# The Big and Dandy AMT Thread - 2nd incarnation



## Ximot

*Welcome to the Big & Dandy AMT Thread*






*Alpha-Methyltryptamine*








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Comparison of AMT vs. MDMA 
Injecting AMT
​
[original post]

Orally ingested 45mg of AMT on Saturday early evening. 2 friends had their first experiences with the compound and ingested 25mg each. I added some 4-Aco-MIPT to mine later. One person had a deep, eamningful, insightful experience, the other had an incredibly restless humorous episode that lasted hours... and hours... and I think perhaps it was ego-stuff... traing hard to avoid the inevitable. Which struck me as odd since AMT does ride one all the way home usually, and it does so in an incredibly gentle way. It tells the whole story but more gently than any other psychedelic that I know. Myself, I enjoyed it lots and am still experiencing a low-level afterglow. Nice stuff, persistently, for me (well, this was only the third time I used a full dose of it, and I've had access to this compound since 2003 and used it for the first time in 2005).

The reasons why I wouldn't use it regularly: 

1) excessive (iu have this from hearsay... is it documented?) serotonin release / reuptake inhibition... regular use might wreak biochemical havoc with concomitant imbalances in mood and sleeping patterns, dreams; plus psychological addictionsince it's so easy to handle  (Thank you Xorkoth for so openly writing about your difficulties with this one)

2) physical issues... I can usually stomach almost anything and most RCs leave me ok except 2c-i, which also messes with my stomach pretty consistently, and 5-MeO-DIPT, which just gives me the runs... but AMT really gave me the stomach from hell... even though this time I made sure I didn't drink any alcohol during the trip. One test subject vomited "blue" (I presume the person had visuals, none of us went to check at the time), but the other test subject seemed unaffected stomach-wise. ... My stomach ache lasted until the next day, and even today I am not very hungy, and I can feel that that this stuff has fine energetic repercussions on the body's organ system that last for days... my liver is most definitely also negatively affected by AMT - having said that, I do have a somewhat weak liver and can't get away with the excesses somefolks onhere seem to be doing fine with.

Apart from these physical issues, I rate it very highly, really in a social setting as a 'talk toy' that is at the same time a great tool for gentle insight into human motivation etc.   The physical effort the chemical requires from my body is also thereason why I am not worried about psychological addiction for myself.


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## Xorkoth

^^ Try rectal administration of AMT, preferrably after converting it to the HCl.  It really, really cuts down the side effects and makes the whole thing smoother.  The come-up is still jittery but it's a much cleaner jittery which fades entirely as it comes into full swing.  Plus, the come-up is at least twice is short.

Several people including myself have found the HCl to provide a more side-effect-free experience, and also rectal administration.  It's really worth trying out.  It also always made it so that I hardly ever got a headache or a strung-out comedown.  Just use a good amount of water so it doesn't burn... AMT burn can be unpleasant. 

AMT is sort of the mescaline of tryptamines.  It's got a very long duration and unfolds slowly and gently, and has elements of strong love and empathy as well as a definite analytical and humorous edge.  I find mescaline more fully psychedelic and a bit more forceful and deeper, and AMT a bit more purely recreational but also more purely empathogenic.


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## dbailey11

Xorkoth said:
			
		

> Yeah, a low dose of 4-AcO-DMT works VERY well with AMT.  So does kratom, by the way.
> 
> AMT... overall, my favorite drug.  I also find it to blow MDMA out of the water, in every way.  True euphoria, unrushed, unforced, real.  No gushing of endless love for everyone... instead, deep thought that leads you to realize your deep love for everyone as your fellow living beings....



word...


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## Jabberwocky

Ximot said:
			
		

> 1) excessive (iu have this from hearsay... is it documented?) serotonin release / reuptake inhibition...


Yes, it is documented at least in rat cell studies-

Ximot, if you PM me your address I'll send you the article later when I'm at my home that charts the reuptake inhibition and monoamine release of AMT compared to MDMA (and a few other tryps and phens that are taken recreationally)-


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## Jabberwocky

Sorry---I'm in robot mode!  8(

that sounds like a great experience Ximot - moves me one step closer to taking a full dose of it myself! 

love,
S_S


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## fastandbulbous

samadhi_smiles said:
			
		

> Yes, it is documented at least in rat cell studies-
> 
> Ximot, if you PM me your address I'll send you the article later when I'm at my home that charts the reuptake inhibition and monoamine release of AMT compared to MDMA (and a few other tryps and phens that are taken recreationally)-




Ooh! Can I scrounge a copy as well? All the stuff I have on AMT is enzyme kinetics blurb about it's competetive inhibition of MAO?


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## e1evene1even

I wouldn't mind a copy either, but probably wouldn't be able to understand it anyway  . fastandbulbous, when you get a copy, could you distill its essence and the possible implications for recreational users into a paragraph or a few sentences for us neophytes...  

The only aMT specific files I have (that I'm aware of) are:
-AMT Derivatives Induce a 5-HT Receptor-mediated Head-twitch.pdf

-MDMA-Like Stimulus Effects Of Alpha-Ethyltryptamine And The Alpha-Ethyl Homolog Of DOM - Glennon.pdf

there's also some discussion of aMT in:
-NIDA Research Monograph 94 - Pharmacology and Toxicology of Amphetamine and Related Designer Drugs.pdf

Are any of those the file you are talking about S_S? If you name it there is a chance a few of us may already have it somewhere on our hard drives.


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## tass4243

Saturday night I did end up retaking it. I had a blast at the massive. I took 60MG orally with no bad effects. I never have any problems with my stomach inreguards to AMT. Carefree ride for sure! The only time I had a bit of a problem was on the come up, waiting in traffic in LA, going 20 MPH and becoming jittery. As soon as I got out of the car and could feel the base, it was smooth sailing from there. I got to have a lot of deep conversations with my friends, without the e-tardedness they all felt. No losing my train of thought mid sentence like them =) 

It was great, this is becoming one of my top 3 favorite drugs fast. I don't plan on doing it for a bit though, but I  it! I guess I'm one of the lucky ones who doesn't get much stomach discomfort on the come up. I've done it with some food in my stomach and empty, both times I was fine.


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## fastandbulbous

At a festival last summer, I took on three consecutive days 20mg; 40mg & 65mg. Now while I can't say anything about neurotoxicity, I have suffered no long term detrimental effects from that, but I did use some ketamine at the same time & it has neuroprotective effects (probably not quite at the doses I was using, but it was a festival!)


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## Ximot

fastandbulbous said:
			
		

> I did use some ketamine at the same time & it has neuroprotective effects (probably not quite at the doses I was using, but it was a festival!)



    so funny


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## WaseFraKa

fastandbulbous said:
			
		

> ketamine at the same time & it has neuroprotective effects (probably not quite at the doses I was using, but it was a festival!)



are you implying the neuroprotective effects are only in action at the higher range of k? I haven't seen any info on the dose/effect


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## Jabberwocky

"The Effects of Non-medically Used Psychoactive Drugs on Monoamine Neurotransmission in Rat Brain"

I'll post it here in a few hours, I'm running late right now -

P & L,
S_S


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## Xorkoth

*The Big and Dandy AMT Thread - New incarnation*

The old B&D AMT thread had outgrown its 500-post limit, so it's been archived and can be found here.  I have moved the last few posts from it into here for continuity of discussion.


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## Ximot

A quality compound... both fellow trippers reported feeling good this week... well, one reported "weird dreams" (the restless one with the borderline-paranoid humour outbreak that lasted hours, as if his plateau never came), but the other has clearly gained great insight from it and the cold they had had (feverish etc) prior to using the AMT has completely gone ... fancy that! I would have thought it would get much worse.... 

My stomach upset has also long gone, and my digestion is back to normal. Last time I remember feeling better during the experience but I had a rougher aftermath (digestion) - I think that's because last time I started drinking lots of beer at a gig after the peak.


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## DivineMomenT

Anyone watch 6 feet under?  The girl Claire took some aMT in one of the episodes. I think I would prefer rectal administration because of the nausea.

what is a good dose rectally like 25mg?

I thought it was dangerous to drink on AMT?


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## Xorkoth

The dose for rectal administration with AMT is about the same.  I guess its bioavailability orally is very good.  Either that or rectally it's not as good as usual.  Either way, the experience is definitely superior though.


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## e1evene1even

DivineMomenT said:
			
		

> I thought it was dangerous to drink on AMT?



It very well may be. I've drank on 20-30mg on AMT a few times and didn't notice any problems, but initially it did increase some of the physical side effects slightly. According to Erowid AMT "experienced a surge in popularity" in the 90's and I wouldn't be surprised if there were a lot of people who drank on it. 

I wouldn't recommend it though as alcohol is notorious for drug interactions, ones that are otherwise safe. There aren't any reports on Erowid on the combo.

If you do decide to do it, go slow, don't drink a lot and make sure to have plenty of water.


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## Xorkoth

I found drinking on AMT to be counterproductive anyway... not like with amphetamine.  It made the whole state less pleasant (for me).


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## e1evene1even

Yeah, I found the same. Alcohol has little to add to a decent AMT experience, but 10-20mg of AMT can enhance a social experience and allow a person to get to a similarly social state, but with less alcohol. Its also just stimulating enough to keep you going a bit, IME.


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## Xorkoth

Large doses of AMT are great for social settings as well, but just with friends/not too many people.  Possibly the best AMT trip I've ever had (the one in my AMT Retrospective report) was at a friend's house that I hadn't seen in over a year, and felt sort of guilty about.  I took I think 65mg (during a period of tolerance however) and ended up having such an amazing euphoria and more importantly productive evening... we all got to know each other on another level.  And the contact high produced was amazing (I was the only one actually on it), helped by the fact that we all had kratom, them for the first time.  And kratom mixes very favorably with AMT... better than it does with any other drug I would say.

What a good memory...  

EDIT:  Whew, I just re-read the whole experience and it took me back quite significantly for a few minutes. 

It reminds me of why AMT is too good for me to have a supply of.   I am thinking about rummaging about for a few doses at Christmastime, to share with some uninitiated friends.


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## tass4243

Has anyone tried doing a physical activity while under the influence? I think I'm going snowboarding next month..and would love to experience maybe a lowish dose while up on that mountain. Any thoughts on doing this?


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## Strange.Days

So much for R & R.


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## Xorkoth

tass4243 said:
			
		

> Has anyone tried doing a physical activity while under the influence? I think I'm going snowboarding next month..and would love to experience maybe a lowish dose while up on that mountain. Any thoughts on doing this?



Yes.  AMT is a drug that I find does not weaken or inhibit me physically.  It makes me feel flushed and strong.  Some things, like DOXs and even LSD, and many phenethylamines, can sometimes cause some vasoconstriction, or fatigue, or muscle weakness.  Not so with AMT, at least for me.  I've spent many a long hike or exercise session on it.


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## tass4243

^^^ awesome! Can't wait to try this ;D Yay snowboarding season =)


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## fastandbulbous

tass4243 said:
			
		

> Has anyone tried doing a physical activity while under the influence? I think I'm going snowboarding next month..and would love to experience maybe a lowish dose while up on that mountain. Any thoughts on doing this?



You mean other than making the beast with two backs?


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## Bare_head

#I agree totally with what Xorkoth, i love aMT.. i find that physical activity not really impaired although on high doses the intoxication can be too much to really want to do alot.. i love the long lasting stimulation and clear headed euphoria which allows for physcial activity although i would make sure i kept hydrated


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## tass4243

Ok guys, I need your help. Last night my friend was pulled over while sitting in a friends car.  She was drunk. Long story short, she ended up being arrested. Now we did AMT the night before, and she took her drug test 24 hours after we had dosed. The police are currently trying to figure it out, but I guess it triggered the drug test for amphetamines or methamphetamine. They said she was on some type of stimulant, but they weren't sure what.

I was under the impression that AMT did not trigger any of the standard drug groups. Should she be worried that something will come up? I am not exactly sure what she has been charged with yet...but does anyone know if you can be charged with being under the influence of an unknown substance? I know that the AMT won't come up on the drug test.


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## Bare_head

i dont think they can charge you if they cant prove you were on something.. fair enough drunk and disordly if she admitted the use.. but on a unknown substance? is this in US.. them cops are ruthless


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## tass4243

Well, I found out she was charged with a 11550 or something of that nature. Just being under the influence of a schedule 1 drug, but they are waiting on the drug test before they push it forward. I guess they told her, if nothing comes up on the drug test, she won't be charged with anything.

From everything I've been able to find, AMT won't trigger anything else...so lets hope thats the case, so she gets off free!


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## Tranced

Tried AMT again yesterday and deffinitely got it this time. A few months back 28mg rectally didn't do much, I just got basic threshold effects and was sick later on.

So last night I got about 59-64mgs, put it in a gelcap and added somewhere less than 1ml malt vinegar in order to hopefully convert the freebase to the salt. Had a bit of a suprise when I first did a tester (without AMT inside) to see what vinegar would do with a closed gelcap. It expanded so far that it popped the gelcap!

It came on within much less than half an hour and gradually seemed to start peaking about two hours into it. I was thinking this might be the full brunt of it and was comtemplating trying to up the dose at some point, but opted out due to talk of differing stages and a long come up. I felt very euphoric and music sounded very deep with quite mild visuals. Decided a joint might be better to notch things up a bit and after this it really all kicked in. Felt very similiar to MDMA to me but a bit more psychedelic, lots of euphoria and constant serotonergic rushes. Very psychedelic closed eye visuals and open eye ones different to what I've seen before. Loads of random, nonsensical thoughts aswell. Also noted that I didn't have any real side effects, never got overly hot/sweaty or sick (but that might have something to do with the ginger extract I took). Decided to take 750mg magnesium as my gurn was getting out of control though.

I very much liked it but it can drone a long a bit long without enough to keep it interesting. I think I'd deffinitely enjoy this more as a club drug as nothing much but variations of the same happen for a long time. I didn't think ketamine had any sort of decent synergy with it. Woke up with a headache early in the morning but that's sorted and I feel very good now

Anyone know if there is a cross tollerance between AMT and 2C-B? i.e can I do 2C-B tonight?


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## Xorkoth

AMT seemed to jack up my tolerance for both tryptamines and phenethylamines quite a bit.


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## e1evene1even

This is the study samadhi_smiles has referrred to. Only the abstract is available online.



			
				The effects of non-medically used psychoactive drugs on monoamine neurotransmission in rat brain said:
			
		

> Abstract
> 
> *We developed a reproducible, simple, and small-scale method for determining the re-uptake and release of monoamines (dopamine, serotonin (5-HT) and norepinephrine) using rat brain synaptosomes.* These assays were then applied to study the effects of different kinds of non-medically used psychoactive drugs on monoamine re-uptake and release. The phenethylamine derivatives, 4-fluoroamphetamine, 2-methylamino-3,4-methylene-dioxy-propiophenone (methylone), 1-(1,3-benzodioxol-5-yl)-2-butanamine (BDB), and N-methyl-1-(1,3-benzodioxol-5-yl)-2-butanamine (MBDB), had strong inhibitory effects on the re-uptake of dopamine, 5-HT and norepinephrine. 4-Fluoroamphetamine, methylone and BDB also strongly increased the release of the three monoamines, but MBDB increased 5-HT and norepinephrine release, but had little effect on dopamine release. However, 2,5-dimethoxy-4-iodophenethylamine (2C-I), 2,5-dimethoxy-4-ethylphenethylamine (2C-E), 2,5-dimethoxy-4-chlorophenethylamine (2C-C), 2,4,5-trimethoxyamphetamine (TMA-2) and 2,4,6-trimethoxyamphetamine (TMA-6), which are methoxylated phenethylamine derivatives, slightly influenced the re-uptake and release of monoamines. *α-Metyltryptamine (AMT), a tryptamine derivative, was one of the strongest re-uptake inhibitors and releasers of the three monoamines.* The tryptamine derivative, 5-methoxy-α-methyltryptamine (5-MeO-AMT), also strongly inhibited re-uptake and increased the release of the three monoamines. N,N-dipropyltryptamine (DPT), 5-methoxy-N,N-diisopropyltryptamine (5-MeO-DIPT), 5-methoxy-N,N-methylisopropyltryptamine (5-MeO-MIPT), and 5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-DMT) inhibited monoamine re-uptake, but had a few effects on monoamine release. 1-(3-Chlorophenyl)piperazine (3CPP) and 1-(methoxyphenyl)piperazine (4MPP), which are piperazine derivatives, inhibited monoamine re-uptake and accelerated their release. *The results suggest that some designer drugs strongly act on the central nerve system to the same extent as restricted drugs. *



Personally, I have yet to have a "full-blown" AMT trip. My highest dose was 40mg oral once and maybe a handful of 20-30mg oral trips.

Now that I've tried rectal administration, AMT is next on the list. I was thinking of trying ~40-50mg. For others that have tried AMT rectally, does Xorkoth's experience of little to no potentiation over oral hold true for you as well?


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## tass4243

Do you guys typically dose alone, or with friends? So far I have only dosed with my friends around, but this week I will be visiting lake tahoe, and will be dosing by myself. I am wondering if this works out for you guys or no? I always seem to be talking with my friends etc when I dose.


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## psood0nym

^In combination with a more powerful psychedelic yes.  If you're just using aMT then you'll probably end up wanting someone to talk to.

I know Xorkoth has experienced some alarming effects after days of continual use, but does anyone crash from aMT use?  Since it both releases and blocks the reuptake of serotonin and dopamine so powerfully (at least in rats) wouldn't you expect a crash?  I've actually avoided crashing on amphetamines by combining them with aMT.  Certainly no complaints here, but it is weird.


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## Bare_head

i fidn the crash from aMT isnt too bad unless you take it for days on end (as i once found out ) i find that it is much less of a comedown than MDMA or Amphetamine, though it does interrupt my sleep patterns somewhat so make sure you have a few days spare


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## Ximot

A friend reported a major crash with AMT. Felt good during the experience and in a SPLENDID mood the next day. Still good 2 days after... and then midweek he had a major crash that took 2-3 days to mend. i wonder if it's all physiological or if it's partly to do with how one deals with the trip itself.


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## Xorkoth

I couldn't say... people seem to react so much differently.  My assessment of AMT is that it causes no crash for me if I take it once with a reasonable length of time between doses (up to half a week at least average over the long term perhaps).  In fact, I feel better than normal for several days, especially the next day, sort of like mescaline only a bit draining on physical energy the first day.  I mean like mescaline in that the trip seems to fade into the background but never fully disappear.  But since the trip is all loving warmth, it's a blessing.

If I take it 2 days in a row, the next day or two I'm noticeably slightly down, but no big deal.  Definitely physically draining and a bit emotionally as well. 

If I take it 3 or 4 days in a row, (as would never happen again but did a certain number of times in the relatively recent past), I'll feel pretty shitty for a day or two afterwards, and at this level it really starts to drain my zest and happiness for a while even after the side effects wore off. 

If I follow a long-term "regimen" of 4 times a week or so, if I don't continue that schedule, I'll start getting brain zaps, like the MDMA ones except less severe.  It seems like withdrawal.  At this level I only really feel particularly good with AMT.

Once I took it for a week straight at ever-increasing dosages (which was horrible and I would never do that again), and on the last day I felt indescribably fucked up, sort of like a combination of the flu and mono and mental retardation.  It was like the worst MDMA depression hangover I can imagine, complete with horrible brain zaps.  I was walking around in a store and kept almost falling because the brain zaps would last so long I couldn't be present enough to stay upright.  For a couple of days I experienced this at slowly decreasing levels, and also nausea and spinning.  It was horrible... just horrible.  The worst directly drug-induced episode of my life.  I took 25mg (a low dose at the time) on the 3rd day after, and felt fine, not high.  Just normal.  It remained that way for a few days, and they came back.  I took pure 4-HO-DMT and had an ego death experience and they stopped.

That has been my experience with AMT.  Which is why I haven't used it since then.  I just love it too much.


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## Bare_head

your reaction with aMT seems exactly liek mine.. its awfully euphoric, and the sense of well beign and stimulated feeling is really nice. The visuals are very subtle though i think my overuse has caused it to be less psychedelic


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## Psych0naut

aMT is really nice stuff, psychedelic speed for me! The stuff is really stimulating and incredibly euphoric in high doses, though weirdly enough, still doesn't provide me with hallucinations at even 120mg. It's very weird that everyone reacts so differently to aMT. Some people are hallucinating pretty hard of 50mg, while others, like me, don't even get hallucinations at 120mg. Still nice stuff though.

The big downside in my experience with aMT is definately the stomach and intestine cramps, and nausea. If it would lack the cramps, it would be even better.


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## Xorkoth

^^ If you take it rectally, there is no nausea or stomach cramps whatsoever and a smoother body high.

AMT produces my favorite euphoria of any drug.  It's remakrably empathogenic, but also crystal-clear mentally.


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## e1evene1even

^ I agree, about the euphoria and I haven't gone above 40mg. The next time I take it will definitely be rectally because for me the come up is always quite shitty. In my experience, having nothing in my stomach significantly reduces the  GI nastiness. 

The Erowid section on AMT related deaths has me a bit confused though. It says "Before February 2003, Erowid had received a handful of unverifiable reports of hospitalization after high-dose (over 60mg oral) AMT ingestion".

It seems to imply to me that 60mg is a high dose that is potentially risky. My impression is that ~60mg is a full dose, maybe equivalent to ~120-150mg MDMA, but not very risky. I'm a bit hesitant to use 40mg rectally (which is probably a riskier method of administration vs. oral), when Erowid suggests that over 60mg oral could be problematic.


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## Xorkoth

The come-up rectally is still annoying, but it's better and most importantly, faster.  The best part about rectal dosing with AMT is that the body load is not there once you come up... oral dosing can sometimes give me a lingering bodyload for the whole trip.  And the nausea and gastric distress is not there either (aside from some discomfort/burning on initial application).

My most frequent dose was probably 60mg, although I was using it often then.  I wouldn't recommend 60mg until you've worked up to it, but I'd hardly consider it dangerous.

I have found rectal administration to be about the same potency as oral administration, curiously.

I tend to prefer taking most substances rectally, but with AMT this is even more so because it is so much smoother and gentler.

Finally, I always converted it to the HCl salt before rectal administration.  I have heard it works as the freebase as well, and it should, but I find it to absorb faster and smoother as the HCl.


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## e1evene1even

^ is there a chance that you may have developed a tolerance from oral dosing by the time you tried rectal so that that although it was perceived as the same potency it was actually stronger? Do you remember reading reports from others that agree with your oral potency=rectal potency observations?

Maybe I'll start with 30mg rectal and work up from there. I'm relocating at the end of the month where I won't be able to trip as much so I'd like to squeeze a few more in.  

Another quick question. I find an empty stomach helps the nasuea with most chems, with rectal does it make a difference in your experience?


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## Xorkoth

I think F&B agrees that rectal admin is about the same in potency, if I recall correctly.  I did not have any tolerance when I began using it rectally.  It may add a tiny bit of potency I suppose, so you should dose a little lower for the first time at least.  In my experience though it mostly just changes the nature of the feel of the trip... it comes on faster so it reaches peak plasma levels more quickly I would imagine.  Overall I have never noticed a significant difference in strength of effects, but the effect is different, in a way more intense but in a way less intense also because the body load isn't there.


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## cerebral_cortex

*AMT & anit-nausea medication*

i am very excited to try out some AMT i've acquired, but the reports of nausea and vomitting in some users has me a bit wary.  

Would taking some anti-nausea medication beforehand be a good idea?  What brand would be good, and when should it be taken?  Or would there be something else worth taking that might work better?  (besides weed, which will be consumed throughout)


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## Bare_head

try a small dose first, like 10-20 mg see how you react. i dont find the nausea that bad tbh, even at doses like 40mg .. everyone reacts differently


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## cerebral_cortex

yeah, it seems that even though alot of the trip reports for amt seem to mention nausea or stomach issues,  most of the time it doesn't seem to impact the experience in a negative way, as most people still have positive things to say about it.  

I usually don't have many stomach issues on phens like 2c-i or 2c-b, so i'm hoping that will carry over for amt... 

But has anybody had any  experience with taking a bit of anti-nausea medication beforehand?  I would rather be safe than sorry....


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## Xorkoth

Merged in a question about anti-ansuea medication and AMT.

I've never taken anything with anti-nausea properties with AMT.  Taking it in a non-oral method will reduce nausea, especially rectally.  I would imagine that it would help though.  In any case, I've never had the nausea last beyond the come-up (maybe around 2 hours at most).


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## fastandbulbous

> Taking it in a non-oral method will reduce nausea, especially rectally



Anything that avoids it sitting in the stomach is suitable. 5-hydroxy AMT is an agonist for 5HT3 receptors (in the stomach, upper GI tract), so avoiding any direct interaction between them & AMT will work.

Don't go with phenothiazine based anti-nausea medications as they will severely blunt the effects of AMT and probably not make it worthwhile. The only ones I'd recommend (if you can obtain them - they're horribly expensive drugs according to the BNF) are 5HT3 antagonists like ondansetron and other members of that family.

Personally, I'd say 'shove it up yer arse', but in the best possible taste!


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## SpunkySkunk347

*Safe to Mix AMT and SSRIs? (Effexor)*

Would it be safe for someone to take an oral dose of AMT while they are on a daily dose of 150mg Effexor CR (SSRI antidepressant)?
My main concern is possible risk of serotonin syndrome, my second concern is that an SSRI might block the supposed "MDMA-like" effects of AMT.

If it is not safe to mix the two, or if it will be a waste of AMT, then how long should a person wait to take the dose of AMT after taking their last dose of effexor? (I'm assuming 2 weeks after cessation of using effexor)

Im aware that AMT experiences vary greatly between individuals, and I am diagnosed with Panic Disorder. However, psychadelics do not usually bring upon panic attacks for me (weird huh). But anyways, if there were to be a "bad trip", I am prescribed 1mg clonazepam for panic attacks, which I could take in case of a bad trip. Would clonazepam be effective in calming someone down who is having a bad trip on AMT?


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## SynAmnesia

Don't do it.  Don't even think about it.  

First, effexor is an SNRI, not an SSRI.  It has serotonin and norepinephrine effects, but that isn't the point here.  

AMT has MAOI activity.  That means it is dangerous to mix with many drugs including SSRI's, SNRI's, MDMA, etc.  That is because MAO is the enzyme that metabolizes neurotransmitters.  With an SSRI/SNRI/Tricyclic/etc, you are inhibiting the reuptake of serotonin, norepinephrine, etc... all of which are degraded by MAO.  If you inhibit both the reuptake and the degradation of neurotransmitters, it can lead to toxic effects, including but not limited to serotonin syndrome, tachnicardia, destroying of one's heart valves, etc.  

Most antidepressants are not good to mix with psychedelics at all.  You definitely need to get off of them before doing most drugs.  However, this isn't a recommended route.  First, it can be really difficult getting off of effexor--the withdrawls are terrible and can lead to convulsions/seizures/all sorts of bad things.  Also, you probably should be careful with drugs if you have a history of depression as they could potentially make it worse.


----------



## SpunkySkunk347

I thought AMT has only a very small MAOI activity?
And effexor has a very short half-life (5 hours), and I haven't been on it long enough to get serious withdrawal symptoms.
So would skipping tonights dose and tomorrow morning's dose of effexor and then taking AMT be okay?
If not, how long should I wait before dosing AMT?

EDIT: Im guessing that tomorrow if I take a dose of AMT I will be okay. But then again I could be making a horrible mistake that I didnt think about. I think I will be fine because:
1. AMT has small MAOI activity, and mixing an MAOI with an  SSRI/SNRI doesnt necessarily always lead to serotonin syndrome.
2. By skipping two doses of effexor (with the 5 hour half life that effexor has), I will have gone 24 hours without a dose of 75mg of effexor. Thats essentially 5 half-lives that the 75mg dose has gone through. Which according to my calculations would mean that roughly only about 2.3mg of effexor is still in my blood?
3. Serotonin syndrome has a low mortality rate, and treatment for it is basically only symptomatic. (Meaning they just give you some benzodiazepines at the hospital until you are no longer suffering from serotonin syndrome). I have benzodiazepines which I am planning on taking at the peak of the trip anyways to make the come-down better. And the symptoms of serotonin syndrome are pretty easy to point out.


----------



## 5-HT2

Have you ever tried skipping that many Effexor doses before?  Unless you have, and did not experience withdrawal symptoms, I would not skip your daily doses, and then take AMT.  

Also, I think it's kind of pointless to take benzodiazepines at the *peak* of the trip, unless you are experiencing negative somatic side effects, because they tend to cloud and blunt the psychedelic experience.


----------



## SpunkySkunk347

5-HT2 said:
			
		

> Have you ever tried skipping that many Effexor doses before?  Unless you have, and did not experience withdrawal symptoms, I would not skip your daily doses, and then take AMT.
> 
> Also, I think it's kind of pointless to take benzodiazepines at the *peak* of the trip, unless you are experiencing negative somatic side effects, because they tend to cloud and blunt the psychedelic experience.


Yes, I am very unscheduled when it comes to taking my effexor, and have gone as much as 2 days without taking it and felt perfectly fine.

And I've heard that the comedown of AMT is particularily rough, so I'm going to keep plenty of benzos handy for when I start to feel the negative strung-out effects of the drug after the peak. Not necessarily as I'm peaking.

I just know that people often get drawn into the *"O0o0o0o0o SHINEY!!!"* aspect of research chemicals, especially ones as interesting as AMT, and then end up getting in way over their head. I'm mostly making sure that's not what I'm doing. 
The 24+ hour long trip of AMT would be a pretty long time to suffer if I was making some tragic mistake, so I feel I should take every precaution necessary to avoid this. Especially, getting second opinions from the people on bluelight.

Thanks for the responses.

PS, i have no history of depression. Just panic disorder and obsessive compulsive disorder (hence why I am taking effexor). But what I have found is that psychadelics and stimulants in particular actually _reduce_ my panic disorder and OCD

PPS this thread seemed to answer some questions. http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=247265
Mostly there were people in that thread who read the word "MAOI" and began spazzing out, but then most of the people who were saying "Its okay to mix AMT and an SSRI" used logic and stated what they said calmly.
The end result: He tried the combination and is not only alive and well, but seemed to enjoy the experience.


----------



## swilow

^As 5HT2 said, don't skip your dose. Withdrawing from such a drug and then taking something that works heavily on the same neuro-pathways is a bad idea. Not as bad as taking AMT with an SSRI/SNRI. I wouldn't do it.


----------



## SynAmnesia

Also, occasionally do mix MAOIs with Psychadelics, (see Ayuahasca), however this is not for the novice nor is to be taken lightly.  Both drugs must be dosed properly or else you can actually die.   MAOIs are decently dangerous by themselves, due to all the interactions they have with drugs but also benign foods like blue cheese.  Serotonin syndrome isn't the only thing that can happen (and is probably the least of your problems)--you can actually stop your heart and get permanent heart damage, in addition to a whole bunch of other things that can happen when you inhibit all of the ways a cell has to inactivate it's neurotransmitters.  

You will see people that do this stuff, but you have to know what you are doing.  Since this is harm reduction, I am going to say don't do it.  I don't want to advocate such behaviors to novices.  I assume that you are a novice, as you probably wouldn't be asking questions on a message board for advice if you weren't--you would already know what you are doing.  (I am not saying this is a bad thing--but you should definitely tread lightly when dealing with dangerous combinations that can go badly quickly).   

However, the question you have to ask yourself is whether the risk justifies the possible payoff.  Yes, this is a high risk behavior.  Yes, you may survive unscathed, but you could also end up having life threatening problems.  Is your life worth one trip?  I can't answer this for you.  But if you do end up doing it--please have a sober sitter so that if anything goes wrong it can be dealt with properly.


----------



## swilow

^Ayahuasca is not likely to cause death if the right precautions are taken. Obviously dietary restrictions should be followed, but dosages of both DMT and the harmala alkaloids are pretty well known and widely documented.

Taking AMT when on a SNRI for medicinal reasons is different to intenionally inhibiting an enzyme to activate a substance. The risk that is most concering with this combo is seratonin syndrome, due to the increased levels of seratonin already in the brain.


----------



## Xorkoth

SpunkySkunk347 said:
			
		

> And I've heard that the comedown of AMT is particularily rough, so I'm going to keep plenty of benzos handy for when I start to feel the negative strung-out effects of the drug after the peak. Not necessarily as I'm peaking.



To me, AMT has virtually no comedown whatsoever.  The worst part of the trip is the come up.  To me it always feels like it very, very gradually fades out in a calm, peaceful manner and eventually is just gone.  I've never had a crash from it in the slightest unless I was using it multiple days in a row.



> The 24+ hour long trip of AMT would be a pretty long time to suffer if I was making some tragic mistake, so I feel I should take every precaution necessary to avoid this. Especially, getting second opinions from the people on bluelight.



Yes, very true.  I think pretty much all of the evidence would suggest that mixing psychiatric medications and AMT is a bad idea.  Just because someone did it and was fine doesn't mean you would be fine.  Some people have mixed DXM and MDMA and been fine.  But some have most certainly not been fine.  It just doesn't seem worth the risk to me, unfortunately.


----------



## Xorkoth

Merged in a question about mixing AMT with SSRIs/SNRIs.


----------



## SpunkySkunk347

Heys guys, took the AMT today and am perfectly fine.
Took it at 8:15, and didnt really notice effect until about 10:00.
It felt great, almost like MDMA but a bit different, a lot more mental than physical. Then at about noon I felt like shit (it felt like I was on the comedown of speed), took some klonopin, smoked some grass, now I am feeling just fine, chilled out and relaxed.

Ill write a report on it later, for a while it got pretty intense. Your thoughts cease to be in a single "train" of thought and instead are "blobs" of concepts that come at you incredibly fast.
Slight visual distortions, but the experience was really mental.
No serotonin syndrome, and my heart rate was just fine.

Now its 3:00pm. I ate some (actually a whole shitload of) food cuz I had the munchies, and I think in a few minutes im gonna hit the sack and sleep for a good 4 hours.

Ill write a report later.
Peace.

PS I didnt know the excact dose, it was probably around 30-50mg from what I've read about other people taking it.


----------



## WaseFraKa

felt like shit???
my few trials have shown a plateau that is very very calm compared to the come up. My highest trial has been at 20mg. Usually at 1-1.5hr there is a strong sense of empathy and some racing thoughts. Then at 3-4h it stabilises and gets very relaxed (too relaxed?) and gets somewhat neutral, very aware of the environment but nowhere as psychedelic/euphoric as during the come up. Ok weed and k can help a lot to spice things up... 
Next trial will be somewhat higher, hopefully the plateau will have a bit more going on.


----------



## Xorkoth

Yeah, I am very surprised you felt like shit after the come up... I've never once felt bad except during the first two hours, and I've used AMT probably more than any other psychedelic.  In fact it leaves me feeling fantastic for a couple of days unless I use it several days in a row.


----------



## SpunkySkunk347

i guess i wouldnt say i felt like "shit" thats a bit of exxagerating

I just sort of felt like "meh bored" and sort of bummed out because the thrill of the onset was over.


----------



## psood0nym

Is aMT likely to be a migraine trigger?  Is it a vasodialator?  Any experiences or friend's anecdotes from people who actually suffer migraines?  I ask because stimulants like caffeine often are triggers, but serotonin agonists have been used to abort or even stop the cycle of migraines/cluster headaches, and aMT is both.  I know headaches sometimes occur in non-migraine sufferers at the end of the trip but I've never experienced that with low doses or with the hcl (I think it may be a hydration and persistent muscle tension issue more than anything.)  My girlfriend gets migraines with caffeine, has expressed an interest in psychedelics but has never done them. If I did it, I would probably do a low (sub-psychedelic/euphoric) dose of aMT before a low dose of a smooth, broad spectrum psychedelic like 4-AcO-DMT to do everything possible to reduce the chances of a bad trip for her first time experience while retaining the classic psychedelic effects.  I really don't want to be responsible for a 10 hour migraine though.  I suppose 4-AcO-DMT might stop it if it started, but still.


----------



## Xorkoth

^^ I have gotten bad headaches from it, although not even once when I used it rectally.  AMT is kind of notorious for causing headaches, but to me they feel like tension headaches and can be reduced or eliminated with common headache remedy techniques.  Then again, I've never had a migraine in my life, so maybe it would give migraines to others.


----------



## kills4Thrills

^^I get headaches from most RC's for some reason. Whenever I get ready to now to take Trypts or Phens I take a tylenol(Or Lortab) right before I ingest. 

On Topic- The first time I did AMT was 40mg(2/20mg pill sample) and It took about 2 hours for things to get going. I remember thinking it was weird because at the time I had only ingested a few RC's and of course all of the traditionals(and some not so traditionals) and I usually felt alerts within 10-15 minutes.  I started thinking they were old or bad then alittle after hour 2 wammo. Duration is cool for a festival or such, but stuck in the appt for 14-16 hours can get abit redundant unless you like that sort of thing.


----------



## SpunkySkunk347

psood0nym said:
			
		

> Is aMT likely to be a migraine trigger?  Is it a vasodialator?  Any experiences or friend's anecdotes from people who actually suffer migraines?  I ask because stimulants like caffeine often are triggers, but serotonin agonists have been used to abort or even stop the cycle of migraines/cluster headaches, and aMT is both.  I know headaches sometimes occur in non-migraine sufferers at the end of the trip but I've never experienced that with low doses or with the hcl (I think it may be a hydration and persistent muscle tension issue more than anything.)  My girlfriend gets migraines with caffeine, has expressed an interest in psychedelics but has never done them. If I did it, I would probably do a low (sub-psychedelic/euphoric) dose of aMT before a low dose of a smooth, broad spectrum psychedelic like 4-AcO-DMT to do everything possible to reduce the chances of a bad trip for her first time experience while retaining the classic psychedelic effects.  I really don't want to be responsible for a 10 hour migraine though.  I suppose 4-AcO-DMT might stop it if it started, but still.



AMT can cause tension headaches (headaches from anxiety)

im no doctor, but AMT is a tryptamine and tryptamines supposedly work MIRACLES for people with migraines/cluster headaches.


----------



## dbailey11

I took AMT while taking Paxil and felt no adverse effects because of it. That doesn't mean it _couldn't_ be dangerous, it's just that it wasn't for me.


----------



## cubehead

Does anyone have any info or experience mixing amt w/ lsd?

In a couple months some friends and I are going up to Humboldt for a weekend. I was gonna be getting some 15mg doses of amt and sugarcubes with probably a single drop of liquid. I'm imagining after taking amt a couple times that it might add a nice mild touch to the lsd. 

Any insight into this would be appreciated. Thanks.


----------



## Xorkoth

^^ No, but I've always wanted to.  I've obtained a small sample of AMT again, and I will be taking it tomorrow night for a gathering of friends.  Perhaps soon I will finally try the mix and report back.  it seems to me that it would be a wonderful mix.  I am very experienced with AMT so I would try a 40mg dose of AMT with a regular dose of LSD.

IMO, 15mg of AMT does not give you its full character, although it is nice.  Try 30mg to see what it's all about.  It gets less mild as you increase in dosage but it remains very euphoric and friendly and sociable as well.


----------



## cubehead

Thanks man, yeah I've taken much larger doses of amt in the past, though everyone I'm gonna be with this weekend will be taking it for their first time and if we're gonna combo with lsd, I figured it would probably be wise to take it for a mild effect on top of the acid.


----------



## fourty6andtwo

i just wanna say I love aMT sooo much...it not a super deep psychedelic or anything but I just love that dreamy, rolly, trippy, eyes rolling back in head, sexy empathogenic aMT feel...damn I think i just nutted a little bit....


----------



## patitafon

*Amt Im*

Hi,
I couldnt find anything about Im'ing AMT, so kill me if it was yet mentioned. Anyone tried? What would look dosage? 

I found that injecting tryptamines gives the maximum efect that substance can offer, and sometimes it is really economic. Thanks for answers.

greets


----------



## Jabberwocky

check the big and dandy thread (use google to search) for comments by Dondante and Psood0nym. They both IMed AMT. I believe psood0nym only takes it that way now and dondante won't try it again that way since it caused a lot of nausea for him (iirc at least).


----------



## Xorkoth

Merged in a question about IM AMT.  I know that some here have plenty of experience with it, but I am not one of them.


----------



## psood0nym

In my experience 20mg IM is roughly equivalent in intensity to 50-60mg oral.  Only use aMT hcl for IM or convert the freebase to an injectable acid.  I do prefer aMT this way because in my experience I plateau within an hour instead of 2.5-3 hrs, tripping time is shortened to a more manageable 8hrs or so (this was not the case for Dondante's 20mg IM trip), and it conserves material.  I think Dondante would've experienced nausea if he had used it orally too.  I say this because many find using aMT rectally i.e. bypassing the stomach, reduces nausea, and because I've experienced nausea orally with the freebase (many consider it harder on the body) but never with IM.  Also, Dondante was using aMT citrate, not the hydrochloride.  It doesn't seem like this should make a difference, but who knows.


----------



## Bare_head

i really want ot get hold of aMT again, its like priceless to me.. it really is a wonderful drug.. i would be interested in rectal dosing .. maybe not IM injection because i dont really know how to change something from the freebase to HCL


----------



## Xorkoth

Agreed, I love AMT a lot... it's my favorite recreational drug which is also very valuable as a therapeutic tool.  It's just one of those things I have a hard time controlling myself with... it makes me feel so good and at peace that I tend to want to use it every day.  AMT to me is like what MDMA wants to be, but fails miserably at.

To change from freebase to HCl you just put the freebase in a small bit of distilled water and add a drop or two of hydrochloric acid, which you can get in the form of muriatic acid at the hardware store.  Or you can use any other acid such as citric acid (drop or two of lemon juice perhaps or you can get it in crystal form at a health food store), or vinegar (acetic acid).  Conversion from base to salt is extremely easy.  But you need to worry about sterility for IM dosing as well.  When I used it rectally I often converted to the HCl first for faster absorbtion.  Plus the HCl always felt smoother and cleaner to me.


----------



## Jabberwocky

*************************************************************
HARM REDUCTION: You MUST use a wheel filter in order to catch any impurities in your AMT if you're prepping it for injection.
*************************************************************

psood0nym, wow it potentiates it that much!? I thought it was roughly equipotent, shit I was going to try 25mg IM to start with  I'm glad you wrote that!!!

Perhaps I'll try 15mg IM for my first go (i've done 10mg oral and it was a GREAT day enhancer).


----------



## psood0nym

Yeah it does potentiate it by that much in my experience.  I know others have found that using it insufflated or rectally doesn't change potency that much, so it's strange that IM would more than double the potency (though this degree of potentiation with IM is near standard with most tryps/phens afaik.)  Despite the weirdness, Dondante's experience with 20mg (of  the freebase weight, a potentially important consideration), even though it was his first time and he has nothing to gauge it off of, still corroborates my claim because it's highly unlikely, assuming potency equivalence between ROAs, that just 20mg orally would make someone sick.  

I usually separate the doses by about 20 minutes because they can be pretty stimulating (not bad though.) At this point I'm familiar enough with IM aMT that I can feel a subtle change as I'm injecting it, and feel definite effects by 10 minutes, though your report of IM DPT and MET onset times (thanks for the report btw) is far longer than is usual/expected, so you may want to just wait ~40 minutes after definite effects are noticed before finishing the second half.  I think you'll be fine with 20mgs as long as you follow the split dose regimen and wait 40 minutes, as it usually takes an hour for a dose to start leveling out for me, and by 40 you'll probably have a good idea where you're going to be.  If I don't want to inject it all I just squirt the remainder in some juice and swallow it.  Good luck with your first fully psychedelic dose; though where aMT really shines in my experience is in combinations.  Best so far w/20mg IM aMT: DPT (IM 25-50mg); 4-AcO-DMT (IM 10-15mg); 5-MeO-DMT (smoked 10mg).


----------



## Jabberwocky

Shut the gates and sunset
After that you can't get out
You can see the bigger picture
Find out what it’s all about
You're open to the skyline
You won't want to go back home
In a garden full of angels
You will never be alone

But oh the road is long
The stones that you are walking on
Have gone

With the moonlight to guide you
Feel the joy of being alive
The day that you stop running
Is the day that you arrive

And the night that you got locked in
Was the time to decide
Stop chasing shadows
Just enjoy the ride

If you close the door to your house
Don't let anybody in
It's a room that's full of nothing
All that underneath your skin
Face against the window
You can't watch it fade to grey
And you'll never catch the fickle wind
If you choose to stay

But oh the road is long
The stones that you are walking on
Have gone

With the moonlight to guide you
Feel the joy of being alive
The day that you stop running
Is the day that you arrive

And the night that you got locked in
Was the time to decide
Stop chasing shadows
Just enjoy the ride

Stop chasing shadows
Just enjoy the ride


----------



## Jabberwocky

I injected 7mg of AMT subq and it was a very nice trip. I have taken before (highest dose) 7mg of AMT orally. This felt substantially stronger. I noticed lots of body rushes and head tingles. Colors were much more saturated and deep. For a few moments there at the peak I felt very similar to how I feel on half a good e pill. Psychologically, I felt tremendously happy. I would call it euphoric. It was sunny today and as I passed by many people on the way to class I noticed the sun mingling with these people - there were tiny auras around each person, shimmering with energy. Visual hallucination. Also standing under the shower blasting over my head I completely 'blacked out' or 'zoned out' and my CEVs became a picture of the scene around me (shower head directly overhead spraying me, tiled walls, shower curtain). It was a crazy visual field!

All in all very satisfied. I guess I am a little affected still (9 hours later) after smoking I am still pretty buzzed on the AMT.


----------



## Xorkoth

I may have just absorbed a little from you


----------



## Jamshyd

The fact that 7mg had a definite effect on you further proves a point I totally agree with: people (historically) have a habit of overdosing on AMT, hence its "reputation" for nausea and bodyload.


----------



## Fishface

So what would be your recommended dose/route of administration, Jamshyd?


----------



## Jabberwocky

yes, I would definitely suggest people start low on this chemical. However, I have a history of being somewhat sensitive to both monoamine releasers and tryptamines.

I am going to try 15-20mg IM sometime soon. AMT really is a wonderful drug..I feel like it has a lot of potential to produce long-lasting changes.


----------



## Jamshyd

I actually only had one experience with AMT, at 25mg (freebase) orally. It was more than enough, but still not uncomfortable.

I will probably be experimenting with it again soon, and this time it will be a salt administered rectally.


----------



## Jabberwocky

oh random point, but once i started smoking on AMT, I could NOT stop. I smoked probably 8 bowls yesterday while coming down. It felt SOOOoooOOOooOOOoo good. Like orgasmic inhaling the marijuana smoke.

I told my roommate the marijuana chilled my lungs and he said I was a bit spun.


----------



## Jamshyd

Heh, it must have felt like inhaling horse-fart, eh?  Gawd I hate smoking things....

A friend once smoked tiny unmeasured doses of AMT. He spent most of the night literally floored.


----------



## Event

Did you notice very increase heart rate and blood pressure on AMT?


----------



## Jabberwocky

Jamshyd said:
			
		

> Heh, it must have felt like inhaling horse-fart, eh?  Gawd I hate smoking things....
> 
> A friend once smoked tiny unmeasured doses of AMT. He spent most of the night literally floored.


oh jamshyd please note I was talking about smoking marijuana not smoking AMT. I was talking about smoking marijuana while ON AMT.

I wouldnt smoke AMT, it would be incredibly harsh smoke I predict.


----------



## Jamshyd

AH, now your post makes much more sense. 

But yeah, AMT freebase is smokeable, and apparently pretty potent. But I hate inhaling my drugs...


----------



## Black

where do you guys get your amt from?!? (rhetorical question, of course)
it just sounds like an incredibly interesting chemical, i would love to try some. in the meantime: keep up the good reports


----------



## Jamshyd

Black said:
			
		

> where do you guys get your amt from?!? (rhetorical question, of course)
> it just sounds like an incredibly interesting chemical, i would love to try some. in the meantime: keep up the good reports


No, I'll actually reply to that.

Since I don't trip like its going out of fashion, I am able to strech a single purchase over several years. I am sure it is the same for many people here.


----------



## BreakingSet

After a bit of trial and error, I found aMT to be valuable when taken at 2mg every other day or so. At that kind of museum dose there is no real trip, but there is an antidepressant and stimulating effect that helps carry one through busy periods or depressing moments. It seems to lift the mood and stimulate the mind, and body, which is no surprise given that this was trialed as a prescription antidepressant.


----------



## VerbalTruist

I have a question:  Would using a liquid measure for AMT be ok?  Will it keep well in a solution of 40% Grain Alcohol and 60% distilled water?


----------



## BreakingSet

I have known some to keep this in a stronger alcohol solution for up to 2 weeks with no perceived degradation. Not sure about real long term stability. Their opinion: you should only desolve according to your intensions in the short term.


----------



## Jabberwocky

just fyi, a subcutaneous injection of AMT acetate (underneath some stomach fat) caused a knot to form under the skin that took roughly 3 weeks to 'dissolve'.

I'm gonna stick to IM from now on with it I think.


----------



## Xorkoth

euphoricnod said:
			
		

> I have a question:  Would using a liquid measure for AMT be ok?  Will it keep well in a solution of 40% Grain Alcohol and 60% distilled water?



AMT freebase will not dissolve in water.  I would be surprised if you had AMT that was not the freebase.  You could probably add a few drops of an acid to a distilled water/alcohol mixture to get it to dissolve.  Has anyone had any experience storing AMT in a salt form in liquid?


----------



## butane

I see no reason why it wouldn't dissolve in a 40/60 alcohol/water solution as the freebase is fairly soluble in alcohol.


----------



## Xorkoth

Hmm, I guess I haven't tried... I've always just weighed it out as it requires a fairly high dose.  It seems though that I've had issues in the past with chemicals that dissolve in alcohol.  Actually, it was AMT I _think_ (though I'm not sure).  I seem to recall that I dissolved some in a bit of alcohol, which worked fine.  Then I added some water so that I could drink it without burning my mouth, and it turned white and cloudy (I believe this is called "louching").

This was from last year so it's possible that it's some invented memory, as I ingested foolish amounts of AMT throughout that year.


----------



## Tranced

Anyone else think that AMT and cannabis definitely have quite a good synergy going on? I've always felt nothing much off AMT (usually about 60mg) for a couple of hours then got bored of waiting and smoked a joint. It always kicks it right in for me when it almost seemed as if it was going to do nothing at all.

I find the progression of effects very strange on this drug. There are at least a few very defined stages ready to take their course over the night. What do they consist of for other people?


----------



## psood0nym

*LSD and aMT*



			
				cubehead said:
			
		

> Does anyone have any info or experience mixing amt w/ lsd?
> 
> In a couple months some friends and I are going up to Humboldt for a weekend. I was gonna be getting some 15mg doses of amt and sugarcubes with probably a single drop of liquid. I'm imagining after taking amt a couple times that it might add a nice mild touch to the lsd.
> 
> Any insight into this would be appreciated. Thanks.


Ringing endorsement for the LSD/aMT combination here.  I used it last night with ~150ug of LSD and 12mg of aMT intramuscularly at T + 1.5.  I used it pretty much spontaneously simply because a chance confluence of events allowed it--and because I had not used LSD in a long time. I don’t take the night--alone in the apartment for a few hours followed by music and drinking with friends--to be a good gauge of the combo’s spiritual potential, which was, obviously, lacking under the circumstances.  It was a great time though.  Of all the psychedelics I’ve mixed with aMT (DPT, 4-AcO/ho-DMT, 2C-E, DMT, and ketamine) LSD adulterated it the least.  It felt like aMT giving me a love bite.  

Conversation was easy, thoughts were lucid and fluid (by my own judgment and the reactions of others), and I felt a very even positive emotional energy that remained strong throughout the night.  If I do it again I think I’ll use the aMT first and take the LSD 15-20 minutes after first alerts with some pot to tamp down the stimulation of both of these drugs coming on at once.  LSD is a good match for aMT because, for me, it’s the most formidable psychedelic that can come close to matching aMT’s endurance.  At this intensity level it seems like an ideal combination for an up tempo day or nightlong event where you might have a few times alone or with a smaller group to enjoy the pair’s more contemplative side.

[Edit]: I'll also add that there were empathogenic effects beyond aMT's normally mild ones compared to something like MDMA. It was pretty similar to a very long more cost effective candy flip actually, or closer to it than anything else I've tried, including tryptamines like DPT (surprisingly not that good, but I think my timing was off) or 4-AcO-MiPT together with MDMA.  In some ways it was superior.  It would have been easier to have fully functional sex on it than with MDMA and LSD at a similar intensity I think, though quality-wise probably inferior due to lesser tactile enhancement (could perhaps be supplemented with a low dose of an amphetamine to fine tune this.)  I may try that out at a slightly lower dose sometime over the next few months come to think of it!


----------



## patitafon

Does anybody have experiences with AMT IV ?


----------



## psood0nym

^Yes.  I have IV'd aMT HCL at 3mg and then at 3mg again a half hour later, which put me at a fairly euphoric ++.  I think if I had done it all at once it would have lasted about 1.5-2 hrs (I ended up drinking so it's hard to say.)  I felt it quickly but it still took 10-15 minutes to reach plateau.  It wasn't really any better than 10mg IM.  For me IMing shortens the experience compared to oral to around 5hrs (at up to 20mgs.)  That's an ideal duration, so I never repeated the IV experiment.  Like LSD, there's really nothing to be gained from using IV qualitatively speaking either.


----------



## Xorkoth

If I ever get some AMT again (I refuse to obtain a quantity because I'll use it every day or two until it's gone), I will definitely mix it with LSD.  I have always wanted to try the combo... I'm sure it would be absolutely stunning!


----------



## Bare_head

i indeed have tried this combo and found found it beautiful, the cisuals were much more dynamic and sharp if you know what i mean. The headspace was lovely until the crash, which needed benzos to help me sleep


----------



## patitafon

Last question, how looks duration of AMT after IM ingestion? Is it shorter than oral?


----------



## vedwit

I am thinking of trying a low dose (10mg) AMT trip on the first day of a 5 day music festival, just how strong would this be? will I be safe mixing it with other drugs? mainly ketamine but also uppers such as m1, mmcat, ethcat, mdma and coke. I will probably take some of those drugs while on the AMT and all of them through out the weekend.

I was looking for a low level trip which lasted for some time which I could use as a base for the other drugs if I wanted, does this sound like a good use for the AMT?


----------



## Xorkoth

10mg of AMT will probably leave you wanting a bit more.  But it should be pleasant.  It's safe to mix with ketamine.  AMT is NOT safe (I repeat, NOT safe) to mix with any uppers, period.  It has MAOI properties and mixing it with uppers could cause a hypertensive crisis or at the very least a very uncomfortable experience.


----------



## Jabberwocky

ketamine and MAOIs are technically contradicted although it appears like combining AMT and ketamine is relatively safe.


----------



## vedwit

Thanks for the information, I had assumed the MAOI propertys would be negligible with such a low dose.

Would it be safe to use uppers the day after doing AMT, if I ate the AMT at lunch time then started on the uppers at lunch time the next day (probably with little or no sleep)?


If not I may just stick to LSD and save the AMT for another time, unfortuanately I dont get many chances to take any long lasting substances due to work constraints.


----------



## Xorkoth

Well, you would probably be _safe_ with such a low dose, but I wouldn't want to combine AMT with stimulants... it would be too much stimulation.  Have you used AMT before?  A good solid dose of AMT by itself would be fantastic for your purposes, in my opinion.

Uppers the day after would probably be safe.


----------



## B9

> but I wouldn't want to combine AMT with stimulants




Well ( being irresponsible & all that) I've combined quite reasonable quantities of both with no obvious negative effects.


----------



## Jabberwocky

uppers the day after will be safe, but mind you that you will probably crash harder as your brain will be partially depleted of monoamines (AMT releases serotonin and dopamine).

10mg of AMT is quite nice, very euphoric and pleasant ride, some mild color saturation/brightening.


----------



## B9

We noticed no problems whatsoever despite dosing several days on MDPV & AMT.

Sorry to be a twat like but that's what happened.

Then again maybe we're that fried that we aint sensitive enough to notice something as ephemeral as a "crash"


----------



## Jabberwocky

AMT releases just as much serotonin as MDMA. Its likely a lot less neurotoxic though because MDMA's neurotoxicity comes about from its dual release of serotonin and dopamine (and AMT releases MUCH less dopamine) not to mention its method of action is drawn out over some few more hours.

Its still not a good chemical to abuse and should not be taken lighthearted. I'd say more than once a month is pushing it as far as long-term health goes, but then again I try to err on the cautious side of things since I really like it when my body is healthy/fit.


----------



## highandrolling

amt is the ultimate concert drug hands down.  im not condoning this but i found 50mg amt with about a 1/4 the normal dose of mdma i take about 6 hours after the amt, to be absolutely breathtaking.  i have never felt such euphoria before ever, the happiness was so pure and from the deepest part of my soul, every beat of my heart sent rushing my body senses, more than the first time i took mdma

i believe that amt does act as an maoi, but to a small degree, dont get me wrong tho, it intensified the mdma alot and definately has the potential to harm you if you arent responsible


----------



## Jabberwocky

oh man sounds good. I think as long as you keep the MDMA dose low you won't get into many problems.

Let me warn you though that the possibility for serotonin syndrome is CERTAINLY there with that combo though as you know.

Careful! Its also probably more important not to be somewhere where your body temperature will rise too much with this combo. Unfortuantely the people attracted to it will probably be at a rave or something similar where body temperatures soar (not good for drug toxicity).


----------



## highandrolling

heres the link to my first couple AMT trip reports, they are very detailed and i think yall will enjoy them 

first journeyhttp://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=382710 - 

amt at pink floyd - 
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?p=6120412#post6120412


----------



## Tranced

How does AMT mix with alcohol? Might be a bit pissed before I take it on Saturday or might start drinking towards the tail end of the trip.

Also, I found about 65mg to be an optimum dose for me and a mate. Good visuals but not at all immersing, were talking for hours and feeling very euphoric. Got quite psychedelic but was fine. Does this indicate that the AMT might have been low quality? I've got it from a different source this time and was just wondering if doing this dose again is likely to produce those sort of effects. Hard to answer I know, but thoughts on likelihood welcome.


----------



## Jabberwocky

you can read some TRs on erowid about doses that high. That level is much more psychedelic than say 40mg for you? I bet it would get trippy.


----------



## Tranced

samadhi_smiles said:
			
		

> you can read some TRs on erowid about doses that high. That level is much more psychedelic than say 40mg for you? I bet it would get trippy.



I've only done it 4 times now. The first time I did 30mg and got very much threshold effects, I felt stimulated, chatty, a little bit euphoric but not much. I was getting CEV's, sort of, but they were quite static. Had a very weird K-hole (who'd have guessed it??) with some strange visual distortions.

The other times I did about 55-65 and got fairly similiar effects each time, very chatty and stimulated, lots of very serotogenic feeling head rushes and then after quite a few hours it got a bit more psychedelic and the visuals amped up quite a bit. It wasn't at all immersive though and I was quite capable speaking to people.

Basically, I'm looking for recreational value at a beach party when my mates will be on 2c-b/mdma. I'm just wondering if this could actually be a high dose. I think I'll just do 50-55 to be on the safe side.


----------



## Jabberwocky

have you thought about plugging some? I've heard that can make things shorter and more intense (compacting the trip down some more). It would also more evenly match your friend's trips if they dose the 2Cb after the MDMA).


----------



## Xorkoth

Tranced said:
			
		

> How does AMT mix with alcohol? Might be a bit pissed before I take it on Saturday or might start drinking towards the tail end of the trip.
> 
> Also, I found about 65mg to be an optimum dose for me and a mate. Good visuals but not at all immersing, were talking for hours and feeling very euphoric. Got quite psychedelic but was fine. Does this indicate that the AMT might have been low quality? I've got it from a different source this time and was just wondering if doing this dose again is likely to produce those sort of effects. Hard to answer I know, but thoughts on likelihood welcome.



65mg is my optimal dose too, although it wasn't at first... if I haven't had it for a long time (like now), 50-55mg is better.  AMT effects us all differently it seem, just like everything else... I never found AMT to be psychedelic in the same sense as most other tryptamines are even most phenethylamines at any dose (I've taken it up to 110mg - with a lot of tolerance though).  Some people report life-changing thoughts and wild visuals with AMT, but I have never had that.  For me, AMT produces a state sort of like MDMA except much better (in my opinion).  It brightens colors and makes things look "fuzzy", and it sometimes makes shadows and areas of color seem to shimmer and ripple.  I have great thoughts... my mind seems better connected and I feel like a genius, like my mind is working incredibly quickly and efficiently.  I feel an absolutely fantastic body high and I feel extremely empathic, in a similar way to MDMA... AMT is my favorite empathogen for sure.  It makes me want to talk, talk talk also.

So, your reactions sound very similar to mine.  But apparently some people find it more traditionally psychedelic.

Oh, also, rectal dosing reduces the required dose by just a little... it's not particularly noticeable.  I never reduced the dose rectally, but the dose I took was better with that method.  Rectal dosing definitely dramatically reduces the bodyload... I rarely felt very uncomfortable coming up that way (AMT is always a little uncomfortable to come up on though), and I never once got a headache from it that way (orally I got headaches at some point about 50% of the time).  Overall I would choose to take it rectally (or maybe IM which I haven't tried) unless I couldn't for some reason, and then I'd take it orally.


----------



## Tranced

Xorkoth said:
			
		

> 65mg is my optimal dose too, although it wasn't at first... if I haven't had it for a long time (like now), 50-55mg is better.  AMT effects us all differently it seem, just like everything else... I never found AMT to be psychedelic in the same sense as most other tryptamines are even most phenethylamines at any dose (I've taken it up to 110mg - with a lot of tolerance though).  Some people report life-changing thoughts and wild visuals with AMT, but I have never had that.  For me, AMT produces a state sort of like MDMA except much better (in my opinion).  It brightens colors and makes things look "fuzzy", and it sometimes makes shadows and areas of color seem to shimmer and ripple.  I have great thoughts... my mind seems better connected and I feel like a genius, like my mind is working incredibly quickly and efficiently.  I feel an absolutely fantastic body high and I feel extremely empathic, in a similar way to MDMA... AMT is my favorite empathogen for sure.  It makes me want to talk, talk talk also.
> 
> So, your reactions sound very similar to mine.  But apparently some people find it more traditionally psychedelic.
> 
> Oh, also, rectal dosing reduces the required dose by just a little... it's not particularly noticeable.  I never reduced the dose rectally, but the dose I took was better with that method.  Rectal dosing definitely dramatically reduces the bodyload... I rarely felt very uncomfortable coming up that way (AMT is always a little uncomfortable to come up on though), and I never once got a headache from it that way (orally I got headaches at some point about 50% of the time).  Overall I would choose to take it rectally (or maybe IM which I haven't tried) unless I couldn't for some reason, and then I'd take it orally.



I always use it rectally, and usually convert to the freebase aswell.

What you described sounds pretty much exactly how it is for me, except for that I do get visuals, although they are definitely not anywhere near as prevalent as a decent dose of acid/mushrooms/2c-b. I agree it's definitely not psychedelic in the traditional sense for me, but after about 4 hours (I think) it definitely seems to have a deeper edge to me than MDMA does. Sort of like (slightly) psychedelic MDMA which is how I've always described it.

What you say about some people finding it seemingly quite different rings true to me as well, it's the reason I had concerns about the dosing and why I wasn't using erowid as a reliable source on this occasion. If you check highandrollings "first time" trip report on page 5, his 50mg experience sounds totally different to my times on AMT.

I think I'll just settle at 55mg and it should be fine.

Is there any way to convert the HCL to freebase before I go out in preperation for plugging it with a capsule? Last time I put vinegar inside the gel cap popped  and I can't really take a bottle of vinegar to a beach.

Thanks by the way.


----------



## Jabberwocky

why do you want to convert it to freebase? Won't that burn a bit more than the HCL?


----------



## Tranced

Ahh, fuck. Do I have it the wrong way round?


----------



## butane

Vinegar wouldn't convert it to the freebase anyway, it could convert it to the acetate salt.  Anyway, I would want to have something in the salt form and not the freebase were I going to plug it.  The only thing the freebase is useful for is smoking; a salt is superior in every other way.


----------



## Xorkoth

I find that AMT HCl tends to be gentler.  I usually put the freebase in water (it won't dissolve and pretty much floats on the top).  Use like 3mL.  Then put 1 drop of relatively dilute hydrochloric acid in (I used hardware store muriatic acid, 30% HCl), and stir it up for a while.  It should change to a more clear crystal and slowly dissolve... it also smells quite sharply but in a different way from the freebase AMT smell.  You might need another drop of HCl, but go really easy on it or you'll have a wee bit of leftover HCl.  When all or very nearly all of the crystals have dissolved, you can then drink it, or plug it, or dry it to form crystals.


----------



## Tranced

butane said:
			
		

> Vinegar wouldn't convert it to the freebase anyway, it could convert it to the acetate salt.  Anyway, I would want to have something in the salt form and not the freebase were I going to plug it.  The only thing the freebase is useful for is smoking; a salt is superior in every other way.



I had it the wrong way round. It's the HCL I was after and HCL I've got so I wouldn't have to do anything. If like last time I had the freebase, there is something mentioned earlier in this thread about using vinegar to convert freebase > HCL.


----------



## Xorkoth

^^ Vinegar would convert it into AMT acetate, actually.  Hydrochloric acid is the only way to turn it into AMT HCl.  But yes, it would turn it into a salt, as vinegar is an acid (acetic acid).  Some other common acids are sulphuric (forms sulphate salts), tartaric acid (cream of tartar - forms tartrate salts) and citric acid (forms citrate salts).  A bit of trivia: LSD is actually LSD tartrate... I guess because it's the most stable of the salts of LSD.


----------



## Tranced

After searching I see you're right, samadhi actually said that a few drops of vinegar would convert to the salt - the acetate as you say. I'm assuming that this is still preferable to freebase though?


----------



## Survival0200

Can AMT be used intravenously?


----------



## IGNVS

Xorkoth said:
			
		

> ^^ Vinegar would convert it into AMT acetate, actually.  Hydrochloric acid is the only way to turn it into AMT HCl.  But yes, it would turn it into a salt, as vinegar is an acid (acetic acid).  Some other common acids are sulphuric (forms sulphate salts), tartaric acid (cream of tartar - forms tartrate salts) and citric acid (forms citrate salts).  A bit of trivia: LSD is actually LSD tartrate... I guess because it's the most stable of the salts of LSD.



tartaric acid isnt cream of tartar, i tried turning dmt into dmt tartate with cream of tartar and it didnt work... (was trying to make a smooth snortable version)


----------



## Xorkoth

Tranced said:
			
		

> After searching I see you're right, samadhi actually said that a few drops of vinegar would convert to the salt - the acetate as you say. I'm assuming that this is still preferable to freebase though?



I would imagine so... I've only used HCl though.


----------



## psood0nym

Survival0200 said:
			
		

> Can AMT be used intravenously?


Yes.  I did it once.  It was pretty pointless, but it satisfied my curiosity.  I posted about it in this thread.


----------



## spaceyourbass

The craziest thing that's ever happened to me was after a very large dose of LSD.  I closed my eyes and was sitting at the lunch table with my friends (I was in middle school at the time).  Not only did I see my friends, I heard them too.  I actually had an entire conversation with them.  I talked to them, and they would respond back to what I said.  It was so wierd, b/c it wasn't like I knew what they would say...just like real life.  

That shit was awesome.


----------



## Xorkoth

^^ Except this thread is about AMT, not LSD.


----------



## cegli

Just wanted to add I plugged 18mg of AMT HCL a couple of days ago as a test dose.  Very low on the psychedelicness scale, but holy crap did I have clean feeling energy and a bit of added joy.

Couldn't stop talking, fiddling with things, bouncing around and smiling.  No nausea with this method, even though I ate 6 large slices of pizza and two cupcakes directly before taking it.  Got a mild headache that lasted for about 24 hours afterwards (mostly taken away by 1 200mg advil).

Took it for an amazing half hour fireworks show that is synchronized with music in a big city.  Sat on a roof top with music blaring watching the fireworks.  Incredible, haha.

Oh yeah, it comes up very slowly still with rectal.  Took an hour or two until I was really going.  Quite different from the ten minutes it takes to peak with rectal 2C-Xs.

I've never tried amphetamine or MDMA, but it was very different from every other class of drugs I've tried (indoles, 4-hos, 5-MeOs, and 2c-xs).  I might not of been able to tell it was a tryptamine if given it in a blind test.  It did feel very clean, none of that 2c-x bizarre body load.  An interesting experience.


----------



## Riemann Zeta

> tartaric acid isnt cream of tartar, i tried turning dmt into dmt tartate with cream of tartar and it didnt work... (was trying to make a smooth snortable version)


Comedy gold!  Would you like some DMT with your fish & chips, sir?  But to add something topical to the thread: I've always wanted to try AMT, if only it weren't so insanely rare...  I personally love (d)-amphetamine and the tryptamine version of amphetamine sounds like it would be a sure-fire winner.  Has anyone ever gotten to try the different enantiopure AMTs and if so, was (S)-AMT any different than (R)-AMT?


----------



## feelgoodhit

hey, what kind of settings do you guys like to take aMT in? i only have one 50 mg dose, and want to make it count. 


feelgoodhit


----------



## SKL

A large outdoor music festival is the only setting I've taken it in, and it was great.


----------



## cegli

feelgoodhit said:
			
		

> hey, what kind of settings do you guys like to take aMT in? i only have one 50 mg dose, and want to make it count.
> 
> 
> feelgoodhit



I find it makes me very energetic and talkative, and I want to run around and do things.  So anywhere that you can be active, or have some people to talk to and won't mind if you're speaking about nothing.  I had a great time socializing with people and getting a couple of my friends to go to the beach and run around with me.  That was really fun.

A non ideal setting for me would be stuck inside a house, isolated with no one to talk to.  I don't think that would be that great personally.


----------



## Jabberwocky

I think an ideal setting would be aside a stream with a sunny day and quiet sylvan surroundings. But, I also prefer MDMA in solitude also so I may be different.


----------



## feelgoodhit

btw guys, my last question still stands, but wanted to add another - how can I tell if my aMT is the freebase or the HCL?


----------



## Jabberwocky

dissolve it in some water, if it goes with a little bit of stirring maybe a touch of heat, then its HCL. If it doesn't, then its freebase.

If it doesn't, then add a little bit of HCL to the solution (just a touch) to create AMT HCL. Or you can add vinegar to create AMT acetate, or citric powder to create AMT citrate.

AMT should probably not be stored for any amount of time within solution, but I think it may be worth converting to a salt to ease the bodyload (most reports about bad bodyload seem to correlate with the freebase).


----------



## feelgoodhit

so there's no way to tell just by looking?


----------



## SKL

no. dissovle in water as above to tell if you have the fb or salt


----------



## Delsyd

just to clarify.
the freebase will NOT dissolve in water. whereas the other salts will.

my ideal setting for AMT would be with some people i love in a comfortable place with good tunes.
AMT is really great for socializing and having deep conversations with your friends.

and nitrous goes great with it.


----------



## WaseFraKa

^k goes also great with it, every bump gives you those intense pleasure rushes, yummy


----------



## Xorkoth

feelgoodhit said:
			
		

> so there's no way to tell just by looking?



AMT freebase is white, not clear.  If old, it may be slightly yellow.  Whenever I have put the freebase in water and added a couple of drops of HCl, it seems to turn a sort of whitish-clear before dissolving.  So I suspect the HCl looks a bit different, but since I have never seen HCl crystals dry, I couldn't say for sure.

My favorite use for it is with a single friend or perhaps a small group of good friends.  I have also used it in larger social settings where I was the only one tripping.  Basically it's fantastic for socializing and I prefer it in a social setting to being alone.


----------



## mu.

Yeah it's a perfect substance for socializing. Very real euphoria but not too much and fake like mdma or m1. AMT is also a very nice museum substance, good for apreciate art. My AMT is white , and i have also a slighty yellow one because this sachet is more old. However AMT has a very distinct odor. A very bad smell like shit.


----------



## donvliet

I read that AMT increases monoamines. This means that it is dangerous to combine it with an MAOI, right?


----------



## Xorkoth

Correct... definitely don't combine it with an MAOI.


----------



## organicshroom

I have a different question. 

Any idea how AMT would react with marquis reagent?


----------



## feelgoodhit

according to Erowid, aMT will turn a dark brownish-yellow color when tested with Marquis.


----------



## organicshroom

Thankyou for that :D ............ For a moment there I thought they were starting to adulterate xtc pills with AMT, or at least with a small amount. But marquis indicates some other foreign substance instead.


----------



## organicshroom

*legal status in NewZealand*

As you can see below, in New Zealand it's covered under the class C tryptamine analogue act.



> Schedule 3
> Class C controlled drugs, Part 7
> Part 7 was inserted, as from 13 January 1988, by section 10 Misuse of Drugs Amendment Act (No 2) 1987 (1987 No 170).
> 
> ---
> 
> DMT (DIMETHYLTRYPTAMINE) ANALOGUES, in which the 3-(2-aminoethyl)indole nucleus has additional radicals, either alone or in combination, attached as follows:
> (a) 1 or 2 alkyl radicals, each with up to 6 carbon atoms, including cyclic radicals, attached to the amino nitrogen atom
> 
> (b) 1 or 2 methyl groups, or an ethyl group, attached to the carbon atom adjacent to the amino nitrogen atom:
> 
> (c) Any combination of up to 5 alkyl radicals and/or alkoxy radicals (each with up to 6 carbon atoms, including cyclic radicals) and/or halogen radicals, attached to the benzene ring.



Source:- http://legislation.govt.nz/act/publ...ts_act_misuse+of+drugs&id=DLM436723#DLM436723


----------



## fastandbulbous

^ DALT still escapes that pretty comprehensive legislation :D


----------



## Bare_head

after the rough comeup the amt high is probably the best feeling on the planet, even more natural than MDMA and other psychdelics i have tried, i soon found out it also needed treating with respect, like all things, tho amt is probably my fave, along with 2CT-7, MDA, psilocybin.


----------



## organicshroom

Heres me getting my hopes up because I thought our laws were similar to the UK.

Is DALT worth a bothering with and does it share any similarity's with AMT?


----------



## Mr. White

Incidentaly, i think (hope) that AMT is not covered by australias very comprehensive analogue laws. The all substitutions of the nitrogen are analogues of DMT, but AMT has a methyl group on the alpha carbon, technically not an analogue of any controlled tryptamine. Though there is that phrase "or is otherwise an analogue of a controlled substance" that could throw a spanner in the works.


----------



## fastandbulbous

It's an analogue of AET, which I believe is on the UN Convention on Psychotropic Drugs banned list, which means just about everywhere has legislation covering AET


----------



## bluedolphin

I'm seeing a lot of comparisons between AMT and MDMA type experiences here.

I really don't see AMT as a drug like this at all. For me it was a lot like LSD... 30mg gave me similar visuals to 100ug of LSD and a similar mindset as well. Maybe a little more sociable and euphoric. And certainly a tenser comedown on the body and muscles.

Just a note of caution for those who think this drug doesn't have the potential to be a heavy psychedelic intoxicant.


----------



## Mr. White

fastandbulbous said:


> It's an analogue of AET, which I believe is on the UN Convention on Psychotropic Drugs banned list, which means just about everywhere has legislation covering AET



rats....


----------



## organicshroom

^ We live in the wrong part of the world Mr White........ Keen for a trip to the UK?


----------



## Mr. White

definetly. So long as i'm not paying for it haha


----------



## bbx4

I'm trying to figure out if my AMT is freebase or HCl salt.  It is perfectly white, kinda waxy meaning some will stick to my metal knife and scale.  It has a very faint smell of chemical fertilizer, not stinky at all.  It does seem to dissolve in water, but it takes a bit of mixing.  Maybe it isn't dissolved just broken apart in the water?  

Also when vaporized, it leaves a black residue.  I was under the impression that freebase AMT would not do this.

I began to think it was the hydrochloride salt because I do not experience any nausea but I have only taken it at 25 mg's.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks.


----------



## Xorkoth

Sounds like a salt.  Look at it when you stir it into water... if it's the freebase you will definitely be able to see the crystals suspended in the water.  Also, the freebase smells... really strongly.


----------



## immad

I tried to vaporize fb aMT and it didn't leave black residue. So either you've got a salt or it's horribly impure (which I doubt, since it's perfectly white and aMT shouldn't be cut).


----------



## bbx4

Yes, I doubt it is impure.  I now believe it to be the HCl salt.  Thank you very much Xorkoth and immad!


----------



## NeuroDr

Ive had some AMT HCl waiting for a special occasion, every once in a while i pop in here and it gets me all excited to try it lol...i think i want to convert to freebase tho so I can vaporize. 

bbx4 how was the experience vaporizing 25mg of the HCl?


----------



## bbx4

The most AMT I have vaporized was only 10 mg.  I have tried it orally at 25 mg.

With 10 mg vaporized, the smoke was very harsh and hard to inhale.  The effects were very subtle as well, I was expecting more.  This leads me to believe vaporizing the HCl salt is inefficient, but I could be wrong because I haven't tried the freebase.  I would also like to convert some of my HCl to freebase for vaporizing as well.


----------



## Xorkoth

It would surprise me if vaporizing the HCl was NOT inefficient... I'm pretty sure it would burn some away and waste it.  According to Shambles however, vaporizing the freebase is most effective.


----------



## NeuroDr

Oh ok, how was the 25 oral experience? Duration and effects-wise?


----------



## bbx4

It lasted around 10 or 11 hours.  I came up to a peak at about 2 hours, but was definetly feeling it about 45 minutes into it.  I didn't experience any nausea or discomfort at all.  I had some CEV's but not much.  Everything was much brighter than it would be normally.  I noticed some time dilation as well.  I enjoyed dancing, it felt as it gave me some excess energy I should lose by doing something.  I think hiking on a 25 mg dose would be wonderful.  

I was probably at a ++ for the experience.  I was bored if I did not have anyone to talk to and I felt very lonely when no one was present.

I can't wait to try this again, probably at a higher dose, in a social situation.  Hopefully with a few other people tripping on AMT with me.  Can't wait for summer!


----------



## Shambles

Xorkoth said:


> According to Shambles however, vaporizing the freebase is most effective.



It most certainly is 

Although I don't have a huge amount of experience with AMT (and most of what I do have comes from vaped doses) so I may not be the most objective source. 25mg vaporised felt pretty damn strong to me and had me going for a good 24 hours... but I also consumed LSD and MDMA during that 24 hour period so, again, not objective.

Never make a proper researcher me - too much of a messy ol' drugpig 

Would give the AMT/LSD/MDMA combo my very highest recommendation though. Had a great - and long-lasting - positive emotional effect and describing the experience as "euphoric" just doesn't even come close :D


----------



## ungelesene_bettlek

does this compound act as monoamine releaser/reuptake inhibitor or are its euphoric and antidepressant properties solely due to its MAOI activity?


----------



## immad

It's MAOi activity is pretty low, like 10x amphetamine; It's mainly a monoamine releaser afaik.


----------



## psood0nym

ungelesene_bettlek said:


> does this compound act as monoamine releaser/reuptake inhibitor or are its euphoric and antidepressant properties solely due to its MAOI activity?


Releaser and reuptake inhibitor.  Apparently almost as strongly as MDMA. The paper linked to below should make appearances more often. Originally linked to by Dondante in this thread's former incarnation: http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/local_links.php?action=jump&id=1255&catid=18



> Abstract
> We developed a reproducible, simple, and small-scale method for determining the re-uptake and release of monoamines (dopamine, serotonin (5-HT) and norepinephrine), using rat brain synaptosomes. These assays were then applied to study the effects of different kinds of nonmedically used psychoactive drugs on monoamine re-uptake and release. The phenethylamine
> derivatives, 4-fluoroamphetamine, 2-methylamino-3,4-methylene- dioxy-propiophenone (methylone), 1-(1,3-benzodioxol-5-yl)-2-butanamine (BDB), and N-methyl-1-(1,3-benzodioxol-5-yl)-2-butanamine (MBDB), had strong inhibitory effects on the re-uptake of dopamine, 5-HT and norepinephrine. 4-Fluoroamphetamine, methylone and BDB also strongly increased the release of the three monoamines, but MBDB increased 5-HT and norepinephrine
> release, but had little effect on dopamine release. However, 2,5-dimethoxy-4-
> iodophenethylamine (2C-I), 2,5-dimethoxy-4-ethylphenethylamine (2C-E), 2,5-dimethoxy-4-chlorophenethylamine (2C-C), 2,4,5-trimethoxyamphetamine (TMA-2) and 2,4,6-trimethoxyamphetamine (TMA-6), which are methoxylated phenethylamine derivatives, slightly influenced the re-uptake and release of monoamines. *α-Metyltryptamine (AMT), a tryptamine derivative, was one of the strongest re-uptake inhibitors and releasers of the three monoamines.* The tryptamine derivative, 5-methoxy-α-methyltryptamine (5-MeO-AMT), also
> strongly inhibited re-uptake and increased the release of the three monoamines. N,Ndipropyltryptamine (DPT), 5-methoxy-N,N-diisopropyltryptamine (5-MeO-DIPT), 5-methoxy-N,N-methylisopropyltryptamine (5-MeO-MIPT), and 5-methoxy-N,Ndimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-DMT) inhibited monoamine re-uptake, but had few effects on monoamine release. 1-(3-Chlorophenyl)piperazine (3CPP) and 1-(methoxyphenyl)piperazine (4MPP), which are piperazine derivatives, inhibited monoamine re-uptake and accelerated their release. The results suggest that some designer drugs strongly act on the central nerve
> system to the same extent as restricted drugs.


----------



## ungelesene_bettlek

thanks for that fast answers! very interesting... of course it acts as 5HT2A-agonist as well, I guess?


----------



## psood0nym

^Yes, that's right! It chops, it self-cleans, it releases three major monoamines while deciphering messages about the apocalypse from the machine elves in your microwave, it's aMT!


----------



## Shakti

LOL  If only someone could combine aMT with a roomba and an electric can opener.


----------



## Xorkoth

I've heard before that AMT does release monoamines almost as strongly as MDMA, but because it does so over a much longer period of time and not all at once, it's much less dangerous.  I couldn't say for sure if that's true though.  I think Gaian Planes posted about it in 2006 when I was doing way too much AMT.


----------



## psood0nym

^That would make sense of how smooth the euphoria is, and of the fact that there's not much of a crash (I'd read the report over if I had time to see if it makes mention of rates of release).  Of course, I remember Dondante writing something like 40mg aMT (a typical dose for many) is approximately equal to 80mg MDMA, and 80mg MDMA doesn't cause a crash in many people anyways. I've used aMT up to 70mg without a crash though too, and I don't think I could get away with that entirely using 140mg MDMA.  In fact, I've used 10mg IM aMT doses to buffer amphetamine crashes with a lot of success (aMT and MDMA is dangerous BTW). 

But I actually came to post about a very functional combination.  Low dose Adderall and low dose aMT.  Moderate doses of each are stellar, but not exactly helpful in getting things done.  This afternoon was really busy with end of the semester stuff, so I took 10mg of Adderall/5mg propylamphetamine to breeze through it.  I started feeling some body tightness about 2.5 hrs in, and took 5mg aMT IM (~10-15 oral/anti-depressant dose) to see what would happen. 

Incredibly, and despite the fact that it releases more noradrenaline on top of the Adderall, aMT completely alleviated the anxiety and body tightness, all while providing a further mood boost and leaving the cognitive focus in tact. I'm 170lbs, and suspect a dose much higher than I took would start making things liquidy.


----------



## sunyata

does anybody else having experience vaporizing AMT? I have found that it is quite nice that way. Its still kinda long but the duration is much more manageable. the taste is not that bad if you 'sip' at it.


----------



## NeuroDr

I have not yet, but i am planning on it as soon as i have the time to convert to freebase. Shambles swears by it as the best ROA i think, ive wanted to try for a long time. Ive only taken aMT once so far, about 25 mg plugged. It lasted a good 16 hours or so, how does the vaporization ROA compare for you?


----------



## psood0nym

^Using an aMT salt IM at a low dose lasts around 5hrs.  Residuals continue after that but the euphoria is mostly gone and sleep is possible. IM at moderate doses lasts around 8hrs IME.  I tried 3mg once IV and it felt like IM, but shorter and more potent (but no instant rush or anything). IV seems pretty pointless, esp. if, like me, you're not accustomed to having to hit veins.   Plugging is the other option to reduce duration, but from the above it doesn't sound like the reduction is much. 

In my estimation IM is about 2.5 times the potency of oral, eliminates the 1.5-3 hour onset (first alerts in 3-5 minutes), decreases the duration anywhere from 30 to 50 percent the duration of an oral trip, and increase the level of euphoria relative to psychedelia.  I consider it the superior ROA unless you want a longer trip, especially for combining with shorter acting psychedelics. 

A long time ago I watched a friend "vaporize" around 30mg (I think) of the freebase off of foil.  He said he never felt a thing.  A few hours later he did 60mg orally and thought it was great. If you try vaporizing it do it slowly and with as little heat as possible; I suspect a lot is destroyed that way, but maybe I'll try it next time to be sure.


----------



## Xorkoth

^^ Shambles uses it by vaporization... he says the dose is significantly reduced and the effects are smoother and cleaner.  Your friend may have burned it or missing inhaling most of the smoke. 

Either that or Shambles is a mutant freak of nature.


----------



## B9

AMT causes more serotonin to be released than MDMA does - anecdotal but defo true - how this is calculated I can't recall tho.

Vapourising is an art form - I suspect that shambles has it off to a tee :D


----------



## Xorkoth

It does cause more serotonin release, but as I understand it, at a much slower rate than MDMA does, making it less draining.  Also, metabolites of MDMA cause dopamine to be reuptaken into serotonin neurons, damaging those neurons, which is why it's so bad for you.  F&B could explain that to a greater extent as I got it from him.


----------



## psood0nym

fastandbulbous said:
			
		

> 19-04-2007, 14:29
> ^ I discoverd the joy of combining amphetamine with AMT nearly 15 years ago and have introduced friends to it since. Mixing both in a capsule (10-20mg of amphetamine and 15-20mg of AMT) produces what I can only describe as a 'state of grace'. Along with that is the fact that it is an aesthetic enhancer that surpasses even mescaline.
> 
> Probably one of the reasons I was never that impressed with MDMA in a club situation; ampohetamine & AMT together actually seemed superior IMO


Though I've combined aMT and amphetamine many times in the past I've never fully understood the import of this quote until now. Tonight I was looking to relax after a lot of work,  so I combined 6.5g of poppy pods with a couple hits of high grade cannabis and about 6 shots of 80 proof alcohol--a combination that would normally have left me in quite a happy stupor--but I also took 5mg Adderall (insufflated) and 13mg aMT IM. I was able to hold an intelligent conversation without arousing suspicions and compose this post nearly verbatim while listening to Grizzly Bear's "Southern Point" and "Ready, Able," all with a big stupid grin on my face. I don't imagine I could juggle for shit right now but hell if the combo hasn't cut through the more abstract mental clouds like a bolt of lightning. ... a state of grace.


----------



## BreakingSet

Have you (or anyone) tried combining 4-FA and aMT?


----------



## psood0nym

I haven't.  Both aMT and 4-FA release serotonin according to what I've read.  The combo might be dangerous/unpredictable depending on the dose.  Start low, obviously, if you do it.


----------



## sunyata

it is definitely active by vaporizing it. I have done it a couple times. It makes things very color saturated 

and happy 

I'll try IV someday I suppose then.


----------



## psood0nym

IV doesn't really provide any qualitative difference over IM.  You'll feel something soon after injection but it's still a slow build. I only tried it once, but that was my experience of it anyways.


----------



## sunyata

were side-effects heightened?


----------



## psood0nym

^It's hard to say; I only did 4mg IV. It felt about what I'd expect IM to feel like at that dose only, as expected, it came on faster without any kind of rush and faded quicker. There's a little more anxiety during the come up simply because it's faster than oral and there's more euphoria proportionate to psychedelia.  I suppose it might be useful for shaving a few hours off IM's already contracted duration but personally I doubt I'll ever see the need.


----------



## sunyata

ah, well I suspect it was so short because it was a low dose and not because it was IV.

IVing tryptamines tends to seem like it is going to be balls out at the onset but then it levels out almost equipotently to an IM dose (it just came on faster like you say).

That goes for DPT at least. 5-meo-DMT and 5-meo-MIPT are quite different (they truly are much more potent IV than any other route).


----------



## feelgoodhit

Oh, aMT... my old friend.


----------



## tetsuo36

Hi,

would anyone have experience of aMT in combination with Methedrone or Methylone? I was thinking 200mg meth/meph with a small 10mg dose of aMT. I appreciate aMT has (possible) MAOI properties and taking with say MDMA could be an issue, would anyone anticipate similar issues with meth/meph?

Regards and advanced thanks.


----------



## Bare_head

have done it with MDMA and aMT .

20mg of amt with 150mg of really good mdma. it felt great, make sure u keep the aMT dose low and you probably wont even need as much as you would with methylone. i would mix around 150mg-180mg of methylone around 2 hours after 10mg of aMT. have fun


----------



## Imperial Tacohead

For those who've taken this stuff orally, how does it taste?  I hope to procure a bit of this stuff in the near future along with some friends, who, while generally open-minded, would almost certainly blanch at the idea of rectal administration.  I've had good experiences taking MDPV sub-lingually, so I'm wondering whether that's a reasonable possibility, since it sounds like oral is the method to be least preferred.  I saw a report on Erowid saying that the taste was "not unpleasant," which would be delightful if true.


----------



## Coolio

AMT's smell is quite unpleasant, and I don't think the taste is anything to laugh at either. Especially since the dose is so high (25-100mg).


----------



## Delsyd

why not just put it in a capsule or parachute it? that'll get rid of the taste


----------



## Shambles

I don't think I could bring myself to put anything that smells quite so much like shit in my mouth :D

Plugging is a good option but vapourising is by far my preferred MOA with AMT - significantly lower dose and come-up time and with no nausea or bodyload (for me, at least).


----------



## Solipsis

Haha I'd just put it in a capsule and maybe put that in a bigger capsule...
It's just became available somewhere, I'm like definitely getting a gr for keeps -
sounds fantastic tbh


----------



## delphium

Shambles said:


> I don't think I could bring myself to put anything that smells quite so much like shit in my mouth :D
> 
> Plugging is a good option but vapourising is by far my preferred MOA with AMT - significantly lower dose and come-up time and with no nausea or bodyload (for me, at least).



Word.  Vaping freebase AMT is definitely the bees-knees.  It's worth noting, though, that most of the AMT circulating nowadays seems like it comes as the HCL salt and cannot be smoked (at least not with the same degree of efficiency as the freebase).  I don't why vendors have begun leaning towards selling the HCL.  Maybe it's a stability thing.  Or maybe the freebase is just too damn stinky to be FedExing. 

I suppose if one were determined to do so it would be possible to cook up freebase AMT a la the crack method.  Unfortunately, doing leaves one with a product that is insoluble in water and therefore unsuitable for rectal administration.  Choices, choices.


----------



## Coolio

Solipsys said:


> Haha I'd just put it in a capsule and maybe put that in a bigger capsule...
> It's just became available somewhere, I'm like definitely getting a gr for keeps -
> sounds fantastic tbh



I thought AMT was too unstable to be much of a collectable.


----------



## feelgoodhit

^I've never noticed degradation... has anyone?


----------



## Coolio

I've noticed a degradation via change in color and smell over time with AMT and AET.


----------



## |>R()|)!G/-\|_

AMT freebase(I think) stored in plastic bag w/in plastic bag in freezer for 1.5 year + cool, dark place for add'l 1.5 year = change in color from white to yellow (think popcorn butter) and still smells like skatole.


----------



## thedeadlywar

*Question on AMT reguarding safety.*

Lately I've had some DPT and AMT on hand, and my fiance' decided to embark on a psychedelic journey for the first time, she intranasally ingested roughly 50mg of dpt for her 3 previous trips, and now I have roughly 15-20mg of AMT left she wishes to partake in. I know the one time I took the drug I felt a lot of harsh side effects, nausea wise, and it felt as if my body were overheating. My friend is concerned about its ability to raise body temperature, and he seems to have a few safety concerns with me providing her with AMT. So my question is, for her 4th trip, would providing her with roughly 15-20mg of AMT have any type of danger component involved? Any Opinions on the matter? Much appreciated.


----------



## Solipsis

I'm not sure about this mind you, but I think there are more than one commonalities with MDMA, all having to do with serotonin release. The comparison has been made numerous times. It seems more serotonin is released but stretched over a longer period of time, for this reason it is less damaging (because: less acute).
With MDMA it actually doesn't raise your temperature directly but it disrupts your bodies temperature maintenance. So if you go in the baking hot sun or dancing without cooling off you will overheat much more easily which isn't only dangerous but also increases neurotoxicity of the drug. Your body just doesn't realize to cool off effectively enough itself. I bet a-MT works the same way regarding this. The nausea is actually something a-MT is known for (take a look at the main Erowid a-MT vault page and the short description, it's mentioned right away) even though some people aren't bothered by it at all. MDMA might be less prone to cause this but there's a good chance it is all caused by serotonin release in your stomache (5-HT3 receptors...).
I wouldn't really call a substance like a-MT "safe as hell" or anything like that but these side-effects are most likely not symptomatic of damage being done.
Just take precaution against longer periods in hot environments or activities that heat you up and remember that the trip itself can make you a bit distracted or oblivious to the fact that you have to keep taking good - special - care of yourself.

If you are still concerned about experiencing the side-effects themselves lowering the dose is still a good idea of course. Regardless of damage.


----------



## ManRider

Anyone know what the stability is like for aMT HCl? I try to keep these sorts of things sealed and refrigerated anyway, but what kind of degradation am i looking at at room temperature and in the fridge?


----------



## ChasingTheCat

I've got some AMT today. It smells like jenkem  and dissolves in petroleum ether, so I suppose it is freebase (although I imagined the smell a bit more pungent).
Is there any way to tell AMT apart from it's 5-MeO cousin (without testing it, of course).

What's the recommended dose for smoked AMT-freebase? I thought of smoking 5mg doses spaced out 20 to 30 minutes until I reach my sweet spot. How does the smoked dose differ from an oral one?


----------



## Mokriti

ManRider said:


> Anyone know what the stability is like for aMT HCl? I try to keep these sorts of things sealed and refrigerated anyway, but what kind of degradation am i looking at at room temperature and in the fridge?



I'd love an answer to this too if anyone has one.  Seems aMT HCL is what is mostly available these days, and I'm curious about how long it will store.


----------



## |>R()|)!G/-\|_

What is the best way to determine if one has the freebase or the HCl?  I see some refer to a difference in smell.  How different do the two smell?  Could one easily confuse the freebase w/ the HCl based on smell alone?  Also, if one were to rectally administer AMT freebase would it be inactive?


----------



## Shambles

^ I'm not sure of the difference between freebase and HCl but I know AMT works pretty well plugged. Xorketh has more experience of dosing that way than I do but from memory he said that the dose is not as dramatically lower than oral doses compared to most things. I think it lowers nausea, bodyload and come-up time to an extent but also not as drastically as - for example - the 2Cs 



ChasingTheCat said:


> What's the recommended dose for smoked AMT-freebase? I thought of smoking 5mg doses spaced out 20 to 30 minutes until I reach my sweet spot. How does the smoked dose differ from an oral one?



I find 20-25mg to be very pleasant indeed vapourised 

I usually feel fairly drowsy for the first hour or so (often doze off in fact) and then the energy and euphoria build fairly rapidly. For me there is no nausea whatsoever when vapourised and the come-up is nearer an hour than the usual four hours or so from oral dosing 

On the storage/loss of potency thing, I really don't know but had wondered myself. My sample of AMT does seem to be noticably weaker than it was a few months back. I _think_ I have the freebase but am not positive. Does certainly feel weaker though. Mine has been stored in a sealed baggied in a refridgerated place, incidentally.


----------



## delsymfan

I'm quite interested in picking some of this up, being out of the USA and its strict scheduling laws now.

I'm wondering about giving it a mix with some Mescaline from one of the local San Pedro's growing in the street.  

Or if I really wanna do a never before done combo, throw some 4-meo-pcp in there... cause I have it lol


----------



## delphium

|>R()|)!G/-\|_ said:


> What is the best way to determine if one has the freebase or the HCl?  I see some refer to a difference in smell.  How different do the two smell?  Could one easily confuse the freebase w/ the HCl based on smell alone?  Also, if one were to rectally administer AMT freebase would it be inactive?



AMT freebase is insoluble in water, while the HCL salt is freely soluble.  If you're sure the substance that you have is AMT of some sort, stir a little into some H2O and see if it goes into solution.  If you want to administer AMT rectally, I'd definitely recommend converting it to the HCL.


----------



## bbx4

^^^ Yep, I had the same question, turned out that mine was the HCL version.  Apparently the HCl is much less smelly also and will leave a residue when vaporized.



On another note, I've never tried my AMT past a dose of 25 mg and I have been wanting to ever since I acquired it.  Anybody have any fun ideas for something to do do while high on AMT?  

There is a rave I'm considering going to this weekend but I don't know if that would be the appropriate environment.  Any thoughts?


----------



## tylerwashere

I also am thinking of trying aMT. I've read some trip reports and i know some people get really bad stomach pains/cramps and some people dont feel anything at all. I have a stomach condition and i was wondering how bad the nausea really is?


----------



## bbx4

tylerwashere said:


> I also am thinking of trying aMT. I've read some trip reports and i know some people get really bad stomach pains/cramps and some people dont feel anything at all. I have a stomach condition and i was wondering how bad the nausea really is?



I had none with 25 mg of the HCL  From what I have gathered, people generally experience more naseau and the sort from the freebase


----------



## Xorkoth

I don't get stomach issues with vaporized or rectally-dosed AMT (I prefer rectal), but I do with oral dosing.

I think AMT HCL would absorb a bit faster than the freebase when taken rectally, but it definitely works very well as the freebase.


----------



## PepperSocks

Xorkoth said:


> I don't get stomach issues with vaporized or rectally-dosed AMT (I prefer rectal), but I do with oral dosing.
> 
> I think AMT HCL would absorb a bit faster than the freebase when taken rectally, but it definitely works very well as the freebase.



How do you rectally administer a freebase?  What do you dissolve it in?  Or do you just put it in a capsule and insert it?


----------



## obscurus

Xorkoth said:


> I don't get stomach issues with vaporized or rectally-dosed AMT (I prefer rectal), but I do with oral dosing.
> 
> I think AMT HCL would absorb a bit faster than the freebase when taken rectally, but it definitely works very well as the freebase.



I'll have this chemical in my hands very soon. Taken rectally seems to be the most enjoyable judging from this thread's opinion. 
How do I prepare it? Just shove a capsule up my woo-woo?


----------



## Solipsis

oh damz it

browser gots stuck again 8)

post is below


----------



## Solipsis

First of all, check this thread for rectal administration.

Furthermore I think you could just put it in a capsule but it would just be better to dissolve the aMT HCl in a volume of water (I'd say like 2 ml?), if it's the freebase you could add like 1 drop of vinegar to get it to dissolve.
Then suck up this watery solution with a needle/syringe, take off the needle!  
Apply some lubricant (optional and doesn't have to be a commercially available one, maybe like olive oil...?) then shove it in far enough to pass like the sphincter or first bit of butt that closes off the content-holding section, and release the fluid into that content holding section / rectum. Done!

I'll be acquiring aMT in about 2 weeks or something  Sexxxxy


----------



## ChasingTheCat

How can one smoke aMT effectively, i.e. without coughing it out immediately? Tried to smoke 10 mg from a lightbulb and felt virtually nothing. Couldn't hold the smoke, because it was VERY harsh, much worse than even the dirtiest waxy-brown DMT (btw smoking anything out of the device you normally use for DMT may provide some surprises )

I'm considering rectal dosing for my next experiment. I plan to do 30-40mg and go to a rave. How long is the come-up? Will a single plugged dose be sufficient for 8 hours? I'm going to use the acetate or hydrochloride salt.


----------



## tylerwashere

do you have to alter the aMT to be able to smoke it or can you smoke it as is?


----------



## Shambles

My AMT smokes just fine - I chase it on tinfoil. Tastes (literally) like shit but not harsh at all. I suspect I have the freebase form though which is apparently easier to smoke/vape. I'm sure the instructions for converting the HCl to freebase is in this thread somewhere. Maybe try giving the search button a lil prod


----------



## Bare_head

my fave drug, but i actuallly found vaporising less euphoric and more speedy, like that magical sparkle goes and i am left with a speedy enegetic high that leaves my mouth tasting like shit


----------



## tylerwashere

Bare_head said:


> my fave drug, but i actuallly found vaporising less euphoric and more speedy, like that magical sparkle goes and i am left with a speedy enegetic high that leaves my mouth tasting like shit



lol, well, maybe ill reconsider smoking it then....


----------



## ChasingTheCat

*stability*

How long will the fb keep? I weighed out some on monday and tuesday and noticed that the residues in my scale pan have turned brownish and oily. 
I plan to keep my stash for 3 or 4 months. Putting it in the freezer is not really an option. Do I have to convert it to the HCl?

btw I'm also wondering about the stability of DMT, although I doubt I will keep it that long 8)


----------



## Shambles

Maybe have a read through Solutions: Solubility & Stability Mega-Thread and The Big and Dandy Storage Thread to get some answers to your storage and stability questions, Catchaser


----------



## Solipsis

ChasingTheCat said:


> How can one smoke aMT effectively, i.e. without coughing it out immediately? Tried to smoke 10 mg from a lightbulb and felt virtually nothing. Couldn't hold the smoke, because it was VERY harsh, much worse than even the dirtiest waxy-brown DMT (btw smoking anything out of the device you normally use for DMT may provide some surprises )
> 
> I'm considering rectal dosing for my next experiment. I plan to do 30-40mg and go to a rave. How long is the come-up? Will a single plugged dose be sufficient for 8 hours? I'm going to use the acetate or hydrochloride salt.



Well I doubt the HCl form can be smoked without the result you're describing but I'm not sure. There are those compounds that vaporize all right at lower temperatures before succumbing to pyrolysis...

Convert it to the freebase then if smoking is what you want and it's correct that the HCl is 'too stable'.


----------



## kong

Anyone tried converting it to the fumarate salt?  Might that lengthen the shelf life?


----------



## Xorkoth

uniter said:


> How do you rectally administer a freebase?  What do you dissolve it in?  Or do you just put it in a capsule and insert it?



I generally just put it in a capsule... as long as it's gelatin and not one of the longer-dissolving ones like vegetable.  Actually I rarely use anything rectally by dissolving it in water anymore... it's just a little faster (just by a couple of minutes really) and it's way easier to put a gel cap up there.


----------



## Solipsis

It's both plenty easy I guess (havent tried with caps (yet?))  ..

Packed some IPA and baking soda for HCl -> fb conversion in the near future.
Vaping DPT sounds mighty compelling but I'm gonna wait until my nerves are settled for
a while.
Chronic wiring


----------



## PepperSocks

Xorkoth said:


> I generally just put it in a capsule... as long as it's gelatin and not one of the longer-dissolving ones like vegetable.  Actually I rarely use anything rectally by dissolving it in water anymore... it's just a little faster (just by a couple of minutes really) and it's way easier to put a gel cap up there.



This interests me.  The reason I hated plugging so much is because of how fast it hit when dissolved in water.  One time I put 2C-I in a capsule and it actually went pretty well.  Started getting alerts at 15 minutes.  When it was dissolved it would hit in 5 and just come roaring up.  I'm interested in doing the gelcap thing again.


----------



## Ayrios

Hmm 2ml water is adequate for RA AMT?  I've heard more surface area is better due to possible burning...  My trials begin tonight


----------



## Solipsis

Let it be clear that AMT is not a substance I've RA'd before but 2C-B is and that burns a hell of a lot in the nose and only produces a hot sensation down below. One important reason for me to mention 2 ml is because personally I dislike the urgent feeling of having to go to the bathroom after rectal admin a lot so I take as little water as possible.
So for your own trials I would check the Rectal Admin thread and search for the details on AMT regarding this because what I was giving's a general guideline. Though it's doubtful I would go over 5 ml. If a substance would still burn then I would not assault my ass with it.


----------



## Ayrios

Cool, I'll just go with my usual 3ml.  I also RA 2C-B (among others) so I know the burns in the nose, feels fine in the ass phenomena


----------



## Ayrios

No discomfort all at from 28mg dissolved in 3ml warm water.  First signs came within 10 minutes, was fully up after 90, and not a hint of nausea


----------



## Morninggloryseed

I looked at some a-MT freebase that is over 8 years old.  Still a white, fun-smelling powder.  No signs of degrading (or even discoloration) as I note with other tryptamines of similar vintage.

It's been kept frozen most of its life, tight in small glass vials, that are well wrapped and kept dry, dry dry.


----------



## delsymfan

Recommended starting dosage for a 200lb manly male? Im thinking 30 orally for a first go. 

It arrived in the mail today. God now I got 4-meo-pcp and this... what to do?


----------



## Shambles

For me, 20-25mg vaped is a mighty fine dose for AMT. I don't use it orally cos it takes hours to come up and the bodyload is nasty but 30mg seems to be a reasonable starting point for oral dosing to get an idea


----------



## Morninggloryseed

I'd try 25-30mg for my first try.


----------



## delsymfan

Shambles said:


> For me, 20-25mg vaped is a mighty fine dose for AMT. I don't use it orally cos it takes hours to come up and the bodyload is nasty but 30mg seems to be a reasonable starting point for oral dosing to get an idea



Yeah I got HCL so idk about smoking it up


----------



## Shambles

Sure it can be freebased, but if you're more of an oral dosing kinda guy (or shit at chemistry like me :D) then you should be good with your 30mg or so plan. 25mg was the starting dose that was recommended to me when I got my last sample but not sure if there's a difference between the freebase and HCl forms in term of dose.


----------



## delsymfan

Yeah I love to vape my tryptamines but I dont feel like potentially wasting it with my poor (nonexistant) chemistry skills.


----------



## Solipsis

174,24 g/mol Freebase a-MT
36,46 g/mol hydrochloric acid
--------------------------------------- +
210,70 g/mol a-MT . HCl

Meaning
the weight of the HCl salt is 121% that of the freebase or
the weight of the freebase is 83% that of the HCl salt

Enjoy your dosing math


----------



## fastandbulbous

> One important reason for me to mention 2 ml is because personally I dislike the urgent feeling of having to go to the bathroom after rectal admin a lot so I take as little water as possible.
> So for your own trials I would check the Rectal Admin thread and search for the details on AMT regarding this because what I was giving's a general guideline. Though it's doubtful I would go over 5 ml. If a substance would still burn then I would not assault my ass with it.



Did you make sure that the temperature of the solution you intend to squirt up yer jacksy is between 30-40'C, as any colder than that will produce those serious urges to go to the toilet previously mentioned (tap water can be anywhere betwen 2'C & 16'C - any liquid squirted uo your backside at that temp will produce an immediate urge to defecate). Obviously don't go higher than 40'C as a bit higher will be uncomfortable (a lot higher could give the rectum wall some nasty burns)


----------



## Solipsis

Thanks so much for that F&B, that will definitely come in handy the next time I'm puttying up the underside!
It also motivates me to try it more readily since that was probably the most major drawback for me.

I know this isnt exactly the appropriate thread but what about putting menthol in your solution, would that
help with any hot sensations from chemicals or will it make you want to defecate all the more because your 
body registers it as cold?

At the very least it will make your hindquarters nice and fresh, I can already hear the compliments from friends 
and co-workers! "Don't we smell lovely today!" :D


----------



## fastandbulbous

Ever got menthol on your lips or up your nose. Now imagine that up yer arse - it'll produce an irritant effect from hell & make you want to empty your bowels quite badly (glycerine/soap is the ingredient in most suppositories designed to counteract constipation as they mildly irritate the gut wall and promote expulsion. Menthol is a hel of a lot more irritating)

If you want to use anything, boil a few cloves in some water, then use some of that water to dissolve the drug of choice in as cloves contain a compound that acts as a local anaesthetic and as such will obliterate any sensations of itchyness (and it'll still make your arse more fragrant than anyone else in your neighbourhood! )


----------



## delsymfan

*30mg of AMT, is this it?*

I've given it 5 hours... its really not doing a whole lot for me so far with 30mg. First time trial. I had a kinda full stomach when I took it, so I've been giving it the benefit of the doubt here.

I know it takes a long ass time to hit but its just been super mild so far. 

Considering popping xanax and going sleepy cause I'm not super awake but I cant quite go to bed.


----------



## fastandbulbous

> First time trial. *I had a kinda full stomach *when I took it, so I've been giving it the benefit of the doubt here.




There's your trip gremlin. AMT is incredibly slow coming on (to the point that at times I've forgotten I'd taken a drug until I notice my coathanger grin :D) at the best of times - 4 maybe more hours to peak & that's on a stomach that's fasted for 18 hours beforehand, but the slowed/delayed absorbtion on a full stomach means that the plasma level of the drug never reaches an impressive level.


You could always dissolve the AMT in water (with a few drops of clear vinegar to form the acetate salt if it's freebase AMT) the squirt it up yer bum. Comes on faster (more speed of a conventional long lasting psychedeic like mescaline or DOM) and has less bodyload & nausea than the oral route. Herr Shambles extolls the virtues of vapourizing AMT, but can you imagine what that smell would translate to in terms of taste after inhaling a whole load of vapourized AMT. I feel confident in predicting it will 'taste like shit'


----------



## Coolio

30mg is an underwhelming dose for most people. I think the 60-100mg dosage range is more appropriate if you don't feel anything 5 hours into a 30mg dose.


----------



## ChasingTheCat

35mg per RA weren't that strong for me.

Also, if you have HCl you just did 24,9mg of freebase

As a rule of thumb one takes about half the dose of MDMA.

But it is always better to start too low than too high


----------



## Coolio

25mg is enough for a full blown +++ psychedelic experience with some people, or so I seem to recall.


----------



## PepperSocks

Yeah, an incredibly slow material to come on such as AMT and a full stomach will do that.



ChasingTheCat said:


> As a rule of thumb one takes about half the dose of MDMA.



I dunno about that, for someone who takes 150mg of MDMA that's 75 mg of AMT; that's quite a bit, I'm sure most people don't need to take those kinds of doses.

It is indeed better to start low than high.

Merging with the Big&Dandy AMT thread.


----------



## delsymfan

Mmk well It was my first time and I wanted to give it a shot. 

At 7 hours I felt only marginally better than I did at 3 and was not getting enough energy from the chem and decided that I was going to call it a night and xanax'd myself to sleep. 

I'll try 60 next time. And to _Chasingthecat,_ I converted my own freebase to HCL so it shouldnt matter no?

Erowid listed like 20-40 as a normal medium dose and given its my first time with any long acting chem I wanted to take it easy. 

Still, showed a lot of promise. Felt good most of the time, laughter came easy, and I was comfy. Nausea was hardly there although I expect it with a higher dose.


----------



## thedeadlywar

delsymfan said:


> Mmk well It was my first time and I wanted to give it a shot.
> 
> At 7 hours I felt only marginally better than I did at 3 and was not getting enough energy from the chem and decided that I was going to call it a night and xanax'd myself to sleep.
> 
> I'll try 60 next time. And to _Chasingthecat,_ I converted my own freebase to HCL so it shouldnt matter no?
> 
> Erowid listed like 20-40 as a normal medium dose and given its my first time with any long acting chem I wanted to take it easy.
> 
> Still, showed a lot of promise. Felt good most of the time, laughter came easy, and I was comfy. Nausea was hardly there although I expect it with a higher dose.



I found the nausea overwhelming in the higher dosages, the most nausea producing chemical I've eaten to date. Careful with that.


----------



## delsymfan

Meh I've accepted it and If it happens it happens. Im hoping its not worse than my harmala alkaloid trip. Where I was dry heaving, and puked up everything I ever had and then some. And where after swallowing saliva, I had to go puke THAT up in a few minutes. That was the worst vomiting I've ever had. Painful too. 

So if it doesnt top that then I'm cool


----------



## Tryptamite

How does one convert the HCL into the freebase or vice versa? I apologise if this has already been covered, I didn't see it when reading though the threads. Mind you I only skimmed them.


----------



## dread

Freebase to hcl: put your material in a dish, and pour an equimolar amount of hydrochloric acid on it. Then evaporate the water and excess hcl. 

Hcl to freebase: dissolve your material in water, add equimolar amount of sodium hydroxide. Evaporate water, or alternatively, pull material with nonpolar solvent and then evaporate the solvent. The latter option can be used if you have material which has lower boiling point in freebase form, than water.


----------



## bbx4

I had an amazing time on ~45 of AMT yesterday.  I tried it at 25 before but the increased dosage certainly makes quite a difference.  

The first 4 hours were very remicsent of the early stages of MDMA.  I had eye wobbles and confusion.  But I felt very sober and clean.  I went swimming in a powerfull river out to an island and laid there in the hot sand for what seemed like ages.  

I really enjoyed it, but I did feel a come-down into the trippyier stage.  Maybe it was just because I had not eaten anything all day but I became very tired and almost delerious.   Luckily some phenezapam eased me into sleep.

After my experience tripping outsite alone, I don't think I could enjoy AMT at a rave.


----------



## PepperSocks

bbx4 said:


> After my experience tripping outsite alone, I don't think I could enjoy AMT at a rave.



Me too.  I went to a 3 day rave once with MDMA one night, 2C-I the next night and it definitely wasn't for me.  I don't have any AMT experience but with psychedelics in general I feel the same way.


----------



## bbx4

uniter said:


> Me too.  I went to a 3 day rave once with MDMA one night, 2C-I the next night and it definitely wasn't for me.  I don't have any AMT experience but with psychedelics in general I feel the same way.



I could never imagine a rave being any fun on any sort of psychedelic, but I have thought about it and I think I will go this weekend.  AMT has a lot of MDMA-like properties and depending on the vibe at the rave it could be fun.  

Or it could just be a bunch of pilled out sweaty kids.  We'll see...


----------



## PepperSocks

bbx4 said:


> depending on the vibe at the rave it could be fun.
> 
> Or it could just be a bunch of pilled out sweaty kids.  We'll see...



I'm pretty sure that's where it lies.  The one I went to was very big and wasn't a very PLURy environment.  The crowd was more into stimulants than psychedelics and I know for a fact at that time the meth bombs dominated the pill market and most people just swallow whatever they buy as ecstasy.

I'm sure smaller raves where psychedelics are the main drugs being taken are much better environments.  It's all about setting. 

Unfortunately such events don't exist in my area, never had the chance.


----------



## delsymfan

So I think something must have happened to my AMT molecules...

When I went to put them in the water, and they didnt dissolve I came here and was told buy the muriatic acid.

When I got back from the store, it appeared that a lot of the AMT had dissolved somehow. There was not nearly as much in the cup anymore. Got me thinking maybe something happened to it. 

Because my doses of "30" and "51" mg were so mild I never broke a +1


----------



## Ayrios

We received our aMT from the same source, and we've been AFAIK the only people who have commented on solubility issues.  Perhaps it really came in HCl form as labeled.  I'll try vaping some of mine sometime--if easily smoked with no burnt residue left behind, it's likely freebase, though I'm currently assuming it's HCl as it came from a reputable source, compounded by the possibility that your conversion attempt somehow degraded your product (if it was already in HCl form) :/


----------



## bbx4

I have had some great experiences with AMT at dosages around 50 mgs recently.  How much does upping the dose change the experience?  I'm thinking of trying around 70 or 75 tomorrow.


----------



## Ayrios

It seems to have a fairly linear dosage/response curve.  That seems like a reasonable step up in dosage.


----------



## Solipsis

Does anyone know about kidney toxicity? Concerning this trip report: I think it's suspect that two people experience apparent kidney problems at the same time, but I was wondering how heavy a drug a-MT is? Because recently I have started to doubt if I'm still a 100% healthy regarding liver, kidneys, GI and CNS...


----------



## delsymfan

I too have to wonder how toxic it may be. I personally think there could be a correlation between drugs that cause severe nausea and toxicity. The body doesnt want something in there right?

Anyway speaking of which, would you say on an empty stomach it should mostly be dosed within an hour. As in, the swallowed chem should be absorbed? Not necessarily in effect yet of course. I dosed and got sick 1 hour after and threw up. Just wondering how much I may have lost on the trip.


----------



## Ayrios

You should avert nausea altogether (or at least diminish it severely) by RA'ing it.

What do you think about what I said to you a few posts up regarding the potency loss you noticed after adding the acid?  Do you feel you received HCl as labeled after all?


----------



## delsymfan

Actually I think that something happened BEFORE I added the acid at all. 

Think I posted this but if not:

None of my AMT dissolved rapidly when i got it, but then I went to the store, and when I got back, I noticed at least half of it appeared to be dissolved or gone or whatever. 

My 3 doses of "post-muriatic-acid" have all responded equally, it appears no degradation was noted between these.

My theory is somehow the AMT died in the water, because after two small doses barely being threshold, I poured the rest of what I had into a glass and drank it.

And had a nice +2.5 for this evening. But understand that this "+2.5" should have, in actuality, been 170mg of AMT. I know something happened because my other doses, expected to be 30 and 50 felt incredibly mild.


----------



## Coolio

I thought recreational drug induced nausea and vomiting was usually from stimulation of serotonin and dopamine receptors in the stomach?


----------



## Solipsis

Coolio said:


> I thought recreational drug induced nausea and vomiting was usually from stimulation of serotonin and dopamine receptors in the stomach?



I think it usually is, but can also arise from (de)activation of certain brain circuits. Not sure though. I think weed works like that only it decreases nausea (OK occasionally inducing it), weed also affects your hunger circuit giving you the munchies. So it's probably safe to say that we can emphasize that "usually" in your sentence...



delsymfan said:


> I too have to wonder how toxic it may be. I personally think there could be a correlation between drugs that cause severe nausea and toxicity. The body doesnt want something in there right?



I think that's incorrect, look at ayahuasca and mescaline: certainly those are not toxic and yet there is significant nausea associated with both.
A while ago I was under the impression that body load and hangovers were enough indication of toxicity and physical damage but now I am really careful with that idea. Surely not all effects on your body are expressed acutely and many ailments progress fairly painless.
Partially you might be right since it's quite probably that we have evolved to recognize certain chemical properties that indicate a hazard with our stomaches and emit that by reflex but even so, that ability is pretty limited I think.


----------



## Iodjini_dk

How are the dosages for nasal administration? 

And can you smoke the HCl salt or do you have to convert it to freebase first?

Generally I like to eat my drugs, but the comeup and duration seems a bit intimidating to me.


----------



## delsymfan

Yeah solipsis idk really. I think it varies from thing to thing. 

I personally am inclined to say most natural psych's are much safer. Just seems to make sense to me. 

Anyway my trip was fantabulous and a TR is on the way.


----------



## phatass

i've heard so many horror stories about AMT, i think its one of the few drugs thats not on my "to try" list


----------



## PepperSocks

Sure you're not thinking of 5-MeO-AMT?  That one has a track record of horror.  Regular AMT on the other hand is liked by many.


----------



## Xorkoth

phatass said:


> i've heard so many horror stories about AMT, i think its one of the few drugs thats not on my "to try" list



As uniter said, you're probably thinking of 5-MeO-AMT.  The two are totally different drugs... not very similar at all.  5-MeO-AMT has a reputation for being unpleasant, and I concur, having tried it a few times.  Most people have great experiences with AMT, however... possibly a bit of nausea, but nothing like 5-MeO-AMT.


----------



## Ayrios

I just put roughly 10mg of what is labeled aMT HCl on a piece of foil and vaporized it (I didn't inhale).  If it was HCl it would leave behind some kind of residue, would it not?  This vaporizes promptly and cleanly, leaving no residue at all.  Has anyone tried vaporizing the HCl form before, and if so, was there residue left behind, and did it require much indirect heat to melt?


----------



## Xorkoth

What does your AMT look like?  Is it white crystals or clear?  How does it smell?


----------



## Ayrios

White, granular, with blotches of orange throughout.  Smells like n,n-DMT but a little less sweet.  Labeled 99.74% pure, Danish.


----------



## Xorkoth

It sounds like freebase, slightly degraded freebase.  Besides, if it left no residue and vaporized quickly, it's probably freebase.


----------



## Ayrios

Thought so... Interesting.  No one before delsym raised the possibility that this source's aMT was mislabeled, but that appears to be the case after I failed to dissolve it in water for RA and then the clean vaporizing of it.


----------



## tylerwashere

im considering getting some aMT and it would be my first time. I was thinking of trying btween 20 and 25mg, just to produce like a 2+ or something. When i try doing new psychs i like to just "test the water" once before i dive in. Does this seem like a good amount or should i do more/less...?


----------



## Xorkoth

25mg would be a nice lowish first-time dose.  I wouldn't go lower, and I'd go maybe up to 30mg.


----------



## ChasingTheCat

I found 35 a bit underwhelming

50mg gave a wonderful experience of pure bliss and pleasure. Negative side effects included muscle tension leading to a slight backpain, a mild headache in the second half of the trip and a tremor throughout the experience. Does anyone else get these problems? Anyway, the high clearly outweighs those issues for me.

ROA was rectally, so no real problems with nausea. Comeup still lasts about two hours and is rather uncomfortable/very jittery.


----------



## delsymfan

Ayrios said:


> Thought so... Interesting.  No one before delsym raised the possibility that this source's aMT was mislabeled, but that appears to be the case after I failed to dissolve it in water for RA and then the clean vaporizing of it.



And while we shouldnt source talk, from your info sounds like its the same one. 

So its clearly not HCL then I suppose.


----------



## Black

Ayrios said:


> If it was HCl it would leave behind some kind of residue, would it not?



no, it would'nt leave a residue. but as it vaporized quickly freebase is more likely. the HCl salt need higher temperatures.


----------



## Ne0

What dose would be good for "stimulant" use without getting that much, if any, psychedelic effects? It would be AMT HCl and I'm thinking plugging it to avoid physical side effects.



SynAmnesia said:


> AMT has MAOI activity.  That means it is dangerous to mix with many drugs including SSRI's, SNRI's, MDMA, etc.  That is because MAO is the enzyme that metabolizes neurotransmitters.  With an SSRI/SNRI/Tricyclic/etc, you are inhibiting the reuptake of serotonin, norepinephrine, etc... all of which are degraded by MAO.  If you inhibit both the reuptake and the degradation of neurotransmitters, it can lead to toxic effects, including but not limited to serotonin syndrome, tachnicardia, destroying of one's heart valves, etc.



Well I took about 20mg mirtazapine at the end of low dose of AMT (10mg) and didn't felt any bad effects, tho' it didn't help me to get sleep so I had to take some nasty antipsychotic.

edit. Did some researchs and it seems that mirtazapine is very safe drug and is not dangerous even when taken with MAOI.


----------



## delsymfan

And also AMT's MAOI Activity is really quite low... While I'd still give it consideration, I think its probably a little over hyped. Obviously before you do any combo, do it with low amounts first. Take it slow. 

As far as that neo... Firstly thats a real PITA to plug it for such a little amount. I've used small oral amounts and never had hardly any nausea. I think you'd be safe without plugging. 

But Id think maybe somewhere around 5-7mg or so. It sure does seem to start changing and shifting things quite quickly though.


----------



## Shambles

I've combined AMT with high doses of MDMA and LSD (seperately and together) with no problems. Quite the opposite in fact - it's possibly the greatest drug combo known to man 

The MAOI activity of AMT is so low it's all but negligible, in my opinion.


----------



## Ne0

I decided to take real ride, so I plugged 25mg. 

Do you think that taking 1g Vitamin C will prevent possible neurotoxicity?


----------



## Shambles

I doubt it and I'm not aware of AMT being especially associated with neurotoxicity. But vitamin C won't hurt as long as you're not taking silly amounts. One of those "can't see it making a difference one way or the other but won't hurt" kinda things, I suspect. Have fun


----------



## Ne0

Shambles said:


> I doubt it and I'm not aware of AMT being especially associated with neurotoxicity. But vitamin C won't hurt as long as you're not taking silly amounts. One of those "can't see it making a difference one way or the other but won't hurt" kinda things, I suspect. Have fun



Thanks. 

Hmm can't say that I feel much, beside some side effects, shouldn't it start faster when plugged? It's already +1,30h, I wait half hour more and then take about 15mg more.

Maybe MDPV has some cross tolerance with this?

edit. Ok, now I start to feel pretty stimulated and nice. Too bad it's night and I'm alone in middle of nowhere. Time for some introperspective moments I guess, if this will get me that far.


----------



## Ayrios

I find rectal peaks around 2-2.5 hours.  My 28mg RA dose was mostly stimulating, and only a little bit psychedelic (open-minded, empathetic).  Try vaping it for a quicker comeup (peak around 1-1.5 hours in)


----------



## Ne0

Ayrios said:


> I find rectal peaks around 2-2.5 hours.  My 28mg RA dose was mostly stimulating, and only a little bit psychedelic (open-minded, empathetic).  Try vaping it for a quicker comeup (peak around 1-1.5 hours in)



I have HCl, can you vape that too?


----------



## Shambles

Can't vape HCl but you can convert it to freebase if you know about such things. I don't so no point asking me but pretty sure it's been covered in this thread previously 

And yeah, RA still takes a good 2+ hours to come-up. Vaped has me fully up in around 60-90 minutes as Ayrios says. Dose is a lot lower too when vaped. Need freebase to do it though so better get your chemistry research hat on


----------



## fastandbulbous

Shambles said:


> I doubt it and I'm not aware of AMT being especially associated with neurotoxicity. But vitamin C won't hurt as long as you're not taking silly amounts. One of those "can't see it making a difference one way or the other but won't hurt" kinda things, I suspect. Have fun




Huge release of dopamine & serotonin at the same time is always gong to have a little neurotoxicity associated with it


----------



## nasir~

fastandbulbous said:


> Huge release of dopamine & serotonin at the same time is always gong to have a little neurotoxicity associated with it



is there a significant(or even "huge") release of dopamine associated with amt?


----------



## feelgoodhit

Yeah, F&B, could you inform us on just how harmful you feel aMT really is? I ask you specifically because of your long history with aMT and generally extensive knowledge of neuropharm-related stuff.


----------



## Solipsis

At long last!  A Mighty Tryptamine is coming my way.
Me so happy.


----------



## Xorkoth

Awesome!  I think you'll love it.


----------



## Solipsis

Cool, I recall you used the stuff extensively for a period - do you still do it?
I really like your descriptions and besides I find that I can identify better with some peoples experiences who just seem like they react to stuff in a "reasonable" way, as opposed to idiosyncratic.
Of course bodies, minds and opinions differ always and everywhere but I still think that more pure people who are less affected by preconceptions, logical fallacies and other misleading stuff present a more clear, conscious and intelligent approach and analysis of their experiences. Not that I have the illusion that anyone is immune to idiosyncracy!

You know that expression great minds think alike? Well I don't want to suck up or boast arrogantly but I think it's really true. A small margin of people, my best friends in it as well, I can get fantastic discussions with where thoughts run deeply synchronous and the discussion becomes a dialogue - like a telepathic monologue...
Like pure unimpeded thought where personal identity doesn't come in the way, almost makes me believe in our true nature we are all the same!!

Hopefully you get what I'm saying.
It's like 15:00 here you know: time to rant.


----------



## delsymfan

I've had similar discussions with my friends when we all trip. And yet we are actually quite different in reality. 

I personally believe brains communicate to an extent without us realizing it, and i believe psych's enhance this property. We know we have brainwaves, I often think other brains can get more in tune with other ones. People who are close seem to finish eachothers sentences, know what the other is thinking, and respond similarly to stimuli despite being different people. 

Of course the other theory is that the drug puts everybody in a more equal mindset, and it is actually the cause of the thought processes being aligned. As opposed to my theory that the drug aids in mental communication and therefore the synchronization of thought and feeling.


----------



## bbx4

Does anyone have any information on combining AMT with piracetam?  

I find AMT to be quite like MDMA at times and in the past I have combined piracetam and MDMA with good results.  The effects were not tremendously noticeable but made the ride smoother.

I am thinking that taking a couple g's of piracetam right after I throw up on AMT would turn out good.   I always throw up about an hour and half into it.


----------



## Tryptamine*Dreamer

I haven't tried it, but am patiently waiting for my chance, should be soon. Maybe this or next weekend.

I hope it is a lot better than 5-meo-amt. Should find out soon.

I've heard it can be intensely psychedelic, but also that it is like a weak dose of lsd with a bit of amphetamine.

I'll try it soon, thinking about 40mg oral to start, then snorting 10mg 2 or 3 times when I peak if not strong enough.  Some time after that I'll try smoking it as I've read it is much more potent smoked without reducing quality or quantity of trip. It's been a while and I can't get on erowid right now, so don't take that as truth.


If not to hard on my body, I'll try it at 125mg oral or equivalent other method with maybe 5mg of DOI. So much to look forward to trying during a time when time is quite limited.

I may initially try a lower 25mg oral dose if I need more study time so I won't be too wasted to get some done. My trips are going to be highly dependent on how I'm doing in college. If I find my classes easy or I am motivated to study lots, I should be able to trip up to twice a month, even with my other obligations.

If I get lazy and start getting bad grades, I won't get to trip. I have my drugs locked away except for poppies and I have to ask for the key. It won't be given if I am not making A's and B's, unless maybe 2 classes are A's and one I'm making C's.


----------



## Delta-9-THC

Who do you have to ask for the key? Seems like a kinda strange system.

I feel like poppies would be the one to lock up if anything.

I know this is off topic but I'm just curious.


----------



## Tryptamine*Dreamer

I have compulsion to trip on psychedelics and I am not functional while tripping. I easily tripped 2-3 times per week before this.  I've had little trouble keeping my opiate use under control even after it became every day, but tripping I couldn't control. I would sometimes take rediculous doses or redose many times, often eyeballed. It was not uncommon for me to trip for 30+ hours at a time.

With opiates, I take just enough to help me deal with my social anxiety and depression(which seems to have gone away with depakote). I rarely use them to get really high, just using daily at the low end and occasionally tapering down to lower/eliminate tolerance during periods of low depression and anxiety provoking stimuli. I have no trouble keeping my use at what I consider a sane level.

My mother controls the safe. Yes, I'm 26 and still living at home, but that is because my parents are seperated, mom in poor health needs help with both everday tasks and finances, I go to college full time, and I have a 10 hour/week job along with several times each year getting big loads of obsolete computers(sometimes free sometimes for $200 orless) to dismantle and recycle ($1,500-$4,000 profit each time varying with amount and commodity prices), I make around $150/month on ebay, but it varies wildly with over $700 last time. I could leave home if I wanted and am not a freeloader.  I pay my mom well for rent.


Some may see this as a showing of weakness and perhaps it is.  I still say there is no need to change things when they are working so well. My mom knows I use drugs and accepts it. Now she has more peace of mind that nothings going to happen until she gets a request for use, then she knows what I am using and doesn't find me high as a kite conversing with beings in an unknown language unexpectedly. The thing with the safe is good for both our mental well beings and for my physical and academic well being.

I think there are others on this board who would benefit from a similar system and I feel no shame or weakness from implementing this plan. I think it was an intelligent decision to make.

My mother would usually figure out I was tripping before this anyway, so it makes her worry less, not more.

I don't  know why it is psychedelics that I needed help with. I just love tripping more than anything else. It may be impossible to become physically addicted to them, but they have been extremely psychologically addictive to me. Good thing is that I don't spend too much time thinking about tripping when there is no way I can actually trip. I haven't craved the experience too much since they were locked away and I used up the small stash I kept out of the safe.

Having to ask my mom further reduces the likelihood of asking as I don't want her to think I'm a hopeless case. There are several sleeping meds with varying degrees of usefulness and fun and she gives me one of those before bed. I've got phenazepam the last two nights. Tomorrow the less enjoyable but effective amitriptyline. Then cyclobenzaprine. Then it will be carisoprodol. I'll cycle through a mix of fun and unenjoyable meds to prevent addiction and keep me from staying awake too much. Seroquell the antipsychotic is in there somewhere.


----------



## Delta-9-THC

Thanks for the detailed answer. I figured it was a unique situation. Whatever works for you and improves your quality of life.

I have the exact opposite problem. I have never had much trouble controlling my psychedelic use but I have been addicted to kratom before which I am glad to have gotten past. I don't really screw with opiates anymore.


----------



## Xorkoth

bbx4 said:


> Does anyone have any information on combining AMT with piracetam?
> 
> I find AMT to be quite like MDMA at times and in the past I have combined piracetam and MDMA with good results.  The effects were not tremendously noticeable but made the ride smoother.
> 
> I am thinking that taking a couple g's of piracetam right after I throw up on AMT would turn out good.   I always throw up about an hour and half into it.



Piracetam with AMT works fine, sort of like piracetam and MDMA.  But you should take it about 45 minutes to an hour BEFORE you take the AMT (and likewise with the MDMA).  If you take the piracetam afterwards, it is unlikely to interact with the other drug(s) very much, if at all.  You need the piracetam fully working in your brain when the AMT/MDMA/whatever begins to be absorbed.



Tryptamine*Dreamer said:


> I hope it is a lot better than 5-meo-amt. Should find out soon.
> 
> I've heard it can be intensely psychedelic, but also that it is like a weak dose of lsd with a bit of amphetamine.



It's definitely way, way better than 5-MeO-AMT... not very similar drugs at all.

I find it more like LSD mixed with MDMA if anything, not amphetamine.  But it's not like the actual combo of LSD and MDMA, which is synergistic.  It's more like it has properties of MDMA and LSD.  Some people find it highly psychedelic and visual.  Personally I find it not very visual at all, sort of like a low dose of mescaline where colors brighten and everything looks beautiful.  I find it very mentally focusing and enhancing, which I suppose it like amphetamine now that I think of it, rather than like MDMA which clouds my mind and makes me kind of retarded.


----------



## delsymfan

Planning on going to smoke... the Freebase... from a lightbulb. My only question is this: Do you find the visual element reduced with smoking" I've read some of this from other reports. I dont wanna smoke it only to get a head rush and feel off. 

I may just put it into a solution again, only this time i'll be ready to HCL it immediately, thereby preventing any loss of the compound like last time.


----------



## Ayrios

Cool.


----------



## bbx4

Xorkoth said:


> Piracetam with AMT works fine, sort of like piracetam and MDMA.  But you should take it about 45 minutes to an hour BEFORE you take the AMT (and likewise with the MDMA).  If you take the piracetam afterwards, it is unlikely to interact with the other drug(s) very much, if at all.  You need the piracetam fully working in your brain when the AMT/MDMA/whatever begins to be absorbed.



Cool! Thank you very much.  That is what I shall be doing then.  I found piracetam before MDMA didn't so much increase the euphoria as level it if that makes any sense. It just made the whole experience smoother.  I hope it has the same effect with AMT.

With AMT I am at times struck with that MDMA-esque, breathless euphoria but it is very brief and seems to come on randomly.  I am hoping the piracetam will level things out.

I will post my thoughts on it after I try it.  By next Wednesday probably.


----------



## |>R()|)!G/-\|_

When the unopened 3 year old AMT starts turning cream/yellow its time to do something about it.  Having no experience with AMT, I'm seeking the opinions of others about how wise it is to take 40mg rectal w/out a benzo for the end.  If one can take acid w/out a benzo at the end I'm sure one could handle AMT, right?


----------



## Feste

Xorkoth said:


> Piracetam with AMT works fine, sort of like piracetam and MDMA.  But you should take it about 45 minutes to an hour BEFORE you take the AMT (and likewise with the MDMA).  If you take the piracetam afterwards, it is unlikely to interact with the other drug(s) very much, if at all.  You need the piracetam fully working in your brain when the AMT/MDMA/whatever begins to be absorbed.



Would this work for a pregabalin & amt combo?


----------



## bbx4

On the topic of other drugs plus AMT, I have to say AMT and cannabis is absolutely great.  I normally don't enjoy smoking weed at all but under the influence of AMT it feels great.  I don't really get high, but it changes my perception enough for me to find it interesting but not enough for me to find it too strange. 

I guess I could compare it to smoking pot on amphetamine or another stimulant.  It doesn't add much to the trip, but feels great! I recommend a spliff!


----------



## delsymfan

|>R()|)!G/-\|_ said:


> When the unopened 3 year old AMT starts turning cream/yellow its time to do something about it.  Having no experience with AMT, I'm seeking the opinions of others about how wise it is to take 40mg rectal w/out a benzo for the end.  If one can take acid w/out a benzo at the end I'm sure one could handle AMT, right?



Dont know bout acid, but I found it tough to sleep after 9 hours on a smaller dose.  Assuming we are talking about sleep that is. 

Popped me a xanax, yay. God I love OTC Peru...

Its definitely got that stimulating buzz that just kinda lingers for a while. Even when you feel sleepy, you really cant. Although you can sit still, you are just alert. Unlike 2C-E where you can be tired as hell, but writhe around in bed cause you cant sit still.


----------



## nuke

nasir~ said:


> is there a significant(or even "huge") release of dopamine associated with amt?



Yes.  I'm guessing that the problems are similar to MDMA, in that many of the metabolites of monoamines under high temperature conditions and with high levels of oxidants do to the breakdown of monoamines are going to be excessively toxic.  Just because the comedown is mellower doesn't really mean that it isn't doing any harm, as the comedown for meth for me actually always felt pretty great, but it was the weeks after that that were pretty weird and anhedonic.  In fact even AET is associated with some serotonergic neurotoxicity so I'd be really surprised if AMT wasn't.


----------



## Feste

Did (well still doing) 45mg a-MT today with 750mg pregabalin & a load of hash.

The a-MT took an age to peak, but enjoying it.


----------



## delsymfan

What about IM dosage peoples? My new order is almost here and i'm looking to try a slightly more efficient dosage. 

IIRC somebody said like 10mg blew their socks off. But I cant find that again. Searched the thread too but IM is everywhere in a search lol.

Also that would likely help nausea no?


----------



## Ayrios

I can't speak for IM, but if you want efficiency, try vaporizing it. 20-30mg is great.


----------



## Solipsis

Mine got in today, it does smell a bit like shit lol! But sweet, nice shit.
It's a brilliant white color


----------



## delsymfan

Yeah poopy smell.. Taste isnt bad but its the smell as you down it. If you down it that is.

Hence why I am investigating the IM.

Again I asked before but nobody said anything. I've read the trip from Vaporization is different, less visual somehow. I wanna know if thats true. I'm quite good with smoking the Tryp's and I could handle it, but I just wanna know if its worth it.


----------



## Shambles

I'd say vaping it is worth it. But I would cos I like vaping it :D

No idea about IM. Don't recall seing any IM or IV reports but imagine the dose would be a pretty small. Kinda like the idea know you mention it. Not sure I'd want to guess a dose though.


----------



## Delsyd

You think IM would be alot smaller than oral or vaped? 
im guessing only slightly lower. Maybe 20mg.

Dont take my word for it though, and i wont be the first to try it either.

As for IV, i wouldnt even know where to start.


----------



## Shambles

IM would probably (possibly) be around the same as vaped (and snorted? that's not one I'd want to try either :D) cos it's often around those kinda levels with other stuff, in my guesstimation.

I'd rather see some reports before even thinking about it really. AMT is lush but can be quite full on and lasts a fair ol' while - wouldn't want to go shooting a silly amount of something like that without realising it was a silly amount of something like that.

Suspect it would be mighty fine if the dose _was_ right though :D


----------



## psood0nym

I've posted numerous times about IM aMT HCl in this thread and it's "old incarnation." Just search.  I prefer it.  In short, it's a little less than double the potency of oral, more euphoric and slightly less trippy. I feel it within a few minutes, I'm plateaued within 45 minutes, and the trip of a 12mg dose (mostly a euphoriant at this level) is over in 6-8 hours and sleep becomes possible with diphenhydramine. I use a minimum of 20mg IM for psychedelia. The onset is a little more tense than oral, but less than you'd imagine from the relative decrease in onset time. I've never experienced nausea using the HCl by any ROA, but used to get nausea from the freebase regularly (which may just be due to physiological changes, because a few years separate my last freebase use and my first HCl use).

I've also commented on one 3mg IV experiment in this thread.  It was slightly faster in onset than IM, but about as mild as I'd expect 3mg IM to be.  I don't think there's any real advantage to IV with aMT.


----------



## Shambles

Thanks for the info, Psood0nym 

Unfortunately the search engine doesn't do "IV" or "IM" so they're hard to search for but that kinda confirms my suspicions. Interesting...

Have you tried vaped AMT? Cos that's similar in comeup time (slightly longer than your IM figure but not much) and lasts longer, in my experience. Would be interested in a comparison of effects between those two. Almost disappointed IV doesn't produce a significantly faster comeup but probably for the best 

I've only used freebase as far as I know. Not much left though and HCl seems to be more "widely" available than freebase now so suspect that may be what I get hold of next. When I track some down.


----------



## psood0nym

^For anyone whose looking: search for psood0nym (that's psood>zero<nym) in this thread to narrow the result.  Most of my posts about experiences have been from using IM. 

I have tried vaporized freebase aMT to test it out fairly recently.  I only used 4mg, though, so it probably wasn't enough. It was also while using a small dose of Adderall (incredible combo), so it's hard to give my judgment. It mostly just seemed like extra stimulation at that level. I was surprised how much noxious vapor was produced from such a small amount, and so so long as there's no potency increase or a substantial qualitative difference I'll probably just stick to IM.  

I tried IV to see if there was a further trend towards increase euphoria relative to psychedelia like there is, in my experience at least, from oral to IM. The shortened duration and qualitative difference is the whole argument for IM. But yeah, aMT is like LSD that way.  There's no advantage over IM (though I doubt IM LSD is qualitatively different than oral because it isn't a powerful releaser of dopamine and serotonin the way aMT is--which, BTW, because of its faster onset and presumed resultant greater DA/SERT release, IM aMT may be more neurotoxic than oral aMT (the same might be true for vaporized)).  Also, my quoted onset time for IM aMT is probably a little sooner than most because I'm familiar enough with to be really sensitive to first alerts and because my body seems to process it faster than it used to. Dondante has an IM aMT/DPT (one of my favorite combos, just don't use 100mg DPT like him!) report in Trip Reports that might supply another data point on the subject. 

Freebase aMT can be easily converted for injection using plain old white vinegar (which is very sterile). I've converted synthed DMT freebase to DMT acetate for injection this way by putting the DMT in a small glass vial then adding 5% vinegar (dripped from a syringe) while heating and sloshing it around on a hot plate (frying pan works fine, too) until it was dissolved (DMT didn't take long).  Then I diluted it with some preservative free sterile saline contact lens cleaning solution (sodium bicarbonate should also work to neutralize), ran it through a filter and IMd.  It stings a little (goes away quickly), but that's because I just don't bother to neutralize fully.


----------



## Bare_head

oh how i miss aMT.. though i love the stuff so i happy it isnt around for me too explore :D

i do find the long come up great, the non sleep part isnt so great! but the feeling is awesome


----------



## delsymfan

Thanks for the IM reports. I personally was thinking about something like 15-20mg. That helps me get a feel for it. 

When you say the stimulant effect increases relative to the psychedelic feel, would you say that you get LESS visuals and less mental trip? With a 20mg dose were you still seeing tons of rad visuals and stuff? 

I just dont want to change the nature of the trip too much. I really liked my Oral trip. I just would like to trip a little more efficiently if possible.

And for the record, wouldnt really even consider IV'ing this stuff.


----------



## Shambles

psood0nym said:


> I have tried vaporized freebase aMT to test it out fairly recently.  I only used 4mg, though, so it probably wasn't enough. It was also while using a small dose of Adderall (incredible combo), so it's hard to give my judgment. It mostly just seemed like extra stimulation at that level. I was surprised how much noxious vapor was produced from such a small amount, and so so long as there's no potency increase or a substantial qualitative difference I'll probably just stick to IM.



Once again, much interesting info in your post, Psood0nym - thanks 

Only part of it I can comment on so far is the vaped bit. For me, dose is around 20-30mg, comeup around 60 minutes and the duration is not much reduced from oral or rectal dosing - well over 12 hours, for sure. Closer to 20, for me... although I like to add LSD and/or MDMA to AMT for the funnest of funtimes which may well distort that figure.

I don't mind the duration at all, it's the comeup and bodyload I dislike from other methods. IM appeals on that basis but seems short to me for AMT. There are, of course, many times that would be a bonus so it has been noted


----------



## psood0nym

delsymfan said:


> Thanks for the IM reports. I personally was thinking about something like 15-20mg. That helps me get a feel for it.
> 
> When you say the stimulant effect increases relative to the psychedelic feel, would you say that you get LESS visuals and less mental trip? With a 20mg dose were you still seeing tons of rad visuals and stuff?
> 
> I just dont want to change the nature of the trip too much. I really liked my Oral trip. I just would like to trip a little more efficiently if possible.


I would say it is less psychedelic relative to euphoria when comparing IM to oral, but the psychedelia isn't that different. Perhaps that's because I've never had many visuals from it (except during a few isolated cases of 60mg of the freebase, oral) and have never found aMT to have much of a mental trip beyond what I derive from a sense of floating in my body at higher doses. If you get a mental trip from oral you'll get it from IM. I have a friend that get's lots of visuals from it, though. These days I use lowish non-psychedelic doses for functional empathy and euphoria, and combine a psychedelic 20mg IM dose with a more powerful psychedelic (faves for this are DPT and 4-ho/AcO-DMT) to channel the power of the latter toward ecstasy and empathy. AMT is invaluable to me in this second regard.  For me, 20mg aMT fades into residual stimulation and sleep with diphenhydramine is possible about 10 hours after injection. YMMV.


----------



## delsymfan

Gotcha. Yeah I had a very visual trip last time and it wasnt even that huge a dose I figure. And mentally I did find myself altered enough to enjoy it. 

Should be interesting. I'll probably try vaping first, then putting into liquid and going from there trying other ROAs.


----------



## Mr.T

has anybody had good experiences with ROA Nasal of Amt. im  thinking about trying 5mg that way since its my prefered route.

any thoughts on that. thx


----------



## Shambles

I think it would be seriously revolting. I imagine it would be like snorting powdered dogshit :D

I wouldn't do it myself but have heard that a few people have. No idea about dosage or difference in effects, I'm afraid. From what I've heard that smell lingers longtime when snorted though...

Personally, I'd recommend plugging it if its the HCl and plugging or vaping it if it's freebase. I'm not a fan of oral AMT but many are. Let us know if you do go the nasal route cos I've seen very little about that method. I suspect there's good reason for that though


----------



## Xorkoth

I've snorted AMT a few times.  It burns, BAD, for like 20 minutes and feels like it's dissolving your nasal membranes.  The effects come on faster, though it still takes well over an hour to peak, and like 20 minutes to even start really coming up.  The duration is shorter, but not by a lot, and the dose is reduced a bit from oral, but not as much as you'd think.  5mg snorted would have only slight threshold effects.  You're better off just taking it orally, at at least 20mg, but better at 25-30 to start.  Or you can take it at the same dose rectally, for a smoother come-up and a lot less bodyload.


----------



## Solipsis

What do you guys think is the ideal setting for AMT? Because the euphoric side of it makes me think of social party-like situations but the trippy side more like peacefulness.

By the way there is a slight chance that I will go for I.M.
I'm considering it as a worthwhile route of admin in general. Supposedly if you get over the stigma and get your technique straight it's actually better in most ways, don't know if thats all correct?


----------



## Shambles

I'm always nervous about doing almost anything IM for some reason. Which is odd as I have no problem doing it with ket and no problem IVing virtually anything. If product is pure and you do things as cleanly as possible (complete sterility is probably unlikely as most drugs don't come in sterile vials ) then it does seem to be a reasonably safe option.

Infections from IMing stuff are no fun though so that's always a slight concern for me. And I've just always been an IV man - IM just feels riskier to me somehow - but it's probably just familiarity with other options. Not sure I'd be up for IVing AMT and it's less than ideal for most other psyches too though 

As for settings for AMT, I've actually had plenty fun just pottering about on my own doing nothing in particular. Very well-suited to party time - especially if you want a long-laster - but I enjoy it all on me lonesome too. Does have that MDMAesque desire to be around people and spread the luuurve, for sure, but can be great in a number of situations. Low doses are great for day to day use - but probably not all the time unfortunately 

PS:  AMT  

There were far to many  in that post so had to balance it :D


----------



## explorer83

Ayrios said:


> I can't speak for IM, but if you want efficiency, try vaporizing it. 20-30mg is great.



How long was the duration for you? Can you compare it to oral dosage in intensity and duration?


----------



## explorer83

There is a certain vendor who has recently changed the AMT they offer from Hcl to freebase. I received an order not long before they made this switch and think that I may have the freebase instead of the HCl(mine is labled HCl). I tried dissovling the AMT in DI water at 5mg/ml and it wouldn't fully dissolve even with warming of the water and stirring. After a week or two crystals had reformed on the inside of the container. I tried it at 20, 25, and 35mg rectally with very good effectiveness before realizing that it may be freebase. 

What do you think the odds are that I got the freebase? What's the simplest method do determine which form I have besides trying vaping? Would the freebase form be active rectally?


----------



## Delsyd

what are the differences in dose between freebase and hcl?


----------



## PepperSocks

freebase: 174.24 g/mol

HCl salt: 174.24 + 36.5 (HCl) = 210.74g/mol

174.24/210.74= .08268 (~83% )

For a 30mg dose of freebase if you have the HCl salt:   30/0.83= 36mg

30mg dose of HCl salt if you have freebase:  30*0.83= 25mg


----------



## Xorkoth

The freebase form is definitely active rectally.  I think that, really, freebase is probably preferable.  I'm not sure why there has been so much HCL recently.  Perhaps due to increase in weight when changing to HCL?


----------



## Delsyd

uniter said:


> post with a bunch of numbers



so 25mg of freebase= 30mg of hcl

so freebase is more potent, making it more preferable.


i want AMT for my bday. i wish it wasnt all the way in february though...


----------



## nasir~

Xorkoth said:


> I'm not sure why there has been so much HCL recently.  Perhaps due to increase in weight when changing to HCL?


there is no HCl available from the common vendors right now. 

two wellknown RC-suppliers labeled their AMT as "HCl".  
both were not aware of the fact that they actually got the freebase. 


one of the shops corrected their description/mistake and they now state their AMT as [EDIT/of course freebase]freebase[EDIT].
(thanks to delsymfan, i guess )


----------



## Solipsis

I guess I will have to test if the AMT I got recently is also mislabeled as HCl then. The vendor still seems to state it as such, though initially they put the molecule of DPT next to it. Probably wouldn't be extremely confusing but the webmaster changed it on my advice... bunch of amateurs.

Is the freebase not significantly less stable by the way? For storage it sounds superior but I'm probably off with this one


----------



## Geegee

*24 mg= Hydromorph- contin*

24 mg= Hydromorph- contin- took it for pain but now using something else...
I guess in our Area, Atlantic Canada, they go for what $40
not sure but who knows , any one?


----------



## Delsyd

^not a question about AMT.

i think its a question about opiates, hydromorphne and oxycodone. But im not exactly sure what your asking.


----------



## PepperSocks

Delsyd said:


> so 25mg of freebase= 30mg of hcl
> 
> so freebase is more potent, making it more preferable.



Yep, you got it 

Sorry for the mess of numericals, It's just how I figure these things out 

If you have freebase; _multiply_ the desired HCl dose by 0.83 to get the corrected freebase dose.  If you have HCl, _divide_ the desired freebase dose by 0.83 to get the corrected HCl dose.


----------



## bbx4

bbx4 said:


> Cool! Thank you very much.  That is what I shall be doing then.  I found piracetam before MDMA didn't so much increase the euphoria as level it if that makes any sense. It just made the whole experience smoother.  I hope it has the same effect with AMT.
> 
> With AMT I am at times struck with that MDMA-esque, breathless euphoria but it is very brief and seems to come on randomly.  I am hoping the piracetam will level things out.
> 
> I will post my thoughts on it after I try it.  By next Wednesday probably.



Ok, here's a follow up on my experiences with the piracetam and AMT combo:

I tried it a couple times since I posted last.  Both times I followed Xorkoth's advice and dosed the piracetam 45min to an hour before the AMT.

The first time I ended up throwing up much more and much earlier into the trip than I normally do.  I think the piracetam kinda upset my stomach and with the addition of AMT I couldn't handle it.  I must have thrown up some of my dose because it did not feel nearly as strong as it should have (I took 70 mg).

The second time I tried it I smoked a lot of weed on the comeup and also took some pepto bismol pills.  I just sat on the couch and remained motionless and the weed made any nausea go away.  I didn't throw up and around and 1 and half to 2 hours into I knew I wasn't going to because I could feel the peak effects arriving.  

My subjective experience with piracetam before AMT is that it will not make the experience any stronger but will make it more clear-minded and euphoric.  It did not seem to have any effect of visuals.  My AMT trips with piracetam seemed more speedy than my trips with AMT alone. 


Anyways I don't know if I would recommend piractam before AMT because it did make me more nauseous.  But if you don't mind getting really stoned before your trip starts I would say it was worth it.


----------



## explorer83

I emailed the vendor that has recently changed labeling on site from HCl to freebase.



> I see that you've changed the aMT from HCl to freebase on your website. There is speculation online and in my experience that what I received was indeed the freebase instead of HCl. Can you confirm which form that I received?




He responded:



> Yes, apparantly it was freebase. We were told that the lab would produce the HCl salt so we didn't question the form. We should have done some basic tests on it to determine the form and we will do in the future with new products.
> We must apologize for labeling it wrong.


 

I'm actually happy to have the base as I know from first experiments that it's active rectally(and probably orally) and have the option of smoking if I want a somewhat shorter experience.


----------



## Xorkoth

It is definitely also active orally in freebase form.  It's just more versatile that way.


----------



## Xorkoth

nasir~ said:


> there is no HCl available from the common vendors right now.
> 
> two wellknown RC-suppliers labeled their AMT as "HCl".
> both were not aware of the fact that they actually got the freebase.
> 
> 
> one of the shops corrected their description/mistake and they now state their AMT as [EDIT/of course freebase]freebase[EDIT].
> (thanks to delsymfan, i guess )



Ah, good to know.  I had heard about HCL available from many people and assumed it was true.  I've only ever received freebase myself.


----------



## Feste

Turns out mine is freebase too then. 

The thought of how bad it'll smell whilst smoking is a bit off putting.


----------



## explorer83

Feste said:


> Turns out mine is freebase too then.
> 
> The thought of how bad it'll smell whilst smoking is a bit off putting.



20-30mg is a fairly small amount to smoke, though.


----------



## General Patton

Tomorrow is Ken Kesey's birthday, a fitting day for my IT-290 to be sent off :D Pretty soon I should be looking through the Indopan windowpane, I'm exited to see the view from up 'thur!

I AM a bit concerned about storage, considering the smell the freebase is known to produce, might convert some to the HCL salt for long-term storage. Considering the possible anti depressive and empathogenic effects of AMT I'd like to hang onto it for as long as possible.


----------



## Shambles

Mine's just stored in a baggie and the smell doesn't leak. Double bag if it's that bad but I've had no problem. You certainly get a heady waft when you open the bag though :D


----------



## Damien

I like the smell in a Pavlovian sort of way.


----------



## feelgoodhit

Has anyone else found aMT to be damn empathogenic?


----------



## Shambles

One of the most empathogenic drugs I can think of if not _the_ most. Unless you add MDMA and LSD which really is a bit of a special combo empathywise and in just about every other way imaginable


----------



## Coolio

AMT is as empathogenic as  methamphetamine for me, which is to say very little. AMT is very much like 18 hours of mushrooms+methamphetamine for me.


----------



## Solipsis

Eesh that doesn't sound attractive at all? How come, when enough people praise a-MT?


----------



## Shambles

Sounds nothing remotely like AMT to me but there's always that YMMV biznizz I suppose...


----------



## Solipsis

What do you think the overall physical load of the experience as in draining can a good medium a-MT trip be compared to? Is it actually less than MDMA, I hope less than MDMA + LSD! Comparable to other stuff I would know?
Because I'd really love to try mine sometime but I don't want to wear myself out more than I can take.


----------



## Shambles

The afterglow is incomparable and can last weeks. No comedown. No drain. Just bliss that seems to never end even long after it's out of your system. I  AMT.


----------



## Coolio

Solipsis said:


> Eesh that doesn't sound attractive at all? How come, when enough people praise a-MT?



Not attractive at all? Methamphetamine and psilocybin are the kings of the stimulants and psychedelics, man. I can't imagine much nicer! I find methamphetamine fairly similar to MDMA at a high dose.

I get the euphoria, duration, and energy of meth along with the visuals and spiritual connection of psilocybin.


----------



## Shambles

Doesn't quite have the gorgeously glowing afterglow of AMT though does it. Meth has yet to achieve a state of peace, calm and near-bliss that lasts for weeks - if not months -  for me with or without shrooms


----------



## General Patton

That's what I'm looking for in this chem, a lasting positive glow that doesn't seem like just the side-effect of a drug. It's good that it lasts a long time even in it's freebase form, because I hope to enjoy my stash of this one for a long time. From what I've been told it sounds like it will be a great new chemical friend


----------



## Shambles

It's the most "natural" feeling afterglow I know. A genuine anti-depressant that doesn't feel in the least fake, unnatural or synthetic and positively changed me on a deep level for a long time and probably still has. Was life-changing for me when combined with MDMA and LSD


----------



## PepperSocks

I'm going to take a low dose of AMT while I'm doing stuff around the house tomorrow.


----------



## 8ft-Sativa

I tried AMT twice, once at 40mg and another 50mg dose about a month apart. Both times I got MONSTER headaches towards the end of the trip, which put me off entirely.

You guys describe such wonderful experiences with it I’m kind off jealous in a way. 

I get the same headaches with 2C-I every time . . . . There’s a bag just sitting there and it has been for years as I’m scared off by those thumping/pulsating headaches.

Never got bad affects from all the other 2C-X’s or weird Tryptamines I gobbled up back in the day. 

/Semi irrelevant post.


----------



## Xorkoth

^^ If you dose it rectally there will be no headache and it will be much smoother overall... or it is for me that way anyway.  I get headaches at least half the time with oral dosing, but I never once have with rectal.  It's far superior by that route in my opinion.


----------



## Solipsis

I can see that Coolio, but I was thinking about the _combination_ of the two, I don't like stimulants on psychedelics at all - well at least not with a dreamy tryptaminey compound like psilocin. But now I understand  you meant that AMT exhibits traits of both!

It surprises me you say that AMT is not taxing Shambles! Of course it's a tryptamine and I wouldn't consider purely psychedelic ones that taxing, but AMT also has a monoamine releasing aspect doesn't it? Plus the nausea, it just seems like you need to be physically fit to deal with this sort of intense psychedelic stimulation...

Uniters idea appeals to me very much, I too want to take a small dose as an anti-depressant while at the same time checking for strange reactions.
Then, at a proper time I'm thinking about 35 mg rectal how is that for a first trip-level trial after the therapeutic trial?


----------



## explorer83

Solipsis said:


> I can see that Coolio, but I was thinking about the _combination_ of the two, I don't like stimulants on psychedelics at all - well at least not with a dreamy tryptaminey compound like psilocin. But now I understand  you meant that AMT exhibits traits of both!
> 
> It surprises me you say that AMT is not taxing Shambles! Of course it's a tryptamine and I wouldn't consider purely psychedelic ones that taxing, but AMT also has a monoamine releasing aspect doesn't it? Plus the nausea, it just seems like you need to be physically fit to deal with this sort of intense psychedelic stimulation...
> 
> Uniters idea appeals to me very much, I too want to take a small dose as an anti-depressant while at the same time checking for strange reactions.
> Then, at a proper time I'm thinking about 35 mg rectal how is that for a first trip-level trial after the therapeutic trial?



35mg rectal was my 3rd dose. I wish I would have started at that. It was much better than the 20 and 25mg doses that I had before.


----------



## dorothyperkins

What do you dissolve the freebase in to take it rectally!? 

It's been a while since I took it, and only at relatively low doses (~20mg). As far as I remember it felt pretty similar to MDA, and I didn't notice any real afterglow like Shambles mentioned. Maybe I should try it again :-D


----------



## Solipsis

Freebase rectally? I guess you can just take a volume of water and throw it in, then add drops of vinegar carefully just to dissolve everything... technically you're not doing freebase anymore then but I don't see the point in trying to keep it FB especially when the solvents needed otherwise are best kept out of your sweet little a-hole!


----------



## pseudononamouse

What is the relationship between nausea and route of administration? I would think that oral produces the most nausea.


----------



## Solipsis

fastandbulbous said:


> You could always dissolve the AMT in water (with a few drops of clear vinegar to form the acetate salt if it's freebase AMT) the squirt it up yer bum. Comes on faster (more speed of a conventional long lasting psychedeic like mescaline or DOM) and has less bodyload & nausea than the oral route. Herr Shambles extolls the virtues of vapourizing AMT, but can you imagine what that smell would translate to in terms of taste after inhaling a whole load of vapourized AMT. I feel confident in predicting it will 'taste like shit'



Vinegar is a roger, and as you can see the ROA certainly seems to make a difference. I'm not sure about smoking it, I imagine you would get nauseous from it because it is so harsh and disgusting?
Then we covered almost every ROA I guess - railing it seems like a bad idea to me.

For completeness' sake: IM / IV also purportedly limits the nausea, but it's like that for many substances: a pure way of introducing it into your body makes for a pure effect.


----------



## dorothyperkins

Ah ok. And yeah, harsh and disgusting about sums it up!

Railing it is pretty bad, not the worst, and it works.


----------



## Shambles

Solipsis said:


> I'm not sure about smoking it, I imagine you would get nauseous from it because it is so harsh and disgusting?



I get no nausea at all from smoking. It's not exactly sweet-tasting smoke but it's also not a lot of smoke and it's not harsh at all. Suppose the taste must linger a bit but can't say I've noticed - maybe have a doobie chaser on hand just in case


----------



## Ayrios

Smoked is the path of least (none yet, still increasing my vaped dose) nausea for me.  The taste sucks a bit, but if you brush your teeth/tongue afterward and clean out your nose, it won't linger.


----------



## Far away

Will AMT dissolve well in water? I'm planning on dissolving 250mg of it in to 250ml of liquid, so 1ml will equal 1mg. Can anyone comment on the effectiveness of this method for dosing?


----------



## Solipsis

It depends: AMT freebase does not dissolve in water, but AMT salt (like AMT . HCl) does. Still, you can get the freebase to dissolve if you add drops of _clear_ vinegar to the water and mix, add drops until it goes into solution I guess it shouldn't take much at all.
In the case you do this last thing with the freebase then technically what you are creating is also a salt: AMT acetate, only dissociated in aqueous solution of course.

But I believe that dissolving AMT *could* really limit the shelflife of it. I'm not sure though, also don't know if anyone here has any experience with keeping it for an extended amount of time.

If no one else knows, it's preferable that you don't dissolve it or at least not that much if you don't trip that often / plan on it. I figure you are asking because you don't have a scale and want to use volumetric measurement as an alternative method.
I really don't want to advise anyone to eyeball anything, and on top of it: if you didn't get your 250 mg from a friend who weighed it but from a vendor they might have given you more or less than 250 it happens often enough! But I suppose it's possible to eyeball a division of the 250 mg in two halves. That way the margin of error is not enormous and you can save half of it from degrading?


----------



## PepperSocks

That 10mg dose on saturday was nice.  I was working on my bike, took a break and just lied there in the field for a while.  I was feeling quite euphoric.  I had taken some phenibut as well.

I'm going to take 15mg this weekend.  It's a great lift without getting trippy and it lasts all day.  I'll stick with oral dosing for now.  It seems to work fine and the long duration is nice for daytime on the weekend.

About rectal dosing of freebase; you can just put it in a gelcap, lube it up, and insert it.


----------



## Far away

Thanks Solipsis. It is from a vendor, I really need to get my hands on some mg scales. Another question, I hear a lot about the horrible smell of this chemical. As I'm living with my parents at the moment and I'd rather not have to explain to them why the mail smells like old people have shit themselves, is the smell so strong that it will penetrate the baggy and envelope, making the hallway smell bad?


----------



## PepperSocks

Not at all.

I can't smell mine through the baggie.  I had an open bag while I was weighing and I didn't notice any smell.  I didn't put my nose right up to it either, but just having it around isn't going to smell.


----------



## Solipsis

The freebase is rumored to reek worse though... my AMT can be smelled through the baggie and is probably the most penetrant odour of my chemical collection, but the shit-aspect of it is WAY overstated by people. And it doesn't spread across the room either, maybe just a little bit if you open the bag. Most of all it smells like a tryptamine, but it's hardly disgusting at all. Although I must say that there is something about it that reminds of fertilizer, not really dung per say but more chemical. It's an interesting odor and I have let my thought wander over it when I smelled it.
When I received it though, I was surprised that there was so much fuss over the stench: the grossness and spreading-hazard and sh*t.

All in all, I really wouldn't worry about it getting across the hallway but an extra baggie couldn't hurt i spose.

Last to mention: it appears that some syntheses of some compounds can yield a much intenser smell than others (can you say mephedrone?), indicating that there is a byproduct in it that has a superpotent odour. It *could* be the case that AMT smells but some precursor or byproduct smells much worse - so it might depend on the qualitees of yer product


----------



## PepperSocks

Indeed.  I have freebase.  It is pure white and not any smell to speak of.  Like I said I didn't sniff the bag, but there was no pungent smell coming off the open (or closed) bag.


----------



## Solipsis

For really?
Hmm, ok add credit to stinky byproduct theory, subtract credit from stinky freebase theory...
Mine is the HCl I think (bought it as such), fwiw...
One of these days I will basify a little, thereby checking that.

Somehow I find the vendor I got it from legit despite the fact that they got a molecule pic
wrong on the site (I know it was just a bit careless rather than incapable) and their DPT
was *really* brown. Though when I basified that it stayed brown. They claimed that this
product is actually not of inferior quality. Dunno what's up with it?

(ok pulling back again from the boundaries of vendor discussion!)


----------



## nasir~

I will get some AMT the next days. will start low with 15-20 mg. just to brighten the day

@Solipsis


nasir~ said:


> there is no HCl available from the common vendors right now.
> 
> two wellknown RC-suppliers labeled their AMT as "HCl".
> both were not aware of the fact that they actually got the freebase.
> 
> one of the shops corrected their description/mistake and they now state their AMT as [EDIT/of course freebase]freebase[EDIT].


it's really easy to test if you got HCl or freebase. 

i'm pretty sure the vendor you're talking about also got the freebase but mislabeled it as HCl.


----------



## psood0nym

Solipsis said:


> For really?
> Hmm, ok add credit to stinky byproduct theory, subtract credit from stinky freebase theory...
> Mine is the HCl I think (bought it as such), fwiw...
> One of these days I will basify a little, thereby checking that.
> 
> Somehow I find the vendor I got it from legit despite the fact that they got a molecule pic
> wrong on the site (I know it was just a bit careless rather than incapable) and their DPT
> was *really* brown. Though when I basified that it stayed brown. They claimed that this
> product is actually not of inferior quality. Dunno what's up with it?


I have had freebase that smelled and freebase that didn't, and they both worked great. I recall reading a post of fastandbulbous' that said the smell is due to an impurity but even an extremely small amount of impurity can cause the smell.

[The following rant is not directed at you Solipsis, your post regarding the vendor's claim just reminded me of a few things...]

I also recall a post by morninggloryseed about the "pink DPT" that made the rounds before web tryp that so many were sure was impure and "not as spiritual" as white DPT or whatever. He said it tested at over 98 percent purity.  It seems that extremely small amounts of impurity can drastically affect color. Unless impurities just happen to be active at extremely low doses (like may be possible in LSD synthesis), an impure product is unlikely to affect the quality of a trip so long as the dosage is adjusted. Maybe some impurities like that exist in tryptamine synthesis, I don't know, but I imagine a lot of bad mouthing about colored or smelly products in terms of the experience they give is nonsensical power of suggestion at work. 

Then there was a post I came across by f&b explaining that the dreaded dark amber JWH-018 could be that way simply due to the way the end product crystallized.  It can apparently be anywhere from white, to yellow, to dark amber independent of purity--a claim further born out but that early product's being just as potent as claimed in the literature.  We all want to be able to know what were ingesting based on salient features because it's more comfortable to imagine we can. It's nice to think we have some predictable control over the experience based on obvious signs. But in the "RC" world where products are typically not cut, probably more often than not our imagination is getting the best of us and resulting in degraded experiences because we're sure impure substance equals impure experience and that impurities can be detected without proper analysis. 

Many judge mushrooms and cacti and psychotria viridis as superior to their main active, but synthesized, constituent--4-ho-DMT, mescaline, and MAO inhibited synthed DMT. That's fine--I don't accuse them of lying--yet all of these species are rife with other chemicals which, if they showed up in a synthetic, would doubtlessly be deemed by many of these same people as dirty impurities of a botched synthesis. It's a bizarre coincidence that those chemicals that have a high yielding natural source are so often  experientially preferred mixed with the other chemicals in the natural source but an impure synthetic is often thought to cause a tainted experience. It's like nature can do no wrong by us self-medicating humans. I'm not saying eat poorly synthesized psychedelics--there may be impurities with a "double-blind" psychoactive influence in some cases (though I doubt in the preponderance). I just mean to raise suspicions about what is influencing our judgment regarding what parts of the experience are intrinsic to purity when we've all had far ranging experiences with the same batch of a psychedelic at the same dose. 

I apologize if I'm misquoting anyone here.


----------



## Tangerine Dream

Oh my god, AMT is amazing 

Its only been an hour and I feel amazing, like MDMA! Warm rushes, can't stop stroking my arms, body etc! Not sure how much I had, maybe 25mg? My scales are slightly inaccurate.


----------



## delsymfan

My freebase was very stanky for the record. Also very white and clean looking. But very poopy smelling. Not as bad as DiPT though. When you smoke that, you just basically smell like ass for a while.


----------



## khatman

Plugged 25mg at 11am yesterday, could feel tingles quite soon afterwards, slight mood uplift 3 hours later, pupils were small not dilated, lots of yawning.
Sex was possible but I could not be bothered.
Was very hungry and managed to east no problem throughout the day.
No desire to listen to music or increase in energy.
No jaw clenching.

Certainly was not comfortable interacting with the neighbours while on it.

By 5pm I was feeling chilly (unusual for me) and just wanted to lie down and close my eyes.
Felt small mood lift but nowhere near what I would call euphoria.
Went to bed at 7pm and probably fell asleep at 9pm, slept right through until 8am.


----------



## bbx4

khatman said:


> Plugged 25mg at 11am yesterday, could feel tingles quite soon afterwards, slight mood uplift 3 hours later, pupils were small not dilated, lots of yawning.
> Sex was possible but I could not be bothered.
> Was very hungry and managed to east no problem throughout the day.
> No desire to listen to music or increase in energy.
> No jaw clenching.
> 
> Certainly was not comfortable interacting with the neighbours while on it.
> 
> By 5pm I was feeling chilly (unusual for me) and just wanted to lie down and close my eyes.
> Felt small mood lift but nowhere near what I would call euphoria.
> Went to bed at 7pm and probably fell asleep at 9pm, slept right through until 8am.



If you're looking for euphoria I would recommend upping the dosage.  I tried AMT at 25 mg and didn't really find it special at all, but 6 months later when I had more time on my hands I tried some higher dosages and found those much more enjoyable.  

60mg orally is probably my favorite dose.  I have done 100mg in one go and that was also great, much more psychedelic but still not overpowering and not a mindfuck at all.  That 100 mg dose was the last of my AMT and I wish I had split it into two 50mg experiences though!  I want some more!


----------



## Coolio

75mg-100mg or more is the sweet spot with AMT.


----------



## Shambles

^ I'd say that was a tad on the high side for the relatively inexperienced. 25mg vaped is my personal sweet spot but YMMV.

Psood0nym: I believe the stinkyness of AMT is down to the presence of scatole. I don't know if that is an impurity or an inevitability though.


----------



## khatman

I am planning to plug a 40 or 50 mg dose next week in the hope that it provides a bit of stimulation and does not make me want to sit down all day and sleep.

Or I could read up on vaping which I understand gives a bit more stimulation.
Never vaped anything before, I assume it is more than just using tin foil to burn it on.
Is there a big and dandy thread on vapourising and the equipment needed?


----------



## Xorkoth

I recommend plugging 40-50mg like you said.  I'd just go for 50mg.  At a higher dosage the euphoria and full effects will come out.  25mg can be a less-than-full dose, and those always have a chance of being disappointing, especially if you've never gotten full effects before.


----------



## Shambles

khatman said:


> Never vaped anything before, I assume it is more than just using tin foil to burn it on.
> Is there a big and dandy thread on vapourising and the equipment needed?



I think there's the odd thread about vapouriser recommendations around but I doubt you'd want to use one of those cos anything else you used it for afterwards may have a bit of a shitty tang :D

I actually do just use tinfoil and it works fine


----------



## delsymfan

Planning on taking some vape'd AMT to go with a 2c-b-fly trip in the coming month or so. 

Should be interesting. Seems AMT and 2c-b have gone well together before, hopefully this holds true with the FLY version.


----------



## pofacedhoe

*Alphamethyl trypatamine interaction with Tramadol*

Does AMT interact with tramadol as i have heard it lasts a long time and i take 150mg of tramadol in the morning daily as an antidepressant.

any info would be great thanks


----------



## khatman

Plugged 50mg aMT yesterday at 8am by dropping what I think is freebase into 2ml of water which mostly sunk to the bottom of the liquid, added a couple of drops of vinegar and then lemon juice which disolved a bit but managed to get the undisolved lumps suspended in the syringe. I was worried that it would not all absorb when squirted but it was definitley stronger than the 25mg shot.

Again felt some changes just a few minutes later but full effects by 10.30, also smoked 7mg 11am.
Pupils bigger this time, much euphoria, music appreciation, eating more difficult, no extra energy.
Sat down to listen to music a 2pm and could not get back up, stayed there till evening and then went to bed, slept at midnight.
Flet tired and drianed all today.

I loved the euphoria but don't seem to be getting any stimulation or energy which I really need with this because it seems a waste to just sleep the whole time.

Any ideas what I can do to add some energy, a higher dose?
I am guessing 200mg of mephedrone is a bad idea but that gives me plenty of energy but no euphoria. This might be a dangerous combo?

Also should I be taking 5-HTP the day after aMT up until the day I take it again?


----------



## Solipsis

Shambles maybe has additional info but I know tramadol is an SNRI but also a weak SSRI and he had a serotonin syndrome episode after combining tramadol with LSD.
Now I'm not sure of the exact differences in pharmacology between LSD and a-MT but I sure as hell wouldn't combine tramadol with a psychedelic myself. Apparently there are some freaky interactions and you really don't ever want that!
On top of that a-MT is a very mild MAOI and a serotonergic drug so I feel confident saying stay away from that combo if you want to stay healthy.


----------



## Shambles

You said it all for me, Solipsis 

The MAOI effect of AMT may be pretty weak (I've combined it with LSD and MDMA with no problem) but that run-in with SS combining LSD and tramadol was a potent reminder that interactions can be hellish and very dangerous. There's no way I'd combine AMT and tramadol and I'd strongly advise anybody else to do the same.


----------



## Shambles

That's odd that you don't get any energy on AMT, Khatman. It certainly gives me energy once it fully kicks in, although it initially makes me very drowsy. I've combined it with LSD and MDMA which was divine and I certainly had plenty of energy. Any AMT combos need to be approached with caution due to its mild MAOI activity though. Given my success with the MDMA combo it's possible mephedrone would be okay (other than meph being toxic crap in general) but I'd only use a very low dose to test the waters and titrate up slowly if you do try it.

There's no evidence to suggest 5-HTP is of any use for the ftereffects of serotonergic drugs, as far as I know. I've never used it personally but some report a beneficial effect. I've also heard that it can be harmful but don't know enough about it either way to say really.


----------



## Xorkoth

Merged in a question about AMT's interaction with tramadol. 

My educated guess is that it will interact dangerously with tramadol.  Stimulants on tramadol can lead to rapid heart beat, serotonin syndrome, and even death.  In general that is.  I wouldn't risk it.


----------



## khatman

Yes I don't understand it either. It is certainly listed as a stimulant on the wiki page.
I wonder if I still did not take a large enough dose to ge the full effects.
Almost there but not quite.

When I first read that you took LSD and MDMA with the aMT I could not understand why you would do that but now I realsie how amazing that could be.
However I don't have access to MDMA and never fancied LSD.

It's strange, coke, speed, MDMA, mephedrone, all make me horny but make my willy shrink where aMT does not shrink me but does not make me feel horny.

I was thinking of plugging 60mg of aMT Friday and then about 4 hours later plugging 200mg of mephedrone.

I was reading about MAOI on wiki and think that many of the problems are averted when not taken orally, the dietry interactions anyway.


----------



## bbx4

khatman said:


> I was thinking of plugging 60mg of aMT Friday and then about 4 hours later plugging 200mg of mephedrone.
> 
> I was reading about MAOI on wiki and think that many of the problems are averted when not taken orally, the dietry interactions anyway.



From my understanding the danger in taking mephedrone or MDMA with an MAOI is not from dietary interactions but the increased heart rate, body temperature and other effects mixing the two could cause.  Maybe someone with a bit more knowledge has something else to add.

Anyways, it seems the MAOI properties of AMT have small influence if any.  I have drank alcohol while on AMT with no problem.  In any case I think you are much safer trying a smaller dose of mephedrone while on AMT first, maybe something like 75 mg, that way if the MAOI properties of AMT do potentiate the effects of mephedrone you aren't going to be in over your head with something like a seizure.


----------



## dread

Mephedrone alone has quite horrible side effect profile. If you must ingest that *crap*, don't mix it with anything else. There's really no one who can say what will happen if you do.

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=439578
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=457690


----------



## khatman

Thanks for the replies.
I have been taking mephedrone regularly for a few months but never over 500mg in a night and only 1 night a week and never mixed with anything else with no ill effects.

I have read the mephedrone threads and see some people have had nasty side effects which is a concern.
Because of those reports I had planned on not taking mephedrone again especially having found some aMT.

The aMT was lovely and euphoric but for me at least lacks any stimulation/energy and makes we want to sleep making the experience unpleasant.
I certainly do not want to risk seratonin syndrome especially after reading shables' horrible experience with Tramadol and LSD.

So am I right in thinking that the danger in mixing the 2 drugs is because the effects of mephedrone may be much stronger whilst under the influence of aMT?
Is seratonin syndrome also a possibility with mixing these 2?

On aMT I do not get hot and sweaty (like on MDMA) or flushed, in fact I feel a bit chilly which is unusual for me.
I don't sweat on meph either but I do get a bit flushed in the face and a faster heart beat which I would expect with a stimulant.

75mg would be a small dose and don't know if I would feel any effects from it normally.

Found this thread where in post 14 psood0nym mentions possibly trying the combination.
Did you ever try it?

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=411522&highlight=amt+mephedrone


----------



## psood0nym

^Yeah, I did it a couple weeks after that post.  I never wrote back because I didn't feel comfortable levying judgment on the combo given the circumstances I took it under.  It was winter break, and my girlfriend and I were sick from cabin fever.  We drove to one of those indoor water parks.  I couldn't take the two separately, so I took them both rectally, mixed together in the same oral syringe, in the hotel before we left.   I had never taken aMT that way before, and a subsequent trial using that ROA confirmed that, for some strange reason, aMT is far more stimulating and less euphoric to me via RA than at a comparative intensity via my usual intramuscular route. The mephedrone kicked in well before the aMT, though it seemed much more stimulating than usual (probably the coffee I had for breakfast plus the fact that I had just woken up). A slightly uncomfortable stimulation stayed with me throughout most of the day, and I really didn't notice the mephedrone decline like I usually would. It still felt good, obviously, but I'd preferred to have just done aMT alone or aMT, then mephedrone.

However, that latter option could be dangerous. Read some of the MDMA/aMT combos on Erowid.  MDMA and aMT have similar mechanisms of action according to limited data, but aMT probably lets out the monoamines in a constant trickle whereas MDMA and, presumably, mephedrone, just kicks over the bucket. People that know more pharmacology than me have read the data as indicating aMT causes release of serotonin, dopamine, and norepinephrine at low doses and both release and re-uptake inhibition at high doses. If you take a high dose of aMT and kick over the bucket with mephedrone, you've got a spill that doesn't get mopped up for a long time. The neurotoxic effects of such a combo are probably far greater than if you summed the individual damages of each taken alone. Plus, due to mephedrone's short duration and aMT's long one, you'd want to re-dose.  

I haven't noticed any health detriments with mephedrone either. But even back in January I was leery of mephedrone, and have yet to take more than 100mg in a single day (might do it once more in my life). I can't believe people use 1-5 grams in a weekend! That's kind of like taking 10-50 rolls in succession. 

If you want more stimulation use amphetamine (Adderall) with aMT. The alphamethylphenethylamine/alphamethyltryptamine combo, as many have claimed before, is incredible.  And for long lasting, powerful euphoria with an emphathogenic edge and no comedown take the amphetamine as the aMT starts to plateau along with a decent opiate (not tramadol, obviously). Take small bumps of amphetamine as necessary.


----------



## bbx4

^ Excellent analogy! Also the amphetamine/AMT combo sounds amazing, I remember reading one of your previous posts in this thread a while back thinking I should try that. 

As far as psychoactive drug combos with AMT go all I have tried is AMT+weed and it is amazing.  It works wonders for the nausea (for the oral route) during the first part of the experience and after you come up and start tripping the smoke tastes so good and compliments the experience perfectly.  I usually don't enjoy smoking marijuana as it gives me too much anxiety but I recommend it with AMT.


----------



## delphium

I think it's also worth mentioning that MDMA + AMT can be a fantastic and safe combination (even moreso than amphetamine + AMT) as long as the amount of each material is accurately measured and prudently chosen.  For me, that means taking 15 mg of AMT along with 75 mg of MDMA at the 2 hour point.  That combination has never before displayed any signs of physical threat (in the form of, say, overheating or headache) in my trials, and I've performed several.  However, if anyone with a thorough knowledge of pharmacology thinks that these substances in conjunction with one another at that level could potentially be dangerous, please speak up.  Obviously, I'd advise anyone considering this combination to first become intimately familiar with their reaction to AMT and MDMA individually, and I'd hate to post this endorsement only to have someone attempt it and land themselves in the ER with serotonin syndrome.  Bah, maybe it isn't even worth the risk.  Thoughts?


----------



## psood0nym

^I'm sure there's a way to do it that minimizes the risk.  The doses you've found to work without issue sound about right for avoiding the biggest problems (though even individually aMT and MDMA have some degree of neurotoxicity due to simultaneous serotonin and dopamine release from what I hear).  The biggest risk in practice stems from common circumstances and thought processes. That is, how many people know they have pure crystal MDMA to dose that way with? People get sold pills they're told are pure MDMA of a certain dose. I know you're intent is to say people should only try the combo with aMT and MDMA of known purity and composition.  I just imagine people having slips of memory and making justifications about what's safe when they're fucked up is all, e.g. "I think I remember reading it's OK to mix those 'e pills' I got from my trustworthy and omniscient dealer and that 60mg dose of aMT I'm on so long as I only eat one."


----------



## delphium

You make a good point, and I likely should have mentioned that I only attempt this combination with tested, crystal MDMA.  Attempting any MAOI + MDMA combination is, at least to some extent, foolish and dangerous, but doing so with unknown quantities of either (using e pills, for instance) is nothing short of reckless.  Be careful out there!


----------



## Shambles

Yup. I should probably point out that when I combined MDMA with AMT it wasn't too huge a dose of AMT (can't remember exactly but no more than 25mg vaped max) and the MDMA was good quality crystal and a weighed (but since forgotten) dose that was also on the lowish side. Although I think I probably redosed MDMA at some point too.


----------



## khatman

Thanks for the replies.
Interesting to read that you found RA of aMT to be more stimulating than euphoric compared with other ROA's. That is the only ROA I have tried and found it euphoric but not stimulating.
I assume you felt the need for something extra that's why you added the Mephedrone?

As I have said before 25mg of aMT felt like a mild dose, not much euphoria and I slept all day.
With 50mg I felt tingles almost straight away and for the next 3 hours a building euphoria which lasted another 3 hours before I felt so tired I just wanted to sit in the dark with music on and sleep. I did not actaully sleep for another 10 hours though.
But there was no stimulation for me which I really craved with the euphoria.

Out of interest what dose of mephedrone did you take, 100mg?
That would normally be a weak dose for me but you mentioned the aMT seemed to potentiate it.
My plan was to take the mephedrone about 5 hours after the aMT when I would normally be feeling tired.

Good analogy about mephedrome kicking over the bucket, it certainly acts fast and can hit hard.

I do not have access to amphetamines, opiates or MDMA but do have .5g of mephedrone left from a couple of weeks ago. I do not smoke either.

Shambles has taken aMT with LSD and MDMA, delphium mentioned several trials with aMT and MDMA although 15mg of aMT I don't think would do much for me.

I also read that aMT releases seratonin, dopamine and norepinephrine and inhibits re-uptake of them, what about Mephedrone?
To me mephedrone does not seem to act on seratonin much, seems more dopamine to me, not much euphoria but more of an excitement and horniness.

I am now undecided about this combo. Neither are that brilliant on their own to me but I do not want to risk SS for the sake of a few hours fun.


----------



## Shambles

Out of interest, is the AMT you have the incredibly stinky (as in strong enough to leak through the baggie and linger) variety that seems to be around in the UK at the moment, Khatman? I know of another EADDer who reported a similar experience to yours (particularly the lack of energy) and mentioned that it was _extremely_ strong smelling.

AMT doesn't exactly smell sweet but it's not _that_ strong - certainly not enough to leak through a baggie. I can only smell mine if I put my nose in the bag pretty much. Just wondering if the stuff gaining popularity in the UK may be a poor quality synth or summat, perhaps.


----------



## islander20

I also found AMT to be sedating, so perhaps it just affects some people that way. I took it via retal admin.


----------



## khatman

I have nothing to compare it to as it is my first lot of aMT.
A friend bought it over from Europe when he visited there a couple of weeks ago but I do not know where it originated from.

Also I don't know how he or the guy he got it from had been storing it, that might affect potency if not kept cool?

To answer your question yes it is extremely smelly.
I have it in 3 plastic zip lock bags and a glass jar, as soon as the lid is taken off of the jar the smell hits me without opening the bags and I don't have a particularly good sense of smell (cannot smell scent of flowers that others can etc).

None of the Mephedrone I ever bought smelt strong to me.

In a post Treacle made he found the stimulation uncomfortable, lots of nervous energy and the speediest drug he has ever taken even at a low dose, 5-10mg.
So I am assuming it is a different batch or like mephedrone and M1 the same drug affects different people in different ways.

It could be a poor quality synth but all the other desirable effects were there for me at 50mg, euphoria, dilated pupils, body tingles, music appreciation.


----------



## psood0nym

khatman said:


> Thanks for the replies.
> Interesting to read that you found RA of aMT to be more stimulating than euphoric compared with other ROA's. That is the only ROA I have tried and found it euphoric but not stimulating.
> I assume you felt the need for something extra that's why you added the Mephedrone?
> 
> As I have said before 25mg of aMT felt like a mild dose, not much euphoria and I slept all day.
> With 50mg I felt tingles almost straight away and for the next 3 hours a building euphoria which lasted another 3 hours before I felt so tired I just wanted to sit in the dark with music on and sleep. I did not actaully sleep for another 10 hours though.
> But there was no stimulation for me which I really craved with the euphoria.
> 
> Out of interest what dose of mephedrone did you take, 100mg?
> That would normally be a weak dose for me but you mentioned the aMT seemed to potentiate it.
> My plan was to take the mephedrone about 5 hours after the aMT when I would normally be feeling tired.
> 
> Good analogy about mephedrome kicking over the bucket, it certainly acts fast and can hit hard.
> 
> I do not have access to amphetamines, opiates or MDMA but do have .5g of mephedrone left from a couple of weeks ago. I do not smoke either.
> 
> Shambles has taken aMT with LSD and MDMA, delphium mentioned several trials with aMT and MDMA although 15mg of aMT I don't think would do much for me.
> 
> I also read that aMT releases seratonin, dopamine and norepinephrine and inhibits re-uptake of them, what about Mephedrone?
> To me mephedrone does not seem to act on seratonin much, seems more dopamine to me, not much euphoria but more of an excitement and horniness.
> 
> I am now undecided about this combo. Neither are that brilliant on their own to me but I do not want to risk SS for the sake of a few hours fun.


I took 100mg of mephedrone rectally with it not because I wanted more stimulation, but just because I thought they might boost and extend the euphoria of one another.  With RA 100mg is enough for me.  

For the decline of aMT to be relaxing is pretty normal.  I've experienced a similar profile to what you describe with freebase and HCl, smelly and not smelly aMT, though I don't typically find the relaxing effects that insistent unless I smoke cannabis and actually try to relax.  Cannabis substantially increases both the euphoric and later relaxing qualities of aMT in my experience--with lots of yawning and tearing and stupid contented grins (euphoria skyrockets for like 10 minutes after sitting down after being out). If sedation is the real deal breaker for you and you don't have access to less dangerous euphoric stimulants, why not just use caffeine when you start nearing the decline? It won't cause much excitement, but it will probably be enough to keep you level longer.


----------



## pseudononamouse

Does the taste of AMT remind anyone else of tea tree oil?


----------



## delsymfan

Whats the standard smoked come up time? 

I hit a little sprinkle around 2:40 and its now 3:20. Havent really noticed much. Got a mild buzz going but no visual elements as of yet.


----------



## Solipsis

Must be pretty weird having a chem with a delayed come up! Thats so not what you are used to with smoking...


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## delsymfan

I know its buggin me...

Well at T+1 hr I didnt feel too different. I smoked more, like closer to 50% more than the first time. 

I probably was being super careful with the first dose, I think Im a lil paranoid from this 2c-b-fly scenario. Plus, I've never smoked AMT before so I really had a tough time guessing a good first dose.

Anyway since the second smoke about 20 minutes ago things have picked up. Again, not sure whether thats the first one kicking in or the 2nd one just taking off. 

Confusing as hell smoking and waiting.


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## PepperSocks

I find it onsets in 5 minutes and comes up over 1/2 and hour.  it is weird to have a delayed come up from smoking.

It's like pot in that way.  You smoke a bowl, but it takes about 10 to really feel it.  I actually like to delayed come-up, it makes it smoother, unlike DMT.

I'm finding it kinda weak.  8mg gives me a bit of a buzz but barely noticeable.  I think it might have to do with my bong-vaporization technique.  Using tin foil next time



pseudononamouse said:


> Does the taste of AMT remind anyone else of tea tree oil?



Not sure about tea tree oil, but it's nearly identical to moth balls for me.

I find the taste from vaporization or the smell from sniffing the bag is exactly like moth balls.  Not overly tasty but not completely offensive either.  I had always heard it smelt/tasted literally like shit.


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## delsymfan

Yeah the buzz is like instant but that fades out...

Well its been 1.5 hrs from the 2nd dosing and I can notice visual wavyness now. 

AMT normally takes a while to really get into high gear. My oral use I noticed didnt really tear off until like 90-120minutes after intake.

And for sake of saying:

Yeah it smells yucky, but smoking it is hardly a problem. People claiming its harsh, I dont get it. I found it just a tad rougher than DiPT but totally smokable. No problem to hold it in the lungs. Sure its a little hot, but I blame that on not being able to find a bigger lightbulb here in peru. 

They all use flourescent bulbs here so the incandescent ones are hard to find, and tiny at that...


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## khatman

I can notice the effects from smoking within 5 minutes and that's even with a small 5mg dose
I just use tin foil and a lighter.

Mind you plugged I feel the effects with 15 minutes, the effects slowly build for the following 2 hours or so.


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## delsymfan

Well I'd say like I said, I feel that buzz for the first bit. But the visual effects and such build up from 1-2 hours after. Theres just that rush at the start.

I like the lightbulb method myself.


----------



## Delsyd

if i was to take ~40mg of AMT today around 4pm. How long about untill i could get to sleep? 

Also would this dose be okay to take at a bar/small venue for a friends bands show or would taking a lower oral or smoking 20-30mg be more advisable for this type of situation.


thx guys.


----------



## PepperSocks

Well if you want to reduce the duration, smoking is the way to go.  20-30mg seems really high, but I dunno, I'm sensitive.  10mg smoked gives me fairly good effects without overdoing it.


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## Delsyd

what do you mean by fairly good?

Do you get visuals and euphoria? Im looking to get a bit of both but not to go all the way if you know whati mean.

Also i think you may be a tad more sensitive to psychs then i am.


----------



## PepperSocks

Oh no visuals.  Just a pleasant body stimulation that makes me want to get up and go.  For going to a bar/venue 10mg would be good for me; I wouldn't want to be into visual territory in a lace like that, but that's all a matter of personal preference.

I actually smoke 5mg in the morning before work now.  It makes my day so much more positive and active.  I smoked 10mg on sunday and got a shitload of wood in the house :D

It's a really good, positive and clean feeling stimulant/antidepressant but I haven't gone into visual territory with it yet.


----------



## Delsyd

yeh, i would like to get it into more psychedelic territory more than just anti depressent.

this will be a psychedelic friendly event.


----------



## Delsyd

So what is a good IM dose for AMT
and what would 10mg be comparable to in oral dosing?

Also why is IM betterr then oral. Ive read it several times from psoodonym but cant seem to find his posts right now.

And is IV a horrible idea?


----------



## delphium

I believe psoodonym mentioned finding IM AMT less stimulating than other ROA's.  Mind you, I've never found AMT particularly stimulating (taken orally or vaporized), at least not more so than any other psychedelic.  The only downside that I've noticed with oral dosing is an increase in nausea, and even that can be mostly avoided by dosing with the HCl rather than the freebase.


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## delsymfan

Dont think IV is a great idea from what it sounds like. Sounds like its not that much better.

I'd say smoked the time was solid. It definitely stimulates more on the early side. 

And for psychedelic territory for going out, 25mg probably would do you well. Depends how sensitive you are. Some people take like 40+mg to get a real trip out of this, and others 30 does it well.

Talking to a fellow BL'er recently, he had a good trip off of 75mg. Seems like a chem that requires some trial and error.


----------



## psood0nym

delphium said:


> I believe psoodonym mentioned finding IM AMT less stimulating than other ROA's.  Mind you, I've never found AMT particularly stimulating (taken orally or vaporized), at least not more so than any other psychedelic.  The only downside that I've noticed with oral dosing is an increase in nausea, and even that can be mostly avoided by dosing with the HCl rather than the freebase.


I mentioned it as less stimulating than rectal dosing, which I found to be strange considering that it comes on much faster IM. Also of note, I've only dosed it rectally twice, and once was the acetate after mephedrone (post above).  Even when the dose/response is scaled to be of equivalent intensity to other ROAs it's still stimulating early on, but not for as long. Later I get very relaxed, especially if it's combined with cannabis.  

I've also noticed a massive reduction in nausea with the HCl compared to the freebase.  I can't imagine why as I figured it would be converted to the HCl quickly in the stomach.  I assumed it was that my metabolism had changed between using the freebase (earlier) and using the HCl more recently. Weird.


----------



## kong

Does aMT typically come as the hcl or freebase?  I'd imagine the freebase is not particularly soluble in water?


----------



## Xorkoth

It almost always comes in freebase... in fact, I think I remember hearing that a batch reported by the vendor to be HCL was actually freebase.  Plus the freebase is more potent by weight and more stable (I think).

The freebase is not soluble whatsoever in water.  It will mix and form a suspension, but it will not dissolve.  If you add a drop or two of hydrochloric acid or other acid, it will dissolve, after turning into the HCL.  I used to that a lot, especially for rectal dosing.


----------



## delsymfan

And do it quick...

Cause if you leave the freebase in the water without converting it, it dies. Thats what happened to mine. Like 80% of it died within 20 minutes or so.


----------



## Delsyd

There was a vendor a while ago that did have hcl.
I think what i have now is Hcl. Ill test it out later when i get home by dropping a few mg in some water. Mine is entirely odorless.
It still works when smoked, though im probably wasting some that way.

DPT Hcl also worked when smoked but not as well as the freebase.

If this weekend permits i think i will try 40-50mg orally to get a full taste for it.

My one and only trial with aMT was probably 4 or 5 years ago with 45mg orally (dont know if it was hcl or fb) and i remember finding it very enjoyable.


----------



## Shambles

Wasn't that the same vendor that mislabelled their AMT but didn't realise till they'd sent out plenty of it already, Delysyd? Possibly the same vendor involved in the "2C-B-fly" fiasco although I'm sure there were others too. Have never known of the HCl being sold anywhere but may, of course, be mistaken.


----------



## delphium

There was a large, now defunct (or at least sketchy) Chinese supplier that was selling the HCl about a year ago, and it was top notch.


----------



## kong

It turns out what I have came as the hcl.  I was planning on taking it orally anyway...it has almost no smell.  Thanks for the responses.


----------



## delsymfan

Shambles said:


> Wasn't that the same vendor that mislabelled their AMT but didn't realise till they'd sent out plenty of it already, Delysyd? Possibly the same vendor involved in the "2C-B-fly" fiasco although I'm sure there were others too. Have never known of the HCl being sold anywhere but may, of course, be mistaken.



Same guy...

Shipped me the AMT labeled as HCl despite it being FB form.


----------



## Delsyd

Shambles said:


> Wasn't that the same vendor that mislabelled their AMT but didn't realise till they'd sent out plenty of it already, Delysyd? Possibly the same vendor involved in the "2C-B-fly" fiasco although I'm sure there were others too. Have never known of the HCl being sold anywhere but may, of course, be mistaken.



no it didnt come from the 2cb-fly guy.
i know he has freebase.

Mine came from the chinese guy that delphium mentioned. 

This is not one of the more recent batches.


----------



## delsymfan

Shambles is referring to the guy shipping it labeled as HCL until people complained and then he fixed it...

And that is the same guy as the 2c-b-fly. I should know, I got a package with both chemicals.


----------



## Delsyd

yeh, i knew who shambles meant.
But im still pretty damn sure mine came from the guy delphium mentioned.

lll test to see if its Hcl tonite. ill drop a few mg into some water and see what happens.


----------



## isotopic_parody

I think you are all talking about the same chinese vendor who used to have a website and now only works with old customers.... Don't quote me, though, as I am not certain on the 2c-b-fly as I didn't even want to bother to ask if they stocked it.


----------



## General Patton

My batch of AMT was one of the later ones that was properly labeled as the freebase, coming from the same vendor as others here, and even bearing the dreaded designation "batch b1" 

But I'm glad to hear from delsymfan that it seems to be pure and active at the proper doses. It seems like this would be so as the chem is white and odourless, and AMT freebase is known to smell pretty bad even if there is a tiny amount of impurity. I still don't trust that 99.74% purity rating, although vaporizing small amount couldn't hurt and seems to be a good choice for a first assay.


----------



## delsymfan

It vaporizes quite cleanly, doesnt leave much residue. 

Also smells kinda dank but not horribly so. It appears pretty clean to me.

Judging by the fact its gone lol... id say it was!


----------



## General Patton

That's good to hear, I guess if it was at all contaminated it would be obvious at this point.

Thanks for your input, that calms me considerably... Too bad about your other orders, but I guess that's just how things are when ordering RC's.


----------



## delsymfan

Well who knows, we may have Bromo-DragonFLY so that may turn out useful anyway.. pending further testing.

Such is life.

Shame I just didnt buy a shit-ton more of this AMT to tide me over. It seems very random with dose response in people. I think I need more than the average joe.


----------



## General Patton

Yeah BDF would be a pretty rare find in and of itself, I hope it tests out OK.

I stocked up because simple tryptamines always catch my eye, and AMT is one I've had my eye on for a while. I'm usually pretty sensitive dose-wise so this should last me a while, I'm very exited to try this one out. I have some 4-AcO-DMT so I'll probably try combining the two if they are as heavenly a combo as Xorkoth says, which I'm sure it will be.


----------



## delsymfan

That does sound like a nice combo. Just start easy. That whole mild MAOI bit I suppose. 

I personally dont think it's much to write home about as long as you keep the AMT side of the combo down.

It does seem very combo-friendly though I never got a chance to try any.


----------



## psood0nym

^The MAOI stuff isn't that significant.  It's the monoamine release and re-uptake inhibition that's probably responsible for most worrisome reactions. 

I rarely use aMT alone at psychedelic doses. I find it quite nice, but it isn't that psychedelic, and for its brand of euphoria there are shorter lasting alternatives. Still, low dose aMT makes a solid recreational euphoriant that isn't expensive, particularly in combination with low doses of amphetamine(s). However, as a supplement to other psychedelics its utility is unparalleled. It's channeled everything I've mixed with it in a very positive direction. Two of my plus four experiences have been aMT combos: aMT/4-AcO-DMT and aMT/DPT.

The last time I did aMT with 4-AcO-DMT was great, too, but felt more dangerous than I thought it would.  I IMd aMT, then about 90 minutes later I IMd the 4-AcO. A quick but smooth transition to greater psychedelia was expected.  But what happened was that the tension of the onset was prolonged for far longer. I kept thinking, "All right, any time now."  Then I felt the moment the 4-AcO's psychedelic stage started like a slap--literally a sudden tactile feeling kind of like a very mild brain zap (perhaps it had made it to a new section of the brain it was held back from for some reason , I don't know). The tension was gone. 

Within seconds my vision started waving and I got dizzy. I laid down and was inundated with a sensual wave of euphoria. My mouth ran dry, I licked my lips because I expected to taste some kind of sweetness, and just lifting my head made me dizzy. It was intensely pleasurable but I was kind of distracted from getting into it because my physiological reaction was a little alarming. It was definitely the 4-AcO-DMT, as I've had a similar reaction to it alone before at a higher dose, it just wasn't this powerful or flat out physically euphoric.


----------



## delphium

psood0nym said:


> Within seconds my vision started waving and I got dizzy. I laid down and was inundated with a sensual wave of euphoria. My mouth ran dry, I licked my lips because I expected to taste some kind of sweetness, and just lifting my head made me dizzy. It was intensely pleasurable but I was kind of distracted from getting into it because my physiological reaction was a little alarming. It was definitely the 4-AcO-DMT, as I've had a similar reaction to it alone before at a higher dose, it just wasn't this powerful or flat out physically euphoric.



I had a pretty similar reaction combining 40 mg of AMT freebase with 2 grams of very potent Cambodians.  At the approximate peak, I was floored by the physical euphoria of the trip.  It felt as though my blood had thickened and been superheated; almost like I had magma flowing through my veins.  It was almost obscenely pleasurable, and, as psoodonym described, more than a little alarming due to the intensity.  Also odd was how physically powerful and strong the sensation made me feel, despite the fact that I could barely roll over to reach the glass of water I'd left sitting on my bedside table.  Folly of drugfuckedness, methinks.


----------



## Delsyd

So what i have is definately Hcl.
I dropped 8mg into a shot glass of water and it dissolved almost immediately with out barely any stirring.

Today was my first time trying it at this dose orally.

Smoked it comes on much quicker and i suppose leaves the system quicker aswell.
Orally it took about 1 hour to come on but the slightly speedy feeling is almost identical to similar doses of the Hcl smoked; but orally i think its more euphoric at this dose (~10mg) as it feels more stretched and maybe even still coming on (though i doubt it as i took it about 4 hours ago).


----------



## Delsyd

Also as far as combining with 4 Aco Dmt.

How would you time when to take the 2? Take the psilacetin once the aMT peaks would be my guess.

And should i use a lower dose when combining these then i would if i were to take them individually?

Suppose a regular dose of aMT for me is 50mg orally and psilacetin is 24mg orally.
What doses should i use when combining the two?


----------



## psood0nym

Delsyd said:


> Also as far as combining with 4 Aco Dmt.
> 
> How would you time when to take the 2? Take the psilacetin once the aMT peaks would be my guess.
> 
> And should i use a lower dose when combining these then i would if i were to take them individually?
> 
> Suppose a regular dose of aMT for me is 50mg orally and psilacetin is 24mg orally.
> What doses should i use when combining the two?


Yep, at aMT's peak. I tend not to do any two part combos with any less than a moderate plus two dose of each.  Each part needs a chance to exhibit its flavor. 

That sounds like a fairly strong dose, but I think you'll probably be better than fine since the aMT's inherent positive push keeps me from straying off track to some degree. If you're concerned maybe knock three of four milligrams off the 4-AcO.


----------



## Delsyd

im excited to try this combination after hearing all the good reports from you and Xork and people who have mixed it with mushrooms.

Also, what dose of IM DPT did you use for the combo?
i have not tried DPT IM'd before but im guessing my sweet spot is around 30-40mg


----------



## psood0nym

I usually do 45-50mg IM DPT with aMT, the same dose I would do of DPT alone. 55-60 mg typically puts me over an edge where I can't walk and I'm in ego death territory, so for me the sweet spot seems to be right at that qualitative divide. 30-40 mg sounds like a good first dose for the combo though.  With IM you'll be peaked in 10-20 minutes, so you'll know quickly if you want more.  

One friend gave me his pair of $250 headphones to thank me for giving him the combo. But don't be like a certain misbehaved bluelighter who took my advice and liked how the combo was going so much he dosed again, doubling the amount of DPT for a total of 100 mg! He had a rough, but very memorable time.  

I can understand why he did it though. Once when I did this it was sheer euphoria and sensual grace--the kind that wells in your throat and percolates there, then makes you sob at the fact that such a state of ecstasy is even possible.  And no comedown! Just a soul with the soft and wavering glow of hot coals. For months afterward whenever I would near orgasm during sex I would find myself gritting my teeth, just like I did from the aMT during the combo ("are you snacking during our love making, psood0nym!?"). I think that what happened was that the pleasure during the combo was so exquisite that teeth gritting was unconsciously conditioned to occur during sufficiently similar states of sensual pleasure. I should note, however, that my reaction to DPT is slightly uncharacteristic--similar to Jamshyd's ethereal experiences with it.


----------



## Delsyd

im getting more excited by the minute.

Do you find DPT on its own to be a bit hectic and chaotic, scary at times even, at your dose of 40-50mg IM? Does taking it with AMT lessen the less pleasurable effects?


----------



## psood0nym

> Do you find DPT on its own to be a bit hectic and chaotic, scary at times even, at your dose of 40-50mg IM? Does taking it with AMT lessen the less pleasurable effects?


50 mg and greater has gotten hectic in the sense of my becoming a trembling mass of ego-bubbling goo, but never at lower doses. Yes, the aMT helps keep it under control. That's what I meant when I said aMT's positive push keeps me from "straying off track." 

The only time I ever found  DPT scary had nothing directly to do with its intensity. It happened after the peak, and I wrote a trip report on it titled "Turning Back the Second Seconds." An excerpt illustrates the concept behind the glitchy horror:


> I'm unable to realize it explicitly at this this time, but I've begun to consistently experience partial echoes of my emotional reactions, thoughts and interior monologue—even the inner impressions of perceptions—approximately two seconds after they occur.
> 
> To understand the nature of what I'll be describing more clearly imagine walking into a quiet empty room at 1 pm. A cuckoo clock whirs to life, startling you, and you twist your head to see it. It gives one quick “cuckoo.” Giggling at yourself, you watch as the tiny bird snaps back behind the doors of the clock. At 1 pm. and two seconds the clock's doors have just shut, yet suddenly you're struck with the same sense of surprise you had when you heard the mechanism first start 2 seconds ago. Less than half a second later the sensation of twisting your head to see the clock recurs. You experience vertigo because in truth you haven't physically moved a bit. Still standing there looking at the cuckoo clock’s closed doors you can almost see the bird pop out and almost hear it's chime. It's more than a vivid memory. What you're experiencing is so transporting that you feel at a far distance from the image of the clock that is actually present an arm's length before you now, like you're a step behind yourself and trailing in time. Expressionless, you feel a mild sense of relief followed by a short spike of elation and a blush spread across your face. This is what that laugh you had at yourself a moment ago would have felt like if you hadn't smiled. You're getting the first hints that something's seriously wrong. Now the muffled echo of that 2 second old laughter is mixed with brand new confusion, which will soon mount to dread. You turn to leave at 1 pm. and 4 seconds, yet as you take your first step you feel a part of you is still standing still, looking at the just closed doors of the clock... This is what's just happened to me.


----------



## Delsyd

Would taking a psychedelic dose of AMT (~50mg) be effective in the evening if i took an anti-depressent dose (~8mg) that morning or would there be some sort of tolerance issue?


----------



## delsymfan

depends on the Anti-depressant...

SSRI's and Anti-psychotics, could hamper the experience. 

Benzos early in the day, you're fine.

MAOI's early in the day, ehh could be potentially harmful, but I dont know enough to say.


----------



## Delsyd

i was refering to anti depressent doses of aMT (5-10mg, like when it was used as Indopan in my mother Russia)


----------



## Shambles

Reduced effects, in my experience. But reduced effects are not zero effects. Make of that what you will...


----------



## delsymfan

Delsyd said:


> i was refering to anti depressent doses of aMT (5-10mg, like when it was used as Indopan in my mother Russia)



Pardon my misinterpretation...

I was re-dosing smoked over oral later that night, and it was a bit wasteful i'll admit.

Although if you have most of the day in between, and the original dose is small, hopefully it wouldnt affect your 2nd run too hard.. But I imagine with a long lasting chem some short term tolerance will be there. Albeit minor.


----------



## Mr Wobble

You know this aMT sounds pretty interesting -  euphoric, entactogenic, euphonogenic :D, a friendly psychedelic, long lasting, but with a gentlish come down and possible mid to long term positive effects upon mood - and also cheap and legal (in the UK) - so why isn't it more popular? You'd think it would give the (slightly less legal) 2C's more of a run for their money?


----------



## delsymfan

Likely there are a few things slowing its popularity:

1. Scheduled in US, and the US does decide a lot of demand. 
2. Many people do get sick on it and throw up.
3. Others need higher doses to achieve a good time, making it not as cheap as it seems. 

Its good stuff but its got its negatives like everything else.


----------



## Mr Wobble

Okay, that makes sense delsymfan.


----------



## khatman

Is aMT in HCL form known to be stronger than the freebase?

I ask because I took a small tester dose of 10mg yesterday of a new delivery and it felt much stronger than 10mg of the freebase I had previously, actually if felt more like 25mg.

Plugged 10mg at 4pm, could feel tingles quite soon afterwards, mood uplift 1 hours later, pupils very dilated, lots of yawning.
AMT always makes me hungry and managed to eat no problem.
No desire to listen to music or increase in energy though.
Asleep by 1am.

One annoying thing about taking aMT is it makes me produse more saliva, anyone else get this?

Going to try a higher dose on Wednesday.


----------



## Iodjini_dk

Maybe the HCl you got was more pure than the freebase you had before? By weight aMT freebase is more potent than aMT HCl. But many things could have influated it I guess. Set and setting play a role here.


----------



## ungelesene_bettlek

khatman said:


> Is aMT in HCL form known to be stronger than the freebase?
> 
> I ask because I took a small tester dose of 10mg yesterday of a new delivery and it felt much stronger than 10mg of the freebase I had previously, actually if felt more like 25mg.


probably the salt is just better absorbed, because it is better water solvable?


----------



## khatman

Yes possibly, I did notice with the freebase that I could not get it to dissolve completely even with lemon juice added.
It was suspended in the water but I wondered how much would be absorbed when plugged.


----------



## Shambles

Freebase works just fine orally or plugged (or indeed IV'd or IM'd, I believe) although I prefer vapourisng it. There's instructions on how to convert the freebase to salts somewhere in this thread if you wish to do so, I think.


----------



## feelgoodhit

How would you go about dissolving a known amount of aMT in water for liquid measurement?

-Would it keep well?
-Is there anything that needs to be done to the aMT before that can be done?
-What's in soluble in? I remember hearing something about forms of aMT not being easy to dissolve in water...

Some detailed instructions would help.


----------



## Iodjini_dk

You have to know wether its freebase or a salt you have. Salts are soluble in water adn should keep fine if youre using demineralized/distilled water and keep the container airtight. You can add a few drops of vinegar or another non-toxic acid if you want to conserve it further, but thats probably overkill. 

I wouldnt reccomend dissolving the freebase in anything as the solvents you need for this are either very toxic, expensive or a pain in the ass to work with. 

You can convert the freebase to a salt by treating it with acid.


----------



## feelgoodhit

How do you do that (treat it with acid)?


----------



## Iodjini_dk

Hmm... maybe mix it with an equimolar amount of HCl (I take it you ony have access to HCl in solution), wait for some time for it all to have reacted. You now have a solution of aMT HCl. Be sure to check the pH before ingesting it!

I guess the water they dissolve HCl in is perfectly safe to ingest after all the acid has reacted, but I really dont know. The optimal way of doing this would be to dissolve your aMT freebase in some non polar solvent and then gas it with pure HCl so it precipitates, but that technique demands access to a lab and stuff.

Alternatively, I think you can buy 96% sulpuric acid in paint shops. That would also be good at the job, but 37% HCl is a bit safer to handle IMO.


----------



## ungelesene_bettlek

^ why not simply use some vinegar as acid, when you already mentioned it already? I would use something less disgusting, though, like lemon juice.


----------



## Delsyd

feelgoodhit said:


> How would you go about dissolving a known amount of aMT in water for liquid measurement?
> 
> -Would it keep well?
> -Is there anything that needs to be done to the aMT before that can be done?
> -What's in soluble in? I remember hearing something about forms of aMT not being easy to dissolve in water...
> 
> Some detailed instructions would help.




Hey buddy, nice to see ya around.

first find out which form you have (its most likely freebase, but check just in case)
The HCL version goes into solution without any problem, i barely even had to stir.
To find out if yours is hcl or freebase just take a little amount (5-10mg) and throw it in some water. If it doesnt disolve and just stayes floating on top you got freebase. 
If its freebase convert it to a slat and go about making a solution as you would with any other chem. (known amount of chemical in known amount of solution, etc)

You could use white vinegar as the solution (just like crackheads do when they want to inject crack (freebase cocaine) rather than smoke it)

Im not sure how well it would keep in solution. Tryptamine arent known for their longevity in solution (though that seems to be the case mostly for 4-ho/aco's)


----------



## delsymfan

My AMT kept fine when properly converted to HCL (i had freebase). It was in a sealed plastic cup, in a dark cabinet. Not sure if that matters though.

However, freebase AMT when put into tap water (at least, peruvian tap) was murdered within half an hour. I lost probably 75-80% of my amount in the 30 minutes it took to get the stuff to make it HCL.


----------



## PepperSocks

I have some AMT I want to prepare a solution of for liquid measurement and this is the predicament I face:



Delsyd said:


> Im not sure how well it would keep in solution.



I have freebase AMT.  I can either dissolve the freebase in 100% ethanol and use it like that or I can dossolve it in white vinegar to make a solution of AMT acetate.

The thing is; Which one will last longer?

Edit: I plan on taking a 5mg dose in the morning so i went ahead and did what i figured would be best; I dissolved it in vinegar to produce the bound salt form.  I figured it would be more stable even though it was aqueous and not alcoholic.  I noticed the solution in the vial i used lost a lot of it's vinegar smell after the AMT dissolved.  It seems as it the AMT freebase neutralized a lot of the acetic acid; that would explain the lack of smell.


----------



## Iodjini_dk

Yeah, the acetate salt should be odorless. Id go for that choice as well. 100% ethanol is worse to use than 96% as 100% often has benzene added to make it 100%, so plese dont go for that. If you distill your alcohol to 100% it will dilute to 96 over time by itself. I guess storing it as the acetate in water solution is a good solution to the problem.

If you have a little surplus of the acetic acid it should keep fine for long time. Vinegar itself keeps well for several years.


----------



## PepperSocks

Iodjini_dk said:


> 100% ethanol is worse to use than 96% as 100% often has benzene added to make it 100%, so plese dont go for that.



Naw.  It has an assay breakdown of impurities on the label.  There is no benzene.  And how would adding an impurity (benzene) make it more pure? 



> If you have a little surplus of the acetic acid it should keep fine for long time. Vinegar itself keeps well for several years.



That's what I thought.  I think most of the acetic acid neutralized though.  There is barely nay vinegar smell left.  The freebase AMT took a lot of it up.


----------



## pseudononamouse

Would there be any downside (as in the longevity of AMT) to accidentally adding a little more vinegar than necessary? Personally, I like the taste of vinegar so long as it is not harsh enough to hurt my throat.

Also, is it more effective to take an alkaloid salt sublingually than its freebase?


----------



## Iodjini_dk

PepperSocks said:


> Naw.  It has an assay breakdown of impurities on the label.  There is no benzene.  And how would adding an impurity (benzene) make it more pure?
> 
> 
> 
> That's what I thought.  I think most of the acetic acid neutralized though.  There is barely nay vinegar smell left.  The freebase AMT took a lot of it up.



Well, ethanol forms an azeotrope with water and thus cant be distilled higher than 96% ethanol. To make 100% pure ethanol they often add bezene with forms an azeotrope with ethanol and water. This azeotrope has a lower BP than the water/ethanol azeotrope and can be distilled off. But this leaves a little residue of benzene behind which is pretty toxic. So technically its not 100%, but for that matter there is no such thing as 100% ethanol.

There are other ways of doing this however, so I guess your ethanol is a bid different from the usual 99,99% from the lab 



> Would there be any downside (as in the longevity of AMT) to accidentally adding a little more vinegar than necessary? Personally, I like the taste of vinegar so long as it is not harsh enough to hurt my throat.
> 
> Also, is it more effective to take an alkaloid salt sublingually than its freebase?



I think it would be a good idea adding extra vinegar. It consrvates your solution much better if theres a bit of surplus acetic acid. 

I dont think it would matter whether the alkaloid youre referring to is salt or freebase. You have plenty of HCl in your stomach, so its gonna be converted to the alkaloid salt under all circumstances.


----------



## PepperSocks

I don't think it would be good to use more vinegar.  I think a 10mg/mL solution is a good number.

What are the thoughts on stability;  More stable at acidic pH or more stable at neutral pH?

The acidic pH would keep things from growing in the liquid but wouldn't it be potentially more reactive for the chemical?


----------



## AChemicalLife

PepperSocks said:


> I have some AMT I want to prepare a solution of for liquid measurement and this is the predicament I face:
> 
> 
> 
> I have freebase AMT.  I can either dissolve the freebase in 100% ethanol and use it like that or I can dossolve it in white vinegar to make a solution of AMT acetate.
> 
> The thing is; Which one will last longer?
> 
> Edit: I plan on taking a 5mg dose in the morning so i went ahead and did what i figured would be best; I dissolved it in vinegar to produce the bound salt form.  I figured it would be more stable even though it was aqueous and not alcoholic.  I noticed the solution in the vial i used lost a lot of it's vinegar smell after the AMT dissolved.  It seems as it the AMT freebase neutralized a lot of the acetic acid; that would explain the lack of smell.



I would say that the salt form would last longer and is more stable.

I don't know if you can compare what turning it into AMT acetate will do to the potency if you're only taking 5mg, but if you ever take a bigger dose, a report back on any loss of potency (minus the fact that the salt will weigh more than the freebase) would be awesome, as I've been wondering this myself.


----------



## PepperSocks

I didn't measure it like that.

I just put 100mg of AMT freebase into a vial and added 10mL of vinegar.  Because the AMT molecules do take up a _little_ bit of space the volume will be slightly higher than 10mL.  I just use a 1cc needle-less syringe to measure the 1/10ths of a cc for an approximate milligram dose.


----------



## pseudononamouse

PepperSocks said:


> I didn't measure it like that.
> 
> I just put 100mg of AMT freebase into a vial and added 10mL of vinegar.  Because the AMT molecules do take up a _little_ bit of space the volume will be slightly higher than 10mL.  I just use a 1cc needle-less syringe to measure the 1/10ths of a cc for an approximate milligram dose.



I would rather take a drug sublingually or orally than intravenously, but out of curiosity, has anyone tried injecting AMT intravenously?


----------



## Solipsis

What factors influence the nausea it has been notorious for for so long?

Is the stomache supposed to be empty? Is stomache and/or sample pH a factor (I heard freebase is much nastier in this respect so a little excess of acid - not lsd but H3O+ ... should help?)
Due to the flavor Id rather not take it sublingually but rectal might be a good way for the body.. not the first time though. Might I try a mg or 10 in the morrow? We'll see.


----------



## PepperSocks

Rectal supposedly has much less nausea.  It also comes up faster and doesn't last the long haul like oral does.

I quite like oral dosing though; much much better than vaporization.  Vaporization doesn't make one trip; it's just a crappy stimulant without much euphoria.

Oral dosing takes a long time to come on but the high is so amazing  

As for oral; try 4-5mg for starters.  Most people aren't the crazy lightweight I am but 5mg had me feeling a bit crappy; but that could have been the benzo rebound anxiety I was having at the time.

3mg oral the next day was one of the most euphoric experiences I've had in a long time.  Very reminiscent of MDMA but not in a rushed or speedy way.  Very relaxed and euphoric with a pleasant body energy.


----------



## khatman

Except for the first time which I took orally I always administer rectally and do still get mild nausea and increased salivation which makes me gag from time to time.
A 50mg dose would last me 14 hours before I could sleep so it was best to take in the morning and hope I don't get any unexpected visitors


----------



## pfeife

Hi there!
Anyone got an idea if the bio-avaibility, onset between rectally ROA and smoking is different? Also, what about the duration? I remember reading not-orally ROAs are shorter what I am aiming for, duration is too long for a 24h day.
I have already taken 2 x amt freebase orally (30-40 mg~) which was a very good experience despite its long duration (for me >12h main effects and slow uncomfortable coming down).
One time rectally 10 mg which only took 1,5h to act, but was a bit too much. Sadly didn't write down anything considering duration...

Regards.


----------



## PepperSocks

Generally oral dosing takes the longest to come up and lasts the longest.  Rectal is much quicker acting and doesn't last as long.  I'm not sure about numbers for rectal I don't do it myself; I like oral dosing.

Smoking comes on fast.  Like in 10 minutes and lasts about 6-8 hours.  However the effects are very different.  It has a kinda speedy, anxious energy to it.

My AMT solution described above seems to have turned a slight tinge of yellow. I was going to take 4mg but decided on 5 due to the slight degradation. I hope it isn't degraded too far. Next time I'm going to make it in 3mL batches instead of 10mL.

I'm also thinking of just dissolving the freebase is absolute ethanol.  I wonder if that would be a more stable form.


----------



## bert123

anyone tried amt+4mmc (+2c-c)? are there any problems because amt=a maoi?


----------



## Shambles

I would probably avoid meph on AMT. I have combined it with MDMA and LSD with no problem but meph is some sketchy shit and the brevity, fiending, anxiety and paranoia (and shitty effects and side-effects) would ruin AMT for me. Could imagine 2C-C being interesting but not sure on the safety factor and it's also brief. 2C-C and meph (sans AMT) is a surprisingly okay combo though.

Pepper: Unlike many other drugs, rectal doses are pretty close to oral doses, I believe. Xorky is more the expert on that MOA though. I mostly smoke it and it's lasted up to (and even over) 24 hours on occasion. That was combined with MDMA and LSD, mind. Lasted a loooooooong time though. Suspect dose may play a role and also the mild MAOI effect combined with the MDMA/LSD maybe increased the duration to such an extent.


----------



## fastandbulbous

> Well, ethanol forms an azeotrope with water and thus cant be distilled higher than 96% ethanol. To make 100% pure ethanol they often add bezene with forms an azeotrope with ethanol and water.



Well AFAIK they add anhydrousmagnesium sulphate to remove the last traces of water. Adding a known carcinogen like benzene just seems stupid & dangerous

PS I've IMed AMT before - no benefits over rectal dosing and a lot more hazards (mostly surrounding the sterility issue)


----------



## Iodjini_dk

Yeah, they have different techniques for purifiying it, but I think they all have good and bad components to them. Most pure ethanol for lab use is purified with benzene afaik. I could imagine the other method was to be preferred if the ethanol was ever gonna come near living things.


----------



## pseudononamouse

*yellowed AMT*

I got some AMT powder about 5 months ago. It was white when I got it. I did 35mg in September and loved it. I took a look at it today for the hell of it and it has turned yellow. I have stored it at room temperature in a Ziplock bag with no air under a stack of paper (where no light would get to it). Is is it safe/is it still AMT (has it undergone a chemical change)?


----------



## psood0nym

pseudononamouse said:


> I got some AMT powder about 5 months ago. It was white when I got it. I did 35mg in September and loved it. I took a look at it today for the hell of it and it has turned yellow. I have stored it at room temperature in a Ziplock bag with no air under a stack of paper (where no light would get to it). Is is it safe/is it still AMT (has it undergone a chemical change)?


Whheell, back around the turn of the century I knew of ye olde RC vendor whose aMT was regularly off-white er yellowish. I reckon it was still your standard duty alphamethyltryptamine, though I do.


----------



## pseudononamouse

psood0nym said:


> Whheell, back around the turn of the century I knew of ye olde RC vendor whose aMT was regularly off-white er yellowish. I reckon it was still your standard duty alphamethyltryptamine, though I do.



I also found that this MSDS for AMT lists the appearance as "very slightly yellow" so I am thinking that my AMT is okay. I wonder what caused the color change though.


----------



## xxdd

Am so annoyed I didn't grab some of this when I had a chance


----------



## Delsyd

pseudononamouse said:


> Is is it safe/is it still AMT (has it undergone a chemical change)?



Its still AMT and still safe.

Maybe slightly weaker due to degradation, maybe not.


----------



## pseudononamouse

Delsyd said:


> Its still AMT and still safe.
> 
> Maybe slightly weaker due to degradation, maybe not.



What exactly is degradation? What does it degrade to if it is still AMT?


----------



## Shakti

He's saying it's probably mostly still aMT, and I agree.  What some of it has degraded to, i have no idea, but it's almost certainly inert and not an issue.


----------



## Xtc <3

Does the euphoria from AMT work in a similar manner to MDMA?

By that I mean I shouldn't have to open a junior's saving account for serotonin, save up for weeks and weeks and then BAM!!! withdraw it all at once for some euphoria like MDMA .

Forgive me as my knowledge of neurochemistry is pretty wank but I would like to get a basic grasp on the whole concept. Here goes...

The way I envision the whole serotonergic system is like this...

You have a serotonin chamber where serotonin is made and used respectively,
I picture each serotonin molecule to be like a post-it note which will then get put in the postbox (SERT) ready to issue a command , the more post-it notes the brain has to send out the more effectively the system can run. A shortage of notes however mean that less messages can be sent so the system is less stable resulting in depression etc.

Also in this chamber are serotonin receptor's that are used to measure the serotonin so the brain knows how many post it notes it can send out, when these receptors are activated by a serotonin molecule your mood improves (depending on number of receptors and amount of serotonin available depends on how happy you feel).

From what I can gather when MDMA is taken, it comes into your system and says to the little post-it notes waiting in the mailbox 'Hey its okay ill take your place and relieve you of your duty because I can also fit in the mailbox (SERT), you go back and chill in the chamber and smoke a J or something'

So now the chamber gets flooded with serotonin, the exact amount depending on the dose of MDMA consumed and the amount of serotonin in the system prior to consumption.

The serotonin activates receptor's much more frequently now due to the excess serotonin in the chamber and more receptors become active to deal with the work load of trying to re-post all the notes that the MDMA replaced.
This is what makes you feel high.

Im aware that the whole system is MUCH more complex than that, but I would very much appreciate some feedback on the quality of my general understanding of the concept, I am very eager to learn and any help will be greatly appreciated.

Any recommendations for some good books for the beginner wanting to get a greater understanding of neurochemistry would be wonderful as well. 

I see that AMT is a serotonin releaser + reuptake inhibitor, what does this mean exactly and how would it be represented in my analogy of the serotonin system?

Woah, long post... got carried away


----------



## Solipsis

You're a little off, consider serotonin to live in a house A (being the first neuron), in the neighbourhood there is another house, B, that has a place where serotonin can do its job, let's say deliver the paper in the morning.
In house A serotonin has a partner (SERT) who doesn't want serotonin to spend all day away from home and gets it and takes it back inside. This is what normally happens. And it happens to dopamine as well.


Taking MDMA is like all over your brain, 'serotonines' in many houses want to go deliver the paper like a madman and spam the neighbours, not even does the partner forget to get serotonin back inside, MDMA causes the SERT partner to kick serotonin out when it is inside, at home. So a two way street becomes a one way tsunami, which is why MDMA feels great but is not the lightest drug on the brain. Again, this is true for dopamine as well.

a-MT is a little different. It leaves the SERT partner alone but sends more serotonin out to do their job in a balanced way and it does this for serotonin, but also dopamine and norepinephrine. 
Besides that a-MT itself acts like it delivers papers only not all that often, but it does that pretty much everywhere in the brain equally. 
If I'm not mistaken, the papers a-MT deliver are the reason for it's psychedelic effect while the sending out more regular old serotonin and pals cause the anti-depressant effects and euphoria.

Oh yeah not to forget the reuptake inhibition, which in this visualization is the same as preventing the partners (SERT, DAT for dopamine and NET/NAT for norepinephrine) from getting their neurotransmitter back inside the house. This is sometimes not mentioned.


----------



## freaktech

PepperSocks said:


> Rectal supposedly has much less nausea.  It also comes up faster and doesn't last the long haul like oral does.
> 
> I quite like oral dosing though; much much better than vaporization.  Vaporization doesn't make one trip; it's just a crappy stimulant without much euphoria.
> 
> Oral dosing takes a long time to come on but the high is so amazing
> 
> As for oral; try 4-5mg for starters.  Most people aren't the crazy lightweight I am but 5mg had me feeling a bit crappy; but that could have been the benzo rebound anxiety I was having at the time.
> 
> 3mg oral the next day was one of the most euphoric experiences I've had in a long time.  Very reminiscent of MDMA but not in a rushed or speedy way.  Very relaxed and euphoric with a pleasant body energy.



Is it possible to get high with only 3mg??! I dont try this because the longer duration and several nausea reports


----------



## Shambles

3mg would be in the antidepressant range for most, I'd think. I find 5mg gives a nice bit of gentle, light euphoria and puts a spring in my step if vaped. I don't really use AMT orally cos of the loooooong come up and GI discomfort. I almost always vaporise it as I find it to be highly effective, of more manageable duration, and with no nausea. Low dose AMT is great for a mild-moderate lift but I wouldn't expect anything too strong or even close to psychedelic at those levels - more like 20-30mg for those effects when vaped. YMMV, of course


----------



## Xtc <3

Cheers solipsis just what I was looking for, very helpful :D

Btw my AMT has arrived and it smells really strongly even through the baggy, the smell is not too dissimilar to the smell of some JWH-073 I had a while back? 
Is this normal?


----------



## Shambles

If your JWH smelled like mouldy arseholes then yes - AMT has a rather... distinctive aroma :D

It literally smells like musty shit. Both AMT and poopy contain skatole and it's kinda hard to mistake


----------



## Xtc <3

Sampled AMT for the first time with 2 others on the weekend.
Attempted to plug 35mg which was difficult as I was not aware it isn't soluble in water, still managed anyway .

Comeup was pretty rough yet easily bearable for about 2 hours, most similar to 2C-I imo.
What followed was not what I expected from this chem at all, SOOOOOO much stimulation...

I havn't been so stimulated in all my life, and not the yippee lets run around in circles and rave kind of stimulation, just sitting there legs tapping and gurning wildy.

One thing that particulary struck me about the state was how similar it was to my perception when i'm dreaming, my waking world was experienced like a lucid dream (Be it a highly stimulated one )

About 6 hours in I decided to smoke a bowl and that highly amplified the psychedelic side of the drug for quite some time, which was rather pleasant.

1.5mg of Phenazepam nearer the end chilled me out and put me to sleep, felt fucked up and lethargic for all of the following day.

The gurn from this substance was unreal, mephedrone or ecstasy dont even come close to the facial tension AMT gave me, wish I bought my dummy with me hehe


----------



## psood0nym

I found RA of aMT to be more stimulating for longer than oral or even IM (same for 2C-E).  I have no idea why it should be more stimulating than IM, and it's probably just natural variability between doses and coincidence, but for less stimulation it's probably best to go with oral instead. The come up typically takes at least an hour to even be felt, so it's best if you can wake up early, take it, and go back to sleep. I start smoking cannabis as soon as I start feeling stimulated from aMT.  It really takes the edge off. I use my one-hitter and smoke just once an hour during the plateau, since there's a definite ceiling on how high you can get during that phase, but even a little cannabis enhances the euphoria significantly. I know quinine is used by some bruxism sufferers, so when you go to get gum next time it might be worth picking up some tonic water for the muscle relaxing effects. If I need to sleep I use the rest of the tonic for a nightcap with gin along with diphenhydramine to help me keep from stirring in bed.


----------



## pseudononamouse

Is there any difference in stimulation between oral and sublingual administration?


----------



## GABBBBA

Hi folks, I have just received 0.1g of AMT to test.  I am 6ft 4in, 249lb and 27 yrs of age. I have quite a high tolerance for MDMA/M1 and am wondering what would be a good starting dose.  I was thinking 35mg in a gelcap rectally taken around noon.  Any thoughts would be appreciated as I dont want to undershoot and yet this will be my first experience with the compound so also dont want to overdo it!?


----------



## psood0nym

^Given your size and tolerance to other monoamine releasers you'll probably find the dose light in terms of stimulation and euphoria (and probably always will).  Still, there's no telling how you will react to aMT's psychedelic side, so 35 mg is a good starting dose.


----------



## GABBBBA

^Nice 1, think i'll stick with 35mg then and see how it goes.  
Also I think i've got the freebase form (fine/white) i.e. not thick crystals as in HCL??? (I think thats right).  Would it work rectally in a gelcap in this form ie. not water soluble, or should I just eat it?


----------



## psood0nym

I think I've read reports that state the freebase will work regardless, but if you want to be sure converting to the acetate salt is super easy.  Just dump the freebase in a small amount of 5% white vinegar. After it's dissolved dilute with water so it's about 2:1 water to vinegar (to avoid sting) and plug away.

I don't think there's any necessary difference in superficial appearance between HCl and freebase.


----------



## jibby jab

I have a few questions concerning amt. 

I am 5,10 and weigh ~70kg. I have very little psychedelic experience. I've done shrooms  twice, one was a high dose the other a medium one. I have done 2c-c a few times and thats it. I havn't done mdma for over a year or any other stimulants for two months ie, mephedrone.

I was thinking about starting with 30mg orally. What do you guys think?

Also I heard this stuff has a bad jaw clench. I was thinking of taking magnesium to ease this. Will magnesium help and will it it interact with the amt in anyway (maoi problems)?


----------



## pseudononamouse

jibby jab said:


> I have a few questions concerning amt.
> 
> I am 5,10 and weigh ~70kg. I have very little psychedelic experience. I've done shrooms  twice, one was a high dose the other a medium one. I have done 2c-c a few times and thats it. I havn't done mdma for over a year or any other stimulants for two months ie, mephedrone.
> 
> I was thinking about starting with 30mg orally. What do you guys think?
> 
> Also I heard this stuff has a bad jaw clench. I was thinking of taking magnesium to ease this. Will magnesium help and will it it interact with the amt in anyway (maoi problems)?



30mg should be a medium dose I think.

How much magnesium and in what form should be taken to prevent jaw clenching? What dose starts to have laxative effects?

Has anyone tried combining gingo biloba with AMT?


----------



## jibby jab

I take 500-700mg in elememtal form to help ease jaw clenching(it doesn't stop it). I also dissolve it in some orange juice and leave it for half an hour to increase the bio-avaliability.

I haven't shit myself yet on magnesium but ymmv.


----------



## Bare_head

i havnt tried amt in a long while, the price has gone up quite alot since i last had it, i hear there is quite alot of crap stuff that was going around, i may have too look into some though because i used to love it as an anti depressant as low levels


----------



## pseudononamouse

Has anyone else found that the unique value of AMT is partly because of its tendency to keep the ego intact but still induce a psychedelic state?


----------



## Iodjini_dk

Gaian Planes said:


> AMT releases just as much serotonin as MDMA. Its likely a lot less neurotoxic though because MDMA's neurotoxicity comes about from its dual release of serotonin and dopamine (and AMT releases MUCH less dopamine) not to mention its method of action is drawn out over some few more hours.
> 
> Its still not a good chemical to abuse and should not be taken lighthearted. I'd say more than once a month is pushing it as far as long-term health goes, but then again I try to err on the cautious side of things since I really like it when my body is healthy/fit.



I know its been a long time since this was posted. But is it really true that AMT releases as much serotonin as MDMA does? I was not under this impression.


----------



## I NUK3D U

Given that it lasts 2-3 times as long, then it's probably accurate in terms of volume of serotonin released.


----------



## psood0nym

The study that I think that post is recalling indicates aMT's release of both dopamine and serotonin is comparable to MDMA in rat synaptosomes (isolated nerve terminals). That doesn't necessarily mean it works just like that inside the human body, though. It feels more like "slow-release" MDMA, a long drizzle of monoamines rather than an inundation. I suppose for this reason it might be less neurotoxic than MDMA.


----------



## I NUK3D U

It's a great substance. Slow but gradual stimulation and euphoria with good visuals. A good trip lasts about 8 hours in the right conditions. Makes most people feel quite ill on the way up though (T+1:00 - T+2:00) - only down side imo.

How much would you expect to pay for good AMT in the UK at the moment?


----------



## Shambles

^ We don't really allow pricing without good reason in PD. We do in EADD though and the info more apropos to your situation. Very, very, variable is the short form.

AMT in the UK


----------



## I NUK3D U

ok thanks.


----------



## NeuroDr

Hey guys, looking through MAOI interactions i notice alcohol on there, for the tyramine only it seems. so is it safe to combine benzos and/or opiates with aMT? i was going to vape some today but i may be taking hydrocodone so I wanted to check if anyone has noticed a problem with that interacting


----------



## Shambles

The MAOI action of AMT is a very mild one but some consideration of any combos is certainly no bad thing. I am no doctor (unlike you Dr Neuro ) but I would be very surprised indeed if opiates or benzos would cause any problems. I've combo'd AMT with MDMA and LSD (together and seperately) with no problem. Although I didn't realise the potential risk at the time and couldn't really advise anyone do the same.

I know of the MAOI action now and I would personally feel perfectly safe using benzos or opies with AMT. Pretty sure I have cos I use both almost daily and doubt I'd have skipped them when I dosed. Tramadol would be an obvious no-no but other than that I see no problem. Others will probably have more than just opinion and gut instinct to go on though.


----------



## NeuroDr

Thanks shambles  Good to talk to you again


----------



## Shambles

You too, Neuro. Not seen you around for a while so good to have you back. Unless I've just not seen you but you never went anywhere in which case good to bump into you again :D

Maybe see if anyone with a firmer grip on the possible risks responds but I wouldn't be concerned with that combo myself.


----------



## Xorkoth

Yes, opiates are fine to combine with AMT.  The MAOI action of AMT is very weak if it exists at all, anyway.  Assume it does, but opiates are fine with it.  I've combined them many times to good effect.


----------



## Special_Monster

AMT has been on my wish list for a while now. It seems like a interesting chemical to say the very least 

I've been wondering though just how dangerous it would be when combined with SSRIs? It's a mild MAOI so I’m wondering if there is any risk of harm in doses lower than 50mg (oral).

My girlfriend is on Prozac and Lexapro yet she still seems to be able to get a good kick out of most drugs (including MDMA ).


----------



## Xorkoth

I would be concerned about mixing it with SSRIs, for that very reason.  I don't think it's a strong MAOI at all, and I've mixed it safely with a variety of things that SSRIs are contraindicated for, but SSRIs themselves seem like a bad thing to mix with any MAOI activity at all.


----------



## Special_Monster

Thanks for the information, seems like this one will be a miss for her then.


----------



## pseudononamouse

I find AMT to not be a very good drug for (making and listening to) music, but excellent for talking and writing. Does anyone else agree or has this just been because of the settings I have done it in? How is AMT at music events?


----------



## I NUK3D U

aMT is not a party drug in my opinion. It does have an amount of stimulation, but the euphoria and strong visuals are best shared in a calm setting. In fact, I'd hate to be tripping on aMT at an 'event'  - unless I'm sitting in mud, in a tent, pitched roughly 1 mile away from said event


----------



## drugs

Finally got to try this substance over the weekend. 
I had weighed out 35mg, but some of it was lost in the transition from baggie to gelcap, so my actual dose was probably just under 30mg.

It felt wonderful from start to finish. The comeup felt great, no noticeable bodyload just a gradually intensifying stimulation that seemed to peak at the 2.5h point. Lights and colours brightened up, but I didnt notice any real visuals.
The headspace is definitely psychedelic, but feels clear at the same time.
The stimulation turned more serotonergic after 4 hours, with body rushes that felt great. 

Added 35mg 4-HO-MET at the 8h point. Turned out to be a great combo.
Went to sleep after 12 or 13 hours aided by 1mg xanax.


----------



## Damien

Sounds delightful.


----------



## drugs

Indeed it was. 

Think I will try 40mg next time.

Also, I did spend an hour or two in a club environment, and I felt rather uncomfortable. aMT is not a club drug ime.


----------



## BehindMind

I just got 1 gram of aMT (fumarate). It's white and doesn't have such a distinct smell like aMT (HCl) or 5-MeO-DMT for instance. Anyone else have the fumarate that can confirm this?

Also does somebody know the dose curve compared to the HCl?


----------



## tass4243

I NUK3D U said:


> aMT is not a party drug in my opinion. It does have an amount of stimulation, but the euphoria and strong visuals are best shared in a calm setting. In fact, I'd hate to be tripping on aMT at an 'event'  - unless I'm sitting in mud, in a tent, pitched roughly 1 mile away from said event



I'm gonna have to disagree with you. But I suppose it may be because im hardheaded when it comes to visuals, so even at 100 MG I don't get too much visually. (Not that that'd be a problem, lsd and psychedelics at raves are still fun) I do agree a calm house is a lot better, but I also think that rolling at home is a lot better most likely for the same reasons.

I had an amazing time at a massive party 2 years ago, I dropped 80MG. The rest of my rave crew was on pills and what not, but we all got along fantastically. Maybe it was the fact that most of these people there, were the same ones who came over to my pad for AMT parties. So maybe if you were alone or what not it would be different. Ah man, having like 8 or so friends over all dosed up on AMT was amazing. Conversation flowed, everyone got along, damn near everything is funny, we would stay up til day break and drink together the rest of the day. I miss those days and I miss my AMT  

Soon...

Of course with all the different people I met, not a single person had a fucking clue what AMT was, but not surprising.

Anyway, its been waaay waay waaay too long since this substance has entered my body, its easily on the top 3 for me. Good memories. I can not wait for the day that I have my love AMT in my arms.

And just to let anyone know, AMT doesnt show up on drug tests. I couldn't find that information way back in the day when my ex was arrested. They thought she was on meth, 24 hours after we dosed. She was still tripping in the police station, and the charge was dropped when she tested clean. Hopefully that helps someone down the road. I mighta posted this way back in the day, can't remember.


----------



## I NUK3D U

^^ dose curve for freebase is about a third less than HCL I think


----------



## Morninggloryseed

Could someone tell me about dosing a-MT at 5mg or 10mg?  I wanna try some on the job, see if it adds an interesting spin to the day without making me saucer-eyed or causing the world to breathe.


----------



## psood0nym

^I remember Xorkoth commenting that he experienced threshold effects at 5mg.  At 10 mg IM I don't experience any psychedelia, just euphoria and stimulation, but my pupils definitely dilate, so I can't really comment on what the minimal dose is that tends to cause dilation.  I'd be comfortable in pretty much any situation with just 10 mg oral, though.


----------



## BehindMind

I dosed 5mg today and it was deffinetly a threshold dose for me. Think i'm going to try with 10mg next time.


----------



## pseudononamouse

psood0nym said:


> ^I remember Xorkoth commenting that he experienced threshold effects at 5mg.  At 10 mg IM I don't experience any psychedelia, just euphoria and stimulation, but my pupils definitely dilate, so I can't really comment on what the minimal dose is that tends to cause dilation.  I'd be comfortable in pretty much any situation with just 10 mg oral, though.



I reckon that the minimum dose that causes pupils to dilate varies from person to person. I have no evidence to back this up, it is just a guess.

Does anyone else have more of a tendency to chatter their teeth when cold after taking AMT (I mean weeks after coming down)? This does not really bother me, I am just curious if anyone else has had this happen.


----------



## Xorkoth

I find 5mg to be a good threshold dose, great for antidepressant effects and adding a sparkle to the day, and creating the tendency to want to be more sociable.  10mg is a bit stronger but still in the threshold-to-light range.  For me at least.


----------



## Morninggloryseed

Xorkoth said:


> I find 5mg to be a good threshold dose, great for antidepressant effects and adding a sparkle to the day, and creating the tendency to want to be more sociable.  10mg is a bit stronger but still in the threshold-to-light range.  For me at least.



Damnit, tell me what I should try so I can make the day warmer, but still handle the job.  5mg or 10mg?!?!?


----------



## Xorkoth

You of all people should know that we're all affected differently! 

Personally I'd use 25mg, but even though I don't trip all the time like I did in previous years, I still enjoy stronger experiences around others when it comes to certain sociable psychedelics (in those days I would take even 50-60mg sometimes for work, when AMT was my drug of choice).  But for others who are fully experienced like yourself, I'd probably suggest 10mg over 5.  Maybe try 7 or 8?  Have you used AMT before?


----------



## Morninggloryseed

Xorkoth said:


> Have you used AMT before?



Never taken any, just smelled a little in the vial.  Just want an alternative to amphetamine (I usually take 7.5mg of IR adderall) at work, that may make me happy and silly so I may enjoy being there.


----------



## I NUK3D U

^ I would suggest that aMT is not the drug to do this with...


----------



## Morninggloryseed

I NUK3D U said:


> ^ I would suggest that aMT is not the drug to do this with...



why?


----------



## I NUK3D U

It will invariably make you sick for the first hour or two. Dose required to reach 'visual' levels will create too much stimulation for work. Vice-versa - dose for acceptable stim will not make it a 'trippy' experience. The duration of this stuff is about 10 hours. This can get a bit tiresome even if tripping alone, on a sofa, in comfortable surroundings. Let alone at the end of a full working day.

Your call. Might suit you. I'd rather a small dose of a 2x-x for a trippy experience at work personally.


----------



## Morninggloryseed

I NUK3D U said:


> It will invariably make you sick for the first hour or two. Dose required to reach 'visual' levels will create too much stimulation for work. Vice-versa - dose for acceptable stim will not make it a 'trippy' experience. The duration of this stuff is about 10 hours. This can get a bit tiresome even if tripping alone, on a sofa, in comfortable surroundings. Let alone at the end of a full working day.
> 
> Your call. Might suit you. I'd rather a small dose of a 2x-x for a trippy experience at work personally.



Not looking for anything trippy.  I want stimulation, euphoria, etc.


----------



## MeDieViL

morninggloryseed said:


> Could someone tell me about dosing a-MT at 5mg or 10mg?  I wanna try some on the job, see if it adds an interesting spin to the day without making me saucer-eyed or causing the world to breathe.



I took around 5 mg a day the last week, it worked wonderfully, started at 5mg wich was good, second day went up to 10mg wich seemed to much as it has put me in a wierd psychedelic headspace wich was counterproductive. 7,5mg seemed to be my sweetspot.

It worked GREAT for me, mood my mood incredibly stable en worked great for my ADHD, i highly recommend this one as an antidepressant.


----------



## MeDieViL

I NUK3D U said:


> ^ I would suggest that aMT is not the drug to do this with...



I disagree, it definatly acts like a stim but in a differend clean happy way.. Hard to describe.


----------



## Xtc <3

Yeah low dose AMT is pretty enjoyable and not too trippy in doses up to 10mg.
Smoked AMT might be more what your looking for, try sprinkling 5mg into a fag or a joint and see how you feel.
Works wonderfully for me


----------



## Delsyd

10mg starts to become slightly psychedelic and would distract me from work. Also i start noticing GI problems at that dose.

5-8mg is perfect for adding a sparkle to your day.

IMO 10mg feels like amphetamine, with a more natural euphoria and no shitty jittery effects.


----------



## pseudononamouse

I NUK3D U said:


> It will invariably make you sick for the first hour or two. Dose required to reach 'visual' levels will create too much stimulation for work. Vice-versa - dose for acceptable stim will not make it a 'trippy' experience. The duration of this stuff is about 10 hours. This can get a bit tiresome even if tripping alone, on a sofa, in comfortable surroundings. Let alone at the end of a full working day.
> 
> Your call. Might suit you. I'd rather a small dose of a 2x-x for a trippy experience at work personally.



No it will not. It will invariably make _you_ sick for the first two hours. Not everyone gets a negative bodyload from AMT.


----------



## Xorkoth

morninggloryseed said:


> Never taken any, just smelled a little in the vial.  Just want an alternative to amphetamine (I usually take 7.5mg of IR adderall) at work, that may make me happy and silly so I may enjoy being there.



For me, AMT is the perfect substance for this.  This is exactly what it does for me.


----------



## tass4243

morninggloryseed said:


> Could someone tell me about dosing a-MT at 5mg or 10mg?  I wanna try some on the job, see if it adds an interesting spin to the day without making me saucer-eyed or causing the world to breathe.



It depends how you think your work enviroment will influence the intensity of the substance. I took 5mg weighed out as a tester dose before work....and damn! I was way higher then I normally would. Crazy how much it influenced me being at work, normally I'd bomb 100MG after I worked my way up.

Go for it


----------



## Morninggloryseed

Xtc <3 said:


> Yeah low dose AMT is pretty enjoyable and not too trippy in doses up to 10mg.
> Smoked AMT might be more what your looking for, try sprinkling 5mg into a fag or a joint and see how you feel.
> Works wonderfully for me




that's not a bad idea but wouldn't 5mg = 15 (or so) of an oral dose?  I.e. isn't it much more potent when smoked (I have the freebase) or is that not the case?  Just don't want to take a hit and wind up walking back in tripping.

Hmmm, maybe a-MT is the drug I am gonna try this weekend instead of 4-Ho-MET.


----------



## Xorkoth

Honestly I'd probably do that, and start with 5-7mg orally.  Actually I prefer it rectally as it's smoother with about the same dosage.


----------



## The Smoking Man

So, if the shit smell/taste is at least in part due to skatole, is there any good way of separating the AMT from the skatole?
Going from a quick read on what Wikipedia says about skatole's odor, in very small amounts, it can actually smell flowery rather than like a shitter in an unclean convenience store. So even if most of the skatole could be removed things would be in good order.


----------



## Special_Monster

Anyone ever thought about a low dose of AMT as a study aid?

Just really looking for some more motivation, struggling to really concentrate at the moment and I have no speed or MDPV to just smash through the stress wall.


----------



## xoqqiy axlotao3al

*smoking amt & other salts*



Xtc <3 said:


> Yeah low dose AMT is pretty enjoyable and not too trippy in doses up to 10mg.
> Smoked AMT might be more what your looking for, try sprinkling 5mg into a fag or a joint and see how you feel.
> Works wonderfully for me



SWIM used to do this many many years back when this material was more widely available. Then read on a board somewhere (can't remember where) that this poses a potential health danger. Would vaping be an option? I seem to read that salts that release bad stuff when burned can often be vaped safely & with very similar (or even better) dose/response curve.


----------



## The Smoking Man

xoqqiy axlotao3al said:


> SWIM used to do this many many years back when this material was more widely available. Then read on a board somewhere (can't remember where) that this poses a potential health danger. Would vaping be an option? I seem to read that salts that release bad stuff when burned can often be vaped safely & with very similar (or even better) dose/response curve.


I think it's the skatole that's the problem, or at least part of the problem. It can cause fluid buildup in your lungs. Unless it has a higher heat of vaporization than AMT (doesn't look like it would, but I can't find exact numbers), then vaping won't avoid that problem.
Also, AMT is almost always in freebase form unless you convert it to a salt yourself, no?


----------



## Shambles

^ There was a sizable batch doing the rounds last year which was sold in salt form (fumerate? can't recall offhand) but have only come across freebase myself. I always smoke AMT and have had no problems. Suspect you would have to smoke a hell of a lot of it on a regular basis for it to be an issue but couldn't say for sure.

Special Monster: Low-dose AMT is very motivational so could work for your purposes. I'd recommend doses of around 5mg for such purposes 10mg max or you end up caught in the uncomfortable hinterland betwixt tripping and sobriety.


----------



## MeDieViL

Special_Monster said:


> Anyone ever thought about a low dose of AMT as a study aid?
> 
> Just really looking for some more motivation, struggling to really concentrate at the moment and I have no speed or MDPV to just smash through the stress wall.



Yes! AMT seems to work better for my ADHD then amphetamine, its perfect for this. I will be taking AMT daily again once its finally send out.


----------



## tittysnacks74

What would you folks say is an ideal setting for AMT? I'm not the biggest fan of raves, and have almost exclusively taken psychedelics in nature with spiritual intentions. But with AMT I want to branch out a little bit and get a little more recreational.


----------



## Xorkoth

The best setting for AMT is with one or more friends new or old, outside or inside.     It doesn't need to be too specific, just friends present as it's very social and empathic.  A rave or party isn't the best idea in my opinion, though I've had fun at small house parties consisting of only my friends.


----------



## psood0nym

If you really want to get social and recreational, combine it with amphetamine.  If you want to get really social, really really recreational, and increase the empathy, aMT, amphetamine, and a low to moderate dose of an opiate has worked great for me in the past (the empathy has actually cost me quite a bit of money and receiving lots of junk mail since many times I've ended up giving to a charity during the high!  One time I was apartment sitting for my girlfriend using the combo and I spontaneously decided to clean her whole apartment as a surprise.  It's not that I wouldn't necessarily have done it sober, it just wouldn't have been as likely to occur to me in the first place -- and she loved it, of course.) 

Don't count aMT out totally for spiritual experiences, though.  It's an incredible addition to other drugs, and in my experience there's no other drug except for maybe cannabis that changes other psychedelics in such a valuable way. I don't necessarily mean the combo is superior to the lone partner drug, just that aMT combos have been more successful than other combos I've tried in terms of sticking out in my mind as great, and of course it gives a positive push to a trip's proceedings without creating any feelings you wouldn't have sober. I think this is due to the uniquely slow and steady way it releases monoamines, something that most psychedelics don't do much of and that MDMA does extremely quickly and sometimes overwhelmingly -- resulting in extremely euphoric but often sloppier experiences.  I've had some of the most beautiful and significant experiences of my life using it in conjunction with DPT and 4-AcO-DMT (mushrooms would probably work, too).  Enjoy.


----------



## Special_Monster

MeDieViL said:


> Yes! AMT seems to work better for my ADHD then amphetamine, its perfect for this. I will be taking AMT daily again once its finally send out.



Sounds like AMT could be my best new study buddy.


----------



## ugh1979

I can't wait for AMT to be back in stock soon so I can try it.

It sounds like it has a load of applications for me. %)


----------



## pseudononamouse

Xorkoth said:


> The best setting for AMT is with one or more friends new or old, outside or inside.     It doesn't need to be too specific, just friends present as it's very social and empathic.  A rave or party isn't the best idea in my opinion, though I've had fun at small house parties consisting of only my friends.



Agreed. A house party sounds like a great setting for AMT (assuming the people there are at least somewhat cool).


----------



## Special_Monster

Shambles said:


> Special Monster: Low-dose AMT is very motivational so could work for your purposes. I'd recommend doses of around 5mg for such purposes 10mg max or you end up caught in the uncomfortable hinterland betwixt tripping and sobriety.



Would that be 5mg oral? I may try this today but I did just have a intense day long trip on AMT yesterday so would it be better to let myself rest and recover fully do you reckon?

AMT no matter how many times I take it always surprises me in how it creeps up on you, it's a beautiful drug as it just lets you slip into the trip and ease the amazing visuals in so you feel completely secure and safe.

I love how it levels out as well allowing you to slip out easily letting you reflect on your trip and talk with trip partners while still in that wonderful altered perception.


----------



## love_sex_desire

My girlfriend is on 30 mg of paxil. I think that is a considerably low dose.

Is it safe for her to take AMT?

It is a mild MAOI so I am assuming it would be al right but if anyone could clarify this we are planning on dosing within the next 5 days or so.

Thanks everyone.


----------



## greenmeanies

paxil is not an MAOI, it is an SSRI.

combination of a monoamine releaser (AMT, amphetamine, MDMA, ephedrine, etc) with an MAOI _can kill you_.

combination of an MAOI with an SSRI _can kill you_.

combination of a monoamine releaser with an SSRI can dull the experience or have no effect (people on SSRIs don't seem to get any effect from MDMA)

START LOW, be careful, good luck.


----------



## love_sex_desire

greenmeanies said:


> paxil is not an MAOI, it is an SSRI.
> 
> combination of a monoamine releaser (AMT, amphetamine, MDMA, ephedrine, etc) with an MAOI _can kill you_.
> 
> combination of an MAOI with an SSRI _can kill you_.
> 
> combination of a monoamine releaser with an SSRI can dull the experience or have no effect (people on SSRIs don't seem to get any effect from MDMA)
> 
> START LOW, be careful, good luck.



I didn't mean that paxil is an maoi I meant that AMT is a mild MAOI so I was wondering if mixing AMT (a mild MAOI) with paxil (an SSRI) would be dangerous.

Thanks for the response.

Are the MAOI effects of AMT strong enough to be of concern to mix with paxil?

Anyone on an SSRI have any experience with AMT?

Thanks in advance for any replies or insight.


----------



## love_sex_desire

psood0nym said:


> If you really want to get social and recreational, combine it with amphetamine.  If you want to get really social, really really recreational, and increase the empathy, aMT, amphetamine, and a low to moderate dose of an opiate has worked great for me in the past.  I've had some of the most beautiful and significant experiences of my life using it in conjunction with DPT and 4-AcO-DMT (mushrooms would probably work, too).  Enjoy.



With AMT and amphetamines and opiates, what kind of doses of each and what routes of administration are we talking? What order should they be administered? I am extremely intrigued in using AMT to combine with other drugs and any input would be greatly appreciated.

I also have 4-AcO-DMT and DPT and I am wondering the same for mixing those with AMT. How much AMT and 4-AcO-DMT? Should they be taken at the same time? Same questions for AMT and DPT.

Thanks a lot. Any info on these combos is greatly appreciated.


----------



## psood0nym

^My average dose was probably: aMT: 12 mg intramuscularly (IM), amphetamine: 10 - 15 mg insufflated with 5 mg bumps every hour, 10 mg oxycodone rectally (RA) and/or pod tea from 2 - 3 pods with ~5 cm diameters at their widest point. A few times I've added 4 - 5 mg 2C-E injected IM at the same time as the others; I take all of these at roughly the same time (I should warn you that the addition of 2C-E with these at the same time makes for an uncomfortably stimulated half hour you'll probably want to be in a resting position for before the tension of the onset gives way to euphoria and a highly sensual trip). 

For me, 12 mg of IM aMT HCL is equivalent to between 20 - 30 mg orally.  My standard oral aMT dose for psychedelia is 60 mg, and this 12 mg IM dose is sub-psychedelic for me (20 mg IM is psychedelic for me).  However, I feel the first alerts of IM aMT within 5 minutes whereas oral aMT takes 2 - 3 hours to feel, so if you're dosing orally adjust your times to roughly coincide with the onset of the other drug's methods of administration and duration to peak, and be mindful that IM administration is typically at least double the potency of oral for most drugs and the onset is far faster.  I don't doubt that other timings of administration of these drugs would be perfectly sufficient, it's just a personal preference of mine to stack peaks.

With aMT/DPT and aMT/4-AcO-DMT I typically use 20 mg aMT IM and 50 mg DPT IM or 12 - 14 mg 4-AcO-DMT IM along with low doses of high-grade cannabis.  You may want to start lower.

EDIT: I have no tolerance to any of these drugs.


----------



## golden1

Wanted to share that DMT while on AMT(10-15mg) is the most amazing feeling I've ever had. The peak was pure bliss, bliss I couldn't believe I was experiencing as a simple human being. After a couple minutes, when I could get up and walk around, everything I saw was perceived in the most beautiful uplifting way possible. The only thing I could think of to explain how it felt at the time was that I was surely in heaven. Only a fictitious fantasy land like heaven could ever come close to comparing to those moments. 

I've done DMT by itself and I have to say this is almost a whole new experience, they both seem to synergize very very well. 

Here is a short report I recently wrote if you want to read more:

I started out by taking the AMT in the morning. I had no nausea or negative effects at all with this dose(compare that to HAVING to throw up on 35mg and having a nasty headache). After about 3 hours I felt I was at the peak, still not intense euphoria at all, but enough to make a summer day pure bliss. I smoked a small small amount of weed, around 1/6 the size of a genuine united states of america dime. Then I loaded up my METH PIPE with some DMT and went outside into the sparsely clouded summer day.

Everything was at maximum color. You know how music these days is all compressed? How they take all the different ranges of volumes in the music and MAXIMIZE them(Dynamic range compression). It's a really stupid idea in my opinion, but anyway all of the colors were at maximum saturation. It makes the world look so beautiful. The extreme blue of the sky contrasted with the solid greens of nature. Pure white clouds passing by the sun causing everything to dim and then come back full force. 

Then I vaporized the DMT.

At first nothing. Then I started slightly trembling, which for a second caused a little worry. I felt the DMT coming on, but it was different. It seems to have changed into a completely euphoria orientated experience. I seriously thought I must have died because it seemed impossible that I could experience such an overwhelming euphoria as a mortal human. It was very much like it took the euphoria, spread it to all of my brain, and then continued to stretch it to infinity until it wore off. As if the usual intensity of DMT was transferred into pure otherworldly euphoria.

Now don't get me wrong, DMT alone is wildly euphoric.... BUT this was out of this world. I would recommend this combination 100%, this is just something that you shouldn't go though life not experiencing. 

Pure bliss extending into infinity.


----------



## love_sex_desire

Repeat post due to importance!

Are the MAOI effects of AMT strong enough to be of concern to mix with paxil, which is an SSRI?

Anyone on an SSRI have any experience with AMT?

My girlfriend is currently on 30 mg of paxil a day. 

Thanks in advance for any replies or insight.


----------



## psood0nym

^I don't think its weak MAOI effects are the central concern with combining it with SSRIs. Since aMT both releases and inhibits the reuptake of serotonin, it's that property that makes the combo worrisome.  I'm sure people have done it and been OK, but taking them together could nevertheless be more dangerous and substantially more damaging than aMT alone. A comparison between it and combining SSRIs with meth or MDMA is probably relevant to guessing what the effects might be.


golden1 said:


> Wanted to share that DMT while on AMT(10-15mg) is the most amazing feeling I've ever had. The peak was pure bliss, bliss I couldn't believe I was experiencing as a simple human being. After a couple minutes, when I could get up and walk around, everything I saw was perceived in the most beautiful uplifting way possible. The only thing I could think of to explain how it felt at the time was that I was surely in heaven. Only a fictitious fantasy land like heaven could ever come close to comparing to those moments.


Awesome. One of the major reasons why I purchased synthetic DMT was so that I could IM it with aMT (since I don't like the idea of combining the MAOI in ayahuasca with aMT) and experience the combo for longer than smoking DMT allows (you could repeatedly smoke until tolerance gets the better of you to get a longer trip, though, I suppose). I still haven't done it for some reason, (I think because IM DMT with mescaline -- which, like aMT, has a positive push -- wasn't nearly as good as ayahuasca with mescaline) but I'm glad to hear another has had such a positive experience.  Combining aMT with a powerful tryptamine looks like a promising strategy. I like to think aMT channels the power of these tryptamines in a positive direction.  I have not found the same to be true with 2C-E, however, a powerful phenethylamine.  The experience was quite nice and had many of its own unique merits, but the extreme stimulation and cognitive focus seemed to prevent the combo from taking off the way aMT/powerful tryptamine combos have for me in the past.


----------



## love_sex_desire

psood0nym said:


> ^I don't think its weak MAOI effects are the central concern with combining it with SSRIs. Since aMT both releases and inhibits the reuptake of serotonin, it's that property that makes the combo worrisome.  I'm sure people have done it and been OK, but taking them together could nevertheless be more dangerous and substantially more damaging than aMT alone. A comparison between it and combining SSRIs with meth or MDMA is probably relevant to guessing what the effects might be.



Thanks for the info.

Combining SSRI's with MDMA dulls the experience. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by a comparison between combining SSRI's with AMT and combining SSRI's with meth or MDMA is probably relevant to guessing what the effects might be. If you could elaborate I would appreciate it.

Any other info on mixing AMT with an SSRI like paxil? Would it be safe to start with a dose of 30 mg of oral AMT for someone on 30 mg of paxil daily?

Any ideas or anyone on SSRI's with direct experience of mixing SSRI's ith AMT?

I'm wondering if this experiment should simply be avoided, but if anyone has any more info it would be greatly appreciated.

All of this info is very helpful.


----------



## psood0nym

love_sex_desire said:


> Thanks for the info.
> 
> Combining SSRI's with MDMA dulls the experience. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by a comparison between combining SSRI's with AMT and combining SSRI's with meth or MDMA is probably relevant to guessing what the effects might be. If you could elaborate I would appreciate it.


Sure, in rat synaptosomes aMT releases dopamine, serotonin, and noradrenaline at levels comparable to meth or MDMA (although judging from subjective effects aMT seems to release similar amounts far more slowly and steadily than either of the former).  Search this thread for the term "synaptosomes" and you'll find a post where I link to the study that shows this. Because the mechanisms of action are comparable, there is some rationale for predicting the effects of combining aMT with SSRIs through comparisons to combining them with meth or MDMA.


----------



## love_sex_desire

psood0nym said:


> Sure, in rat synaptosomes aMT releases dopamine, serotonin, and noradrenaline at levels comparable to meth or MDMA (although judging from subjective effects aMT seems to release similar amounts far more slowly and steadily than either of the former).  Search this thread for the term "synaptosome" and you'll find a post where I link to the study that shows this. Because the mechanisms of action are comparable, there is some rationale for predicting the effects of combining aMT with SSRIs through comparisons to combining them with meth or MDMA.



So the rationale would be that SSRI's would dull the experience of AMT?

But is the combo dangerous, as in serotonin syndrome?


----------



## psood0nym

love_sex_desire said:


> So the rationale would be that SSRI's would dull the experience of AMT?
> 
> But is the combo dangerous, as in serotonin syndrome?


Yes, if the preponderance of reports indicates that combining SSRI's with MDMA or meth dulls the experience of both, there is reason to believe the same would be true of aMT.  The big difference is that aMT is also an agonist at the 5HT2a receptor.  So, assuming the aforementioned analogy holds for your girlfriend, she would probably still trip, but the euphoric effects of aMT would probably not be as prevalent for her as for the average non-SSRI user. If she's looking for a straight psychedelic experience, in my opinion there are better candidates than aMT. 

Although it's been called into question, as I understand it, with my limited knowledge, the prevailing theory is that neurotoxicity is inevitable given simultaneous release of dopamine and serotonin in the same areas of the brain. I'm not sure your girlfriend's SSRI dose's effect is powerful enough to cause serotonin syndrome, but the sheer fact that an SSRI keeps more serotonin in the synapse than would be the case without it indicates that more damage could be done given the truth of the theory.


----------



## Black

love_sex_desire said:


> But is the combo dangerous, as in serotonin syndrome?



we don't know exactly if the maoi properties of amt are sufficient to be dangerous (they're most likely not), but at very least the serotonergic effects of the amt would be blocked by the ssri, so why not just take another drug altogether if amt will be at best an underwhelming experience (lacking everything that makes amt special) and at worst life-threatening?


----------



## Xorkoth

I got a bit of this as a birthday present... I'm looking forward to revisiting it.   I had read years ago about its use in helping to get past addiction.  So I'm going to try that, perhaps tomorrow, since I'm currently withdrawing from poppy seed tea - for the last time!


----------



## love_sex_desire

Black said:


> we don't know exactly if the maoi properties of amt are sufficient to be dangerous (they're most likely not), but at very least the serotonergic effects of the amt would be blocked by the ssri, so why not just take another drug altogether if amt will be at best an underwhelming experience (lacking everything that makes amt special) and at worst life-threatening?



Sound logic. Personally I want to take the aMT, but my girl is the one on paxil, but we're going to do some 2C-I together tomorrow and maybe later done the road when she's off paxil we'll do the aMT together.

Or maybe I'll take aMT and she can try something else.

Any suggestions as to what psychedelic my girlfriend should do while I'm on aMT? If I take it orally the only other drug I have that will last as long are DOx blotters, presumably DOI. I'm not sure if those two highs would go together but any insight or thoughts on how well being high on aMT with a girlfriend on DOI would be helpful.

If I smoke the aMT it will last around 12 hours, so I'll have a lot more options of chemicals for her to choose from that will have a similar duration.

Even though aMT is a tryptamine maybe a phenethylamine would be better?

The candidate would have to be one or a combo of more than one of  these chemicals:

2C-B,C,D,E,I, 2C-T-2,T-7, DOx, DPT, 5-MeO-MiPT, 4-HO-MiPT, 4-HO-DiPT, 4-AcO-DMT, acid, ketamine, mdma, mephedrone, methylone.

Any suggestions for what my girlfriend should take or combine while I'm on aMT so that our trips are compatible rather than clash? 

Cheers


----------



## love_sex_desire

Xorkoth said:


> I got a bit of this as a birthday present... I'm looking forward to revisiting it.   I had read years ago about its use in helping to get past addiction.  So I'm going to try that, perhaps tomorrow, since I'm currently withdrawing from poppy seed tea - for the last time!



Good luck! aMT will leave you with an afterglow that no withdrawal can take away from you


----------



## Delsyd

Xorkoth said:


> I got a bit of this as a birthday present... I'm looking forward to revisiting it.   I had read years ago about its use in helping to get past addiction.  So I'm going to try that, perhaps tomorrow, since I'm currently withdrawing from poppy seed tea - for the last time!



hope it works out for you.

im actually planning on taking a bit tomorrow aswell.
Either aMT or Methylone, for a party im going to.


----------



## psood0nym

love_sex_desire said:


> The candidate would have to be one or a combo of more than one of  these chemicals:
> 
> 2C-B,C,D,E,I, 2C-T-2,T-7, DOx, DPT, 5-MeO-MiPT, 4-HO-MiPT, 4-HO-DiPT, 4-AcO-DMT, acid, ketamine, mdma, mephedrone, methylone.
> 
> Any suggestions for what my girlfriend should take or combine while I'm on aMT so that our trips are compatible rather than clash?


Though I've never used many of the chems I'm recommending, reports indicate that DOC is probably the most similar of those (fairly light, with a positive push, and long). Lots of people don't like the length of DOx's though. If she can keep a 2C-B or 2C-C trip going decently through repeated dosing that would likely put her in a similar head space as well. A light LSD trip could work, too, if she finds it euphoric and not confusing. In my experience aMT's empathogenic effects are much smoother and less forceful than MDMA or its ilk so combining them with any of the other listed psychedelics would probably be too much for too short a time. Of course, the SSRI is probably going to interfere no matter what, since that paper I told you about indicates 2C-X's at least mildly release and inhibit the reuptake of monoamines (nowhere near as much as aMT), and that's probably why most people feel they've got a more positive push than tryptamines.


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## shephard89

Has aMT made a lot of drugs redundant for anyone else? I dont bother with booze, MDMA, weed, speed, coke or pretty much anything now ive started taking this magical substance. None of them live up to what I experience on aMT. Ive become a bit obsessed with the stuff to tell you the truth...But not in a bad way , I just have yet to get anywhere near bored of it. I still get VERY exited when I know im gonna be taking some the next day or whatever.


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## Delsyd

what kind of doses are you taking?
People here enjoy doses in all ranges.

I love the 5-10mg range for a daily boost.

I only have limited experience with higher dose trips (40mg and 45mg) but both of those were quite spectacular too, though obviously in a different way than 5mg doses.


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## shephard89

My usual dose is around 40mg , absolute bliss...


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## willkell420

My girlfriend and I each took 30mg amt last night before a concert.  The amt was over 2 years old kept in a vial at room temp.  It had turned a light brown color from its original white color.  At this dose I usually experience a nice stimulation and euphoria with very mild visuals.  This time we were both extremely dehydrated the entire time. Drank about 8 bottles of water in a couple hours.  The venue had air conditioning and the show was a very high energy show. A half hour into the show I had to buy someones bar stool off of them for $10, so I would be able to sit down. Everyone was dancing but my girlfriend and I had to stay seated for fear of passing out.  I noticed more visual activity and more stimulation side effects, such as: grinding teeth, jaw clenching, eyes rolling, legs shaking, etc.  But not enough energy to stand??? We also experienced none of the great euphoria that we had come to know and love from this gem. Does anyone with experience with amt know if the effects from degraded amt differ in ways other than the expected potency loss, such as those I listed above?
-Thanks


----------



## psood0nym

I doubt it had anything to do with pharmacologically active degradation products and everything to do with being dehydrated in a hot muggy stressful and exhausting environment that accentuated the negative for you the way bad environments on psychedelics tend to do.  MDMA, like aMT, will raise body temperature way more than standard psyches, but I think MDMA tends to work for people in hot high energy environments because they're too blissed out to realize just how bad for them heat is on these kinds of drugs; aMT is less forceful so you retained more awareness of unpleasantness. The air conditioning at the show doesn't stand a chance against the heat given off by hundreds of sweaty jumping people. It's probably better for cooler outdoor festival kinds of shows than for sticky crowded dance venues.


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## willkell420

I should add that after leaving the event (7 hours after consumption) we were still experiencing the unpleasant stimulant side effects with no euphoria or usefull energy.  Sex was not even possible, we would overheat minutes into it.  We also noticed none of the closeness or empathy we usually expect from amt.  Amt usually makes me want to move around, give massages, talk, etc. This time I felt drained of any energy or motivation.  We went to bed a little more then 12 hours after dosing still feeling the negative effects.


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## Bomboclat

Ive had a sample of aMT laying around for a few months now that ive been dying to try,  but am just too nervous to because of all the nasty things ive heard in regards to the nausea produced from this substance. From what ive read in here though, it seems like mostly none of you have been effected that much (since you're not talking about it), or even at all?

Id like to try a 25mg dosage to see what I would get, but I just dont want to spend hours on end vomiting. 

Help?


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## psood0nym

Willkell420: Maybe it's because you had been having an uncomfortable and stressful time due to the aMT the whole night? I suppose your physiology could have changed since you last used aMT as well.  My "typical experience" with numerous psychedelics has gone through a lot of changes over the years as my metabolism has changed.

I guess I'm skeptical of any claim that some impurities in a substance, whether through degradation or poor synthesis, really impact psychedelic experiences substantially (in so far as might be consistently measured by ratings given in a a double-blind study kind of way). The reason I am is that for these byproducts to have a substantial influence, they must have a powerful pharmacological action in doses far lower than the psychedelic they've degraded from or that they've served as a precursor for if they're going to psychologically influence experience (since impurities usually only make up a tiny percentage of a typical RC dose). 

For instance, LSD manufactures have reported to Erowid that simply by putting the same LSD and the same dose on different sheets their customers will come back to them insisting on a certain print because that one was so much more euphoric or lucid than the other. It's natural to do this because physical changes we can see or smell in a substance (or what's printed on a sheet) are far more salient than our inner physiological and subconscious psychological states. We trust our ability to intuitively discriminate far more than is justified and assume that impure substance means impure subjective experiences, but except in certain special cases where impurities are shown to be active in extraordinarily small amounts I don't really see much support for our confidence in that judgment.  So I guess I'm saying if you assume the negative experience was a total fluke unrelated to any intrinsic property of the aMT and next time take it in circumstances as similar to those of past positive experiences as possible you'll be far more likely to have a great experience than if you hold on to the notion that chemical degradation degrades experience.


----------



## instink

Is aMT still legal in the UK? I like to think my RC detective hunting skills are pretty good but I can't find a single place selling it online. I can find stuff that's explicitly illegal even but no aMT... still legal? cheers


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## Xtc <3

instink said:


> Is aMT still legal in the UK? I like to think my RC detective hunting skills are pretty good but I can't find a single place selling it online. I can find stuff that's explicitly illegal even but no aMT... still legal? cheers



Yeah I'm pretty sure AMT is still legal in the UK.
Considering its awesomeness and legality im suprised at its scarcity on the internet.
However there are places selling it currently... keep looking


----------



## Hofmannsdream

Shit. You guys !
Can I just say something?
I've just read everything that's in link with aMT on bluelight...
Pretty interesting is the least I can say.


----------



## Xorkoth

Well even a small dose (10mg) of AMT gave me a crushing headache.  I wonder if it's due to withdrawal or if it's the AMT?  Either way I'm a little cautious about taking it again... I don't think I'll use it again for quite some time.  I have some more but I'm going to save it for when I'm generally healthier.


----------



## psood0nym

Xorkoth said:
			
		

> Well even a small dose (10mg) of AMT gave me a crushing headache. I wonder if it's due to withdrawal or if it's the AMT? Either way I'm a little cautious about taking it again... I don't think I'll use it again for quite some time. I have some more but I'm going to save it for when I'm generally healthier.


Interesting, especially considering how uniformly positive your experiences have been with it in the past. I imagine a steady opiate habit, and especially withdrawal, could really throw the way you process it out of whack -- stupid body's need to achieve homeostasis ...


----------



## Xorkoth

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's the withdrawal but I'm not sure at all that it's ONLY the withdrawal.  I guess we'll see sometime in the future.  I was always using opiates on it before, but it was kratom and not poppies.  Who knows, maybe kratom combines excellently with it?


----------



## psood0nym

^It's clear the only sensible thing to do now is buy a garbage bag full of kratom, post haste! Yay!


----------



## Xorkoth

Heh, clearly.  To go with my ~300mg of AMT.


----------



## MeDieViL

Just took 5mg, finally back on AMT!%)


----------



## shephard89

aMT ftw!!! damn you have tempted me now....


----------



## Listening

After reading about aMT for so long, I finally got a hold of some and I'm excited to try!

I've got the freebase, and I think I'm going to go the vaped route. I just wonder what dose I should start with... Questions:

 - What is the comeup like when vaped? Shambles and others have said it takes ~1 hour when vaping, but are you out of commission during that time or is it a gentle/easy ride? After 1 hour, are you at the peak or do the effects keep increasing until mid-trip?

 - I'm thinking of vaping 10mg to see what it's like and then another 10mg an hour later if I feel up to it. Does that sound reasonable or is it best to vape it all in one go?

 - How long does it take you to vape? I.e. is it one or two giant lungfuls of vapor, or is it a slow process, little by little?

Thanks!


----------



## Special_Monster

I'd just like to know how the visual side of AMT is for people who have used it quite frequently (as in once a week a dose above 30mg)?

I know I personally haven't had visuals nearly as good as the first time, all trips after that has fell quite short in the visual department. 
All I get is light burns and that sort of mescaline like colour on the world. No amazing swirls or tracing and patterns emerging out of everything. 

Only downside with AMT is it's cross tolerance to tryptamines and phenylamines.

I've had various dosages; even high dosages of 80mg don't produce any of its more interesting visuals. I think I'm going on a month’s break since this is probably just tolerance.


----------



## crazyhairman

s1 sold this to me as molly and a bunch of us snorted a bump and ate some wtf it was so fun to start out but later that day like 8 hours later im still fucked up and felt tripped out  my puples were huge but i was deff not rolling i knew it but i didnt tell anybody els till just resently.   no peak and it lasted alll day long .   and after redosing i had a difficult trip where i was just fine but i was super light headed  and i saw stars all around me ,  i hyperventallated and fell down thinking i was oding on somthing that was not mdma  .... i called the person i got it from .  he was like ur fine i was telling him how i was tripping out , i was fucking mad wen i found out it was amt ,  and not my beloved molly  .    just goes to show u some ppl will sell u anything to make a buck ,   wuts strange is we felt relly relly good at a low dose,  god it frekin burned like a mofo wen we snorted it.    god after that i was like fuck that guy , sell me amt as molly  wtf  its my fault i took his word for it


----------



## crazyhairman

i dont know how pure it was either but mine was offwhite not powdery but kinda matted like it would clump together as if it were moist,  we dosed it out like it was molly ... so each dose was 100mgs give or take i only had a 0.0 scale,  tasted bitter  like mdma nothing els i couldnt see crystals or  anything like that .   wen i did it i started with eating 60 mgs and a bump via nose  let me tell u that shit hurt so bad but me and my friend instantly fellt good as hell .   thinking it was mdma i was amazed how strange i felt but i noticed i wasnt feeling as good as if i took a tab witch would make sence sence i find out it was amt!!!!!!!

everybody loved it , but me and some more experiaced ppl were like somthing is wrong with this "molly" it was totally new feeling to me as far as rolls go i had never had true molly before so i was like well idk i it better or same  wtf  ,   everybody loved it but i think it was the plasibo effect we thought it was molly witch were im from dont ever cum around unless ur rich


----------



## shephard89

I have worked my way up from 5 to 60mg doses. Tomorrow im going for a 80mg dose with plenty of mj thrown in...

Anyone have any good/bad experiences at this dose?


----------



## Xorkoth

Special_Monster said:


> I'd just like to know how the visual side of AMT is for people who have used it quite frequently (as in once a week a dose above 30mg)?
> 
> I know I personally haven't had visuals nearly as good as the first time, all trips after that has fell quite short in the visual department.
> All I get is light burns and that sort of mescaline like colour on the world. No amazing swirls or tracing and patterns emerging out of everything.
> 
> Only downside with AMT is it's cross tolerance to tryptamines and phenylamines.
> 
> I've had various dosages; even high dosages of 80mg don't produce any of its more interesting visuals. I think I'm going on a month’s break since this is probably just tolerance.



I've never found AMT to be more visual than the way you described, a mescaline-like enhancement of color and beauty, and haloes around lights, and occasionally some shifting shadows at most.



shephard89 said:


> I have worked my way up from 5 to 60mg doses. Tomorrow im going for a 80mg dose with plenty of mj thrown in...
> 
> Anyone have any good/bad experiences at this dose?



When I used to use AMT a lot I used 70-80mg for a dose and didn't experience problems.  If you have experience with 60mg and you didn't feel on the edge of danger, you should be okay to go up more.  80mg is a pretty large amount to jump up, but you know what's best for you probably.


----------



## psood0nym

Xorkoth said:


> I've never found AMT to be more visual than the way you described, a mescaline-like enhancement of color and beauty, and haloes around lights, and occasionally some shifting shadows at most.


It's interesting; there have been times where I was using aMT at the same psychedelic doses, say 60 mg, when I've been hit with strong visuals, despite the fact that the trips during when I got so many visuals and ones when I didn't were equally free on tolerance issues.  One friend of mine had the most powerful visual experience of his life on 60 mg of aMT (OEVs pulsing in time with the music, which prompted him to listen to Modest Mouse's "The View" four times in a row while he rolled around on the floor laughing).


----------



## Shambles

Listening said:


> After reading about aMT for so long, I finally got a hold of some and I'm excited to try!
> 
> I've got the freebase, and I think I'm going to go the vaped route. I just wonder what dose I should start with... Questions:
> 
> - What is the comeup like when vaped? Shambles and others have said it takes ~1 hour when vaping, but are you out of commission during that time or is it a gentle/easy ride? After 1 hour, are you at the peak or do the effects keep increasing until mid-trip?
> 
> - I'm thinking of vaping 10mg to see what it's like and then another 10mg an hour later if I feel up to it. Does that sound reasonable or is it best to vape it all in one go?
> 
> - How long does it take you to vape? I.e. is it one or two giant lungfuls of vapor, or is it a slow process, little by little?
> 
> Thanks!



I find that for the hour after vaping I am quite drowsy and have even dozed off during that period sometimes. I also get drowsy after taking shrooms whilst waiting for them to kick in so maybe it's just something I'm prone to on tryptamines... although that's obviously gonna be a bit of a generalisation. It feels fairly similar to the wait for mushrooms to take effect for me though.

After that first hour I perk up quite noticeably and the energy and euphoria start to build but still takes a good while to reach the peak and even longer for the more psychedelic edge to kick in. Duration seems to be surprisingly similar to other ROA for me but some report it being quite a bit shorter for them.

I usually chase it on foil - smoking in a pipe or whatever is probably far too hot with the direct flame and burns it rather than vaporising it - and it goes down easy enough. Not vast amounts of smoke and not tiny wisps either. I have staggered my vaped doses before and it has worked fine for me. Probably better to get it down over a fairly short timescale if you want a more intense experience or take it a bit slower if you want it to come on in stages. Personally I find it comes on in several distinct stages even taken as a single dose but is obviously more intense that way. Never feels overwhelming to me but have never used huge doses. 25mg vaped is pretty strong for me - way stronger than the same amount orally or rectally. It feels (and I have no evidence to back this up) to be approximately twice as potent weight for weight vaped compared to oral or rectal but that is just a guesstimate and - of course - YMMV.


----------



## Special_Monster

Interesting, maybe visuals are hit or miss with AMT, I thought it was a tolerance issue. The visuals I got from my first AMT trip were on par with one strong hit of acid. I wish AMT would be like that all the time, having such a clear mind state while seeing such crazy tracing was beyond funny.


----------



## Xorkoth

So the other day I was feeling some pretty intense anxiety related to post-acute opiate withdrawal.  I took a 5mg dose of AMT and it really perked me up a lot and I didn't receive any headaches.  I ended up taking another 7mg and then another 5mg a few hours apart, as well as about a half gram or so of mushrooms.  Altogether my tryptamine cocktail perked me up significantly and I was glad I did it... been feeling pretty good since.


----------



## Delsyd

Did you get any significant psychedelic effects?
Like what level on the shulgin scale?


----------



## Xorkoth

Oh, a +1 at most.  But a pleasant +1.  Nothing psychedelic really, just a little glow and a mood lift.


----------



## shephard89

Yesterday I decided to try my first High dose. the following is a brief report of what Happened during the course of the day:

-00:45-Have a small breakfast of scrambled eggs and sausages. Tidy the flat to create good vibes. Have a very chilled morning.

00:00-Was going to dose with a friend but they had other commitments so I decided to dose anyway. My girlfriend had to work the next day so she decided to be my trip sitter . I took a dose of 70mg of aMT.
   The sun was shining and it was warm but not to warm so we decided to walk into town and go the park. 

00:15-Left for the park when the girlfriend was finally ready (make up etc).  On the way to town slight mood list noticed but nothing spectacular.

00:45-Arrive at the town center and decide to get supplies, so we head to pound land and get some water , fruit juice and chewing gum. While in the que I felt uncomfortable about all the people around me and felt very hot and irritated. I noticed the coloring of the walls a lot more and the yellow seemed brighter than usual.

00:50-Arrive at the park and notice how bright the flowers were , and everything seemed more beautiful than normal.Feeling the heat a lot more and am very glad for the water at this point. As we walk through the park i notice a slight sickness building in my stomach. Its manageable but worrying as I detest throwing up. 

00:60- Arrive at the lake in the park and decide to sit by the side. Its very pretty and I appreciate it more. Have long conversations with my girlfriend and this point and feel very sociable.

01:15-Feeling sick and a bit paranoid. We decide home would be more appropriate if i was to start being sick etc so leave the park. When we are out of town I feel a lot less nauseous and am starting to see minor visual distortions and patterning of the pavement etc. 

01:30 When we return home we stopped of at a friends house .He has a spiral pattern wallpaper which was morphing slightly. At this point it felt good to be around people but I didn't feel very talkative. Smoke another cigarette but dont really enjoy it. 

02:00 Went to lie on the sofa, as despite the energy I felt i also felt very lazy . Put some music on and have very strong music appreciation. Could really empathize with it . For the next two hours I lay on the sofa and strange but beautiful psychedelic patterns swirled on every object in the room . Could see clouds of colour on the ceiling. It felt very hard to urinate but when I did the whole toilet seemed to change colour. 

04:00-We roll a strong joint and go outside and sit on the grass. Once the joint is smoke I feel incredible euphoria and everything in the world seems right. All of life's worries disappeared. The euphoria tapered of after 2 hours by the time of my next joint.

06:00-The next joint we shared seemed to kill the euphoria but really increased my visuals . The sky had patterns as did everything else. We sat down to watch t.v and whilst I managed to follow what was going on and it seemed funnier than usual I wasn't looking at the screen. The visuals were amazing as was the introspective thoughts I was having. It felt like I had reached a higher stage of conciseness.

08:00-My girlfriend went to get some ice lollies which tasted amazing. Found it very hard to concentrate as was having very complicated and random thoughts and visuals. Felt confused but in a good way. I felt that If i really tried I could concentrate on conversation etc, but this now all seemed meaningless to me. 

10:00-My girlfriend went to bed and left me to my own devices. I smoked lots more weed and at this point felt it was impossible to concentrate on anything even my own thoughts. My pupils were huge. I spent a long time outside as it felt calmer . Got lots of auditory hallucinations and my sense of sound went through the roof. 

12:00-After my last joint I decided to try and get some sleep. MY mind was racing and I felt very relaxed at the same time. Sat staring at the remaining visuals and in the mirror at my morphing face. decide to lay in bed and see what the cevs are like, and get lost in them. Fall asleep at some point in the next couple of hours. Cant be to sure as throughout the whole trip time seemed to slow down a lot or speed up at times. 

24:00-Wake up feeling dehydrated and hungry. In a fantastic mood and feel fine. No comedown to really speak of.


----------



## FJ1

Nice report thanks. Could be of use in the trip reports forum?

Couple of quick questions..

Did you smoke the AMT or take it orally?

How much of an impact do you think the later experiences were due to the weed rather the AMT? Your lack of concentration especially reminds me of the only time I was really stoned ( in Yogurt lol.. didn't like it..)

Sounds like a fun time though, I have to try this substance! ( I know, I had my chance..)


----------



## Imperial Tacohead

I wish I could have the same success with this stuff as so many others have had.  The body load always seems to be a bit much for me, and on multiple occasions I've gotten crushing headaches about ten hours into the trip, which sours me on the experience.  Does anybody have any ideas for mitigating that?


----------



## Chemical Wizard

I had my first go with aMT yesterday.  I took 15 mgs, and I spent my day going for a hike in the Kootenay mountains.

Overall, I have very favorable impression of aMT.  I didn't get too strong of an effect, but I could sense the potential of this compound.  I took the aMT at 11:30 am, and I was in bed by 11:00 pm with no difficulty.  I went to bed with a small headache that I am sure was from dehydration, and I also felt a little bit "comedowny" if that makes sense.  I thought I might have some diffuculty sleeping, but I fell asleep quite quickly.  Smoking marijuana during the experience always seemed to augment the effects of aMT in a hard to put my thumb on it kind of way.  Increased the psychedelic aspect, and reduced body load though.  Also seemed to add to the "uneasy" part of the experience, although overall I highly recomment marijuana during aMT. There was a vague stomach uneasyness throughout the experience, and when I did eat some food about 5 hours into the experience, i did notice a slight increase in the stomach discomfort, but overall it was entirely manageable.

I found aMT to have a high level of psychedelia, but the overall character of the experience was much more in control than any other psychedelic I have done, and had very strong empathogenic feelings throughout the whole experience. I always felt quite centered, and felt connected to my girlfriend and my friend, whom I was going on the hike with.  My girlfriend knew I was on aMT, but I didn't mention it to my other friend.  I didn't notice him notice me acting weird, and I was completely able to hold a conversation with him, although I definitely noticed that I was not quite as able to stay on topic as normal, definietly a bit of ramblyness.

aMT really felt like it had phenethyamine and tryptamine properties, but I would say it was mostly tryptamine dominant - which makes sense sinch it is a tryptamine.  But overall, i really like this material, and I can't wait to try a higher level. 

Does jumping from 15 mgs to 35 mgs seem okay ?  I think it will be suprisingly strong, but I really like my 15 mgs experience, and I want to experience what aMT is all about next time I do it.

I must mention that by the time I went to bed, I was thinking to myself that aMT does seem to have a quite a high body impact, and seems to me that it is something that one should really limit ones use to once a month at the absolyte very most.  I think it has the potential to be much awesomer than MDMA.    It kind of reminds me of 2C-T-7, only not so crazy and intense, and longer lasting.


----------



## TheWackness

I've got a g of this making its way to me right now.

After reading through the ups and downs of this thread, I'm left rather optimistic and excited about the coming experience.

Thanks to the above people for the information and experiences.


----------



## I NUK3D U

Let's say (purely hypothetically of course  I had a substance in front of me claiming to be AMT (HCL). Is there an easy way (visually / some other basic test) which can confirm that it is probably *not* 5meoAMT?


----------



## Chemical Wizard

oh yeah, I should mention that while my AMT doesn't smell like poop, it fucking REEEEEKS like mothballs.  It smells almost exactly like mothballs, except, I would say, smells even more strongly.  AMT came to me in the mail in a little dime-baggie, and I could smell it through the envelope and everything.

After I took it out of the package, the packaging sat in my spare room for a couple of days, and even that emanated a strong AMT odor until I realized just how clingy the smell was and threw it out.  Now I have it stored in a vial, in a mason jar, away from my other stash, because it is soooooo stinky.


----------



## Listening

Chemical Wizard said:


> oh yeah, I should mention that while my AMT doesn't smell like poop, it fucking REEEEEKS like mothballs.  It smells almost exactly like mothballs, except, I would say, smells even more strongly.  AMT came to me in the mail in a little dime-baggie, and I could smell it through the envelope and everything.
> 
> After I took it out of the package, the packaging sat in my spare room for a couple of days, and even that emanated a strong AMT odor until I realized just how clingy the smell was and threw it out.  Now I have it stored in a vial, in a mason jar, away from my other stash, because it is soooooo stinky.



Exact same thing here with the pervasive mothball smell. I freaked out a bit at how much the envelope it came in smelled. Not cool. I immediately disposed of everything but the AMT and put that in a mason jar in the freezer.


----------



## Xorkoth

Yeah, AMT's stench is extremely pervading.  I have to put it in a baggie in a mason jar in the freezer to avoid any smell at all.


----------



## botfly

I seen dis shit available now. What colour is it and does it have strong smell?


----------



## Xorkoth

Well the post right above your says something about the smell, as well as the previous posts. 

The freebase is white crystals, hard, shiny white crystals.  If it's a little old it will be off-white or light yellow and not shiny, but it's still good then, just past its prime.  Apparently the HCl has gone around and if that's what you have, it will be clear-white crystals (the freebase is not at all see-through, it's totally chalky white).  The HCl also doesn't have the same intense odor.  AMT freebase, which is probably what you'll get, smells really, REALLY strongly of mothballs or chemical fertilizer.  You'll need to keep it inside a bag inside an airtight jar or something like that to avoid it smelling from storage.


----------



## botfly

hmm interesting..what I saw was said to not have much smell so I'd imgaine it was the HCL. They seem to have shut up shop now though which is shame. So both crystally and the freebase is the one that stinks? I'm not sure what mothballs smell like? 
Are they both as good? imagine you can snort one and not the other and smoke one and not the other. which is your favourite?


----------



## goku4ever

I think I have found my perfect dose. Hurrah. The bad thing is, I don't exactly know how much that is, because some of it was from a failed rectal administration. And so I took 10mg orally after that failed, but I only ate a couple of hours previous to that. Cue me having the worst nausea and body load I have ever felt. At points I was bloated in my stomach and chest. It never went away completely either =(

Edit:
Thrown up twice now. I don't get it, the bodyload is much worse than my first experience, yet this is at a lower dose, and by now the meal I had which I thought was causing the problems was 6 hours ago.


----------



## stanleyK

Damn.  I tried to buy aMT online but they couldn't send it in my country


----------



## Xorkoth

botfly said:


> hmm interesting..what I saw was said to not have much smell so I'd imgaine it was the HCL. They seem to have shut up shop now though which is shame. So both crystally and the freebase is the one that stinks? I'm not sure what mothballs smell like?
> Are they both as good? imagine you can snort one and not the other and smoke one and not the other. which is your favourite?



No, the freebase is what smells really strongly and is most common.  I'm saying both the HCl and the freebase tends to be crystally... as in it's not a fine powder like many RCs available but is more like tiny chunky crystals (well actually the HCl could be a fine powder as I've never had it).

I used HCl, but only when I converted the freebase to HCl in a shot glass and administered it rectally.  Actually the freebase can be snorted and used rectally and it will work.  I don't recommend snorting it though as it hurts bad and it's nasty.  But freebases are often permeable through mucous membranes even though they're not water-soluble.


----------



## LooSiD

Freebase works rectally? Why do people say that you have to convert it to HCL for that ROA?


----------



## Chemical Wizard

it probably burns less if you don't have chunks of AMT freebase clinging to the walls of your rectum.  bad way to come up on a drug methinks.


----------



## Xorkoth

Actually I found it burns more when I use the converted HCl that way, though it may be because it's  in liquid instead of gradually-absorbed freebase crystals.  It definitely burns a bit each way, but it's a small price to pay for the effects.  And rectal admin with most drugs seems to reduce the negative part of the bodyload, for me anyway, and this holds true with AMT.  It also bypasses the stomach so prevents a lot of the nausea.

I think I recommend converting it to HCl when using it rectally because it seems to be a bit cleaner feeling and it comes on quicker.


----------



## Bomboclat

Xorkoth said:


> Yeah, AMT's stench is extremely pervading.  I have to put it in a baggie in a mason jar in the freezer to avoid any smell at all.



Wowzers, I just have mine double bagged and wrapped in foil, left in the fridge.
IMO, it smells like bad breath.


----------



## Xorkoth

Jesus, what do you eat to get breath like that??   To me it smells like sharp chemical fertilizer mixed with mothballs with a faintly shitty odor mixed it.  My wife actually thinks it smells "fascinating".  She also loves the smell of DMT, but I also love the smell of DMT. 

But yeah, a different area than I would normally think of as bad breath-like.  Did you smell the freebase or the HCl?


----------



## Onoe

Would this substance be considered a "speedy" psychedelic?


----------



## MeDieViL

Ive got the AMT that smell like shit now wich does work great, my previous batch (wich i think is the freebase) didnt work properly at all, ive only taken it in antidepressant doses but the effects were nothing like my first batch, dosing higher just brought up psychedelic effects so it wasnt an underdosing problem. I know the product was legit, gues my body just doesnt respond properly to the freebase, if thats even possible.


----------



## goku4ever

When taken orally just a couple of hours after taking food, did anyone else find that the ability to sleep was greatly hampered compared to the drug being taken on an empty stomach?
The first time I took it on an empty stomach, and was able to sleep without problems 10 hours after the dose. The second time was 2 hours after eating and it was about 18 hours before I was able to get any (with problems) sleep.


----------



## I NUK3D U

The stuff recently released into the UK market is a fine, slightly clumpy (ala MDPV), grey-ish powder. It smells like moth balls (or satan's anus) ; a tiny bit sulphorous, like a cannon's just gone off nearby, that sorta thing. Hard to explain. I'm reliably informed it's HCL, but am waiting for confirmation of this.


----------



## Delsyd

drop a few mg's into some water. If it disolves its probably hcl. 
If it stays floating on tops its the fb.


----------



## goku4ever

Also, apparently, the freebase smells worse than the HCL.


----------



## Bomboclat

Xorkoth said:


> Jesus, what do you eat to get breath like that??   To me it smells like sharp chemical fertilizer mixed with mothballs with a faintly shitty odor mixed it.  My wife actually thinks it smells "fascinating".  She also loves the smell of DMT, but I also love the smell of DMT.
> 
> But yeah, a different area than I would normally think of as bad breath-like.  Did you smell the freebase or the HCl?



Like morning breath! 

and I like the smell of DMT as well, so thats a totally different boat if you ask me.

I have the HCl salt of aMT



Onoe said:


> Would this substance be considered a "speedy" psychedelic?



Seeing as its the tryptamine "version" (so-to-speak) or *a*lpha*m*ethyl*ph*en*et*hyl*amine*, id say so.

Although I still havent tried it (which has gotten quite annoying since I hate just leaving things in my stash spot untouched), many who have talk of it as a speedier tryptamine.


----------



## Delsyd

i was able to sleep about 9 hours after dropping it.
Same goes with LSD if its isnt too high of a dose.

2c-e surprisingly keeps me up longer than amt or lsd


----------



## Chemical Wizard

I tried AMT again today, as a low-ish dose to use an anti-depressant and stimulant and euphoriant.  I've been working a shitload lately, and I decided to try a little AMT boost on my last work day of the week...I knew it would be a good day to do this...I'm a produce clerk in a grocery store btw.  Anyways, it worked great !  What a fantastic drug !  I did 8 mgs orally at 8:30 in the morning, then I did about 3-4 more at 1 pm, as I went to work.  It's almost 10 hours later now, and I'm still slightly feeling the AMT...mostly as muscle tension and slight mental stimulation.  I think after some weed and a beer I'll be able to sleep, we'll see how sleep quality is though.

Anyways, the whole experince was very speedy, and slightly psychedelic.  I talked with my boss, coworkers, and customers with absolutely no great amount of difficulty at all.  I was able to work steadily all day long and get a lot done, although my dose was a little bit too high, and I was a little bit scatter brained...but I was kind of going for that because being high at work is fun sometimes.

I've tried tiny doses of LSD, just little tiny bits of blotter paper, for this same purpose, and I have to say, AMT is waaay better for this kind of thing than LSD.  I think so anyways.  With AMT, I felt totally together and myself, although I had quite significant effects - stimulation, euphoria, no visuals at all.  My thought process was pleasantly stimulated in a barely even noticeble way, but it made for a nice day.  There was a bit of tummy uncertainty, but I ate lightly, and it didn't give me any trouble.  I made sure to stay hyrdated, and still no headache to speak of at all.

AMT is win !  Can't wait to do a higher dose one day...seems like this stuff sure has a high body impact though, noo doot aboot it.


----------



## InternetMuse

I NUK3D U said:


> The stuff recently released into the UK market is a fine, slightly clumpy (ala MDPV), grey-ish powder. It smells like moth balls (or satan's anus) ; a tiny bit sulphorous, like a cannon's just gone off nearby, that sorta thing. Hard to explain. I'm reliably informed it's HCL, but am waiting for confirmation of this.



Have you tried it?  How does it compare to what you've had in the past?  Just wondering because I've come across this too I think, and the lack of much smell at all - plus no crystals - has me a bit cautious. almost has a slightly green tinge to it as well (although grey-ish I guess describes that too).

p.s. this stuff dissolves in water quickly, so I guess is HCl.


----------



## MeDieViL

Chemical Wizard said:


> I tried AMT again today, as a low-ish dose to use an anti-depressant and stimulant and euphoriant.  I've been working a shitload lately, and I decided to try a little AMT boost on my last work day of the week...I knew it would be a good day to do this...I'm a produce clerk in a grocery store btw.  Anyways, it worked great !  What a fantastic drug !  I did 8 mgs orally at 8:30 in the morning, then I did about 3-4 more at 1 pm, as I went to work.  It's almost 10 hours later now, and I'm still slightly feeling the AMT...mostly as muscle tension and slight mental stimulation.  I think after some weed and a beer I'll be able to sleep, we'll see how sleep quality is though.
> 
> Anyways, the whole experince was very speedy, and slightly psychedelic.  I talked with my boss, coworkers, and customers with absolutely no great amount of difficulty at all.  I was able to work steadily all day long and get a lot done, although my dose was a little bit too high, and I was a little bit scatter brained...but I was kind of going for that because being high at work is fun sometimes.
> 
> I've tried tiny doses of LSD, just little tiny bits of blotter paper, for this same purpose, and I have to say, AMT is waaay better for this kind of thing than LSD.  I think so anyways.  With AMT, I felt totally together and myself, although I had quite significant effects - stimulation, euphoria, no visuals at all.  My thought process was pleasantly stimulated in a barely even noticeble way, but it made for a nice day.  There was a bit of tummy uncertainty, but I ate lightly, and it didn't give me any trouble.  I made sure to stay hyrdated, and still no headache to speak of at all.
> 
> AMT is win !  Can't wait to do a higher dose one day...seems like this stuff sure has a high body impact though, noo doot aboot it.



Hehehe, another one that discovered AMT's magic!!


----------



## Chemical Wizard

I'm thinking of doing AMT again tonight, do you think I will experience a significant amount of tolerance after doing 12 mgs yesterday ?

I was thinking of trying 30 - 35 mgs ?  Will that be a substantial increase in effects from 15, which is the largest dose I have tried thus far.


----------



## MeDieViL

Dunno, i take 7,5mg daily, didnt notice any tolerance the week i took it untill i ran out, this my second day on it again.


----------



## botfly

I want to try this tomorrow evening but am attending a family bbq on sunday so want to be normal by then. I've heard it can last up to a day so this is off putting. Is that mainly with high doses? I don't want to trip balls i just want some euphoria and a few funky visuals. How long do the dilated pupils last for? they don't linger forever do they? is AMT good for euphoria?


----------



## LooSiD

botfly said:


> I want to try this tomorrow evening but am attending a family bbq on sunday so want to be normal by then. I've heard it can last up to a day so this is off putting. Is that mainly with high doses? I don't want to trip balls i just want some euphoria and a few funky visuals. How long do the dilated pupils last for? they don't linger forever do they? is AMT good for euphoria?



Vaping it reduces the duration I hear. Probably your best bet. What time are you taking it and what time does the bbq start?


----------



## botfly

Well I'll take it about 6pm 2moz probably or maybe a bit earlier if it takes a few hours to come up and the bbq will be sunday afternoon like 4ish I think. Can you look normal or do you get wierd meph eyes? I don't hide drugs very well put it that way. Also I think it's the salt I have, what ways can i make it absorb quicker and last not as long? Thought about sniffing it, I know it's meant to be painful but that doesn't bother me really.


----------



## Chemical Wizard

I did 18 mgs last night before I went to a party.  I did it at 4 pm, and 12 hours later i fell asleeep.  Drank about 8 beers and did some shrooms too.  I definitely had a nice little afterglow today...and a hangover, it was a goodshitty feeling.


----------



## LooSiD

If you have the salt then dissolve it in 1ml of water and squirt that up your bum with an oral syringe or a medicine dropper (the ones I get are graduated and hold 1ml, you can get them at a pharmacy). Make sure to lube up the implement before inserting, olive oil works fine. After the initial squirt the discomfort is minimal, the duration is lessened somewhat, the come-up time is shortened significantly and the various nausea/headache/body load problems are reduced if not eliminated. I've never tried AMT rectally but tons of other substances greatly benefit from the ROA and rectal is many people's favourite method.

I'm going to take some rectally tomorrow, in fact, and I was wondering - I have the freebase, should I cap it and insert or dissolve in water with titrated vinegar added to help it dissolve?


----------



## Xorkoth

botfly said:


> Well I'll take it about 6pm 2moz probably or maybe a bit earlier if it takes a few hours to come up and the bbq will be sunday afternoon like 4ish I think. Can you look normal or do you get wierd meph eyes? I don't hide drugs very well put it that way. Also I think it's the salt I have, what ways can i make it absorb quicker and last not as long? Thought about sniffing it, I know it's meant to be painful but that doesn't bother me really.



It will make your eyes very dilated during the effects.  AMT is odd in that all of the methods of admin, even smoking it, take at least an hour to come on, or more, and last many hours.  Smoking it does reduce the duration.  Plugging it (rectally) also reduces the duration a bit and makes it come up faster and come down faster.  Also in my opinion it greatly reduces the bodyload so it's my preferred method.

The next day you will feel a bit tired but good, with a nice good mood during the afterglow.  Your eyes will no longer be dilated and you will probably feel pretty social.  To be honest I'd most prefer to take it during the BBQ if I were you, because it's such a social drug... it always makes me a better talker and find a lot more interesting things to talk about.  It's not like meph or some shitty stimulant where it basically turns you into a mess.  AMT is a psychedelic and for me at least it makes me feel more "on it"... like I'd prefer to hang out with people on it than not on it.  But if you're not very experienced I wouldn't suggest it... and I definitely wouldn't suggest it for your first time with any substance.  But I'm just trying to say that it's not going to make it hard to hang out the next day and it's not going to make it obvious that you were on drugs.  Unless maybe you get no sleep at all, depending on how you do with lack of sleep.


----------



## Listening

Tried smoking 10mg (slightly yellowed freebase) earlier today as a first test run... The effect is subtle to say the least; I've had a noticeable/pleasant body buzz for several hours, but it's almost more sedating than trippy or even speedy.

I sandwiched the AMT between some weed and smoked it that way. Might I have destroyed it all accidentally? I figured sandwiching it would be good enough, but I guess I'll go out and buy a crack pipe (I can't bring myself to chase it on some foil; I guess I have issues).


----------



## busby

Managed to grab some of this today. Took 35mg at 20:45 and still not feeling anything other than nausia.

Should it take this long for such a relatively high dose?


----------



## love_sex_desire

Listening said:


> Tried smoking 10mg (slightly yellowed freebase) earlier today as a first test run... The effect is subtle to say the least; I've had a noticeable/pleasant body buzz for several hours, but it's almost more sedating than trippy or even speedy.
> 
> I sandwiched the AMT between some weed and smoked it that way. Might I have destroyed it all accidentally? I figured sandwiching it would be good enough, but I guess I'll go out and buy a crack pipe (I can't bring myself to chase it on some foil; I guess I have issues).



Smoking it inbetween weed seems to waste it. You need to vaporize it. A lightbulb works better than tinfoil.


----------



## love_sex_desire

busby said:


> Managed to grab some of this today. Took 35mg at 20:45 and still not feeling anything other than nausia.
> 
> Should it take this long for such a relatively high dose?



How did it end up? It can take several hours to fully develop, but 35 mg's orally should give you a nice euphoric, stimulating high. 

What did your sample look and smell like?


----------



## busby

love_sex_desire said:


> How did it end up? It can take several hours to fully develop, but 35 mg's orally should give you a nice euphoric, stimulating high.
> 
> What did your sample look and smell like?



Really dissapointing actually. It looks like concrete. Slight greyish colour.

It started to kick in about 20 mins after my last post but not in a good way. Felt jittery and as the night progressed we both felt talkative but it was all negative talk.

Do you think it's because we took too much? Smaller dose maybe?


----------



## InternetMuse

busby said:


> Really dissapointing actually. It looks like concrete. Slight greyish colour.
> 
> It started to kick in about 20 mins after my last post but not in a good way. Felt jittery and as the night progressed we both felt talkative but it was all negative talk.
> 
> Do you think it's because we took too much? Smaller dose maybe?



I had the same stuff as you busby, pretty sure.  It wasn't the aMT I can tell you that.  I had a 35mg dose as well, followed 3 hours later by another 15mg because we thought it wasn't peaking enough.  What followed was 10 hours of pure bliss, nothing was negative or jittery.  Not sure why you felt that way, but I don't think it was the dose or the substance.


----------



## psood0nym

I used MDAI, adderall and aMT yesterday. It was pretty much as I expected it would be, like MDA.  I think I undershot the MDAI, though. I only did 70 mg (of the brown batch).  Next time I'll probably do 120 to 150 mg MDAI, (12mg adderall - both plugged), with 17 mg aMT (IM)


----------



## Shambles

Listening said:


> Tried smoking 10mg (slightly yellowed freebase) earlier today as a first test run... The effect is subtle to say the least; I've had a noticeable/pleasant body buzz for several hours, but it's almost more sedating than trippy or even speedy.
> 
> I sandwiched the AMT between some weed and smoked it that way. Might I have destroyed it all accidentally? I figured sandwiching it would be good enough, but I guess I'll go out and buy a crack pipe (I can't bring myself to chase it on some foil; I guess I have issues).



How odd... I did the exact same thing this afternoon myself to say goodbye to the remains of my freebase now HCl is all the rage.. actually purely cos I desperately needed a gentle but _big_ mood lift. 10mg vaped is enough to get you at least plenty, chilled, mellow, content, dreamy and a just a few teasing tinglyrushes, in my experience. I would personally suspect that smoking it with weed may have been the culprit - _waaaaaaay_ to hot so would have mostly completely toasted beyond repair. A crack-pipe (or hash pipe or any other kinda pipe) is too hot too.

Hence tinfoil - gives you complete control of temperature cos it heats however fast you want it to but also cools down almost instantly to keep those lil beetles right wher you want them to b. It's all right there actually happening in controllable real time  right under yer nose and before yer very eyes and in your very lungs. Once you get the hang of chasing from foil (not that I'm suggesting anybody should) it's like an instinctive thing to not frazzle all the Good from your Goodies.

If you want to vape aMT then tinfoil is your friend. I'm sure a decent vaporiser would be at least as good but I don't have one, they cost a fortune and tinfoil doesn't, and I've been a Friend (and Foe) of the Foil for a very long time indeed. Really is the best technique for vaping aside from maybe an actual (good) vaporiser.


----------



## knock

This is on the cards for me in the near future at a music festival. I have no prior experience with aMT.

I've read all I can, here and in EADD; I'm left with the impression that low doses may reap disappointment. I'm tempted to dive in at 45-50mg rectally (after an initial 3-4mg tester to prove it's not the 5-meo cousin and discount allergic reaction). I have experience with psyches, stimulants and empathogens in various situations and I imagine I would enjoy the full range of effects in the planned setting.

Is this a stupidly high first "real" dose?

My other thought is 35mg and a backup of MDMA in case it's not hitting the spot (say, after four or five hours)? I wonder what amount of MDMA would be within reason in that case? 

Or other suggestions for a backup? Anyone tried it with MDPV?

I don't mean to sound like my happiness depends on the drug experience, it doesn't, but my sheer bliss probably does.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts! I'm being quite cautious here, I think BL makes me cautious.


----------



## goku4ever

My first experience with AMT was 25mg. It was too much for me. I didn't really enjoy it. I would say having a sucky experience due to dosing too low is much better than having a sucky experience due to dosing too high, as you can always re-dose later on if the effects aren't as strong as you like.


----------



## I NUK3D U

knockando:-

I personally think you'll be fine with 40mg rectally.

And no, I wouldn't try this with peevee. Fine on it's own, or with some nice weed. GBL goes well too.


----------



## love_sex_desire

Does redosing work with aMT, or is tolerance built up too quickly to have much of an effect?

My friend is thinking of trying 30 mg and waiting 3 hours to see if it's strong enough and if the effects are too subtle could he redose at the 3 hour mark with another 30 mg?

He has never tried aMT but he is looking for a psychedelic experience so he figured 60 mg would be a good psychedelic dose, but is thinking of starting out with 30 mg to test the waters and take it from there.

Anyone redosed with aMT that can shed light onto how effective redosing is?


----------



## love_sex_desire

I am also wondering what people use to combat stomach issues with aMT.

Is non-drowsy ginger-based gravol effective?

Any tips on how to combat stomach issues is fully appreciated!


----------



## goku4ever

love_sex_desire said:


> I am also wondering what people use to combat stomach issues with aMT.
> 
> Is non-drowsy ginger-based gravol effective?
> 
> Any tips on how to combat stomach issues is fully appreciated!



Have an empty stomach. That will get rid of most of the queasiness. Or take it rectally.


----------



## I NUK3D U

+1 for rectal. Failing that an empty stomach is fine.

In response to a redosing question, the amounts sound fine, but I'd wait four hours to assess the level.


----------



## InternetMuse

love_sex_desire said:


> Anyone redosed with aMT that can shed light onto how effective redosing is?



I found redosing to be highly effective.  35mg initial dose, waited three hours and could feel it coming up quite nicely after four hours though we felt like the come-up had hit a plateau so we redosed 15mg which took us very nicely into heaven!   About 8 or 9 hours after initial dose took another 15mg which didn't seem as effective (as expected), but maintained the euphoria for a good 5 or 6 hours more.

We were certainly 'tripping balls'   But just not in a visual kind of way.  As others have said, the closest I can compare it to is mescaline but much much more euphoric, orgasmic really.  Redosing was good, but probably not a third time might be a bit of a waste.


----------



## Mr Wobble

Is there a consensus on whether ingestion of HCl vs freebase AMT lead to different trip experiences (duration, strength, body load, visuals etc.)?

Would it be easy to convert HCl to freebase if one wanted to vape?

(Seems like HCl is all that's available right now - hence the questions)


----------



## psood0nym

^In my experience the HCl has a faster oral onset, less nausea, and it's a little more euphoric and a little less psychedelic and stimulating.  But I can't rule out the possibility that the way I metabolize aMT has just changed since I only had the freebase years ago and only have the HCL now.  I have no idea why there should be any difference, though, since the freebase should convert to the HCl when the stomach acid hits it.


----------



## Mr Wobble

Thanks psoodOnym


----------



## Shambles

I tend to agree with Psood0nym.

The HCl doing the rounds in the UK at the moment is one of the smoothest (especially in terms of GI issues) I have yet come across. It doesn't seem to have the intensity of the freebases I've had but as it's relatively gentle on the ol' guttywuts it shouldn't be a huge issue to adjust your dose to suit.

The only reason I would try to convert it to freebase is if I intended to smoke it (as is sometimes my wont) but if using other ROA I'd leave it as is and just fiddle with the dose to find your own personal sweet spot. Conversion is possible but unless you have particular reason to smoke (greatly reduced come-up being the main one for me since GI issues seem less of an issue with this batch) I personally probably won't be bothering other than maybe a tad for experimentation and variety.


----------



## Mr Wobble

Thanks Shambles - I've got some HCl winging its way to me right now...


----------



## Psychonautical

i am the oppurtunity to acquire this substance,
given the fact that sense my accident, when the van hit me.
i've been feeling slightly detatched//depressed and i was wondering if the
therapeutic anti depressant effects are really as strong as most people claim.

i really am on the line here, i enjoy  my visuals quite a bit.


but i could also acquire an assload of mdma for the same price which i know helps me sort out my feelings...


----------



## Shambles

Visuals are not too apparent with the grey HCl currently available in the UK (dunno 'bout elsewhere) but the antidepressant effects are still in full force. AMT is hands down the most effective antidepressant - in both the short and long term - I have ever encountered... and I have encountered a fair few. How useful (or indeed how risky) it would/could be in your situation I really couldn't say though. Hope you're feeling better


----------



## Mr Wobble

A quick question - and apologies, I'm sure this has been covered before, probably in this thread ('tis a long thread) - I've just read that AMT quickly degrades (oxidises) in aqueous solution.

So how quickly does it deteriorate?

Having no milligram scales I was intending to put the whole lot in solution for measuring accurate(-ish) doses. If the break down is that rapid looks like I'll have to think again.


----------



## psood0nym

> i am the oppurtunity to acquire this substance,
> given the fact that sense my accident, when the van hit me.
> i've been feeling slightly detatched//depressed and i was wondering if the
> therapeutic anti depressant effects are really as strong as most people claim.
> 
> i really am on the line here, i enjoy my visuals quite a bit.
> 
> 
> but i could also acquire an assload of mdma for the same price which i know helps me sort out my feelings...


Plus aMT isn't reported to cause depression in the following days nearly as bad as MDMA. At the same time, though, MDMA is more of a sure thing due to its track record in therapy (the Russian use of aMT as an antidepressant doesn't mean much because the Soviets really didn't have their scientific shit together during its clinical tests so far as I've read). If you want to guarantee visuals I recommend combining it with DPT or 4-AcO-DMT, which are both combinations that have created blissful, life-affirming experiences rivaling any candy flip I've ever had.


> A quick question - and apologies, I'm sure this has been covered before, probably in this thread ('tis a long thread) - I've just read that AMT quickly degrades (oxidises) in aqueous solution.
> 
> So how quickly does it deteriorate?
> 
> Having no milligram scales I was intending to put the whole lot in solution for measuring accurate(-ish) doses. If the break down is that rapid looks like I'll have to think again.


For the price of the cheapest mg scales you buy insurance that saves you the trouble of worrying about it breaking down in solution. ...


----------



## Mr Wobble

psood0nym said:


> For the price of the cheapest mg scales you buy insurance that saves you the trouble of worrying about it breaking down in solution. ...


I know it kind of makes sense, but then part of me says cheap scales are probably a false economy, better to spend more and get something a bit more reliable and longer lasting - but then that would be adding considerable cost to what was hitherto a fairly cheap trial of something I may, or may not, take a shine to...


----------



## psood0nym

^Assuming you can't sell the surplus off to friends, that you'll never need it for anything else, and that you can trust the starting weights the vendors tell you I guess. Frequent re-calibrations and testing test weight-retest consistency help to get pretty reliable readings out of even cheap $30 scales.


----------



## Shambles

My £20 eBay specials have lasted well over a year and are still doing the job shockingly well. I even trust them to weigh out doses of 2C-E and the like where a mg or two either side can make all the difference cos they've never once let me down. Best. Investment. Ever.


----------



## Mr Wobble

You're talking to a Yorkshireman here. Blood. Stone. etc.. 

I do see the sense in what you're both saying, thanks. As it happens I had a look on ebay earlier - looks like cheap mg scales are only available on import, so shipping would probably take a while.

I think someone I know has electronic scales, just not sure if they're sensitive in the mg range.


----------



## Shambles

Ha! I actually deleted a token Yorkshireman comment from my post in case it was considered racist 

Honestly, they are well worth the £20 and take a week or so to ship from HK where most seem to come from. May not be quick enough to sate your appetite for a first taste of aMT but will be there for a long time to come. Do eeeeet.


----------



## Mr Wobble

Shambles said:


> Ha! I actually deleted a token Yorkshireman comment from my post in case it was considered racist


Political correctness gone mad - you racialist! 

Okay, I give in, I'll buy the bloody scales!

Right, no more derailing the thread from me and feel free to delete any of the above posts as you see fit Shambles (when you're fit  )


----------



## Psychonautical

i hope im not bumming anyone out here with my story.
Its just seriously i have never felt like this before in my life.
All of these people including the insurance people who are susposed to be against me
are like ooo you're so lucky to be alive. SO thankfully i am getting a nice settlement.
Luckily he didn't break my knees or else i would be getting lots more...lol.



like this is what i want...

IS AMT going to get in my face make me relive moments and strange memories a la 2c-e
or is it going to be one of those Happy Tactile but slightly philosophical trips that bring forth an effervescense because right now i feel like my bulbs are burnt out...

last time i got high was on June 9th. I took 10mg of 4-ho-dipt with 135mg of MDMA
my girlfriend and my roommate and i watched the imaginarium of doctor parnassus and Dead man with Johnny Depp by Jim Jarmusch just made a very open minded textural evening.

i got hit on the 21rst.
and i just want my light bulbs changed a refresh.. 
is AMT a gentle system upgrade 
or is it one of those vicarious in nature drugs like 2c-e.
like obv 
set and setting and ect ect


but i want something that will come on gently and just guide me back to center...
because i do feel a bit raped....i guess you could say


in terms of theraputic value of mdma i think i would need to take a fair bit...then again i really only abused it for a very short time frame...
i still go get alot of revelation from  it  but no where near as much as i used to...


----------



## Xorkoth

AMT is going to be like your second option:

"one of those Happy Tactile but slightly philosophical trips that bring forth an effervescense"

  I think it's a good choice for your purposes.


----------



## |>R()|)!G/-\|_

How similar do aMT and 5-meo-aMT smell?


----------



## General Patton

AMT has to be one of the gentlest yet life-affirming psychedelics there is, even a couple mg will take me out of the worst negative spirals my mind can throw at me. I think because it's a slight antidepressant, in the true sense of increasing serotonin, it's almost like a psychedelic with "training wheels" :D ...Training wheels that turn into spinning wheels of death once enough DPT is added 

Right now I want to escape this heat by dipping myself in the waters of lake Minnitonka... AKA taking a hit of AMT than jumping in my pool. Ahhhh fuck how nice that'd be right now!


----------



## Psychonautical

my AMT was acquired 3gs of the freebase...
i am interested in testing this stuff out....
So should i orally indulge myself in a 5mg taste test 
or smoke test?


----------



## Shambles

Always best to start with a lowish test-dose, I'd say. Low dose aMT is really nice anyway. Not trippy at that level but such a nice mood lift you're walking on air all day 

As for oral/rectal vs vaped - the former options provide a "fuller" experience so would be my recommendation to get a real feel for the stuff at first. Does tend to be more heavy on the nausea/GI discomfort than vaped but that varies a lot from person to person and you may be fortunate enough to skip that stuff. Vaped tends to emphasise the speedy and entactogenic side and can reduce the psychedelia somewhat for some - again, YMMV of course. I like both but choose vaped sometimes for the greatly reduced come-up and avoidance of GI issues. Sometimes slightly reduces duration when vaped but doesn't seem to greatly for me.


----------



## retard

I recently discovered this drug. I saw this drug used to be an antidepressant at doses of 5–10 mg. 

My question. I take Duloxetine (Cymbalta) which is an SNRI. What can I expect if I take AMT (releasing agent of serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine) with therapeutic dosages ~5-10 mg. Does Duloxetine block the serotonin and norepinephrine release from AMT and it wouldn't affect the release of dopamine? Can somebody explain how Duloxetine would work with AMT? I would like to use AMT for a subtle boost of dopamine during the day, but I don't if this will work out.


----------



## Xorkoth

I don't know if AMT will be a good candidate if what you're after is a subtle boost of dopamine.  I find its effects to be by far predominantly serotonergic in nature.


----------



## jblz

Two questions:

Deterioration: Does it only deteriorate in air, or does light affect it aswell? I received mine inside two black baggies.

Tolerance: Whats up with this? How long is it until you can dose again feeling the full effects?


----------



## Xorkoth

Deterioration - All chemicals pretty much, including AMT, deteriorate in the air, and in light, and in heat.  So try to keep them away from all of these.  AMT is more stable than most tryptamines I would say but it will still degrade over time.

Tolerance - I'd say you need to wait at least two weeks between doses to feel full effects, or longer.  This is because unlike many other psychedelics, this one releases monoamines, and it takes you body a little time to replenish them.  You can dose a lot nearer than that and still get good effects, but they won't be as good and not nearly as psychedelic as the first.


----------



## jblz

Xorkoth said:


> Deterioration - All chemicals pretty much, including AMT, deteriorate in the air, and in light, and in heat.  So try to keep them away from all of these.  AMT is more stable than most tryptamines I would say but it will still degrade over time.
> 
> Tolerance - I'd say you need to wait at least two weeks between doses to feel full effects, or longer.  This is because unlike many other psychedelics, this one releases monoamines, and it takes you body a little time to replenish them.  You can dose a lot nearer than that and still get good effects, but they won't be as good and not nearly as psychedelic as the first.



I'm currently taking 5HTP, L-tryosine and multivits daily, anything else I can grab to boost monoamines? Will probably be hitting this again this weekend.


----------



## jblz

jblz said:


> I'm currently taking 5HTP, L-tryosine and multivits daily, anything else I can grab to boost monoamines? Will probably be hitting this again this weekend.



In addition: What about adding MDAI to aMT? Proper stims are a pain in the ass to get at the moment, I haven't tried it but would it increase the euphoria, or just increase body load?


----------



## ugh1979

Shambles said:


> My £20 eBay specials have lasted well over a year and are still doing the job shockingly well. I even trust them to weigh out doses of 2C-E and the like where a mg or two either side can make all the difference cos they've never once let me down. Best. Investment. Ever.



My 0.01 scales that I got from eBay are poor.  I can't really trust them, despite using your trick of putting the tray on and but then not zeroing them.

I see a vendor has 0.001 digital scales for £20 so i'm going to get them so I can be sure of doses.


----------



## ebola?

> Yes, if the preponderance of reports indicates that combining SSRI's with MDMA or meth dulls the experience of both, there is reason to believe the same would be true of aMT. The big difference is that aMT is also an agonist at the 5HT2a receptor. So, assuming the aforementioned analogy holds for your girlfriend, she would probably still trip, but the euphoric effects of aMT would probably not be as prevalent for her as for the average non-SSRI user. If she's looking for a straight psychedelic experience, in my opinion there are better candidates than aMT.



While your reasoning is sound, I'm not sure if the case pans out completely.  aMT actually has a higher binding affinity at SERT than either methamphetamine or MDMA.  It could be that aMT's affinity is high enough to cut through the activity of many SSRIs.  I would say that SSRIs are at least less likely to inhibit aMT's activity than they are to inhibit MDMA's (depending on the particular SSRI's selectivity and binding affinities).  Also, the methamphetamine contrast isn't that useful, as its activity at 5ht is significant but minor.



> Although it's been called into question, as I understand it, with my limited knowledge, the prevailing theory is that neurotoxicity is inevitable given simultaneous release of dopamine and serotonin in the same areas of the brain.



This is true, but it really depends on the quantities of the 3 monoamines that are released.  Methylone and 4fa, for example, have been demonstrated non-toxic (using MDMA as a comparative model, and of course high-dose injections in rats).  In general, strong peak effects where a lot of dopamine and a significant amount of 5ht are released tend to elicit the most neurotoxicity, as is demonstrated by methamphetamine.  But do methylone and 4fa throw doubt on this seeming trend?

ebola


----------



## psood0nym

^Thanks for those clarifications, ebola.


----------



## Pralus

Here's your Starter for ten, fingers on buzzers... "What current theories are there as to the mechanism in which Alpha Methyl Tryptamine acts on the body to produce nausea and, in light of which, what drug might be effective with which to treat it?"


----------



## Pralus

I hate Paxman, but he is the king of the incredibly long sentence.


----------



## psood0nym

> Here's your Starter for ten, fingers on buzzers... "What current theories are there as to the mechanism in which Alpha Methyl Tryptamine acts on the body to produce nausea and, in light of which, what drug might be effective with which to treat it?"


Like other psychedelics, it may hit the 5-HT3 receptor, whose activation is correlated with anxiety and nausea. It also releases and blocks the re-uptake of serotonin, and so the sudden surplus of serotonin may itself activate those receptors and cause nausea. So you want a 5HT-3 antagonist like ondansetron. 

In other news, I’ve been having an incredible night on 14 mg aMT IM, 60 mg MDAI, 60 mg mephedrone, three 4 mg bumps of Adderall, a few 1 mL squirts of GHB, unknown low dose bumps of ketamine, and some puffs of jwh-018.  Yeah, I decided to go balls out. That’s because last night I had one of the most terrifying and significant experiences of my life.  (Read here if you’re interested). 

I would have expected to have an amazing time on the drugs listed above no matter what, but having just been through something so terrifying and significant the night before gave the night heavy spiritual momentum.  I resolved to undertake a number of projects and outlined plans I hope will aid in expanding my mind, help others, and maybe even make me some money. 

Life is beautiful. It’s all about orienting your perspective with your spiritual beliefs, physical body, intellectual interests, and actions in the world. Psychedelics can help.  Now go self-actualize people! Wheeeee!


----------



## Scoobysnacks

gonna oral dose some amt, will be smoking weed for the duration of being high, anywhere on BL are there  trip reports with varying doses?, any help will be appreciated


----------



## I NUK3D U

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=512812


----------



## shephard89

Got some more aMT coming in tomorrow , and might be acquiring some meph for the mrs as for some reason she really enjoyed the stuff...

Was just wandering if its safe to combine the two? I wouldn't want to waste my aMT but she seems interested in the combo. 

Any thoughts?


----------



## dOM!

Do you guys think it would be safe to mix meclizine with aMT for its anti-emetic effects? since aMT is a mild MAOI and i cant find much information about meclizine, cheers! :D


----------



## I NUK3D U

shephard89 said:


> Got some more aMT coming in tomorrow , and might be acquiring some meph for the mrs as for some reason she really enjoyed the stuff...
> 
> Was just wandering if its safe to combine the two? I wouldn't want to waste my aMT but she seems interested in the combo.
> 
> Any thoughts?



Not a terrible combo, but you might want something a bit more stimulating than meph (depends on dose of course!).

Personally, I find something like a small dose of molly about 5 hours in to be perfect.

Meph should be fine too though, I'd just worry about the compulsion to redose, meaning essentially, you'll overpower the aMT.

Maybe a bombed 100mg each of meph, no more, would be fine.


----------



## Special_Monster

I'm on the end of a quick intense 2C-I trip but so over stimulated I can't get no sleep.

I was thinking of maybe making things interesting with AMT now, bad Idea after 2C-I?

Also how is AMT HCL preety much ineffective smoked? I'm thinking of trying to convert it to freebase but I have no idea how. I used to find it was easy to get my freebase AMT batches of the past to be converted into salt form but I can't find a method of going back.


----------



## I NUK3D U

Special_Monster said:


> I'm on the end of a quick intense 2C-I trip but so over stimulated I can't get no sleep.
> 
> I was thinking of maybe making things interesting with AMT now, bad Idea after 2C-I?
> 
> Also how is AMT HCL preety much ineffective smoked? I'm thinking of trying to convert it to freebase but I have no idea how. I used to find it was easy to get my freebase AMT batches of the past to be converted into salt form but I can't find a method of going back.



I would avoid aMT in your current situation. Can't tell you why, it just feels very wrong!!

Yeah, you can't smoke HCL. Best ROA with the HCL is up your gary glitter. No nausea, and slightly more pronounced come up. It's mainly a euphoric stimulant at lower dosages. 50mg - 60mg is where the visuals really start to kick in, but I still wouldn't describe the latest batches as being amazingly psychadelic. aMT is quite forgiving in that way.

Don't you have a benzo or similar? That would go very nicely now in a small dose - enough to keep you awake and enjoy the trippy ending of the 2c-i without the stimulation.


----------



## psood0nym

shephard89 said:


> Got some more aMT coming in tomorrow , and might be acquiring some meph for the mrs as for some reason she really enjoyed the stuff...
> 
> Was just wandering if its safe to combine the two? I wouldn't want to waste my aMT but she seems interested in the combo.
> 
> Any thoughts?


This question was addressed in this thread a few months back. Basically you're dumping a lot of monoamines so it's probably more damaging than either alone and perhaps a serotonin syndrome risk. I've done it with low doses of each to good effect (see a few posts up). Just go slowly and keep the doses of each low to moderate.


----------



## Special_Monster

I NUK3D U said:


> I would avoid aMT in your current situation. Can't tell you why, it just feels very wrong!!
> 
> Yeah, you can't smoke HCL. Best ROA with the HCL is up your gary glitter. No nausea, and slightly more pronounced come up. It's mainly a euphoric stimulant at lower dosages. 50mg - 60mg is where the visuals really start to kick in, but I still wouldn't describe the latest batches as being amazingly psychadelic. aMT is quite forgiving in that way.
> 
> Don't you have a benzo or similar? That would go very nicely now in a small dose - enough to keep you awake and enjoy the trippy ending of the 2c-i without the stimulation.



No phenazeham or anything on me, no weed either, thats the thing 2c-I stimulation is annoying, i dosed on AMT like a fool, really wish I could have smoked it though.

I took 70mg of AMT because I'm fairly experienced with it, I never found it anything like MDMA in my opinion in low doses, only on a few occasions i felt more social/ Also always felt AMT euphoria was more fluid which I liked, MDMA always feels like false love for me.

Any idea of converting HCl to freebase?


----------



## Shakti

Special_Monster said:


> I'm thinking of trying to convert it to freebase but I have no idea how. I used to find it was easy to get my freebase AMT batches of the past to be converted into salt form but I can't find a method of going back.



quick answer:

put the hydrochloride in distilled water.  basify the solution.  extract with non-polar solvent.  remove solvent (evaporate, distill off in oil bath, or rotovape, etc.) leaving freebase.


----------



## Dr Mamba

quicker answer :
put the hydrochloride in your pipe
add 1 drop of amoniac
warm with a lighter to evaporate amoniac and water
smoke


----------



## Scoobysnacks

just ordered some amt, gonna book off next monday at work and take around 6 pm sunday evening( next week), i feel sick thinking about how high im gonna be, gonna stik with this from now on


----------



## Vurtual

Scoobysnacks said:


> just ordered some amt, gonna book off next monday at work and take around 6 pm sunday evening( next week), i feel sick thinking about how high im gonna be, gonna stik with this from now on



Hey scooby - my suggestion is to start with at least 30 mg (unless you've never done psychs before) - i found lower than this was a nice trippy feeling, but only when i did 35mg did the lovely euphoria/stimulation become predominant 

My next go is 45mg - i have to work my way up whatever anyone tells me (maybe you do to)

 - anyway, got to be better than the blasted clear caps eh


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Vurtual said:


> Hey scooby - my suggestion is to start with at least 30 mg (unless you've never done psychs before) - i found lower than this was a nice trippy feeling, but only when i did 35mg did the lovely euphoria/stimulation become predominant
> 
> My next go is 45mg - i have to work my way up whatever anyone tells me (maybe you do to)
> 
> - anyway, got to be better than the blasted clear caps eh


#

hey Virtual, read lots of reports around 50 haha, i will be smoking weed throughout and the consensus is weed + amt = awesomeness, so i gonna go 40 mg first time, thanks for the heads up mate


----------



## push

I will finally be able to try what sounds like an amazing substance, judging by reports both on here and elsewhere I have heard.
In the interests of harm reduction I will be working my way up in dosage. I'm seeing around 25mg avg to be rated as a good first dose (Erowid suggests a threshold dose for a new user; 5-15mg). I have tried various psychedelics and stimulants in the past but would still class myself as below average in experience to some others. Would 25mg be advisable, I have seen this is a recommended dosage for an MDMA like experience (as close as comparisons between the two can drawn anyway) where in the same context 40-50mg for the same type of experience was unadvised as at that dosage level the trip became much more visual and largely psychedelically based. I have a big night planned next week so in taking a smaller dosage tonight I would have clearer judgement and understanding of how much to take next week for the setting; it may even turn out as I have been reading that 20-25mg level would be perfect. 
I am wondering if 25mg taken tonight, the setting would be alone with music, is advisable for a first experience with this substance or if a lower dosage would be more recommended, say at threshold level? That said Vurtual's recommendation of 30-35mg sounds very promising for a first experience.
Prior to today I did a small allergy test in the amount of approx 1-2mg for harm reduction and although it more than likely was a placebo effect, I did feel and experience low euphoria, feelings of well being and slight visual enhancement. At this dose level I would say it was most definitely placebo (it would certainly be the first I have heard about aMT being active at such a low dose).


----------



## goku4ever

Im sure somewhere on bluelight I read that drinking alcohol whilst on AMT is perfectly fine, but I can't find that post at the moment so Ill ask anyway. Is drinking fine whilst on AMT?
Could just 5mg of AMT spice up a night of drinking, safely?


----------



## InternetMuse

goku4ever said:


> Im sure somewhere on bluelight I read that drinking alcohol whilst on AMT is perfectly fine, but I can't find that post at the moment so Ill ask anyway. Is drinking fine whilst on AMT?
> Could just 5mg of AMT spice up a night of drinking, safely?



Not sure about the medical scientific answer - but in my experience drinking has been no problem and can also help keep the peak going for a bit longer (if you need it) as well as reduce anxiety on the comeup.  

When I trip I like it to last a whole 24hrs if possible, so I redose and drink.  This weekend, for example, did 40mg -> 20mg -> 20mg and drank about 12 beers over 24 hours.  Felt great, and no hangover either although I obviously spread the beers out quite a bit.


----------



## goku4ever

Awesome, cheers. I took the 5mg and I feel really good. It is keeping the euphoria I get after having a couple of beers going. I feel my thought pattern is enhanced too, rather than decreased.

EDIT:
No problems were encountered. But I have now taken AMT 3 times (25mg, 15mg and 5mg), but I don't think its for me. The first 5 hours are great, but then my body starts to get uncomfortable and I become really really tired.


----------



## retard

Does AMT release serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine just like meth?? I saw this study but I don't know what those values really mean. On page 14. They look pretty similar to me.


----------



## petebog

Vurtual said:


> Hey scooby - my suggestion is to start with at least 30 mg (unless you've never done psychs before) - i found lower than this was a nice trippy feeling, but only when i did 35mg did the lovely euphoria/stimulation become predominant
> 
> My next go is 45mg - i have to work my way up whatever anyone tells me (maybe you do to)
> 
> - anyway, got to be better than the blasted clear caps eh



I tried this for the first time on Saturday at 30mg as I'd read this was a light dose. Have to say no euphoria, just a light feeling of 'trippyness' and _very_ slight morphing of people's faces.

Was thinking of going straight up to 50mg next, though will probably pussy out and do 40mg first - I'm usually very cautious with new substances.


----------



## push

I tried some aMT just last night and had a very similar experience to the post above me. 
Took what was approx 10mg, dissolved in water, last meal eaten approx 3 hours prior, around 6pm. I experienced some placebo like effects; general content feeling, enhanced tactile response, slight visual enhancement. When very little appeared to be happening I waited approx 2.5 hours (as this substance can take 2-3 hours to fully develop) and took an additional approx 20-25mg, dissolved in water, around 8:30pm. Within 30 mins there was a slight enhancement of the placebo like effects experienced earlier, music sounded a little better. Around 9:30 or so visual effects started to manifest, first noticed was the slight moving of objects around me, my computer monitor for example seemed to rise up and move around behind my back in a darkened room. Slight notion of shadows moving and other objects noticed while walking stated to feel very light and strange. Music still sounded good, but by no means stunning. Sitting down very faint feelings of pleasant body sensations and mild rushes presented themselves every now and again. Around two hours following this the visual effects started to intensify. Checking my eyes in the mirror showed pupil dilation. The room appeared to mildly morph and appear bigger than it was, the music was loud so set a center piece for everything around it. Again though it was by no means incredible sounding. My head began to be filled with crazy thoughts and at times the feeling could be described as more of a delirious effect, albeit with very slight nausea. Walking around became to feel very dream like and surreal. Every time checking my pupils almost full dilation was present.
Around 2 hours later I decided to lie down and over the next couple of hours the visuals intensified. Closing my eyes the CEV's took the form of awesome kaleidoscopic patterns. As time went on the state of looking from a lying down position on my side outward seemed to switch from almost normal to trippy and mild - medium visual effect. Trials seemed to be apparent and as my eyes switched from one object to another the previous appeared in an after image. Looking directly up at the ceiling was the most visual. The corners of the walls and ceiling morphed and twisted and rippled in a real fucking trippy way! 
Generally the visual effects formed the experience, although by no means incredible, they were certainly interesting and entertaining. Although my general mood was fairly fatigued, at times I thought about getting up to walk around the house or put on some music but it never materialized past a thought in my mind. Almost all the time crazy tripped out thoughts running through my head. There was a interesting event around the 5-6 hour mark or so where time and everything around me seemed to slow down but I myself was in normal motion. This only lasted for around a second though. I must have fell asleep after this point as very little else is remembered. A very slight spun out feeling today but nothing too bad. 
In conclusion this was a visual trip but with very little of the euphoria  and wellbeing and empathy (pretty much absent on all counts) as others have experienced, even at this dose level. 
Very interested to experience the dose level that is giving people mdma like feelings of euphoria, music appreciation and empathy. Will probably try 40mg next time. I would have to say I was disappointed for a first time, generally though this could be down to the dose level and not forgetting how set could factor into the experience. 
Really don't know if I should take it for my big music event next week in fear of the experience being disappointing again, although that said the other alternative is methylone which won't have the duration I am after, even with a re-dose.


----------



## Psychonautical

*Wow.*

Alright, this stuff is as good as platinum. 

I took 5mg of 11:30. 
First effects Noted at 12:30.

A slightly stimulated, relaxing feeling of overwhelming happiness looms on the horizon. 

I decide that this stuff is relatively safe, so i take 10 more mg. 

by 1:30 The painting in my living room has taken on a life of its own. 
it melts down the wall when i don't look at it directly, and it springs back up when i do.  The fog is also rolling across the landscape in the painting. The puddles in it, also ripple.


Music makes me feel like i am about to fall into a DMT hole 
when music gets incredibly intense, i almost feel like i am going to white out. 


My roommates and i are having lots of very philosophical and open minded discussions about everything. 

4:30am 
We decide to watch the movie
U-turn by Oliver Stone, as my roommates have not seen it.

The other name of the movie should be Oliver Stones "Why you shouldn't be mean to Cats." ^.^ if you've seen it, you'd understand.

No actual mind fuck noted. No really intense introspection about the universe or the powers that be, just a wholehearted lift from the depression i'd been experiencing mixed with slight LSD visuals.

i can't wait to experience this stuff with my girlfriend.
I have a feeling shes going to love it.


----------



## Novice74

Hello, i was wondering if somebody could help me with a few questions, i have some AMT arriving from the UK this week.

1: Im after a long lasting mood lift that would not be obvious to the average person, what would be a suggested dose and how long can i expect this mood lift to last?

2: If im on a small dose(mood lift) am i able to consume a fair bit of alcohol...say about 6-8 bottles of beer?

3: Am i likely to experience nausea on a small dose-is the nausea dose Dependent(the more you take the more likely u will experience nausea?).

4: I currently take some 5htp and mucuna pruriens, should i stop taking these if i use AMT?

My aim is to take AMT as well being drug, don't want any visuals or to get fucked up. At worst the feeling you would get from a decent dose of methylone but ideally just a long lasting mood lift where you just feel good in yourself an inner warmth.

Thank you for any help that can be forwarded


----------



## goku4ever

1. Supposedly around 5mg would give a threshold effect, but I tried that last night and got fairly strong effects, which was taken 7 hours before I went to bed.

2. Drinking alcohol is fine whilst on it, though your desire to drink alcohol will be lowered

3. When taken on an empty stomach, I feel very little nausea, but for each dose I have taken (ranging from 5-25mg) the nausea has been about the same


----------



## Black

retard said:


> Does AMT release serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine just like meth?? I saw this study but I don't know what those values really mean. On page 14. They look pretty similar to me.



if you'll look at those numbers again you'll find that the values are quite different from methamphetamine but almost identical to mdma (in fact there's no statistically significant difference).
for instance methamphetamine is 10x more potent at releasing dopamine than amt while amt is in turn 10x more potent at releasing serotonin than meth.


----------



## Novice74

goku4ever said:


> 1. Supposedly around 5mg would give a threshold effect, but I tried that last night and got fairly strong effects, which was taken 7 hours before I went to bed.
> 
> When you say you had fairly strong effects can you explain these effects? Would i be able to drive and go about an average daily schedule whilst on the threshold dose?
> 
> Can you take St johns wort whilst on AMT?
> 
> Can you store AMT in a sealed plastic bag (minimum requirement) or would this not be suitable?
> 
> Thanx


----------



## petebog

Novice74 said:


> Can you store AMT in a sealed plastic bag (minimum requirement) or would this not be suitable?
> 
> Thanx



I've heard that aMT is quite susceptible to degradation by light and heat (as I believe all trytamines are?). Mine came in two black baggies which seems to back that up. I'm keeping it in the freezer to be on the safe side as it may be a fair while before I use it all.


----------



## Morpheus19

Did somebody ever experience a great antidepressant effect the days after taking AMT?

I was doing a lot of drugs at a festival (mephedrone, amphetamin) and a combination of AMT (40mg) + Metyhlone (300mg) in the last night. 
The Trip was fucking crazy, but the main point is that I felt totally great the next days, although I must have felt LIKE SHIT for weeks, as I do normally after festivals.


----------



## goku4ever

Novice74 said:


> goku4ever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 1. Supposedly around 5mg would give a threshold effect, but I tried that last night and got fairly strong effects, which was taken 7 hours before I went to bed.
> 
> When you say you had fairly strong effects can you explain these effects? Would i be able to drive and go about an average daily schedule whilst on the threshold dose?
> 
> Can you take St johns wort whilst on AMT?
> 
> Can you store AMT in a sealed plastic bag (minimum requirement) or would this not be suitable?
> 
> Thanx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I dunno about the other 2 questions, but the effects of 5mg were fairly strong for me. I took with some alcohol, so Im not sure if that did anything to potentiate the effects or not. I was very giggely, singing and dancing around. My pupils were slightly dilated. I tend to require lower doses for drugs than most people though, so for the average person 5mg would do a lot less.
Click to expand...


----------



## Borissey

This stuff seems rarer than rocking horse shit in the UK.  I was wondering, do you have to live underground to get hold of this?


----------



## psood0nym

goku4ever said:


> Novice74 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I tend to require lower doses for drugs than most people though, so for the average person 5mg would do a lot less.
> 
> 
> 
> It's funny.  The preferable situation is actually one where a person's intake of drugs is kept minimal, yet there's this juvenile and embarrassingly male  anonymous culture of online insecure losers who get off on posting about the reckless amount of drugs they've abused as if such proclamations socially validated their existence.
> 
> ...anyways, congratulations on being sensitive to drugs! You minimize the physiological harm they do this way and a person like you has also gone a long way towards popping out that dent that drugs make in our pocket books.
Click to expand...


----------



## Morpheus19

Borissey said:


> This stuff seems rarer than rocking horse shit in the UK.  I was wondering, do you have to live underground to get hold of this?



I've never seen AMT on the street. Anyway, it's not that hard to obtain from the net.


----------



## Novice74

PHP:
	

[QUOTE="goku4ever, post: 8587005, member: 154751"][QUOTE="Novice74, post: 8586768, member: 145501"]

I dunno about the other 2 questions, but the effects of 5mg were fairly strong for me. I took with some alcohol, so Im not sure if that did anything to potentiate the effects or not. I was very giggely, singing and dancing around. My pupils were slightly dilated. I tend to require lower doses for drugs than most people though, so for the average person 5mg would do a lot less.[/QUOTE]


That sounds promising lol Being in a giggley mood and wanting to sing and dance sounds great to me. Pupil dialation isn't a problem for me since i have very dark eyes and only noticeable if you were extremely close and you knew what you were looking for. I agree with psood0nym i would much rather be very sensitive to any type of drug. Who wants to be able to drink 20 pints before they get drunk or having to take double the amount of substance to get high. Not me i definitely prefer to be sensitive to drugs, they would last twice as long.

P.s thanx for the help petebog. Do you know if the average person could drive and go about there a normal daily schedule on the threshold dose of 5-10mg?


----------



## petebog

Novice74 said:


> P.s thanx for the help petebog. Do you know if the average person could drive and go about there a normal daily schedule on the threshold dose of 5-10mg?



In the interests of harm reduction I could not honestly recommend driving on any amount of any drug.

However, that said, seeing as I seem to be one of the unlucky ones (with psychs anyway) that need a higher dose than many to get the same effects, I doubt 5 - 10mg would be noticeable at all.

As for the average person, it's really hard to say because responses to the same dose of the same drug can vary wildly between different people or even the same person at different times.

Safest option is just not to do it.


----------



## Novice74

petebog said:


> In the interests of harm reduction I could not honestly recommend driving on any amount of any drug.
> 
> However, that said, seeing as I seem to be one of the unlucky ones (with psychs anyway) that need a higher dose than many to get the same effects, I doubt 5 - 10mg would be noticeable at all.
> 
> As for the average person, it's really hard to say because responses to the same dose of the same drug can vary wildly between different people or even the same person at different times.
> 
> Safest option is just not to do it.



What im trying to say is that when i find the correct dose that is not trippy but is just a sustained mood lift would the effects also impair my judgement to control a motor vehicle? I know that AMT will effect people in different ways at different thresholds but can you envisage a dose that would give you feeling of well being but not effect your ability to undertake your daily routine?


----------



## petebog

I see what you mean. I think you need to wait for someone more experienced with the drug's range of effects to chime in.

As stated in my first post, this was my first time on aMT.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

I tried this at 30mg orally on Sunday and mainly just felt the heavy body load. No real mood elevation or euphoria and no visuals or psychedelic thoughts. 
I did smoke some DMT in low doses (not weighed aound 20mg x3) after around 6 hours and this brought euphoria but no more than spice usually brings.
Tolerance may have been an issue because i took 2x10mg doses on Friday which just gave me a slight body buzz/heavy feeling.
I am wondering if there may be some cross tolerance with DMT as i have been hitting it regularly in the week prior.
Also i haven't noticed any anti-depressant effect in the couple of days since.
Think I will try 40-50mg this weekend after a week of no spice and hope for better results.


----------



## Juice23

*Minimum aMT dose for first timers*

Sorry if this has been asked a million times before, but i'll be ordering some aMT tomorrow and because of the price i was just going to order .5g. Is this going to be enough for two first time users to experience any euphoria? No real psych use other than a fair few shroomz back in the day 

cheers


----------



## CatfishRivers

I only ever needed 50 mg or so to enjoy myself. At that dose, you'd have 10 nice experiences to look forward to. Even at 25 mg the experience is nice, which would give you 20 experiences! In other words, with half a gram, you've got plenty material that should last you several experiences.


----------



## Juice23

Oh shit i got my units wrong lol, g, mg, mcg. Its been a long day! Cheers mate, i'll prob still go with half a g and start with 25mg working up to 50mg. Thanks again mate


----------



## Psychonautical

5mg had me feeling like i just ate 180mg of mdma with a hint of speed in there for show.

once i realized i was comfortable at this level i moved up another 10mg

i had 15mg in my system in total. I was experiencing full LSDesque hallucinations

Melting pictures and beautiful orange and gold spirals dancing on everything that was the color white. 

at this point, i couldn't imagine taking 25-40mg

this makes me wonder if there are different isomers of AMT with one of them being more active. This is definately not 5-meo-amt that i have... 

The duration from 15mg lasted roughly 10-12 hours.


----------



## Psychonautical

Does anyone know if there are different isomers of AMT or anything like that.
Like one isomer being stronger than the other

I am finding it incredibly interesting that 15mg allowed me to have visuals
while most people are residing in the 25-40mg++ range which i find slightly strange.

this isn't 5-meo-amt that i have, i know that much...


----------



## The RZA

Psychonautical said:


> 5mg had me feeling like i just ate 180mg of mdma with a hint of speed in there for show.
> 
> once i realized i was comfortable at this level i moved up another 10mg
> 
> i had 15mg in my system in total. I was experiencing full LSDesque hallucinations
> 
> Melting pictures and beautiful orange and gold spirals dancing on everything that was the color white.
> 
> at this point, i couldn't imagine taking 25-40mg
> 
> *this makes me wonder if there are different isomers of AMT with one of them being more active*. This is definately not 5-meo-amt that i have...
> 
> The duration from 15mg lasted roughly 10-12 hours.



Quite probably. A poster in EADD recently consumed 250mg (yes, 250mg) of aMT and reported nothing like the visuals you describe.

In fact, in our aMT megathread over there, 50/60mg is emerging as a "standard" dose. Even amongst several first timers.


----------



## Tunnelfission

I'm in small supply of AMT, 60 mg and would like to have a good time, explore the substance i'm thinking of chopping the dose in half so I only orally injest roughly 25-35 hopefully 30 mg of AMT, also if that dose is worthwhile, squeezing two doses out of it.

So far I am just plain concerned about the MAO portion of it being a subject a have only root knowledge about that type of drug reaction and tend to use CWE with codiene often enough that I may like to on the come down or at the end of the AMT trip. I usually use 20-24, 8mg codeine 15 caff 300 acetaminophen tablets, so roughly 160-200 mg of codiene and twice that caffeine 320-400 mg. I usually drink half, then 3-4 hours later the other half

I'm just wondering if this is safe, or worthwhile as I do worry about post comedown headaches and I've heard that specifically opiates and MAO is possible yet dangerous territory. also it's becoming ritual at the end of certain trips to get a little dopie and smoke some bowls.

Just tend towards headaches, and they really piss me off so I want to know if I can fight it if it comes.

so how safe it is to take post dose opiate, 6-10 hours after injestion of 30 mg AMT?

thank you pros!


----------



## Bare_head

i am really pleased to have my beloved amt back  and i am definately not abusing it like last time! i find this stuff quite strong, being the hcl, i cant really put my finger on it but it feels a little smoother tho the come up still has that kick !! 

my scales have broke unfortunately i do have some old, 0.01 scales which might help me weigh out say like 20-30 mg but i loved weighing out a measly 7 mg and sprinkling it on my cornflakes :D ,, it was my anti depressant !


----------



## lineartransform

One important consideration - I assume the 50mg "standard" dose is oral. Are you referring to smoked doses Psychonautical?


----------



## love_sex_desire

Psychonautical said:


> 5mg had me feeling like i just ate 180mg of mdma with a hint of speed in there for show.
> 
> once i realized i was comfortable at this level i moved up another 10mg
> 
> i had 15mg in my system in total. I was experiencing full LSDesque hallucinations
> 
> Melting pictures and beautiful orange and gold spirals dancing on everything that was the color white.
> 
> at this point, i couldn't imagine taking 25-40mg
> 
> this makes me wonder if there are different isomers of AMT with one of them being more active. This is definately not 5-meo-amt that i have...
> 
> The duration from 15mg lasted roughly 10-12 hours.



Are you using the grey hydrochloride, or the possibly slightly yellow freebase?


----------



## I NUK3D U

The grey HCL going around is best at a dose of 40mg-60mg, consumed orally.

However, one brave individualy (as mentioned above) did consumer 250mg over a 24 hour period. Had this been in one dose, I think we may have seen a slightly  different result.

Empty stomach important on this one though. Any heavy carbs in your stomach is going to slow down the rate of absorbtion and a 50mg dose will feel like consecutive 10mg doses. IE. not reaching nearly the visual potential associated with such an amount.


----------



## Juice23

I NUK3D U said:


> The grey HCL going around is best at a dose of 40mg-60mg, consumed orally.
> 
> However, one brave individualy (as mentioned above) did consumer 250mg over a 24 hour period. Had this been in one dose, I think we may have seen a slightly  different result.
> 
> Empty stomach important on this one though. Any heavy carbs in your stomach is going to slow down the rate of absorbtion and a 50mg dose will feel like consecutive 10mg doses. IE. not reaching nearly the visual potential associated with such an amount.



Would an empty stomach help with nausea or is it unavoidable? And if i go with 10mg increments working up to 50mg so to avoid as much nausea as possible, how quickly should i take each dose? I don't want too big a gaps in between as i still want the full effect without chucking or feeling like shit initially. Cheers


----------



## Psychonautical

the freebase i have is bright tan.
and stinks like mothballs and dmt.

Curiosity...

5mg had me rolling balls.
10more 2 hours later had me tripping not "balls" but i was definately a medium ++.5
From Midnight until Noon the next day i was high...

is there a possibility that there are different isomers of AMT
like how ketamine has different isomers or is that just an utterly useless notion.

I know what i have isnt 5-meo-amt. 
this is AMT
i've had 5-meo-amt before no smell or anything really
and if i took 15mg i would have been high for DAYS not hours.
and felt like shit for DAYS 
instead of glowing beautifully for days afterwards.

Like its really weirding me out that i got so fucked up from so little.
I mean... i did get into an accident
This is the first drug i've taken in over a month.
and it was my first time taking it.
But i have taken LSD and Amphetamine and MDMA and all the 2c's before.
but it just caught me off guard how much mileage i attained from such a tiny amount.

i imagine an allergic reaction or something like that would be strictly held within the domain of alot of physical negative symptoms
not an increase in positive ones.

I also DO NOT understand half of the posts on erowid they all claim 
25-75mg as like a first timer starting dose.
i felt as if i took more than what i did that night... i'd need to be restained a little lol.
Then again, i do battle with depression....maybe that was just what it felt like to be truly happy.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

hey guys, recieved my amt in post today, came in a jiffy packaged in a jet black non seethrough bag, weighed out 6x 40 mg bags,tiny bit of dust left in bag which i will use for an allergy test on sunday 9.00am soon as i finish work ,YAY \O/, cant fooking wait !!!, used my weed guys scales due to the importance of acurate dosage, crystals were of varying sizes with a eggy , bad breath smell but i wouldnt say overly foul as the freebase was reported, i will take a 40 mg dose on empty stomach after a few spliffs, i will smoke spliffs throughout the duration of being off my head


edit* just had 15mg for the purposes of science

read what Goku says about alcohol, i find when i used to mix stuff with it ruined the buzz slightly, with it being a depresssant after say 3 drinks, how much alcohol did ya take mate?


----------



## Black

aMT does have two stereoisomers, but there's no way that one is that much more potent than the racemate. also i highly doubt that any chinese/... lab would go through the effort of enantioselective synthesis.
you either are extremely sensitive to amt or have simply received a different compound altogether.
have you tried reagent tests on your material?


----------



## Vurtual

Psychonautical said:


> ....i had 15mg in my system in total. I was experiencing full LSDesque hallucinations....



... and you're absolutely sure you're not reading the units wrong (0.15 instead of 0.015 - sorry if you are; just checking).  I'm sensitive to psychs (i get a fair buzz of 15 mg), but i have to use 35 or more to start getting substantial euphoria and visual effects (and even then, not full LSD-esque ones).  

You say you have freebase - this is a bit more potent by weight than the HCl (but it shouldn't be twice as potent)

OP - always start with allergy/5-meo-amt test (~1mg).  Then, i'd say starting dose depends on experience with other psychs - if you have none, start with a little dose (15-25) to get used to the tryptamine feeling.  If you've done plenty of other trips, i'd say jump in with at least 30-35mg

(these figures are based on the grey HCl - decrease them for the 'base).


----------



## Mr Wobble

From Tihkal:



> There is quite obviously a wide range of reported effect described for a-MT, indicating much individual variability. For some it has a fast onset, for others a slow one. Some find it a good psychedelic, others are disturbed by the negative physical side-effects. This is all a bit reminiscent of harmaline, where the spectrum of responses also range from 1 to 10 on a scale of 1 to 10.


----------



## dOM!

Psychonautical, it is most likely because you received the freebase which is considered more psychedelic  and stronger than the grey HCL salt going around at the moment in the UK. Do you guys think if i converted my salt to the freebase, it would be more potent?


----------



## Mr Wobble

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the relative weight for weight potency of freebase a-MT vs a-MT HCl just down to there being an additional one mole of HCl per mole of a-MT in the hydrochloride salt, thus a-MT HCl is slightly heavier per mole than freebase?

Comparing freebase and the hydrochloride salt, all other things being equal, mole for mole they should both of equal potency, no?


----------



## I NUK3D U

^ you are absolutely correct, and if we were comparing the the HCL and freebase of the same synth, then there should be little difference (assuming the same rate of absorbtion).

The HCL around at the moment is a different synth to the freebase however. The HCL tends to have very high levels of euphoria, and limited visuals at lower doses (increasing at higher doses). The freebase is the opposite. Visuals are high, but some report a distinct lack of euphoric stimulation.

The comparison being made is between the batches, not (I don't think), between the 'form'.


----------



## Delsyd

the freebase is slightly more potent mg/mg than the hcl.
other than that the effects should be the same.


----------



## Mr Wobble

So, if different 'synths' of a-MT, as opposed to different forms (freebase or HCl), really do produce different effects this must either be due to different levels/types of impurities, or different isomers. 

In a post somewhere above someone claims that there should be no difference in effect between stereo isomers, so that just leaves impurities - but then one, or more synths must have a fair degree of contamination with some other mystery chemical(s) to produce really pronounced effects.

My gut feeling is that the perceived differences are either down to varying sensitivity to a-MT between different people, or that different forms (freebase/HCl) have different absorption rates, or even that isomerism can play a role.


----------



## Delsyd

Mr Wobble said:


> My gut feeling is that the perceived differences are either down to varying sensitivity to a-MT between different people...



i think you're right.

i have tried 3 different batches of aMT and have had pretty consistent effects.
As consistent as a psychedelic could be.  Trips can also feel different from one another from the same batch.


----------



## Peeping Tom

I tried this for first time last week.  Did approx. 60mg. That was about right.  I'm a bit of a caner so wanted to feel it in all its glory for the fist time.  Didn't want to be underwelmed.  60 was perfect.  But be prepared for the long haul!  The experience lasted 11 hrs (ish) plus not an easy/ druggy interrupted sleep after.

Tom


----------



## Dr Mamba

Vurtual said:


> ... and you're absolutely sure you're not reading the units wrong (0.15 instead of 0.015 - sorry if you are; just checking).  I'm sensitive to psychs (i get a fair buzz of 15 mg), but i have to use 35 or more to start getting substantial euphoria and visual effects (and even then, not full LSD-esque ones).


First time 5 mg -> nothing.
Next day 10 mg -> nothing
Next 20 mg -> perhaps some little euphoria at H+6h ...
Next time i try 40 mg for my "first dose".


----------



## Psychonautical

a first timer last night smoked 10mg and had excessive leg vibrations but said he felt great.
Few hours into the trip he asked for another 10mg orally consumed 5mg with a glass of orange juice and smoked the other 5 on a small bowl of weed.

Within 45 minutes he said definitely feels like LSD. except for this speedy sensation. 
He said it was much cleaner and more open than any mdma he has done.


I'm going to be taking 15mg all at once, rather than 5 and then 10, 2 hours later this weekend with my girlfriend.

I'm not at all ... scared by the material. dont get me wrong.
I do have depression. like clinically diagonosed depression. I really only trip out, when i am on that more positive upswing. But i think because i was feeling down. I took this drug, which was marketed as an anti depressant and being nervous about the effects and then suddenly being surprised at feeling authentically happy left me feeling curious as to why it happened.


it's the yellow and tan freebase. uber stinky.


----------



## Special_Monster

I think its personaly differances.

I used to have freebase which Ifound to be less psychedelic than the HCL oddly enough.

Only got visuals on freebase the first time I tried it however on HCL I get visuals everytime.

Mind you the freebase original visuals were intense but so were the HCL when I frist tried that so I wouldn;t say tolerance is too much at play.


----------



## psilocybonaut

> 5mg had me feeling like i just ate 180mg of mdma with a hint of speed in there for show.


I have a feeling that you may have impure 5-MeO-AMT.  But who knows ?


----------



## love_sex_desire

^^ 5 mg of 5-MeO-AMT would not feel like 180 mg of mdma with a hint of speed!
Comparing 5-MeO-AMT to mdma is wrong IMO.
It sounds like he is especially sensitive to AMT.


----------



## I NUK3D U

^ or has the scales set to lbs/oz


----------



## halycyondaze

So the common consenus seems to be AMT has the empathogenic effects of MDMA in doses around 30 - 40 mgs, turning speedy and trippy like LSD at higher doses.  And with that uncomfortable sleep afterwards.  No nausea and you can drink alcohol on it?

Some people say it lasts a very long time, so take early rather than re-dose at 1am if you need to sleep by 3 ish?  

Anyone have good tips for sleeping after it?  And whats it like to mix with something like Meph later in the night?


----------



## PippUK

Just had my first dose of AMT yesterday after a 3 year gap. I got a couple of g again due to a general disenchantment with empathogens such as MDMA and M1 etc. I can't recapture my initial enjoyment of these compounds, and to try and do so (pushing up the dose etc) seems unhealthy, to say the least. 
  Anyway at midday, I took a 40mg dose on a nearly empty stomach, and after two hours I was subtly altered but by no means satisfied. Slight borderline visual enhancement but by no means impressive. Pleasant mild mental state. Redose at 3hr with 20mg, to no massive effect, and again 3 hours after that. By about 9pm I was yawning (I had done a shift on postal delivery between 5 and 12). Had a mildly stimulating evening of guitar practice, Cubase crunching and talking with my better half. To be honest, I was underwhelmed. On a different occasion, the same dosage pattern had me blissed out with some minor tummy rumbles but generally having a great time. 
  My point is, this stuff is very unpredictable. You think you want to be sure to hit the sweet spot regarding dose, but to do so might actually result in overshooting the margin by a long way, depending on a range of variables which are beyond my understanding.
  Tolerance might be part of the issue, seeing that I had a great Saturday evening of movies and quality time with the Mrs last weekend after I had washed down 5mg of DOM with my dinner. Overall while the DOM supplies a powerful drive which can be uncomfortable if not channelled into some constructive activity (like conversation, sex or even gardening!) I found it intellectual more interesting than AMT. However, I'm feeling tip top today after last nights dose so it is much lighter on the body than DOM was.
   Not sure I'd mix it with stuff like Meph though. I would combine it with DMT for a blast, or other simillar Tihkal materials, but the stims sound a bit off to me.
   Peace - Pipp


----------



## Zodiakk

Just make sure you know the difference of 5-MeO-AMT and AMT.  5-MeO-AMT is 5-10x stronger if my memory serves me correctly.


----------



## Bella Figura

Its best to start with an allergy test first, then a clinical anti-depressant dose to see how you react (5-10mg), then take it higher if you wish.

Jumping straight in at 60mg isn't a great idea.


----------



## Peeping Tom

^+1

60mg is a very strong dose on the grey stuff you are referring to.


----------



## Listening

If I take an oral anti-depressant dose (i.e. 10mg) tomorrow (Wednesday) just to test the waters, will I be able to trip on Saturday?

I'm going to a music festival for a lot of the day on Saturday and I figure AMT would be a good option. However, I've not yet dosed it orally (just tried vaping it, somewhat unsuccessfully or not high enough dosage thus far). Therefore I figure I should at least test at lower dosage to get a feel first... But I'm scared that it will make dosing on Saturday problematic...


----------



## Dr Mamba

Stuff is base, white with 75%naphtalene-25%DMT odor, no any scatol odor at all.
Dont want to do a TR, just the shema :

H : 40 mg oral morning with no food.
H+1h first feeling until H+2h30 : not enjoyable, like when a murshrom trip before it began : yawn, stretch, sleepy, tremor.
H+2h30 it begins, a sort of benzo-trippy buzz, dont want to do anything
H+4h : mild euphoria, always sleepy, eat a bit
H+4h30 : begin to fade out
H+8h : end

I think a starting mild dose may be 30 mg for me.
No pupill dilatation, not empathie, very light euphoria and nothing i can do (reading, watching a film...).
Just loosing a day, like 4meoPCP did to me, not sure i will do it twice.


----------



## Myshkin

In response to Listening's questions, it's always best to wait at least a week between doses, however if you stay strictly at the lower end of an antidepressant dose then you may well manage to trip a few days afterwards on a higher dose. The only problem is the increased nausea you'll feel at a higher dose (at least when taken orally) - I never get it at lower levels but it's VERY apparent at the psychedelic level, albeit transient and followed by utter bliss. Some green (or other anti-emetic) is highly recommended. I would also bear in mind the 'come up shits' experienced by many, myself included. I certainly wouldn't want to chance a festival toilet queue, so make alternative arrangements for this if you possibly can.


----------



## Juice23

I've searched for quite a while but can't find info on smoking the grey hcl version, i know the freebase is designed for that purpose but i can only get hcl, does it still work? And what would be the best method of smoking the stuff?


----------



## Myshkin

I probably overplayed the nausea thing; it's definitely there but it does pass and you feel amazing afterwards. I feel more nauseous on mushrooms sometimes to be honest. The only worry would be that somebody with no experience would freak out and think they'd taken too much. Having said that, the best way to avoid it would be to plug. I've not done this myself but many people say there's no nausea that way.


----------



## Chemical Wizard

Psychonautical said:


> a first timer last night smoked 10mg and had excessive leg vibrations but said he felt great.
> Few hours into the trip he asked for another 10mg orally consumed 5mg with a glass of orange juice and smoked the other 5 on a small bowl of weed.
> 
> Within 45 minutes he said definitely feels like LSD. except for this speedy sensation.
> He said it was much cleaner and more open than any mdma he has done.
> 
> 
> I'm going to be taking 15mg all at once, rather than 5 and then 10, 2 hours later this weekend with my girlfriend.
> 
> I'm not at all ... scared by the material. dont get me wrong.
> I do have depression. like clinically diagonosed depression. I really only trip out, when i am on that more positive upswing. But i think because i was feeling down. I took this drug, which was marketed as an anti depressant and being nervous about the effects and then suddenly being surprised at feeling authentically happy left me feeling curious as to why it happened.
> 
> 
> it's the yellow and tan freebase. uber stinky.



I'm pretty damn sure I have the same batch as you have Psychonautical.  It's beige-gold colored, and FUCKING REEKS.  It smells like concentrated mothballs.  Very stinky.  It was so stinky it made picking it up from the post office kinda of sketchy.  Anyways, I have done it three times since I got it.  The first time I took it on a hike, the second time I took it and went to work, and the third time, I took it before a huge sweet ass party with some DJs playing.  That last time I also did some mushrooms and drank about 7-8 beers.

Anyways, the first time I took it when I went on the hike, I was totally fucking impressed.  It was clearheaded, but I also got noticeable visual enhancement.  Lots of speedy energy, easy to talk to my friend and girlfriend.  It still felt grounded, and in this world.  I suppose that is one way that I would say it differs from LSD quite significantly.  The dose was 15 mgs as well.

The second time I did it, I tried it before going to work at my job at the grocery store, where I am a produce clerk.  It sure did give me a shitload of energy, and added a nice sparkle to the day.  My dose was a bit too high, and it was sometimes difficult to remain focused on conversations and staying on task, but really it wasn't that bad.  I still carried on at work totally fine, nobody suspected anything (and if they did, they didn't say anything haha).  But yeah, it's like a perfect mixup of MDMA, LSD, and amphetamine.  well, no, I don't like doing that, it's AMT, and it's fantastic !!! Dose was 7.5 mgs at 8 in the morning, and then 7.5 mgs again at 12 o'clock noon, for a total of 15 mgs.  Stretching out the dose worked nicely on this occaision. 

The third time I took it at the party, and mixed it with mushrooms and beers.  Dose was 18 mgs of AMT, followed by unknown but not tooooo big amount of mushrooms about 1 and 2 hours after dosing AMT.  SOOOO FUUUN.  I was realllly fucked up though.  I had quite a bad case of ataxia (drunken stumbling).  The alcohol + mushrooms + amt really really really made me wobbly.  Mostly this experince is just hedonistic recreational poly-drug use, so I won't taint the AMT pseudo-research with my ravey party ramblings.  But I will say, I didn't feel that bad at all the next day, mostly I remember feeling quite alright.

This stuff definietly has an awesome afterglow.  The day after AMT is still a totally awesome day.  I still feel like I did drugs yesterday, but a nice afterglow none the less.  AMT does give me stomach and muscle tension, and I feel like it is quite dehydrating, and could DEFINITELY leave you with a headache if you don't stay hydrated during your trip.  I like this stuff though, great material.

Next time I do it will probably be at Shambhala music festival.  I'm not sure how much I want to dose, i'm thinking 35 mgs, and then I will undoubtedly be mixing it with ketamine and maybe acid and MDMA and 2C-D (well those are things that I COULD mix it with if I want to....i think my days of intense drug combos are coming to an end...they're just...so intense.  DOUBLE DRUG COMBO ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE SKY.

OH MAN I CAN'T FUCKING WAIT for SHAMBHALA !!!!!!!!! 6 more days yeah !


----------



## pofacedhoe

rainey said:


> I took 11mg at 12pm and felt it within 15mins.Waited till 0145 and felt fine so took another 23mg. The next 2 hours my heart was in my mouth. No sickness or running to toilet but incredible anxiousness. At 0345 the fear subsided but I was left with the negative feeling of lsd with none of the positives. Absolutely no visuals or visual distortion of any kind. At 4.45 I got fed up with the feeling and took 10mg diazepam. Oh man then I felt incredible like E from years ago. Next time I take this I am going to take it with 10mg diaz again and I bet I will love every minute of it. Grey stuff capped.



come up's are anxiety inducing most of the time, maybe if you take valium frequently then you could be getting rebound anxiety.

all i know is i tend to save sedatives for the end of a stimulant, rather than to cancel the anxiety the stimulant causes. i had a friend who used to take valiums with cocaine, and he ended up with a serious valium/xanax addiction. just be carefull.


----------



## Psychonautical

valium x cocaine.
Wow if there was ever a combo that could kill you quicker.
it'd be that one. 

maybe next to that atropine laced Heroin.


----------



## deano88

The stuff I had was like a dull grey colour tasted bitter I only had 40mgs and was fucked for 20 hours no joke. Nice visuals too


----------



## Psychonautical

the stuff i have is the yellow//tan ultra stinky mothball stuff.
bought in Canada. thats all im going to say.
What you guys are getting is from Europe.


----------



## deano88

Psychonautical said:


> the stuff i have is the yellow//tan ultra stinky mothball stuff.
> bought in Canada. thats all im going to say.
> What you guys are getting is from Europe.



wel the stuff i described is what i'm getting and i'm from UK its nice stuff too 40mgs is plenty whats your stuff from canada like?


----------



## Myshkin

Sounds like the Canadians have the freebase. Increased potency, balanced out by an unholy smell. A trade-off. Kind of like having a beautiful, scenic country to live in but having the yanks as neighbours... I jest of course.


----------



## I NUK3D U

^ HCL in the UK is slightly less potent, and slightly less visual, but apparently, much for stim/euphoric than the freebase synths.

Strange, but true for most people (although very very different experiences reported using the same product/vendor/synth, so could just be one of those drugs that hit people very differently).


----------



## Myshkin

Yeah, I don't think I can recall seeing such wildly differing trip reports, even at identical doses and identical synths! 

Course, dosage isn't everything, but it goes to show how versatile and interesting the stuff actually is.


----------



## Myshkin

I don't think there's anything inherently dangerous as far as drug interactions go, but just think about it - the benzos take the edge off the coke but also make you feel the coke less, meaning more coke gets taken to compensate. Or the other way round - tolerance to the sedative effects of benzos means taking more of them than would be required without the coke. Throw alcohol or other CNS depressants into the mixture and you've got a great route to an OD there.

Of course, plenty of people do it. Danny Whitten did; look him up sometime.


----------



## Delsyd

I NUK3D U said:


> ^ HCL in the UK is slightly less potent, and slightly less visual, but apparently, much for stim/euphoric than the freebase synths.
> 
> Strange, but true for most people (although very very different experiences reported using the same product/vendor/synth, so could just be one of those drugs that hit people very differently).



it not uncommon for people to have varying effects from a psychedelic. 
Even on different trips from the same batch.

The hcl should not be more stim/euphoric while the freebase is more visual.

The only real difference (other than impurities) should be the dose required. (80mg of freebase=~100mg of hcl)


----------



## Myshkin

That's what I thought. It's a really, really subjective substance. That's part of the appeal.

Though it doesn't stop me feeling slightly disappointed that the little orange chunks in my bag of Hcl don't have any extra magic in them...


----------



## I NUK3D U

Apparently a single  (and quite strong) redose works a treat. I think Andy_2g started with 60mg, and then a further 40mg at about the 4 hour point. He said it brought the visuals on wonderfully.


----------



## Myshkin

Yet to try redosing, but I've heard a few people say that. I know my first 60mg dose (with the help of a lot of weed) was far more visual than I'd ever have expected - weird purplish light being the most unusual part!


----------



## Peeping Tom

I NUK3D U said:


> Apparently a single  (and quite strong) redose works a treat. I think Andy_2g started with 60mg, and then a further 40mg at about the 4 hour point. He said it brought the visuals on wonderfully.



i tried to redose after approx. 5hrs into ~ 60mg dose.  Trying to switch the scales on took long enough.  then trying to accurately weigh out 20 or so mg.  then proceeding with plugging, sorting out the squirter etc. 

it wasn't easy and i ended up with the redose all over the kitchen floor.


----------



## rainey

oh man!!! ....and how did the kitchen floor look after a few hours lol


----------



## Peeping Tom

yeah kinda pulsing and morphing.  the chequered tiles didn't help.


----------



## deano88

Delsyd said:


> it not uncommon for people to have varying effects from a psychedelic.
> Even on different trips from the same batch.
> 
> The hcl should not be more stim/euphoric while the freebase is more visual.
> 
> The only real difference (other than impurities) should be the dose required. (80mg of freebase=~100mg of hcl)



What!! I'm sorry but 100mg of the stuff I had would of defo been a OD I only had about 45mg and I was mashed redosing didn't even come into my mind although I might try to next time but not by much and i'll make sure I sort out the extra dose before hand as this shit makes even the simplist of tasks seem hard.

Don't get of wrong i'm defo not a lightweight when it comes to drugs I took loads of mdma in past etc but I was shocked how strong this stuff I was just not prepared for it and never expected to still be buzzing 24 hours later.


----------



## Delsyd

i wasnt suggesting you take 100mg.
In fact i think 40-60 is probably the sweet spot for most.

i was pointing out the difference in weight btwn hcl and freebase.


----------



## Peeping Tom

delsyd said:


> in fact i think 40-60 is probably the sweet spot for most.




+1..


----------



## Deak40

Hey bluelight, been lurking for a while and this is my first post 
I was wondering about the legality of amt, the wikipedia article states it is legal here in the uk, but I've only been able to find one vendor who stocks it. Is there issues with it, as I can't see why it isn't more readily available from a number of sources?
Cheers, D


----------



## knock

Deak40 said:


> Hey bluelight, been lurking for a while and this is my first post
> I was wondering about the legality of amt, the wikipedia article states it is legal here in the uk, but I've only been able to find one vendor who stocks it. Is there issues with it, as I can't see why it isn't more readily available from a number of sources?
> Cheers, D



Probably because it's a long-lasting psychedelic with a body load and highly variable effects, with rectal administration preferred. Market is probably quite a bit smaller than the former meph trade i.e. MDMA/coke stand-in for friday night pub/club/night-in bombing/snorting shenanigans.

Just my guess though.


----------



## Fourth_Drive

Got it in one, Knockando


----------



## Juice23

Is plugging with a gel cap just as effective? And is the benefit of plugging over oral administration just the lack of nausea? Or are the effects hightened?


----------



## Juice23

Another question, i tried 40mg the other day and got a half decent buzz with some visuals, would 60 or 70mg give an increased buzz or just increased visuals?


----------



## ConnectFor

To echo whats been said on the dosages - my experience - I'm 6ft/15 ... alright 16 stone and had aMT a couple of times about a week and a half apart.

- 30mg taken at 5pm dissolved in water (same method each time in fact) - an hour to feel it, then about an hour of slight nausea which was soothed by milk as it reached a nice mellow peak for about 4 hours of feeling very nice thankyou and went to sleep after about half an hour.

- 40 mg taken about 3.30 am in combination with some meph (I'd done about 600mg out of a g of the stuff by that point, first time I'd had it in a couple fo months...). 

An hour to come up, no nausea this time (probably due to the meph) and the combination was kind of what you'd expect - very stimulated, trippy and pretty full on euphoria. I remember giggling to myself quite a lot :D

Then the meph ran out and I decided to try and measure out some more aMT at about 7.30am. Shite idea looking back, but I measured out about another 40mg. What followed throughout the morning was a mixture of a weird meph come down and a couple of kind of sleeps where I woke up after about 30 mins still with OEVs and major CEVs.. 

The rest of the afternoon was spent tripping out to trancey music until about 6pm when it just started to wear off and I had a benzo and chilled, got some cuddles and proper food in me so all was well 

Next day felt fine if a little tired. I know which of the two substances I prefer now


----------



## Deak40

knockando said:


> Probably because it's a long-lasting psychedelic with a body load and highly variable effects, with rectal administration preferred. Market is probably quite a bit smaller than the former meph trade i.e. MDMA/coke stand-in for friday night pub/club/night-in bombing/snorting shenanigans.
> 
> Just my guess though.




Thanks mate sounds right, just wanted to make sure something wasn't up before ordering


----------



## goku4ever

Psychonautical said:


> the stuff i have is the yellow//tan ultra stinky mothball stuff.
> bought in Canada. thats all im going to say.
> What you guys are getting is from Europe.



I have the same stuff you do. What is your dose for that? My first time I took 25mg which I found to be a bit too much, but I reckon now I know more about it and feel more comfortable about the drug, I could handle 25mg a whole lot better.


----------



## Listening

goku4ever said:


> I have the same stuff you do. What is your dose for that? My first time I took 25mg which I found to be a bit too much, but I reckon now I know more about it and feel more comfortable about the drug, I could handle 25mg a whole lot better.



Curious to hear what you found "too much" about 25mg (I have almost no AMT experience, but have the same batch as you and would like to plan my first oral dose). Was it overwhelming? In what way? Or nausea?


----------



## goku4ever

It was my first proper time with a psychidelic drug, I found the whole experience rather scary. At times it was like I was in a completely different place, if I let it. I found that to be a bit intimidating so the entire time I was fighting with it to keep my self normal.
Also, my body is fairly sensitive to drugs.


----------



## Bare_head

what doses are people taking?!?!?! i find this stuff quite potent the HCL version i have gives really good effects at 35mg.. like not full blown visuals but i always found amt to be more of a tactile enhancer rather than a typical psychedelic in the sense 2CB/LSD works..  i am a bit of a pussy with it though, i have never exceeded 50mg .. and never really wanted too


----------



## Bare_head

Listening said:


> Curious to hear what you found "too much" about 25mg (I have almost no AMT experience, but have the same batch as you and would like to plan my first oral dose). Was it overwhelming? In what way? Or nausea?



i find the comeup the most intense part, u can become very fidgity and have this real sense of energy running through you. can get some nausea i dont find paticulary bad .. i find the duartion to be a long one, so dosing small and very early always helps.. 10mg around 10am would give me a nice novel day being able to eat and even sleep around 1am (though i usually stay up later than that anyways)


----------



## Tunnelfission

Does anyone notice thier sweat gets a rather unpleasent smell when they're on this drug? I tried it for the first time and it could have just been the taste of the chem coming up my nasal passages from heaving it out at the 1.5 hour mark but just in my own mind I smelled horrible! def similar to the drugs smell itself (mothbally)

Felt pretty cool but it took 4 hours before the nausea subsided (30 mg dose) and I had a good time, I would have really enjoyed this drug at certain times of my life but I'm due for a break from 95% of substances for a bit this trip told me.


----------



## Slam_London

Psychonautical said:


> valium x cocaine.
> Wow if there was ever a combo that could kill you quicker.
> it'd be that one.
> 
> maybe next to that atropine laced Heroin.




Valium + Cocaine is actually a lifesaver.... hospitals administer valium to counteract cocaine overdose


----------



## Peeping Tom

Tunnelfission said:


> Does anyone notice thier sweat gets a rather unpleasent smell when they're on this drug? I tried it for the first time and it could have just been the taste of the chem coming up my nasal passages from heaving it out at the 1.5 hour mark but just in my own mind I smelled horrible! def similar to the drugs smell itself (mothbally)
> 
> Felt pretty cool but it took 4 hours before the nausea subsided (30 mg dose) and I had a good time, I would have really enjoyed this drug at certain times of my life but I'm due for a break from 95% of substances for a bit this trip told me.



Cant say i've notice my sweat smelling but i have sweated quite profusely on it.  Next time i will have a whiff.  One thing i did notice which i thought was a bit odd is that after administering rectally, i could actually taste the substance about an hour or so into the experience.  very odd - not sure if i really tasted it or it was because i had a sniff of the smelly stuff and i was 'remembering' what i had smelt.


----------



## Juice23

Well i did 80mg hcl saturday topped up with another 30mg and a gram of weed, 5 hours after ingestion - proper fucked. Me and the missus were just chatting repetitive shit for several hours, forgetting what we'd said just 5 seconds ago. Good buzz initially. Then got a bangin headache for half hour and fell asleep for 27 hours(10 hours after ingestion)!


----------



## Peeping Tom

Juice23 said:


> and fell asleep for 27 hours(10 hours after ingestion)!



jesus thats a hell of long time to be sparked out for!!


----------



## Juice23

Peeping Tom said:


> jesus thats a hell of long time to be sparked out for!!



I did take 10mg valium and 25mg amitriptyline so that probably had an influence! But still, i've never slept that long, ever.


----------



## 33Hz

Would taking some vitamin E before I dosed lessen the alleged "neurotoxicity" of this chemical, or does that only apply to MDMA?


----------



## Myshkin

I don't think this chemical is particularly neurotoxic in comparison with MDMA. I'd definitely go with your usual drug preparations though; I found working out beforehand and making sure my stomach was completely empty really lessened the body load and made the whole  experience a lot smoother.


----------



## 33Hz

Alright, thanks. Yeah, I might as well take it, it's not like it's going to hurt. Might help counter some free radical damage too, if it has a similar action to MDMA that is.


----------



## commander-blue

*AMT & dramamine (anti-nausea drugs)*

i would advise against mixing AMT (or almost any drug for that matter) with anti vomiting drugs.
my reason being that vomiting is a useful function of the body for avoiding dangerous overdoses. for example: no one would take gravol to combat vomiting from alcohol because its dangerous to not be able to puke.
AMT in specific as well as many other RC's are often highly variable in effects. 40mg may be just enough to trip for one person, while that same dose may be a nightmarish overdose for another person. which makes loss of the vomiting function extremely risky...
the lesson here is to start small and don't be afraid to vomit.


----------



## HiHigh

commander-blue said:


> i would advise against mixing AMT (or almost any drug for that matter) with anti vomiting drugs.
> my reason being that vomiting is a useful function of the body for avoiding dangerous overdoses. for example: no one would take gravol to combat vomiting from alcohol because its dangerous to not be able to puke.
> AMT in specific as well as many other RC's are often highly variable in effects. 40mg may be just enough to trip for one person, while that same dose may be a nightmarish overdose for another person. which makes loss of the vomiting function extremely risky...
> the lesson here is to start small and don't be afraid to vomit.



Well said that man


----------



## Xorkoth

33Hz said:


> Alright, thanks. Yeah, I might as well take it, it's not like it's going to hurt. Might help counter some free radical damage too, if it has a similar action to MDMA that is.



Any antioxidants could only be a good idea I think.  FYI, AMT does release monoamines like MDMA does... in fact it releases serotonin, dopamine, and norepinephrine.  But it does so very slowly over its long duration and so it does not cause anywhere near the damage or depletion that MDMA causes, at least not with responsible use.  MDMA releases a bunch all at once which is why it's more dangerous.  And if I recall correctly, MDMA also metabolizes into alpha-methyldopamine, which is neurotoxic to serotonin neurons, and AMT does not.

Someone please correct the above information if it's wrong... I am too lazy to look it up right now but from what I recall with discussions with some intelligent and knowledgeable Bluelighters, that's the deal.


----------



## 33Hz

Xorkoth said:


> Any antioxidants could only be a good idea I think.  FYI, AMT does release monoamines like MDMA does... in fact it releases serotonin, dopamine, and norepinephrine.  But it does so very slowly over its long duration and so it does not cause anywhere near the damage or depletion that MDMA causes, at least not with responsible use.  MDMA releases a bunch all at once which is why it's more dangerous.  And if I recall correctly, MDMA also metabolizes into alpha-methyldopamine, which is neurotoxic to serotonin neurons, and AMT does not.
> 
> Someone please correct the above information if it's wrong... I am too lazy to look it up right now but from what I recall with discussions with some intelligent and knowledgeable Bluelighters, that's the deal.



Thanks for that. I'm going to be taking some later this evening with a close friend of mine. Bearing in mind that this is our first time, would 40mg (after an allergy test) be too high a dose to start off with? Both of us have a good deal of experience with the 2c's, shrooms/4aco-dmt, and LSD to a lesser extent.


----------



## Xorkoth

No, I think 40mg is a perfect starting dose for someone with psychedelic experience.


----------



## botfly

I'm umming and ahhing whether to get this or 6-apb.


----------



## Delsyd

commander-blue said:


> i would advise against mixing AMT (or almost any drug for that matter) with anti vomiting drugs.
> my reason being that vomiting is a useful function of the body for avoiding dangerous overdoses. for example: no one would take gravol to combat vomiting from alcohol because its dangerous to not be able to puke.
> AMT in specific as well as many other RC's are often highly variable in effects. 40mg may be just enough to trip for one person, while that same dose may be a nightmarish overdose for another person. which makes loss of the vomiting function extremely risky...
> the lesson here is to start small and don't be afraid to vomit.



good advice, and thank you.

But can i ask why not vomiting is risky?

You would not be vomiting the drug out, since by the time you are feeling nauseas or tripping it has already made its way into your bloodstream and vomiting or not vomiting wont make the slightest bit of difference to your trip (except re-leaving nausea).


----------



## Delsyd

i would take nausea meds, especially prescription ones, because they are often 5ht3 antagonist and i feel it would interfere with the trip somewhat.


----------



## psood0nym

Isn't 5HT3 agonism correlated with nausea and anxiety?  It sounds like an improvement to me.  I agree that when first finding your dose you shouldn't take them in order to reserve the potential to puke up an overdose, but once you get your bearings sail away.


----------



## Delsyd

i was going on the assumption that any seratonin antagonist would interfere/weaken the trip.


----------



## Dondante

^Actually, there is anecdotal evidence that 5-HT3 antagonism may potentiate psychedelics with 5-HT2A agonism. The reports are mixed, but most at least agree that it effectively abolishes nausea. 

Mescaline - Experienced - "Soul annihilating overdose"

Though this is merely conjecture, the high concentration of 5-HT3 receptors in the gut could potentially sequester the active compound and prevent it from getting to the brain. Therefore, filling these receptors with an antagonist would not only alleviate nausea, but would also increase the amount of compound that enters the brain. That's just my completely unsubstantiated theory. There are also 5-HT3 receptors in the brain, including the nausea center (chemoreceptor trigger zone), which may also help explain the antiemetic properties. Nausea from psychedelics likely reflects 5-HT3 agonism, not toxicity, so prevention of vomiting should not be dangerous. 

Other roles for 5-HT3R are unclear, but the receptor is present through the CNS, with high concentrations in the neocortex and amygdala. Interestingly, ondansetron has been shown to mitigate some of the physiological signs of opiate withdrawal.


----------



## psood0nym

^That is interesting about the opiate withdrawl.  I get brain zaps while trying to sleep on hydrocodone.  Brain zaps are usually correlated with low serotonin levels.  Maybe opiates effect serotonin systems in specific parts of the brain. They don't really release it or block its re-uptake, but they could alter the way it's distributed through some as of yet unknown mechanism. The withdrawal mitigating effects of ondansetron and the brain zaps with hydrocodone suggest maybe something with serotonin is going on.


----------



## Xorkoth

I agree... that's an interesting observation.  I was about to say I've never had brain zaps from opiates, but actually I have, rarely, but only when awake.  I couldn't speculate as to what conditions were present other than opiate intoxication.


----------



## I NUK3D U

botfly said:


> I'm umming and ahhing whether to get this or 6-apb.



Two very different drugs. I've tried the 2nd synth sample of 6apb and it absolutely knocked my bollocks off. Mind you, I did fuck up my measurements and took way too much, but it was very MDMA, pushy, full OEV experience. Very very enjoyable. Felt like I'd had a very heavy experience when it was over.

aMT is much more subtle on all fronts, whilst still managing to hit all the right spots. The euphoria is consistent and not overpowering; at no point do you feel as if you are not in complete control. Of course, you're fucked, but not 'out of this world'. The visuals are also very different. On 6apb, I actually had tangible objects (bright blue orbs) in my field of vision that I could move around and play with. aMT is much more trippy and the visuals play around with the environment that's already there. 

I say try and both and pick your favorite. I think they both have their strong points depending on your situation.

I would caution though that the new 6apb pellets do not appear to be anywhere near as strong as the 2nd synth. I think (for many reasons which I won't go into publicaly) the lab have had to scale back the amount of the 'good stuff' in the pellets. Not by much, but certainly to achieve what I achieved with the 2nd synth, you're gonna have to spend about £40-£50, which makes aMT by the far the best cost wise.

Enjoy!!


----------



## muel65

Is it ok to ask what a sensible price I should be paying per g of AMT?


----------



## Delsyd

no price discussion aloud.


----------



## botfly

I NUK3D U said:


> Two very different drugs. I've tried the 2nd synth sample of 6apb and it absolutely knocked my bollocks off. Mind you, I did fuck up my measurements and took way too much, but it was very MDMA, pushy, full OEV experience. Very very enjoyable. Felt like I'd had a very heavy experience when it was over.
> 
> aMT is much more subtle on all fronts, whilst still managing to hit all the right spots. The euphoria is consistent and not overpowering; at no point do you feel as if you are not in complete control. Of course, you're fucked, but not 'out of this world'. The visuals are also very different. On 6apb, I actually had tangible objects (bright blue orbs) in my field of vision that I could move around and play with. aMT is much more trippy and the visuals play around with the environment that's already there.
> 
> I say try and both and pick your favorite. I think they both have their strong points depending on your situation.
> 
> I would caution though that the new 6apb pellets do not appear to be anywhere near as strong as the 2nd synth. I think (for many reasons which I won't go into publicaly) the lab have had to scale back the amount of the 'good stuff' in the pellets. Not by much, but certainly to achieve what I achieved with the 2nd synth, you're gonna have to spend about £40-£50, which makes aMT by the far the best cost wise.
> 
> Enjoy!!



Yeah from the reports I'm thinking the pellets are no more than 80mg which is a shame. Will probably be best to hold back for a few weeks till some quality or greed control is introduced. Seems as though some of the pellets are well pressed and even, others less so. so there might even be different batches in this lot!
Having tried AMT once in tiny increments and building up, I think I'll have a lot less but a bigger dose this time, this will probably make it more intense as I think constantly redosing small amounts doesn't work as well, gets really mongy. I did abuse the shit out of it though. Only thing that puts me off AMT is the looong half-life of it. Will see what my state my finances are in tomorrow, wait for a few more reliable reports on the 6-apb front to come through then decide tomorrow. I'd just buy both but times are hard lol.

Cheers!


----------



## I NUK3D U

^Yeah mate, don't be doing the whole 250mg again. That was crazy man lol! - the story is already quite legendary around here.

60mg oral on an empty stomach was a strong experience for me.

Something in the 40mg range would be a good first dose, in the scheme of 'larger doses'.


----------



## botfly

lol yeah was a bit of a stupid of me doing that much, do I still hold the record?
Felt like I was on the moon at one point the ground looked like it was waving up and down, saw about ten different me's everytime I looked in the mirror was very trippy indeed. Clouds were purple then flipped orange noticed all the details in hd was pretty damn cool at the time. There were some audal(sp?) hallucinations not like voices or owt just like warped nice relaxing wavy sounds, the wind enhanced it.
Felt somewhat shit for a couple days after but that's to be expected from not much sleep, food and quite a few cans while on it. Won't be going daft like that again! Not necessary really just thought i'd experiment and go for it as I find everything moreish once in the mood. It's not actually moreish though to anyone reading i'm just a fiend. Like you said though, you never feel out of control or anything like that, it is forgiving and not pushy. I think I'd have say 10mg just to get your body to adjust, then go for the 30-60mg dose.


----------



## commander-blue

*+ and- aMT (amtryptamine)*

just found a tid bit about the potentcy of -aMT as compared to +aMT in a compilation of synth routes... they stated that the +aMT was five times as potent as a stimulant.

there have been alot of mixed reports about aMT and i believe this difference plays a strong role, as well as the differences between salt/freebase, ect forms of aMT


in my opinion +aMT is more desirable, however some people dont like speedy effects in which case they may prefer the other. this also explains why some people claim its relatively awesome psychedelic effects, while others tell a completely different story of a magical euphoric-psychedelic-stimulant

ive always wondered why amphetamine and aMT arent named more similarly?

a-m-phet-amine OR alpha methyl phenethylamine.

may i suggest: a-m-trypt-amine "amtryptamine" for Alpha methyl tryptamine.


----------



## Dondante

^Interesting on the first point...mind linking your source?

It has also been shown that (+) AMT has 4x greater affinity for 5-HT2A than (-) AMT, so it's unlikely that the (-) enantiomer would have more (or even equivalent) psychedelic effects. 

Psychoactive Drug Screening Program; results from McKenna DJ et al. 1989. 

More importantly, I find it unlikely that there are various enantio-pure compounds circulating, since enantio purification requires additional steps during synthesis, and there is no reason why it wouldn't be marketed as such. Even if it had been, based on recent actions of the 'RC scene', I'd be skeptical until I saw third-party testing. 

There are mixed reports on every psychedelic drug. That's just the nature of the beast. While it's tempting to chalk the differences up to unique drug structure, it's more likely that the differences are due to psychological set and setting plus the individual's physiology.


----------



## Psychonautical

how long does AMT last when stored inside of  a dimebag inside of a smellyproof bag
inside of a freezer? i want to treasure this remarkable material.


----------



## Xorkoth

A long time... the freebase does anyway.  It's quite stable, especially in the cold.  I'd put the bag inside a small jar too if I were you.  But probably not necessary, just even better.


----------



## change-jug

I finally got around to laying my hands on some aMT over the weekend and just bought a scale on line today. I can`t wait to dose up a 40mg hit! But man that stuff does smell. It came in a smellyproof bag and then another 2 bags after that and when I opened the envelope my whole car reeked liked bad breath. My girlfriend was less than thrilled.


----------



## love_sex_desire

commander-blue said:


> ive always wondered why amphetamine and aMT arent named more similarly?
> 
> a-m-phet-amine OR alpha methyl phenethylamine.
> 
> may i suggest: a-m-trypt-amine "amtryptamine" for Alpha methyl tryptamine.



It is also known as metryptamine, but amtryptamine does make more sense :D


----------



## dOM!

change-jug said:


> I finally got around to laying my hands on some aMT over the weekend and just bought a scale on line today. I can`t wait to dose up a 40mg hit! But man that stuff does smell. It came in a smellyproof bag and then another 2 bags after that and when I opened the envelope my whole car reeked liked bad breath. My girlfriend was less than thrilled.



your aMT doesnt sound like the aMT us brits are getting, sounds more like the freebase so it probably isnt the best idea to start off at 40mg lol you should start with an anti-depressant dose first of 5-10mg imo seeing as most people smoking the freebase even see psychedelic effects at this dose?


----------



## Xorkoth

The smoked dose of AMT is much lower than the oral dose.  Freebase AMT is what 95% of the existing reports are reporting, and the dosages recommended at Erowid are accurate for that.  I think 40mg is a good starting dose, or maybe 35mg.  But if you've never had AMT before, definitely try an allergy test dose first, a few mg anyway.


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ 35 mg seems to work well for most people for their 1st dose. Although some people just don't jive with this particular tryp, so starting low doesn't hurt.


----------



## 33Hz

So I didn't end up dosing until Saturday as it was more convenient for the both of us. 

Decided to start off with 30mg instead of 40mg, but will definitely increase to 40mg next time around. Very smooth come up, and only mild stomach discomfit during the onset. Noticed a definite increase in energy after the first hour, was pacing around the room inspecting objects and whatnot. Everything was a lot more interesting, and things seemed more amusing. Started feeling really good coming up to the 2nd hour, couldn't resist the urge to smile from ear to ear. Sometime into the 2nd hour the rushes came on, along with a slight bodyload. Was feeling very happy and chatty so decided to invite a few more people round. Felt like a mixture of shrooms/MDMA. Visuals were kicking in by this point. Noticed distortion of the size of objects, accompanied by a zooming in and out effect. Colours were more intense, and light was more sparkley. Some mild CEVs as well. Music was more interesting, and had a lot more depth. Very similar to what I get with shrooms. Started getting speedier by the 3rd hour with slight jaw clenching going on. Headspace was somewhat trippy, but very easy to control. Spent the rest of the evening chatting with mates, and kicking ass on the Xbox. Bit of a migraine the following day and felt a little drained, but that was it really.

I have a feeling this chem will be perfect for Bestival at a slightly higher dose.


----------



## Psychonautical

Hey does anyone know exactly what dose of AMT would be a Full MAOI Inhibiting dose.
My friend wants to try Oral DMT, but we currently have no access to MAOIS at the moment


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ AMT's MAOI action is weak. Someone mentioned trying a dose of AMT to try a kind of pharmahuasca and it didn't work. 

I think AMT's MAOI properties are similar to some other psychedelics and MDMA. AMT's MAOI properties might be a little stronger, but not by much, and certainly not enough to be a plausible MAOI for oral DMT.


----------



## Myshkin

Psychonautical said:


> Hey does anyone know exactly what dose of AMT would be a Full MAOI Inhibiting dose.
> My friend wants to try Oral DMT, but we currently have no access to MAOIS at the moment



Syrian Rue seeds? Honestly, there are a number of MAOIs out there which are _so_ much cheaper and more available. 

Why waste the AMT and/or the DMT attempting to do something which other people have failed at?


----------



## MrTiHKAL

I have smoked DMT around 6 hours into an AMT trip and didn't notice any maoi type effects, like i would if i had smoked some caapi leaf say. I'm not saying that the maoi effect doesn't exist but in my experience it must be weak with the AMT doses I have tried i.e. up to 50mg.


----------



## Morpheus19

I have a question regarding the combination of AMT and MDMA.

I'm planning the drug use for a festival in this summer. The psytrance festival will last 5 days, and usually there is some kind of 'main day', which we will remember first when thinking about our time there.

Last year we had a combination of AMT (35mg) + Methylone (300mg).
That resulted in the badest eye-wiggles-real-hallucination-thing ever, some of us liked it, others went totally crazy.
It's clear that it was way to much Methylone. And in fact, methylone on its own can induce weird hallucinations.

So this year I want to try it with MDMA (HCL).

Is this a good way to go?

4-5 hours after taking AMT rectal we'll take 50mg MDMA oral. We'll redose 2 times with 40mg and 30mg.

Will the dosage be enough to get a great experience without being totally messed up? We don't want to lie on the ground without being able to move and just telling that 'I love you so much' thing, we want to be able to dance and just be loved up a bit and feel great.


----------



## Myshkin

Hmmm. Not sure I'd like to combine the two. I'm far from expert on such matters, but I think you're running the gauntlet there with regard to serotonin depletion, neurotoxicity etc. It may well have the potential to be a wonderful experience, but I also think it could have undesirable consequences. It's up to you whether you want to run the risk, and I see you've already done a similar combo with methylone.

I would strongly recommend taking the two substances separately. If you're comfortable with AMT, try upping the dose to about 50-60mg and you shouldn't _want_ anything as prosaic and workmanlike as MDMA after that!


----------



## Psychonautical

well i mean think about it, if alexander shulgin, took 100mg and got sick, with a very fast heart beat and everything it almost sounded like what he was going through was a mild serotonin syndrome.
So lets say doses of, 30mg and under are only slight maoi inhibitions.

Would doses of 60+ be more full?


----------



## Xorkoth

No, I don't think so.  100mg of AMT is a shitload, especially for Shulgin and his testers who seemed to have low tolerances.  You need full MAO inhibition for oral DMT to work.  I VERY much doubt that any dose of AMT would provkide full MAO inhibition.  I think the idea that AMT is a dangerous MAOI is from a case of earlier AMT researchers in this community erring on the side of caution.  Personally I have combined AMT with a lot of things, at doses of 60-100mg when I was really into it, and never noticed really any degree of MAO inhibition at all.  Plus taking a high dose of AMT, even if it did cause MAO inhibition, would add a huge extra factor to the oral DMT experience that would probably be too much.

Syrian rue seeds are easily ordered from ethnobitanical sites for really, really, REALLY cheap.  Just use those.  Caapi is pretty cheap too and would be even better.


----------



## deano88

Psychonautical said:


> well i mean think about it, if alexander shulgin, took 100mg and got sick, with a very fast heart beat and everything it almost sounded like what he was going through was a mild serotonin syndrome.
> So lets say doses of, 30mg and under are only slight maoi inhibitions.
> 
> Would doses of 60+ be more full?


 
60+ Doses of what, mdma or aMT. I'm also very interested in the effects of aMT and mdma combined has anyone tried it?


----------



## Psychonautical

well deano, have you taken AMT before.
because before you decide to mix it with a stimulant, i would just take a high dose of it.
it in itself is quite stimulating and the fact that there really isn't much of a crash kind of is interesting to me. Maybe it has like some sort of cyclic MAOI inhibition vs a traditional, keeping the serotonin you already have a bit more charged but consistantly there, but siphoned away slowly in order to prevent extreme neurotoxicity, vs the extensive release of MDMA.

SO lets say you take some mdma, get a shit load of serotonin into your brain on something that will consistantly build making you more and more euphoric. Building on top of mdmas extreme serotonin release. 

you might just feel like a cockroach or somethin scuttling about eyes jigglin and probably tweeking.

i'd do one or the other.

or get some LSD

AMT AND LSD i imagine is about as amazing as LSD and MDMA ^.^


----------



## tragiclemming

I did 50mg aMT and after 10 hours dosed 150mg MDMA. This blew me away, but I'm still here and didn't have any adverse effects that I noticed.


----------



## change-jug

I plan on plugging my first dose of aMT when I finally get my scale in the mail(hey! That rhymed!). I normally have a hard time sitting on drugs(no pun intended) so depending on when I get the scale I might end up getting high during the work week(and I get up around 5:30am. it sucks balls) How would a low dose of around 10 to 15mgs effect some one on average? Do you think I would be up all night? Or would that be a annoying under dose? What say you fine gents?


----------



## deano88

Psychonautical said:


> well deano, have you taken AMT before.
> because before you decide to mix it with a stimulant, i would just take a high dose of it.
> it in itself is quite stimulating and the fact that there really isn't much of a crash kind of is interesting to me. Maybe it has like some sort of cyclic MAOI inhibition vs a traditional, keeping the serotonin you already have a bit more charged but consistantly there, but siphoned away slowly in order to prevent extreme neurotoxicity, vs the extensive release of MDMA.
> 
> SO lets say you take some mdma, get a shit load of serotonin into your brain on something that will consistantly build making you more and more euphoric. Building on top of mdmas extreme serotonin release.
> 
> you might just feel like a cockroach or somethin scuttling about eyes jigglin and probably tweeking.
> 
> i'd do one or the other.
> 
> or get some LSD
> 
> AMT AND LSD i imagine is about as amazing as LSD and MDMA ^.^




ok thanks for the advice and yes i have tried AMT i have had it every weekend for the past 3 weeks and i have mixed it with drugs but the strongest drug i mixed it with was one pill of 6-apb and it was amazing but i'd love to try it with mdma but maybe not til about 4 or 5 hours into the AMT trip. my average dose of AMT is 50mg usaully having a booster about 10 hours in but i prob wont bother having a booster if i'm having MDMA with it.


----------



## deano88

oh by the way its really really hard to get LSD where i live sothats not a option for me. going a bit off subject does anybody have there own nickname for AMT cuz AMT is a bit of a boring name and sounds shite, i like to call it nutty putty or spirals haha


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ Most people on BL stray from using nicknames, as they confuse people and we want to know what people are talking about. Sure AMT, 4-HO-MET, 5-MeO-MiPT, the 2C's etc, might sound boring, but it's the best way to keep track of so many different chemicals. Or we could call it Benzo Fury! I don't think many people on here respect branded gimmicks like that.

Or you could just name it by its IUPAC name:

2-(1H-indol-3-yl)-1-methyl-ethylamine

I'd say AMT is good


----------



## deano88

love_sex_desire said:


> ^ Most people on BL stray from using nicknames, as they confuse people and we want to know what people are talking about. Sure AMT, 4-HO-MET, 5-MeO-MiPT, the 2C's etc, might sound boring, but it's the best way to keep track of so many different chemicals. Or we could call it Benzo Fury! I don't think many people on here respect branded gimmicks like that.
> 
> Or you could just name it by its IUPAC name:
> 
> 2-(1H-indol-3-yl)-1-methyl-ethylamine
> 
> I'd say AMT is good



haha yeah of course i'd call it AMT on here but we have our own nicknames for it i was just seeing if anybody had any. i'll just call it nutty putty between me mates


----------



## jblz

I asked this in the UK aMT thread but will probably get more exposure here

Has any tried mixing aMT + MDAI? I've yet to try MDAI as the reports seem 'meh' but it could add a little something to the aMT.

If no ones tried mixing, for those who have tried both chems can you theorize what the effect may be?


----------



## psood0nym

> Has any tried mixing aMT + MDAI? I've yet to try MDAI as the reports seem 'meh' but it could add a little something to the aMT.
> 
> If no ones tried mixing, for those who have tried both chems can you theorize what the effect may be?


Yes. I posted about it somewhere in the MDAI thread and gave a small review.  Search for psood <zero> nym in that thread and you should find it.  The combo also included Adderall in an attempt to more closely mimic MDA's monoamine release profile.  It was pretty great.  I recommend it provided you take it slow the first time.  Serotonin syndrome is a possibility when doing novel combos of releasers.


----------



## rusk

howdy all...

For my 1st aMT experience....ive just plugged 25mg of it.

Im presuming thats ok with the grey powder stuff (is it HCl?)

Anyone know how long u should have to lie on your side for after doing the injection?


----------



## jblz

^ With no experience with the grey stuff or plugging, from reading on here: the grey stuff seems to be the more potent freebase, although you should be fine with 25mg, and lie on your side for about 10 mins.

EDIT: I think I may be wrong about grey = freebase. Just opened my HCl I received and its also grey. Last time it was tan, unless I've been sent freebase this time (was advertised as HCl)


----------



## rusk

cool cheers jb

its been about 45mins now.......cant wait!


----------



## rusk

although....i do feel like a dirty drug pig!


----------



## petebog

jblz said:


> ^ With no experience with the grey stuff or plugging, from reading on here: the grey stuff seems to be the more potent freebase, although you should be fine with 25mg, and lie on your side for about 10 mins.
> 
> EDIT: I think I may be wrong about grey = freebase. Just opened my HCl I received and its also grey. Last time it was tan, unless I've been sent freebase this time (was advertised as HCl)



'm 99.9% sure from what I've received and what I've read on here that hcl = grey, freebase = yellowish.


----------



## Myshkin

deano88 said:


> does anybody have there own nickname for AMT cuz AMT is a bit of a boring name and sounds shite, i like to call it nutty putty or spirals haha



Seriously, if that's the way you're approaching this substance then I really don't think it's for you...


----------



## rusk

so....its been about 2hr45min....and im not feeling much.

Hands are a bit sweaty......brains a bit mushed....but no real good effects

Shall i drop some more, or wait?!


----------



## Myshkin

*Wait!* For god's sake, wait!

Redosing is pretty pointless.

Did you empty your bowels before plugging?


----------



## rusk

Well 3hr45min....still nothing.

I tried emptying my bowels first.....but couldnt muster anything.

This is getting boring.


----------



## Myshkin

Ah, there's the problem. 

Plugging is really not advised unless you're _100%_ flushed in the bowel department. 

Unfortunately your AMT has been absorbed elsewhere, if you know what I mean...


----------



## rusk

Stop press.....somethings happenin.......


----------



## I NUK3D U

press stopped, now where's the update?


----------



## Delsyd

ctrl alt   trp bwlz


----------



## Myshkin

Delsyd said:


> ctrl alt   trp bwlz



My thoughts exactly. 

Reminds me of those acid first-timers who swear blind they're feeling nothing while all the time acting odder than _anybody_ else in the room.

I would've thought 25mg was a pretty substantial first dose (for plugging) too. I hope the guy / girl has a good time...


----------



## rusk

Sorry, i thought no-one was listening so i shut up

im still here guys.....not sure what that ctrl alt trp nonsense is all about though!

Somethings deffo happening, i cant stop smiling - not unlike mdma but with more visuals.

hard to explain. hands are like two slugs though....v.slimey


----------



## Delsyd

rusk said:


> Somethings deffo happening, i cant stop smiling - not unlike mdma but with more visuals.



sounds like aMT


----------



## rusk

So....like a true drug pig....about an hour or so back....i orally took about 10 or 15mg.

Seems to be working a lot better now.....visuals are getting stronger!

So far its pretty good stuff.


----------



## rusk

...bit of an update. Its hitting hard now.

I'd say it had MDMA qualities, most of the euphoria but without the stimulation,.......the visuals are cool too, very manageable. 

But for *sure* - its deffo not a club drug imho.  In fact, i wouldnt like to be on this anywhere else other than a home setting.

PS. Mods feel free to delete my posts if im rambling on a bit now


----------



## rusk

is anyone out there?!


----------



## the big sleep

Individual experiences with aMT can vary wildly. Personally, at lower doses I find it an excellent and manageable social drug. 

Glad to hear you're enjoying your aMT debut, though. And well played for grasping the nettle and plugging it.


----------



## rusk

cheers!

I'm digging the duration of it.....if this goes on for another 5 hours.....it will be epic!


----------



## rusk

im still ctrl-alt-trp bwlz!

I dropped at 10:45ish this morning, cant believe its still going strong! 

How much longer is this really gonna go on for ?! (not that i want it stop....the opposite)


----------



## rusk

comeon peeps....there isnt much activity in here tonight!

share in my good times


----------



## botfly

It lasts about a week for most people.


----------



## THCDunc

I took some 10 years ago and i'm still tripping. 

Nah never tried it myself (although plan on rectifying that in the next couple of days) but i've read it can last anywhere from 7-14 hours.


----------



## deano88

I disagree with some people saying its not a party drug, I think its a excellent drug for raves where everyones mashed but not so much for going up town to the clubs as its too hard to hide how fucked you are from bouncers/police

However I couldn't care a less about what other normal people think of me when i'm wrecked but some people do so each to there own.

As to the other guys question about aMT + mdai combo yeah I tried that last weekend how ever I also had 6-apb so couldn't really give m8 a accurate report of what reaction just those two drugs had by themselves but I was psycho as fuck but in a good way 

If you really want a mad night on this stuff start off with a 50mg bomb . 

By the way in the next couple of weeks i'll be getting some real good quality mdma i'll be planning on taking it about 4 to 5 hours into my 50mg aMT trip, i'm used to taking mdma in the past however its been 2 years since I last had it, i'm also used to taking aMT which I been caning a lot lately i'm just wondering what would be a good dose of mdma to take into my aMT trip? Has anyone out there ever had this combo and be kind enough to share their experience with me.

Thanks


----------



## Ghettofox

botfly said:


> It lasts about a week for most people.



Lol, imagine that! Took a 50mg  bomb 6.00pm saturday,had an awesome night (also thought I was the funniest guy in the world) and still had a glow the next day.In fact,twice I have tried AMT at around 50mg and both times the effects lasted 24 hours.Would also like to add,that usually my sat night consists of loads of Guinness,fags and a gram of coke.On AMT,didnt want to smoke as it wasn't all that .pleasant and drank about 5 pints all night.No desire for coke as I felt great and didn't get drunk.Mainly just to keep my mouth wet.So sunday,my lungs didn't feel and sound like a set of bagpipes and no hangover!Wish I found this years ago.
 My initial come up was pretty hard though.Was a  bit panicked at first as it started to feel too intense in a crowded beer garden.Slipped out for 5 down a lane made myself sick to quell the body load.This did the trick instantly.Not to be taken lightly but a thoroughly enjoyable experience.
 Stay safe.


----------



## YaniCZka

deano88 said:


> By the way in the next couple of weeks i'll be getting some real good quality mdma i'll be planning on taking it about 4 to 5 hours into my 50mg aMT trip, i'm used to taking mdma in the past however its been 2 years since I last had it, i'm also used to taking aMT which I been caning a lot lately i'm just wondering what would be a good dose of mdma to take into my aMT trip? Has anyone out there ever had this combo and be kind enough to share their experience with me.
> 
> Thanks



aMT has MAOI properties so it is not advised to use it together with mdma. although i personally would be very interested in it too (or combining with speed or mephedrone


----------



## Psychonautical

how fast do you scuttlebugs want to go.
lol... oh yes thats right, until the wheels come off.


----------



## Xorkoth

AMT's proposed MAOI properties are questionable... every drug that is broken down by MAO is an MAOI to some extent.  My belief is that AMT doesn't inhibit MAO much more if at all more than most other psychedelics.  But better to be safe than sorry.

For the record, there are reports of successful combinations of AMT and MDMA.  But I would never combine them, simply because they both release monoamines (AMT slowly releases serotonin, dopamine, and norepinephrine, and MDMA very quickly releases a shitload of serotonin).  Two releasers, especially when one is a potent and rapid releaser like MDMA, will deplete your monoamines very quickly and will probably leave you feeling quite drained and anxious/depressed for a while.

Most psychedelics are just agonists to their receptor sites, not releasers.  But AMT and MDMA are both releasers.


----------



## psood0nym

^Agreed.  You definitely don't want to be dancing on the combo since you'll probably overheat and do all sorts of damage that way.  If you're going to mix them keep both doses low to moderate and make sure you have access to air conditioning and water.

If I recall correctly hyperthermia is how most of the brain damage happens with these releasers.  It sucks because it makes you want to dance, but dancing gets you hot...  Maybe a late autumn festival would be the best for it.


----------



## love_sex_desire

How safe is it to drive on an anti-depressant dose of AMT, say 5-10 mg?

I know driving on any psychedelics is a bad idea, but I'm thinking of trying out an anti-depressant dose of AMT to see how it perks up the day. 

As I will be going about my daily routine, I may end up having to drive at some point.

Obviously I will ride it out and see how I'm feeling before ever considering getting behind the wheel, but I'm just wondering if driving is completely out of the question with a low dose of AMT.

I'm assuming when it was used as an antidepressant people prescribed AMT would have driven while using their regular dose, so I'm wondering if anyone has any experience driving while on 5-10 mg of AMT or if anyone who has tried an anti-depressant dose of AMT can shed light on how impaired they were on a low dose.


----------



## Xtc <3

If you dont have any tolerance then 10mg may cause some difficulties
I took 18mg yesterday and to my suprise I was rendered unable to drive.
Was completely unsure of where I was the whole night, everything looked so unfamiliar.
I would say take it, wait 4 hours and then work out if your capable or not.

Anyone else get really bad headaches coming down from this stuff and a lot of anxiety coming up?

Really loving this stuff after last nights experience though, a re-order is next on my shopping list


----------



## psood0nym

Cannabis helps take the edge off of the onset for me. I don't get headaches, but I imagine if you make a time line of your night and drink a cup of water with some aspirin and ibuprofen at the peak and down one more every hour until it's over you'll steer clear of the aches. Stretches and warm up exercises do wonders for vasoconstriction related pains even if they don't make you look cool.


----------



## Xorkoth

love_sex_desire said:


> How safe is it to drive on an anti-depressant dose of AMT, say 5-10 mg?
> 
> I know driving on any psychedelics is a bad idea, but I'm thinking of trying out an anti-depressant dose of AMT to see how it perks up the day.
> 
> As I will be going about my daily routine, I may end up having to drive at some point.
> 
> Obviously I will ride it out and see how I'm feeling before ever considering getting behind the wheel, but I'm just wondering if driving is completely out of the question with a low dose of AMT.
> 
> I'm assuming when it was used as an antidepressant people prescribed AMT would have driven while using their regular dose, so I'm wondering if anyone has any experience driving while on 5-10 mg of AMT or if anyone who has tried an anti-depressant dose of AMT can shed light on how impaired they were on a low dose.



5-10mg leaves me just feeling sparkly and nice, not intoxicated whatsoever.  Especially on the 5mg side.  Driving would be just fine, provided you make sure you're not feeling intoxicated at all first.



Xtc <3 said:


> If you dont have any tolerance then 10mg may cause some difficulties
> I took 18mg yesterday and to my suprise I was rendered unable to drive.
> Was completely unsure of where I was the whole night, everything looked so unfamiliar.
> I would say take it, wait 4 hours and then work out if your capable or not.



That's odd... it was THAT strong at 18mg?  I wouldn't even be high from 18mg, just kind of in an in-between state.  Either you have a very low natural tolerance or you got 5-MeO-AMT and thought it was the same thing as AMT (18mg of 5-MeO-AMT is definitely a very strong dose).


----------



## psood0nym

Yeah, low tolerance people seem to be coming out of everywhere since aMT took off in the UK.  I'm not sure if it's really low tolerance or if the vendors are mixing extra stuff into their aMT batches.  I wouldn't put it past them. People seem to be talking a lot about gray aMT this and smelly or not that.  I doubt superficialities like these make any difference except to the minds of the suggestible, but who knows.


----------



## Listening

psood0nym said:


> People seem to be talking a lot about gray aMT this and smelly or not that.  I doubt superficialities like these make any difference except to the minds of the suggestible, but who knows.



Well I don't think that's entirely true... It seems to be consistent that the freebase is extremely smelly (I've never smelled anything that potent; like DMT x 1000) and yellowish, and the HCL is not so smelly and gray, but perhaps that's not always the case...


----------



## Psychonautical

Alright straight up, i think the AMT you guys got in the U.K. right now is bunk.
The stuff i have is RANK of indole dimethyltryptamine smell.
it's not 5-meo-amt.

15mg orally, lays you out. for 7-12 hours
35-50mg orally lays you out for ALMOST 2 fucking days..

There is no genuine crash, just a heady euphoria that lasts for a few days afterwards.


----------



## Xorkoth

Hmm, weird Psychonautical.  I've for sure had real AMT and 15mg is not a full dose.  My regular dose was 40-60mg, and this was pure sparkly-white straight from the chemist.

Maybe you're extra sensitive naturally, though with the doses of other things you've written about I would be surprised.  I wonder if someone is mixing some 5-Me-AMT with AMT to make it stronger for less AMT, which requires the higher dose?  You're the second person in as many days I've heard mention such low doses of AMT, which is odd.


----------



## psood0nym

Listening said:


> Well I don't think that's entirely true... It seems to be consistent that the freebase is extremely smelly (I've never smelled anything that potent; like DMT x 1000) and yellowish, and the HCL is not so smelly and gray, but perhaps that's not always the case...


I've had both freebase and HCl, both white, that didn't smell. I've also had yellowish freebase aMT that did smell. There's no telling without tests.


----------



## Xorkoth

I had pure sparkly white AMT freebase once, the be4st I ever had, straight from a great chemist.  I needed about 10-15mg lower than with most other AMT I've had.  And this stuff smelled more than any other AMT I've had too... it smelled RANK, absolutely intense.  It would go through a plastic bottle with a tight screw top I had it in, after going through the double bag it was in inside the bottle.


----------



## love_sex_desire

I don't think the yellowish AMT from Canada is mixed with 5-MeO-AMT. I know people have done 35 mg and felt it was a very intense euphoria, but very little visuals. One friend described it as a very strong MDMA euphoria, but different. They don't have much experience with chems, so an extremely strong MDMA euphoria was the closest they could compare it to. I'm assuming if there was any signicant amount of 5-MeO-AMT mixed there would be significant visual activty at the 35 mg dose range.

I think it is simply more potent than they grey hydrochloride because it is freebase and there seem to be some people with low natural tolerances to this particular chem.


----------



## jebus

Psychonautical said:


> Alright straight up, i think the AMT you guys got in the U.K. right now is bunk.
> The stuff i have is RANK of indole dimethyltryptamine smell.
> it's not 5-meo-amt.
> 
> 15mg orally, lays you out. for 7-12 hours
> 35-50mg orally lays you out for ALMOST 2 fucking days..
> 
> There is no genuine crash, just a heady euphoria that lasts for a few days afterwards.



Haven't tried aMT yet, though intend to very soon, and so have been reading up quite a bit on dosages etc, and there is no doubt that yours seems _much_ more potent than any I've read about here or elsewhere.  This includes info going back years, and from right across the globe, so it's unlikely that there is simply low grade product in the UK at the moment.  

Everywhere seems to state 25-30mg as a fairly nice beginner dose with euphoria but not too much psychedelia and 50 and above for the sort of effects you are mentioning for 15mg, which has me a little worried.  Think I will have to take it extra slow when experimenting with this one in case it is a lot more potent than anticipated.


----------



## Xorkoth

Well okay, but it's only recently that the hydrochloride has been available... it's always been freebase other than that, and it just seems that recently a number of people have been reporting doses of like 15mg being extremely intense... the person here described it as "laid out".  That doesn't fit at all with reports of freebase all the way to pre-2000/2001.  I suppose both of these people could have really low natural tolerances, but that's such a low number that it seems unlikely, because I've never really heard of powerful doses that low before this.

35mg that you describe is a full dose and could certainly produce strong euphoria with the freebase, so that sounds normal.  I'm referring to the low dose claims with high activity.  Even 1mg of 5-MeO-AMT per 5mg of AMT could really ramp up the intensity of the AMT, without adding too much 5-MeO-AMT character to it, I would think.  I just wonder.

I have no idea if their stuff is from Canada though... could be any batch of AMT going around.


----------



## Xorkoth

Jebus... I've made several posts about this today, though they are in large part speculation.  But yes, those low dosages reported are highly unusual.  Of course when trying a new substance it is always a good idea to start very low to test for unusual reactions, so you should definitely start low when you experiment.


----------



## deano88

Xorkoth said:


> Well okay, but it's only recently that the hydrochloride has been available... it's always been freebase other than that, and it just seems that recently a number of people have been reporting doses of like 15mg being extremely intense... the person here described it as "laid out".  That doesn't fit at all with reports of freebase all the way to pre-2000/2001.  I suppose both of these people could have really low natural tolerances, but that's such a low number that it seems unlikely, because I've never really heard of powerful doses that low before this.
> 
> 35mg that you describe is a full dose and could certainly produce strong euphoria with the freebase, so that sounds normal.  I'm referring to the low dose claims with high activity.  Even 1mg of 5-MeO-AMT per 5mg of AMT could really ramp up the intensity of the AMT, without adding too much 5-MeO-AMT character to it, I would think.  I just wonder.
> 
> I have no idea if their stuff is from Canada though... could be any batch of AMT going around.



is 5-MeO-AMT legal and easily available in the uk?


----------



## Feste

Legal, yes. Readily available, no.

It's a bit horrible IMO.


----------



## Xorkoth

Not readily available to those who use resale vendors.  But it's available to anyone wanting to contact an asian chemical manufacturer and have them make a quantity.


----------



## jebus

Xorkoth said:


> Jebus... I've made several posts about this today, though they are in large part speculation.  But yes, those low dosages reported are highly unusual.  Of course when trying a new substance it is always a good idea to start very low to test for unusual reactions, so you should definitely start low when you experiment.



I'll definitely do that.


----------



## change-jug

Xorkoth said:


> Hmm, weird Psychonautical.  I've for sure had real AMT and 15mg is not a full dose.  My regular dose was 40-60mg, and this was pure sparkly-white straight from the chemist.
> 
> Maybe you're extra sensitive naturally, though with the doses of other things you've written about I would be surprised.  I wonder if someone is mixing some 5-Me-AMT with AMT to make it stronger for less AMT, which requires the higher dose?  You're the second person in as many days I've heard mention such low doses of AMT, which is odd.



Turns out me and Psychonautical have the same source. I have yet to try mine but I may lower the dose just to be careful. I hope it`s not adulterated with 5-meo-amt. It may just be that he is sensitive. I`ll report back when I get my scale and measure out and drop my dose. I want to try it out now so bad but with out a way to measure properly I just don`t want to risk it. Plus,without weighing we won`t have any added insight to how my dose effects me. One more thing. I want to plug it to avoid any upset stomach issues. Do I need to turn it into the hcl first or can I just plug it in a solution of say,propylene glycol instead of water? Would that help dissolve it?


----------



## Feste

Xorkoth said:


> Not readily available to those who use resale vendors.  But it's available to anyone wanting to contact an asian chemical manufacturer and have them make a quantity.



True, true.


----------



## deano88

Xorkoth said:


> Not readily available to those who use resale vendors.  But it's available to anyone wanting to contact an asian chemical manufacturer and have them make a quantity.



ah right i see thanks.

why is it horribal?


----------



## 33Hz

Xtc <3 said:


> Anyone else get really bad headaches coming down from this stuff and a lot of anxiety coming up?



I got a migraine for most of the following day. 

So is the AMT in the UK being cut or what? My first dose was 30mg and I could have deffo gone higher than that.


----------



## Xorkoth

change-jug said:


> Turns out me and Psychonautical have the same source. I have yet to try mine but I may lower the dose just to be careful. I hope it`s not adulterated with 5-meo-amt. It may just be that he is sensitive. I`ll report back when I get my scale and measure out and drop my dose. I want to try it out now so bad but with out a way to measure properly I just don`t want to risk it. Plus,without weighing we won`t have any added insight to how my dose effects me. One more thing. I want to plug it to avoid any upset stomach issues. Do I need to turn it into the hcl first or can I just plug it in a solution of say,propylene glycol instead of water? Would that help dissolve it?



Yes, both of those will work.  You can also just put your dose of freebase dry into a gel cap and insert the gel cap.  Though the other methods are a bit faster to absorb.


----------



## jebus

change-jug said:


> Turns out me and Psychonautical have the same source. I have yet to try mine but I may lower the dose just to be careful. I hope it`s not adulterated with 5-meo-amt. It may just be that he is sensitive. I`ll report back when I get my scale and measure out and drop my dose. I want to try it out now so bad but with out a way to measure properly I just don`t want to risk it. Plus,without weighing we won`t have any added insight to how my dose effects me. One more thing. I want to plug it to avoid any upset stomach issues. Do I need to turn it into the hcl first or can I just plug it in a solution of say,propylene glycol instead of water? Would that help dissolve it?



Not sure about propylene glycol, or perhaps even ethanol might work, but I've read that you can dissolve the base form using ethanoic acid (white vinegar) which will give you the acetate salt in situ (and should be easier than converting to hcl), which is apparently fine for plugging.


----------



## Xorkoth

5-MeO-AMT is horrible because it's much rougher on the body than AMT and just feels roxic to most people.  I found it confusing and uncomfortable.  It also tends to cause lots of nausea and diarrhea.

33Hz: 30mg is definitely a full AMT dose but it's on the low side.  40-50mg is my ideal dose without tolerance.  These low doses being reported are highly unusual even for pure AMT... they're not the norm by any means.


----------



## Xorkoth

jebus said:


> Not sure about propylene glycol, or perhaps even ethanol might work, but I've read that you can dissolve the base form using ethanoic acid (white vinegar) which will give you the acetate salt in situ (and should be easier than converting to hcl), which is apparently fine for plugging.



Vinegar is acetic acid, not ethanoic acid (hence the acetate salt yield).


----------



## jebus

Xorkoth said:


> Vinegar is acetic acid, not ethanoic acid (hence the acetate salt yield).



Same thing I think, I just know learnt to rhyme them off in school meth, eth, prop, but, pent etc so always just extent eth to ethanol and ethanoic acid, but yeah same thing at the end of the day.

EDIT

I think acetic acid is like the more modern word, and more commonly used though you are right.


----------



## 33Hz

Xorkoth said:


> 33Hz: 30mg is definitely a full AMT dose but it's on the low side.  40-50mg is my ideal dose without tolerance.  These low doses being reported are highly unusual even for pure AMT... they're not the norm by any means.



Yeah, don't get me wrong, 30mg got me pretty messed up, but I didn't feel out of my depth. Will be trying 40mg soon, hopefully this will give me some stronger visuals.


----------



## love_sex_desire

I've got to dispell any speculation about the Canadian AMT being cut with 5-MeO-AMT. This chem is simply very unpredictable. I am certain that I have the same AMT as Psychonautical and I have tried 5-MeO-AMT and I would be able to tell if there was any of that toxic shit mixed in. 

I tried an anti-depressant dose of 8 mg today and I'm barely feeling anything. Slightly perked but that's all. Maybe if I had depression I would notice it more. Meanwhile Psychonautical reports that 15 mg had him laid out. It's very interesting how people are reporting such different effects, but it all boils down to how unpredictable this chem is.

I repeat THERE IS NO 5-MEO-AMT IN THE YELLOW FREEBASE BATCH!

But as always, everyone should start low.


----------



## Psychonautical

thats right i mean thats what i'm saying.

Everyone is different, there are SOOO MANY trip reports on erowid of difficult experiences that were first times that are all pretty much involved in taking doses of 30mg and higher the first time.

I hadn't touched a drug, other than marijuana for 2 months, because i got into an accident and almost died. I was more depressed than usual.

So i think the shift in conciousness to feel more like myself was something that was going to happen no matter that drug i would have taken.

I think what i experienced on 15mg was a weak plus ++++
if thats possible, it basically just made me realize its AWESOME to be alive, and i'm not dying or was ever going to die from my injuries.


now 30mg for me besides lasting a ridiculously LONG TIME is awesome.

i think this drug is one of those drugs that is HIGHLY dictated by ones own personality


----------



## psood0nym

^That's an interesting assessment.  I have a friend who at the time weighed between 250 and 300 pounds, get floored by 60 mg of aMT. I recommend 60 mg  of the freebase to most people as a dose for full effects, so I was surprised to see my large friend totally immersed in visuals that kept rhythm with the music we were blaring (he had me turn the volume up really high to Modest Mouse's "The View" 3 to 5 times over and over as he rolled around on my parent's basement floor laughing manically.)  I love the guy but there's no doubt he's a little dim upstairs.  I'm not one to judge people by how they react idiosyncratically to chemicals but the fact that he sort of freaked out does maybe say something about using aMT as a metric for character measurement.


----------



## love_sex_desire

The fact that Psychonautical was experiencing depression makes it much more understandable that Psychonautical experienced stronger effects from such a low dose.

Like I mentioned earlier today, I took an 8 mg "anti-depressant" dose and felt a slight perk, but it felt like that dose would have been more noticeable if I was experiencing depression myself. 

This chem is very unpredictable:

- Some people get strong effects from low doses, other get few effects from larger doses. 

- Some experience LSD like visuals, others experience slight mescaline-esque glowing and brightness. 

- Some people get massive euphoria and others find it more stimulating. Some people actually find it sedating!

And beyond that, some people find AMT to feel very dirty with nasty side effects and a toxic stimulation, while others find it feels sublime and euphoric.

But overall it seems most people like this chem, myself included :D

And although it is not recommended to combine MDxx with AMT, although I think the contraindication is a little exaggerated, mixing smoked AMT with MDA has been the best combo I've experienced, better than candyflipping in my opinion!


----------



## Chemical Wizard

I just got back from shambhala music festival, and did 25 mgs of AMT alongside 2 mushrooms chocoloates each purchased from seperate vendors, and then I ate maybe 7 grams or so of my own homegrown mushrooms.

WHOOOOA. That's all I have to say.  And also, I have to say, that it's absolutely insane how many psychedelic drugs you can do at a psychedelic music festival.  I had such an amazing time.  again.

Anyways, the shrooms and AMT combo is VERY intense.  Not for the faint of heart.  It was a spiritually gut wrenchingly difficult, but amazingly rewarding and beautiful time.  Visuals were out of this world at times....impossible to act normally.  What else is there to say....i was too mashed to really offer any good advice other than, AMT combines with mushrooms quite nicely.  I've done the AMT mushrooms combo twice now, and this time at shambhala was by far on of the most crazy trips I have ever had.


----------



## deano88

love_sex_desire said:


> The fact that Psychonautical was experiencing depression makes it much more understandable that Psychonautical experienced stronger effects from such a low dose.
> 
> Like I mentioned earlier today, I took an 8 mg "anti-depressant" dose and felt a slight perk, but it felt like that dose would have been more noticeable if I was experiencing depression myself.
> 
> This chem is very unpredictable:
> 
> - Some people get strong effects from low doses, other get few effects from larger doses.
> 
> - Some experience LSD like visuals, others experience slight mescaline-esque glowing and brightness.
> 
> - Some people get massive euphoria and others find it more stimulating. Some people actually find it sedating!
> 
> And beyond that, some people find AMT to feel very dirty with nasty side effects and a toxic stimulation, while others find it feels sublime and euphoric.
> 
> But overall it seems most people like this chem, myself included :D
> 
> And although it is not recommended to combine MDxx with AMT, although I think the contraindication is a little exaggerated, mixing smoked AMT with MDA has been the best combo I've experienced, better than candyflipping in my opinion!



I've found every AMT trip I had has been different in some way to the last I pretty always seem to have a different trip thats what I like about it. Its by far my fav drug lately. Cant wait to try it combined with mdma and when mushroom season comes i'll be combining with that too.


----------



## I NUK3D U

Those who are interested in the grey-ish HCL available in the UK at the moment (and the purity/potency thereof) should check out the AMT thread in EADD.


----------



## psood0nym

psood0nym said:


> ^That's an interesting assessment.  I have a friend who at the time weighed between 250 and 300 pounds, get floored by 60 mg of aMT. I recommend 60 mg  of the freebase to most people as a dose for full effects, so I was surprised to see my large friend totally immersed in visuals that kept rhythm with the music we were blaring (he had me turn the volume up really high to Modest Mouse's "The View" 3 to 5 times over and over as he rolled around on my parent's basement floor laughing manically.)  I love the guy but there's no doubt he's a little dim upstairs.  I'm not one to judge people by how they react idiosyncratically to chemicals but the fact that he sort of freaked out does maybe say something about using aMT as a metric for character measurement.



EDIT: I don't mean to imply that if someone has difficulties with aMT at lower dosages they're stupid (reading it now it does sort of seam that way - was feeling almost unbearably  euphoric on plugged full spectrum maeng da kratom, DXM and ondansetron when I wrote that). I only intended to note an amusing coincidence.


----------



## stanleyK

I don't see much experience mixing amt with lsd or mushrooms.
It's probably safe but does anyone have an experience to share about it?


----------



## Jesusgreen

stanleyK said:


> I don't see much experience mixing amt with lsd or mushrooms.
> It's probably safe but does anyone have an experience to share about it?



aMT is a mild MAOI - which shouldn't cause any problems but might make the trip additionally intense. There could be some vasoconstriction problems, but other than that they should be safe to combine. Just start low and work your way up as with any combinations.


----------



## th3 s1aught3r

As aMT is a psychedelic, would you describe it effects closer to LSD and Shrooms, than it would be to MDMA or MDA  ??


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ Depends on doseage and personal reaction. Many people find the euphoria to be similar to MDMA with a tryptamine buzz, although people have reported full blown LSD visuals at higher doses (80mg+). AMT is similar to MDA in my opinion, but definitely feels like a tryptamine, and combining the 2 is excellent :D


----------



## Xtc <3

Right maybe I should clarify, the batch of AMT I dosed 18mg of was very smelly and was white/yellow. 

I also smoked a little bit of cannabis, maybe 5 or 6 tokes on a joint which is nothing considering I smoke bongs almost daily, although granted it did have an effect.

I wasn't that messed up from the stuff, it was alot stronger than I anticipated though and would have made driving very difficult.
All the roads getting a lift home looked so unfamiliar and I couldn't work out which roads connected which, visual activity overall though was pretty minimal.

A strong MDMA like euphoria was felt though once back home and lying in bed, took a baloon of nitrous and it was incredible, definately a combo I would recommend.

It should also be noted that I was rather depressed at the time of taking it, and havn't been since the experience or during it.

I have taken in the past much higher doses of this drug from the same batch, ranging from 30-80mg and I can say that the visual's really are quite astounding when you up the dosage, however the 18mg was my most euphoric experience with it so far.


----------



## THCDunc

I should be trying AMT HCl for the first time tomorrow. I then plan on taking it with me to a festival next week. I know people always say AMT is a weak MAOI but just how weak are we talking? If I were to take some MDMA and other psychs would it just increase the effects somewhat or would I be in trouble?


----------



## change-jug

Any one have any tips on smoking it? Can I just use some tin foil and a straw? I know that I should use a indirect flame so that I don`t burn it but that`s the extent of my knowledge.


----------



## Listening

change-jug said:


> Any one have any tips on smoking it? Can I just use some tin foil and a straw? I know that I should use a indirect flame so that I don`t burn it but that`s the extent of my knowledge.



Tin foil and a straw has been said to work well from experienced users. When I tried it myself I found it difficult, but that's just me.

At noon today I vaporized 20mg of the smelly Canadian freebase in my glass Vapor Genie (which worked effortlessly for vaporizing this chemical). I find it interesting that others have indicated very potent effects, to me this was very light. This is my third try at vaporizing this AMT, and the results were pretty consistent. 20mg vaporized was a solid ++ but no higher (and I'm including some weed to help it along). Am I just a hard-head for this stuff? Seems like it should have had a stronger effect.


----------



## tragiclemming

THCDunc said:


> I should be trying AMT HCl for the first time tomorrow. I then plan on taking it with me to a festival next week. I know people always say AMT is a weak MAOI but just how weak are we talking? If I were to take some MDMA and other psychs would it just increase the effects somewhat or would I be in trouble?


I take MDMA towards the end of the aMT trip and find it highly rewarding


----------



## deano88

THCDunc said:


> I should be trying AMT HCl for the first time tomorrow. I then plan on taking it with me to a festival next week. I know people always say AMT is a weak MAOI but just how weak are we talking? If I were to take some MDMA and other psychs would it just increase the effects somewhat or would I be in trouble?



It comes in waves, there are times where I was getting up dancing like a nutter with loads of energy then there was times I was floored and liked to sit or lie down tripping out but music always sounds ace on this stuff so I would defo call it festival material.

I'm not sure what its like combined with mdma but i'll be doing that combo next weekend so youl find out by then :D


----------



## deano88

tragiclemming said:


> I take MDMA towards the end of the aMT trip and find it highly rewarding



How far into your AMT trip do you take mdma and how much mg of mdma do you drop? 

I'm thinking of dropping 100mg of mdma about 5 hours into the 50mg aMT trip.


----------



## ugh1979

th3 s1aught3r said:


> As aMT is a psychedelic, would you describe it effects closer to LSD and Shrooms, than it would be to MDMA or MDA  ??



For me personally, 50mg doses are pretty MDMA like and nothing like LSD/shrooms.


----------



## deano88

ugh1979 said:


> For me personally, 50mg doses are pretty MDMA like and nothing like LSD/shrooms.



its a bit like shrooms at high doses but not as visual but still nice especialy if mixed with weed.


----------



## ugh1979

deano88 said:


> its a bit like shrooms at high doses but not as visual but still nice especialy if mixed with weed.



I think I need to try some high doses from the off to get any psychedelic effect off aMT I think.  I've always stuck with 50/60mg, and redosed at that amount over the course of the day(s), and there's never much to report psychedelic wise.  Had 100mg doses a couple of times but those were re-doses 24-36 hours after the initial dose and again, nothing much to report psychedelic wise.  Tried smoking weed many a time as well while on it but it doesn't seem to do anything for me.

I'll try a 100mg initial dose at some suitable time and see if it makes a difference.

These experiences are all with a current UK vendors grey HCL.


----------



## deano88

ugh1979 said:


> I think I need to try some high doses from the off to get any psychedelic effect off aMT I think.  I've always stuck with 50/60mg, and redosed at that amount over the course of the day(s), and there's never much to report psychedelic wise.  Had 100mg doses a couple of times but those were re-doses 24-36 hours after the initial dose and again, nothing much to report psychedelic wise.  Tried smoking weed many a time as well while on it but it doesn't seem to do anything for me.
> 
> I'll try a 100mg initial dose at some suitable time and see if it makes a difference.
> 
> These experiences are all with a current UK vendors grey HCL.



100mg?? your telling me you get hardley anything visual wise not even breathing walls or carpets etc? thats crazy


----------



## ugh1979

deano88 said:


> 100mg?? your telling me you get hardley anything visual wise not even breathing walls or carpets etc? thats crazy



Not off the 50/60mg doses i've been taking no.  Very very mildly occasionally, once i've redosed once or twice, but nothing remotely close to LSD or even shrooms.

Also, I'm beginning to think my tolerance for aMT is going up.  Last weekend I had about 800mg between Friday night and Sunday night and while I was at a nice level of euphoria throughout, it was a bit less than it had been in weekends before.  I'd been on aMT for the entire 3 weekends prior to that as well (I don't take anything during the week), so maybe that was enough to build up tolerance.

I'm going to give it a break for a couple of weeks and see if it makes a difference, but then return with a higher initial dose to try and get a psychedelic element rather than just the euphoria I always get.


----------



## deano88

ugh1979 said:


> Not off the 50/60mg doses i've been taking no.  Very very mildly occasionally, once i've redosed once or twice, but nothing remotely close to LSD or even shrooms.
> 
> Also, I'm beginning to think my tolerance for aMT is going up.  Last weekend I had about 800mg between Friday night and Sunday night and while I was at a nice level of euphoria throughout, it was a bit less than it had been in weekends before.  I'd been on aMT for the entire 3 weekends prior to that as well (I don't take anything during the week), so maybe that was enough to build up tolerance.
> 
> I'm going to give it a break for a couple of weeks and see if it makes a difference, but then return with a higher initial dose to try and get a psychedelic element rather than just the euphoria I always get.



true. yeah the last 3 weekends bar this one just gone i been doing it and having more every week but nowhere near the doses you mentioned maybe about 100mg in total over the weekend starting at 50mg but i been mixing with other drugs too like last week i had a pill of 6-apb plus asnorted some mdai so maybe explains why i felt more effects.

had a break this week as i'm getting some mdma so will combine with that to get a nice buzz and as i not had mdma in 2 years i should be pretty spangled.

dunno what it is about amt but its really morish in the sense that every weekend i want to do it just lately but don't want to build tolerence up too much so willhave breaks.


----------



## ugh1979

deano88 said:


> dunno what it is about amt but its really morish in the sense that every weekend i want to do it just lately but don't want to build tolerence up too much so willhave breaks.



Yeah it is, but anything that makes me feel good is moreish.   What I find really good about aMT re-dosing is though is that I don't need to keep upping the dose.  I'll feel just as great after 1x 50mg dose on a Friday evening as I do come Sunday night when I'm on my 14th 50mg redose or whatever.  The time between dosing stays pretty much the same as well which is good.  ~4hrs.  I do get pretty damn tired come the end of a 50+ hour stint on it due to the lack of amphetamine side to it but that suits me, as when I want, I can then sleep for 36 hours and wake up feeling great.

The same can not be said for MDMA in my experience!

I'm at the experimental stage with aMT at the moment and have seen it's long lasting euphoric recreational effects, so next I want to see it's psychedelic side if possible, and see how it is in very low mood enhancing doses for non party scenarios.

A very nice side effect for me is that since I started taking aMT my creativity has been given a big boost.  I'm a creative person anyway but often very lazy with it so it's been great to have something giving me the kick I need to be productive.  And not just while UTI.  The creative kick lasts all week.


----------



## deano88

ugh1979 said:


> Yeah it is, but anything that makes me feel good is moreish.   What I find really good about aMT re-dosing is though is that I don't need to keep upping the dose.  I'll feel just as great after 1x 50mg dose on a Friday evening as I do come Sunday night when I'm on my 14th 50mg redose or whatever.  The time between dosing stays pretty much the same as well which is good.  ~4hrs.  I do get pretty damn tired come the end of a 50+ hour stint on it due to the lack of amphetamine side to it but that suits me, as when I want, I can then sleep for 36 hours and wake up feeling great.
> 
> The same can not be said for MDMA in my experience!
> 
> I'm at the experimental stage with aMT at the moment and have seen it's long lasting euphoric recreational effects, so next I want to see it's psychedelic side if possible, and see how it is in very low mood enhancing doses for non party scenarios.
> 
> A very nice side effect for me is that since I started taking aMT my creativity has been given a big boost.  I'm a creative person anyway but often very lazy with it so it's been great to have something giving me the kick I need to be productive.  And not just while UTI.  The creative kick lasts all week.



yeah its strange i been happier lately since i been taking it every weekend, i even enjoy the comedown its not a feel like shit hide from the world comedown that phet or mdma gives you. despite all this i don't crave it either its just the perfect drug


----------



## Listening

Listening said:


> At noon today I vaporized 20mg of the smelly Canadian freebase in my glass Vapor Genie (which worked effortlessly for vaporizing this chemical). I find it interesting that others have indicated very potent effects, to me this was very light. This is my third try at vaporizing this AMT, and the results were pretty consistent. 20mg vaporized was a solid ++ but no higher (and I'm including some weed to help it along). Am I just a hard-head for this stuff? Seems like it should have had a stronger effect.



Just to follow up my own post the next day. I'm thinking that maybe it was as strong as it should have been, but at 20mg vaped, I don't experience any psychedelic effects (which jibes with what another poster said above if I assume 20mg vaped = 40mg oral?). However, I also didn't experience much "euphoria" as such. Instead, it felt like a mental stimulant. I was sharp and deep and creative thoughts came easily to me, and I connected to music readily and with great emotion.

Stimulation lasted about ~14 hours at which point I fell asleep. Pot smoked throughout and actually the craziest parts of my trip were listening to music after smoking a lot of pot at the 11 hour mark. Go figure. Woke up this morning still slightly activated, but at least I slept through it.

I think this drug can be dangerous in the same way that other stimulants are dangerous, but that's just my feeling and obviously I don't have the experience of the regular users here... It doesn't feel physically benign to me at all. I'm by no means a mess today, but I wouldn't want to do this stuff on a regular basis, or lightly.


----------



## tragiclemming

deano88 said:


> How far into your AMT trip do you take mdma and how much mg of mdma do you drop?
> 
> I'm thinking of dropping 100mg of mdma about 5 hours into the 50mg aMT trip.


Usually at the end when I feel myself coming down from the aMT. Last time was 50mg aMT and then after approx 9/10 hours I dropped 150mg MDMA. Blew me away 

I wouldn't drop the MDMA so soon into the aMT trip as I find the aMT comes in waves and some of those are quite large ones! I felt no need to dose more aMT or mix with anything else (except a few beers and some weed). Personally, I would dose more aMT if I wanted a more 'intense' experience rather than mix with the MDMA.

For me, the MDMA really kicks hard at the end of the aMT trip. I had the biggest eye and jaw wobbles ever and it felt grrrrrrrrreat


----------



## deano88

Listening said:


> Just to follow up my own post the next day. I'm thinking that maybe it was as strong as it should have been, but at 20mg vaped, I don't experience any psychedelic effects (which jibes with what another poster said above if I assume 20mg vaped = 40mg oral?). However, I also didn't experience much "euphoria" as such. Instead, it felt like a mental stimulant. I was sharp and deep and creative thoughts came easily to me, and I connected to music readily and with great emotion.
> 
> Stimulation lasted about ~14 hours at which point I fell asleep. Pot smoked throughout and actually the craziest parts of my trip were listening to music after smoking a lot of pot at the 11 hour mark. Go figure. Woke up this morning still slightly activated, but at least I slept through it.
> 
> I think this drug can be dangerous in the same way that other stimulants are dangerous, but that's just my feeling and obviously I don't have the experience of the regular users here... It doesn't feel physically benign to me at all. I'm by no means a mess today, *but I wouldn't want to do this stuff on a regular basis, or lightly*.



i said that after my first time trying it but then after my second session i loved it even more and it just gets better every week for me but i have to do it with friends around and with lous=d music it makes a big difference to just sitting at home on your own.


----------



## Listening

deano88 said:


> i said that after my first time trying it but then after my second session i loved it even more and it just gets better every week for me but i have to do it *with friends around and with lous=d music it makes a big difference to just sitting at home on your own*.



I hear you, but just for the record, I spent half of the duration doing a bit of woodworking (not recommended as my hands were too shaky, but it worked out perfectly since I took my time). The other half was spent with my wife and listening to loud music (The Suburbs, uninterrupted from beginning to end, was epic).

Another thing that I forgot to mention is that I couldn't eat dinner that night and didn't eat much at all the entire day. No appetite.


----------



## deano88

Listening said:


> I hear you, but just for the record, I spent half of the duration doing a bit of woodworking (not recommended as my hands were too shaky, but it worked out perfectly since I took my time). The other half was spent with my wife and listening to loud music (The Suburbs, uninterrupted from beginning to end, was epic).
> 
> Another thing that I forgot to mention is that I couldn't eat dinner that night and didn't eat much at all the entire day. No appetite.



strange thing is there are times when i do actually feel hungry on it and have eaten before but its usaully things like jaffa cakes, ceriel or noodles. didn't eat last week tho as i mixed it with other stims.

i find the simplest things exiting on amt its like being a little kid again wanting to explore everything and finding everything amusing and interesting tv is just pointless and confusing on this stuff.


----------



## ugh1979

What's are peoples experiences with having DMT during an aMT trip?

I get zero hallucinogenic effect from aMT so a short DMT trip might sit every nicely along with aMTs euphoric quality.

The DMT in question id take is a Pharmahuasca.


----------



## psood0nym

ugh1979 said:


> What's are peoples experiences with having DMT during an aMT trip?
> 
> I get zero hallucinogenic effect from aMT so a short DMT trip might sit every nicely along with aMTs euphoric quality.
> 
> The DMT in question id take is a Pharmahuasca.


Don't take any MAO inhibiting "pharmahuasca" DMT preparations in combination with aMT.  Because aMT releases large amounts of monoamines, inhibiting an enzyme that mitigates their levels would be a disaster - like serotonin syndrome puking and shitting yourself in an unrelenting hyperthermic fever delirium until you die in a sweaty heap of convulsing human stew disastrous.


----------



## .tOobi.

hello bluelighters

is it safe to combine aMT with phenibut?

like 30mg aMT up where the sun dosnt shine
and 1200mg phenibut down the throat?

thanks very much for your answers!

swirls from sunny switzerland


----------



## uncle stinky

ugh1979 said:


> What's are peoples experiences with having DMT during an aMT trip?
> 
> I get zero hallucinogenic effect from aMT so a short DMT trip might sit every nicely along with aMTs euphoric quality.
> 
> The DMT in question id take is a Pharmahuasca.



I have often used a small/medium amount of AMT with smoked DMT and it's very fine indeed. Doesn't make the main hit any stronger but seems to let the return phase stretch out a bit. In addition it puts you in a positive frame of mind before you start, which might help with any fear, if you are that way inclined with psychedelics. 

To reiterate from above, avoid the MAOIs, just smoke it. After learning to love the effects you can develop a Pavlovian learned flavour reaction, oddly enough I enjoy the taste now.

Probably it wont matter soon anyway. I've spotted it creeping into a couple of the mainstream RC sites. That's going to more or less make it certain to be "temporarily" banned when the Autumn law hits the books.

Could be even quicker if one of the more lackwitted vendors sells the 5-MEO version and someone dies.


----------



## Xorkoth

.tOobi. said:


> hello bluelighters
> 
> is it safe to combine aMT with phenibut?
> 
> like 30mg aMT up where the sun dosnt shine
> and 1200mg phenibut down the throat?
> 
> thanks very much for your answers!
> 
> swirls from sunny switzerland



Absolutely - great combo.


----------



## InternetMuse

Quick question, speaking of combos.  How does it go with benzos such as clonazepam?  Talking low doses here (1 - 2mg), will it be counterproductive during the peak/high?  Save for the tail end when sleep is needed?


----------



## Xorkoth

It will be some degree of counterproductive, yes.  I'd save it until the tail end.   If you're panicking or something they can be good (though it's best to work through it on your own for maximum benefit), but I would never *plan* to take benzos with a psychedelic.


----------



## MagickalKat777

I'm amazed there is still talk about this drug. It still remains my favorite of all time. So unfortunate that it is not available anymore - the DEA emergency schedules and then fully schedules aMT yet TFMPP and BZP are readily available. *sigh*

Last time I tried ordering aMT, I got 5-MeO-AMT instead... talk about a disaster.


And I still think that aMT is the most potent and longest-lasting antidepressant in existence. I wish I would have been more frugal with my supply - but I had no idea about the emergency scheduling until it was too late.


----------



## Delsyd

The good ones dont disappear.

also The US is one of the few states where it is illegal.


----------



## Xorkoth

Hey MagicalKat.   Haven't seen you for quite some time.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Xorkoth said:


> Hey MagicalKat.   Haven't seen you for quite some time.



Yeah its been quite awhile LOL. You know how it is - life and such. lol


----------



## MagickalKat777

Delsyd said:


> The good ones dont disappear.
> 
> also The US is one of the few states where it is illegal.



Well I'm in the US unfortunately and I haven't even heard of availability outside the US so people must be very hush hush about its existence.


----------



## seejay33

Amt arrived this morning hoping to try tomorrow or Sunday...
Grey hcl 
First time trying experienced in mdxx and sampled apb samples...
What is suggested dosage and what are expected effects, I know about duration..

Thanks
Seejay


----------



## Ben So Furry

Had a 60mg dose of the grey, clumpy, stinky amt hcl the other night and fell in love with the substance, felt like two different experiences one after the other, very gentle, extremely lovely.

Getting some freebase soon, are there any differences in strength of dose between hcl and freebase?  Is the freebase ok for plugging with a needle-less syringe?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Unless you are 100% positive that you have pure aMT, start off with low doses of 10mg or even 5mg to make sure it isn't something else.

Once you have established that, generally a good dose of aMT is 20-30mg.

If you want a really intense experience, 60mg - but I don't recommend that the first time, especially since I've seen people get absolutely smacked against the wall on 30mg while others took 40, 50, and 60 and didn't get as smacked around.

I don't recommend doses above 60... body load increases exponentially with higher doses and really the trip just gets extended in duration rather than getting more intense. It gets to a point where the intensity of the drug hits a wall.

As for the effects - for me, and some others that I know, it feels like a very strong candyflip with less body load than a candyflip would normally produce. Some say it acts like LSD. Others say it has more MDXX quality... Everyone experiences it differently and it is once again, dose dependent.

Just start out small and work your way up. It can be a very pleasurable chemical but it can also be a total nightmare if you don't know what you're doing.

Oh and I *HIGHLY* recommend that you do not mix it with ANY other drugs - I've seen some aMT trips that were +4 quickly turn into a really nasty experience even just by smoking pot or drinking a beer.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Ben So Furry said:


> Had a 60mg dose of the grey, clumpy, stinky amt hcl the other night and fell in love with the substance, felt like two different experiences one after the other, very gentle, extremely lovely.
> 
> Getting some freebase soon, are there any differences in strength of dose between hcl and freebase?  Is the freebase ok for plugging with a needle-less syringe?



That sounds like a rather low-key experience for such a high dose... 60mg of aMT is anything but gentle... Have you consumed other tryptamines recently?

The freebase in my experience is negligible in dose differences but it decomposes fairly quickly. As for plugging, that is the only route I never tried with aMT.


----------



## seejay33

Thanks for the advice cos its my first time I probably will go with 10 mg an see what happens...

Seejay 





MagickalKat777 said:


> Unless you are 100% positive that you have pure aMT, start off with low doses of 10mg or even 5mg to make sure it isn't something else.
> 
> Once you have established that, generally a good dose of aMT is 20-30mg.
> 
> If you want a really intense experience, 60mg - but I don't recommend that the first time, especially since I've seen people get absolutely smacked against the wall on 30mg while others took 40, 50, and 60 and didn't get as smacked around.
> 
> I don't recommend doses above 60... body load increases exponentially with higher doses and really the trip just gets extended in duration rather than getting more intense. It gets to a point where the intensity of the drug hits a wall.
> 
> As for the effects - for me, and some others that I know, it feels like a very strong candyflip with less body load than a candyflip would normally produce. Some say it acts like LSD. Others say it has more MDXX quality... Everyone experiences it differently and it is once again, dose dependent.
> 
> Just start out small and work your way up. It can be a very pleasurable chemical but it can also be a total nightmare if you don't know what you're doing.
> 
> Oh and I *HIGHLY* recommend that you do not mix it with ANY other drugs - I've seen some aMT trips that were +4 quickly turn into a really nasty experience even just by smoking pot or drinking a beer.


----------



## Ben So Furry

MagickalKat777 said:


> That sounds like a rather low-key experience for such a high dose... 60mg of aMT is anything but gentle... Have you consumed other tryptamines recently?
> 
> The freebase in my experience is negligible in dose differences but it decomposes fairly quickly. As for plugging, that is the only route I never tried with aMT.




What I meant was it felt controllable, I was out of it but it wasn't intense to the extent that I was freaking out because I felt like I was losing control or couldn't walk etc. It's possible because of the state of the UK market that it wasn't pure, I'd plugged 20mg a day or two earlier and only felt a nice soft pleasant glow for the whole day, no visuals but a really good tingly feeling all day.

Thanks for the info on the freebase when you say it decomposes quickly what time scale are we looking at if from date of manufacture? Days? Weeks?


----------



## seejay33

Would u say a couple of sleeping aids after about 10-12 hrs in should induce sleep ? 

Seejay


----------



## ugh1979

seejay33 said:


> Would u say a couple of sleeping aids after about 10-12 hrs in should induce sleep ?
> 
> Seejay



You should easily be able to sleep normally after that time.

I only need to take sleep aids post aMT if the time is much shorter.  ie >6 hours.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Ben So Furry said:


> What I meant was it felt controllable, I was out of it but it wasn't intense to the extent that I was freaking out because I felt like I was losing control or couldn't walk etc. It's possible because of the state of the UK market that it wasn't pure, I'd plugged 20mg a day or two earlier and only felt a nice soft pleasant glow for the whole day, no visuals but a really good tingly feeling all day.
> 
> Thanks for the info on the freebase when you say it decomposes quickly what time scale are we looking at if from date of manufacture? Days? Weeks?



Well I never really built a tolerance to the stuff but 60mg of either form would have whooped my ass  Everything around me would have been flowing, I would be able to smell and taste music, and I would be pigging out on food because of how heightened my taste buds would have been - but I would have been tripping hard and everyone that knows me around here knows I have a high tolerance for tryptamines.

As for the freebase, it is hard to say really. A sample that I obtained before operation webtryp of the freebase had discoloration and an odd smell to it about two weeks after I got it - but who knows how long the company had it sitting around for before that. We ingested it anyway and found that it had a much higher body load than usual - everyone puked, had lots of muscle rigidity, trisma, etc, and we all came down so hard that we didn't feel like doing anything for days.

I know of a friend who had some freebase that he wrapped up the vial in rubber bands and tape and then took an empty pill bottle, filled it with water, set the vial inside of it, and froze it... it was still good when he took it out a year later though I would say that method of preservation was a bit of overkill...

The concern I would have with the freebase is just a matter of how long the supplier had it... also back in the day, things were shipped in blue vials, not baggies. Ah, the good old days.


----------



## Ben So Furry

Fairly sure it was cut then because my experience was no where near what you described.  Everything you described I had but not all that intense, walls were breathing but not in an overly intense way, was watching a video on Youtube which just had a static eye on it but I wasn't sure if it a video effect or because of the amt but it looked like it moving/changing colour slightly. Also I could have swore blind the track I was listening too was slowing down and speeding up, listened to the tracks today the tempo was constant throughout.

Interesting you mention the food will try that next time, never had the desire to eat but was craving the warm, sweet feeling of tea flowing down my throat.

With your advice in mind and knowing the fact that the freebase is coming form a source I trust I will start out small (10mg plugged) again to avoid having the shock of a lifetime.  Thanks for the warning.


----------



## seejay33

Can u describe your two experiences?

Seejay 





Ben So Furry said:


> Had a 60mg dose of the grey, clumpy, stinky amt hcl the other night and fell in love with the substance, felt like two different experiences one after the other, very gentle, extremely lovely.
> 
> Getting some freebase soon, are there any differences in strength of dose between hcl and freebase?  Is the freebase ok for plugging with a needle-less syringe?


----------



## Xorkoth

MagickalKat777 said:


> That sounds like a rather low-key experience for such a high dose... 60mg of aMT is anything but gentle... Have you consumed other tryptamines recently?
> 
> The freebase in my experience is negligible in dose differences but it decomposes fairly quickly. As for plugging, that is the only route I never tried with aMT.



Actually there seem to be two general groups of people with regards to AMT.  Some, like myself, find it to be gentle, warm, more MDMA-like than LSD-like, no real visuals, just warmth to colors and light haloes.  And others seem to have a full-on trip with a more psychedelic headspace.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Xorkoth said:


> Actually there seem to be two general groups of people with regards to AMT.  Some, like myself, find it to be gentle, warm, more MDMA-like than LSD-like, no real visuals, just warmth to colors and light haloes.  And others seem to have a full-on trip with a more psychedelic headspace.



Yeah that's what I had pointed out in a previous post. Its the only drug I know of that is consistently varied from person to person even with the same batch. Although I can say this - whenever we had groups that would get together and trip, we would all end up on the same trip. This was much more common with aMT than say, LSD or shrooms, where most of the time we would be too far out there to really communicate anyway.

What was the highest dose you took? I've noticed that there is somewhat of a dose-dependent response to it. Like for example, 30-40mg produces more MDXX-like experience for me, accompanied by a 'mission' that MUST be completed or I will flip out about it until the end of the trip (my 'mission' one time was to steal the stop sign from by the local high school - I ignored it but it drove me nuts all night). The higher doses, the drug still has very strong MDXX feelings (I actually prefer it to MDXX drugs - its a lot less synthetic feeling other than the body load) but turns into a full on psychedelic trip.

I only ever got colorful visuals from it one time orally (that was a group trip) - the rest of the time, it was more along the lines of things breathing, flowing, melting... I remember one time I stared at a picture of an ocean for an hour and watched as the waves crashed about in full 3D but that was still just visual distortion, however entertaining it was.

Anyway I think aMT is an odd one. Some people have a terrible time with it and some people think its the best thing ever. Some people don't really "trip" and just get euphoric effects, while others compare it with LSD.


----------



## Xorkoth

MagickalKat777 said:


> Yeah that's what I had pointed out in a previous post. Its the only drug I know of that is consistently varied from person to person even with the same batch. Although I can say this - whenever we had groups that would get together and trip, we would all end up on the same trip. This was much more common with aMT than say, LSD or shrooms, where most of the time we would be too far out there to really communicate anyway.
> 
> What was the highest dose you took? I've noticed that there is somewhat of a dose-dependent response to it. Like for example, 30-40mg produces more MDXX-like experience for me, accompanied by a 'mission' that MUST be completed or I will flip out about it until the end of the trip (my 'mission' one time was to steal the stop sign from by the local high school - I ignored it but it drove me nuts all night). The higher doses, the drug still has very strong MDXX feelings (I actually prefer it to MDXX drugs - its a lot less synthetic feeling other than the body load) but turns into a full on psychedelic trip.
> 
> I only ever got colorful visuals from it one time orally (that was a group trip) - the rest of the time, it was more along the lines of things breathing, flowing, melting... I remember one time I stared at a picture of an ocean for an hour and watched as the waves crashed about in full 3D but that was still just visual distortion, however entertaining it was.
> 
> Anyway I think aMT is an odd one. Some people have a terrible time with it and some people think its the best thing ever. Some people don't really "trip" and just get euphoric effects, while others compare it with LSD.



I prefer it to MDXX too. 

I used to use it compulsively... like a lot.  The most I ever tried without tolerance was probably 70mg.  But I've had doses up to 100mg or even more when you count redoses.  Definitely high-dose as opposed to low.  Though if I had some now I'd probably go for 40mg.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Xorkoth said:


> I prefer it to MDXX too.
> 
> I used to use it compulsively... like a lot.  The most I ever tried without tolerance was probably 70mg.  But I've had doses up to 100mg or even more when you count redoses.  Definitely high-dose as opposed to low.  Though if I had some now I'd probably go for 40mg.



Yeah I used to take really high doses and we will just leave it at that lol. This was the really high grade Ω stuff and I had some serious +3s and a couple +4s on it. One time I actually had ego death but that was a really really high dose (no idea how much but between the different methods of administration I would say between 150 and 200mg) and I would never go that far again. The trisma was terrible! lol


----------



## Ben So Furry

seejay33 said:


> Can u describe your two experiences?
> 
> Seejay



I try as briefly as I can mate,

Plugged 20mg plugged dose within an hour I was getting nice little tingles from my groin and getting a sense of pleasant well being, a little floaty but happy and nice.  This didn't really develop into much more than that but I really enjoyed the soft, yummyness of it.  I was happy being happy, had no desire to redose, no pain or vomiting nausea or anything, like I said in PD social, was like being wrapped in a blanket of pleasentness.  This really was subtle and very gentle though, but I very much enjoyed feeling good and was walking round smiling and chatting and happy doing things.  I had no visuals that I was aware of at all.

The second dose was 60mg oral and within an hour and a half began having tingles and waves of lightness and a floaty feeling.  Within two hours I was feeling slightly nauseous like I was about to be sick but never did.  The gentle waves were washing over me more rapidly and stronger. Three hours in and it felt like I had reached a peak, I was warm and kept wanting to walk around and find things to do, then find something else to do straight after, the waves and general feeling of well being were very nice and enjoyable.  Around four to five hours in I realised the image on the TV was swaying slightly side to side, this is when the experience changed into a very visual one.  Colours were swirling and moving, clouds that were far away seemed to be very close where as trees that were close seemed to be far away, strange distortion of depth but not overwhelming or frightening.  This lasted for several hours after that and had a really smooth to ride back to base.  It's almost like I never noticed it leave it was that smooth.  I stayed up for the rest of the day tired with a slightly dull head but nothing I wouldn't expect from being up all night.  After I slept I expected some negative effects but had nothing, I was completely fine.

It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if the compound I got was weaker because it was cut or had degraded.  The next batch I receive because of MagikalKatt77's advice I will start slow again just in case it is a hell of a lot stronger.


----------



## Xorkoth

Wait, that description sounds a lot better than the way you described it before .   That sounds like the sort of intensity I get from 60mg, except with a lot more visuals (as I mentioned I don't really get visuals from AMT).


----------



## Ben So Furry

Oh ok, but it never felt intense or over the top, I felt completely in control and never like being pinned to the floor or knocked for six.  It did feel gentle and nice, don't get me wrong I wasn't looking to get completely out of it, that's not my thing at all, I like being able to move around and interact with people, not pinned to my seat feeling like I'm in a wind tunnel.

I completely enjoyed it and look forward to my next experience, I was expecting it to be more intense and like I said before will take it easy to start with just in case.

I found the visuals to be comfortable, like made out of the things that were there not seeing things that weren't there pop into existence (which would scare me half to death in all honesty) it was a funny, loved up experience.

So Xorkoth have you never had visuals or did they diminish through use?

Also as I described the 20mg dose I had was a 'good vibes' feeling would it be possible in anybody's experience to dose like a few times this to keep this feeling going throughout the day?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Ben - That sounds much more like a high dose AMT trip than what you had described before, as Xorkoth said though still rather weak for 60mg.

Curious - how much time had elapsed between the two dosings?


----------



## Ben So Furry

MagickalKat777 said:


> Ben - That sounds much more like a high dose AMT trip than what you had described before, as Xorkoth said though still rather weak for 60mg.
> 
> Curious - how much time had elapsed between the two dosings?



Sorry, my first description was obviously lacking  

Around 24 hours between doses with sleep and food in between.


----------



## MagickalKat777

No wonder - you most likely had some degree of tolerance. Keep in mind that AMT stays in the body for a long time compared to most drugs... There was probably some degree of tolerance involved in that one.

Its best to not use AMT more than once a week or two if you want to get the full effects. I developed a slight tolerance to it but most people I know develop a tolerance to it rapidly.

Had you waited a week or even a few days, that trip you got from 60mg would have most likely been able to be had from 40-50.


----------



## Ben So Furry

Right, thanks for the info will bear that in mind next time. How long would you advise at minimum between doses?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Ben So Furry said:


> Right, thanks for the info will bear that in mind next time. How long would you advise at minimum between doses?



See my post - I edited it


----------



## Ben So Furry

Excellent info, I'm really looking forward to my next time with it but will give it a week. Test with 10mg to be on the safe side then 3-4 days later try at 40mg. To be honest I was very happy with it and like I said earlier don't like being completely floored so not sure how much further I would want to go, your (MagikalKat77) description earlier at 60mg (flowing feeling music etc.) sounded really intense and as much as I'm curious I'm not sure I'm the type to be able to handle something like that, but who knows maybe in time.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Ben So Furry said:


> Excellent info, I'm really looking forward to my next time with it but will give it a week. Test with 10mg to be on the safe side then 3-4 days later try at 40mg. To be honest I was very happy with it and like I said earlier don't like being completely floored so not sure how much further I would want to go, your (MagikalKat77) description earlier at 60mg (flowing feeling music etc.) sounded really intense and as much as I'm curious I'm not sure I'm the type to be able to handle something like that, but who knows maybe in time.



Well high dose AMT is definitely not for the faint of heart but I can tell you that unlike most psychedelics, the AMT head space doesn't generally allow for a bad trip. 

There's no point in taking 10mg if you already know the stuff is decent - that's barely a threshold dose. A common dose is 20-30mg.


----------



## Ben So Furry

My experience before was with hcl which has all gone now, getting some freebase soon that I'll start with 10mg because I'm worried it'll blow me out of the water and I'm a light weight with most things in all honesty.


----------



## Xorkoth

Ben So Furry said:


> Also as I described the 20mg dose I had was a 'good vibes' feeling would it be possible in anybody's experience to dose like a few times this to keep this feeling going throughout the day?



It was actually first explored as a daily antidepressant at 5mg.  Most people find 5-10mg doses to be very good for inducing an all-day lift of mood.  A little more and it gets a little sparkly.  I find that 5-10mg doses, whatever is good for you, can be maintained over at ;east a few weeks without seeming to burn out or anything... it actually got pretty far as an antidepressant and I believe it was mainly discontinued where it was being tested due to a certain percentage of people would feel uncomfortable (they started tripping :D)


----------



## Ben So Furry

That's interesting because at the 20mg dose I did feel good, and towards the end of the day I felt as if I was no longer under the influence but the good feeling and well being was still there (I guessing at the following) because I had enjoyed feeling good that I just allowed it to continue and enjoy being happy.

Having those feeling but with colours and light just starting to get a little sparkly sounds like I'll never stop grinning and have a lot of fun enjoying my time with others.

Anyone else half audio distortion like I described earlier? I really could hear the music slow down gradually and speed up again, I really thought it was part of the song but an a later listen found this wasn't the case.


----------



## seejay33

thanks for all your advice today ben and magickal ive decided although im a novice to this particular chem im very experienced in mdxx and psychs generally so taking that into consideration i was thinking nothing above 30mg should suffice...

thoughts...?

seejay


----------



## tragiclemming

seejay33 said:


> thanks for all your advice today ben and magickal ive decided although im a novice to this particular chem im very experienced in mdxx and psychs generally so taking that into consideration i was thinking nothing above 30mg should suffice...
> 
> thoughts...?
> 
> seejay


30mg of the HCl is an excellent starting dose me thinks. It is a very pleasant ride and very manageable. Enjoy.


----------



## Xorkoth

Yeah, 30mg is a good place to start.


----------



## Xorkoth

Deleted a few posts for brushing the line of pricing and source discussion.  Please keep that out of here.  Thanks!


----------



## tonsill

Xorkoth said:


> Yeah, 30mg is a good place to start.



i'm assuming thats an oral dosage?


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

So just to double check, dosage should be the same for HCl and freebase?


----------



## Scoobysnacks

JedTheHumanoid said:


> So just to double check, dosage should be the same for HCl and freebase?




hcl is slighter weaker Jed, seen it compared strength wise as 20 perecent weaker, so freebase 50 mg will equal roughly 40 mg hcl, i get my hcl sample soon and im going with 40 mg


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Scoobysnacks said:


> hcl is slighter weaker Jed, seen it compared strength wise as 20 perecent weaker, so freebase 50 mg will equal roughly 40 mg hcl, i get my hcl sample soon and im going with 40 mg



Do you mean the other way around then if hcl is weaker?


----------



## Xorkoth

Yeah, the HCl is weaker, correct.   The other way around.

And yes, 30mg oral dose is what we meant.


----------



## tonsill

Xorkoth said:


> Yeah, the HCl is weaker, correct.   The other way around.
> 
> And yes, 30mg oral dose is what we meant.



so you have to increase the dose if it's HCL to get the equiv strength of a freebase one...but what are the dosing differences like with plugging and oral? pretty much the same? or would a plugged dose be a lot less?


----------



## Scoobysnacks

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Do you mean the other way around then if hcl is weaker?



yeh sorry


----------



## seejay33

alright guys an gals...

unfortunately later than planned i dosed 30+- 5mg ( allowing for scale) stirred into pure orange juice...

45min experienced the following...

increased hr 120
slight visual distortion and possibly depth
feeling like a serotonin build up without releasing if u know what i mean...

will keep u updated its gonna be a looonngg night will have a few beers if i need to relax later think ill be fine though...

seejay


----------



## ugh1979

Xorkoth said:


> It was actually first explored as a daily antidepressant at 5mg.  Most people find 5-10mg doses to be very good for inducing an all-day lift of mood.  A little more and it gets a little sparkly.  I find that 5-10mg doses, whatever is good for you, can be maintained over at ;east a few weeks without seeming to burn out or anything... it actually got pretty far as an antidepressant and I believe it was mainly discontinued where it was being tested due to a certain percentage of people would feel uncomfortable (they started tripping :D)



Do you know if 5-10mg daily doses would lead to a decreased effect of a weekend recreational dose?

I'm considering using it daily but not if it negates it's recreational use.


----------



## change-jug

I finally tried aMT earlier in the week at 30mgs plugged. During the come up I experienced a closed eyed,semi-sleep/fantasy/dream state and with eyes opened I felt mildly confused,yet it was enjoyable. After that was over(45-55 minutes) I was left with feeling very in control of myself and was able to grill food and act some what normal in front of  my kids when they came home. I wouldn`t want to drive or talk to a fellow adult because it was hard to maintain a conversation without trailing off. I felt that I under dosed. So I waited 7 hours and took a pellet of 6-apb. After that I felt much better. I had no afterglow of any kind. Next time I will increase my dose to 40 mgs and see if I feel better. At 30 mgs I had no kind of mood lift or euphoria or any of the described effects of aMT other than the absent mindedness. I hope to have better luck next time.


----------



## Listening

^ change-jug: Was that the freebase or HCL? Coincidentally, I vaporized 30mg of the freebase yesterday (my third trial with the drug). The effects were not too far from what you're describing. However, when I added some weed into the equation, the effects of the aMT shone through. It was the difference between a subtle ++ and a solid +++ (at times). My friend came over (who wasn't on anything) and we had a great time together just talking.

Great stuff, but it felt very under-dosed. I think I'm going to try eating it next time, as I don't know if I want to vaporize 50mg of this stuff (which is seeming necessary if I want the full effects).


----------



## change-jug

I have the freebase. I too tried to smoke it and didn`t really get much of an effect. I used foil but would like to get a base pipe for next time.


----------



## scab

Dosed aMT 8 times, all in all, at around 30mg-50mg HCl and, enjoyable as it was, I found it a little underwhelming.

I'm off to a festival this coming weekend and have 50mg freebase.  Will the dose increase be something I can handle considering my previous experience?  Can it be plugged (as it's not water soluble) to avoid the harsh come up and subsequent headache?  Are there any other important differences between the salt and freebase that I should be aware of?

Thanks!


----------



## Xorkoth

You'll most likely be fine with 50mg of the freebase if you've tried 50mg of the HCl and been underwhelmed.  Hope you have a good time.


----------



## MagickalKat777

It sounds like there is some really weak aMT making rounds right now...


----------



## scab

MagickalKat777 said:


> It sounds like there is some really weak aMT making rounds right now...



Yeah, hence being a little concerned my experience has been solely with a weaker-than-usual HCl at 30mg-50mg.  The freebase I have now is from an entirely different source, and its distinctive smell is penetrating several bags quite pungently.

The difference in potency is a definite worry, but I don't want to under-dose either.  Perhaps 40mg would be more sensible.


----------



## Ben So Furry

I had a break through with this and had a marvellous time on the freebase.  The waves and tingles, music appreciation and visuals while intense were fun and very much 'under control' not forced or deliberate or pinning me to my seat.  My sense of taste seemed to be through the roof, I experienced sound distortion (music slowing and speeding up) and some extreme (though not scary) visuals, colours splitting, depth perception messed up, and things moving in waves.  Not only was it a very manageable experience but it was an extremely long lasting one, seemingly all day (20 hours+) and just when I thought the experience was over I'd get a body shiver and the room would start breathing again.

Even though it was a very intense experience throughout it was comfortable and I was able to function normally (I felt I could anyway) and even converse with straights, even though their faces were morphing all over the place.

I have had the HCL which in comparison was weak at the same dose (60mg see previous posts) but the freebase I  have is very far from weak let me assure you. 

I have had zero ill after effects except from tiredness, once I caught up with my sleep I was perfectly fine.

Wowee tiger, what a fun and mind opening ride.


----------



## scab

Ben So Furry said:


> I had a break through with this and had a marvellous time on the freebase.  The waves and tingles, music appreciation and visuals while intense were fun and very much 'under control' not forced or deliberate or pinning me to my seat.  My sense of taste seemed to be through the roof, I experienced sound distortion (music slowing and speeding up) and some extreme (though not scary) visuals, colours splitting, depth perception messed up, and things moving in waves.  Not only was it a very manageable experience but it was an extremely long lasting one, seemingly all day (20 hours+) and just when I thought the experience was over I'd get a body shiver and the room would start breathing again.
> 
> Even though it was a very intense experience throughout it was comfortable and I was able to function normally (I felt I could anyway) and even converse with straights, even though their faces were morphing all over the place.
> 
> I have had the HCL which in comparison was weak at the same dose (60mg see previous posts) but the freebase I  have is very far from weak let me assure you.
> 
> I have had zero ill after effects except from tiredness, once I caught up with my sleep I was perfectly fine.
> 
> Wowee tiger, what a fun and mind opening ride.


Bit confused.  You're saying this was 60mg freebase?

Would you have been 'safe' at a music festival?


----------



## ugh1979

Ben So Furry said:


> I had a break through with this and had a marvellous time on the freebase.  The waves and tingles, music appreciation and visuals while intense were fun and very much 'under control' not forced or deliberate or pinning me to my seat.  My sense of taste seemed to be through the roof, I experienced sound distortion (music slowing and speeding up) and some extreme (though not scary) visuals, colours splitting, depth perception messed up, and things moving in waves.  Not only was it a very manageable experience but it was an extremely long lasting one, seemingly all day (20 hours+) and just when I thought the experience was over I'd get a body shiver and the room would start breathing again.
> 
> Even though it was a very intense experience throughout it was comfortable and I was able to function normally (I felt I could anyway) and even converse with straights, even though their faces were morphing all over the place.
> 
> I have had the HCL which in comparison was weak at the same dose (60mg see previous posts) but the freebase I  have is very far from weak let me assure you.
> 
> I have had zero ill after effects except from tiredness, once I caught up with my sleep I was perfectly fine.
> 
> Wowee tiger, what a fun and mind opening ride.



Interesting.  I'm keen to try the freebase after several times of using the HCL from a certain UK vendor.  However, hopefully their new stock which they are getting this week is from a new batch so hopefully it will be better.

The freebase is more expensive than the HCL but would be well worth it if it's stronger and longer lasting.


----------



## scab

ugh1979 said:


> Interesting.  I'm keen to try the freebase after several times of using the HCL from a certain UK vendor.  However, hopefully their new stock which they are getting this week is from a new batch so hopefully it will be better.
> 
> The freebase is more expensive than the HCL but would be well worth it if it's stronger and longer lasting.



I think we've all been on the same 'weak' HCl here (UK).


----------



## ugh1979

scab said:


> I think we've all been on the same 'weak' HCl here (UK).



Yeah.  Sounds like it.


----------



## Ben So Furry

scab said:


> Bit confused.  You're saying this was 60mg freebase?
> 
> Would you have been 'safe' at a music festival?



Yes it was a 60mg freebase amt dose and I believe on that dose I would be perfectly fine and dandy at a music festival, in fact I think it would be awesome being sucked into the and practically seeing the music while staying in control. ymmv obviously so stay safe 

I'd just like to add that if you (or anyone for that matter) has not taken amt before it would be a good idea to familiarise yourself with the effects in a safe, familiar environment before taking at a music festival.  Just so you know what to expect as there is nothing scarier than the unknown. 

Hope you have a great time 

btw I'm UK too and too had a (good) but underwhelming experience on the hcl @ 60mg so can only agree with the above stating there's a weak batch going round


----------



## scab

Ben So Furry said:


> Yes it was a 60mg freebase amt dose and I believe on that dose I would be perfectly fine and dandy at a music festival, in fact I think it would be awesome being sucked into the and practically seeing the music while staying in control. ymmv obviously so stay safe



Exactly what I hoped to hear!  Cheers.


----------



## tonsill

Ben So Furry said:


> Yes it was a 60mg freebase amt dose and I believe on that dose I would be perfectly fine and dandy at a music festival, in fact I think it would be awesome being sucked into the and practically seeing the music while staying in control. ymmv obviously so stay safe
> 
> I'd just like to add that if you (or anyone for that matter) has not taken amt before it would be a good idea to familiarise yourself with the effects in a safe, familiar environment before taking at a music festival.  Just so you know what to expect as there is nothing scarier than the unknown.
> 
> Hope you have a great time
> 
> btw I'm UK too and too had a (good) but underwhelming experience on the hcl @ 60mg so can only agree with the above stating there's a weak batch going round



could you tell me what you think would have been a decent dose of the weak HCL?


----------



## scab

tonsill said:


> could you tell me what you think would have been a decent dose of the weak HCL?



I did it myself, and I'd say 50mg.  However, if it's your first time, I'd stick to the usual guidelines whether it's weak or not.


----------



## tonsill

ok, thanks very much. very good advice. i did a 5g allergy tester last week and plan on doing a small initial dose and then re-assessing after 2 1/2 hours.


----------



## Ben So Furry

scab said:


> I did it myself, and I'd say 50mg.  However, if it's your first time, I'd stick to the usual guidelines whether it's weak or not.



Agreed, I started at a 20mg plugged dose of the HCL and even though I felt good for the whole day, I didn't get anywhere until I tried 60mg oral.  

Discussing it in this thread some users claim this is a high intense dose and it may be the case that the UK currently has some poor HCL going round, a 60mg freebase dose blew me out of the proverbial water, but in a very manageable, un-frightening way, Magikalkatt777 summed it up well by saying: 'the amt headspace doesn't really allow for a bad trip' once you've tried it you'll understand what we both mean by the above.  

But even with that in mind it is always safer to err on the side of caution and as scab says above build up doses slowly because you never know and wait, it really takes a long time to kick in, and remember (this is true for me anyway) visuals took even longer than the initial and peak effects to manifest.


----------



## tonsill

I may never get to the high end of doses as im not primarily after visuals. i'm more interested in the rushes and feeling good qualities. (i've tried LSD in the past but it's never really had much effect on the visual side for me)


----------



## Myshkin

Ben So Furry said:


> I'd just like to add that if you (or anyone for that matter) has not taken amt before it would be a good idea to familiarise yourself with the effects in a safe, familiar environment before taking at a music festival.  Just so you know what to expect as there is nothing scarier than the unknown.



For "the unknown" read "liquid shit of the kind usually only seen the morning after drinking eight pints of weissbier and eating a bad takeaway". 

Just so you know...


----------



## MagickalKat777

Just the description of the pungent smell tells me that the freebase is better than the HCl - that characteristic aMT smell - where you open the vial and the smell fills the room immediately and doesn't dissipate for a good bit - kind of reminiscent of moth balls and artificial grape mixed together - that lets you know you've got the good shit.

Wish I was in the UK. You lucky bastards are getting to partake of my favorite substance while I am stuck in the US and will probably never get to experience it again.

Just make sure you respect the drug. While it really does tend to be a light and pleasant trip, if you aren't respectful to it, it does have the power to kick your ass just like any other psychedelic. I definitely find that it is much more forgiving than other psychedelics but I have seen people get their asses kicked by it for getting cocky. There is also a point where the dose/effect curve drastically changes. It is different for everybody but once you hit the curve, going up any higher in the dose will cause an exponentially more intense experience. I have had full-blown ego death from aMT and as Ben So Furry pointed out, a lot of the effects take a long time to manifest.

On a happy note, one of my close friends just informed me that he has some materializing within the next week or two. Happy me!


----------



## tonsill

i've plugged 30mg of the non-stinky HCL . it's been 30 mins and i'm bouncing, such a clean and happy energy.music is on a new level

 i've set a reminder for when it's been 3 hours so i'll know when the peak's come.

I get what everyones been saying, it's bliss


----------



## MagickalKat777

The peak should definitely come before 3 hours on a plugged dose... I usually peaked at 2 hours on an oral dose... But happy tripping! I can't wait til I get my chance to dance with the magical IT-290 again :D


----------



## tonsill

Cheers Kat. 

im having such an awesome time on this. like a clean mellowed out E. i've got the lava lamp going and jack johnson in the background

im thinking of redosing in an hours time. but after reading:


"There is also a point where the dose/effect curve drastically changes"

i assume this means that a redose of 10 will almost be like a 20? what would you suggest a good one to be? (on the non stinky HCL)


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

I know this is an extremely subjective question, but how easy would it be to talk to someone straight on the phone whilst peaking on a 30/40mg dose of freebase (as I will inevitably have to do)...?


----------



## Delsyd

not too hard IME.

But it best to save trips for when you dont have other responsibilities to worry about.


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> Cheers Kat.
> 
> im having such an awesome time on this. like a clean mellowed out E. i've got the lava lamp going and jack johnson in the background
> 
> im thinking of redosing in an hours time. but after reading:
> 
> 
> "There is also a point where the dose/effect curve drastically changes"
> 
> i assume this means that a redose of 10 will almost be like a 20? what would you suggest a good one to be? (on the non stinky HCL)



Oh no not that low. I'm talking ridiculous doses like I've done myself in the past... nothing in your low territory. No worries. 



JedTheHumanoid said:


> I know this is an extremely subjective question, but how easy would it be to talk to someone straight on the phone whilst peaking on a 30/40mg dose of freebase (as I will inevitably have to do)...?



I find that on any dose up to 70mg of AMT, I am able to act "normal" - for most people, 50mg of freebase would put them at the edge of being able to talk normally on the phone... you should be fine with 30/40 but it depends on your tryptamine tolerance.


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

MagickalKat777 said:


> Oh no not that low. I'm talking ridiculous doses like I've done myself in the past... nothing in your low territory. No worries.
> 
> 
> 
> I find that on any dose up to 70mg of AMT, I am able to act "normal" - for most people, 50mg of freebase would put them at the edge of being able to talk normally on the phone... you should be fine with 30/40 but it depends on your tryptamine tolerance.



Thanks, never been near a tryptamine before, although extensive shroom experience, including having to act straight on a couple of memorable occasions...


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Delsyd said:


> not too hard IME.
> 
> But it best to save trips for when you dont have other responsibilities to worry about.



Never going to happen!


----------



## MagickalKat777

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Thanks, never been near a tryptamine before, although extensive shroom experience, including having to act straight on a couple of memorable occasions...



Shrooms are tryptamines - AMT is less pushy than shrooms unless you knock the dose out of the park.. so if you can handle those you should be fine.


----------



## tonsill

i can say after having a 30g dose my mind is still perfectly clear and i can easily hold a conversation. this drug doesnt impair your thoughts at all (at this level)


----------



## MagickalKat777

I hope you didn't take 30g 

But yeah, its pretty benign at that dose as far as effects on your thoughts. Higher doses are a different story but we're talking pretty much doubling of that dose or close to it.


----------



## tonsill

haha that would be interesting! i've just taken another 30MG dose. it feels like its kicked in almost straight away. placebo or not?


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> haha that would be interesting! i've just taken another 30MG dose. it feels like its kicked in almost straight away. placebo or not?



Most likely not. I always found that redosing caused the effects of the drug to increase almost immediately... usually feeling the full effects within 15 to 20 minutes.


----------



## Delsyd

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Never going to happen!



probably not with aMT, but that attitude will get you into some uncomfortable situations.

There is a reason set and setting are preached by veterans.


----------



## tonsill

yup d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y NOT placebo! 

I think i've found my fav RC.

just depends on the comedown. but from what i've read plugging makes it a lot easier on the body right?


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> yup d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y NOT placebo!
> 
> I think i've found my fav RC.
> 
> just depends on the comedown. but from what i've read plugging makes it a lot easier on the body right?



Plugging generally makes it easier on the body, yes, but AMT can have a pretty heavy body load... Especially at higher doses. The comedown isn't so bad but the excess stimulation may keep you from sleeping (this was never a problem for me though)


----------



## MagickalKat777

Delsyd said:


> probably not with aMT, but that attitude will get you into some uncomfortable situations.
> 
> There is a reason set and setting are preached by veterans.



Indeed. I've had my ass handed to me many times - twice by aMT itself - and even when I've been fully prepared (or at least thought I was). 

In my experience tryptamines are less forgiving than phenethylamines as well. Phenethylamines (not including 2C-T-X or DO*) are generally stimulating, intensely visual, but not so heavy on the mind. Tryptamines, on the other hand, are the great teachers of the psychedelic family.


----------



## tonsill

i've got some sleeping tablets if worse comes to it. but i've the next 2 days off in any case!


----------



## MagickalKat777

You should be fine then. The worst bodyload effects I got from aMT were nausea and dry-heaving (which actually was my queue that the trip was about to start), a heavy body feeling, a mild headache on the come down, and with higher doses, extremely bad trisma (jaw bouncing up and down - it was quite entertaining actually when trying to talk to others).

If you go search Trip Reports, I have one or two aMT trip reports in there... one is called the Beauty of Everything I believe - that will show you the true power this drug can have.


----------



## scab

tonsill said:


> i can say after having a 30g dose my mind is still perfectly clear and i can easily hold a conversation. *this drug doesnt impair your thoughts at all (at this level)*



Says the guy claiming to have taken 30 grams!

Glad you're enjoying it.  I'd hide it all away and experiment with a higher dose at a future date if I were you.

The Kat's living rather vicariously right now, eh!


----------



## MagickalKat777

^ can't be helped. I won't have any for at least 2 weeks... and its been about 7 years now!


----------



## scab

MagickalKat777 said:


> ^ can't be helped. I won't have any for at least 2 weeks... and its been about 7 years now!



It's worth that kind of wait, thankfully.


----------



## tonsill

just read it, very very cool report. my god i can only imagine what a 100mg of this would have been like.

since the redose the visuals have come on quite well. things are blurring and trailing and the lava lamp is doing some crazy stuff. it's the first time i've had XP with visuals but im liking it so far!


----------



## tonsill

scab said:


> Says the guy claiming to have taken 30 grams!
> 
> Glad you're enjoying it.  I'd hide it all away and experiment with a higher dose at a future date if I were you.
> 
> The Kat's living rather vicariously right now, eh!



haha i know! DOH!! 

ive got a couple mates coming round in 2 days so i think im going to need to introduce them to this. so far the best rc ive ever had


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> just read it, very very cool report. my god i can only imagine what a 100mg of this would have been like.
> 
> since the redose the visuals have come on quite well. things are blurring and trailing and the lava lamp is doing some crazy stuff. it's the first time i've had XP with visuals but im liking it so far!



I'm glad that you enjoyed it. I wrote it LONG after the initial experience so it was not fully complete but it gives you an idea.

The visuals of a-MT tend to be pretty soft so I think you'll really enjoy them. Mostly melting, size distortion. Maybe some greyscale patterns (that can get rather intricate). The coolest visual effect from it though is the flowing... Once that starts get out a calendar or something and watch the image come to life. It is incredible.


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Delsyd said:


> probably not with aMT, but that attitude will get you into some uncomfortable situations.
> 
> There is a reason set and setting are preached by veterans.



Agreed, I just meant that certain things cannot be avoided. I never take a trip lightly or unprepared...

...despite not knowing shrooms are tryptamines...


----------



## MagickalKat777

scab said:


> It's worth that kind of wait, thankfully.



Yes it definitely is... I think I'm going to have to obtain a lot though - my friends all love this chemical too. We call it eye tea lol... We have more of a fondness for the IT-290 name than calling it aMT.


----------



## psood0nym

MagickalKat777 said:


> Just the description of the pungent smell tells me that the freebase is better than the HCl - that characteristic aMT smell - where you open the vial and the smell fills the room immediately and doesn't dissipate for a good bit - kind of reminiscent of moth balls and artificial grape mixed together - that lets you know you've got the good shit.


It depends on what you value I guess. I prefer the HCl for the following reasons:

It doesn't smell; it's more soluble in water, making the faster onset and lesser side effects of IM administration more practical than with the freebase; it's more stable than the freebase.

The advantage of the freebase is that it's a better value for the money since it's more potent.  It's possible to convert the freebase to the HCl, but it's going to take some time and equipment to get an end product than can be IMd.


----------



## tonsill

MagickalKat777 said:


> I'm glad that you enjoyed it. I wrote it LONG after the initial experience so it was not fully complete but it gives you an idea.
> 
> The visuals of a-MT tend to be pretty soft so I think you'll really enjoy them. Mostly melting, size distortion. Maybe some greyscale patterns (that can get rather intricate). The coolest visual effect from it though is the flowing... Once that starts get out a calendar or something and watch the image come to life. It is incredible.



haha i did the calendar thing and your right, it's incredible. i've taken LSD before but never had visuals like this and it was always so cold and egdy. this is like being wraped in a soft glow. i keep being amazed


----------



## MagickalKat777

psood0nym said:


> It depends on what you value I guess. I prefer the HCl for the following reasons:
> 
> It doesn't smell; it's more soluble in water, making the faster onset and lesser side effects of IM administration more practical than with the freebase; it's more stable than the freebase.
> 
> The advantage of the freebase is that it's a better value for the money since it's more potent.  It's possible to convert the freebase to the HCl, but it's going to take some time and equipment to get an end product than can be IMd.



Oh I know about the advantages but with the freebase, I know the smell so well that I *KNOW* it is aMT and not something else. Although with the source I found I am not concerned about that. Excellent communication.

I don't think I would ever be brave enough to try IM administration... its plenty intense orally. 

And yeah I know about the stability... I'm going to order a large amber vial to store it in and hide it in the closet so it isn't exposed to any light.



tonsill said:


> haha i did the calendar thing and your right, it's incredible. i've taken LSD before but never had visuals like this and it was always so cold and egdy. this is like being wraped in a soft glow. i keep being amazed



I told you - its a fantastic experience! I can't wait to relive it! Also, get some Shpongle - Tales of the Inexpressible... close your eyes and listen to the whole album... if you aren't blown up another notch and taken on an incredible journey I'll eat my shoe!


----------



## seejay33

psood0nym said:


> It depends on what you value I guess. I prefer the HCl for the following reasons:
> 
> It doesn't smell; it's more soluble in water, making the faster onset and lesser side effects of IM administration more practical than with the freebase; it's more stable than the freebase.
> 
> Not tried the freebase although I want to but I like the hcl id hardly call it weak like people are suggesting... compared to freebasr maybe...
> 
> Seejay


----------



## tonsill

shpongle? with a name like that it must be good! im watching "man on a wire" at the moment. it's a documentary about the frenchman who walked inbetween the world trade centre.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Freebase is good for smoking... Smoking freebase is super low dose... 15mg of smoked AMT freebase can have you seeing stars lol.


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> shpongle? with a name like that it must be good! im watching "man on a wire" at the moment. it's a documentary about the frenchman who walked inbetween the world trade centre.



Shpongle is incredible - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1jPeG1LlaQ

One of my favorite tracks... its called Divine Moments of Truth... but take the capital letters out and you'll figure out what its really about.


----------



## tonsill

haha your really good at this. that songs amazing. i've never heard anything like it!


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> haha your really good at this. that songs amazing. i've never heard anything like it!



That's the LIVE version too - the non-live version is even better.

Seriously, all Shpongle rocks all. We had a group of like 8 of us get together for an AMT trip and as soon as Shpongle went on, we all blasted to another dimension... stellar trip - I had never had full color open-eye visuals from AMT until that trip... and we were all inside each other's heads... it was nuts.


----------



## tonsill

its blasted me off to a new level - i can tell you! defo going to aquire the discography. totally amazing

keep it coming!


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> its blasted me off to a new level - i can tell you! defo going to aquire the discography. totally amazing
> 
> keep it coming!



Infected Mushroom, Juno Reactor, Sasha - Airdrawndagger, Sasha - Involver... its been awhile since I've come up with music for trips lol. Airdrawndagger would probably blow your mind too.


----------



## ashtray girl

If you like Shpongle then check out Simon Posfords other stuff - Hallucinogen and Younger Brother.  I've seen him at festivals a few times, always amazing DJ-sets.


----------



## tonsill

thanks for that!! i've noted it all down. defo going to have a listen to each of those. 

phew im well and trule shpongled (or where im from -  schmangled)


----------



## Scoobysnacks

tonsill said:


> yup d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y NOT placebo!
> 
> I think i've found my fav RC.
> 
> just depends on the comedown. but from what i've read plugging makes it a lot easier on the body right?




top when a person finds aMT and falls in love

hey guys


----------



## tonsill

i've had two doses at 30mg of the "weak uk batch"  and im tripping balls

i cant even begin to think what a strong dose would be like lol


----------



## Scoobysnacks

tonsill said:


> i've had two doses at 30mg of the "weak uk batch"  and im tripping balls
> 
> i cant even begin to think what a strong dose would be like lol



if ya got some weed get it bashed tonsil


----------



## tonsill

wish i did! from what i've read the two mix incredibly well together


----------



## MagickalKat777

Weed is good when coming down from AMT but because of how long AMT lasts if you aren't in the come down phase, when the weed wears off, you'll be ridiculously tired but unable to sleep because of the AMT. We made that mistake...


----------



## tonsill

i can def feel that this trip is tapering off now. is the comedown always this nice and smooth?


----------



## Xorkoth

Yeah, for me, AMT leaves me feeling great for days, if maybe a little tired.


----------



## MagickalKat777

tonsill said:


> i can def feel that this trip is tapering off now. is the comedown always this nice and smooth?



Yes unless you go crazy with the dose. Remember - it was originally developed as an anti-depressant. A single large dose of AMT has antidepressant effects on me that last for weeks - much like the MDMA "glow" but without the subsequent crash...


----------



## scab

This reads too much like an advert to me this morning.

Like anything else, aMT has a dark side, and if dosage can't be measured accurately to within 5mg then it isn't the chemical for you.


----------



## MagickalKat777

scab said:


> This reads too much like an advert to me this morning.
> 
> Like anything else, aMT has a dark side, and if dosage can't be measured accurately to within 5mg then it isn't the chemical for you.



aMT is much less likely to produce a dark side than just about anything else except maybe 2C-C. I've taken doses from 10mg to test threshold up to 100+ and yes, the body load can get pretty bad but nowhere near other chemicals and I've done 5-MeO-AMT (a lot of this one), 2C-E (a lot), 2C-D, 2C-C, 2C-T-2, 5-MeO-DMT, 5-MeO-MiPT, 4-AcO-DiPT, 4-AcO-MiPT, 4-HO-MiPT (a lot), 4-HO-DiPT, 4-HO-DET, 4-AcO-DET, DiPT, MiPT, DXM (a lot), methylone (a lot), and I'm sure I'm missing some.

Yes, make sure you know your dose - but aMT is nowhere near as sensitive as the others can be... Mostly because the dose is a lot higher than most of the others (besides methylone, DXM, 2C-C)


----------



## tonsill

MagickalKat777 said:


> Yes unless you go crazy with the dose. Remember - it was originally developed as an anti-depressant. A single large dose of AMT has antidepressant effects on me that last for weeks - much like the MDMA "glow" but without the subsequent crash...



i do have 0.000 scales so it's not an issue. 

im just about back to baseline now, it's been a smooth tapering off and has left me with a such a good afterglow. just what you've described. hands down the best RC i've ever tried. it gave me all sorts of mdma happy feelings with  super vivid visuals (first time i've ever had those). but unlike LSD these were always in my control and always in a warm happy place. i felt it was almost like having training wheels on. 

oh and thank you for your advice Kat, it really put my mind to ease last night knowing that i had an experienced person to bounce things off of. and sphongle is just mental!!


----------



## scab

MagickalKat777 said:


> aMT is much less likely to produce a dark side than just about anything else except maybe 2C-C. I've taken doses from 10mg to test threshold up to 100+ and yes, the body load can get pretty bad but nowhere near other chemicals and I've done 5-MeO-AMT (a lot of this one), 2C-E (a lot), 2C-D, 2C-C, 2C-T-2, 5-MeO-DMT, 5-MeO-MiPT, 4-AcO-DiPT, 4-AcO-MiPT, 4-HO-MiPT (a lot), 4-HO-DiPT, 4-HO-DET, 4-AcO-DET, DiPT, MiPT, DXM (a lot), methylone (a lot), and I'm sure I'm missing some.
> 
> Yes, make sure you know your dose - but aMT is nowhere near as sensitive as the others can be... Mostly because the dose is a lot higher than most of the others (besides methylone, DXM, 2C-C)



I'm actually referring to psychological addiction and serotonin syndrome.  aMT releases amounts higher than MDMA.

As you said elsewhere, it needs respect.  It's not for casual abuse.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> Weed is good when coming down from AMT but because of how long AMT lasts if you aren't in the come down phase, when the weed wears off, you'll be ridiculously tired but unable to sleep because of the AMT. We made that mistake...



easy peesie solution..just smoke more lol

just got a bag of blueberry, beautiful and coated in crystals, be hard pressed getting it as good in the dam...if only i could get mdma/pills as easy


----------



## Delsyd

scab said:


> I'm actually referring to psychological addiction and serotonin syndrome.  aMT releases amounts higher than MDMA.



are you sure this is true?
ive never heard such a thing.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Delsyd said:


> are you sure this is true?
> ive never heard such a thing.



lmao@ Delsyd's shock at such a statement


----------



## MagickalKat777

Delsyd said:


> are you sure this is true?
> ive never heard such a thing.



Me neither and I've done MORE than my fair share of AMT... 2g in 3 months is a pretty sizable amount I'd say... Never suffered anything NEAR serotonin syndrome and AMT was the only drug I DIDN'T get addicted to... DXM and 5-MeO-AMT on the other hand...


----------



## Xamkou

I'm getting quite worried that this is going to take off soon, people are talking about it now in my area.


----------



## MagickalKat777

It wouldn't surprise me. It is quite an incredible drug... For many, it is MUCH better than certain other substances... The problem comes when people make stupid mixes - like aMT & MDMA.


----------



## scab

Delsyd said:


> are you sure this is true?
> ive never heard such a thing.



Which part?  I understand it releases greater amounts of serotonin, but over a more extended period of time.  To combine any SRA is stupid but common practice; to do so with aMT is asking for trouble.

What I'm really arguing with is the last few pages of this thread inadvertently painting aMT as carefree light and happiness.


----------



## Xamkou

Well most have written off 6-APB and this is obviously widely available, has been for ages, and is gaining a lot of popularity in the UK on the internet. Not seen it in the news (yet) but I can see them having a field day with this with it being a hallucinogenic. Fingers crossed it doesn't blow up Meph style.


----------



## MagickalKat777

People that liked Meph wouldn't really get off on AMT IMO. But yeah with 6-APB being written off, I see AMT as the next target. The thing is that AMT is not a terribly hard compound to synth and even if it gets banned, there will still be ways of getting it... I only just yesterday found out how easy it truly is to acquire - and has been even after the scheduling. Wish I  would have known sooner lol.


----------



## scab

All RCs're going the way of the dodo for us in the UK sooner rather than later, so I wouldn't be too concerned about its popularity increasing.

Well, unless you're looking to stock up, like some of us...


----------



## Xamkou

My fav source is out of stock atm so I'm biding my time, then I will be stocking up. Legal RC's will remain, it will still take the government a few months to find and ban things even after the blanket ban comes into effect.


----------



## scab

Xamkou said:


> My fav source is out of stock atm so I'm biding my time, then I will be stocking up. Legal RC's will remain, it will still take the government a few months to find and ban things even after the blanket ban comes into effect.



The market will shrink with that kind of fast-acting legislation, profit margins will be squeezed, and vendors will cease to see any use making risky investment in new chemicals.

Sad, but likely.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Half of englands youth would end up in there parents beds sobbing if they took aMT at a worthwhile dose, youth need shit that gets em buzzing and dont wanna have to put any effort in, all lazy haha

amt will defo not take off with kids in england, it wdnt fit into there hooligan ways, they like uppers and beer not tripping out where they have to examine there inner selfs


----------



## Xamkou

ikr. Proper scales are needed for research with aMT.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Xamkou said:


> ikr. Proper scales are needed for research with aMT.



depends on the initial weight, if ya buy 250 mg to start with , ya cd eyeball x5 50 mg doses and be ok, it only when ya go over 80-90 mg it gets shaky lol


----------



## scab

Scoobysnacks said:


> depends on the initial weight, if ya buy 250 mg to start with , ya cd eyeball x5 50 mg doses and be ok, it only when ya go over 80-90 mg it gets shaky lol



That's a really irresponsible post tbh, Scooby.  It is *never* a good idea to eyeball something as potent as aMT.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

scab said:


> That's a really irresponsible post tbh, Scooby.  It is *never* a good idea to eyeball something as potent as aMT.



yeh sorry wasnt thinking


----------



## ashtray girl

Scoobysnacks said:


> Half of englands youth would end up in there parents beds sobbing if they took aMT at a worthwhile dose, youth need shit that gets em buzzing and dont wanna have to put any effort in, all lazy haha


Nah, that isn't true.  Kids still like the shrooms, they don't mind going out for a day of picking, then making a brew between them.

I first took psychedelics as a kid, and it seems psychs are getting popular with kids again.  Retro-scals and all that - listening to pink floyd and tripping in their lacoste trackies.


----------



## Xamkou

I wouldn't eyeball this. Luckily  the site we use sells in 50mg bags which is handy for harm reduction.

I do think that the search for the "new meph" is over. A lot of people in my area have simply become bored with straight empath stims like Meph and are looking for something different which is why aMT is being mentioned a lot around here. There was a lot of buzz around here about 6-APB but a lot of those dud capsules and powders have been floating about (admittedly pellets have also been around) so most have written it off. I think I was the first in my "group" to source aMT online and a few of my close friends have tried it with me when I've bought it in the past and all loved it. 

We get freebase btw, what's everyone's preferred dose with freebase?


----------



## Ben So Furry

Xamkou said:


> I wouldn't eyeball this. Luckily  the site we use sells in 50mg bags which is handy for harm reduction.
> 
> I do think that the search for the "new meph" is over. A lot of people in my area have simply become bored with straight empath stims like Meph and are looking for something different which is why aMT is being mentioned a lot around here. There was a lot of buzz around here about 6-APB but a lot of those dud capsules and powders have been floating about (admittedly pellets have also been around) so most have written it off. I think I was the first in my "group" to source aMT online and a few of my close friends have tried it with me when I've bought it in the past and all loved it.
> 
> We get freebase btw, what's everyone's preferred dose with freebase?



I don't think this is the new mephedrone (by that I mean as popular in the UK) as the come-up times are so long and it hasn't got any 'cheeky line potential' like mephedrone had.

My preferred as in 'mindblowing' (I don't advise anyone do the same just answering a question based on my experience) dose was at 60mg freebase, it lasted so long and was intense enough for me not to want to journey any higher, in fact I must say I really enjoyed the anti-depressant doses (10-20mg) for the nice glow and well being without the world feeling the need move all over the place, colours to split into their constituent parts and music take on a very physical presence.


----------



## scab

It's never the 'new meph'.  It's not nearly 'casual' enough.


----------



## Xamkou

I never called it the new meph. I merely meant that the search for a "new meph" is over and people are searching for something different than an empath stim.


----------



## nomis

Unfortunately anything that gets labeled as plant food is doomed now I reckon. These stupid greedy uk vendors will kill the fun for the rest of us just for a few months of easy money.


----------



## Xorkoth

Removed a few off-topic posts.  No need to argue in public.


----------



## mistereman

Long time lurker fairly experienced with mainstream drugs like mdma, cocaine, 'phets

I'm after some important advice re AMT as I've never tried before

I have 0.001 scales so I'm confident on dosage but I'm unsure on a couple of things, appreciate any help

Can you drink alcohol on AMT?

Noticed people mention eating certain foods can be a bad idea xan someone explain what and why?

I know I sound like a novice but I'm after some advice to limit my risks really appreciate any help

Cheers


----------



## Vader

aMT acts as an MAO inhibitor, which means it prevents an enzyme from doing what it normally does. No, you can't drink on aMT, any combinations should be well-researched and cautiously approached.

With regards to the "new meph" thing, I reckon that not being able to drink or eat kebabs whilst on it would put a lot of people off it. Or, they'd all just end up in A&E.


----------



## MagickalKat777

I'm going stir crazy right now...  Its gonna be like a week before I even have it... UGH!

Oh well at least I'm going to get to experience the magic again :D


----------



## SpellmanT7

MagickalKat777 said:


> Me neither and I've done MORE than my fair share of AMT... 2g in 3 months is a pretty sizable amount I'd say... Never suffered anything NEAR serotonin syndrome and AMT was the only drug I DIDN'T get addicted to... DXM and 5-MeO-AMT on the other hand...



2 grams in 3 months?

I've had just over half a 100mg vial sat in a dark, cool place for several months. I'm waiting for a special occasion, given that AMT is such a wonderful substance.

I'm guessing that set and setting don't generally come into your equation when deciding whether or not to trip on strong, day-long hallucinogenics Kat?

Seriously - it seems as if its a case of 'If I can afford it, I'll fucking do it...and often too' for you. 

Seems reminiscent of the posts from ketamine users that do bumps whilst clubbing but have often never given themselves a decent shot at experiencing a full blown k-hole in a comfortable, controlled environment.

I cant comment on potential for physical damage, resulting from your frequency of usage but the risk of losing the beauty of this substance is a very real concern.


----------



## MagickalKat777

That was in 2003. I was young and stupid. And I didn't take ALL of it by myself - I shared it with friends. But I definitely did consume quite a bit.

Back then, I had to be fucked up all the time because I hated being sober. I hated being sober so much that I would take anything and everything to make sure I wasn't sober. If you think my AMT binges were bad, you should have seen my 5-MeO-AMT binges... literally days on end of constantly redosing and just tripping my ass off for days... Even would go to work fucked up on it, open the store, make the dough, make the sauce, get the register ready, and continue to trip all throughout the day.

I've gotten a lot wiser in my chem usage since I have gotten older. In fact I haven't tripped in about 3 years and I haven't rolled in 2.


----------



## ugh1979

Yerg said:


> aMT acts as an MAO inhibitor, which means it prevents an enzyme from doing what it normally does. No, you can't drink on aMT, any combinations should be well-researched and cautiously approached.
> 
> With regards to the "new meph" thing, I reckon that not being able to drink or eat kebabs whilst on it would put a lot of people off it. Or, they'd all just end up in A&E.



I've always drank on it, as has everyone I know, without issue, but everyone is different so it's up to the individual to make the decision seeing as AMT is very mild MAOI so doesn't really have the dietary restrictions like full blown MAOI's do.  However, to be safe, mature cheeses and red wine should still be avoided since they are high in tyramine.


----------



## ugh1979

SpellmanT7 said:


> 2 grams in 3 months?
> 
> I've had just over half a 100mg vial sat in a dark, cool place for several months. I'm waiting for a special occasion, given that AMT is such a wonderful substance.
> 
> I'm guessing that set and setting don't generally come into your equation when deciding whether or not to trip on strong, day-long hallucinogenics Kat?
> 
> Seriously - it seems as if its a case of 'If I can afford it, I'll fucking do it...and often too' for you.
> 
> Seems reminiscent of the posts from ketamine users that do bumps whilst clubbing but have often never given themselves a decent shot at experiencing a full blown k-hole in a comfortable, controlled environment.
> 
> I cant comment on potential for physical damage, resulting from your frequency of usage but the risk of losing the beauty of this substance is a very real concern.



I hear what you are saying but I don't see AMT as any different from MDMA in how often it can be taken.  500mg every second weekend works fine for me.  I did notice 500mg every weekend was beginning to dull the effect a little bit so I'm taking longer rests where possible.

AMT isn't a day long hallucinogen for me.  It's a ~5 hour MDMA like euphoria drug which is best suited to parties.  If I'm looking for a day long hallucinogenic trip i'll take something else and do it under the correct circumstances/setting.

My point is, AMT has a very different effect on different people so it can have very different uses.

Also, the up to week+ long after effects of AMT are great (i.e. it's anti-depressant property) so using every 2 weeks for me means the best of both worlds. 

I'd be very very surprised if there was any damage being done considering it's history and family.  It appears to me to be a bit of a wonder drug.


----------



## MagickalKat777

^^ You must have this chemical confused with something else. 500mg would most likely kill you. I had severe negative consequences from between 160 and 200mg... and I never built any form of a tolerance to it.

Also, it doesn't last ~5 hours... The plateau is more like 8-10 hours... Something is wrong here.


----------



## DavidBowieILoveYou

*First time experienced*

I'm new here but I thought I'd post my two cents.
So I finally got around to dipping into my 300mg yesterday. I started with 10-15mg at 3pm, then redosed every couple of hours until I'd taken maybe 40mg by midnight. The come up seems really unpleasant and physical, serious anxiety but felt mainly as a tight feeling in the stomach/chest with some serious nausea. After an hour or two though that completely disappeared and a very smooth, speedy rush came on, relaxing into (t+5-8hrs) a very MDMA like feeling, but not pushy or fake as MDMA can feel. All in all, a wonderful experience, moderate euphoria throughout, with mild but very pleasant OEVs later on in the evening.
But...
Its now t+18, mid morning, and I am having a difficult come down (not as bad as the down time after oral opium, but close). I am feeling very strung out, my brain is exhausted, but I am not going to sleep until seemingly this evening, I have a nasty headache, and my legs feel restless and sore. Ugh. Benzos are a must for next time. Still, would definitely do it over again 

PS How long until I am no longer on an MAOI and can do as I please with regard to chianti, fava beans, other serotonergic drugs etc? I cant seem to find half life figures for amt.


----------



## DavidBowieILoveYou

Oh also I had taken 1mg as an allergy test a few days before. I am not wholly irresponsible.


----------



## ugh1979

MagickalKat777 said:


> ^^ You must have this chemical confused with something else. 500mg would most likely kill you. I had severe negative consequences from between 160 and 200mg... and I never built any form of a tolerance to it.
> 
> Also, it doesn't last ~5 hours... The plateau is more like 8-10 hours... Something is wrong here.



No I don't have it mixed up.

I wasn't talking about taking 500mg at once!  I'm talking about over the course of a weekend.

It does last ~5 hours for me, at a 50mg dose, then I redose.  This may well be due to the HCL that is currently in the UK being weaker than the freebase you might be used to though.

As I say though, bear in mind that AMT has very different effects on different people.  If you read any of the AMT threads on BL you should know that.


----------



## Vader

Hang on... it lasts you 5 hours, you dose 10 times, so you trip for 50 hours every weekend? That's hardcore, there's only 48 hours in a weekend! When do you sleep?


----------



## ugh1979

Yerg said:


> Hang on... it lasts you 5 hours, you dose 10 times, so you trip for 50 hours every weekend? That's hardcore, there's only 48 hours in a weekend! When do you sleep?



Actually Friday night to Monday night sessions aren't unheard of round my way.  Doing the 72hours is pretty hardcore though and certainly not a weekly occurrence.  48 hours sessions are more frequent but again, not every single weekend.

One thing I really like about AMT is that unlike MDMA, which loses a lot of it's effects after a day or so on it for me, AMT can keep going strong for at least 2 days.

I just sleep for 24hours when I'm done after a 2 or 3 day session and that's me fine when I wake up.


----------



## MagickalKat777

500mg in a weekend is still nuts. I couldn't even imagine... Must be nice to be so rich! lol


----------



## ugh1979

MagickalKat777 said:


> 500mg in a weekend is still nuts. I couldn't even imagine... Must be nice to be so rich! lol



Rich?  I wish!  500mg isn't expensive at all in my country.  In fact AMT works out as one of the cheapest drugs around for effect/longevity.


----------



## MagickalKat777

ugh1979 said:


> Rich?  I wish!  500mg isn't expensive at all in my country.  In fact AMT works out as one of the cheapest drugs around for effect/longevity.



Seriously? I've looked at all the sites and its definitely not cheap... Price discussion obviously isn't allowed but I could get E, K, and alcohol and party all weekend for how much it costs.

Anyway, be careful. Nobody knows the long term consequences of using it like that - I thought I was bad with my usage but I never had more than 250mg in a 48-72 hour period...


----------



## ugh1979

MagickalKat777 said:


> Seriously? I've looked at all the sites and its definitely not cheap... Price discussion obviously isn't allowed but I could get E, K, and alcohol and party all weekend for how much it costs.



No chance I could.  Not anywhere near in fact.  I'd have to spend at least at least triple.  Say 24 beers, 5 E's and 1g of Ket would last a day (as long as the E's are good) but pushing for another day would generally require the same again.



> Anyway, be careful. Nobody knows the long term consequences of using it like that - I thought I was bad with my usage but I never had more than 250mg in a 48-72 hour period...



I'm happy with the historical use of AMT and knowledge of long term effects of drugs that are similar to it, and in it's family, to consider it safe at those doses.

I'm hoping to get some freebase AMT at some point though so maybe I can half my overall weekend dose, making it even better and cheaper.


----------



## nomis

Very tempted. Shame it is HCI and not Freebase that seems to be doing the rounds, but tempted all the same.


----------



## Vader

^HCl=hydrochloride. HCI=? 
Tryptamines are fairly unstable, I imagine that the hydrochloride will degrade considerably slower than the freebase (also, the freebase tends to smell of...well...poo). I'm happier with the salt, the loss in potency is worthwhile IMO.


----------



## ugh1979

Yerg said:


> ^HCl=hydrochloride. HCI=?



He obviously meant HCl/HCL.


----------



## nomis

ugh1979 said:


> I've always drank on it, as has everyone I know, without issue, but everyone is different so it's up to the individual to make the decision seeing as AMT is very mild MAOI so doesn't really have the dietary restrictions like full blown MAOI's do.  However, to be safe, mature cheeses and red wine should still be avoided since they are high in tyramine.



I drink on most things. Cant help it. I love my beer


----------



## Vader

Indeed, but that isn't what s/he typed, so I corrected s/him.


----------



## DJ Revisionist

I recently obtained some AMT from a friend. The package is sealed and labelled AMT but I'm paranoid about it being a mistakingly labelled package of 5-MeO-AMT. So besides taking a small test dose is there any way I can be sure it is actually AMT?


----------



## atara

DJ Revisionist said:


> I recently obtained some AMT from a friend. The package is sealed and labelled AMT but I'm paranoid about it being a mistakingly labelled package of 5-MeO-AMT. So besides taking a small test dose is there any way I can be sure it is actually AMT?



I'll cut this off right here:

No.

Take 3 mg. If it's 5-MeO, you'll feel effects.q


----------



## agnetha

I'm in the process of ramping up my AMT doses. Already in the territory where I get solid psychedelic effects, but far from a dose where AMT shows its full power. But I'm impressed with the aftereffects even at this level. 

Went swimming two times after a night on AMT. The first time I thought the chemical had run it's course, all effects -except a little afterglow- had subsided. I was wrong, it turned out to be amazing. The sensation of water streaming over my skin was almost overwhelming. Floating weightless, submerged in water, tingling all over my body brought out solid euphoria. The second time I swam laps, a little more than 1000m almost effortless without noticeable exhaustion, despite getting no sleep the night before. Have to explore this a little more, but have to think careful about the setting, I'm not keen on drowning during an AMT trip.


----------



## Ben So Furry

agnetha that sounds amazing, I had something similar where touch would 'activate' the trippy visuals again long after I thought they had subsided. A public swimming pool like you say cause problems but next time I get some AMT I will definitely run a bath  

I've asked this before but this is something that has interested me since it happened and is a very prominent part of my AMT experience.  It must be because of distortion of time, which feels like it runs fast like you would expect while enjoying yourself, but when I listen to a solid set tempo piece of music it sounds like it slows down and speeds up randomly but quite severely at some points (really slow/very fast) but it's only noticeable through music, I don't get peoples voices slowing or even TV or video (that I'm aware) this has never happened while on mushrooms and just wondered if this happened to anyone else?


----------



## GlassCage

ugh1979 said:


> As I say though, bear in mind that AMT has very different effects on different people.  If you read any of the AMT threads on BL you should know that.



Absolutely right! I recently took 30mg swallowed (precisely measured) which made me feel very warm and relaxed, similar to MDAI, then I fell asleep for 12 hours. Woke up feeling totally refreshed and energetic. Best night's sleep for years!


----------



## MagickalKat777

DJ Revisionist said:


> I recently obtained some AMT from a friend. The package is sealed and labelled AMT but I'm paranoid about it being a mistakingly labelled package of 5-MeO-AMT. So besides taking a small test dose is there any way I can be sure it is actually AMT?



Assuming you don't have a scale accurate enough to measure 3mg as suggested below... if it smells like mothballs and artificial grape (its a smell so pungent that simply opening the bag will make your room smell like it for minutes after its been put away) - and its freebase - it is most likely AMT. 5-MeO-AMT doesn't have a strong smell and I've never seen it for sale as a freebase.

Best to make sure by weighing out a tiny dose and taking it... but 3mg of 5-MeO-AMT will not always make someone feel anything... I've had friends who needed a lot more - and I've had friends who felt 5 to 10mg of AMT hit them - just not in a psychedelic sense... So just be careful with your dosing until you confirm its not 5-MeO. 

Everyone is different... Personally, 10mg of 5-MeO-AMT was a +.5 for me while my friend took 10mg and hit a full +++ with some serious toxic consequences...


----------



## MagickalKat777

ugh1979 said:


> I'm happy with the historical use of AMT and knowledge of long term effects of drugs that are similar to it, and in it's family, to consider it safe at those doses.



So you are comfortable knowing that AMT's direct cousin, AET, was discontinued in the states because of it causing agranulocytosis?


----------



## drugs

My highest dose so far is 40mg. A very enjoyable trip at that level. I wonder though, how the effects scale up in the 50-100mg range? especially the psychedelic component of it. Anyone have any comments?


----------



## ugh1979

MagickalKat777 said:


> So you are comfortable knowing that AMT's direct cousin, AET, was discontinued in the states because of it causing agranulocytosis?



Yes, considering AMT was used as an anti-depressant for a considerable length of time without report of any agranulocytosis effect.


----------



## MagickalKat777

drugs said:


> My highest dose so far is 40mg. A very enjoyable trip at that level. I wonder though, how the effects scale up in the 50-100mg range? especially the psychedelic component of it. Anyone have any comments?



I find once you hit the 50-60mg range, the dose-response curve DRASTICALLY changes with 70mg being MUCH more intense than 60... not worth the body load. Intense trisma, vomiting, longer duration trip, definite mind fuck component at that level, really tired for the next two days after doing it. Awesome visuals though.


----------



## MagickalKat777

ugh1979 said:


> Yes, considering AMT was used as an anti-depressant for a considerable length of time without report of any agranulocytosis effect.



In doses much lower than recreational ones. 8)


----------



## drugs

MagickalKat777 said:


> I find once you hit the 50-60mg range, the dose-response curve DRASTICALLY changes with 70mg being MUCH more intense than 60... not worth the body load. Intense trisma, vomiting, longer duration trip, definite mind fuck component at that level, really tired for the next two days after doing it. Awesome visuals though.



Thanks for the reply.  What is the highest you have dosed and what were the effects?


----------



## MagickalKat777

drugs said:


> Thanks for the reply.  What is the highest you have dosed and what were the effects?



http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=120799&highlight=magickalkat777

I couldn't tell you how much I took that day...... Way too much... That one I was absolutely DESTROYED and my friend almost took me to the hospital...

Here's a better one...

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=120820

That was a lower dose than the first... but still quite high... like 70 total.


----------



## deano88

I know this has probably been asked a million times but my phone internet is slow and it takes of ages to go back through all the pages but can AMT be dissolved in water and drank and will it still be as potent?


----------



## MagickalKat777

deano88 said:


> I know this has probably been asked a million times but my phone internet is slow and it takes of ages to go back through all the pages but can AMT be dissolved in water and drank and will it still be as potent?



If it is the HCl salt, it can be dissolved in water. As for potency loss, I'm not sure...

The freebase will not dissolve in water.


----------



## deano88

MagickalKat777 said:


> If it is the HCl salt, it can be dissolved in water. As for potency loss, I'm not sure...
> 
> The freebase will not dissolve in water.



Yeah its the hcl version. I just want to try it in water mainly so it comes on quicker but Hope it don't loose its strength this way


----------



## MagickalKat777

It won't come on quicker in water... AMT takes awhile to come on unless you plug it, smoke it (can't smoke the HCl), or snort it (which BURNS and is really stimulating and requires a dose adjustment).


----------



## Xamkou

Dose for insuffilation?


----------



## deano88

Yeah i'd be interested to know how it is snorted.


----------



## deano88

Not how, I mean what its like compared to taking it oraly


----------



## commander-blue

i definately dont want an sources because that would be too easy (and against the rules), but as for availibility, is AMT still available? and is it usually sold as an RC or a street drug?


----------



## MagickalKat777

AMT is readily available in Canada... that's all I will say.

As for insufflation, I couldn't tell you what dose adjustment would need to be made because the only time I did it, I also smoked the freebase and took some HCl orally...


----------



## deano88

MagickalKat777 said:


> AMT is readily available in Canada... that's all I will say.
> 
> As for insufflation, I couldn't tell you what dose adjustment would need to be made because the only time I did it, I also smoked the freebase and took some HCl orally...



Think i'll just eyeball my snorted dose take it just after having a bomb so don't have to wait for the comeup


----------



## MagickalKat777

PLEASE don't eyeball! Weigh it out, especially if you are going to snort it...


----------



## deano88

MagickalKat777 said:


> PLEASE don't eyeball! Weigh it out, especially if you are going to snort it...



Don't worry mate i'm not gonna be doing heroic coke lines just the tinyiest little line hardly anything. Perhaps somebodys got recommended dose for snorting so we might all have better idea? I'd imagine it being slightly more than oral dose anyway but thats just my guess.


----------



## MagickalKat777

No, its definitely less than the oral dose... My friend Rachel just informed me that 15mg insufflated is equivalent to 25 to 30mg orally but to be prepared for the worst burn ever.


----------



## zamzams

MagickalKat777 said:


> No, its definitely less than the oral dose... My friend Rachel just informed me that 15mg insufflated is equivalent to 25 to 30mg orally but to be prepared for the worst burn ever.



I think the worst burn ever award (for me so far) goes to 4-FA (yeah i was warned not to sniff it) but was curious at to how bad it could actually be. Stupid stupid me. It put me off ingesting any more of it for good.

Still haven't tried aMT yet though it's on my to do list.


----------



## Xamkou

So, to sniff aMT 25mg would be a good dose? Can you snort freebase? How long would it take to come-up and how long do the effects last?

Sorry, never done it nasally before but I'm interested.


----------



## any major dude

for most things like this, between 1/3 & 2/3 of a oral dose is good for insufflation.  Best to start on the low end though


----------



## Myshkin

Xamkou said:


> So, to sniff aMT 25mg would be a good dose? Can you snort freebase? How long would it take to come-up and how long do the effects last?
> 
> Sorry, never done it nasally before but I'm interested.



Just don't. Please. It's a waste of time, aMT and it'll hurt your nose. Not much else.


----------



## ugh1979

MagickalKat777 said:


> In doses much lower than recreational ones. 8)



I don't think that's an issue.


----------



## ugh1979

SamhainGrim said:


> Just don't. Please. It's a waste of time, aMT and it'll hurt your nose. Not much else.



How is it a waste of time?  The grey HCL that is around in the UK isn't all that bad for snorting if you have a strong nose.  I've snorted FAR worse, like DXM, now that I was stupid to do and regretted big time.

I've done it a couple of times but not from the offset.  I always start with oral/rectal admin so can't say for sure if it comes up quicker but it did have effect, so not a waste.  I need to do some more experimentation with insuffication to say for sure of a come up and duration time. For the record I don't find rectal admin to reduce the come up time much.

I can imagine trying to snort more potent stinky AMT would be a very different story as to how well it would work out for the user.

Working round the 2 hour come up, which is quite anxiety inducing in me, is something I need to work on a solution to.  I might try using Phenibut as a launch pad for AMT.


----------



## mistereman

This is possibly a really stupid question but how do you tell the difference between the freebase and the hcl? Appearance wise not effects


----------



## seejay33

Yes deano that's what I do 

Seejay 





deano88 said:


> I know this has probably been asked a million times but my phone internet is slow and it takes of ages to go back through all the pages but can AMT be dissolved in water and drank and will it still be as potent?


----------



## MagickalKat777

mistereman said:


> This is possibly a really stupid question but how do you tell the difference between the freebase and the hcl? Appearance wise not effects



Oh you'll know if you have freebase just by the smell. It has a smell that makes your house smell like its been filled with mothballs and artificial grape at the same time...


----------



## Doombar

ugh1979 said:


> Working round the 2 hour come up, which is quite anxiety inducing in me, is something I need to work on a solution to.  I might try using Phenibut as a launch pad for AMT.



Phenibut is perfect for the come up IMO.  0.5-1g  removes the excessive stimulation and anxiety perfectly without dampening the trip too much/at all.


----------



## mistereman

MagickalKat777 said:


> Oh you'll know if you have freebase just by the smell. It has a smell that makes your house smell like its been filled with mothballs and artificial grape at the same time...



So they both appear the same but smell different? What would hcl smell of?

I'm really trying to determine which I have as I've never seen either the freebase or hcl before sorry


----------



## MagickalKat777

HCl has almost no detectable strong smell... seriously AMT freebase has such a powerful smell that your neighbors might think you have a drug lab in your house.


----------



## Xamkou

Freebase smell is lovely :D


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

I am going to acquire a 50mg sample of freebase shortly. I was planning to dose an initial 25mg with a possible 10-15mg redose later. Will the redose greatly extend the trip or just intensify it?


----------



## mistereman

MagickalKat777 said:


> Oh you'll know if you have freebase just by the smell. It has a smell that makes your house smell like its been filled with mothballs and artificial grape at the same time...


Thanks for your help

Shame as I was sold freebase but even though it smells its nowhere near as intense as you describe which puts doubt in my mind what it really is

I'll bin it !


----------



## MagickalKat777

Well, my AMT was always in vials... so the scent gets stored up... I'm sure its considerably less with plastic bagging. When you open it up though you should definitely be able to smell it.


----------



## Xamkou

How long does it take to begin affecting you if insufflated? And does it reduce the experience duration also?


----------



## YaniCZka

hi there! i know that amt is said to be maoi but is there anybody who really experienced some discomfort when using it in combinations (mdma, meph, amph) at all? thanks.


----------



## mistereman

Gaaaaaargh!!!

I've now just read that freebase AMT is a tan/off white powder the one I've binned was bright white so I'd be careful to anyone who's recently bought freebase AMT who knows what it is


----------



## MagickalKat777

mistereman said:


> Gaaaaaargh!!!
> 
> I've now just read that freebase AMT is a tan/off white powder the one I've binned was bright white so I'd be careful to anyone who's recently bought freebase AMT who knows what it is



May be AMT HCl.

Try putting some in some water and see if it dissolves. If it does, its the HCl salt. No big deal. Just 20% higher dose.


----------



## Myshkin

Xamkou said:


> How long does it take to begin affecting you if insufflated? And does it reduce the experience duration also?



Seriously, snorting is probably the least appropriate, efficient and pleasant way of taking this drug, *especially if you have the freebase*. Why anyone would want to do it _when there are other methods which are far better_ is beyond me. 

For your information, it's also an irritant. Anybody who enjoys putting irritants on their membranes just for the sake of it should go ahead and ignore my advice. 

You can do it, sure. You can also drink wine out of a shoe, but as a glass works so well, why bother?


----------



## Listening

SamhainGrim said:


> You can do it, sure. You can also drink wine out of a shoe, but as a glass works so well, why bother?



Not everyone can afford a glass, and drinking straight from the bag is rude.


----------



## Myshkin

Listening said:


> Not everyone can afford a glass, and drinking straight from the bag is rude.



Quite. 

Though give some of the posters here half a chance and they'd try to snort it...


----------



## gannetsarewe

I have been running on empty the last few weekend's. 25mg every 6-8 waking hours mostly, I enjoyed a nice pick me speedy, intresting world. If I dosed higher I got a want to lie down body load. But last w-e on the last day I got vile and frequent black shites every hour or two interspersed with buckle up stomach cramps. In my case and I have a strong tolerance to the body side effects of Tryps the BL precludes any potential for long term abuse of AMT.


----------



## stom10

gannetsarewe said:


> I have been running on empty the last few weekend's. 25mg every 6-8 waking hours mostly, I enjoyed a nice pick me speedy, intresting world. If I dosed higher I got a want to lie down body load. But last w-e on the last day I got vile and frequent black shites every hour or two interspersed with buckle up stomach cramps. In my case and I have a strong tolerance to the body side effects of Tryps the BL precludes any potential for long term abuse of AMT.



Be careful with this one. AET (ethyl homologue of AMT) was withdrawn from the antidepressant market for the occurrence of agranulocytosis in a non trivial amount of patients, and this was at much lower doses (especially comparing the effective dose of the two compounds). I'm not sure how much this would carry over to AMT, but I'd treat this more like MDMA and try to keep it to a few times a year, or at least avoid binging.


----------



## MagickalKat777

The fact that AMT does have such a high bodyload for some (it doesn't for me - especially compared to most phens) keeps most people from doing it on a constant basis.

AMT was in use in Russia longer than AET here in the states though and there were no reports of agranulocytosis that I'm aware of but the reports on "toxicity" are hard to find... I think AMT was mainly pulled because of its abuse potential.

AET has been shown to have the neurotoxicity of MDMA though so it wouldn't surprise me if AMT did as well.


----------



## Xorkoth

mistereman said:


> Gaaaaaargh!!!
> 
> I've now just read that freebase AMT is a tan/off white powder the one I've binned was bright white so I'd be careful to anyone who's recently bought freebase AMT who knows what it is



Actually pure AMT freebase that is fresh and not degraded is sparkly chalky white.  The best AMT I ever had was straight from the chemist and it was bright white.

I'm not saying it IS AMT, just that it very well could be.  What does it smell like?  Is it a very strong smell?



Xamkou said:


> How long does it take to begin affecting you if insufflated? And does it reduce the experience duration also?



Insufflated starts in like 30 minutes and peaks maybe an hour and a half, and yes it does shorten the duration.  However, I strongly recommend against this for AMT.  First of all, as mentioned, AMT freebase (and maybe the salts, but I don't know) is an irritant to mucous membranes and nasal cavities.  It burns, BAD, for at least 20 minutes.  It's honestly horrible.  And it's not fast like many other things snorted, just a little faster.  And about the same dose too.

PM Shambles if you're interested in smoking/vaporizing... apparently it works quite well but I haven't done it.  And it still takes 30-60 minutes to come up.

Honestly the best route for me is rectal.  The dose is the same, but the come-up is faster and the come-down/aftereffects are shorter, and the main effects, the peak and plateau, last about the same amount of time as with oral.  Also, rectal eliminates the AMT being in your stomach which dramatically cuts down on nausea, and overall there is a lot less bodyload.  It's just the best way to take it IMO, keeping in mind I have never used needles.



stom10 said:


> Be careful with this one. AET (ethyl homologue of AMT) was withdrawn from the antidepressant market for the occurrence of agranulocytosis in a non trivial amount of patients, and this was at much lower doses (especially comparing the effective dose of the two compounds). I'm not sure how much this would carry over to AMT, but I'd treat this more like MDMA and try to keep it to a few times a year, or at least avoid binging.



DEFINITELY follow this advice.  Take it from me, possibly the most severe abuser of AMT ever for much of 2006 and most of 2007.  If you use it sparingly, it will be a wonderful drug every time, and it will probably leave you feeling tired but in great spirits, with the antidepressant effect lingering on for days or even up to a week.  No crash like with MDMA in the next few days at all.

However, if you use it too much, without allowing your neurotransmitters to replenish their stores, then you will feel the symptoms of serotonin depletion just like you can by abusing MDMA.  My symptoms were extreme fatigue, extreme mood swings, feeling like I'd been run over by a truck.  I would get brain zaps extremely severely, sometimes 10 or so in a row that would have me falling down in the middle of the hallway.  I also had sleep paralysis and the most intense and doom-filled dreams of my life.  I was generally completely miserable and nauseous along with the symptoms I described, for like 4 or 5 days, and then I felt much better (but I was still run down for quite a while... I didn't feel quite right for months after the 4-5 days but it was just a general malaise, apathy, and lots of fatigue (likely the result of me getting very little sleep at all during this entire period )

So yeah, don't abuse it.  Don't abuse any drug or any psychedelic, but definitely not AMT especially.  I don't do this anymore, but when I used to use way too many psychedelics, I would take quite a variety of chemicals much too often, even 3 or 4 days in a row.  These included 2C-B, 2C-E, 2C-I, 4-AcO-DMT, DOC, and AMT.  Of those, only AMT left me feeling like I had hurt myself.  After the others multiple days in a row, and in fact any psychedelic I've tried except for MDMA (if you consider it psychedelic even), I'd be fine as long as I could get enough sleep between those 3 or so nights.

*Please note I am NOT condoning or recommending anyone to trip multiple days in a row regularly, on AMT or anything else.  It's alright for a special event like a psychedelic festival but other than that, all it does it make the psychedelics slowly begin to feel just like some other drug, nothing very magical anymore.  And then even if you take a break for 7 months without anything (as I did), you will still permanently have a massive tolerance to psychedelics and a hard time having a trip that really overwhelms you and takes you for a ride.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Wow I never experienced anything like that from my AMT binges. I'm sorry to hear about that Xor... 

Anyway I did notice that when I binged on AMT, I would get so wrapped up in it that I didn't even realize what was going on around me anymore. I felt like I was in the middle of the Matrix instead of living inside or outside of it... Its really hard to explain. When I would go on AMT benders, to others I seemed perfectly fine other than my bright nature, my blown pupils, and and my massive philosophical insights. I could go about my day to day tasks without any issues whatsoever or arousing suspicion "Oh my pupils? My doc put me on Paxil" but >I< was not there. Where >I< was, I have no idea.

Also, I have had doses of AMT where one pupil was significantly larger than the other or where they would actually switch from one being dilated to the other being dilated and the one that was dilated not being dilated - this is a sign of brain damage. I didn't know then what I do now - I thought it was a cool effect and just blew it off - but that is an early sign of potential seizure activity or brain hemorrhaging and a number of other dangerous brain issues.

AMT and AET both have structural similarity and somewhat similar effects on the brain although AET tends to be less stimulating and more like MDMA - so the toxicology profile of the two is probably somewhat similar.

Tread lightly with this stuff. I went on my benders. I learned my lesson. I don't honestly believe that I suffered any serious long term damage (in fact it wasn't until I started binging on MDMA that I began to suffer panic disorder which I still have to this day) - and it has been almost 7 years since I stopped binging on it - but who knows what could show up in the future?

Don't take psychedelics every day. I've done it. It sucks. It can completely ruin your life, you can end up dead (either as a direct consequence of the drug, something the drug caused such as anorexia or extreme appetite suppression, something you did on the drug (I almost walked off a cliff on nutmeg), you can end up in jail, or worse you can end up a vegetable.

I lucked out. Went on massive benders with DXM for a good year or two, went on a 4 month binge on AMT, went on a year long binge on 5-MeO-AMT, went on 10+ pill a night MDMA benders, and I was taking so many phens that my 2C-I tolerance at one point got to 60mg.

I'm lucky that all I escaped with was panic disorder and depression - it could have been SO much worse. None of these substances were ever meant to be abused daily. Hell look what daily alcohol consumption does and how quickly a person deteriorates from just that. Now you're talking about psychedelic substances that effect NUMEROUS receptors in the brain (serotonin, norepinephrine, dopamine, and MAO if I am not mistaken in the case of AMT) and it just gets to the point of idiocy. These can cause serious psychological damage which in many cases can be worse than the physical damage!

For your own sake, be careful with these substances!


----------



## gannetsarewe

I hear ye boys, I got myself into ropes and ropes of troubles with mushrooms a few years ago, I set myself back years in a few months of binging and upping dosages to counteract tolerance.

AMT will not cause a brain hemorrhage, it may for all i know induce one, but if a hemorrhage is in the post for you it is in the post and you will only avoid it by dying first or having your  aneurysm prophylactically sealed. Certain activity or conditions can increase the risk of the condition occuring before you die but it is generally congenital.


----------



## Xamkou

What would you lot say is the best way to take freebase AMT as I'm doing it tomorrow - got 50mg. No experience with freebase.


----------



## gannetsarewe

i would eat 25 wait 2-3 hours then eat the rest.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Redosing when its already hit you isn't as potent... but I agree... guage it to see how it affects you.

On another note, who has plugged AMT and what's the best way to get freebase in solution for plugging purposes?


----------



## psood0nym

Dump the freebase aMT into the back end of an unplunged syringe with the needle cut off with a wire cutter and the edges filed down smooth.  Squirt about 20 mL of white vinegar into it with another syringe and wait until it's clear. Dilute with another 20 mL of water.  Squirt up your butt. That's it. You're welcome.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Figured it was vinegar that would do it. Thanks for that.

Also if I dump AMT freebase in water, it won't dissolve at all (distilled) right? But most impurities probably will?>


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

MagickalKat777 said:


> Redosing when its already hit you isn't as potent... but I agree... guage it to see how it affects you.
> 
> On another note, who has plugged AMT and what's the best way to get freebase in solution for plugging purposes?



So redosing is not as potent but does it significantly prolong the trip? Thanks.


----------



## MagickalKat777

JedTheHumanoid said:


> So redosing is not as potent but does it significantly prolong the trip? Thanks.



Its only slightly less potent... you will still get smacked into the stars... and yes, it extends the duration... I once tripped on AMT for 24 hours...


----------



## Xamkou

Guys, got my 50mg freebase. Bomb in rizla? Bomb in tissue? Mix into drink? Help!


----------



## Bare_head

30mg in a rizla would suffice then keep two 10 mg doses for some other time  yes i love amt that much to be tight with it :D


----------



## MagickalKat777

30 then 20 later if you're not satisfied. Some people aren't sensitive to AMT, some are.


----------



## psood0nym

MagickalKat777 said:


> Figured it was vinegar that would do it. Thanks for that.
> 
> Also if I dump AMT freebase in water, it won't dissolve at all (distilled) right? But most impurities probably will?>


I wouldn't bother trying to separate the impurities. I doubt there's that many or that they're going to interfere with the trip, especially when used rectally. It doesn't really matter if the water is distilled or tap if it's going in your ass.  It's a dirty place; all the bacteriostatic whozits and whatzits in the world aren't going to change that. 

So I'm guessing Rizla is to rolling papers what Kleenex is to snot rags? Why them versus TP or a tissue - or heaven forbid, an empty capsule? Whatever you want to do, I just think it's funny how much I see posted about people "bombing" happy powders in brand name paper intended to be burned.


----------



## deano88

should be getting some more amt arriving tommorrow the hcl stuff apperantly my this synth is supposed to be much much stronger according to my supplier so anyone else getting this stuff in the uk be carefull.


----------



## rickolasnice

psood0nym said:


> Why them versus TP or a tissue - or heaven forbid, an empty capsule? Whatever you want to do, I just think it's funny how much I see posted about people "bombing" happy powders in brand name paper intended to be burned.



Rizla / rolling papers = Its so easy, simple and affective.

Toilet paper / tissure = fiddly, good chance it will split in your mouth leaving you to suffer the taste and it may even rip before you even get it into your mouth.. 

Plus sometimes people take drugs where there is no toilet paper.. but chances are someone will have some rizla.

I dunno about anywhere else but rizla is what most people in the UK call rolling papers, yes, thanks to the brand. Just like hoover


----------



## psood0nym

^Oh yeah? While I wipe my butt with your "Rizlas". Bomb that and smile at your "mates" with your big 'ol crooked teeth-assed shit eating grin, ya wanker!






Now excuse me. I must be off.  It's tea time.


----------



## Vader

^Good input man.


----------



## psood0nym

Always room to pollute the thread with some charming Yankee hospitality.


----------



## Boombox2

After waiting months to see something on the 6-apb thread that would convince me that 6apb is worth the effort, I have given up. I am a relative newbie to the whole RC scene. My efforts pale into embarassing insignificance compared to the grizzled veterans on here but I am very interested in trying amt. It sounds like a pretty perfect drug but I was just wondering what to look out for when trying to find somewhere reliable to buy it. Should it be a certain colour or smell a certain way? Are there other things to watch out for when trying to decide where to purchase it and not lose your money?

I hope this isn't vendor chat. I'm just trying to collect tips on what to look for and do when looking - in the interest of harm reduction really. I don't want to buy and take random chemicals that will mess me up or buy and not have it delivered. Harm reduction to my body and wallet. 

But if it is somehow vendor chat, please feel free to murder my first post!


----------



## MagickalKat777

psood0nym said:


> I wouldn't bother trying to separate the impurities. I doubt there's that many or that they're going to interfere with the trip, especially when used rectally. It doesn't really matter if the water is distilled or tap if it's going in your ass.  It's a dirty place; all the bacteriostatic whozits and whatzits in the world aren't going to change that.
> 
> So I'm guessing Rizla is to rolling papers what Kleenex is to snot rags? Why them versus TP or a tissue - or heaven forbid, an empty capsule? Whatever you want to do, I just think it's funny how much I see posted about people "bombing" happy powders in brand name paper intended to be burned.



AMT freebase can degrade fairly rapidly... I want as pure of an experience as I can get.

Rectal is the ONLY RoA I've never done with AMT... if I had a freebase pipe I'd just smoke it.


----------



## windows78

ok....not tried this yet but have 2 small samples. one white clumpy one that stinks so bad and one that's a bit browner and looks like tiny little stones. 

anyone know which one to try first?


----------



## MagickalKat777

the white clumpy one that stinks so bad is freebase and is probably more potent than the brown/tan powder you got which is probably HCl unless you got some very bad freebase.


----------



## glenjih

I'm looking at trying a 25mg dose at some point during the coming week. I've never dabbled in psychedelics before, and I'm kinda hoping that the "trippy" quality here is relatively mild at medium doses. Would I be at least close to the mark with this assumption? I'm really curious about the euphoric effects described in some of the trip reports, but I don't want to lose control when the psychdelia begins.


----------



## MagickalKat777

glenjih said:


> I'm looking at trying a 25mg dose at some point during the coming week. I've never dabbled in psychedelics before, and I'm kinda hoping that the "trippy" quality here is relatively mild at medium doses. Would I be at least close to the mark with this assumption? I'm really curious about the euphoric effects described in some of the trip reports, but I don't want to lose control when the psychdelia begins.



AMT is pretty light on the head unless you dose way too high... its not an in your face psychedelic like LSD or mushrooms unless its dosed highly. It has very different effects at lower doses than higher doses with 5-10mg providing a moodlift that can last for days, 20mg it starts to get euphoric, 35mg or so it becomes more psychedelic-euphoric, 50+ it is an intense psychedelic - with or without lots of visuals.

Those doses are based on freebase. HCl will need a 20% dose increase to each one... and these are just relative based on things I've seen. I'm not that sensitive to tryptamines and usually need much higher doses - ie 16mg of freebase was threshold for me... 40 was euphoric... 60 was earth shattering psychedelic.


----------



## glenjih

Thanks a lot for the info. I believe it will be the freebase that I'm getting, so by your estimations (provided I don't have some kind of crazy tolerance) 25mg should fall right into the category I'm aiming for.


----------



## Vader

I'd make it up 1mg/ml, nice and easy then. Won't the aMT react with the vinegar to form aMT acetate?


----------



## love_sex_desire

1 mg per ml is probably way too much water. Most people take between 30-60 mg at a time, some people pushing it past 80 mg. I wouldn't want to use 80 ml of solution. I'd think 10 mg per ml would be more plausible, and it coul probably be diluted further.


----------



## barafundle

ill soon be getting some amt but im currently on a methadone prescription (90ml at 1mg/1ml) and was wondering if anyone can foresee any problems.personally i dont think so-my body is very used to it and im obviously taking,for me,a theraputic dose,not a mind altering dose.but better safe than sorry!


----------



## Xamkou

This is taking off big time now...


----------



## Ben So Furry

Xamkou said:


> This is taking off big time now...



Yep, I agree.  I think after the uncertainty of 6-apb people are looking to this and finding an absolute gem.  

Sadly I think that means it's time is limited.

Will be getting some freebase this week which is apparently from a purer batch than I had I last.  Means starting lower again as 60mg blew my head off for a long, long time (20+ hours).


----------



## barafundle

Xamkou said:


> This is taking off big time now...



frankly i dont think id be trying it if it wernt for a free sample,its duration would probably have stopped me parting with my money-but when vendors offer samples then yes,it will take off.


----------



## feeny87

would amt be good for a dj tiesto concert and how much would or should i take? and could it mix with other drugs well? mdma or coke? thanks


----------



## JackHereruk

I have just aquired some of the grey HCL aMT that is going round in the UK at the moment.  A group of us are going to be trying it out next weekend and none of us have tried it before.  All of us are pretty experienced with other drugs including MDMA, mushrooms and acid.  What would be a good starting dose, i was thinking around 20-25 mg.  Also I have a full gram of it. I would like to disolve it all in a solvent and then store it like that to so that it can be dosed without having to break out the mg scales.  What would be a good solvent.  I know the HCL disolves in water but i wouldn't like to keep water lying around for a long time because of bacteria.  Would vodka be an OK solvent as i was thinking of a 10mg/ml ratio so the alcohol shouldn't really have any effect itself.


----------



## MagickalKat777

feeny87 said:


> would amt be good for a dj tiesto concert and how much would or should i take? and could it mix with other drugs well? mdma or coke? thanks



AMT is not a party drug. It doesn't have the stimulant edge that the 2C-X's do and honestly, if you over exert yourself while you're on it, you're going to feel like shit.

Its not uncommon for people to take AMT and then complain about back pains and such as part of the bodyload. I've had them before and while they're minor it would really blow at a party. Finally, AMT tends to feel so good once you get past the bodyload that you feel like you could do anything. This leads people to buy pills, which has led to deaths.

If you need to take something at the show, find something else but please not AMT. I have heard of few AMT party experiences that went well... I took AMT one time and went to a party, I had already puked at home but I dry heaved for about 45 minutes after being there awhile (I had no sense of time) because I started to get so hot. Then I remember all the lasers and lights were making me paranoid. I felt like I was in a different universe. Plus all the loud noise... I was on 30mg, which is a really low dose for me, but even when Armin Van Buuren went on, I just couldn't handle all of the sensory overload and I ended up having to sit in the very back of the party for awhile and when that got to be too much, I went outside - that's when the experience became fun again. I was looking up at the night sky at the stars seemed to be tripled, the moon was big and full and I could feel its radiant energy shining down on me...

The trip was fine once we left the party. Two of us took AMT, three took LSD and MDMA - the two of us that took AMT both only took 30mg and we both had pretty much the same experience - and one of them left the party with some of her friends but agreed that as soon as she got outside of the warehouse, everything was so much better.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

feeny87 said:


> would amt be good for a dj tiesto concert and how much would or should i take? and could it mix with other drugs well? mdma or coke? thanks



If it's the first time you trying it I would say no. The first couple of hours can be a little anxious if your not used to it and some people get quite nauseous
Do not mix with mdma, aMT is an maoi and should not be mixed with a serotonin releaser like mdma this could cause seretonin syndrome, there have been reports of a death here from this combo.


----------



## pofacedhoe

MagickalKat777 said:


> AMT is not a party drug. It doesn't have the stimulant edge that the 2C-X's do and honestly, if you over exert yourself while you're on it, you're going to feel like shit.
> .



to me at a low dose (35mg) it seemed very much like a party drug, i have heard other people on bluelight having amt parties in a similar vein to mdma parties

it gives me lots of rushes and energy and i spent three hours dnacing in te living room when i was coming up on it to michael jackson


----------



## jebus

Michael Jackson came on to me once too.


----------



## MagickalKat777

MrTiHKAL said:


> If it's the first time you trying it I would say no. The first couple of hours can be a little anxious if your not used to it and some people get quite nauseous
> Do not mix with mdma, aMT is an maoi and should not be mixed with a serotonin releaser like mdma this could cause seretonin syndrome, there have been reports of a death here from this combo.



Have you taken AMT at a party? I've known quite a few that have taken it and they said the only way to go with it if you're going to a big party is an outdoor event on a somewhat cool day but even then, the body would much rather be chilled out on a couch.

I will say this though - it is absolutely incredible if you go to an outdoor camping party complete with tents, turntables, generators, off the main road so the cops don't come out all the time. The vibes are incredible and the colder temperatures up in the mountains where these happen actually make the body feel better than the hot temperatures inside of a warehouse or a club. 

Sometimes you want to get up and dance to some chill tunes, other times you want to sit around by the fire, and other times you go running off into the surrounding forest with the shroomers and have just as much fun as they do running through the forest tripping balls.

I would have to say that this chemical tends to like nature much more than MDMA which really doesn't give a shit where its taken.


----------



## MagickalKat777

pofacedhoe said:


> to me at a low dose (35mg) it seemed very much like a party drug, i have heard other people on bluelight having amt parties in a similar vein to mdma parties
> 
> it gives me lots of rushes and energy and i spent three hours dnacing in te living room when i was coming up on it to michael jackson



Its great for HOUSE parties where you can chill... I'm talking clubs and raves were you have so much coming at you at once... YMMV but I know many of my friends who have had AMT at parties and the only time any of us like it is if its outdoors like Global Dance Festival or Twizted Woods.


----------



## Vader

> 1 mg per ml is probably way too much water. Most people take between 30-60 mg at a time, some people pushing it past 80 mg. I wouldn't want to use 80 ml of solution. I'd think 10 mg per ml would be more plausible, and it coul probably be diluted further.


What do you mean way too much water? Too much for what? If you're taking it orally I don't see how it makes a difference, and it lets you be very precise with your dosing.


----------



## Mullered

How do people handle such small amounts of powder without loosing lots of it?  I have some .001mg scales and when messuring out 6-apb I estimate that around 10mg must have stuck to the mesuring dish. Im getting a sample of AMT shortly and dont want to end up losing a load in the mesuring process


----------



## MagickalKat777

Mullered said:


> How do people handle such small amounts of powder without loosing lots of it?  I have some .001mg scales and when messuring out 6-apb I estimate that around 10mg must have stuck to the mesuring dish. Im getting a sample of AMT shortly and dont want to end up losing a load in the mesuring process



Well if you weigh it in a gelcap, you tend to lose much less product. I use a large flathead screwdriver from a set of small repair screwdrivers to get the powder out, I set the large half of the capsule in a rubber door stop (seriously works perfectly) and I careful put the powder in the capsule. You lose the least powder this way though some MAY stick to the screw driver... I usually take my finger to that bit of powder and put it right on my tongue though.


----------



## Mullered

Thanks for that.  I guess i could do the same with a rizzla paper too.  Think i shall invest in small screw driver


----------



## MagickalKat777

gelcaps are easier to work with imo but whatever works.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Mullered said:


> Thanks for that.  I guess i could do the same with a rizzla paper too.  Think i shall invest in small screw driver



i use a black tile as my surface, empty out capsule/bag  , then i use a small stiff paint brush ( artists not painters) lol, to carefully brush out whats left, then usiing a razor blade you can gather up every bit of powder and being on a jet black surface you cant miss any Mullered

i got a sample of freebase on its way, my beautiful wife has given me 36 hours off, ill book two days off work, had to let her go the Trafford center with 250 pound spending money, but fuck it haha

i am gonna neck 50 mg orally at 9 am, will i be upto walking my dogs , getting up and down stairs etc haha, to walk my dogs i will bump into neighbours etc, i will be in the attick for the majority of the time but will my boys know im off it when wishing them goodnight and so on, how wasted do ya get off 50mg orally?, what im trying to say is even though ya flying can you blag it that your ok or do ya look completely off it?


----------



## love_sex_desire

Yerg said:


> What do you mean way too much water? Too much for what? If you're taking it orally I don't see how it makes a difference, and it lets you be very precise with your dosing.



Wasn't sure who you were responding to, just a general comment that 1 mg per ml seems to be unnescessary.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Scoobysnacks said:


> i use a black tile as my surface, empty out capsule/bag  , then i use a small stiff paint brush ( artists not painters) lol, to carefully brush out whats left, then usiing a razor blade you can gather up every bit of powder and being on a jet black surface you cant miss any Mullered
> 
> i got a sample of freebase on its way, my beautiful wife has given me 36 hours off, ill book two days off work, had to let her go the Trafford center with 250 pound spending money, but fuck it haha
> 
> i am gonna neck 50 mg orally at 9 am, will i be upto walking my dogs , getting up and down stairs etc haha, no seriously how wasted do ya get off 50mg orally?



50mg your first time? Of base? I don't think that's a smart idea. Anyway you could be anywhere between ++ to a very intense +++ - this is why you always start small... I've seen people lose their shit on 40mg of freebase AMT...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> 50mg your first time? Of base? I don't think that's a smart idea. Anyway you could be anywhere between ++ to a very intense +++ - this is why you always start small... I've seen people lose their shit on 40mg of freebase AMT...



i have had a 15mg threshhold dose of aMT a couple of months back mate. from 14 year old till twenty in mushroom seasons i was eating hundreds regularly so im experienced in tripping and not worried about having a " bad un",my concern is having to maybe participate in real life things and will i be able to do so


----------



## MagickalKat777

People and their cockiness and absolutely disrespect for these chemicals disgust me..

Anyway, to answer your question, at 50mg you will most likely have a lot of difficulty doing anything that requires much focus and depending on whether or not you get visuals, everything might look rather flowy and walking could make you dizzy. Particularly if you have patterned carpet or hardwood floors or patterned tiles...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> People and their cockiness and absolutely disrespect for these chemicals disgust me..
> 
> Anyway, to answer your question, at 50mg you will most likely have a lot of difficulty doing anything that requires much focus and depending on whether or not you get visuals, everything might look rather flowy and walking could make you dizzy. Particularly if you have patterned carpet or hardwood floors or patterned tiles...



i wasnt trying to be cocky in the slightest Magical, sorry if ya think that, i was wanting to know can you function at 50 mg as in go to a shop , walk my dogs etc


----------



## MagickalKat777

People... let me put this in language everyone can understand. This chemical is completely unique. It has effects of both the amphetamine and tryptamine families. Overdose can be fatal. This is a truly stimulating (not in your head) tryptamine and high doses have the potential to cause stimulation beyond that of ANY of the 2C family. If you look at the skeleton of AMT versus AMP, its not hard to see why.






 Amphetamine






 AMT

Please don't be reckless with this stuff and get cocky thinking "oh I've done so much of ______" - I don't give a fuck what you've done before, this chemical is an entirely different beast from any of it. People have been hospitalized and people have DIED from this drug. Don't take a "threshold" dose and then say "oh that 15mg didn't seem to do much, lets see what 50mg does"... jesus christ people, use your heads!


----------



## MagickalKat777

Scoobysnacks said:


> i wasnt trying to be cocky in the slightest Magical, sorry if ya think that, i was wanting to know can you function at 50 mg as in go to a shop , walk my dogs etc



Sorry but the way you came off saying oh I did 15mg threshold a few weeks back, then talked about your prior experience, etc...

The problem isn't necessarily the intensity of the trip. Its the dose-response curve. And the very strong reality that AMT can be an intense stimulant in high doses and higher doses can also have a higher tryptamine body load.

There was a HUGE jump between the 10mg trial I had and the 30mg dose I took the very next day... had I waited a week between dosing, that 30mg may have been even MORE intense...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> People... let me put this in language everyone can understand. This chemical is completely unique. It has effects of both the amphetamine and tryptamine families. Overdose can be fatal. This is a truly stimulating (not in your head) tryptamine and high doses have the potential to cause stimulation beyond that of ANY of the 2C family. If you look at the skeleton of AMT versus AMP, its not hard to see why.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amphetamine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AMT
> 
> Please don't be reckless with this stuff and get cocky thinking "oh I've done so much of ______" - I don't give a fuck what you've done before, this chemical is an entirely different beast from any of it. People have been hospitalized and people have DIED from this drug. Don't take a "threshold" dose and then say "oh that 15mg didn't seem to do much, lets see what 50mg does"... jesus christ people, use your heads!



50mg seems to be a good dose for what i am after, visuals etc, i think it would be hard to overdose at that level if taken by itself, as i said i just want to know can ya keep ya shit together if need be?


----------



## MagickalKat777

From Erowid:

# We have also received several reports of severe vomiting, dissociation, dehydration, and extreme reactions with as little as 40mg oral AMT. New users should not begin experimentation above the threshold level of any psychoactive drug and should slowly work their way up over the course of several sessions to avoid dangerously strong reactions.
# People experienced in experimenting with powerful psychoactives recommend starting with very low doses and working up to check for one's personal thresholds for each compound. 

But hey, do what you want. I've personally overdosed on AMT before and I don't remember much of anything but my friend who was with me was about two seconds from driving me to the hospital.

50mg should be fine as long as you aren't sensitive to it... But I've seen as little as 40mg break a hard core acid tripper down to tears.

Also, 21 of the 34 trip reports classified as health problems were AMT only, not combinations... 16 of those were 30mg or above. A number of them BETWEEN 30 and 50mg... 

Just be careful. Honestly you can always redose 3 hours into the trip if thirty isn't enough with the other 20...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> From Erowid:
> 
> # We have also received several reports of severe vomiting, dissociation, dehydration, and extreme reactions with as little as 40mg oral AMT. New users should not begin experimentation above the threshold level of any psychoactive drug and should slowly work their way up over the course of several sessions to avoid dangerously strong reactions.
> # People experienced in experimenting with powerful psychoactives recommend starting with very low doses and working up to check for one's personal thresholds for each compound.
> 
> But hey, do what you want. I've personally overdosed on AMT before and I don't remember much of anything but my friend who was with me was about two seconds from driving me to the hospital.
> 
> 50mg should be fine as long as you aren't sensitive to it... But I've seen as little as 40mg break a hard core acid tripper down to tears.



i gonna have 39mg to start and an eleven mg booster later

/me snuggles Kat xx


----------



## MagickalKat777

I would seriously recommend starting with 30 and saving the 20 for 3 hours after the dose if you aren't feeling it as much as you'd like... or 4 hours to be on the safe side... see my edits I did to that post.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> I would seriously recommend starting with 30 and saving the 20 for 3 hours after the dose if you aren't feeling it as much as you'd like... or 4 hours to be on the safe side... see my edits I did to that post.



cheers Kat


----------



## Mullered

MagickalKat777 said:


> I would seriously recommend starting with 30 and saving the 20 for 3 hours after the dose if you aren't feeling it as much as you'd like... or 4 hours to be on the safe side... see my edits I did to that post.



Im thinking of starting with 30mg myself scooby, maybe even 25mg and then topping up 3-4 hours later if need be.

How do I tell the difference between the HCL and freebase versions?


----------



## Vader

> If you look at the skeleton of AMT versus AMP, its not hard to see why.


How does looking at the structure tell you that?


----------



## Xamkou

I can't believe how much this is taking off now. It was quite difficult to get hold of a few months ago on the net (unless you knew where to look) and now it couldn't be more simple. I'm worried that people will buy it and ignore the warnings about how taking only small amounts of the chemical could potentially kill you. A shit storm is brewing. I fucking love aMT but I think its legal days could be numbered.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Mullered said:


> Im thinking of starting with 30mg myself scooby, maybe even 25mg and then topping up 3-4 hours later if need be.
> 
> How do I tell the difference between the HCL and freebase versions?



Ask your vendor about it because of the 20% dose adjustment.



Yerg said:


> How does looking at the structure tell you that?



AMT is amphetamine with a tryptamine instead of PEA skeleton.


----------



## Vader

Right, but when you take away the phenethylamine from amphetamine, you're only left with a single methyl group. Does the same logic apply to alpha-methylfentanyl? After all, that's alpha methylated.


----------



## feeny87

ok thanks dont think i will take it for tiesto maybe try 6-apb. so would amt be good for a night in with some trance music?


----------



## Scoobysnacks Bware

Scoobysnacks is up to his/her old tricks again. All he/she seems to do is infiltrate a certain thread and ask questions or claim 'facts' that Bluelight's resident moderator feels obliged to answer which is quite frankly a waste of their time.

Scoobysnacks has been wetting on about various subjects including AMT & 6-APB for ages now and keeps asking basic questions, etc. which only serve to distort and clog up the thread - in my newbie opinion. 

Scoobysnacks, please go away and stop ruining every thread you get involved in. You really do not seem to ever post anything worthwhile and I for one have been reading for months now.

This website has Harm Reduction as its main reason to exist and too many people are clouding the waters and wasting genuine posters/viewers/enquirer's time and energy - let alone the moderators who have to patiently deal with irrelevant waffle in a balanced and surely exasperating manner (for them and most of us who are simply seeking harm reduction info).

Mods: I've read the rules carefully and don't think I've broken any - sorry in advance if that's not the case. Just fed up with reading posts that continuously confuse the issues at stake.


----------



## MagickalKat777

feeny87 said:


> ok thanks dont think i will take it for tiesto maybe try 6-apb. so would amt be good for a night in with some trance music?



6-APB? You're kidding right?

Seriously, save the research chems for a save environment. Ie., at home. I remember taking a low level dose of 2C-C and going to a party... had a terrible experience even though 2C-C had never had a body load to it or a dark head space, I couldn't breathe, I was freaked out by the lights... even going in the chill room, the echo of the music made me dizzy and nauseous...

Sorry but I just can't advocate research chemicals at parties. I would be extremely reckless to advocate it.

And yes, AMT would be fantastic for a night in with some trance music.


----------



## Dr Mamba

2 CB and 4aco DIPT are very nice party chemicals, "RC" means nothing, its not a class of product, you cant make a rule that apply to any "RC".


----------



## Xamkou

feeny87 said:


> ok thanks dont think i will take it for tiesto maybe try 6-apb. so would amt be good for a night in with some trance music?



Personally, whilst a 6-APB fan, I wouldn't recommend it for a party.


----------



## Taoluo

Xamkou said:


> Personally, whilst a 6-APB fan, I wouldn't recommend it for a party.



You think? I would. I had an amazing time clubbing on 6-APB.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Mullered said:


> Im thinking of starting with 30mg myself scooby, maybe even 25mg and then topping up 3-4 hours later if need be.
> 
> How do I tell the difference between the HCL and freebase versions?



im not sure what the freebase looks like  mate, Ben will know that , the hcl doing the rounds in the uk is grey and very similar to cemment with varying size granules alongside dust, just got three 5mg diazepam off my brother in law for the comedown, decided im gonna take 40mg and save 10 mg for smoking at a later date




Scoobysnacks Bware said:


> Scoobysnacks is up to his/her old tricks again. All he/she seems to do is infiltrate a certain thread and ask questions or claim 'facts' that Bluelight's resident moderator feels obliged to answer which is quite frankly a waste of their time.
> 
> Scoobysnacks has been wetting on about various subjects including AMT & 6-APB for ages now and keeps asking basic questions, etc. which only serve to distort and clog up the thread - in my newbie opinion.
> 
> Scoobysnacks, please go away and stop ruining every thread you get involved in. You really do not seem to ever post anything worthwhile and I for one have been reading for months now.
> 
> This website has Harm Reduction as its main reason to exist and too many people are clouding the waters and wasting genuine posters/viewers/enquirer's time and energy - let alone the moderators who have to patiently deal with irrelevant waffle in a balanced and surely exasperating manner (for them and most of us who are simply seeking harm reduction info).
> 
> Mods: I've read the rules carefully and don't think I've broken any - sorry in advance if that's not the case. Just fed up with reading posts that continuously confuse the issues at stake.



im honoured you would spend the energy and time to make an account with that nick, im also flattered you have read everyone of my posts:D, i asked a question which was answered, scooby bashing is so last year mate


----------



## Mullered

Scoobysnacks said:


> im not sure what the freebase looks like  mate, Ben will know that , the hcl doing the rounds in the uk is grey and very similar to cemment with varying size granules alongside dust, just got three 5mg diazepam off my brother in law for the comedown, decided im gonna take 40mg and save 10 mg for smoking at a later date



I've checked the site where my sample is coming from and its supposed to be freebase.  Am I right in saying that the freebase is the stronger version and should be dosed 20% less than the HCL version?  Or have I got it the wrong way round?


----------



## Vader

Yes, the freebase is stronger.


----------



## Mullered

So would 20mg be a reasonable starting dose for an experienced substance user?


----------



## ashtray girl

I'd suggest 25-30mg of freebase to start.  Then top up 3+ hours later, if you need to.


----------



## Mullered

ashtray girl said:


> I'd suggest 25-30mg of freebase to start.  Then top up 3+ hours later, if you need to.



How trippy is it generraly at around the 30mg mark? Im not really into anything overly psychedelic  , Im looking more fore the seratonine release, empathy and stimulation etc.  Is it possible to get these effects without it being trippy?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Dr Mamba said:


> 2 CB and 4aco DIPT are very nice party chemicals, "RC" means nothing, its not a class of product, you cant make a rule that apply to any "RC".



2C-B has been used at parties for years upon years. It also is not a research chemical and has a relatively known safety profile.

4-AcO-DiPT doesn't last long enough to be of much use at a party... I suppose it could be a good sit against the wall most of the night but only trip hard for 2 hours kind of drug... but that's boring at a huge party. Perfectly fine for a house party.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Mullered said:


> How trippy is it generraly at around the 30mg mark? Im not really into anything overly psychedelic  , Im looking more fore the seratonine release, empathy and stimulation etc.  Is it possible to get these effects without it being trippy?



Sounds like a good dose if that's what you're looking for.


----------



## Mullered

MagickalKat777 said:


> 2C-B has been used at parties for years upon years. It also is not a research chemical and has a relatively known safety profile.
> 
> 4-AcO-DiPT doesn't last long enough to be of much use at a party... I suppose it could be a good sit against the wall most of the night but only trip hard for 2 hours kind of drug... but that's boring at a huge party. Perfectly fine for a house party.



Whats AMT like in a party / club situation?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Mullered said:


> Whats AMT like in a party / club situation?



http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost.php?p=8770895&postcount=1249

Read that and my posts on page 51.

In general, its pretty overwhelming although its wonderful at outdoor events as long as they aren't too hot and you have a place you can sit and relax when things get overwhelming. Big rave/club-type parties I and my friends have gotten sick and just had a shitty time until we went outside... This is especially true for venues that have no cooling.


----------



## Mullered

MagickalKat777 said:


> http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost.php?p=8770895&postcount=1249
> 
> Read that and my posts on page 51.
> 
> In general, its pretty overwhelming although its wonderful at outdoor events as long as they aren't too hot and you have a place you can sit and relax when things get overwhelming. Big rave/club-type parties I and my friends have gotten sick and just had a shitty time until we went outside... This is especially true for venues that have no cooling.



Thanks for the info Magickal.  Im so gutted that I have already been to the last big dance festival of the season in the uk before discovering AMT.  Theres a decent big trance club not far from where I live but it can get hot and crowded in there although they do have a large outside area thats easily accesible.  Ill see how it goes when I road test it with my other half next weekend then hopefuly I will be able to make a more educated decesion as to whether I will find it suited to a club environment


----------



## gannetsarewe

Mullered said:


> Thanks for the info Magickal.  Im so gutted that I have already been to the last big dance festival of the season in the uk before discovering AMT.  Theres a decent big trance club not far from where I live but it can get hot and crowded in there although they do have a large outside area thats easily accesible.  Ill see how it goes when I road test it with my other half next weekend then hopefuly I will be able to make a more educated decesion as to whether I will find it suited to a club environment



It is not a club drug, you could use small amounts and be sociable but you would or may find it too debilitating if you took a psychedelic dose. Pointless really paying in and  perhaps waiting 4 or 5 hours in the outside area waiting for the BL to wear off so you are able to climb into a cab to go home. I wasted an afternoon on it, it happened to me at the beach too lazy to walk anywhere and I had to ring a friend to be bring me home because I didn't fancy trying to get my babies pushchair onto the bus.


----------



## MagickalKat777

*sigh*

AMT arrived today... its seen better days and I honestly don't know how decomposed it is and if its worth messing with... it stuck to the inside of the baggie like crazy... took me working the bag for about 15 minutes to get it up from scaling 846mg to 996mg (was a 1g order) and there is still a lot stuck in the bag. Even after putting it in a glass vitamin bottle and agitating it, its still all clumped together... and good god the smell is so bad...

I am going to be pissed if I wasted as much money as I spent on this... My hands smell like moth balls just from handling the bag...


----------



## Banjo Fury

Scoobysnacks said:


> i wasnt trying to be cocky in the slightest Magical, sorry if ya think that, i was wanting to know can you function at 50 mg as in go to a shop , walk my dogs etc



Going by your bad experience with the 6 apb pellets (your six day comedown and added stimulation) I'd give this one a miss if I was you. Certainly not at the 50mg you are talking about. Some people have bad reactions and you seem prone to it.

In answer to your question, at 50mg NO - you would not be able to function properly! Set and setting. If you have anything urgent in the 24hrs after taking don't do it.

Last thing we all need is you spamming this thread and internet with your bad experiences because you did not treat this with the respect it deserves.

Take the advice and start low.


----------



## feeny87

MagickalKat777 said:


> 6-APB? You're kidding right?
> 
> Seriously, save the research chems for a save environment. Ie., at home. I remember taking a low level dose of 2C-C and going to a party... had a terrible experience even though 2C-C had never had a body load to it or a dark head space, I couldn't breathe, I was freaked out by the lights... even going in the chill room, the echo of the music made me dizzy and nauseous...
> 
> Sorry but I just can't advocate research chemicals at parties. I would be extremely reckless to advocate it.
> 
> And yes, AMT would be fantastic for a night in with some trance music.



well when the 6-apb samples wer going i was lucky enough to receive one and it blew my mind so i reckon it would do nicely for tiesto. i just havent tried these pellets that are getting so many diff reports so thats why i was thinking about amt!


----------



## Xamkou

25mg freebase aMT, for me, went from total euphoria to a horrible state of dysphoria back to total euphoria with added entactogen/empathogen qualities and lovely little visuals. 

*QUESTION:* aMT + Ketamine = bad idea?


----------



## psood0nym

The answer to that equation's answer is its inverse.  Add nitrous and music and you'll be shorting out your headphones because your brain will be ejaculating out of your ears.


----------



## Xamkou

Daaaaaaang. Thought so.


----------



## |>R()|)!G/-\|_

6 mg +/- 1 of Chinese AMT freebase from 2006 produced some extra visual clarity and clean stimulation.  Music, exercise, and the outdoors were wonderful. It was not entirely physically transparent.  There was some gut discomfort and feelings of tightness in the forearms and hands.  Effects were most pronounced between hours 5 and 7 but were still very mild.  I slept and drove fine after 8.5 hours.


----------



## Mullered

The more I read up on the substance the less Im planning to take on my first dose.  Initially I was considering 30- 40mg but Im not looking for a full on  Psychedelic expereience,  Now Im thinking of taking 20mg (my missus will be dropping too). 

Im looking for something comparable to an MDMA type roll. Will I get anything like this from 15 - 20mg of freebase?


----------



## psood0nym

Probably not. It's less of an intense rushy euphoria and more like if that intensity had a rolling pin taken to it and flattened it out over time.  So a slower onset, much longer duration, moderate to strong euphoria depending on where you are in the duration, and no crash or nasty after effects.  The closest I've gotten to making aMT like a super long and fairly intense roll was by combining it with repeated doses of MDAI and Adderall.  That was great.  It was most everything that MDMA is but much longer and with, again, no crash.  Got brain zaps from the massive prolonged serotonin dump, though. Cured it with a 300 mg dose of DXM (I've used this "cure" successfully twice now; one dose is all it takes to get rid of them and not return). Combining it with opiates increases the euphoria substantially, and in my experience at least, increases the empathy component. That combo is not like MDMA of course due to the much more floaty relaxed opiated feeling but it nevertheless has many of its features. Adding Adderall and a few drinks or GHB to the opiate combo is pure hedonism -- one big dumb body orgasm for a few hours.


----------



## Xamkou

15-20 is no way MDMA. 30-40 could be I _suppose_ though I've never done that myself. Probably more like MDA due to visuals. Aaaaaaaaaand I'd still suggest you start low (20-25).


----------



## Mullered

Thanks for the info guys

I think we will stick to 20mg and see how it goes.  Basically we just want to get nice, chatty, euphoric and loved up


----------



## Xamkou

20mg at first. Wait three or four hours - if it doesn't feel enough, dose another 20mg. 

I started at 25mg and I never quite got there. Couldn't re-dose as I'd shared my 50mg with a friend. Daaaaaaaaym.


----------



## ashtray girl

I wouldn't dose another 20mg after a few hours - that is doubling your dose  I'd add another 5-10mg max.


----------



## Xamkou

Don't agree. Adding 20mg once you're already in the trip wouldn't feel like an extra 20mg. Someone who knows alot about aMT would be able to explain better.


----------



## jebus

Xamkou said:


> Don't agree. Adding 20mg once you're already in the trip wouldn't feel like an extra 20mg. Someone who knows alot about aMT would be able to explain better.



Same with a lot of drugs.


----------



## psood0nym

I've only ever re-dosed when using aMT intramuscularly, and the increase was pretty linear. However, that was always within an hour of the first injection.  Orally you have to wait 3 hours before you're plateaued, and I could see how tolerance effects may make doubling the dose not double the intensity.  That said, every time I've taken extra of something like LSD or 4-AcO-DMT to compensate for suspected tolerance developed from using the day before I've ended up with a more intense experience than expected.


----------



## ashtray girl

It doesn't double the intensity, but there is a big jump from 25 to 35mg.  20 to 40mg is going to be a massive increase in effects.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Banjo Fury said:


> Going by your bad experience with the 6 apb pellets (your six day comedown and added stimulation) I'd give this one a miss if I was you. Certainly not at the 50mg you are talking about. Some people have bad reactions and you seem prone to it.
> 
> In answer to your question, at 50mg NO - you would not be able to function properly! Set and setting. If you have anything urgent in the 24hrs after taking don't do it.
> 
> Last thing we all need is you spamming this thread and internet with your bad experiences because you did not treat this with the respect it deserves.
> 
> Take the advice and start low.



well a member here who i listen too says he was fine at that dose as in functioning normally, but thanks for your concern, this is not like shit benzo fury, as we know what is actually in it..i got 3 benzos to help with any stimulation i may encounter on the comedown

( ps ..love ya nick )


----------



## mi5

Mullered said:
			
		

> The more I read up on the substance the less Im planning to take on my first dose.  Initially I was considering 30- 40mg but Im not looking for a full on  Psychedelic expereience,  Now Im thinking of taking 20mg (my missus will be dropping too).




Good idea. There's no rush anyway, take your time


----------



## Mullered

Thanks for all the great advice! 

As its my first time Im going to keep it at 25mg (or less) and not redose and see how it goes.  

Me and the other half both have a 50mg sample each so by keeping it at 25mg we get to have 2 sessions for free each, and get a chance to see what its like before going for higher doses.

One thing Im interested in as well as the high is the comedown.  A managable comedown is a strong selling point for me.  I have read varying reports; wikipedia says that the hangover is generrally milder than MDMA wheras I have read reports from people saying its the worst comedown ever and then again reports where people are saying there is no crash at all.  I guess the dosage has a lot to do with it as with any drug.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Mullered said:


> Thanks for all the great advice!
> 
> As its my first time Im going to keep it at 25mg (or less) and not redose and see how it goes.
> 
> Me and the other half both have a 50mg sample each so by keeping it at 25mg we get to have 2 sessions for free each, and get a chance to see what its like before going for higher doses.
> 
> One thing Im interested in as well as the high is the comedown.  A managable comedown is a strong selling point for me.  I have read varying reports; wikipedia says that the hangover is generrally milder than MDMA wheras I have read reports from people saying its the worst comedown ever and then again reports where people are saying there is no crash at all.  I guess the dosage has a lot to do with it as with any drug.



hey mate can ya get some sleepers?, take the edge of the comedown nicely Mullered..also check this 

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=503180

its available and sounds mint


----------



## psood0nym

Most reports of undesirable after effects are from using multiple doses over a few days.  The comedown is so slow it's unlikely you'll have a crash - at worst it'll be more like a flat landing on a runway without landing gear where everyone survives.  Some do report headaches at the end.  Preemtive dosing with aspirin and ibuprofen around 5 - 7 hours in, eating sugar and staying hydrated (like with any stimulant) should mostly prevent this. A couple of alcoholic drinks with some diphenhydramine after the trip is over usually gets rid of residual stimulation enough by around 12 hours to get me to sleep.  Cannabis smooths out the rough edges of the onset in a big way.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

psood0nym said:


> Most reports of undesirable after effects are from using multiple doses over a few days.  The comedown is so slow it's unlikely you'll have a crash - at worst it'll be more like a flat landing on a runway without landing gear where everyone survives.



mate how heavy is aMT compared to magic mushrooms dose wise, i.e 50 mg of amt would equal how many mushies eaten raw?

i have only 50 mg and it will be a while before i can take time off work again so i really dont want to underdose

i will have weed for the up , sleepers for the down and my wife is going to buy me loads of pure fruit smoothies as that shit makes ya feel amazing while ya high and it just like eating a meal without the heaviness, highley recomend to everyone


----------



## Mullered

Scoobysnacks said:


> hey mate can ya get some sleepers?



Wish I could


----------



## psood0nym

It's hard to say because people react so differently to different doses of aMT and the varying concentrations of psychoactives in mushrooms, but my standard moderately strong dose of aMT freebase is 60 mg, and in terms of psychedelia I suppose that's around the rough equivalent of 2.5 grams of mushrooms i.e. quite noticeable OEVs and CEVs with trippy thoughts.  However, the intensity of aMT is not nearly as attributable to psychedelia alone as it is with something like psilocin.  The monoamine release is a big part of it.  You get the swimmy, sort of stumbling fucked-upness from the serotonin and of course stimulation from the dopamine and norepinephrine, so saying 60 mg is about the same psychedelic intensity as 2.5 g of average to decent mushrooms doesn't account for the more MDMA-like intensity compounding it. Sorry I don't have a simpler answer, but it's a complex interaction that's going to be weighed differently by different people. 

The most intense experience I've had from it was a sense of floating in my body walking down a hallway on my way to get on a bus to go to an IMAX film.  I told my friend we better skip it since I wasn't sure I wouldn't get dizzy and fall down getting off the bus or something. It wasn't scary at all the way the rapid associations you might get from mushrooms can be, it was just a sense of being too fucked up to think public transit and street walking was a good idea. In fact, the positive push of the monoamine release, if anything, has made the psychedelia much less prone to cause any anxiety in my experience, at least after the onset.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

psood0nym said:


> It's hard to say because people react so differently to different doses of aMT and the varying concentrations of psychoactives in mushrooms, but my standard moderately strong dose of aMT freebase is 60 mg, and in terms of psychedelia I suppose that's around the rough equivalent of 2.5 grams of mushrooms i.e. quite noticeable OEVs and CEVs with trippy thoughts.  However, the intensity of aMT is not nearly as attributable to psychedelia alone as it is with something like psilocin.  The monoamine release is a big part of it.  You get the swimmy, sort of stumbling fucked-upness from the serotonin and of course stimulation from the dopamine and norepinephrine, so saying 60 mg is about the same psychedelic intensity as 2.5 g of average to decent mushrooms doesn't account for the more MDMA-like intensity compounding it. Sorry I don't have a simpler answer, but it's a complex interaction that's going to be weighed differently by different people.
> 
> The most intense experience I've had from it was a sense of floating in my body walking down a hallway on my way to get on a bus to go to an IMAX film.  I told my friend we better skip it since I wasn't sure I wouldn't get dizzy and fall down getting off the bus or something. It wasn't scary at all the way the rapid associations you might get from mushrooms can be, it was just a sense of being too fucked up to think public transit and street walking was a good idea. In fact, the positive push of the monoamine release, if anything, has made the psychedelia much less prone to cause any anxiety in my experience, at least after the onset.


 
thanks mate that was beautifully explained and i have made my mind up, im taking the whole 50mg, i have taken mushrooms countless times and there were times i was freaked out but never had a bad trip only bad moments, this sounds tamer and the mdma rushes wd be most welcome, got monday and tuesday booked off work and will prepare myself nicelt in the days leading up, plenty of sleep and greens lol


----------



## MagickalKat777

20mg AMT freebase down the hatch... here we go...


----------



## MagickalKat777

Scoobysnacks said:


> thanks mate that was beautifully explained and i have made my mind up, im taking the whole 50mg, i have taken mushrooms countless times and there were times i was freaked out but never had a bad trip only bad moments, this sounds tamer and the mdma rushes wd be most welcome, got monday and tuesday booked off work and will prepare myself nicelt in the days leading up, plenty of sleep and greens lol



its more the bodyload that becomes an issue with high doses...


----------



## MagickalKat777

Xamkou said:


> Don't agree. Adding 20mg once you're already in the trip wouldn't feel like an extra 20mg. Someone who knows alot about aMT would be able to explain better.



Once you're tripping on AMT, there is a bit of a cross tolerance. 20mg added 3 hours "into" AMT would be equivalent to 10-15mg of AMT taken at the beginning of the trip at the most.

That said, it WILL extend the duration so keep that in mind. Always wait at least 2 1/2-3 hours before redosing because some people come up really fast (30 minutes or so) and others take HOURS... You're more likely to come up around an hour on freebase I've noted while HCl takes longer. But that's a personal, not scientific, observation. Definitely err on the side of caution because too much AMT is rather unpleasant.


----------



## rainey

This is from a vendor who posts NMR`s of his drugs and creates the impression he knows exactly what he is talking about etc

I genuinely freaked when I received this and wriote to him hours ago...he has sent this to everyone on his mailing list.

No reply from him and no `adjustment` has been sent out to his group list so far......

(begin)

AMT (freebase). This has to be one of the most interesting ad hard to 

source chemicals we offer. This is extremely pure (we had it tested at 

an independent lab) and is without doubt the best find of this year. We 

tip this one to be extremely popular and maybe even more so than 6-APB. 

We will sell this in *0.1g quantities which is enough for one lab test* 

use with extreme caution and be sure to have the proper lab equipment 

and scales for any test which you wish to carry out 

 (end)

note the bit in bold....100mg for ONE DOSE????

imagine one of his customers has already bought this elsewhere and has received this mail this afternoon and thinks `ah....100mg is the rec dose`

nee naw nee naw nee naw

it`s all getting beyond a joke.


----------



## deano88

After a high dose of AMT going out in public can be a strange but fun experience. When I was walking to shop with my m8 at about 7am and feeling at my most fucked as I was walking I kept looking back and it didn't look as if we were getting any further from the flat and we were just walking on the spot it felt like we had been walking for about 5 mins but when we looked back we were only a few yards away then out of no where we were at the other end. Anyone else ever had this walking no the spot feeling?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Okay.. dirty AMT freebase... not pleasant... at all... there is reason why the HCl is recommended and now I remember why. Fuck this.


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ Why would freebase have any different effect other than higher potency?


----------



## MagickalKat777

love_sex_desire said:


> ^ Why would freebase have any different effect other than higher potency?



Because it breaks down and is not pleasant when it does.

I just went through hell from a simple 20mg. Head pounding, heart pounding, fluid retention, back pain, nausea for the last 6 hours, shaking...

I had no idea how bad it was going to be until I took it - I knew it was not in good condition but I didn't think it was anywhere near this bad. 

3mg of Klonopin later and I'm still feeling totally poisoned, can't sleep, totally tired, weird body pains ranging all over my body...

Seriously, I didn't believe it could be so bad. I would have rather taken 5-MeO-AMT - at least I would have seen some nice visuals.

I need to figure out how to clean this stuff up or just toss it all... but this was a nasty nasty experience. And 20mg is nothing. SO glad I didn't take 40 like I wanted to. Started off feeling fine and then the head pain and everything else set in. Nasty. Now I know what my friend Rachel went through when she left a gram of freebase out in the sun for a week and then took some. Definitely don't want to repeat this experience.

And unlike your average psychedelic, you can't terminate AMT. Now I'm just stuck with a crappy bodyload, a fucked up head space, and just feeling like I've been poisoned - I would rather eat a bunch of benedryl than feel the way I feel right now, that's how bad it is.


----------



## ashtray girl

MagickalKat777 said:


> I need to figure out how to clean this stuff up or just toss it all...


Is this stuff that you have imported from the UK, or have you found it locally?  I've always used the freebase from canada, but was interested in ordering some from the UK.

Hope you are feeling better soon.


----------



## Banjo Fury

MagickalKat777 said:


> Because it breaks down and is not pleasant when it does.
> 
> I just went through hell from a simple 20mg. Head pounding, heart pounding, fluid retention, back pain, nausea for the last 6 hours, shaking...
> 
> I had no idea how bad it was going to be until I took it - I knew it was not in good condition but I didn't think it was anywhere near this bad.
> 
> 3mg of Klonopin later and I'm still feeling totally poisoned, can't sleep, totally tired, weird body pains ranging all over my body...
> 
> Seriously, I didn't believe it could be so bad. I would have rather taken 5-MeO-AMT - at least I would have seen some nice visuals.
> 
> I need to figure out how to clean this stuff up or just toss it all... but this was a nasty nasty experience. And 20mg is nothing. SO glad I didn't take 40 like I wanted to. Started off feeling fine and then the head pain and everything else set in. Nasty. Now I know what my friend Rachel went through when she left a gram of freebase out in the sun for a week and then took some. Definitely don't want to repeat this experience.
> 
> And unlike your average psychedelic, you can't terminate AMT. Now I'm just stuck with a crappy bodyload, a fucked up head space, and just feeling like I've been poisoned - I would rather eat a bunch of benedryl than feel the way I feel right now, that's how bad it is.



There is good and bad around the UK at the moment. Some samples have been sent out that are degraded and bunk. They obviously don`t know what they are doing.

I have had 3 different samples over the last 2 weeks. 2 freebase and 1 hcl. 1 of the freebase i had similar experience to you at 25mg. It is not good! The other freebase was obviously clean pure and had a fantastic time.

Just goes to show you dont know exactly what you are taking and if people want to listen i would start low.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

just recieved my 50 mg sample, white powder with a smell like bad breath, will take on monday


----------



## Equal Observer

Got sent 2 50mg freebase samples by mistake, was just going to eat a little 15mg today, but because of this wee surprise I've popped 25mg. Will post how it goes.


----------



## midinoz

50mg free sample in possession, gonna give 25mg a bash too with a friend tomorrow or friday.. will attempt to make some sort of a trip report (albeit will be my first on here)

regarding Banjo Fury's post (great u/n btw!) .. how do i tell if i've got given the whack freebase? it's slightly yellowed and smells quite a bit like bad breath also


----------



## Xamkou

Got 150mg of freebase in my possession now plus 50mg of Methoxetamine on way. Exciting weekend lies ahead!


----------



## Banjo Fury

midinoz said:


> 50mg free sample in possession, gonna give 25mg a bash too with a friend tomorrow or friday.. will attempt to make some sort of a trip report (albeit will be my first on here)
> 
> regarding Banjo Fury's post (great u/n btw!) .. how do i tell if i've got given the whack freebase? it's slightly yellowed and smells quite a bit like bad breath also



The good aMT I could smell through the padded envelope, very pungent. It was bright white and slightly fluffy.

The bad, the smell was only there when the plastic bag was opened. Same but not as strong. It was off white almost tan.

I would pm but I can't as yet.


----------



## Xamkou

Banjo Fury said:


> The good aMT I could smell through the padded envelope, very pungent. It was bright white and slightly fluffy.
> 
> The bad, the smell was only there when the plastic bag was opened. Same but not as strong. It was off white almost tan.
> 
> I would pm but I can't as yet.





Scoobysnacks said:


> just recieved my 50 mg sample, white powder with a smell like bad breath, will take on monday



Mine smelt like that. You've got the good stuff, it seems.


----------



## farmyardchap

Is the dodgy freebase coming from a vendor within the UK (can I ask that?) its just that I've got some on the way, and wouldn't want to risk it with dodgy stuff going about.  Mine is coming from a vendor in the Netherlands though.


----------



## Mullered

So if it smells of bad breath its a thumbs up?


----------



## midinoz

we're talking dog-shit, stale coffee, not-brush teethed high school teacher breath yea?

and mine is a tad yellow rather than white, but nowhere near as yellow as some of the bunk m-cat that was about not long after the ban for example.


----------



## Mullered

Mine has just arrived, I would describe the smell as 'work colleague's bad breath'.  Mine is white,  with a slight  tint of cream.

Wish they would put such small amounts of powder in a paper wrap before putting it in the baggie.  Half of it is stuck in the corners of the bag!


----------



## getinnocuous

just received my 50mg sample..stinks to high heaven, could smell it through the envelope. looking forward to testing!


----------



## Ben So Furry

wow I had an amazing but somewhat in controlled experience on 60mg freebase. Got a 50mg sample very light coloured very stinky and after my past experienced thought I'd be ok with the whole 50mg.  

Well now I know what Xorkoth and MagikalKat have been getting at, the other freebase I had at higher dose was more visual but I was in control of it, I could function fine.  This is total euphoria, boot shaking euphoria, no visuals as such like the last times but things seems sparkly and bright.  But the euphoria I'm feeling of 50mg very pale freebase is something I had thought I'd lost.  Totally overwhelming.

My thanks to Xorkoth and MagikalKat777 (and others) for being relentless in your message to take it easy and slowly, build up, never think you've got the measure of something, it is appreciated,  now I know why. 

Must TR this when I can see straight

Take it steady is the point, I thought I had the measure and I'm now a blubby, incoherent, incapacitated mess. Be careful Xorkoth and MagikalKat777 know.


----------



## Equal Observer

25mg of freebase, very easily handled. Went up some fields, got quality visuals, experienced walking but not getting any further, colour shifts. And as a big bonus I found what must be the first liberty caps of the season (and the first I've ever found) Feeling alright now, wish I was out again but its a tad cold, don't like being confined, too restless. Headspace feels mongy and clear at the same time.


----------



## psood0nym

Ben So Fury said:
			
		

> wow I had an amazing but somewhat in controlled experience on 60mg freebase. Got a 50mg sample very light coloured very stinky and after my past experienced thought I'd be ok with the whole 50mg.
> 
> Well now I know what Xorkoth and MagikalKat have been getting at, the other freebase I had at higher dose was more visual but I was in control of it, I could function fine. This is total euphoria, boot shaking euphoria, no visuals as such like the last times but things seems sparkly and bright. But the euphoria I'm feeling of 50mg very pale freebase is something I had thought I'd lost. Totally overwhelming.
> 
> My thanks to Xorkoth and MagikalKat777 for being relentless in your message to take it easy and slowly, build up, never think you've got the measure of something, it is appreciated, now I know why.
> 
> Must TR this when I can see straight
> 
> Take it steady is the point, I thought I had the measure and I'm now a blubby, incoherent, incapacitated mess. Be careful Xorkoth and MagikalKat777 know.


It flipped on the dopa-epinephrine electric jitter switch and sent your brain for a fuse blowing swim in the serotonin filled washing machine, eh? That's what I was talking about before where even if the psychedelia isn't too intense the monoamine release can still get you really floaty, sloshy, and disoriented. It's probably best just to ride it out so the lesson really sticks but if things get substantially more intense benzos or a few drinks should help with any more worrisome anxiety and trembling.


----------



## Ben So Furry

psood0nym said:


> It flipped on the dopa-epinephrine electric jitter switch and sent your brain for a fuse blowing swim in the serotonin filled washing machine, eh? That's what I was talking about before where even if the psychedelia isn't too intense the monoamine release can still get you really floaty, sloshy, and disoriented. It's probably best just to ride it out so the lesson really sticks but if things get substantially more intense benzos or a few drinks should help with any more worrisome anxiety and trembling.



Thank you for the very thoughtful and informative advice psood0nym it is greatly appreciated.

Though I have to say even though the first say...oh..4 hours were a slighty messy, intense ride I have now completely mellowed and feel back in control.  I just wasn't expecting such a bumpy ripe up here. I thought I wouldn't be able to handle things on the way up, but if I feel I want to be back in control I can sort of snap myself round long enough to make sure I'm safe before melting into a yummy pot of gorgeousness.

I'm going to ride this out as it's settled thanks psood0nym.

I'll edit any of the above later if it's not appropriate, my apologies.


----------



## psood0nym

There's nothing inappropriate about your post. Glad to hear it's going smoothly for you. Just relax and enjoy the ride.


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ To those asking if the nasty indole mothball smell is indicative of high purity, I don't think it will indicate much. Two different freebase batches that both smell rank could have vastly differing levels of impurities. I have two different samples of AMT freebase, neither are from recent UK batches. One is white and the other is slightly yellowish, and both appear to have the same effects profile. Smell and colour alone aren't enough to gauge the quality. Hope everyone has good quality aMT!


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Equal Observer said:


> Got sent 2 50mg freebase samples by mistake, was just going to eat a little 15mg today, but because of this wee surprise I've popped 25mg. Will post how it goes.



lmao..nice one mate, have a great un

/me waves to Fluffy...hope ya good mate


----------



## Delsyd

I dont think amt is the only thing to blame here.
You put your brain and body through quite a bit by using m1 a couple days in a row.
Also that dose is a bit on the low side.
Low doses of amt are not pleasant. It only gets fun once you've taken enough to trip (or 5-10mg is a good way to spend the day too).

If it were me id wait a week or two and eat 40mg.
Youd be surprised how different it will feel.



MagickalKat777 said:


> Because it breaks down and is not pleasant when it does.
> 
> I just went through hell from a simple 20mg. Head pounding, heart pounding, fluid retention, back pain, nausea for the last 6 hours, shaking...
> 
> I had no idea how bad it was going to be until I took it - I knew it was not in good condition but I didn't think it was anywhere near this bad.
> 
> 3mg of Klonopin later and I'm still feeling totally poisoned, can't sleep, totally tired, weird body pains ranging all over my body...
> 
> Seriously, I didn't believe it could be so bad. I would have rather taken 5-MeO-AMT - at least I would have seen some nice visuals.
> 
> I need to figure out how to clean this stuff up or just toss it all... but this was a nasty nasty experience. And 20mg is nothing. SO glad I didn't take 40 like I wanted to. Started off feeling fine and then the head pain and everything else set in. Nasty. Now I know what my friend Rachel went through when she left a gram of freebase out in the sun for a week and then took some. Definitely don't want to repeat this experience.
> 
> And unlike your average psychedelic, you can't terminate AMT. Now I'm just stuck with a crappy bodyload, a fucked up head space, and just feeling like I've been poisoned - I would rather eat a bunch of benedryl than feel the way I feel right now, that's how bad it is.


----------



## psood0nym

^Agreed, you're trying to squeeze out dopamine from vesicles that probably look like raisins.  Not to mention you may still be dehydrated.  These two things alone could explain a lot of your symptoms.

Re the smell/quality conjecture, I'll add to the skepticism already levied and say probably the purest aMT I've ever had (judging from how fast and clearly in goes into solution) has been totally odorless HCl.  I've also had nearly odorless white freebase that was of the expected quality.  No amount of color or smell I've ever come across in about 7 different samples from 5 different sources over the years has made any consistent difference in effects.  Tiny bits of whatever or lack thereof make big differences to color, smell, consistency etc, and I doubt the breakdown products present in even, say, 92 percent pure batches, are sufficiently psychoactive to alter the effects in any kind of "double-blind" statistically significant way.


----------



## deano88

So can different batches vary in effects or quality a lot?


----------



## psood0nym

^They probably don't vary all that much.  For a chemical to directly impact experience due to impurities in its synthesis its impurities must, themselves, be psychoactive. There may be chemicals whose unreacted synthesis byproducts are psychoactive, or whose breakdown metabolites are psychoactive, but so far as I know it's not common for these fractional amounts to be both psychoactive and an order of magnitude more potent than their parent compounds -- as they must be if they are to influence the subjective experience of the trip in amounts on the order of 0.01 - 8 percent impurities, as is a common breakdown in RC syntheses.  Variance in experience is most often better accounted for by set and setting.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Delsyd said:


> I dont think amt is the only thing to blame here.
> You put your brain and body through quite a bit by using m1 a couple days in a row.
> Also that dose is a bit on the low side.
> Low doses of amt are not pleasant. It only gets fun once you've taken enough to trip (or 5-10mg is a good way to spend the day too).
> 
> If it were me id wait a week or two and eat 40mg.
> Youd be surprised how different it will feel.



I actually factored this in to the the equation - I gave a 30mg and a 40mg dose to two separate friends, the one who ate 30mg had a terrible time of it (she is quite sensitive to AMT bodyload like myself), then one who ate 40mg had visuals that she said she wouldn't relate to AMT at all.

Even at 20mg, I was getting some pretty strong flowing... usually that wouldn't start to manifest until 40 or 50mg... 

Anyway, I was just happy for it to be over. You may be right about the dose but I don't want to push it... that was not pleasant and I've done all sorts of doses of AMT before and the only other time it wasn't pleasant was when we did AMT freebase that was stored stupidly.

This stuff was so highly degraded Delsyd that when examining the bag, it was yellow with white spots in it and it clumps together so much that even once I got it out of the bag (for the most part - some of it seemed to have fused with the bag), agitating it broke it up into two parts - a bunch of clumps and a bunch of fine powder... I took the clumps. I'm almost betting the fine powder would be perfectly fine.

My methylone use may have had something to do with this but I had 48 hours between the come down of the M1 and coming up on the AMT, was well-rested, had enough food, etc., this was just crappy AMT bodyload.

Anyway, I'll hold onto it and use the powder next time, at 30mg...

Something to keep in mind though - nothing knocks AMT out. I took 3mg of Klonopin, some phenibut, and even two Remeron and still couldn't pass out. Anything else, I would have been out cold. I have friends that take Trazodone on the come down but even still, they can't sleep until the plateau has worn off. Just a word of caution that I had totally forgotten - there is just about NO WAY to abort a bad AMT trip.

Careful everyone!

And Delsyd, you have PM 

EDIT: Oh and I by no way meant to imply that the freebase smell meant better quality product, I meant it is a good way to guage you actually have AMT - nothing else smells like AMT freebase - rather than having something else like 5-MeO-AMT. IMO, one of the only advantages of freebase AMT besides lower dosing requirements is that the smell of skatole will give it away - properly done AMT freebase (ie., pure), will have almost no strong smell to it but that stuff is quite rare as it needs to be QUITE pure.


----------



## BobWeir'd

Haven't tried aMT. If I do I was wondering in your experiences does it have an aphrodisiac effect like a lot of other drugs.

If taken at home will I play music for a long time or is it more likely to end up in the bedroom with my mrs?

Seems it lasts a very long time. Not too sure about it.


----------



## MagickalKat777

BobWeir'd said:


> Haven't tried aMT. If I do I was wondering in your experiences does it have an aphrodisiac effect like a lot of other drugs.
> 
> If taken at home will I play music for a long time or is it more likely to end up in the bedroom with my mrs?
> 
> Seems it lasts a very long time. Not too sure about it.



High doses it was a very erotic drug... but normal low doses should be neutral... You will most likely play music for a long long long time...


----------



## Mullered

arrrgghhh Im starting to worry about my first time 2mg dose now.  Dont want to push it by taking any more though.  this may not be the chemical for me, we shall see!!


----------



## MagickalKat777

Mullered said:


> arrrgghhh Im starting to worry about my first time 2mg dose now.  Dont want to push it by taking any more though.  this may not be the chemical for me, we shall see!!



2mg? You won't even feel that.

Let me tell you that I may very well have psyched myself out on the AMT based on past experiences with bad quality stuff... And Delsyd may very well be right that my brain was just zapped along with my body... 

I can tell you that out of my 20 or so experiences with it that I can remember, only 2 or 3 of them were ever bad, yesterday included... But when I was doing AMT, it was pretty much the ONLY thing I was doing... I wasn't doing drugs like M1 that blast the receptors...

Just make sure you stay really hydrated - also, having Emergen-C on hand will help amazingly with the body load. I did start to feel much better after drinking an Emergen-C packet and its always been that way - if I hadn't popped the Klonopin and instead drank the Emergen-C first, I may very well have not had such a nasty experience. I have a feeling that taking the Klonopin may have made things worse because it wanted to sedate me and AMT wasn't having any part of it so it just made the trip drag on longer and longer.


----------



## ashtray girl

Don't stress or you won't enjoy it.

Just start low and enjoy the experience.  Most people enjoy it, other than the bodyload.


----------



## BobWeir'd

Thanks MagickalKat777

Seems to me this may be a quite perfect drug for the home music listening (DJ'ing) experience. I don't mind the aphrodisiac effect of some RC's but in many cases it's so much that it overrides everything else (or perhaps that's just me)

A perfect night for me would be *plenty* of music listening before the eventual (inevitable?) sexfest. 

I don't take Viagra or anything like that but I wonder if our night does go as mentioned above, does the drug cause the sort of problem associated with some peoples need for Viagra? Stimulants are the main culprits for this I know but I'm wondering what aMT is like in that sense as I gather it's a psychedelic with _some_ stimulant properties?

I think it's useful to know what _might well_ happen so we have no surprises. (I realise everybody is different.) Cheers folks.

(ps I see people on here refer to 'bodyload' quite a lot. I'm not really sure what this means)


----------



## Mullered

MagickalKat777 said:


> 2mg? You won't even feel that.
> 
> Let me tell you that I may very well have psyched myself out on the AMT based on past experiences with bad quality stuff... And Delsyd may very well be right that my brain was just zapped along with my body...
> 
> I can tell you that out of my 20 or so experiences with it that I can remember, only 2 or 3 of them were ever bad, yesterday included... But when I was doing AMT, it was pretty much the ONLY thing I was doing... I wasn't doing drugs like M1 that blast the receptors...
> 
> Just make sure you stay really hydrated - also, having Emergen-C on hand will help amazingly with the body load. I did start to feel much better after drinking an Emergen-C packet and its always been that way - if I hadn't popped the Klonopin and instead drank the Emergen-C first, I may very well have not had such a nasty experience. I have a feeling that taking the Klonopin may have made things worse because it wanted to sedate me and AMT wasn't having any part of it so it just made the trip drag on longer and longer.



sorry, that should have said 20mg!!


----------



## Ben So Furry

BobWeir'd said:


> Thanks MagickalKat777
> 
> Seems to me this may be a quite perfect drug for the home music listening (DJ'ing) experience. I don't mind the aphrodisiac effect of some RC's but in many cases it's so much that it overrides everything else (or perhaps that's just me)
> 
> A perfect night for me would be *plenty* of music listening before the eventual (inevitable?) sexfest.
> 
> I don't take Viagra or anything like that but I wonder if our night does go as mentioned above, does the drug cause the sort of problem associated with some peoples need for Viagra? Stimulants are the main culprits for this I know but I'm wondering what aMT is like in that sense as I gather it's a psychedelic with _some_ stimulant properties?
> 
> I think it's useful to know what _might well_ happen so we have no surprises. (I realise everybody is different.) Cheers folks.
> 
> (ps I see people on here refer to 'bodyload' quite a lot. I'm not really sure what this means)



I had serious sound distortion on a 60mg freebase dose that would completely destroy the ability to beatmatch. Shouldn't stop you trying though. I never had this yesterday into last night and going still I could listen to music through speakers and really get in touch with it and separate all the parts. Was very involving and allowed me to calm myself of the original shock of the rushes. My sense of hearing felt highly tuned and I was talking quietly because it sounded like I was booming this is why when I put earphones in on yesterday's dose the music at any volume was completely overwhelming.  

BobWeir'd I suggest you and your partner put the music on in the bedroom and see where the mood takes you. Take your time and have fun. I didn't get overly sexually aroused like I have done on other drugs but I did want sex because I felt so good and wanted to share this and my missus' flesh looked so damn stunning.  We played and cuddled for a long time stroking and cuddling and the physical finger tip strokes were absolutely amazing, feeling the goosebumps raise as I slide my finger and almost see sparks shooting around the area it passed.  

It was complete and utter magic.   

It really is pointless to say which batch was better or if there is any difference at all. Many have said this drug varies greatly every time and my last two experiences were both totally amazing in different ways for different reasons. 




psood0nym said:


> Variance in experience is most often better accounted for by set and setting.



It's been mentioned many times before with regards amt specifically but my two experiences  have varied so much I wonder what adventures are in store next time?  

I learnt to not get complacent and think I'm invincible because I have done it once before and therefore know it inside and out. 

At the beginning and during the most intense parts it was like I was being shown briefly how it can bite like it was warning me then when I got the point it would reign it in a little. Before telling me off sternly but fairly after that lesson had been learnt it dropped me into a really nice mellow trippy dreamy sequence that I felt completely in control and on top of.  I had a great yellowy time as the colour yellow seemed a prominent theme.

I slept happily for a few hours and have woken feeling great but obviously still under the influence, coming up to 18 hours now.


----------



## BobWeir'd

Thanks Ben So Furry.

I'm looking at vendors and see some hcl and some freebase. I'm interested in trying both.

I take it the freebase is smoked in a pipe in a tiny quantity and the hcl is ingested sensibly starting at 10mg / 20 mg and see what happens.

Is it a bad idea to try the hcl and freebase on the same occasion?


----------



## Ben So Furry

I have tried the hcl and freebase on separate occasions and after trying a plugged dose then oral followed a few days later I can't really distinguish between the two so I just use oral now.  The freebase doesn't have to be smoked. I haven't felt the need to try.

Can't comment on taking the freebase and hcl at the same time I'm afraid I'm sure someone more knowledgeable than I (and there's a hell of a lot of them around here ) will be able to answer that.

Just about to go out and get out from behind my laptop screen for a change but just when I think the visuals are all completely gone I'll get a little wiggle of straight lines or a cluster of lights are born and vanish before my eyes.


----------



## jimmy_jedi

I am having some of this at the weekend. I find that with most other drugs alcohol calms the intense initial rushes. How would booze sit with amt?


----------



## psood0nym

^Cannabis is a better idea since the aMT onset makes some people nauseated.  Alcohol is best saved for winding down, though I've certainly used it at the peak to party on aMT, just usually in combination with Adderall.


----------



## Xamkou

45mg down the hatch

Tried insufflating 5mg, wanted to see what the fuss is all about (pain-wise). Yes, I see now.


----------



## BobWeir'd

I'm interested in how this compound is psychedelic but also stimulant in such small quantites. I know with psychedelics a tiny tiny amount can be very powerful but usually with something giving a stimulant effect you take maybe a half gram or more which obviously you would never do with this. How so how does the amphetamine like side take effect in such a small dose I wonder?

After doing lots of Mcat earlier in the year it will be nice not to be caning something like a fiend.


----------



## Xamkou

I'm currently getting warm body rushes and tingles. Feel very stimulated but so relaxed aswell.


----------



## Treatderek

aMT. The drug that gives and gives but never takes


----------



## Help?!?!

BobWeir'd said:


> I'm interested in how this compound is psychedelic but also stimulant in such small quantites. I know with psychedelics a tiny tiny amount can be very powerful but usually with something giving a stimulant effect you take maybe a half gram or more which obviously you would never do with this. How so how does the amphetamine like side take effect in such a small dose I wonder?
> 
> After doing lots of Mcat earlier in the year it will be nice not to be caning something like a fiend.


DO'x's, 2c-I, 5-meo-mipt/dipt. All those are psychedelics with stimulative properties. It really has to do with which receptors the drug touches as to the stimulative effects and also how greatly it binds with said receptor.


----------



## Vader

> with something giving a stimulant effect you take maybe a half gram or more


That's not true at all. If you took half a gram of amphetamine you would be in serious trouble. Cocaine dose is about 50mg, MDPV maybe 15mg, methamp is active at about 1mg...


----------



## BobWeir'd

I was thinking mephedrone when I said that and maybe I should rephrase. I mean abit more than just an effect. I know what you mean if stuff is very pure^^

So am I right in thinking it's you're brain which makes you _think or feel_ like your stimulated but without lots of powder in your system which equates to a nice time without the poisoned like comedown effects associated with speed  / mephedrone etc?


----------



## psood0nym

^I don't think you _just_ think or feel that you're stimulated i.e. physiological measures or imaging techniques would indicate your body/brain is stimulated independently of subjective effect.

I think the central reason why aMT doesn't have a shitty comedown is because it lasts so long and is metabolized much more slowly than most stimulants.  With something like mephedrone you get a quick monoamine dump, the it's metabolized and stops releasing over a short time, the monoamines breakdown or are taken back into vesicles shortly thereafter and the rug is pulled out from under your good times (crash boom, bleh)


----------



## rickolasnice

Done about 50mg of aMT freebase last night.. 

What's all the fuss about? I didn't like it atall.

I mean, i didnt hate it.. but all i got was slight visuals (deeper colour) and some crappy body load which made moving feel un-natural and like the simplest movements become more of a conscious effort.. If the mood lift was there it was so slight it may aswell not have been there.. plus there was no euphoria.. just a feeling that i was warm (but not exactly in a nice way)..

Got a crappy sleep.. kept waking up with a headache (not too bad) and no afterglow..

Meh.


----------



## psood0nym

^Different strokes I guess.  If you haven't been doing other stims recently I don't know what else to say.  Its monoamine release profile is comparable to MDMA or meth (just over a longer time), so it's strange you didn't get euphoria. Also, like has been mentioned a lot recently in this thread, there can be huge variation between sessions in the same person at the same dose.  I've had times where the visuals were really prominent and distinct and the euphoria was sort of light and others where I was blissing out blowing bubbles in a serotonin hot tub but with no visual effects beyond brighter colors.

These days it's more consistent for me, but it took my brain about 8 years to figure out exactly what it wanted to do with the stuff (i.e. heavy on the euphoria and self-love and compassion and leave the psychedelia to the drugs I combine with it).


----------



## Xamkou

rickolasnice said:


> Done about 50mg of aMT freebase last night..
> 
> What's all the fuss about? I didn't like it atall.
> 
> I mean, i didnt hate it.. but all i got was slight visuals (deeper colour) and some crappy body load which made moving feel un-natural and like the simplest movements become more of a conscious effort.. If the mood lift was there it was so slight it may aswell not have been there.. plus there was no euphoria.. just a feeling that i was warm (but not exactly in a nice way)..
> 
> Got a crappy sleep.. kept waking up with a headache (not too bad) and no afterglow..
> 
> Meh.



Strange.

I'm in heaven right now, personally after 3hrs30 on 50mg.


----------



## rickolasnice

psood0nym said:


> ^Different strokes I guess.  If you haven't been doing other stims recently I don't know what else to say.



I abused MDMA to fuck but that was like over a year.. no wait.. like 3 years ago now? I've also gone on some mad amphetamine binges and mephedrone binges but still it's been months since i done either.. with my abuse slowily turnin into use towards the end.

Ah god please don't tell me my neurons are permafried to the point i'm gonna be unable to enjoy the drugs i loveeee (MDMA + Stims)..


----------



## MagickalKat777

Xamkou said:


> Tried insufflating 5mg, wanted to see what the fuss is all about (pain-wise). Yes, I see now.



We warned you!


So I got the full reports back from both people after they had fully come down. They both agreed the body load was nasty (back pain, weird stimulation/sedation mix, head ache on the comedown, severe diuresis, they both vomited when coming up) but they both had an alright trip but neither of them had the sought after empathogenic effects - very psychedelic with sometimes overwhelming flowing visuals and my friend who took 40mg reported some colorful patterns that were morphing wildly. Weird. Not a typical AMT trip.

Oh well I'll hold on to it for a rainy day but for now, I'm going to try to seek out more traditional things (hard to find around here) and the 4-HO/4-AcO families.


----------



## psood0nym

Eh, try some meth or mephedrone since they're similar in action to aMT (I'm assuming mephedrone is, at least).  If they work the way you remember you're good and aMT maybe just isn't for you.  I'd give it another shot in a few weeks or so to make sure this wasn't just a one time fluke.


----------



## rickolasnice

Meph stopped working the same.. so did amphetamine.. both reduced me to an anxiety ridden paranoid nut..


----------



## mistereman

Would it be considered normal for my aMT to be quite hard? The pack has arrived and is a mix of powder and fairly large lumps which crush easily enough with a bash

Only because magikat mentioned hers was quite clumpy and caused her some problems


----------



## psood0nym

rickolasnice said:


> Meph stopped working the same.. so did amphetamine.. both reduced me to an anxiety ridden paranoid nut..


Ouch, that sucks.  Well, at least you've got opiates.  Combining stimulating versions of them or kratom with 5-HT psychedelics might re-capture some of the tripartite monoaminergic magic of those three. 

Regarding the clumpy aMT: it probably just got packed down super tight for shipping or maybe it's from previous freezer storage.


----------



## MagickalKat777

mistereman said:


> Would it be considered normal for my aMT to be quite hard? The pack has arrived and is a mix of powder and fairly large lumps which crush easily enough with a bash
> 
> Only because magikat mentioned hers was quite clumpy and caused her some problems



I'm a male 

As for the clumps, I shook apart the clumps from the powder and the powder looks completely different from the clumps. I took the clumps last time, I'll take the powder next time.


----------



## Mullered

MagickalKat777 said:


> I'm a male



lol


----------



## psood0nym

I like your name.  But in that poster's defense, calling yourself Magikal Cat you might as well be wearing a name tag that says "Enchanted Pussy." I kid, I kid ... sort of. I've definitely noticed the girls here seem to go way out of their way to give themselves girly names and avatars. It's helpful to know when you're addressing a lady, so I appreciate it.

BTW, I never knew Teozcoatl (or however you spell it) was a woman.  She's got a man-sized ego and dickish attitude, though. After I found out I felt sorry for badmouthing her for about a second before I didn't.


----------



## MagickalKat777

I've had this name since 2004... If I could change it, I would, but that would probably confuse people anyway.


----------



## Volundr

psood0nym said:


> BTW, I never knew  (or however you spell it) was a woman.  She's got a man-sized ego and dickish attitude, though. After I found out I felt sorry for badmouthing her for about a second before I didn't.



I am 100% sure Teo is male, based on my seeing 'them' post on other forums I read/have read (they're banned on all of them btw).


----------



## Help?!?!

psood0nym said:


> BTW, I never knew Teozcoatl (or however you spell it) was a woman.  She's got a man-sized ego and dickish attitude, though. After I found out I felt sorry for badmouthing her for about a second before I didn't.


HAHAHA wow where was I when this was found out. Women or man ignorance transcends all!


----------



## love_sex_desire

MagickalKat777 said:


> I've had this name since 2004... If I could change it, I would, but that would probably confuse people anyway.



I know how you feel! I'm liking ChemFatale which I've used on more recent forums I've joined. Although both might lead you to believe I'm a female, but at least ChemFatale is a nice drug-inspired play on a great Velvet Underground song!



psood0nym said:


> BTW, I never knew Teozcoatl (or however you spell it) was a woman.  She's got a man-sized ego and dickish attitude, though. After I found out I felt sorry for badmouthing her for about a second before I didn't.



Wow, such a dick for a chick. I've noticed Teo on e-dot's entheogen.com forum as well and would have never thought that super-ego could be a female. Girl Power!


----------



## psood0nym

Volundr said:


> I am 100% sure Teo is male, based on my seeing 'them' post on other forums I read/have read (they're banned on all of them btw).


I was told this by a moderator in the PD social thread after I referred to Teo as "him".  They replied something like, "BTW Teozocoatl is female believe it or not".  I think it was Solistus, Teo's arch nemesis, so by the transitive property of "know thy enemy" it's true.  I don't know how he (or whichever moderator actually told me) knows. I was sure she was male, too.  Hell, I even made up a bizarre story about naginnudej accidentally eating "his" ass against a dumpster in the back of the Sex and Relationships forum.  I was invested in the belief that "she" was male, so I feel you. It's also possible that Teo said "he" was female at one time when Solistus was around because "he" was in one of his epic manic episodes...


----------



## Fin

So is a yellowish biege appearance with white spots through it a sure indicator that AMT freebase has degraded? I wouldn't describe it as clumpy, it's still quite powdery. The odour is extremely strong. Is it still safe to consume? Would it mean the freebase is just past its prime and not so potent anymore or does it actually decompose into something nasty?


----------



## psood0nym

^Yes but it doesn't mean it's degraded so much that it's not fine to consume or that the experience that will result will be "degraded".  Read the posts above for a short discussion of the meaning of superficial appearances of chemicals.


----------



## MagickalKat777

love_sex_desire said:


> I know how you feel! I'm liking ChemFatale which I've used on more recent forums I've joined. Although both might lead you to believe I'm a female, but at least ChemFatale is a nice drug-inspired play on a great Velvet Underground song!



I know who you are now! LOL. I was wondering who the person on SoS was - I'm Ethrem.


----------



## Boombox2

I was jut wondering how eating affects the amt trip? That is, eating before and during? Dies eating before lessen or increase nausea (oral roa) on the comeup? Does it dilute the trip?


----------



## MagickalKat777

As long as you eat MAO-compatible foods, you'll be fine. Avoid cheese, wine, beer, etc., about 24 hours before the trip. I totally fucked up on my 20mg experience and that may have done it... I ate a bunch of cheese and all kinds of shit that day...


----------



## MagickalKat777

And once you peak, food tastes absolutely INCREDIBLE


----------



## Mullered

MagickalKat777 said:


> As long as you eat MAO-compatible foods, you'll be fine. Avoid cheese, wine, beer, etc., about 24 hours before the trip. I totally fucked up on my 20mg experience and that may have done it... I ate a bunch of cheese and all kinds of shit that day...



Does cheese really make a difference?  I love cheese!!


----------



## Boombox2

Thanks MK. Any suggestions for a meal before and an absolutely INCREDIBLE one during?

Planning to take 30-40mg on my first whirl.


----------



## Ben So Furry

I found warm fluid running down my throat a really pleasurable experience,(minds out of gutter please ) I craved tea followed by something cold then more tea.  

I would like to try my guilty pleasure, fries dipped in strawberry milkshake.

I thought I was going to pay dear for the last few days, (report to come) I had an extremely long lasting experience from one 50mg dose and now I feel exceptional after finally getting some sleep.  Reset and recharged, if a crash is in the post I'll update but for what I experienced I can't believe I got let off.


----------



## Boombox2

Well we all love cheese. I sobbed for half an hour when I realised a mid-trip pizza was off the agenda.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Yeah you may not have a hypertensive crisis from it but eating a non-MAO compatible diet can add a LOT of load to the trip.

Just eat a salad or something... you really want your body to be in wholly good shape when you trip AMT or it can be downright brutal.


----------



## BobWeir'd

What about whey protein drink? I like my fitness and try to keep nourished during these type of experiences therefore whey protein made with milk for some carbs is ideal when the appetite is supressed. I have no knowledge of the dangers so I'm wondering if whey protein is a no no like cheese?


----------



## Mullered

BobWeir'd said:


> What about whey protein drink? I like my fitness and try to keep nourished during these type of experiences therefore whey protein made with milk for some carbs is ideal when the appetite is supressed. I have no knowledge of the dangers so I'm wondering if whey protein is a no no like cheese?



I would like to know this too.  Im currently on a weight training regime which includes several whey protein shakes each day.  Should I give these a  miss befor my planned AMT expedition?


----------



## Mullered

I found this list, I presume this is what we're talking about?

http://www.psycom.net/depression.central.maoidiet.html


----------



## foal

There's also this list at erowid

Done as google cache because Erowid seems to be down at the moment.

It does mention protein supplements to be avoided there.

Also a list of drugs to avoid here.


----------



## BobWeir'd

Just got mine through the post (50 mg freebase) It actually smells like DMT to me unless it's the packaging.

I don't have scales so I was going to crush it all up (some lumps) so it's even and split it into 2. (2 x 25mg)

Now then, I hear there's less nausia and it works well rectally. I've never done anything that way. Anything wrong with simply putting it on the end of ya finger and whacking it up there? Or how about a very small bit of Rizla?

What about the idea or doing half oral and half rectal and if it's not a bad idea which way round? (fingers washed! haha)


----------



## MagickalKat777

Freebase won't work rectally.

Get some vinegar and put your dose that you want to do rectally in some water and drop vinegar in there until it dissolves...


----------



## Boombox2

Is ketamine a good mix with this?


----------



## BobWeir'd

Oh, ok. I thought I saw a moderator post here saying it did, I may have got it wrong. Maybe he was talking about hcl, can't find the page now. Thanks, could of wasted half of it!

Another thing I'm wondering is what it would be like if I actually saved some and smoked it the next day. I plan to do this Monday daytime so hopefully I will get some sleep and feel good Tuesday which is when I'm thinking maybe smoke a bit. I fancy a couple of days at it but of course may change my mind!


----------



## ashtray girl

Freebase is fine to use rectally, just convert to a salt with vinegar like magikalkat says.

Boombox, Ket will be fine to mix with it - I would use the ket after the peak though.


----------



## love_sex_desire

BobWeir'd said:


> Oh, ok. I thought I saw a moderator post here saying it did, I may have got it wrong. Maybe he was talking about hcl, can't find the page now. Thanks, could of wasted half of it!
> 
> Another thing I'm wondering is what it would be like if I actually saved some and smoked it the next day. I plan to do this Monday daytime so hopefully I will get some sleep and feel good Tuesday which is when I'm thinking maybe smoke a bit. I fancy a couple of days at it but of course may change my mind!



Salts such as hydrochloride will dissolve but freebase wont. Whoever posted about AMT dissolving must have the hcl doing the rounds. For rectal administration you should dissolve your AMT and use a syringe-less syringe. Since you have 50 mg you could try 15-20 mg rectally and smoke 20 mg another day and still have 10-15 mg leftover to try orally. 10 mg orally will provide a nice anti-depressant perk to the day. 20 mg rectally will be somewhat like 30-35 mg orally from what I've read and 20 mg smoked will be similar to about 35 mg orally. Smoking still takes about an hour to comeup, but drastically reduces the 3 hour comeup from oral. Smoking also reduces the nausea but isn't the most pleasant tasting as it tastes like indoley DMT or mothballs. You should use a meth pipe or something similar. You want to to vaporize the AMT. Smoking it in a bong with weed has proven to be ineffective.


----------



## love_sex_desire

MagickalKat777 said:


> I know who you are now! LOL. I was wondering who the person on SoS was - I'm Ethrem.



Ya I'm quite active on said forum. I've noticed you as well. Always assumed the names I didn't recognize were somewhere on BL!


----------



## 33Hz

MagickalKat777 said:


> As long as you eat MAO-compatible foods, you'll be fine. Avoid cheese, wine, beer, etc., about 24 hours before the trip. I totally fucked up on my 20mg experience and that may have done it... I ate a bunch of cheese and all kinds of shit that day...



I think you're overestimating this drugs MAOI capabilities at reasonable doses. I witnessed someone drink at least 3 beers while on 40mg of AMT at Bestival last weekend and he was absolutely fine. Seeing as this is a harm reduction site though, I guess it's best to err on the side of caution.


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ The MAOI capabilities of AMT seem to be nowhere near as strong as has been assumed, and also the dangers of consuming non-MAOI compatible food/drink such as certain cheeses and beers has been shown to not be of much concern. Beer isn't really much of a problem on AMT, but I suppose it's in everyone's best interest to try and avoid MAOI contraindicated food/drink just to ensure the sometimes nasty AMT bodyload isn't worse. But yeah it seems that AMT is a somewhat weak MAOI and  it also seems that non-MAOI food/drink is not as bad as was once believed. Better safe than sorry though.


----------



## tragiclemming

33Hz said:


> I think you're overestimating this drugs MAOI capabilities at reasonable doses. I witnessed someone drink at least 3 beers while on 40mg of AMT at Bestival last weekend and he was absolutely fine. Seeing as this is a harm reduction site though, I guess it's best to err on the side of caution.


I drank a shit load of wine and beer on 50mg of aMT at a festival - no problem. Same with a mate. It's not big and it's not clever, but it happened. The alcohol definitely takes the edge of the psychedelia, so if you're looking for a full on trip, don't drink.


----------



## Mullered

tragiclemming said:


> I drank a shit load of wine and beer on 50mg of aMT at a festival - no problem. Same with a mate. It's not big and it's not clever, but it happened. The alcohol definitely takes the edge of the psychedelia, so if you're looking for a full on trip, don't drink.



Im not after psychedelia and I love beer %)


----------



## MagickalKat777

Its actually the fact that these things increase the body load a LOT more than worrying about MAO - though I can tell you from experience that HIGH DOSE AMT is definitely an MAO... Caffeine made me so sick and my trip got so much more intense my friend almost took me to the hospital.

Anyway I've never drank on AMT but I've heard it smooths out the bodyload.

A friend of mine did confirm that AMT is an MAOI by taking 60mg and then taking DMT orally - he had a weird pharmahuasca trip. So it definitely does inhibit MAO to enough of an extent.

I wouldn't use ketamine on AMT... But that's just me. I've heard of some nice experiences doing so.


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ Interesting. I've heard attempts at using AMT in conjunction with DMT as a sort of pharmahuasca have all been unsuccessful. I believe these attempts were with lower doses of AMT to try to get MAO inhibition without the AMT altering the DMT trip in a huge way, but I suppose a large dose such as 60 mg could be enough to activate oral DMT.

Did 60 mg fully inhibit MAO, or was the DMT a lot weaker? I'm assuming that would be a weird combination as my first thoughts are that the AMT would not inhibit enough to make the DMT as powerful, so you'd be on a high dose of AMT with a weaker dose of DMT. Could be fun? Only have experience with DMT once and that was smoked.


----------



## goku4ever

Concerning smoothing out the trip, Treacle reccomended to me using GBL, it worked beautifully, normally I get a bit anxious and can't enjoy the trip but GBL really complimented it well.


----------



## love_sex_desire

^ Would gabapentin work for like GBL? I don't have access to GHB at the moment and the only gabaergic drug I have access to is gabapentin.

What other chemicals are good for smoothing out the trip, without drastically changing the nature of the trip?


----------



## Boombox2

Ok. Had my first amt experience. Slightly disappointed. Received 1/2 gram of grey HCI powder (apparently a slightly stronger synth). Took 35mg. Felt groggy and shaky on the come up. About 5 hours in feels ok, had a line of ket. Felt nice and couldn't really move. 6 hours in re-dosed another 30mg of amt. Then not a lot happened for the rest of the trip. Couldn't sleep until about 15 hrs after first dose and just felt stimulated and tired. No visuals at all.

Day after, slight headache and very tired.

Was expecting much better really. I'm someone who's more interested in the psychedelic side rather than the MDMA side of amt (ideally a bit of both!) but all i really ended up with was a reasonable high and lots of stimulation.

Have I got rubbish stuff (I hope not at £80 a gram!) or was I just unlucky? I did smoke a lot of weed during and I guess that bit ok K may have made a difference. Do other drugs take the edge of the psychedelia/high?

Should I try 50mg with no re-dose and no ket or weed in a couple of weeks?


----------



## Volundr

^ i hope it's just you as I've ordered from the same location and if it's how you say it is, I'm gonna be pretty pissed off haha


----------



## tragiclemming

^^It has different effects on different people. Maybe it's not for you? I never get strong visuals on aMT, but do enjoy the ride! Maybe an increase in dose will get you where you want to go. I think 50mg is a good next step.


----------



## love_sex_desire

Boombox2 said:


> Ok. Had my first amt experience. Slightly disappointed. Received 1/2 gram of grey HCI powder (apparently a slightly stronger synth). Took 35mg. Felt groggy and shaky on the come up. About 5 hours in feels ok, had a line of ket. Felt nice and couldn't really move. 6 hours in re-dosed another 30mg of amt. Then not a lot happened for the rest of the trip. Couldn't sleep until about 15 hrs after first dose and just felt stimulated and tired. No visuals at all.
> 
> Day after, slight headache and very tired.
> 
> Was expecting much better really. I'm someone who's more interested in the psychedelic side rather than the MDMA side of amt (ideally a bit of both!) but all i really ended up with was a reasonable high and lots of stimulation.
> 
> Have I got rubbish stuff (I hope not at £80 a gram!) or was I just unlucky? I did smoke a lot of weed during and I guess that bit ok K may have made a difference. Do other drugs take the edge of the psychedelia/high?
> 
> Should I try 50mg with no re-dose and no ket or weed in a couple of weeks?



HCl is not a potent as freebase and people usually need at least 50 mg of freebase to start getting psychedelia. Maybe try 50 mg next time and work your way up from there. It may take a few trials with AMT to find the right dose because everyone reacts differently and it requires fairly large doses before it gets visual.


----------



## Boombox2

Volundr - I hope not too. For your sake. please let us know how it goes.

tragiclemming/love sex desire - Thanks for the advice. Will up the dose and see what happens.


----------



## pseudononamouse

Does anyone else feel that a distinguishing characteristic of AMT is its light, transparent, and lucid feeling? I mean this both bodily and mentally.


----------



## knock

On MAOI properties:

I ate some pastrami during the come up on 30mg HCl. I had an annoying headache from trip onset until I took a couple of ibuprofen maybe 8 hours after ingestion. I never made the link until now, looking back on my trip ramblings in EADD. Pastrami is possibly bad with an MAOI.

After the ibuprofen had worked it's magic I stupidly drank a bottle of red wine and ate nuts, blue cheese and chocolate, all contraindicated. I was starving and that's all I had... it didn't hurt me at all, in fact I felt great.


----------



## midinoz

Boombox2 said:


> Ok. Had my first amt experience. Slightly disappointed. Received 1/2 gram of grey HCI powder (apparently a slightly stronger synth). Took 35mg. Felt groggy and shaky on the come up. About 5 hours in feels ok, had a line of ket. Felt nice and couldn't really move. 6 hours in re-dosed another 30mg of amt. Then not a lot happened for the rest of the trip. Couldn't sleep until about 15 hrs after first dose and just felt stimulated and tired. No visuals at all.
> 
> Day after, slight headache and very tired.
> 
> Was expecting much better really. I'm someone who's more interested in the psychedelic side rather than the MDMA side of amt (ideally a bit of both!) but all i really ended up with was a reasonable high and lots of stimulation.
> 
> Have I got rubbish stuff (I hope not at £80 a gram!) or was I just unlucky? I did smoke a lot of weed during and I guess that bit ok K may have made a difference. Do other drugs take the edge of the psychedelia/high?
> 
> Should I try 50mg with no re-dose and no ket or weed in a couple of weeks?



i had a similar experience, somewhere inbetween mongy pip pills + 'not enough mushrooms' feeling.. i took somewhere between 20mg and 25mg and did not enjoy the 'trip' whatsoever. nasty sicky feeling, dull elements of 'tripping' and body felt like led weight. the come up was about 5 hours long and then the actual experience only lasted 2 hours.. until ketamine was thrown in the mix which actually felt like a breath of fresh air.

is this entirely due to the dose i took? would a higher dose make the drug more enjoyable or would it just add more intense effects on to the aforementioned bodyload nastiness? if the latter i don't think i'll be dabbling in aMT again


----------



## psood0nym

^Try it rectally at the same dose and see if it's better.  Simply mix the freebase with white vinegar and weight until it dissolves.  Now you have aMT acetate for plugging.  You may want to dilute the vinegar with extra water since it might sting a little.


----------



## k.kat

its my first time doing AMT, its freebase, what would be best ROA between smoking & snorting it, would i use different amounts for each ROA or the same,
 i dont want to plug,


----------



## psood0nym

^Snorting freebase won't work, at least not well.  Smoking it changes the nature of the trip to something that's more stimulating and less euphoric, at least in my experience, and I assume you don't want to do oral because of the potential nausea.  It's just your butt; get over it and you'll be rewarded.


----------



## Volundr

Should be getting some Hcl in the mail any day now, suggestive dosage for plugging?


----------



## psood0nym

^Between 50 and 75 percent of your oral dose I think, assuming you've used it orally (otherwise start with like 20 I guess). I've only done low doses that way so maybe your should wait for someone who's done higher.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

I plugged 30mg and it wasn't any stonger than the same oral dose, I am sure it has been mentioned somewhere in this thread that plugging doesn't really increase potency with aMT and I agree.


----------



## knock

My 30mg HCl dose was plugged. I was aiming low but got middle, with mild visuals at the peak (multi-coloured halos), waves of euphoria and stimulation for 6-7 hours after. I am average build, 95kg. Could certainly bear to take it higher but I wouldn't if it's your first dose.

Edit: I've never dosed orally so can't draw a comparison.


----------



## psood0nym

MrTiHKAL said:


> I plugged 30mg and it wasn't any stonger than the same oral dose, I am sure it has been mentioned somewhere in this thread that plugging doesn't really increase potency with aMT and I agree.


Hmm, I wonder why not. IMing most definitely increases potency, by more than double in my experience, so if it's not first pass that's lowering bioavailability I don't know what it would be.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Plugging may not increase potency but it is said to have less of a bodyload and a faster come up.


----------



## Listening

MagickalKat777 said:


> Plugging may not increase potency but it is said to have less of a bodyload and a faster come up.



What about duration?


----------



## MagickalKat777

About the same as orally. I've never done it personally but I have friends that have and they swear by it - faster come up and less of the 2-3 hour "tweak" period, more like 30 minutes, and a very strong and clean trip with much less nausea and overall bodyload.


----------



## knock

I had no nausea whatsoever plugging, even with the pastrami. Muscular tension would be the only "bodyload". I did start with an empty stomach though.


----------



## MagickalKat777

^^ So not even the tweaky come up?


----------



## Myshkin

The tweaky come-up is unavoidable. All part of the fun though, really!


----------



## tragiclemming

I love the tweaky come up! As soon as you feel it, hit the bong and you will sail through the turbulence. After that, it is a long a smooth ride


----------



## MrTiHKAL

I tried the freebase at 50mg orally for the first time recently after only having had the grey hcl in the past, come up was smooth as silk and bodyload much reduced, very euphoric, better visuals and more pleasant and enjoyable in every way.


----------



## k.kat

MrTiHKAL said:


> I tried the freebase at 50mg orally for the first time recently after only having had the grey hcl in the past, come up was smooth as silk and bodyload much reduced, very euphoric, better visuals and more pleasant and enjoyable in every way.



That sounds good to me, so i will probably do it orally, did you bomb it in a rizla or mix in a drink, did you redose atoll,
would 50mg be okay for first time ever on AMT or would that be too much


----------



## MrTiHKAL

^Yeah i bombed it in a rizla, you don't want to taste it, trust me on that.
I really want to say yes take 50mg for your first dose because I had such a wonderful day on it but you are not me and I can't say how it will effect you, aMT really effects people in different ways which you will see if you read through this thread.

I worked my way up from 30 to 50mg with the grey hcl over a few weekends and it wasn't until I hit 50 that I really saw the potential in this stuff, so I was confident to jump in at 50 with the freebase even though it is more potent by weight, in fact I could still have gone a bit higher but I only had the 50mg as a free sample, so there was no redosing but i took it at 11 am and couldn't get to sleep until 1:30am and that was after a couple mg of xanax so didn't need to top up.

Only you can make the decision where you want to start really.

Have fun.


----------



## k.kat

^ its freebase i have, yeah i know i can only make the decision,
just reading this snip below from someone elses post has made me think i dont want to take too little if this is how it makes you feel,

snip
 had a similar experience, somewhere inbetween mongy pip pills + 'not enough mushrooms' feeling.. i took somewhere between 20mg and 25mg and did not enjoy the 'trip' whatsoever. nasty sicky feeling, dull elements of 'tripping' and body felt like led weight,

so in your opinion would you say freebase is better than hcl


----------



## MrTiHKAL

^Only tried the freebase once but yeah as I said above I found it better in every way.

I haven't done it myself but a few people here have advised first timers to take 30mg and see how you feel after a couple of hours, if your not where you want to be take a bit more.


----------



## tragiclemming

It's interesting reading the salt vs freebase debate. Basically, it boils down to this. The HCL salt has approx 20% more mass per mole, or for the non chemists, 1 molecule of salt has approx 20% more mass than 1 molecule of freebase. aMT freebase molecular mass = 174g/mole and HCl salt  (174 +35.5) = 209.5g/mole. Assuming the products are 100% pure (which they won't be), then they should have the same effect assuming you have the same molecular ratio. You just need approx 20% larger dose of the salt (actually 17% by mass). Once inside the body, the salt will dissociate into it's respective ions and will be indistinguishable from the 'pure' basic aMT.

So, it all depends on the quality of the synth rather than salt vs freebase.
Steps off soap box.


----------



## Phoenix_rising

Yesterday at 1.00pm i took 5mg orally of AMT freebase for it`s antidepressant effects,i had just run out of my Rhodiola rosea that i had been taking for the last five months and wanted to see if the AMT could lift my spirits.

I should also add that i`m just finishing off a Dianabol only cycle,also i`m going through a tough time with a seperation and a new baby involved.

So at 1.00pm i took the AMT,my first ever dose of this compound,i don`t know if it was a psuedo effect but i`m sure i had alerts at the 30min point,at 2.30pm the music on my mp3 player sounded much better,richer and deeper,the sun felt hotter than usual and everything felt and looked brighter...Clearer.

By 3.30pm my mood hadn`t lightened but it had become heavy,the weight of my problems became magnified,i was in a paradoxical state of mind,the antidepressant effects of the drug were not apparent,if anything my mood had declined.

By 6.30pm i had improved and felt slightly stimulated,i felt quirky and silly,by 11.00pm i felt tired and went to bed,i fell asleep easily but had disturbing dreams...Well not all of them,in one my ex and i had wild sex and that she had the perfect body,but in the other dream she was being totally cold and i flew into a rage and ended up beating her.
The dreams were so realistic it was frightening.

Today has been not good at all,not only have the dreams disturbed me,bt i have felt very depressed.

So all in all the experiment to find an antidepressant in AMT has failed terribly.


----------



## tragiclemming

Sorry to hear than Pheonix rising. I think the anti-depressant qualities at such a low dose are cumulative. I doubt that 1 x 5mg dose would have any significant impact on your current state of mind.

I think you may get a better impression over a longer period of time. That's not to say that professional help may also be better than self medication. Good luck and welcome.


----------



## Phoenix_rising

Thanks Tragiclemming,

I understand about what you say with it be cumulative,like any MAOI then,but if used in a high dose then the MAOI effects would be more apparent over the following week.

I know self medicating is not always the right way,but maybe i need a higher dose for a breakthrough,maybe not,especially when doing it on your own.I`m not really into the spiritual aspect of psychedelics,but more the scientific approach using the intellect to sift through and resolve problems on a deep level.

I`m looking forward to getting to know people here.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

tragiclemming said:


> So, it all depends on the quality of the synth rather than salt vs freebase.
> Steps off soap box.



Yes mate, I was comparing it to the grey hcl that has been doing the rounds here, rather than hcl in general because that is the only one I have tried. Maybe that didn't come across well.
I am sure that the freebase I had was a better synth though, it was white for a start, or is hcl always grey?


----------



## RLP

Took a 5mg allergy test on Monday night. No problems, felt a slight relaxation/happiness but I reckon that was more down to me than the drug.

Had 25mg tonight (5 hours into such dose now) and was sorely disappointed. It's very light and relaxing (eventually, after 3 hours of waiting) but no euphoria, no energy... Didn't feel nausea at any point. The bag smells rank though, so I can only presume it is indeed amt.

I'm hoping a 40mg or even 50mg dose may take me to where I want to go. Roll on Saturday. Cross fingers.


----------



## Xamkou

RLP, I found 25mg underwhelming myself and it was even dysphoric at times. 50mg, however, was unbelieveable and a really beautiful experience. Little visuals but shockingly intense euphoria which just kept giving! Mixed in some Mephedrone which took me to where I wanted to be, heaven! :D This was the freebase form, fyi. 

Good luck!


----------



## RLP

Cheers. I'm only looking for mild visuals to be honest. A major trip can be fun but I don't have time to write off the best part of a day anymore.

I reckon I'll go with 50mg. Why not eh?

Edit: I've also got the freebase form. It smells delightful!


----------



## cosmic._.ape

phoenix rising, research about ketamine in google and you'll be very surprised. I was surprised.

I write this because 4 days ago I learned, thanks to this forum, about a legal analogue of ketamine, Methoxetamine (search here on bluelight, sorry I can't post links yet). Methoxetamine is legal, and maybe you can buy from the same place you bought amt. Otherwise surely you can google somowhere. 

One of the posters here on bluelight named it "heaven on earth". I haven't tried ketamine ever before, and I tried methoxetamine for first time yesterday -I can't disagree with the poster.

But search about ketamine, about its healths dangers and its anti depressive properties on google. If you do not now about it, as I didn't know, you too will be amazed and flabbergasted... but no so much as when you actually try it though!


----------



## Crack4Lyfe

Damn, so how much is a specials set of scales to measure this out going to set me back?


----------



## k.kat

Crack4Lyfe said:


> Damn, so how much is a specials set of scales to measure this out going to set me back?



have a look on ebay, type in digital jewelry scales 0.001g,
cheapest one will cost you about £10 inc delivery


----------



## petebog

Be careful how you use them though. They are notoriously innacurate with near-zero weights.
Best technique is to put something on top first, eg bank card (_do not_ re-zero/tare the scale) and then add what you're measuring on top.

Then redo it at least once.


----------



## Psychonautical

i imagine these experiences are some of your first experiences with psychedelic compounds.

I imagine you may have done mushrooms and things like that before, but i've always noticed that when working with the pure compounds, especially those people, who are not completely psychedelically inclined to every aspect of their psyche, and of the experience, will find that they are experiencing a different almost more personal array of effects than those who are more able to fundmentally tap into the "system" a bit more. 

Now you also need to realize that maybe your dream, was two possible outcomes, and you got to experience each one of them, kind of like a drop in time. Just understand that, it's the nature of the pendulum to swing back and forth, and its the nature of the coin to have two sides. Yin and Yang, if there are undealt emotions, and you take a psychedelic, it will make you deal with them.

AMT is an antidepressant, but it is also a Psychedelic. and an Amphetamine. 
It will produce stimulation, prolonged concentration, visuals, and it will put you in touch with things that you thought you've buried.
But it will allow you to deal with these zombies, in a more relaxed, gentler way, than lets say DPT, or 2c-e.


----------



## gannetsarewe

The worse by a long way BL I had from aMT was after eating a can of smoked oysters, I thought the MAOI profile of said bivalves was OK, could the smoking or canning process increase it?


----------



## tragiclemming

gannetsarewe said:


> The worse by a long way BL I had from aMT was after eating a can of smoked oysters, I thought the MAOI profile of said bivalves was OK, could the smoking or canning process increase it?


I don't need aMT to be sick on oysters!


----------



## Mullered

Well here goes; first time and 30mg down the hatch. Now around an hour and a half in ......


----------



## Phoenix_rising

Your gonna be up all night lol...Have fun dude!


----------



## Mullered

Phoenix_rising said:


> Your gonna be up all night lol...Have fun dude!



Cheers dude, hope it will be fun, the missus is on it aswell and its her first time too


----------



## Crack4Lyfe

Does Amt mix well with MDMA. If I'm taking Amt for the first time should i dose with MDMA after I've taken it?


----------



## glenjih

Crack4Lyfe said:


> Does Amt mix well with MDMA. If I'm taking Amt for the first time should i dose with MDMA after I've taken it?



I've no intention of being harsh...but use your common sense. Does it sound like a good idea to mix two extremely potent compounds when you've never experienced one of them on its own?


----------



## Crack4Lyfe

glenjih said:


> I've no intention of being harsh...but use your common sense. Does it sound like a good idea to mix two extremely potent compounds when you've never experienced one of them on its own?



That's why I'm asking?


----------



## glenjih

Okay I'll spell it out for you, to be friendly.

AMT is very similar to amphetamine, and MDMA is an amphetamine. This is the first problem, as overstimulation leading to heart palpitations and other complications could occur.

AMT can be (and usually is) a psychedelic, and is quite potent. MDMA can also have that type of effect if the dose is high or the dosee is sensitive. This could prove overwhelming.

So what I'm saying is, until you're very familiar with both drugs, don't do it.


----------



## Mullered

Crack4Lyfe said:


> That's why I'm asking?



Should you even need to ask?


----------



## Crack4Lyfe

Mullered said:


> Should you even need to ask?



Shouldn't I?


----------



## Phoenix_rising

You run the risk of possible siezures due to serotonin syndrome,so NOT advisable.


----------



## Crack4Lyfe

glenjih said:


> Okay I'll spell it out for you, to be friendly.
> 
> AMT is very similar to amphetamine, and MDMA is an amphetamine. This is the first problem, as overstimulation leading to heart palpitations and other complications could occur.
> 
> AMT can be (and usually is) a psychedelic, and is quite potent. MDMA can also have that type of effect if the dose is high or the dosee is sensitive. This could prove overwhelming.
> 
> So what I'm saying is, until you're very familiar with both drugs, don't do it.




Thanks.


----------



## Crack4Lyfe

Phoenix_rising said:


> You run the risk of possible siezures due to serotonin syndrome,so NOT advisable.



This is the sort of the info I was after. 

Was sure I read if people mixing the 2 because amt added an extra edge to the MDMA and wanted to check it was safe.


----------



## glenjih

It's not completely unsafe, you just need to go slowly and make sure you can handle both drugs before you combine them


----------



## Mullered

Ok well first time for me an the missus, 30 mg of shit smelling freebase.
Well to be fair we both had a good time to a certain extent but we both feel underwhelmed gennerallu, nothing really full on, no visuals or rushes, just a restless sociable buzz. Lots of yawning and stretching and a little bit of gurning. We will certainly both be going for a higher dose next time  maybe 40mg



Not what we expected but glad we came away saying not enough rather than too much


----------



## Vader

> AMT is very similar to amphetamine


In what way?


----------



## donvliet

2 days ago I got my first chance to try AMT. I only did ~5mg to check for allergies etc. I didn't expect to feel anything, but I got noticable effects. Nothing strong, but enough to get a feel for what higher doses might be like. It felt like a cross between MDMA and 2C-I.

How can I tell if I have freebase or a salt? It is white powder.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Fuck AMT. 4-HO-MET and molly or methylone. HOLY FUCKTASTIC AWESOMENESS!

AMT is too heavy on the body... I didn't even feel the come up from the 4-HO-MET... just suddenly smacked over the face with visuals.

You'll never see the kind of visuals that you get from the 4-HO/4-AcO family from AMT because AMT is just a flowing chem... not a beautiful flowing complex of patterns...


----------



## MagickalKat777

Yerg said:


> In what way?



I think the reference was to the structural analog of the tryptamine family is alpha-methyltryptamine and in the amphetamine family, alpha-methylphenethylamine.


----------



## k.kat

How trippy is AMT compared to LSD or MUSHIES,
I read a post the other day but can't find it now, but it said something about if a AMT trip goes bad there is no way out of it, so would it be like a bad LSD or MUSHIES trip.
Also read that its quite like MDMA but better which is more why i want to try it
So is it along the same line as if you took LSD & MDMA at the same time,
im thinking if its quite like MDMA more than TRIPS why would it turn into a bad trip surely the MDMA side would keep the chance of a bad trip away,


----------



## ugh1979

k.kat said:


> How trippy is AMT compared to LSD or MUSHIES,
> I read a post the other day but can't find it now, but it said something about if a AMT trip goes bad there is no way out of it, so would it be like a bad LSD or MUSHIES trip.
> Also read that its quite like MDMA but better which is more why i want to try it
> So is it along the same line as if you took LSD & MDMA at the same time,
> im thinking if its quite like MDMA more than TRIPS why would it turn into a bad trip surely the MDMA side would keep the chance of a bad trip away,



I'm afraid the only way you can tell how trippy it is is to try it yourself.  Some people get next to no psychedelic elements with it while others get a notable amount.

However, overall it's a lot more forgiving than LSD in terms of being able to have a 'bad trip'.

It's nothing like LSD or mushies for me personally.  I find it just like MDMA/6-APB, except it takes longer to come up and can make me feel a little nauseous on the come up for a short time.


----------



## k.kat

ugh1979 said:


> I'm afraid the only way you can tell how trippy it is is to try it yourself.  Some people get next to no psychedelic elements with it while others get a notable amount.
> 
> However, overall it's a lot more forgiving than LSD in terms of being able to have a 'bad trip'.
> 
> It's nothing like LSD or mushies for me personally.  I find it just like MDMA/6-APB, except it takes longer to come up and can make me feel a little nauseous on the come up for a short time.



Thanks ugh,
a cross between MDMA & 6APB sounds really good to me, MDMA is my drug & i really enjoyed 2 pellets DD of 6-APB, 


ive decided to take my Methoxetamine just now & save the AMT till friday
i read that it goes off quickly if not stored properly 
But i have no drying agents to put in the bag, its in its sealy bag sealed then in another sealy bag sealed and thats in the padded envelope/jiffy bag  it came in and is in a dark cupboard,
will it still be okay by friday


----------



## psood0nym

^Go try on a bag of shoes and grab yourself some desiccants, then on your way home buy some Jack's beef jerky for an oxygen absorber.  In any case, it'll be fine for that long, I'm sure.  But if you can't store your chems in a freezer at least have them in a bag, inside another ziplock with the two absorbers in it.


----------



## MagickalKat777

k.kat said:


> How trippy is AMT compared to LSD or MUSHIES,
> I read a post the other day but can't find it now, but it said something about if a AMT trip goes bad there is no way out of it, so would it be like a bad LSD or MUSHIES trip.
> Also read that its quite like MDMA but better which is more why i want to try it
> So is it along the same line as if you took LSD & MDMA at the same time,
> im thinking if its quite like MDMA more than TRIPS why would it turn into a bad trip surely the MDMA side would keep the chance of a bad trip away,



This varies. Some people like myself experience a full-blown candyflip like experience with intense euphoria that is different from MDMA but just as nice in the body.

Others just get the euphoria no matter what dose they take - they never have visuals. For me to see visuals, it took 50mg... and the body load at that dose was so high that I was not feeling great most of the time.

As far as terminating AMT. Its not possible. I tried Xanax, Klonopin, and phenibut and none of them slowed it down - in fact, they made it stronger. However, I've heard that two 15mg mirtazapine ONLY WHEN COMING DOWN will put you out like a light or if you're having a really nasty trip, my friends always kept trazodone on hand. Pop 400mg and you're either a lot more relaxed or you're comatose.


----------



## k.kat

psood0nym said:


> ^Go try on a bag of shoes and grab yourself some desiccants, then on your way home buy some Jack's beef jerky for an oxygen absorber.  In any case, it'll be fine for that long, I'm sure.  But if you can't store your chems in a freezer at least have them in a bag, inside another ziplock with the two absorbers in it.



so i could put it in the freezer in the bags the way it is without desiccants & oxygen absorbers, even though the freezer is wet,
see ive no money left this week to go buy beef jerky or anything as ive spent it all on drugs now, lol



MagickalKat777 said:


> This varies. Some people like myself experience a full-blown candyflip like experience with intense euphoria that is different from MDMA but just as nice in the body.
> 
> Others just get the euphoria no matter what dose they take - they never have visuals. For me to see visuals, it took 50mg... and the body load at that dose was so high that I was not feeling great most of the time.
> 
> As far as terminating AMT. Its not possible. I tried Xanax, Klonopin, and phenibut and none of them slowed it down - in fact, they made it stronger. However, I've heard that two 15mg mirtazapine ONLY WHEN COMING DOWN will put you out like a light or if you're having a really nasty trip, my friends always kept trazodone on hand. Pop 400mg and you're either a lot more relaxed or you're comatose.



i take it by candyflip you mean  E & LSD at same time, ive done that & enjoy that,
just i used to love & do lots of tripping but have had a few bad trips & its put me of tripping & havent tripped since about 1999 when i had a bad one,

i love E and its been my fav drug since 1988 but cant find real ones 
so got into mephedrone , these days jolly & did enjoy 6-apb when i had 2,
i enjoyed the visuals with 6-apb,

mirtrazapine i do have somewhere so thats good ,
hopefully im worrying for nothing though as i do love intense euphoria.

i think i should go pick some mushies,lol


----------



## MrTiHKAL

^Your worrying too much. I know it is said to degrade quite quickly but not by next friday. Just put the bag in a drawer it will be fine.


----------



## k.kat

MrTiHKAL said:


> ^Your worrying too much. I know it is said to degrade quite quickly but not by next friday. Just put the bag in a drawer it will be fine.



thanks  MrTiHKAL
thats me a born worrier,lol,
 i'll stop worrying now.


----------



## drugs

I dont think it will degrade that quickly. I had some stored at roomtemp for several months, didnt notice any significant potency drop. Just keep it sealed and away from light and excess heat.


----------



## kingme

what a wonderful chemical... just enjoying the afterglow after a trip last night... ~30mg. was my first time on it, and i have to say the body load is something to consider, but not as bad as it was with 2c-e for me.

what i found special about it was that i got quite interesting visuals even at such a presumably low dose (freebase). my favourite was sitting in a dark room with a light projecting the shadow of my hands on the wall and looking at the patterns forming... just incredible

also this is the first chemical where i feel like my memory has been distorted during the trip a little bit, losing track of time, sometimes playing events in reverse or waking up in a position i did not remember how i had gotten into. it might have been a more severe effect of time distortion. this had me worried a bit because at the beginning of the trip i had been with company (unknowing) and didnt want to appear like i was tripping. during the time spent with them it felt like i was in control. slow, but awake, a bit like the lazyness one gets after alcohol. 

i just wish i could remember better. but so far am enjoying the feelings this rc gave me. will definetly try it again, probably at a lower dose to benefit more from the insights this chemical promises.

but has anyone else had these sort of memory play happen to them?


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Gah! Cannot figure out my starting dose for this. Was planning on 25mg then adding up to another 25 later dependent on how it was going, but recent reports suggest this might be an underdose....


----------



## Mullered

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Gah! Cannot figure out my starting dose for this. Was planning on 25mg then adding up to another 25 later dependent on how it was going, but recent reports suggest this might be an underdose....



Me and the missus started on around 26-28mg each and neither of us felt much aftr 3 hours so we had what was left stuck to the bag - hard to tell how much as i had to turn the bag inside out and wash it in a small glass of water to make a solution but maybe around another 10 mg each and although we were both high to a certain extent we were both very mongy and lazy and just sat up all night chatting and consuning alcohol. We will definitly be doing 40mg the next time as a. Starting dose then maybe 10 - 15mg to top up later.  We both mannaged some sleep the next day and there wasnt much of a comedown apart from feeling tired.  Peple seem to find this stuff different at different doses so 25mg is probably a wise starting dose


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Thanks Mullered, I think you are right... 25mg to start it is...


----------



## Mullered

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Thanks Mullered, I think you are right... 25mg to start it is...



No worries Jed. From our experience i would say 25mg is a safe starting dose, if your experienced with RC's then you will probably have no problems pushing it up to 30 maybe 35mg, but if your unsure then i would say stick to 25 the first time as a tester then you should be better placed to work out your ideal dose for your second time.  As with all these RC's I guess its better tobe safe than sorry


----------



## InternetMuse

I've said this in one of the RC threads.  But is it just me or does having aMT referred to as an 'RC' annoy anybody else?

It's not an RC anymore than LSD is an RC. Can we _please_ stop referring to it as such, I'm not asking this to be a snob...just to keep it legal for a little bit longer!


----------



## MagickalKat777

InternetMuse said:


> I've said this in one of the RC threads.  But is it just me or does having aMT referred to as an 'RC' annoy anybody else?
> 
> It's not an RC anymore than LSD is an RC. Can we _please_ stop referring to it as such, I'm not asking this to be a snob...just to keep it legal for a little bit longer!



Really? Because aMT has a very short history of usage in humans... isn't being investigated as a drug for human consumption... and is largely unknown as far as its effects short and longterm... sounds like a research chemical to me.


----------



## InternetMuse

MagickalKat777 said:


> Really? Because aMT has a very short history of usage in humans... isn't being investigated as a drug for human consumption... and is largely unknown as far as its effects short and longterm... sounds like a research chemical to me.



I say this for three main reasons:

1) It's only 15-odd years younger than LSD and has a similar amount of history used in therapeutic environments, although less so when we take into account things like MKULTRA (which we know little about the results).  If you are willing to also classify LSD as an RC than fair enough.

2) It's been used and 'abused' for 40 years - I think we know a hell of a lot more about it at least experientially than we do substances like Meph, 6-A**, 5i** etc. etc.  It also had to go through quite a series of tests on humans and other research before being sold as an anti-depressant.

3) Keeping it off the radar of those looking for the next 'RC' can only be a good thing, no?  All the RC threads are now filled with 'buy aMT' = scheduled.

Edit: Having said all that, Erowid classifies is as a Research Chemical so I guess I have to fold to higher authorities.  But still...


----------



## melvin420

Do you think AMT gets sold as MDMA... I can easily see that because it basically has all of the side-effects as MDMA as seen here - http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/amt/amt_effects.shtml


----------



## MagickalKat777

^^^ AET was purchased in bulk from a chemical company and sold as MDMA here in Colorado for years until the DEA brought up a court case, lost, so scheduled it and brought the guy to court again.

AMT has been in pills in Colorado in the past. Very dangerous.


----------



## k.kat

@ MagickalKat777 
hi
 is Trazodone available without prescription, as my mirtazapine are low dose only 5mg
so low they took about 6 months to work,


----------



## MagickalKat777

trazodone is out there but its not the easiest thing to find. Its not very recreational.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

melvin420 said:


> Do you think AMT gets sold as MDMA... I can easily see that because it basically has all of the side-effects as MDMA as seen here - http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/amt/amt_effects.shtml



I woud think the nasty smell of aMt would make this unlikely.


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Hello - bombed 25mg of amt about 1hr15 ago. Got another 25mg to play with. 

Am I right in thinking that +3hrs is the peak and I shouldn't redose until then?

Feeling a bit like prior to coming up on mdma at the moment - slightly edgy etc etc

EDIT: +2hrs - nausea and dilated pupils. Feeling quite good but no euphoria to speak of.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

Should be ok to take more if your not feeling that your there by now.


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Thanks . Ok one more question. How long do you think I should give a redose to work before adding some more...? (Still not quite there)


----------



## MrTiHKAL

I have never redosed with it mate, but if your not loving it by now I would say that your not in the minority that have strong effects from these small doses. I see alot of people being underwhelmed by starting too low here at the moment, so if it was me i would neck the other 25 now to avoid disapointment. I hope your not working tomorrow though as you won't be sleeping.

Have fun


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Cheers MrThikal. Impeccable logic...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Cheers MrThikal. Impeccable logic...




yeh, 25 mg will just make ya angsty imo and underwhelmed, MrThikal logic is perfect and now is bluelights Spock haha


----------



## Xamkou

My AMT "opened" at the post office and has been passed on to the police. What the fuck.....


----------



## Listening

Xamkou said:


> My AMT "opened" at the post office and has been passed on to the police. What the fuck.....



Don't know how yours was packaged, but I'm surprised that the freebase that was sent to me a while ago didn't raise enough suspicion to do the same. RC distributors need to package this stuff in something smell-proof. They are putting their clients at risk.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Xamkou said:


> My AMT "opened" at the post office and has been passed on to the police. What the fuck.....



due some today recorded delivery, last lot stank to high heaven, different vendor this time and im hoping it is packaged better concerning the odour, im more worried about the postie having it off than what happened to Xamkou as i once caught the postie pocketing a letter from a neighbour, i threratened to kick his ass lol


----------



## deano88

I shit myself with worry waiting for my 5 grams to come thinking it was gonna get opened, thankfully it didnt


----------



## Lazyscience

so what are everyones thoughts on amt? love it or hate it? i tried it a couple of months ago and hated it. it made me feel horrible.


----------



## k.kat

Xamkou said:


> My AMT "opened" at the post office and has been passed on to the police. What the fuck.....



fuck 
sorry to hear that Xamkou, hope you get it back, 
as you should seens its legal surely,
they must have packaged it badly for it to just open,


----------



## ashtray girl

Lazyscience said:


> so what are everyones thoughts on amt? love it or hate it? i tried it a couple of months ago and hated it. it made me feel horrible.


 it.  A fantastic mellow psych.


----------



## k.kat

Lazyscience said:


> so what are everyones thoughts on amt? love it or hate it? i tried it a couple of months ago and hated it. it made me feel horrible.



how much did you take,describe the horribleness
seems people  having under 50mg has dysphoria
was it freebase you had,
ive yet to try mine and am thinking of trying 50mg
straight off


----------



## Xamkou

k.kat said:


> fuck
> sorry to hear that Xamkou, hope you get it back,
> as you should seens its legal surely,
> they must have packaged it badly for it to just open,



It's a bit weird though. Letters dont just "open", and it's illegal to open post without permission. Seems fishy to me.


----------



## glenjih

Hmm I've read reports from people having a good time on as little as 15mgs if I remember rightly. I'll be trying some soon, and having never dabbled in psychedelics before I won't be going any higher than 25/30mgs


----------



## MrTiHKAL

Lazyscience said:


> so what are everyones thoughts on amt? love it or hate it? i tried it a couple of months ago and hated it. it made me feel horrible.



What dose did you try it at? I'm betting it was less than 50mg.

From my own experience and from reading alot of reports here and elsewhere I am quickly forming the opinion that dosing anything under 50 is a waste of aMT.

I'll probably be criticised as being anti harm reduction but I think too many people are taking aMT wanting it to be mdxx so they are dosing too low to try and avoid any psychedelic effects but still want all the euphoria.
Well i'm sorry folks but this is a psychedelic drug and if you want the euphoria and other intersting effects that it offers then you have to take a psychedelic dose. If you want the new meph or mdxx then look elsewhere.

Peace


----------



## Mullered

Me and the missus started at around 26 - 28mg with another aprox 10mg each after we felt not much happening after 3 hours.  We were up all night but felt lazy / mongy and restless all night.  We will definitely be doing 40 - 5g next time to see if its any better


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

25mg made me feel pretty edgy. It wasn't until I took Mr Tikhal's advice and necked the rest of it (another 25mg) that things took a turn for the fantastic. Euphoria, great visuals. Music sounded amazing.


----------



## glenjih

Mullered said:


> Me and the missus started at around 26 - 28mg with another aprox 10mg each after we felt not much happening after 3 hours.  We were up all night but felt lazy / mongy and restless all night.  We will definitely be doing 40 - 5g next time to see if its any better



HCL or freebase? There are definitely people who have had a great time on that kind of dose. Was your diet MAOI compatible etc? Any other drug use near the time you took the AMT?

Sorry if I sound like I'm interrogating you, I'm just trying to make sure my attempt goes smoothly.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

JedTheHumanoid said:


> 25mg made me feel pretty edgy. It wasn't until I took Mr Tikhal's advice and necked the rest of it (another 25mg) that things took a turn for the fantastic. Euphoria, great visuals. Music sounded amazing.



Ahh good to hear back from you Jed, glad you had a blast mate.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> Ahh good to hear back from you Jed, glad you had a blast mate.



yeh buzzing ya had a great time Jed, my two bessie mates are coming to visit from where i grew up, got 200 mg on the way, im so exited to be taking with my amigos i feel sick haha , my unbelievable wife insisted they come and offered to stay at her sisters( overdue visit), we all taking 50 mg orally to start, with the option of a 17 mg bump later on if it feels right


----------



## hugodanner

hey all,

Just purchased 250mg of AMT *snip*. As many people have reported it's an off white powder with an incredibly strong foul odour. *the rest of this comment was about sourcing and was removed, feel free to comment on whether the physical description of the AMT matches samples you've seen or not.  -Soli*

Thanks in advance

Hugo


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Yes, once I had the full dose it was great. I can see what xorkoth means about the 'unforced' euphoria. Felt really pure if you know what I mean. Visuals similar to shrooms for me, trails, morphing faces, melting etc. Closed eye visuals wete quite crazy actually. Kept forgetting i had my eyes closed - there were loads of bearded men stood around staring at me, then i'd open my eyes and be back on my own! 

At about +7hrs did a 25mg line of methoxawhatdoyoucallit and that really picked up the euphoria. Around +10 I hit the tranqs and gin and got pretty fucked on that whilst maintaining the visuals... Very very enjoyable. Have a good one scoobs...

Should mention I had quite a bit of nausea for the first few hours. When i finally chucked it seemed to step it up to another gear...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

hugodanner said:


> hey all,
> 
> Just purchased 250mg of AMT *snip*. As many people have reported it's an off white powder with an incredibly strong foul odour. *the rest of this comment was about sourcing and was removed, feel free to comment on whether the physical description of the AMT matches samples you've seen or not. -Soli*
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> Hugo



mate welcome to BL, just a heads up, no vendor naming or discussion, can you please edit your post

quality is fine btw



JedTheHumanoid said:


> Yes, once I had the full dose it was great. I can see what xorkoth means about the 'unforced' euphoria. Felt really pure if you know what I mean. Visuals similar to shrooms for me, trails, morphing faces, melting etc. At about +7hrs did a 25mg line of methoxawhatdoyoucallit and that really picked up the euphoria. Around +10 I hit the tranqs and gin and got pretty fucked on that whilst maintaining the visuals... Very very enjoyable. Have a good one scoobs...



lmao at meth************, i just got an ounce of beautiful afghan black, smooth as a high class hookers legs, got my benzos and some quality bud also Jed, your timescale sounds perfect, a good one will ensue i have no doubt, easy mate


----------



## ashtray girl

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Should mention I had quite a bit of nausea for the first few hours. When i finally chucked it seemed to step it up to another gear...


Nothing beats vomming, and when you look down into the water realising you are tripping.  ;-)


----------



## Scoobysnacks

ashtray girl said:


> Nothing beats vomming, and when you look down into the water realising you are tripping.  ;-)



always sick when i come up of drugs, used to it now and it lets me know im gonna get high lol


----------



## Mullered

glenjih said:


> HCL or freebase? There are definitely people who have had a great time on that kind of dose. Was your diet MAOI compatible etc? Any other drug use near the time you took the AMT?
> 
> Sorry if I sound like I'm interrogating you, I'm just trying to make sure my attempt goes smoothly.



No worries glenjih.  It was labled as freebase and had that smell everyone describes.  Dont know if you remember that 'fart gas' that the joke shops used to sell but it smelt exactly like that.  My diet wasnt MAOI compatible to be fair as I had been drinking protein shakes all day (I work out) but I dont think the missus had anything particually MAOI uncompatible and we had similar experiences.  TBH I think you should stick to 25 - 30mg for your first go and see how it suits you.  We were both glad it was not enough rather than too much and we wont be nervous about trying a higher dose next time now we (sort of) know what to expect.

In hindsight, in my personal opinion 40 - 50mg would have been much better as although it was nice in a way, we both had the feeling of never quite getting there.  However to put it into context we both have a reletivly high BMI, weighing in at around 15 stone each (we're both pretty tall) which I suspect makes a difference.  Someone smaller might have a stronger experience off the same dosage, so I guess better to be safe than sorry


----------



## Mullered

Scoobysnacks said:


> always sick when i come up of drugs, used to it now and it lets me know im gonna get high lol



Haha, as long as you dont see two half desolved pills in the toilet looking back at you


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

I have to confess I sicked up a little nugget of amt which I shoved back down...


----------



## Mullered

JedTheHumanoid said:


> I have to confess I sicked up a little nugget of amt which I shoved back down...



What was your dosage in the end Jed?


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

I had 50mg in total. Started with 25mg which left me feeling a bit edgy. Between +2 and +3 I did the rest in a couple of doses. Took me to another level pretty quickly and was amazing for the next 6 hrs...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Mullered said:


> Haha, as long as you dont see two half desolved pills in the toilet looking back at you



haha..ye total bummer mate, i had that sussed by chewing my pills like rennies

Jed ive swallowed my sick on occasions when i was a young drug fiend..ewwwwwwwww


----------



## Mullered

JedTheHumanoid said:


> I had 50mg in total. Started with 25mg which left me feeling a bit edgy. Between +2 and +3 I did the rest in a couple of doses. Took me to another level pretty quickly and was amazing for the next 6 hrs...


 The first part of your experience on 25mg sounds similar to ours, looks like 50mg is the way forward 



Scoobysnacks said:


> haha..ye total bummer mate, i had that sussed by chewing my pills like rennies
> 
> Jed ive swallowed my sick on occasions when i was a young drug fiend..ewwwwwwwww



When I got sick I used to try and hold out until I was sure the goods were digested .......... then let fly


----------



## Scoobysnacks

got my stuff today, no noticeable smell...UNTIL.. i opened it..fook it stinks rank, whole front room filled up with the god damn awful smell..read somewhere you can dab this..not on my nelly hahaha..it going down via a cigerette paper


----------



## MrTiHKAL

^Scoob
I actually emailed the new vendor im trying to make sure my order would be properly packaged after reading about xamkou's woes but they had already posted and when it arrived there was no detectable smell at all before i opened the envelope, after.....let's just say I now know what it would be like if Jabba the Hut farted in my kitchen


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> ^Scoob
> I actually emailed the new vendor im trying to make sure my order would be properly packaged after reading about xamkou's woes but they had already posted and when it arrived there was no detectable smell at all before i opened the envelope, after.....let's just say I now know what it would be like if Jabba the Hut farted in my kitchen




hahaha..i was thinking on the lines of an old flatulant guy on a terrible meat only diet, how ya doing mate? when ya taking yours and if so how much ya having?


----------



## MagickalKat777

Well there will be new AMT coming out soon that is a much higher quality synth... should have much less smell than the current batches as the smell is an impurity.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> Well there will be new AMT coming out soon that is a much higher quality synth... should have much less smell than the current batches as the smell is an impurity.



i always thought the smell was from a compound found also in human shite, actually im positive..read it in a mods post

much prefer it to be smelly..least we know it for real lol


----------



## MrTiHKAL

^Not sure mate, maybe tomororow. 
Trying out a sub lingual dose of 30mg mxe right now, aint really hitting the spot as you can probably tell by the fact im still here typing this message.


----------



## zamzams

you should try plugging it instead... buy a plastic syringe without a needle for about 13p - much better experience, uses less, more euphoric/quicker onset too and will remove some of the nausea & having to pick through chunks to find what you lost into the toilet - at least with plugging you can expel if you've taken too much and there's no lingering aftertaste of vomit in your mouth or fartgas breath burps 

the only problem is doing this in a social setting but at least you won't all be rushing to the toilet at the same time...

If your GF/wife has a douche use that beforehand though incase you're worried about anal leakage later 

my mrs loves it up the bum these days fnarr fnarr


----------



## MagickalKat777

Scoobysnacks said:


> i always thought the smell was from a compound found also in human shite, actually im positive..read it in a mods post
> 
> much prefer it to be smelly..least we know it for real lol



It is but its an impurity. Skatole I believe.

The smell will still be there just much less intense.


----------



## zamzams

MagickalKat777 said:


> It is but its an impurity. Skatole I believe.
> 
> The smell will still be there just much less intense.



wow they put a synthetic version in icecream according to the 2nd link on google

link

brings a whole new perspective to the term 'mr whippy'


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> ^Not sure mate, maybe tomororow.
> Trying out a sub lingual dose of 30mg mxe right now, aint really hitting the spot as you can probably tell by the fact im still here typing this message.




hope it picks up mate, once took 15 mg and felt a little shitty, this stuff is crap when ya underdose, i just had a shitty bodyload and wide awake, im taking 50 mg orally and have a further 17mg on hand for a booster, i will smoke weed for the whole duration , got a oz of some beautiful sticky afghan, will finish off with a few benzos and a gram of squidgy will be eaten..happy days:D



zamzams said:


> wow they put a synthetic version in icecream according to the 2nd link on google
> 
> link
> 
> brings a whole new perspective to the term 'mr whippy'



hahaha..nice one zamzams, i lol'd at that

can i turn freebase to HCL using malt vinegar, anything else i can use what we find in our homes?


----------



## MagickalKat777

vinegar will turn freebase to acetate - and you should use pure white vinegar.
'


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> vinegar will turn freebase to acetate - and you should use pure white vinegar.
> '



not got any Magical, can ya buy from a normal shop or will i need a supermarket?

will vodka work?

lmao..this may sound sick but will ya piss do the job?


----------



## MagickalKat777

what are you wanting to make it soluble for?


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> what are you wanting to make it soluble for?



may plug it Magical


----------



## MagickalKat777

you're considering plugging vodka? T_T

Go get some vinegar... its cheap, its readily available, and its much safer than vodka. As to AMT solubility in alcohol I've never tried it.


----------



## psood0nym

zamzams said:


> you should try plugging it instead... buy a plastic syringe without a needle for about 13p - much better experience, uses less, more euphoric/quicker onset too


I've taken to cutting the needle and tip of the plastic piece off of insulin syringes with wire cutter for this (so that it still squirts through the needle but the needle is completely recessed in the plastic casing).  Then I just use the nail file in my nail clippers to file down the sharp plastic edge from clipping. This way I can tip the filled syringe without any dripping out, plus it's thinner.  I just back load whatever pure chem I'm plugging, stick the plunger back in, and suck water/vinegar into the barrel through the recessed needle. 

It can be disposed of without wasting much money if you can't clean it -- finally public bathroom rectal re-dosing is a reality!  Just drop trough, spit on the barrel, grab your ankles and swallow your pride (If you dissolve in 30 insulin units or less there's little risk of leakage, even if you stand up and walk out right away; just squirt it deep and make sure you pull it out while you're still tipped upside down).


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> you're considering plugging vodka? T_T
> 
> Go get some vinegar... its cheap, its readily available, and its much safer than vodka. As to AMT solubility in alcohol I've never tried it.



ill ask my wife to buy some white vinegar, thanks mate


----------



## MrTiHKAL

Scoobysnacks said:


> hope it picks up mate, once took 15 mg and felt a little shitty, this stuff is crap when ya underdose, i just had a shitty bodyload and wide awake, im taking 50 mg orally and have a further 17mg on hand for a booster, i will smoke weed for the whole duration , got a oz of some beautiful sticky afghan, will finish off with a few benzos and a gram of squidgy will be eaten..happy days:D



Mate, mxe not amt, my thoughts on low dose amt are all over this thread and i would certainly never try it sub lingual, just the thought if it makes me wanna puke.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> Mate, mxe not amt, my thoughts on low dose amt are all over this thread and i would certainly never try it sub lingual, just the thought if it makes me wanna puke.



haha..DOH..thought ya was a looney for eating aMT but i was being polite and didnt want to laugh and ridicule ya lol..25 mg of mxe was ok, much prefered 50 mg, though i wont buy again i dont think


----------



## zamzams

Scoobysnacks said:


> may plug it Magical



sorry scoobs i forgot it's all freebase now. 

Try a tiny amount in warm water see if it dissolves, plus you'll be surprised at how readily your rectal canal will absorb anything you put inside it.

vodka and white vinegar are two things i wouldn't like to plug neat would make me more sick than taking it orally!


----------



## Scoobysnacks

zamzams said:


> sorry scoobs i forgot it's all freebase now.
> 
> Try a tiny amount in warm water see if it dissolves, plus you'll be surprised at how readily your body will absorb anything you put inside it.
> 
> vodka and white vinegar are two things i wouldn't like to plug would make me more sick than taking it orally!



cheers zamzams , so its the getting it up there thats the problem, cd put in tiny piece of rizla and just shove it up there

shit plan , dont think a rizla will melt up ya arse..haha


----------



## zamzams

Scoobysnacks said:


> cheers zamzams , so its the getting it up there thats the problem, cd put in tiny piece of rizla and just shove it up there
> 
> shit plan , dont think a rizla will melt up ya arse..haha



i dunno depends what you had to eat the night before  - a vindaloo might just work hahaha



psood0nym said:


> I've taken to cutting the needle and tip of the plastic piece off of insulin syringes with wire cutter for this (so that it still squirts through the needle but the needle is completely recessed in the plastic casing).  Then I just use the nail file in my nail clippers to file down the sharp plastic edge from clipping. This way I can tip the filled syringe without any dripping out, plus it's thinner.  I just back load whatever pure chem I'm plugging, stick the plunger back in, and suck water/vinegar into the barrel through the recessed needle.
> 
> It can be disposed of without wasting much money if you can't clean it -- finally public bathroom rectal re-dosing is a reality!  Just drop trough, spit on the barrel, grab your ankles and swallow your pride (If you dissolve in 30 insulin units or less there's little risk of leakage, even if you stand up and walk out right away; just squirt it deep and make sure you pull it out while you're still tipped upside down).



you could just stick the syringe (without any needle) as far up as it goes, that's what i do... just gotta make sure it doesn't come flying back out again when you remove it. getting into an almost pornographic position of legs behind you head - bum in the air works well


----------



## MagickalKat777

And how exactly is the rectum going to absorb the freebase? You have to convert it to a salt of some sort before it will absorb properly.

What you do is get a small amount of water (5mL should work - distilled only) and you put the AMT in there then add a drop at a time of vinegar until it goes into solution... then add one to two more drops to make sure it stays there, pull it up in the syringe, plug.


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Might be a honeymoon period but the comedown from this is incredibly light considering how long it lasts... Felt a bit ropey yesterday but good today.


----------



## lineartransform

Any amount of vinegar with rectal admin is going to make it VERY difficult to retain the AMT - trust me, that's the nicest way I can put it.

The best method of plugging AMT freebase I have found is to dissolve it in a small amount of propylene glycol. It dissolves easily over a period of a few minutes, and this process can be sped up by the addition of a bit of heat. I do not believe conversion to a salt is required, as this has been tested and has a distinct increase in potency and decrease in onset over oral.


----------



## Unbreakable

I am curious about this too... because i can only find the Amt Freebase


----------



## zamzams

lineartransform said:


> Any amount of vinegar with rectal admin is going to make it VERY difficult to retain the AMT - trust me, that's the nicest way I can put it.
> 
> The best method of plugging AMT freebase I have found is to dissolve it in a small amount of propylene glycol. It dissolves easily over a period of a few minutes, and this process can be sped up by the addition of a bit of heat. I do not believe conversion to a salt is required, as this has been tested and has a distinct increase in potency and decrease in onset over oral.



would a couple of drops of mineral oil work then? either way i wouldn't want to make a habit out of doing that, it would have some serious long term health risks. 

from the data sheet:-
"avoid skin contact with propylene glycol as this strong skin irritant can cause liver abnormalities and kidney damage."

generally i would avoid plugging anything unless it is in water.



MagickalKat777 said:


> And how exactly is the rectum going to absorb the freebase? You have to convert it to a salt of some sort before it will absorb properly.



i see your point i've never tried plugging freebase of anything though, i would smoke it if i had freebase as wouldn't like the long duration of taking freebase orally.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Might be a honeymoon period but the comedown from this is incredibly light considering how long it lasts... Felt a bit ropey yesterday but good today.



nice one Jed, i taking 3pm sunday and in work 7am tuesday so shd be cool

did ya do a full trip report mate , would like to read if you have


----------



## JedTheHumanoid

Not yet. I'll try and do one tomorrow. There don't seem to be many first time TRs for this.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Not yet. I'll try and do one tomorrow. There don't seem to be many first time TRs for this.



yeh was thinking the same, just browsed the tr's, i will post a full one also when im recovered lol,  seen a cpl of posts on another forum comparing it to the infamous 6-apb pellets, hope fucking not haha..if my 50mg dose lives upto the majority of the reports on erowid i will be over the moon, the ones who mixed with weed took off and thats what i want, im getting tempted to eat some weed on taking the aMT as it will be a nice slow release and i imagine will stop any bodyload and nausea and best of all magnify the trip, thats my philosiphy..sounds good doesnt it haha


----------



## lineartransform

zamzams said:


> would a couple of drops of mineral oil work then? either way i wouldn't want to make a habit out of doing that, it would have some serious long term health risks.
> 
> from the data sheet:-
> "avoid skin contact with propylene glycol as this strong skin irritant can cause liver abnormalities and kidney damage."
> 
> generally i would avoid plugging anything unless it is in water.




You may want to research just what propylene glycol is used for.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propylene_glycol

See "Applications". While I wouldn't chug bottles of it, I'm not too concerned about the 1-2mL required.


----------



## Sidus

I've recently ordered 50mg freebase and as I have the house for myself tomorrow, I'm keen on doing a bit of researching.

I was wondering how trippy/introspective AMT is, as I can't really deduct that from everybody's comments. I had a bad trip over a year ago on acid and I haven't touched psychedelics since then (but had my fair share of MDMA, Meph, M1). I don't really feel in the mood a 10hour self analysis 

What kind of dosage would you recommend to maximize euphoria and minimize thought loops, mind fucks? Any input would be appreciated...


----------



## psood0nym

Did you read post 151?

"I'll probably be criticised as being anti harm reduction but I think too many people are taking aMT wanting it to be mdxx so they are dosing too low to try and avoid any psychedelic effects but still want all the euphoria.
Well i'm sorry folks but this is a psychedelic drug and if you want the euphoria and other intersting effects that it offers then you have to take a psychedelic dose. If you want the new meph or mdxx then look elsewhere."

I've personally found that euphoria relative to psychedelia is increased by using aMT intramuscularly rather than by any other method. Still, it's less intense than most straight empathogens at low IM sub-psychedelic doses.  If you want to use it for euphoria it's real value is as part of combinations -- it tends to potentiate other monoamine releasers, smooth them out, lengthen them, and reduce or eliminate any kind of crash for me. Amphetamine, an opiate, some cannabis and aMT is pretty fantastic for non-committal pleasure.


----------



## Sidus

Thanks psoodonym, I indeed read that post. Some people seem to insinuate that it is a relatively anxiety-free substance and that it is hard not to have a good time on it.

I def agree with you on the "get the full effect" thing. I guess I'am just trying to find out what kind of thinking patterns to expect....


----------



## psood0nym

You're unlikely to get mindfuckery reminiscent of powerful psychedelics.  You could try lower and just keep some M1 on hand to kick it up a notch if needed.  The worst you get at a low dose is mild to moderate anxiety, and that's nowhere near a bad trip.


----------



## MagickalKat777

psood0nym said:


> You're unlikely to get mindfuckery reminiscent of powerful psychedelics.  You could try lower and just keep some M1 on hand to kick it up a notch if needed.  The worst you get at a low dose is mild to moderate anxiety, and that's nowhere near a bad trip.



Some would beg to differ with this opinion. 12 hours of anxiety versus a 30 minute spell of ick in a trip... give me the 30 minute bad trip...


----------



## Scoobysnacks

psood0nym said:


> Did you read post 151?
> 
> "I'll probably be criticised as being anti harm reduction but I think too many people are taking aMT wanting it to be mdxx so they are dosing too low to try and avoid any psychedelic effects but still want all the euphoria.
> Well i'm sorry folks but this is a psychedelic drug and if you want the euphoria and other intersting effects that it offers then you have to take a psychedelic dose. If you want the new meph or mdxx then look elsewhere."
> 
> I've personally found that euphoria relative to psychedelia is increased by using aMT intramuscularly rather than by any other method. Still, it's less intense than most straight empathogens at low IM sub-psychedelic doses.  If you want to use it for euphoria it's real value is as part of combinations -- it tends to potentiate other monoamine releasers, smooth them out, lengthen them, and reduce or eliminate any kind of crash for me. Amphetamine, an opiate, some cannabis and aMT is pretty fantastic for non-committal pleasure.



i have weed and can get some phet, opiates i not sure , are sleepers opiates?, how much of each wd ya recommend, will taking phet not wire ya as amt is also an amphetimine of sorts, cheers mate


----------



## MagickalKat777

Yeah lets mix stims and downers with a psychedelic stimulant. 8)


----------



## Xamkou

I mixed aMT with Mephedrone and later added some Methoxetamine and had the most amazing experiences. 

could be dangerous so do not try etc etc


----------



## MagickalKat777

*facepalm*

I swear if it wasn't already illegal here I'd smack some people around...


----------



## Sidus

Thanks for the advice 35-40mg down the hatch (freebase)


----------



## Lombergerh

Soon I will have AMT, I have no experienced with psychedelics, but experienced with dissociatives (used big doses of DXM and K)
I think I will start from 25mg.Somebody tried to mix amt with Piracetam or Phenibut? Will it be dangerous?
I think it can enhance the experience, in reality Phenibut works great with shrooms.


----------



## Sidus

Man, it takes long to come up (T+2). Def feeling it now: buzzing and a slight change in colour.


----------



## Sidus

T+4: delight!


----------



## Albion

Hopefully got 500mg coming in the post beginning of next week. Going to take 50mg as a first dose...and I'm probably going to be doing this around 22:00. Reckon I'll be adequately sober by 09:00 the next morning? Also how forgiving is the comedown from AMT? I don't want this substance affecting anything other than my free time.


----------



## psood0nym

Scoobysnacks said:


> i have weed and can get some phet, opiates i not sure , are sleepers opiates?, how much of each wd ya recommend, will taking phet not wire ya as amt is also an amphetimine of sorts, cheers mate


I keep the doses of the aMT and amphetamine low e.g. 12 mg aMT IM and 5 - 10 mg amphetamine insufflated with another bump every couple of hours or so.  The opiate dose is something like 10 - 15 mg oxycontin or 2 or 3 1.5 - 2 inch diameter poppy pods. 

I don't think it's anymore dangerous than mixing MDMA with opiates, which is really common -- and certainly not comparable to the dangers of an IV speedball or something -- so I'm not sure what the hubbub is about above. None of the components of the combo is contraindicated with any other so far as I know. With amphetamine you're not releasing serotonin either, so you're not combining serotonin releasers and risking serotonin syndrome like you are combining aMT with meth/meph/MDMA.  What it is is a whole lot of non-committal pleasure, which carries increased risk of addiction and always wanting a little more, but I think that's pretty obvious.


----------



## Sidus

JSPete said:


> Hopefully got 500mg coming in the post beginning of next week. Going to take 50mg as a first dose...and I'm probably going to be doing this around 22:00. Reckon I'll be adequately sober by 09:00 the next morning? Also how forgiving is the comedown from AMT? I don't want this substance affecting anything other than my free time.



i'll let you know! (going good right now


----------



## Albion

Sidus said:


> i'll let you know! (going good right now




Ahaaa jealous!


----------



## MrTiHKAL

JSPete said:


> Hopefully got 500mg coming in the post beginning of next week. Going to take 50mg as a first dose...and I'm probably going to be doing this around 22:00. Reckon I'll be adequately sober by 09:00 the next morning? Also how forgiving is the comedown from AMT? I don't want this substance affecting anything other than my free time.



Adequately sober enough to do what? Fly a jumbo jet? No
The comedown is not severe but aMT is still quite stimulating after the main effects subside and I like to have a few beers or a smoke to ease myself back into reality, benzos are fine if you don't have any weed available.
I generally take aMT during the day so I don't lose much sleep but you will have not slept all night so it depends how well you function when your tired.
I really wouldn't plan anything for the next day except maybe smoking some weed and watching some films until I fell asleep but I am an old git now, when i was in my early twenties I could go out all night clubbing and carry on with my day mostly unhindered.
My advice if you want to take this substance without it affecting your everyday life too much would be to dose early in the day and get a good nights sleep when you come down.


----------



## theotherside

Why is AMT schedule I here in the states since the 70's or 80's but is everywhere in the UK?


----------



## ashtray girl

aMT was only made illegal in the USA in the early 2000s I think.


----------



## theotherside

^^^Oh ok but just wondering why they are so harsh on tryptamines here. I've always wanted to try AMT....oh well


----------



## Isaac_Hock

I'm going to do 60mg of aMT tonight for the first time. I want to have a bit of food in my stomach rather than doing it empty, so plan to eat a small meal about 2 - 3 hours before doing it. I hear that you have to be careful what foods you eat with this stuff, so can someone tell me please what is best to avoid?


----------



## MagickalKat777

theotherside26 said:


> Why is AMT schedule I here in the states since the 70's or 80's but is everywhere in the UK?



Emergency scheduled with Foxy and 2C-T-7 in 2004 IIRC.

And I still don't understand the reasoning behind it... There were things that were much more popular than AMT and causing just as many trips to the hospital if not more in the case of DPT...


----------



## ashtray girl

MAOI Diet.

I don't personally get the stomach problems or much of a bodyload from aMT, other than nausea (and sometimes a mild headache on the comedown) and I don't eat at all on the day I am going to use it.  Friends who eat that day tend to get the shits quite bad.


----------



## MagickalKat777

Isaac_Hock said:


> I'm going to do 60mg of aMT tonight for the first time. I want to have a bit of food in my stomach rather than doing it empty, so plan to eat a small meal about 2 - 3 hours before doing it. I hear that you have to be careful what foods you eat with this stuff, so can someone tell me please what is best to avoid?



Seriously? 60mg your first time? You guys really don't fuck around with your doses.

Look up the MAOI compatible diet on Google. Mainly, avoid aged cheese, wine, caffeine, other stimulants, cough syrup, etc...


----------



## MagickalKat777

ashtray girl said:


> MAOI Diet.
> 
> I don't personally get the stomach problems or much of a bodyload from aMT, other than nausea (and sometimes a mild headache on the comedown) and I don't eat at all on the day I am going to use it.  Friends who eat that day tend to get the shits quite bad.



Yeah most people I know, including myself, fast before taking AMT...


----------



## MrTiHKAL

The smoothest come up I had with aMT was when I dosed 50mg as soon as I woke in the morning around 11am before eating anything. I had a cup of coffee and a glass of fruit juice while waiting for it to take effect but nothing else. 
There was no nausea, no edgyness just a smooth slow transition into bliss while taking a long bath with the radio turned up loud, wonderful


----------



## Scoobysnacks

psood0nym said:


> I keep the doses of the aMT and amphetamine low e.g. 12 mg aMT IM and 5 - 10 mg amphetamine insufflated with another bump every couple of hours or so.  The opiate dose is something like 10 - 15 mg oxycontin or 2 or 3 1.5 - 2 inch diameter poppy pods.
> 
> I don't think it's anymore dangerous than mixing MDMA with opiates, which is really common -- and certainly not comparable to the dangers of an IV speedball or something -- so I'm not sure what the hubbub is about above. None of the components of the combo is contraindicated with any other so far as I know. With amphetamine you're not releasing serotonin either, so you're not combining serotonin releasers and risking serotonin syndrome like you are combining aMT with meth/meph/MDMA.  What it is is a whole lot of non-committal pleasure, which carries increased risk of addiction and always wanting a little more, but I think that's pretty obvious.



thanks for the info mate, i decided im gonna fairly high dose amt orally and cane weed ending the night/day/night off with benzos:D



MrTiHKAL said:


> The smoothest come up I had with aMT was when I dosed 50mg as soon as I woke in the morning around 11am before eating anything. I had a cup of coffee and a glass of fruit juice while waiting for it to take effect but nothing else.
> There was no nausea, no edgyness just a smooth slow transition into bliss while taking a long bath with the radio turned up loud, wonderful




hey MrT, like the sounbd of that, my wife bringing me some pure smoothies back later, no banana included, will a pure fruit smoothie , say 500 ml count as a drink or a meal?..do you think this will stop me coming up as good, i would be taking smoothie 5 hrs before orally ingesting 50 mg amt


----------



## Vader

> are sleepers opiates?


No.


> amt is also an amphetimine of sorts


No.


----------



## MrTiHKAL

@scoob
I drank the juice after bombing the amt and it didn't cause any problems so you should be fine mate.


----------



## psood0nym

A small to midsized fruit smoothie sounds like perfect aMT food.  Stimulants tend to zap glucose, so you definitely want something sugary.  In any case I recommend eating lightly throughout the day -- fruit, pastries, and the like -- to prevent GI issues, especially if you swallowed the aMT.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

hey guys , just got a gram of meph, will it go nicely with aMT and if so how much alongside 50 mg aMT, when best taken and best route..oral or bumping, cheers


----------



## ugh1979

Lazyscience said:


> so what are everyones thoughts on amt? love it or hate it? i tried it a couple of months ago and hated it. it made me feel horrible.



Sorry to hear that.

aMT for me has been incredible.  It helped bring me out of a long period of depression and got me off SSRI's (I took SSRI's for 18months and they contributed to the worst time of my life).

Along with being a very very good alternative to MDMA for me but with no comedown (I love MDMA but hate the comedowns!), it is also the best drug or med i've ever had for focusing and creativity.  I'm a creative person naturally but when I take aMT it rockets.  It's brilliant! I bleed ideas when on aMT. %)

I love how controlled I am when on it as well.  I have no qualms with being in absolutely any situation when on it, which isn't something I can say about any other RC or illegal drug.

For me it's basically a lovely weekend medication for socialising, creativity, and of course fun.


----------



## Feste

Does amt work well snorted? I just found a tiny amount that I forgot I had, but it looks to be only 30mg, so not enough for an oral dose & I don'[t want to smoke it.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

Feste said:


> Does amt work well snorted? I just found a tiny amount that I forgot I had, but it looks to be only 30mg, so not enough for an oral dose & I don'[t want to smoke it.



it fine to snort if ya can handle the awful stench..make sure it HCL and not freebase, let us know how ya go on


----------



## MrTiHKAL

Scoobysnacks said:


> hey guys , just got a gram of meph, will it go nicely with aMT and if so how much alongside 50 mg aMT, when best taken and best route..oral or bumping, cheers



Probably a bad idea mate due to aMT being a MAOI, could cause serotonin syndrome.


----------



## Feste

Scoobysnacks said:


> it fine to snort if ya can handle the awful stench..make sure it HCL and not freebase, let us know how ya go on



Nah, it's hcl. Might give it a go soon then. Cheers.


----------



## Isaac_Hock

MagickalKat777 said:


> Seriously? 60mg your first time? You guys really don't fuck around with your doses.
> 
> Look up the MAOI compatible diet on Google. Mainly, avoid aged cheese, wine, caffeine, other stimulants, cough syrup, etc...



Well it's not like I'm an inexperienced drug user, heh. I decided on 60mg for the first time after reading discussions and talking to friends who have tried it, everyone seems to pretty much agree that anything below around 50mg is not enough for a good breaktthrough dose.

As it is, I did the 60mg at 3pm yesterday and found it absolutely excellent, no sickness problems for me. It suprises you by the way it creeps up on you so slowly. Builds up to a really wonderful, intense high. I'd say probably more intense than benzo fury. Didn't get any visuals on it (but then I rarely get visuals on anything except the really freaky stuff like 2C-e.)

After doing it 3pm Saturday, I was still flying high at 6am this morning, can't believe how long it lasted. Great stuff!

Excellent drug, A+++, will do again.


----------



## Scoobysnacks

3 hours in after a 50 mg dos...weed is going down a beauty, lovely mdmaesquee feeling and im tripping in the most beautiful way, no hidden nasties with this...my  .......OMFG..  just try it


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## deano88

Scoobysnacks said:


> 3 hours in after a 50 mg dos...weed is going down a beauty, lovely mdmaesquee feeling and im tripping in the most beautiful way, no hidden nasties with this...my  .......OMFG..  just try it



i have made a load of 50mg capsules for ease of use as i find 50mg to be the perfect starting dose as anything higher can make you feel a bit too sick on the come up.

thursday night had two 50mg capsules it was the most intense buzz i had and beat any mdma buzz i ever had and i never thought i'd say that. took my second capsule about 4 or 5 hours into my first dose and this blended perfect. as i came up of the re-dose i whacked on a old top buzz set full blast and had the most intense rushes ever my eyes were litteraly rolling in the back of my head and it felt like i went to another planet or something.

my jaw was chattering like fuck and i whilst my eyes were rolling back i saw some crazy patterns which got more intense if i closed my eyes.

i'd say two 50mg doses is the way to go wait about 4 or 5 hours to take the second this will do ya for the night i was buzzing for at least 12 hours the peaks come in waves. at one point i thought i was sobering up then out of nowhere got the rushes back again and my jaw going like crazy haha.

loud music and weed defo helps!! have fun


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## JedTheHumanoid

Here is my belated trip report for anyone interested...


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## Albion

Still waiting for a certain supplier to get some stock in...grrrr


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## Xamkou

I mixed with Meph and it was brilliant - euphoria through the roof. Took away the compulsiveness of Meph - take it easy though.


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## Myshkin

Feste said:


> Does amt work well snorted? I just found a tiny amount that I forgot I had, but it looks to be only 30mg, so not enough for an oral dose & I don'[t want to smoke it.



Don't snort it, please.

You might think 30mg isn't enough for an oral dose, but on an empty stomach it's more than enough to make the day a lot more enjoyable. 

I see the logic in wanting to snort it, but with aMT it's such an inappropriate ROA that you'd be far better taking it orally, or ideally plugging it. What's true for one drug isn't necessarily true of another. 

As for taking it with _meph_, would you piss in your cognac? 

Thought not.


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## Xamkou

I don't find it stimulative enough, and after the peak of the euphoria is over Mephedrone boosts it back up.


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## deano88

Snorting it is fucking horribal and pointless. Just loads of pain then numb face with no real noticeable effect. oraly is better


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## Scoobysnacks

fuck this shit is so easy on the body, i have come down now and have no adverse effects, took 50 mg and drank smoothies and smoked weed constantly throughout, felt very sleepy around 8 hours in and nodded off for an hour haha..woke and had 100 mg meph which woke me up and complimented the amt perfectly....10 hours in had another 25 mg off amt ...wow..i will do a trip report tommorrow as im very tired..other than tiredness i feel excellent ...everything 6-apb should of been, same duration in my opinion but supeior in every ways, no nasty stimulation or mouth chewing...just the most beautiful high i have ever experienced...ps my two mates also loved it and are asking me to get tyem a gram..hahahahah..Amt FOR THE WIN

at one point the visuals came on strong and felt like mushrooms with out the scatterness, i defy anyone to have a bad time on this gem of a substance


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## JedTheHumanoid

Couldn't agree more scoobs (usual harm reduction caveats apply of course....).


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## Scoobysnacks

JedTheHumanoid said:


> Couldn't agree more scoobs (usual harm reduction caveats apply of course....).



hey Jed, thanks for the pm, beautiful substance and of all the 5 r.c's i have took this is a million times better, i wont buy another r.c other than amt again..the wait is finaaly over and i have found a substance that works like a charm


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## JedTheHumanoid

Yeah - sorry about the bad pun - I was pished....


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## deano88

Scoobysnacks said:


> fuck this shit is so easy on the body, i have come down now and have no adverse effects, took 50 mg and drank smoothies and smoked weed constantly throughout, felt very sleepy around 8 hours in and nodded off for an hour haha..woke and had 100 mg meph which woke me up and complimented the amt perfectly....10 hours in had another 25 mg off amt ...wow..i will do a trip report tommorrow as im very tired..other than tiredness i feel excellent ...everything 6-apb should of been, same duration in my opinion but supeior in every ways, no nasty stimulation or mouth chewing...just the most beautiful high i have ever experienced...ps my two mates also loved it and are asking me to get tyem a gram..hahahahah..Amt FOR THE WIN
> 
> at one point the visuals came on strong and felt like mushrooms with out the scatterness, i defy anyone to have a bad time on this gem of a substance



Knew you would end up liking it :D

I aint bothered with any other rc's since either m8. Bet ya wish ya never flushed the other stuff now do ya haha


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## Scoobysnacks

*my amazing aMT report*

hey thought i would do a trip report as i love reading other peeeps..

38 yr guy... 70 kg..experienced in most drugs

2.30 p.m... took 50 mg of aMT five hours after consuming an apple and a pure fruit smoothie

+ 90 mins...feel it now coming on in waves..visuals starting

+ 2 hours...fook im flying, waves and waves of the most beautifull euphoria i have not felt till i took my good last E over 16 yrs ago

+ 3 hours...full on rushes..smoking spliffs constantly and getting amazing visuals..nothing heavy or dark..just beautiful colours and morphing

+ 3 hours till 7 hours...... euphoria and visuals still strong and with each spliff i get higher and higher haha

+ 8 hours..fook im tired and lay back and fall asleep for an hour

+ 9 hours..awake and my mates are like " oi wake up ya lightweight" lmfao..all take 100 mg of meph

+10 hours... meph has worked alongside the aMt amazingly ..feel slightly stimmed but in an a top way, nothing heavy, no chewing or have the need to drink gallons on water

+ 11 hours.. take an another 25 mg aMT along with another mate, 2nd mate passes... here we go again haha..not as strong as the original 50 mg but getting the most profound thoughts and visuals are coming on again

+12 till +22...spend this period putting the world to rights...plenty of male bonding and telling each other how much we love each other...the most beautiful tail end to a drug i have ever experienced

+ 24 fall asleep after packing a spliff

conclusion...what can i say...the best 24 hrs on a drug i ever experienced ..including old school E.... AMAZING ..BEAUTIFUL...MY FAV DRUG EVER

P.S no sore mouth whatsoever and feel brilliant..peeps say this stuff can be heavy on the body...i totally disagree


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## Scoobysnacks

deano88 said:


> Knew you would end up liking it :D
> 
> I aint bothered with any other rc's since either m8. Bet ya wish ya never flushed the other stuff now do ya haha



Hey Deano yeh i flushed 250 mg...DOH


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## Ben So Furry

Scoobysnacks said:


> conclusion...what can i say...the best 24 hrs on a drug i ever experienced ..including old school E.... AMAZING ..BEAUTIFUL...MY FAV DRUG EVER
> 
> P.S no sore mouth whatsoever and feel brilliant..peeps say this stuff can be heavy on the body...i totally disagree



Glad you enjoyed it and finally had a chance to really enjoy this, I agree with the above comments above about it being a new favourite as I feel exactly the same, it's just so nice.

Although I have to say scoobs I thought I had this thing sussed and on a lower dose from the same batch was a completely different almost overwhelming experience, it really did vary that much.


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## MrTiHKAL

@scoob
Sounds like you had a good one mate, do you think you have finally kicked the 6-apb obsession now?


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## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> @scoob
> Sounds like you had a good one mate, do you think you have finally kicked the 6-apb obsession now?




haha..my obsession with 6-apb ended soon as i took a pellet of the shit..if aMT is a bentley...6-apb is a robin reliant


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## MagickalKat777

Scooby - just be careful with it... I personally have become addicted to AMT and 2 of my other 3 friends that liked it had the same issue. No withdrawals really but just a strong desire to eat it all the time.

I went on a bender where I went through an entire gram in a month. And I regret it to this day because that was 2003 and I didn't get anymore before it was scheduled.

I'm going to be getting some freshly-synthed freebase AND HCl soon though so I'm quite stoked.

I really want to try a 50mg dose of the base I have but with how stimulated I got from my 16-20mg trial (pulse 160 resting, 180 not) and 3mg of Klonopin putting absolutely no dent in the stimulation or the trip (which was intense), along with the horrid bodyload I got, I just can't justify a visit to the hospital if things go south. :/


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## Phoenix_rising

I only ever had a 5mg tester,mainly for depression issues,but it didn`t work,so then i gave away my last 50mg to a friend.

Listening to these reports makes me want to do a 50mg dose so bad,the only thing stopping me is that i can never get the time away from those who don`t use to do it...In fact there isn`t even a place to go to get away from everyone to do it.

It sounds a fantastic experience at the levels that i`m reading about.Maybe one day,when i have my own place.


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## Scoobysnacks

MagickalKat777 said:


> Scooby - just be careful with it... I personally have become addicted to AMT and 2 of my other 3 friends that liked it had the same issue. No withdrawals really but just a strong desire to eat it all the time.
> 
> I went on a bender where I went through an entire gram in a month. And I regret it to this day because that was 2003 and I didn't get anymore before it was scheduled.
> 
> I'm going to be getting some freshly-synthed freebase AND HCl soon though so I'm quite stoked.
> 
> I really want to try a 50mg dose of the base I have but with how stimulated I got from my 16-20mg trial (pulse 160 resting, 180 not) and 3mg of Klonopin putting absolutely no dent in the stimulation or the trip (which was intense), along with the horrid bodyload I got, I just can't justify a visit to the hospital if things go south. :/



no stimulation of any note imo mate, and i fucking abhor being stimmed

wont be taking again till my birthday in january, im not a drug pig as i work 7 days a week, thanks fior the concern


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## goku4ever

wtf, AMT is the least abusable drug Ive ever come across. I trip for so long it takes me weeks to actually want to do it again.


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## MrTiHKAL

Scoobysnacks said:


> no stimulation of any note imo mate, and i fucking abhor being stimmed
> 
> wont be taking again till my birthday in january, im not a drug pig as i work 7 days a week, thanks fior the concern



No stimulation really? I have just posted a trip report where I walked probably 6 miles on a 50mg dose, so I would say this is definately stimulating for me  

AMT in the Park


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## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> No stimulation really? I have just posted a trip report where I walked probably 6 miles on a 50mg dose, so I would say this is definately stimulating for me
> 
> AMT in the Park



im not saying i didnt have energy..i mean stimmed as in sucking ya fooking mouth off and constant twitching..leg shaking etc..and remeber i smoked spliff after spliff of squidgy black..i lost no weight at all..if id took whizz i wd of been totally stimmed , on aMT it was hardly noticeable mate

shd of actually said i felt no bad stimulation


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## MrTiHKAL

^I see what you mean mate, it's not a pushy jittery type of stimulation like speed.


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## Scoobysnacks

MrTiHKAL said:


> ^I see what you mean mate, it's not a pushy jittery type of stimulation like speed.




exactly MrT


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## rainey

_ bought some amt a while back which cost me £100 for the gram. I took an alergy sample then followed up to a total of 33mg and I hated it. It made me very nervous and edgy and I had to take benzos to calm down.

I reported it here on bluelight and the general concensus was that I didnt take enough. On Sunday I plugged 50mg and went through 12 hours of hell. It was llike taking bad acid and all I got was this crude crude crude acid feeling and a horrible acid mouth.

Its the most disgusting drug I have ever had the misfortune to take. There was NOTHING pleasant about it at all.

It was grey hcl and at the time there was only one place in the uk that you could source it.

I will never take it again.

Give me 6-apb anytime!!!_

I like most of the rc`s including 4mmc, m1,b1,mdat,5iai,mdpv,dmc.

Amt was taking poison for a trippy effect.

My mouth is also covered in little blisters and my teeth feel `tight` and 2 days later my partner feels sick and she never gets any kind of adverse effects from rc`s.

The place I got it from sells only amt nothing else.

Maybe the white crystal variety is better?

ps....I slept for 20 hours after it.


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## Scoobysnacks

rainey said:


> _ bought some amt a while back which cost me £100 for the gram. I took an alergy sample then followed up to a total of 33mg and I hated it. It made me very nervous and edgy and I had to take benzos to calm down.
> 
> I reported it here on bluelight and the general concensus was that I didnt take enough. On Sunday I plugged 50mg and went through 12 hours of hell. It was llike taking bad acid and all I got was this crude crude crude acid feeling and a horrible acid mouth.
> 
> Its the most disgusting drug I have ever had the misfortune to take. There was NOTHING pleasant about it at all.
> 
> It was grey hcl and at the time there was only one place in the uk that you could source it.
> 
> I will never take it again.
> 
> Give me 6-apb anytime!!!_
> 
> I like most of the rc`s including 4mmc, m1,b1,mdat,5iai,mdpv,dmc.
> 
> Amt was taking poison for a trippy effect.
> 
> My mouth is also covered in little blisters and my teeth feel `tight` and 2 days later my partner feels sick and she never gets any kind of adverse effects from rc`s.
> 
> The place I got it from sells only amt nothing else.
> 
> Maybe the white crystal variety is better?
> 
> ps....I slept for 20 hours after it.



hey Rainey, i can only put it down to a bad batch, sorry to hear you and ya better half were so poorly, me and my two mates had no adverse effects at all except i felt nauseas for a while till i had a spliff


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## ugh1979

Scoobysnacks said:


> hey Rainey, i can only put it down to a bad batch, sorry to hear you and ya better half were so poorly, me and my two mates had no adverse effects at all except i felt nauseas for a while till i had a spliff



I don't put it down to a bad batch.  My friend had exactly the same reaction from a batch myself and others had which was fine from the same supplier (as I can can guess).  Rainey must just be one of the unlucky ones who don't react well to aMT.  There has been a few as reported in this thread.

As we should all have learned from reading this thread by now, aMT effects different people very differently.


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## any major dude

looks like this one's a bit old & overgrown.  Here's a link to the new one


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