bank before 2012 and using it to buy REAL goods, I have a bad feeling that the polar shift that is predicted and solar storms will decimate our technology, and all the money on computer screens will vanish, and many people will be broke.
> 
> Call me a fool or idiot, but im loading up for this like people did for y2k. THERE IS JUST WAAAY TO MUCH CREEPY STUFF ABOUT 2012 FROM TOO MANY DIFFERENT CIVILIZATIONS NOT TO BE SCARED.
> 
> I secretly hope, that the whole thing with the planets aligning, solar maxim and pole reversal will evolve us, will evolve everything on earth, into somehow super beings or something of the sort, it sounds stupid, but I had a dream on the 21st of dec 2012 of at the dawn of that day a tiney bacteria instantly evolving infront of my eye into a walking talking being, and us evolving into a super race where everyone was equal, in shape, form, we had no needs, and our only wants was peace
> 
> but thats just a dream...




There are no planetary alignments on Dec 21st. 2012, at least from what I've read up about it. I'm no astronomer, though, so I'll just go with what I consider the most credible sources. The last I heard of this, was from the video that I posted a few posts back, "debunking" 2012. The guy has real astronomical data, from credible sources... Though I haven't bothered to go checking them for myself. 

There are a lot of cultures pointing around the same time-frame (now) for a change, or a movement into the "next world", I agree. This is another reason why I can't just throw this 2012 stuff out the window, thoughtlessly.

Venus transits are an interesting thing, however. I would suggest looking up some info on that. The last one was in 2004, which was a very inspiring time for me, and the next one will be in 2012 (June). The next one after that will happen in 2117- so quite a ways out. Venus is an important part of Mayan culture (well, a lot of cultures), associated with Kukulkin, or "Quetzalcoatl". Interestingly, Jesus has also been associated with Venus- being the "morning star" (and so has Lucifer). 

I read somewhere years ago, something about how a few previous Venus transits coincided with leaps in technology, and/or connection of the world. On one of them, for instance, a cable was laid under the ocean, allowing communication between the eastern and western hemispheres. There are others, I just can't remember at the moment.


----------



## swilow

twentysix said:


> I really enjoy McKenna, personally. Who am I, and who are you- to say he is crazy?
> 
> I think what got Terence so excited was that he extrapolated his timewave from the I Ching, and unknowingly came up with the exact same date for his "0-point/infinity" as the Mayan Calendar's end date. It would get me excited, too. The same types of "coincidences" have happened in my life.




The problem is that he based it on simply throwing the hexagrams- he believed that over 64 days in La Chorrrera he threw every card once. Have you read True Hallucinations? In it, he doesn't sleep for nine days, and his brother Dennis loses his mind. Literally. 

They planned to get a psilocybin mushroom, chant at in in its own resonant frequency- that would create standing waves which would somehow force harmine to bind with Dennis' DNA. Now I am not going to say he's crazy, but Terence McKenna was certainly a strange un.

The problem with Terence is that he was looking for this theory and would have applied it to anything given the data. The timewave zero theory is not cnsidered very scientific as it measures novelty, which is purely a subjective concept. Hell, its novel to me to scratch my ears- yet he didn't take that into account.

I like McKenna, but I take what he says with a grain of salt. Even he did  

I always thought that 21 Dec 2012 was not the end of the Mayan calendar, but the end of the Long Count or something, a measurement of time we don't employ.


----------



## twentysix

^True. I'm pretty sure.. Dec 21st 2012 would be the start of the 14th "b'ak'tun". The previous count would actually "end" on the 20th, technically- I guess. But, technically, 0 is 1 in a calendar... or well, beginning and end are the same point.

Yea I have read it.. and yea, grains of salt..

The calendar is just a system of measurement. The Mayans had "longer than long-count" measurements of time, too. It's just like saying no space exists beyond a ruler, really- to say it truly "ends". Space and time aren't dependent upon the systems that measure them.


----------



## Psychedelic Gleam

2012 is the arrival date of the aliens from Bad Taste.  When they will finally return and harvest mankind for the galactic fast food restaurant's famous Man-Burger.  Prepare for the cosmic intergalactic meat grinder.


----------



## underground_troll

Daniel Pinchbeck has written an interesting book regarding 2012, if this sort of thing intrigues you, I recommend it!

I'm not sure if on **December 21, 2012** anything will happen (although I think it would be fun to take psychedelics on that day....haha), but I DO know that there needs to be a shift of priorities for the Western World, which it seems like is happening slowly. I mean, it isn't going to be like all of a sudden we wake up on December 21, 2012 and magically the whole world has changed overnight. If we want there to be a shift in awareness, it's something we have to work toward.


----------



## twentysix

^I'd say in more than the western world.


----------



## underground_troll

by "western world" I don't mean any countries specifically, but rather the western mode of thought (which of course has infiltrated the rest of the world)


----------



## mr_p

underground_troll said:


> Daniel Pinchbeck has written an interesting book regarding 2012, if this sort of thing intrigues you, I recommend it!
> 
> I'm not sure if on **December 21, 2012** anything will happen (although I think it would be fun to take psychedelics on that day....haha), but I DO know that there needs to be a shift of priorities for the Western World, which it seems like is happening slowly. I mean, it isn't going to be like all of a sudden we wake up on December 21, 2012 and magically the whole world has changed overnight. If we want there to be a shift in awareness, it's something we have to work toward.




great post ~

if we want there to be a shift ... we have to creat it .. and be it .. starting without selves. and let that ripple out always .... ripple out all ways


----------



## Ripley

^^ Well we would need our "ignoble" selves to decide on initiating and incorporating such a selfless shift, no?


----------



## swilow

underground_troll said:


> Daniel Pinchbeck has written an interesting book regarding 2012, if this sort of thing intrigues you, I recommend it!



Wow, I must say- that book typifies why I hate this 2012 tell stuff; I mean, he channelled Quetzacoatl?? WTF? He's just a pop-lit author imo- his breaking open the head book is almost as bad....Not a fan at all.


----------



## twentysix

underground_troll said:


> by "western world" I don't mean any countries specifically, but rather the western mode of thought (which of course has infiltrated the rest of the world)



my bad. That's something to think about... I'm refreshing myself on eastern/western thought as I write. In that way, I would have to agree with you, at the base.


----------



## twentysix

swilow said:


> Wow, I must say- that book typifies why I hate this 2012 tell stuff; I mean, he channelled Quetzacoatl?? WTF? He's just a pop-lit author imo- his breaking open the head book is almost as bad....Not a fan at all.



If you perhaps look at it as "Channeling" "Quetzalcoatl" it might not seem so WTF-ish.


----------



## underground_troll

I could definitely see how someone wouldn't be into Pinchbeck....he's pretty far out there.


----------



## Psychedelic Gleam

as someone who spent time camping next to pinchbeck at a regional burn, and a relatively good amount of time communicating with him I have to say he takes himself WAY too seriously in the academic sense.  Individuals such as McKenna and Robert Anton Wilson had a firm grasp of the absurd and the comical, they didn't take themselves too seriously, I didn't get that vibe at all from Pinchbeck.  Plus I have heard multiple stories of negative interactions women had with him, so I find is "channelling" or "reincarnation" of Queztacoatl to be a bit absurd/wrongheaded/anti-intellectual and contrary to actual on the ground behavior.  He was a nice guy to get drunk with though.

I truly hope that 2012 will bring together communities who are attempting to evolve in some grandiose sense and bring them tighter not in the cosmic scale evolution but rather in the immediately quantifiable reality of interaction and coexistence with our friends and loved ones.


----------



## underground_troll

^ interesting, as I find I enjoy reading such far out ideas by not taking things too seriously or literally...


----------



## swilow

^I don't think Pichbeck is far out there; just really full of himself. Just my perspective on someone who could be a very interesting person. Truly thugh, I just see him as a guy who can write who takes psychedelics. 



twentysix said:


> If you perhaps look at it as "Channeling" "Quetzalcoatl" it might not seem so WTF-ish.



Sorry bro, you've utterly lost me there


----------



## Ananass

bikki_muncher69 said:


> Well in 2012 the universe is going to re align itself, last time this happend they mayans just dissapeared off the face of the Earth, Nobody will really know whats gonna happen, Terrance Mckenna had some good points, how do we know that some cataclysmic events might happen?. They say that the enlightened people will ascend this could be the case and to the unenlightened it ay just appear as though we died in whatever disasters occureed around that time. See 2012 is way bigger than any of the other apocolyptic dates, yes there is alot of stuff being written by nutcases on this subject but there is also alot of intelligent information also alot of my friends who through psychedelics and astral travel accessing their higher selfs have gained info on what is going to happen. They all think there is going to be an ascension of some sort and this is more than one person. who says the world wont implode? This plane of existance is here so that our souls can learn and grow, maybee GOD might have thought that we have come to the end of our learning here on Earth anything is infinatly possible.




Thats pretty much in accordinance with my thinking. I believe theres a rapture which is coming up in 2012, and ive seen some miracles/revelations on things like Salvia which further supports my theories.


"
I have another theory as to why nothing might happen as well. The mayans say that right now the time between 1987 to 2012 is between worlds and its up to us to create the next world which will cross over in 2012 but what we are createing now is exactly the same as what we had in the past so when the time dose come for worlds to cross over were createing something exactly the same so there wont be much change if any at all. I also dunno if tripping on acid would be a good idea during the shift, what happens if we do shift and you get lost that would suck balls i mean eventually you'd end up back at the source but could be fucked up if you ended up in the void for a while lost and confused. 
"

thats very intersting u should say we are creating next era


"
New info:

I'm taking an anthropological religion course at uni right now and my teacher is a scholar of ancient mayan civilization. He is published and can read their "hieroglyphs (sp?)" himself. I think he even speaks some of their language. Basically, he has spent 20 years researching their civilization.

Anyhow, he says that according to all evidence, the mayans made NO predictions for 2012. The only thing they said is that it is the end of the current cycle of four ages, and on the winter solstice of 2012, we will go back to the beginning of a new cycle. That's it.

Seeing as they cycles last thousands of years each, 2012 does seem somewhat significant. However, as far as end of the world predictions go, he summed them up nicely with, "bull shit."

Just thought ya'll might be interested in that.

peace 
"

I agree with that

Check out 2012 discussion on another board:
http://www.planetganja.com/highsociety/showthread.php?t=89602






Drug-Alchemist said:


> I have an inkling of what might happen, but I'm not going to tell you.
> All I say is that this is just a character creation phase. The game will begin when the cosmic clock unwinds itself at 23 of December, at 2012.
> 
> It's the end of the world as we know it, and everyone is invited.



*Claps*


----------



## Ananass

Anyone got MSN windows live messenger?

Me and this guy from another spiritual message board have been talking all week on MSN about 2012.

Join us, just send me ur addy in a PM, we been discussing some never before heard material - since we are both up high on a enlightenment ladder


----------



## Ananass

yea join us on MSN

But the pinnacle of our discussion last week was:

Famous healer/shaman Wanda
http://www.theexorcisms.com/
Is here on earth to help deal with ghosts - people who refuse to ascend after their death

Famous Asutralia mystic Robert Bruce
http://www.astraldynamics.com/
Is here to help us deal with negative spiritual entities

And me
(i have a website but dont want to disclose it yet)
Is here to help with problematic ETs (which we will be seeing come closer 2012)


----------



## GoddessLSD-XTC

McKenna, Pinchbeck (who I never heard of until now), Ram Dass, Carlos Casteneda, Zeitgeist  . . . all false/phony prophets/profits, IMO. Lots more of 'em out there . . . some of their stuff is okay but a lot of it is off-the-wall. Not all propaganda is untrue . . . that's how they suck U in, so when U quote some of these ppl as truth, U totally discredit Urself. Anyone who takes astrology, H.A.R.P., 2012, UFO's, aliens and a bunch of other stuff seriously is totally discredited, IMO.


----------



## twentysix

^why don't you save the world, then?


----------



## GoddessLSD-XTC

I have a better plan 4 saving the world than I've ever seen elsewhere.

The ultimate goal would be to eliminate money, laws & international boundaries. To do this we hafta educate ppl . . . We'd do that with a movie, where 12, gorgeous and/or rich famous ppl (like Al Gore, Britney Spears) & I tell the truth 'bout the situation. (9/11 fraud, CIA Killed JFK, etc.)


----------



## mr_p

^ interesting you mention Ram Das.... didn't he write 'be here now'


----------



## Psychedelic Gleam

GoddessLSD-XTC said:


> McKenna, Pinchbeck (who I never heard of until now), Ram Dass, Carlos Casteneda, Zeitgeist  . . . all false/phony prophets/profits, IMO. Lots more of 'em out there . . . some of their stuff is okay but a lot of it is off-the-wall. Not all propaganda is untrue . . . that's how they suck U in, so when U quote some of these ppl as truth, U totally discredit Urself. Anyone who takes astrology, H.A.R.P., 2012, UFO's, aliens and a bunch of other stuff seriously is totally discredited, IMO.



Lol McKenna would never call himself a "prophet", never told people to take what he has to say as dogmatic truth, he said not to trust him, that he may be full of shit, and that the only thing he can put out there is the subjective experiences he has  had in his life.  For you to call the subjective reality of one individual as "false/phony" shows  you seriously lack the understanding of their content/message to offer a serious critique.  Jung took UFO's seriously, as well as aliens.  Carl Sagan as well.  Many intellectuals and renowned scientists (like Tesla) were involved in fringe "pseudoscience".  Astrology can be a symbolic system of self analysis and a tool for the examination of the world and one's place in it without being a dogmatic tool of consciousness oppression.  You flat out deny the validity of certain individuals/topics without considering that one can engage them on multiple levels providing unique truths (or falsities).  You project your facile perception of reality onto objects that have truly limitless depth due to their positioning within the realm of human interpretation.


----------



## swilow

Ananass said:


> Join us, just send me ur addy in a PM, we been discussing some never before heard material - since we are both up high on a enlightenment ladder



Somehow, I just don't believe you 



			
				Goddess said:
			
		

> McKenna, Pinchbeck (who I never heard of until now), Ram Dass, Carlos Casteneda, Zeitgeist . . . all false/phony prophets/profits



Okay, well seeing as you hadn't heard of Pichbeck, and Zeitgeist isn't a human but a movie, I think your statetment is senseless. Adolf Hitler was also a false prophet, for what its worth. 

Honestly, as an Australian- the whole who killed JFK thing means jack shit- I mean, if your government did it, thats fucked up, but how it has any effect on the world NOW, I cannot figure.....

So you will elminate international boundaries, and make everything legal, using Britney Spears as your spokeperson? Why britney spears I would ask? Is she of the ubermensch variety?

What the fuck is this thread about??? :D:D:D


----------



## GoddessLSD-XTC

Yeah, Ram Das wrote "Be here now" and all the stupid pot-smokers of my day fauned over it.



> Lol McKenna would never call himself a "prophet" . . .



Or, false "profit." Read enough here about Pichbeck to see that he fits the stereotype of a false profit/prophet.

Spears is just an example . . . maybe she can sing one of the songs in the soundtrack.

This Thread is about the lunatic theory of 2012 . . . just thought I'd add some more lunatic theories to the Thread as an example of the genra and BS that befuddles/brainwashes The Masses.


----------



## twentysix

Prophet and Profit are not the same word, and do not imply the same thing, either.

They're not even pronounced the same.


----------



## ControlDenied

fuck that. all words that sound the same (what they called? onamatofucksums? fuckingcoffeedicksins?) are the same for a reason! in my experience, there is no such thing as coincidence! you will be... you will be... (< not joking the slightest). the tranny-goddess is right. listen to Atum!

Anyho. 2012... i used to believe in it when  all i did was sit on the internet lviing at home in the styx...then  itraveled europe for a year and it seems a tad less meaningful. that said, there is a certain beauty and intrigue in believing in global concepts like apocalypse, holy wars, etc. but they are concepts - in essence, empty, meaningless. people have been crying wolf since christianity invented evil. 

global societal collapse, on the other hand? you know you want it. the only way to "fix the economy" is to break it. the only way to fix the problem of authoritative corruption is to let the leeches fall off. it will happen. you must believe... there is no other hope for humanity except oneness... every man to himself... then everyone finds themselves, links together, la la la, heavenly music ensues...


----------



## Psychedelic Gleam

GoddessLSD-XTC said:


> Yeah, Ram Das wrote "Be here now" and all the stupid pot-smokers of my day fauned over it.
> 
> 
> 
> Or, false "profit." Read enough here about Pichbeck to see that he fits the stereotype of a false profit/prophet.
> 
> Spears is just an example . . . maybe she can sing one of the songs in the soundtrack.
> 
> This Thread is about the lunatic theory of 2012 . . . just thought I'd add some more lunatic theories to the Thread as an example of the genra and BS that befuddles/brainwashes The Masses.



Its obvious that your gripe is not with the content of these individuals (which judging from your opinions you have a incredibly limited grasp of the content) but rather the popular consensus and subjective experiences and beliefs which surround many of these individuals and information.  You seem to think that they had some sort of "profit" motivation, which is pure projection and arrogance on your part.


----------



## GoddessLSD-XTC

If profit isn't their motive, they're deluded. When U've been around & experienced enough BS, deluded ppl, con-men, false-prophets, etc., U can spot 'em is a few minuites, one sentence or by the look in their eye.


----------



## twentysix

ControlDenied said:


> fuck that. all words that sound the same (what they called? onamatofucksums? fuckingcoffeedicksins?) are the same for a reason! in my experience, there is no such thing as coincidence! you will be... you will be... (< not joking the slightest). the tranny-goddess is right. listen to Atum!



What are you not joking about?

Words that sound the same (but don't on the surface imply the same meaning) are called homophones, and I have some experience with them, and asking myself how these sounds "feel" to me... and finding them in words, and names. I just listened to the names of places, and they made sense, like "signs". It felt kinetic, almost like a conversation with the universe/myself.

I don't really believe there exists "coincidence" unless I break the word down into a simplified form for my understanding. Co is used with many words such as habitat (with an e added), to imply that "more than one" shares a certain habitat. Incidence/Incident, well.. it means "something happens". Many things happen at the same time, or else nothing would exist. So, you are wrong, there IS such a thing as coincidence, and it seems the universe is made of it... It all depends on how you want to read it, or how much you read into.. . Depending on how many relative connections you make, it might be called "synchronicity" or "harmonic resonance".



I'm not one to say "oh it's _just_ coincidence".


----------



## ControlDenied

Yeh that's what I meant. Don't worry we agree hehe. It's good to have an "etymological" view of the world.


----------



## Xorkoth

Ananass said:


> Join us, just send me ur addy in a PM, we been discussing some never before heard material - since we are both up high on a enlightenment ladder



This statement reeks of ego.


----------



## ControlDenied

lol yeh. high up on the enlightenment ladder... not quite as high as a worm or an ant, still...

Pinchbeck is an annoying eggface.


----------



## Pink1966Floyd

Mckenna and his brother dennis, ie the invisible landscape, ie the i ching.  read it know it learn it!


----------



## Cyrus

Everyone seems to have their own view of 2012 to some extent, mine, is that some sort of live genetic mutation will occur in our mitochondria causing overloads of energy in reaction to the poles switching, and then, we all grow wings and gain odd powers of nature like the ability to shoot lightning bolts out of our ass or breathe fire from enormous geyser-like pores in our back.... like pokemon.


----------



## ControlDenied

sounds plausible. im up for it.


----------



## MCMG

Just because the Mayan calender ends there, doesn't mean shit. The calender has to end eventually, and just because it ends (which it has to) people think that's when the world is going to end, its a really stupid theory.


----------



## Roger&Me

^Yah I've never understood it. What do the _mayans_, of all people, know about the end of the world? All they did was grow corn n' shit.


----------



## mr_p

^ I've got a friend who is on a journey around the world; connecting with the ancient wisdom held by some of the remaining indigenous peoples, the teachings that we have mostly forgotten about in our fast-paced world ... 

anyway, he has actually connected with some of the last Mayan tribes who hold the knowledge and from what he's told me, they didn't _just_ grow corn 'n' shit ...

we've got a lot to learn from the indigenous peoples of this Earth ~


----------



## Psychedelic Gleam

MCMG said:


> Just because the Mayan calender ends there, doesn't mean shit. The calender has to end eventually, and just because it ends (which it has to) people think that's when the world is going to end, its a really stupid theory.



The mayan calender is cyclical, the long count is coming to a close (the largest cycle of many in their system),  the calendar is not ending, its just completing its largest cycle.  Most 2012'ers don't think the world is going to end, just that some sort of "shift" is going to happen, though I don't really grasp the mechanisms or logic behind such a shift.

And they didn't "just grow corn" they had one of the more advanced empires in the world at the time, with the (by far) largest cities in the world with higher concentration than the most populated european cities.   They also had relatively advanced technologies for the day and age, and knew plenty about astronomical movements.


----------



## Roger&Me

mr_p said:


> ^ I've got a friend who is on a journey around the world; connecting with the ancient wisdom held by some of the remaining indigenous peoples, the teachings that we have mostly forgotten about in our fast-paced world ...
> 
> anyway, he has actually connected with some of the last Mayan tribes who hold the knowledge and from what he's told me, they didn't _just_ grow corn 'n' shit ...
> 
> we've got a lot to learn from the indigenous peoples of this Earth ~



I actually really do agree with you; I was just joking (although I can see how it didn't come across in tone, this being the internet and all).

I still don't think it means much, 2012 seems like as good a time to end your calendar as any other date. It can't just go on forever..

And actually the mayans were really smart about corn, they were the first to mix it with lime in order to break down the undigestible cellulose in order to make it nutritive. So really, they should be proud about growing corn n' shit!


----------



## Xorkoth

Well like someone said above, the Mayan calendar is cyclical.  It is made up of interconnecting cycles, and the largest of these cycles is ending in 2012.  I agree that this doesn't have to mean some sort of catastrophe, or even anything.

So anyway, my point is that the mayan calendar DOES go on forever, and endlessly repeats the cycles it maps.  It's starting back at the "beginning" in a few years (if a cycle can be said to have a beginning).


----------



## swilow

mr_p said:


> anyway, he has actually connected with some of the last Mayan tribes who hold the knowledge and from what he's told me, they didn't _just_ grow corn 'n' shit ...
> 
> we've got a lot to learn from the indigenous peoples of this Earth ~



Interesting, seeing as the Mayans are extinct. Its just some vague ancestral/genetic bonds and language that ties modern "Mayans" with the people that created the calendar we are referring to.

But your last sentence is damn correct.


----------



## Psychonautical

I think that there should be a meeting of the world leaders.
Where we send the best and brightest to the amazon the Afternoon of December 21 2012
and make 500 of these worlds "best" people take ayahuasca and pray to god they save the world from ending.


----------



## swilow

^Who decides whos the best? Because humans voted George Bush in- twice- so I don't think they are reliable.


----------



## Psychedelic Gleam

Psychonautical said:


> I think that there should be a meeting of the world leaders.
> Where we send the best and brightest to the amazon the Afternoon of December 21 2012
> and make 500 of these worlds "best" people take ayahuasca and pray to god they save the world from ending.



I imagine 95 percent of the best and brightest wouldn't be praying to any god, on ayahuasca or off.  I also think that looking to a deity to save mankind from doom is childish and absurd.


----------



## TheAppleCore

^ lol, I was convinced that Psychonautical was joking - I could be wrong, however...


----------



## tribalDJ

2012 is supposed to be one of the peak times for solar flares (which come in 12 year cycles I believe), and a strong enough solar flare could knock out satellites, power, ect which would be pretty devastating  as we rely on them so heavily these days. It is hard to predict the strength of these flares, and the strongest recorded were 150 years ago, but scientists agree that there may be some very serious ones in the next decades. Something to think about


----------



## twentysix

^yea, I've heard we're due for a flare of great magnitude shortly. They happen once every so many years.. but this will be the first time we've been so dependent on electronic systems and tech. Supposedly we're past due, actually, if I remember my source right (it's been awhile).


----------



## ct-boi

I'm pritty sure i read back in 2006ish that another world war was going to start in 2008... So much for that eh? Bullshit if you ask me, just my opinion though.


----------



## RhythmSpring

swilow said:


> Interesting, seeing as the Mayans are extinct. Its just some vague ancestral/genetic bonds and language that ties modern "Mayans" with the people that created the calendar we are referring to.
> 
> But your last sentence is damn correct.



Excuse me, but the Mayans are NOT extinct. I've spoken to several myself... they kind of giggled at me and called me a woman...

The temple ruins were abandoned, but that doesn't mean they all died off... Perhaps the temples were a big civilizational project that was completed and done with.


----------



## twentysix

ct-boi said:


> I'm pritty sure i read back in 2006ish that another world war was going to start in 2008... So much for that eh? Bullshit if you ask me, just my opinion though.



bull(shit is good fertilizer).


----------



## Shaman Koz

I think that by the way people have been acting, society is getting worse. I don't see the future any brighter for ours, all I see is it going down hill like a snowball down a mountain. Honestly I don't know if 2012 is going to be the end all, but we are seriously coming close to it.


----------



## swilow

RhythmSpring said:


> Excuse me, but the Mayans are NOT extinct. I've spoken to several myself... they kind of giggled at me and called me a woman...
> 
> The temple ruins were abandoned, but that doesn't mean they all died off... Perhaps the temples were a big civilizational project that was completed and done with.



Yeah, but the Mayans you'd be referring to are not the same group, culturally at least, that created the marvels of pre-colombus Sth America. That particualr group are the ones who invented calendars, etc. They are probably genetically related to the Mayans of yore, but to consider them as "Actual Mayans" is like considering the tiger to also be a sabre-toothed tiger; which it clearly is not. 

Sure, they survived, but their culture was not intact, and their cultural memory is innacurate (modern mayans).


----------



## hypnotiq88

I only read through the first few pages, so sorry if it's been posted by then.
But, I have two thoughts on this.
Either nothing will happen, seeing as how it's just the end of a cycle. Life will continue as usual, once all the doomsayers get it out of their system.
Or it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy.


----------



## XperiencedMe2

http://caycesprophecies.com/


----------



## Max Power

swilow said:


> Honestly, as an Australian- the whole who killed JFK thing means jack shit- I mean, if your government did it, thats fucked up, but how it has any effect on the world NOW, I cannot figure.....
> 
> So you will elminate international boundaries, and make everything legal, using Britney Spears as your spokeperson? Why britney spears I would ask? Is she of the ubermensch variety?
> 
> What the fuck is this thread about??? :D:D:D



you crack me up. :D


----------



## Geeno

Some prophets have envisioned my car biting the dust in 2012.

Which would bring about the end of humanity.


----------



## tittysnacks74

I can't take the 2012 theories seriously because there are as many doomsday theories as there are advocates. Every one thinks something entirely unique is going to happen, and there is absolutely no unifying hypothesis whatsoever.

I personally think that the people spouting off about 2012 are the same who worried about Y2K, and the same who will find yet another imminent apocalypse prophecy to subscribe to when nothing happens in 2012. It's just another incarnation of doomsday enthusiasm. Every generation has expected theirs' to be the last.


----------



## robhr

..._they're coming_...


----------



## Fjones

Why do people think somethign bad is going to happen in 2012?


----------



## Max Power

Fjones said:


> Why do people think somethign bad is going to happen in 2012?



Not something bad, necessarily. Just something big . . . or rather, noteworthy?


----------



## XperiencedMe2

Search Nibiru aka planet X by nsa


----------



## ControlDenied

i reaaaally hope something does happen


----------



## twentysix

_editing_


----------



## ResinTeeth

^ that's cool. The number 9 is a recurring enigma in my life but I don't really look into it much.


----------



## twentysix

^Thanks! The 9th prime number is 23.


----------



## f13nd

An ending to things might not mean the end of humanity, just an end to an aspect of something, which leaves room for change and the growth of something new.

Also I think it has something to do with the suns alignment in our solar system and sagittarius constellation problem.

Age of aquarius. beware.  a air sign that bears water followed by an earth sign that is a goat with a fish tail...
Seems like going backwards in term of evolution.  back to the sea 

to quote the lovely maynard james keenan
_Some say a comet will fall from the sky.
Followed by meteor showers and tidal waves.
Followed by faultlines that cannot sit still.
Followed by millions of dumbfounded dipshits.

Some say the end is near.
Some say we'll see armageddon soon.
I certainly hope we will cuz
I sure could use a vacation from this

Silly shit, stupid shit...

One great big festering neon distraction,
I've a suggestion to keep you all occupied.

Learn to swim. _

Theres lotsa info on the history channel about this stuff.
Its interesting because it coincides with both the entire "revelation 13" in christianity kinda.
One from the sea, one from the ground, an antichrist and a false prophet!!!
2000 years for the beast to return will be up 

And the mayans prediction

and the egyptians hieroglyphics have some hints..


Ok time to watch zeitgeist again


----------



## ControlDenied

lol history channel. fucking psycho puritan americans creating a new armageddon for their own entertainment,


----------



## f13nd

umm...well..aside from discussing actualy ancient recorded history and texts and INTERPRETATIONS of some vague messages (they never claim any interpretation as true, just as one of the possible ways this could have been portrayed)....they talked about astronomy and physics....thats not exactly making up an armageddon.

Not a big fan of american culture in general, but I think you're being a bit harsh on one of the *more objective sources of information than most other television shows.



*I am not claiming anything to be absolute.  I just appreciate shows that shed light upon some FACTS that I may not have thought of looking into.


----------



## midimightyclog

*failure to pay*

if your entering 4th dimention, basically we've failed to pay for what weve used.  ie. e=mcc == ''FIBRESURE EFFICIENCY; PROFESSOR REEGUN/RONNIE RAYGUN''. etc etc etc... dont expect many psycologists or lacutas of borg though...

ps. theres a good song called ''4th dimentional transit'' on web just now (''recompiled'' for mp3 and its in ''english'') with stuff about cyrons and the rest of the ''meteor feild'' out in 4d space who pruportedly you should goto meet for ''sex'' and 'reintegration''....? wouldnt float my boat? personally i wouldnt hold your breath though.. not my cup of tea..  the wacky backy brigade? 2d spaces? npcompleteness, ETC ETC, isnt beyond our understanding if you put your mind to it?

MARS....... kruder & dorfmeister........ goes to church smoking more whacky backy and having free love..... twiddling?

ps. its a ''rubix cube'' == fibresure, a glass of water a day....... you were intel atom.. eee pc..


----------



## midimightyclog

eee pc - popular ''also'' with the lassies john..... but i never saw any of them read a book or look for fibesure in safeway? what about ''our food'' Lexx- you can still make that right?



midimightyclog said:


> if your entering 4th dimention, basically we've failed to pay for what weve used.  ie. e=mcc == ''FIBRESURE EFFICIENCY; PROFESSOR REEGUN/RONNIE RAYGUN''. etc etc etc... dont expect many psycologists or lacutas of borg though...
> 
> ps. theres a good song called ''4th dimentional transit'' on web just now (''recompiled'' for mp3 and its in ''english'') with stuff about cyrons and the rest of the ''meteor feild'' out in 4d space who pruportedly you should goto meet for ''sex'' and 'reintegration''....? wouldnt float my boat? personally i wouldnt hold your breath though.. not my cup of tea..  the wacky backy brigade? 2d spaces? npcompleteness, ETC ETC, isnt beyond our understanding if you put your mind to it?
> 
> MARS....... kruder & dorfmeister........ goes to church smoking more whacky backy and having free love..... twiddling?
> 
> ps. its a ''rubix cube'' == fibresure, a glass of water a day....... you were intel atom.. eee pc..


----------



## qwe

> A 2D space doesn't have this problem, you're on a plane, but now you generate other problems. Consider our digestive system (or even worse, our circulatory system). Its a long "tube" though us. Thats okay, because its enclosed within our bodies. What about a long tube through a 2D object, it would split the object in half. Hence you can't get objects with overly complicated makeups because they'd fall apart. Not to mention the whole problem about disipation of radiation in only 2D being too "slow".


ive thought a little about this before

a 2D life form could EASILY have a digestive hole.  different materials would make up this 2D world, and some would allow certain materials to pass through them while others wouldn't (this scenario for the universe would be necessary for digestive holes).  this way, the digestive hole would be made of a material that A) sticks to the rest of the organism and B) allows digestable contents in as well

if that didn't make sense, here's it reworded

i mean, the hole through us is mostly fluid, not much air
even if there was a pathway of air from our mouth to anus, AIR is a substance itself!
so in the 2d word, the air or fluid in the digestive tract would have "sticky sides" so that the organism doesnt fall apart in two

however, who says 2 dimensional beings are going to have a digestive hole in the first place?  they might be self sustaining patterns of some sort, made of a composition we can't even imagine...


----------



## Changed

once this thread gets to 12 pages, the world will implode.


----------



## karruters

new stage of evolution? 4th dimension? 

neo-hippy clap trap!

garbage!


----------



## BiG StroOnZ

Just skimmed through this thread; too much nonsense and disinformation in here.

2012 is simply a date that signifies nothing more than moving from one Astrological Age into another. We will be physically moving into the next Sign of the Zodiac, and because the calendar runs backwards through the Zodiac (Precession of the Equinoxes), this will be the *last* sign left.

For instance, right now we're in the Age of Pisces. Before that we were in the Age of Aries. 2012, marks the beginning of the Age of Aquarius; although some say the shift began in the year 2000 (Where other skeptics say even later than 2012).

Now, because the Bible is a book based mostly off of Astro-Theology, I can use an excerpt for example. 

*Luke 22:9-11*

_Jesus says, "As you enter the city, *a man carrying a jar of water* will meet you. Follow him into the house that he enters..."_

And follow him we will into this house. The house he speaks of though, is the sign of Aquarius. They are the houses of the Zodiac.

In history, men aren't known for bearing the the pitcher of water or fetching water. This was typically a woman's job. Therefore a man carrying a pitcher of water is very symbolic and represents a great change or shift.

This is also said to be the "Age of Revealing." Where many things that have remained in the shadows, will finally surface and come to light. 

As far as an evolution taking place, it will more than likely be a conscious evolution. No different than the mental polar shift that took place after 9/11. What will be the event that will cause such a polar shift in 2012 or before? Who knows? Will there need to be one exact event or any event at all? Probably not because the Astrological shift alone will be more than powerful enough to cause such changes.

All you need to know, is we're going from the Age of Pisces (aka. The Age of Jesus) to the Age of Aquarius (The Age of the Water Bearer)

Mythologically speaking, The Water Bearer is said to put out the "fire" as depicted here:


----------



## nearjat

BiG StroOnZ said:


> Therefore a man carrying a pitcher of water is very symbolic and represents a great change or shift.
> 
> This is also said to be the "Age of Revealing." Where many things that have remained in the shadows, will finally surface and come to light.



I've heard idea proposed that the 2012 "event" is the equivalent to Armageddon in a way because this "revealing" or consciousness shift will not be accepted by some people. It added that egocentric individuals will clash with this shift, which may or may not include expanded consciousness , and that unselfish, more aware people will embrace this change. In my head I immediately remembered the teachings of the apocalypse from when I still went to church with my parents. It sounded a lot like the story of Jesus coming back and the good people ascending to a higher state/ heaven and the sinners/bad guys will be in great peril. 

It's a fun idea to entertain and makes me draw all kinds of connections from various cultures and stuff, but it's pretty outlandish to just accept without evidence.


----------



## BiG StroOnZ

The problem with people making these claims saying, "it's going to be an Apocalypse." Is what they don't know is that this word derives from the Greek, "To Reveal"

People always want to turn something that is supposed to be a positive outcome into something negative. I see what your proposed theory (or the other peoples rather) says, that not everybody will accept the change but the point is that it's not necessarily something that they will or won't accept. The alignment of the stars, astrologically placing us in a new location, or what I said before. Moving into a New Age, will shift consciousness automatically. 

As far as the idea of Jesus coming back, well I'm sure now you're much more educated and realize that if Jesus were to come back. Then so is Batman, Superman, The Incredible Hulk,  and Ironman. Jesus, along with all his Super Hero pals, are going to jump out of the books and save the day... 8)


----------



## PriestTheyCalledHim

ControlDenied said:


> lol history channel. fucking psycho puritan americans creating a new armageddon for their own entertainment,



Heh I saw the History channel documentary that you wrote about and there was some european guy going on and on about how in 2012 the entire world except for a few very remote spots is going to be submerged in water and massive tidal waves are going to be made and we're all gonna die!1!

Then the one surviving McKenna brother went on and talked about how of course it's going to be the end of the world because the I-Ching and he and his brother's theory said so when they took way too much DMT in the Amazon without any respect for how Yage/DMT are used by native peoples. 8)

Then they put on some half baked conspiracy theory about a program called web bot or something that supposedly predicted 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina.

Despite all of these theories that do not make an ounce of sense and all conflict each other people have predicted the end of the world many times in the history of humanity and they have never been correct.


----------



## lostNfound

As far as I can tell from the readings I have done, my understanding is that 2012 is meant to be a time when there is expected to be a shift in global consciousness somehow.

This end of the world stuff is hocus pocus.

Then you've got your planet x (nibiru) theorists...........

Who's right, Who's wrong?

Time will tell.


----------



## PriestTheyCalledHim

lostNfound said:


> As far as I can tell from the readings I have done, my understanding is that 2012 is meant to be a time when there is expected to be a shift in global consciousness somehow.



Hmmm so will it sort of be like when the internet first went mainstream eh?

That certainly was a huge shift in global consciousness/human communication.

Granted yeah the internet was around in the 70s and 80s as I remember using what would now be a very slow modem and a basic terminal program to chat with a friend who had another phone line and this was back when people would use a BBS mainly.

Anyway, the internet/text or IM chat was a huge shift in global consciousness as it's changed how people communicate.

While I'm young I still am not that big into texting.

Just curious what have you read that's not based on the crackpot theories that I wrote about? What's Planet X? I thought that was what Pluto was once called before it was classified as a planet and now it  one? Or that the term was used to describe one small planet that's close to Pluto?


----------



## lostNfound

The evolving of mass communication by means of the internet was change, but not what I meant.

Many people are out of touch; with themselves and the world around them.
I would to see a sense of connectedness between all humanity and the natural world we live in.

No, I'm not a bong smoking hippy. I am a realist, I won't go into all that.

PTCH - You asked of Nibiru.

I found many things about planet x after reading some of zechariah sitchins work; now that guy is a crackpot, sure he has a few interesting ideas but that's all they are. 
I haven't found much information that seems to be factual at all tbh.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nibiru_collision

I'm just interested in this whole subject matter but have found no conclusive evidence anywhere.

Most people that are well read in this field or any authors or researchers have their own agendas, read from everyone and draw your own conclusions.

Like I said, time will tell.

I personally do not think anything will happen on a massive scale that we will see. Again, maybe nothing at all will happen like Y2K. Different comparisons there though, 2012 has been a date of interest longer than Y2K was.


----------



## malakaix

I havn't read through this entire thread, so what i say next may be benign to whats already said. My apologies if this is the case..

But as far as i can tell (and i haven't read much into this.. as i try not to concern myself with theories) is that the time and date marked on 2012 is the exact point where the December solstice sun aligns with the equator of our galaxy, which is the result of the procession of equinox's (aka Galactic Alignment) Occuring once every 26,000 years which is roughly the time between astrological 'ages'.

From this people have made there own conclusions as to what will result, end of world.. opening of global awareness/spirituality.

Only time will tell


----------



## swilow

I truly beleve 2012 will occur.

In about, or roughly less then, 2 years from now.

Thats a fact, that is. 

:D


----------



## rollin_stoned

Um, what about the different time zones people? Isn't Austrailia practically a day ahead? So does that mean the end of the world will start in Austrailia, and while people are dying and suffering over there us folks in the U.S. will be perfectly fine until our time zones cross over into December 21, 2012? I don't believe any of this mumbo jumbo, but if it is true at least I won't be the only one who has to live through the end of the world.

Someone said that the galactic alignment would be a beautiful sight, what on earth would it look like?


----------



## karruters

me and all the other lightworkers are going to bring this place into oblivion!


----------



## B9

Changed said:


> once this thread gets to 12 pages, the world will implode.



I'm quoting this merely to see if it brings it on.


----------



## B9

Damn! I need more posts


----------



## Sykoknot

karruters said:


> me and all the other lightworkers are going to bring this place into oblivion!



You show signs of strong delusion and possibly psychosis. I'd lay of them psychs buddy.


----------



## karruters

Sykoknot said:


> You show signs of strong delusion and possibly psychosis. I'd lay of them psychs buddy.



2012 is something we must create for ourselves.


----------



## B9

this thread is doomed to remain forever on page eleven!


----------



## PriestTheyCalledHim

lostNfound said:


> The evolving of mass communication by means of the internet was change, but not what I meant.
> 
> Many people are out of touch; with themselves and the world around them.
> I would to see a sense of connectedness between all humanity and the natural world we live in.
> 
> No, I'm not a bong smoking hippy. I am a realist, I won't go into all that.
> 
> PTCH - You asked of Nibiru.
> 
> I found many things about planet x after reading some of zechariah sitchins work; now that guy is a crackpot, sure he has a few interesting ideas but that's all they are.
> I haven't found much information that seems to be factual at all tbh.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nibiru_collision
> 
> I'm just interested in this whole subject matter but have found no conclusive evidence anywhere.
> 
> Most people that are well read in this field or any authors or researchers have their own agendas, read from everyone and draw your own conclusions.
> 
> Like I said, time will tell.
> 
> I personally do not think anything will happen on a massive scale that we will see. Again, maybe nothing at all will happen like Y2K. Different comparisons there though, 2012 has been a date of interest longer than Y2K was.



Hahaha I remember the planet X/Nibru theory lady! How she said that the Hale Bopp comet was somehow magically not a comet at all even though science had shown that it is.

Or how in 2002 or 2003 she said how planet X would zoom by Earth and the Earth's poles would reverse and the Earth would stop spinning on its Axis for about 5 days.

What a loon!

I remember the band Tool making fun of those theories then with their website saying how they were in an underground shelter since it was going to be the end of the world.

I take theories like that and the end of the world at 2012 like the history channel documentary said how we'll have another ice age and the sun will be completely blocked out from the sky because of clouds or something all with a grain of salt.

Before the Y2K thing my dad's friend was totally convinced that everything would fail and he really did buy a shotgun and said how we'd have race riots and anarchy and it was the end of civilization and the world all because some guy predicted that it was going to happen.

Or how a friend of mine thought that the peak oil theory that some scientist from Princeton had theorized really would happen in fall of 2005 and how all of the oil would disappear from the earth by then and how this was all true even though it was a theory just because a scientist from Princeton university said how it might happen then.

Anyway people have been predicting the end of the world for centuries ever since human existence has started and they've always been wrong.


----------



## Sykoknot

Its only a matter of time before someone causes the leap, and maybe I am just posting this to be that person, so what? haha


----------



## B9

bad luck - but credit for being brave enough to try


----------



## Sykoknot

good job B9, you are the death of us allll D:


----------



## B9

Ah man how odd I believed it was on eleven when i looked at the post - I'm paradoxed to fuck now - need more drugs to cope with the uncertainty principle it wasn't me - now it seems it is - I thought it was you now it seems it wasn't !


----------



## Sykoknot

Just ingest some psychoactives, and all will be right


----------



## B9

Can't too much psychs & lack of sleep over the past few days - lightweight opiates probably then zzzz and to bed I hope


----------



## Sykoknot

Glad im not in your shoes, personally, id be in a nice psychosis by now haha


----------



## B9

nice psychosis fled long ago because nasty psychosis scared it away - now I have no fun with psychosis !


----------



## Sykoknot

I was being sarcastic  i went through a month long psychosis due to LSD and excessive herbage. Scariest shit of my life.


----------



## B9

I can relate - for me stimulant psychosis was indescribably awful so much so - and I've done it more than once why i cannot fathom


----------



## Sykoknot

Anytime i get very stoned, i fall into a mild psychosis, and I too keep inducing this onto myself for reasons i do not know. Opiates are all I can do anymore without losing my mind haha


----------



## B9

Hn nah i can do some stuff without going loop but i'm less mentally secure than previously - however it's all relative to intake etc & other activities for me it is anyway.


----------



## Sykoknot

True, there are many variables. 

Hah sorry to people discussing 2012, kinda derailed your thread.


----------



## B9

i see no derailment - there was never a train - was there ?

Ghost train maybe


----------



## Sykoknot

Maybe a train ready for departure but discouraged do to traffic? Heh.


----------



## B9

The points need to be synchronised - i suspect that's what the hold up is being caused by - what's the intended destination ? there seems little consensus from the people i've talked to


----------



## Sykoknot

You lost me. My bad


----------



## B9

No worries like nearly everything written in this forum it is of little real importance - hopefully no one feels insulted by that statement.

Actually a question - has anyone learnt anything in here that has actually made a positive long term improvement to their lives ?


----------



## Sykoknot

Well by its very nature as an online discussion board, with limited number of members personally knowing each other, dismisses any personal importance. Though I've known a handful of users that use bluelight as a support group of sorts, which could be deamed as important, personally. I suppose such instances would be classified as "nearly" in your terms.


----------



## B9

i OUGHT TO HAVE QUALIFIED THAT - I MEANT THAT THING DESIGNATED REAL LIFE - AS IN SEEN THE SPIRITUAL/PHILOSOPHICAL LIGHT & CREATED THE THEORY INTO A WORKING MODEL WHICH HAS BEEN A SUCCESS.

Bloody caps - sorry


----------



## Sykoknot

As for long term improvement caused by this very site...cant say i have.
 That'd be a good thread starter, possibly.


----------



## B9

Yeah perhaps - but i'd like to make an effort if it was my thread and i'm tired but can't sleep so it can wait or someone else can do it. it does raise a valid ppoint about effectiveness what is it & how we apply it etc


----------



## Sykoknot

True, especially the original basis of this site being to increase safety and awareness among drug users. If you look at it from the standpoint that someone decided not to do a drug(or combination) that could have harmed them because of info on this site, than it has probably made a large difference in many peoples lives. EDIT: Including Mine.


----------



## B9

oh yeah the site for sure does - i was referring to this part of it really - there's also little doubt that HR can be a double edged sword - however i do believe it's better to have info than not to  -despite the fact that some people further their drug taking exploits with that info which they otherwise may not have had access to.


----------



## Sykoknot

The P&S forum?

True, its not the info, but how you use it.


----------



## B9

yeah i think so as well - nice chatting with you goonight & take care


----------



## CosmicDream

*Last Call for Evolution!*

_*Last Call for Evolution! (All Sentient Souls Report for Duty)*_


Brothers & Sisters, fellow beings of light..., Souls of Timeless Beauty & Infinite Love...

You are here to receive a message that has come through Spirit & The Embodiment of the Planetary Consciousness, the Great Mother Gaia. 

It is perhaps easy to forget that time is continuing to proceed in a linear fashion when one is enjoying busy enjoying the frivolous luxuries and comforts provided by the current soul-binding manifestations of the collective dream, often referred to as "The Great Machine", "The Matrix",  "Babylon" or the "The Prison of Souls".

As we move closer and closer to the year 2012, we are rapidly nearing the completion of the 26,000 year Precession of the Equinoxes cycle, demonstrated within the mayan calender & other correlating cultural & astrological Sign Posts. This will be the catalyst for a global transformation of a scale so grand that it can not be known by any one piece of this life. 

Many of the establishments responsible for the mass programming that has been instilled into the collective consciousness which hold this out-dated paradigm in place have tried to convince the masses that we are soon approaching the end of all ages, or perhaps even more frightening - The end of the Universe itself!

This is a distortion of the truth designed to propagate mass fear and keep souls from taking responsibility for their own evolution. Let this serve as a wake up call for all Illuminated souls that have temporarily forgotten their purpose and strayed away from their true nature. 

Let us all remember why we incarnated on this planet, let us remember why we chose to be here at this particular point in time. We all have an extremely critical role to play in the evolution of our species. It is only a matter of years before the great transformation is to occur, and those who are paying attention can already see the changes happening all around them with increasing acceleration.

The current paradigm-of-mind has been inflicted by tremendous disease, and as a result the greater majority of our species has become a toxic influence on our environment. Much like a virus that multiplies and proceeds to infect and destroy more and more of it's host. We have become parasites within the constitution of the planetary entity, Mother Gaia.

No longer can we afford to allow ourselves to feed into the old Dream of humanity that has so ruthlessly degraded and disrespected the Sacred life-force. We have poisoned our water and our air, we have turned our forests into concrete, our roads are chains around the Great Mother that bind her....

But not for much longer! The Planet will heal itself, like any organism that is afflicted with a Toxin, there will  be a  natural cleansing process. All of these things will be taken away... and they are so very temporary in the grand scheme of things - such is the law of nature, the law of impermanence. Our civilization is just a spec of time within the much grander life-span of Mother Gaia.

Those of us who are not in harmony with the natural vibration of the Earth will no longer have a residence on this planet much longer. This is the Eviction notice. This is the No-Nonsense Warning, that _*we must choose to collectively clean up our mess and learn to play nice with the other species, or we will be forced to go home, back to where-ever-it-is we came from....*_ 

For those of you that are interested in continuing the evolution of our species so that we may further experience the ecstatic joy of being alive, this means it is time to get your act together! Now is the time to embrace the earth as our mother and re-establish our connection with the earth as a living being - we must remember how to live harmoniously with life, as all life is sacred. We must take the responsibility for our own destiny as we consciously create our future together. We must corporate with one another and learn to simplify our lives, letting go of all that which is no longer needed...

We must remember our true nature as Divine Beings of Light. We must constantly fight to see beyond the veils of illusion, That great fog that hides our radiant splendor from ourselves must be transcended so that we may always see clearly! Through the power & Grace of Spirit, through the Love of all we may unify our being and receive the necessary strength required to overcome any obstacle that is presented before us.

 It is so very easy to get dragged down into the collective dream of Babylon when one is so intensively ingrained in it, so utterly reliant on it... when one has been so thoroughly programmed - The only way to overcome this is to disconnect yourself from the system, we must wake up from the dream! We must dream our own dream, The Old Mind no longer serves us - so let it die!

Allow yourself to expand beyond these narrow minded conceptions that dominate the society! Money, Comfort, Greed, Instant-Gratification, Endless cycles of Consumerism, Sexual & Emotional Repression, Vicarious Living, Soul-Numbing-Chemicals, Prisons, All forms of Over-Stimulated Sensory Masturbation, Neuro-Toxic Water & Fake Food, 9-5 Jobs, Atomic Bombs! None of these things are needed, these are some of the many mechanisms through which the society keeps us enslaved in their corrupted dream. All of these things must be transcended!* If you don't play the game - then the rules will no longer apply.*

The time for healing is now. We must first heal ourselves, then we must help to heal each other, and only then we may aid the planet in it's healing. Perhaps then we can unlock the infinite potential hidden deep within the confines of our latent DNA, perhaps then we can reclaim our divine birth right as we live in absolute harmony with all. Each and every one of us have extrodinary gifts to share with the world, they must simply be given the space to be revealed!

Thank you for allowing yourself to be receptive to this transmission as filtered through the perception of this particular Ego.

Much Love to all,

Many blessings to all.

*In Lak'Ech, I am another yourself.*


----------



## Sega420

there's no way anyone is going to read all if any of that.


----------



## Portillo

I didnt get it.


----------



## Raw Evil

Sega420 said:


> there's no way anyone is going to read all if any of that.



Not all of us have such short attention spans. I found it to be a fantastic read.

@OP: Right on, brother. The day will soon come when we truly live as we should - as one.


----------



## safety

I couldn't read past "2012"


----------



## capstone

Put me down as ready for a planetary consciousness paradigm shift!!

But, I think its more that if people don't learn from their same mistakes, and quit repeating them, we'll be forced to do all this again in the next cycle. If humanity can regain their innate infinite wisdom though, we'll be able to avoid destruction and cataclysmic change, to take our next dimensional step in evolution. FINALLY!! 

There is no doubt our race on this planet is facing an important choice. The choice: is humanity going to be a service-to-self race, learning nothing, and repeating the same failures, or a service-to-others race, transcending this world of hate and death.

Finally, PROPS dude, that was very well said, even if I don't agree with it all. But that's no reason to dismiss your overall kickass point.


----------



## swilow

Time to usher in the reign of TeddyBearShaman-


----------



## Unbreakable

I think he is talking about entering the  5th dimension ... which is suppose to happen on Dec. 21 2012.....


----------



## PaulyPointz

I can dig it, bro. Gaia's homeostatic response if you will. Talked to a guy in group therapy today who grew up in the woods of W. Virginia. He grew up there in the late 40's in a house with no electricity or running water. He'd have to fetch a pail of water every morning from the fresh spring behind the house. He seemed to have a more present soul, he seemed to be more real, less empty and distracted/bound by the trappings of first world souldead materialism, in spite of being in need of 'group therapy'. Next time meta-evolution will select for a species with more brain-power but no opposable appediges. I see dolphins making a big comeback in 2012. Dolphins: the next big thing.


----------



## capstone

PaulyPointz said:


> I see dolphins making a big comeback in 2012. Dolphins: the next big thing.



Indeed, but don't forget whales, they're both very wise animals.


----------



## swilow

^No, its all up to TeddyBearShaman. Worship him.

Dominus Flevit...


----------



## B9

swilow said:


> Time to usher in the reign of TeddyBearShaman-




Reminds me of a still from the "the secret life of toys" a cartoon/puppetry thing I used to watch when my kids were little.


----------



## swilow

^You still watch it, B9, I know these things.

Anyway, until we all grovel at TeddyBearShaman's feet, we are doomed. Hail TBS!!! (his name JUST became too holy to utter)...


----------



## DOB

the end is close


----------



## MyDoorsAreOpen

Merging this with the 2012 thread


----------



## Taryth

I'm quite certain that the reason governments, and leaders or figures of power in general, keep knowledge from the public is made evident in this thread.

Explain bits of science (or, tell them a doomsday prophesy of an extinct society in this case) to the average person, and suddenly they tell you that, by their calculations, the world will end in approximately 25 days.  



I have generally found people to be excitable idiots.


----------



## capstone

*Jesse Ventura Conspiracy Theory - 2012*

Even if there isn't something going to happen in 2012, the government's building underground bases for _some_ reason.


----------



## L2R

^they do that for surpluss budgets to ensure more moneys the following financial years


oh and for the lulz, of course.


----------



## L2R

CosmicDream said:


> _*Last Call for Evolution! (All Sentient Souls Report for Duty)*_
> 
> 
> Brothers & Sisters, fellow beings of light..., Souls of Timeless Beauty & Infinite Love...
> 
> You are here to receive a message that has come through Spirit & The Embodiment of the Planetary Consciousness, the Great Mother Gaia.
> 
> It is perhaps easy to forget that time is continuing to proceed in a linear fashion when one is enjoying busy enjoying the frivolous luxuries and comforts provided by the current soul-binding manifestations of the collective dream, often referred to as "The Great Machine", "The Matrix",  "Babylon" or the "The Prison of Souls".
> 
> As we move closer and closer to the year 2012, we are rapidly nearing the completion of the 26,000 year Precession of the Equinoxes cycle, demonstrated within the mayan calender & other correlating cultural & astrological Sign Posts. This will be the catalyst for a global transformation of a scale so grand that it can not be known by any one piece of this life.
> 
> Many of the establishments responsible for the mass programming that has been instilled into the collective consciousness which hold this out-dated paradigm in place have tried to convince the masses that we are soon approaching the end of all ages, or perhaps even more frightening - The end of the Universe itself!
> 
> This is a distortion of the truth designed to propagate mass fear and keep souls from taking responsibility for their own evolution. Let this serve as a wake up call for all Illuminated souls that have temporarily forgotten their purpose and strayed away from their true nature.
> 
> Let us all remember why we incarnated on this planet, let us remember why we chose to be here at this particular point in time. We all have an extremely critical role to play in the evolution of our species. It is only a matter of years before the great transformation is to occur, and those who are paying attention can already see the changes happening all around them with increasing acceleration.
> 
> The current paradigm-of-mind has been inflicted by tremendous disease, and as a result the greater majority of our species has become a toxic influence on our environment. Much like a virus that multiplies and proceeds to infect and destroy more and more of it's host. We have become parasites within the constitution of the planetary entity, Mother Gaia.
> 
> No longer can we afford to allow ourselves to feed into the old Dream of humanity that has so ruthlessly degraded and disrespected the Sacred life-force. We have poisoned our water and our air, we have turned our forests into concrete, our roads are chains around the Great Mother that bind her....
> 
> But not for much longer! The Planet will heal itself, like any organism that is afflicted with a Toxin, there will  be a  natural cleansing process. All of these things will be taken away... and they are so very temporary in the grand scheme of things - such is the law of nature, the law of impermanence. Our civilization is just a spec of time within the much grander life-span of Mother Gaia.
> 
> Those of us who are not in harmony with the natural vibration of the Earth will no longer have a residence on this planet much longer. This is the Eviction notice. This is the No-Nonsense Warning, that _*we must choose to collectively clean up our mess and learn to play nice with the other species, or we will be forced to go home, back to where-ever-it-is we came from....*_
> 
> For those of you that are interested in continuing the evolution of our species so that we may further experience the ecstatic joy of being alive, this means it is time to get your act together! Now is the time to embrace the earth as our mother and re-establish our connection with the earth as a living being - we must remember how to live harmoniously with life, as all life is sacred. We must take the responsibility for our own destiny as we consciously create our future together. We must corporate with one another and learn to simplify our lives, letting go of all that which is no longer needed...
> 
> We must remember our true nature as Divine Beings of Light. We must constantly fight to see beyond the veils of illusion, That great fog that hides our radiant splendor from ourselves must be transcended so that we may always see clearly! Through the power & Grace of Spirit, through the Love of all we may unify our being and receive the necessary strength required to overcome any obstacle that is presented before us.
> 
> It is so very easy to get dragged down into the collective dream of Babylon when one is so intensively ingrained in it, so utterly reliant on it... when one has been so thoroughly programmed - The only way to overcome this is to disconnect yourself from the system, we must wake up from the dream! We must dream our own dream, The Old Mind no longer serves us - so let it die!
> 
> Allow yourself to expand beyond these narrow minded conceptions that dominate the society! Money, Comfort, Greed, Instant-Gratification, Endless cycles of Consumerism, Sexual & Emotional Repression, Vicarious Living, Soul-Numbing-Chemicals, Prisons, All forms of Over-Stimulated Sensory Masturbation, Neuro-Toxic Water & Fake Food, 9-5 Jobs, Atomic Bombs! None of these things are needed, these are some of the many mechanisms through which the society keeps us enslaved in their corrupted dream. All of these things must be transcended!* If you don't play the game - then the rules will no longer apply.*
> 
> The time for healing is now. We must first heal ourselves, then we must help to heal each other, and only then we may aid the planet in it's healing. Perhaps then we can unlock the infinite potential hidden deep within the confines of our latent DNA, perhaps then we can reclaim our divine birth right as we live in absolute harmony with all. Each and every one of us have extrodinary gifts to share with the world, they must simply be given the space to be revealed!
> 
> Thank you for allowing yourself to be receptive to this transmission as filtered through the perception of this particular Ego.
> 
> Much Love to all,
> 
> Many blessings to all.
> 
> *In Lak'Ech, I am another yourself.*



seriously, that was a very pretty piece of writing, even though it contains no actually useful information. how does one become "ready". what is the experience that is expected? How will the earth heal, and how can man help?


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## Taryth

capstone said:


> *Jesse Ventura Conspiracy Theory - 2012*
> 
> Even if there isn't something going to happen in 2012, the government's building underground bases for _some_ reason.



We've always had bunkers (well, in my country).
Where have you been for the last hundred years?



Also . . .what makes you believe the government is omniscient?  Even supposing the government (here referring to mine) was frightened, what makes their fear credible?  How many times have we seen governments (and people in general, of course), develop completely irrational fears, and subsequently act foolishly?


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## Pink1966Floyd

Terrence Mckenna makes the most sense to me, just got done reading True Hallucinations, yet another well written and thought out work.  The man is most certainly "the copernicus of consciousness"

I am eagerly awaiting the "cosmic giggle"  that is instore for us.


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## rollin_stoned

http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20101019/sc_livescience/endoftheearthpostponed


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## Shrooms00087

continuousbeing said:


> I have heard and read a lot about a large scale evolution in or around 2012 to the 4th dimension.  Now, lets just assume that that is true, and that it is not everyone that will ascend.
> 
> My question is, do oyu think that we would see a large influx into our dimension of beings/energy/cosnsciousness from a lower dimension?  Does this even make any sense to anyone else but me?
> 
> one love



Eh, I've heard this on liveleak. Something about a photon-ring? Where we pass through it and that's the fourth dimension? Well, the minute readings on the photons it did exist, however, some nut just proclaimed it was the forth dimension. At any rate, nothing significant will happen on 2012. The Mayan Calendar doesn't even end in the sense that time does. It just wasn't continued. 

"do you think that we would see a large influx into our dimension of beings/energy/cosnsciousness from a lower dimension?  Does this even make any sense to anyone else but me? "

Sir, someone before me suggested this is 'hippy bull shit' I tend to argue to a slight hue because I've read this being circulated elsewhere and it's more conspiracy than hippy. I do suggest caution with psychedelics, they can produce symptoms of "Leary-Timothy-Idiocy-itis" A very serious disease indeed.


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## Mr_Fluffykins

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CN5sNXxe498&feature=related this should end all discussion


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## fizzle

rollin_stoned said:


> http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20101019/sc_livescience/endoftheearthpostponed



Glad you posted that, I was going to, but that saves me the trouble of having to go and look for it :D


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## JJ-180

Aaaawww, people, people! Planet Earth getting too crowded.
Time to move on out to the Cool and Dark.

I'm having a party at 18.54 on 23/12/2012, or whenever it is.
I also expect to wake up with an appalling hangover.


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## swilow

JJ-180 said:


> Aaaawww, people, people! Planet Earth getting too crowded.
> Time to move on out to the Cool and Dark.
> 
> I'm having a party at 18.54 on 23/12/2012, or whenever it is.
> I also expect to wake up with an appalling hangover.



Wow, sounds like you've really got that party organised brother  :D


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## twentysix

but it's.. what i see, when i see, how i see, in the psychological context/landscape of this preceding, immediately, a thought to some EASY representation (manifestation). i'm not talking stretching it. more like it just condenses on me. it's water, and i'm a cold coke can on a hot day.


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