# mephedrone long term negative effects progress reports



## Boojum

Ok I figure people who have had bad reactions to mephedrone can post their symtpoms here as well as progress like if you are getting better over time or whatever. Like after three months maybe you are fully back to normal. Please don't clutter this thread with things that are not you talking about your bad reaction to mephedrone, or updating on the progress of your body/effects/symtpoms/whatever since you got the bad effects.

I just posted my mephedrone experience in the, how toxic is mephedrone thread. Anyways, here is a quick run down (I am not including acute effects, please don't either)

Initial Bad Effects:

Foot discoloration (was postural dependent, happened where I had my foot pressed up against something), was bright red acutely and then turned to a deep bronze brown.

Foot swelling and engorged veins on the side of feet

Fingers were purple / dark at the knuckles, hands white as paper, tips of fingers after last joint bright red.

Oozing sores on foot opposite foot of the one with discoloration

Heart pains and light headedness, this was most noticed as an acute effect and went away fairly quickly

Purple knees

Progress report after 5 weeks:

The foot discoloration went from the dark bronze brown color and slowly faded away to a more normal color, about two shades or so different from the normal foot with a bit of a pinkish-purple-red hue to it but it is def much better. A little numb but I can still feel it.

Foot swelling greatly reduced but the veins that were engorged are still bigger and more prominent than they were.

Fingers and hands are much closer to normal color, get occasional pains in my fingers now (and feet) but its really nothing too bad and only lasts a split second at a time. Still a bit darker color in the knuckles, and a bit pinker at the tips of the fingers, but for the most part my hands actually look normal again. The knuckles the skin on them seems a wee bit more loose perhaps or this could be in my head.

All sores have healed including the most prominent one on my foot, but it left behind a perfectly round slightly indented pink scar. It is about as big as the round part on one of those tacks with the colored plastic press in part on it. 

Have not really gotten heart pains since they initially went away. Occasionally I will get one very breifly but htis hardly ever happens, and I am pretty sure it happeneed before the mephedrone anyways so I am not that worried about it. I do get light headed more now though, and find myself having to take a deep breath / yawn on more occasions than I used to.

knees are pretty solidly normal colors now except for when I take a shower, in which case they turn extremely bright red or purple.

One thing I noticed is that I started getting a lot of infections after my mephedrone experience and they stayed with me for like a month before they went away. Still keeping my eye on this, praying to god I did not ruin my immune system for the rest of my life, but atm I have no signs of infection.


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## Boojum

edit: Also I will update this thread with my current mephedrone related situation every month till I am back to normal or dead or stabalized for a long ass time I suppose.


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## Ceres

can you post your usage pattern i.e dose/frequency...


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## Lupus

> Fingers were purple / dark at the knuckles, hands white as paper, tips of fingers after last joint bright red.



Stop taking stims right now, you're going to have a heart attack. Purple is a solid indicator that not enough oxygen is getting to your limbs and probably organs.


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## d-Dexter-25

I think you may be allergic bro cause I IV'ed that stuff for weeks at a time when I was also doing alot of Meth and the 4-MMC felt much cleaner on my body then the meth did so not sure what is up with you but its good to know these things thanks!!!


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## Boojum

d-Dexter-25 said:


> I think you may be allergic bro cause I IV'ed that stuff for weeks at a time when I was also doing alot of Meth and the 4-MMC felt much cleaner on my body then the meth did so not sure what is up with you but its good to know these things thanks!!!



Allergic is def a possibility I thought of, but I think it is more likely some bio-chemistry related thing. Perhaps me and the multiple others who got similar effects lack a proper enzyme or something. I think this is more likely due to the frequency of these effects and their strange nature.

Anyways my dose pattern was 50 mg every half hour or so, 12 hours a day, for three days. That is all I ever used it for was over three days. The first negative effects (sore on foot, knees, etc) was at around hour 11 or 12 of the first day (whyyyy the fuck did I think I could keep using it!!!) which makes me also think it was not an allergy and leads me to think it is due to a metabolite with a build up in my body. I imagine that mephedrone metabolizes quickly into something else that sticks around for many hours or days. So 50 mg the first time didn't cause problems, but led to X amount of metabolite. Then each dose after that led to the metabolite being present in X * amount of doses which eventually lead to toxic symptoms. Perhaps some people can handle the metabolite, and others are lacking an enzyme to deal with it, or can not remove it from the body fast enough. I mean if 50 mg does nothing bad to me, and then 50 mg a half hour later does nothing bad to me for 9 half hour repeats, it makes little sense that at hour 11 I am suddenly going to have an allergic reaction, or sudden onset of symptoms directly related to mephedrone. I am not a scientist, this is all just guess work, but I am betting on this being the cause (a small but significant subset of the population lacking the proper biochemistry to quickly remove some toxic mephedrone metabolite. This would lead to people only getting negative effects if they use a large dose and are hit with a large amount of the metabolite at once before their body can process it, or if they use smaller doses with a large amount of frequency and their body can't adequately remove the metabolite in a timely fashion, leading to build up of the metabolite to toxic levels over time).

Another thing that leads me to think this is that in many (but not all) of the cases of serious negative symptoms, the symptoms arose AFTER the high was already done with. This leads me to think even more so that it is a metabolite causing the issues and not mephedrone directly.

I just want to also take a second to reassure people who may be experiencing similar side effects, that at least in my case they seem to be slowly subsiding over time and get a tiny bit less every day, If I make as much 'progress' over the next 5 weeks as I made over the past 5 weeks I think I will be close to normal (ie: close to how I would be if I never used mephedrone). And I am really hoping for this. I would really appreciate anyone else who got the pruple knees etc.. if you would post your progress here too as I am very interested in it, especially if you got the onset of symptoms two months ago or longer, so I can see what to hopefully expect for myself. Am hoping you continued to get better. My biggest worry right now is that I caused some permanent damage to myself, the extent of which I will not realize for many more months or years or something. I knew this was a risk I was taking when I tried a research drug, and I accept I was stupid as fuck with it. but I am hoping people can research this drug, or people with negative effects such as the purple knees, can post their stories and share their progress, to help put everyones mind at ease (or, in the worst case scenario, find out that we actually did cause ourselves some serious problems, but at least find out what the problems are so we don't need to live in uncertainty).

I also whole heartedly suggest people stay as far away from this drug as possible. You make your own choices in life and have the right to use what ever you want. But don't say no one ever warned you if you come down with these symptoms. The high of mephedrone is fun, but it isn't even worth the *chance* that this will happen to you. If it does happen to you, you will have nothing but regrets about using it. I do not think mephedrone is a safe drug for anyone, and I really wish people would stop marketing it so intensely (in some cases even spreading false information on it, which I see a lot doing) with so little actual REAL information on it.


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## swilow

I wouldn't be touching this stuff with a tern foot pole....


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## Crankinit

I wouldn't go that far, but I'd definately treat it with a similar level of caution as something like MDMA and keep it as a once a month, no more than half a gram kind of thing.


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## swilow

^It seems to be a *lot* physically more dangerous then MDMA.

Anyway, F&B's refusal to take it has largely prompted my own desicison..


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## dread

swilow said:


> I wouldn't be touching this stuff with a tern foot pole....



I concur


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## melange

sounds like some peripheral vasoconstriction goin on



the problem may not lie with the drug, but with the ridiculous doses most of these people are taking


people talking about grams and grams in a few days


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## dread

Didn't some of the people who reported these side effects take completely normal dosages...


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## melange

hmmm, could be - I've taken it at a normal dose and all I got were typical stimulant side effects - I don't know, it just seems every trip report I read on here about the stuff people are taking insane doses and get hooked on it


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## Buddy122

Seems that drone affects people very differently.  I've taken anywhere from 200 to 750mg in a night over a few hours and have only managed the basic stimulant effects.  But i have read of people, on a normal dose, turning blue and having chest problems.  Although it does seem that these drastic negative side effects tend to happen more in those that greatly abuse this drug, be it by using too much at once, or too frequent.  I think this is a good thread though, may enlighten people.


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## lineartransform

Boojum - 

Was your mephedrone the "crystally" or the "powdery" stuff?


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## Quanta

To the OP and all others experiencing toxic effects from mephedrone - my heart goes out to you and hope that you recover fully and good on you for documenting it.  People choosing not to touch it - smart choice.

I like mephedrone but I certainly treat it with care.  This is more of a general statement but all of these RC's prepared in anonymous laboratories in unregulated countries carry the risk of unwanted and dangerous impurities.  This is less of an issue for the 2C-I's etc. because the doses are so much lower.  The reports of mephedrone being "yellowish" and having an "odor" are very scary to me and indicate careless manufacturing!  I know we are not supposed to talk about drug synthesis but I've prepared myself >99.9% pure mephedrone and didn't notice any adverse-effects aside from the normal body load assoicated with most amphetamine/ beta-ketone type compounds.  People treat MDMA with caution and they should do the same with mephedrone and some of these 3-4 day binges of more than 5 grams that people are going on are ridiculous and dangerous. 

The mephedrone problem and others to come in the future are directly a result of the crackdown on MDMA - it causes people to look for alternatives which can end up being much more dangerous.  It would be great it we could have some true toxicology studies on mephedrone instead of anecdotal reports.  My 2 cents. 

PS:  One potential major impurity in mephedrone is 3-methylmethcathinone, even up to 10%


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## hugo24

swilow said:


> ^It seems to be a *lot* physically more dangerous then MDMA.
> 
> Anyway, F&B's refusal to take it has largely prompted my own desicison..



Not that it means anything,I took (only 2-3 times though) and felt safe with bk-PMMA but I never persued Mephedrone.Just intuition and I'm usually not too shy to take some risks.It appears that it takes at least one or two methoxi groups to "sterilize" a 4-Methylamphetamine (and I'm still not 100% ok on DOM to be honest).How is agranulocytosis be found out?


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## Coolio

I think I've only seen one report of long-lasting side effects from a single normal less than 300mg dose. Perhaps one of the deaths were from a single normal dose too?

However, every other report seems to be after having redosed and taken a combined dosage of 500mg or 1000mg or more.


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## fastandbulbous

> and I'm still not 100% ok on DOM to be honest




Considering the dose of DOM for effect is in the single figures of milligrams as opposed to hundreds of milligrams for 4-MMC, I somehow think that DOM will be devoid of any such side effects unless taken at massive (stupid) doses - the sort of dopse where the psychiastric effects will be the paramount concern


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## nuke

I really don't think this drug is safe.  Not sure why it was ever chosen to be produced.  I'm sure the person who discovered this and mass marketed it is out there on the internet since that's where it's mostly available, so tell us some day.


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## dread

> why it was ever chosen to be produced.



greed of man


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## spudhed

well ive had plenty of fun with it, been experementing for a few months now, never over 500mg in a sitting though and i always leave a decent amount of time between uses (usually only at weekends unless something special is goin on in the week) so far the worst side effect i had was on my 2nd dose when i had a very dodgy stomach the next day, feeling queasy all day, but no worse than a heavy night on the booze, havent seen any side effects in any of my mates either, its nearly all gone now though and once it is i shall move on to the next thing that takes my fancy, but i too think most of the bad side effects are down to people either being stupid with it, taking big doses or people who are probably having a bad reaction to it


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## fastandbulbous

> but i too think most of the bad side effects are down to people either being stupid with it, taking big doses



In this respect, aren't they the same thing?


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## amanitadine

quanta- out of curiousity where did you get the impurity of 3-methylmethylcathinone? I honestly don't know but looking at the molecule i would assume the chinese are going from the 4-methylpropiophenone so i have a hard time understanding how 10% of the 4-mmc would be 3-mmc? And, duh, i thought we have already been thru the toxicity of 4-substitution (PMA? PMMA?) and of methylcathinone........and you combine the two? I sure as hell aint fucking with this shit......


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## Quanta

amanitadine said:


> quanta- out of curiousity where did you get the impurity of 3-methylmethylcathinone? I honestly don't know but looking at the molecule i would assume the chinese are going from the 4-methylpropiophenone so i have a hard time understanding how 10% of the 4-mmc would be 3-mmc? And, duh, i thought we have already been thru the toxicity of 4-substitution (PMA? PMMA?) and of methylcathinone........and you combine the two? I sure as hell aint fucking with this shit......



I know there is not to be discusion on synthesis but hopefully this will be ok.  The most likely precursor for mephedrone is 4-methylpropiophenone which when produced by standard methods or purchased from chemical suppliers contains up to 10% 3-methylpropiophenone (technical grade reagent).  Separation of 3-methylmethcathinone from 4-methylmethcathinone is difficult.  On large scale, multiple recrystallizations are required which I doubt most RC manufacturers would do because of lost material and thus lost profit - hence the impurity.  I am suspicious of numerous RC purity claims.

Separation of 3- and 4-methylpropiophenone via distillation is pretty much impossible.


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## dread

How about chromatography?


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## fastandbulbous

Nah it'll be most probably fractional distillation under reduced pressure (same way of purifying safrole from plant sources) for separating 3-methylpropiophenone from the 4-methyl (or are the boiling points within a few degrees of each other ?). One way of ensuring purity is to start with 4-methylbenzaldehyde and treat with a grignard, then oxidize to the ketone, but that would be prohibitively expensive




> I am suspicious of numerous RC purity claims.



I think they just make the numbers up as they go along.... "mmm 98 percent, that sounds convincing - slap that on the label" (only in Mandarin! )


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## bpayne

Sounds like the type of thing that you do and forget about and then when your 35 keel over from a massive heart attack due to damage to your heart valves and circulatory system, just because it don't kill you right then don't mean its not setting you up for some irreversable damage.


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## Quanta

fastandbulbous said:


> Nah it'll be most probably fractional distillation under reduced pressure (same way of purifying safrole from plant sources) for separating 3-methylpropiophenone from the 4-methyl (or are the boiling points within a few degrees of each other ?). One way of ensuring purity is to start with 4-methylbenzaldehyde and treat with a grignard, then oxidize to the ketone, but that would be prohibitively expensive
> 
> 
> Yep, boiling points of 3- and 4-methyl are very close to one another, you may get rid of some but not all.  And you are correct about your other proposed route - better selectivity but much more expensive.
> 
> Dread - Chromatography works but only on a small scale not production scale.
> 
> http://www.sigmaaldrich.com/catalog...ALDRICH&N5=SEARCH_CONCAT_PNO|BRAND_KEY&F=SPEC
> 
> Check out what the remaining 10% is under the description...


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## fastandbulbous

> Chromatography works but only on a small scale not production scale.




Would column chromatography _a la_ LSD not be a viable method for separation (probably better with he final products as amines can be differentiated by differing pH elution)


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## Quanta

fastandbulbous said:


> Would column chromatography _a la_ LSD not be a viable method for separation (probably better with he final products as amines can be differentiated by differing pH elution)



Chromatography works great but it is prohibitively expensive for any scale greater than say 50 grams.  Chromatography grade silica gel is very expensive and its use is always avoided in production chemistry.  For production, distillation and recrystallization are really your only choices especially when you are dealing with a relatively cheap product.

I should point out that I have not tested commercial mephedrone for the 3-methyl impurity because I've never purchased any but I am only pointing out that it is a very likely impurity based on personal experience in its sythesis and where it comes from


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## vecktor

I would be suprised if it was 3 methyl rather than 2 methyl given the way it is made from toluene, where the reactive positions are ortho which is sterically hindered and para which is not, hence the para product predominating under kinetic conditions. 
me thinks sigma may have written a 3 instead of a 2 and this has become net lore, with nobody bothering to check what seems to be an odd feature.

see the pharmacopeia data and DMFs for tolperisone which is made from 4-methylpropiophenone.


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## fastandbulbous

^ I got to admit, para & ortho substitution go togehter like salt & pepper, meta tends to be a different thing altogether. I gather 4-methylpropiophenone is from a Friedel-Craft acylation of toluene (that'd be my first approach)


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## amanitadine

vecktor this was exactly my line of thinking, i assumed a 2 and a 4, and if they are making the shit this inexpensive it has to come from our fav cheapo hydrocarbon amenable to substitution. but i dunno, I'll stand corrected. And yeah, running column chromatography on even 10 grams of anything is a total time consuming bitch and fractional distillation useless if the b.ps are as close as quanta implies. So i dont doubt the large presence of an impurity, whether 2 or 3 or whatever......I mean, these guys are RETAILING the crap for a couple bucks a gram, I'd be suprised if their even is a recrystallization involved. I have a feeling we will see a fenfluramine like rash of heart valve problems down the line or something similiar. I tried it one evening, and the physical effects were pronounced and of concern but i swear I could even *feel* my neurons sizzling......that was enough for me!


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## Quanta

Methyl groups are so weakly 2,4-directing that with weak electrophiles like oxonium ions you will get a percentage of 3-substitution.  The late transition state in the reaction will favor the 3- and 4-position (In this case about 90% para, 10% meta).  Too much on this topic to elaborate here but look into product distribution in acetylation or nitration of toluene.  In Aldrich's product it is the 3-isomer.  As you say though, dangerous product no matter how you slice it.

*Nitration of toluene at 85C: 58% ortho, 4% meta, 37.2% para (Strong electrophile)*
*Acetylation of toluene at 25C: 3% ortho, 69% meta, 28% para (Weak electrophile)*  unexpected hey?  If you increase the temperature further, the amount of meta product will increase even more.  Thus, control of the conditions in acylation reactions with toluene is very important and on on large scale, this becomes more and more difficult unless you really know what you are doing and my guess is that they (insert weird lab name here) don't.

Only the gist of what is said in undergraduate organic chem texts is true, check out http://www.amazon.com/Mechanism-Theory-Organic-Chemistry-3rd/dp/0060440848 if you want to know more


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## amanitadine

quanta, *i like you*....and goddamn we could really dive into this shit but alas, es ist verboten.....shame....


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## Quanta

amanitadine said:


> quanta, *i like you*....and goddamn we could really dive into this shit but alas, es ist verboten.....shame....



Thanks, and I agree we are getting off topic.  Cheers


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## vecktor

Quanta said:


> Methyl groups are so weakly 2,4-directing that with weak electrophiles like oxonium ions you will get a percentage of 3-substitution.  The late transition state in the reaction will favor the 3- and 4-position (In this case about 90% para, 10% meta).  Too much on this topic to elaborate here but look into product distribution in acetylation or nitration of toluene.  In Aldrich's product it is the 3-isomer.  As you say though, dangerous product no matter how you slice it.
> 
> *Nitration of toluene at 85C: 58% ortho, 4% meta, 37.2% para (Strong electrophile)*
> *Acetylation of toluene at 25C: 3% ortho, 69% meta, 28% para (Weak electrophile)*  unexpected hey?  If you increase the temperature further, the amount of meta product will increase even more.  Thus, control of the conditions in acylation reactions with toluene is very important and on on large scale, this becomes more and more difficult unless you really know what you are doing and my guess is that they (insert weird lab name here) don't.
> 
> Only the gist of what is said in undergraduate organic chem texts is true, check out http://www.amazon.com/Mechanism-Theory-Organic-Chemistry-3rd/dp/0060440848 if you want to know more



I am sorry I just don't buy the numbers for the acetylation of toluene, from first hand experience of acetylation of the very similar ethylbenzene with 1 equiv AcCl and 2.5 equiv AlCl3  it is para approx 90  meta 2-3% and the rest ortho. overall conversion about 45%. perhaps if the reaction is pushed harder a different distribution occurs I don't know. (product identification by 1H nmr and IR between 1900 and 2400 cm-1)
if you have a primary ref giving the reaction conditions for producing the meta isomer as the predominant product I would appreciate it as it would be a useful thing to be able to do.

quick look found this http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ja00754a045 mostly para with some ortho and met being a minor minor product


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## Quanta

vecktor said:


> I am sorry I just don't buy the numbers for the acetylation of toluene, from first hand experience of acetylation of the very similar ethylbenzene with 1 equiv AcCl and 2.5 equiv AlCl3  it is para approx 90  meta 2-3% and the rest ortho. overall conversion about 45%. perhaps if the reaction is pushed harder a different distribution occurs I don't know. (product identification by 1H nmr and IR between 1900 and 2400 cm-1)
> if you have a primary ref giving the reaction conditions for producing the meta isomer as the predominant product I would appreciate it as it would be a useful thing to be able to do.
> 
> quick look found this http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ja00754a045 mostly para with some ortho and met being a minor minor product



Yah, I'm not doubting your results infact I have attained similar results.  I guess my major point is that acylations of alkylbenzenes can be unpredictable and can be condition dependant.  Further, separation of the 3- and 4-isomers can be difficult if need be.  I just don't trust anonymous labs to perform multi-step synthesis of compounds meant for human consumption.  Cheers.


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## vecktor

Quanta said:


> Yah, I'm not doubting your results infact I have attained similar results.  I guess my major point is that acylations of alkylbenzenes can be unpredictable and can be condition dependant.  Further, separation of the 3- and 4-isomers can be difficult if need be.  I just don't trust anonymous labs to perform multi-step synthesis of compounds meant for human consumption.  Cheers.



all interesting.
I suppose analysis of commercial mephedrone is required gc should separate the isomers reasonably well.
V


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## Quanta

vecktor said:


> all interesting.
> I suppose analysis of commercial mephedrone is required gc should separate the isomers reasonably well.
> V



Indeed, I would be interested to see that GC trace.  Hopefully it doesn't look like a pine forest


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## xaenima

melange said:


> the problem may not lie with the drug, but with the ridiculous doses most of these people are taking
> 
> 
> people talking about grams and grams in a few days


I have to say that's probably where the problem lies.

Everything in moderation.


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## Riemann Zeta

I have taken it a handfull of times, never exceeding 350mg (always oral) in an entire 24hr period.  I never had an serious negative reactions to it, but at higher doses, there was some minor adrenergic annoyance a few hours after dosing (sympathetic nervous system activation, much like a lot of ephedrine or one of those adrendoceptor agonists from an asthma inhaler...which is not surprising, as 4-methyl-ephedrine is a major metabolite of mephedrone).

Has anyone seen a serve vascular inflammatory recreation emerge after taking a single normal recreational dose, say 250mg orally?  If so, then I presume that a certain small percentage of people have an autoimmune hypersensitivity to it.  For them, it must trigger some form of vasculitis (massive inflammation of vascular tissue), which is then attacked (overzealously) by the immune system, which itself is subsequently weakened from the whole hyperallergenic clusterfuck.  The thing about idiosyncratic autoimmune reactions is that they are usually (1) genetically determined and (2) catalyzed by a metabolite of the drug, not the drug itself.

For example, a drug that I take every single day, lamotrigine, can, in certain rare hypersensitive individuals, cause an autoimmune reaction called toxic epidermal necrosis--in which ones' skin gets massively inflamed, rashy, vascularized...and then dies and falls right off.


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## ColtDan

think im gonna give this shit a break, did my usual amount last night and barley felt anything, which is strange as i usually end up feeling pretty good at least, only eye wobbles etc on higher doses


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## Buddy122

^curious to know what's happening when you get the eye wiggles?  I've experienced them as well while on drone, what physically is going on here?


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## vortex30

All I can think really is that whilst stimulated the eye muscles flex/tighten like the jaw and eventually become tired, then you relax them and they just kinda 'wiggle' haha. I really am not certain, but the eye's version of gurning makes sense to me. Its really just a matter of relaxing your eyes though. I can sorta do it when sober. They don't wiggle a lot just I can feel a little want to.


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## Riklet

Used mephedrone once, around 400mg in January; two bombs and a line.  Had a blast, drank a lot with it and smoked cannabis too.

Started noticing heart/chest weirdness the next few days, combined with dizziness, fast and then slow pulse and things.  The chest "tension" and the feeling that my heart was closer to the surface to my chest continued for several weeks, in some ways it's never completely disapeared, especially if I hammer stimulants I can feel it a little bit.  At the time it was pretty scary, I was getting anxiety too and finding it hard to go to sleep.  I noticed it got worse at night, and it inspired me to try and go to bed earlier, as well as to drink less and to stop smoking cigarettes (mostly).

I had an ECG (all was pretty normal) and a couple of check ups and the very first one (maybe a week after meph use) my doctor thought he could hear a slight murmur with my heart.  It seemed to have faded another week after that though.  Ever since the meph experience I have had these red blotchy spots on my chest.... centred around my nipples and also two quite prominantly in the middle of my rib cage, at the top and towards the bottom.  They really haven't faded at all since January,and one to the top right is darker red.  I've never posted pics of this, but I might.  

I don't feel like i've done serious serious damage to myself, but 8 months later I still feels like i'm feeling the repercussions of meph use.  Everyone atm is bang on it at festivals and in clubs as MDMA is in short supply.  I am maybe one of the unlucky few, but it's enough to put me off the stuff.  Never had anything like this from a drug before, I am only 20 and young and heart worries are not something i'm keen on! Fuck that!  I do still take drugs and stimulants n feel pretty fucking healthy generally, but I do slightly worry quite WHAT mephedrone did to me, and if anything's changed, n why those blotchy spots are still there.  Will I still have them at 60? Have I damaged my cardiac system irreparably? Who fucking knows, I am still living life, and I don't actually regret trying mephedrone, despite the issues.  It's just one more thing that faces me in life now....


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## Boojum

I also have been getting anxiety badly since my run in with meph, and strangely enough also notice it is far more prominent at night than it is in the day time. I am still needing to get an ECG, also creatine and other blood tests. I hope someday we find out what we did to ourselves. 

I have discoloration on the side of my foot still where I was sitting on it when I used mephedrone. Were you by chance laying down on your stomach when you did mephedrone, with perhaps a matress or something pressing into you? I am wondering if it is some sort of posturally dependent discoloration. I find it strange it is only discolored where there was pressure, although at the same time it is only my foot not on my butt which would be I guess cuz I was sitting down.

Good luck man, thanks for the update.


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## Dai

I also took about 400mg of meph in 2 bombs spaced over a night out. Had a wicked time, euphoria, confidence etc. Woke up the next day with chest pains, a numb left arm and proper anxiety. so i'm never touching this stuff again.
However it's almost 2 weeks later and i'm pleased to say that i pretty much feel like my old self again, sometimes get slight tingling in my little finger on my left hand, but apart from that i'm Ok now, no more anxiety or pains. which i am RLLY thankful for. If you've never tried this stuff before be really careful, because it completely fucked me up, i think it's really toxic and my advice is to stay away from it.


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## nolys

with mephedrone i dont understand how people are getting nasty side effects and others arent. personally i have sniffed 1.5g in the space of a night, went to bed, had a great sleep and woke up the next day in a good mood with no side effects whatsoever.
can somebody explain why mephedrone seems to give different people different negative effects?
and the blueness of your fingers/limbs is more than likely vasoconstriction in the capilaries resulting in less oxygen getting around your body causing the blueness


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## ColtDan

nolys said:


> with mephedrone i dont understand how people are getting nasty side effects and others arent. personally i have sniffed 1.5g in the space of a night, went to bed, had a great sleep and woke up the next day in a good mood with no side effects whatsoever.




i reckon it could be something to do with the different stuff the vendors are selling. some of it smells weird, some of it has no smell, some of it has bigger crystal lumps, some of it is slightly moist, other stuff is dry as fuck

i guess it also depends on if people are mixing it with other stuff, how much they are doing at once, how often they are re-dosing, how often they take it, the method of consumption, 

i used to wake up feeling fine. now (on the same dose, ) i usually wake up feeling dizzy, then the next few days i get a nasty come down which leaves me wanting to curl up and die. no idea why


----------



## Toela65

melange said:


> sounds like some peripheral vasoconstriction goin on
> 
> 
> 
> the problem may not lie with the drug, but with the ridiculous doses most of these people are taking
> 
> 
> people talking about grams and grams in a few days



I had my most serious side effects run in with Meph (puple Knne's, legs, arms, elbow, numb limbs , couldn't breathe properly, very lightheaded, severe headache....could go on) with a dived total dose 450mg. That is not really a big dose. I would say that was pretty average.

EDIT - I should also point out here that this night before taking the Meph I took 200mg Methylone for the very first time ever, Maybe it was the Methyl that fucked me over? IN looked unpure as shit in the baggy and was a clumpy off white colour similar in consistency to flour.


----------



## Toela65

ColtDan said:


> i reckon it could be something to do with the different stuff the vendors are selling. some of it smells weird, some of it has no smell, some of it has bigger crystal lumps, some of it is slightly moist, other stuff is dry as fuck
> 
> i guess it also depends on if people are mixing it with other stuff, how much they are doing at once, how often they are re-dosing, how often they take it, the method of consumption,
> 
> i used to wake up feeling fine. now (on the same dose, ) i usually wake up feeling dizzy, then the next few days i get a nasty come down which leaves me wanting to curl up and die. no idea why



I think you are on to something here. Different batches from different vendors have  had different effects on me. We can't rule out contaminates (deliberate or not) or vendors cutting it to make more money.


----------



## Toela65

ColtDan said:


> think im gonna give this shit a break, did my usual amount last night and barley felt anything, which is strange as i usually end up feeling pretty good at least, only eye wobbles etc on higher doses



I've noticed this too. I was doing up to 500mgs every friday (missed the odd couple) for about 3 months and the  it suddenly just wasn't giving me the same results anymore? Strange.


----------



## dread

Don't kid yourselves, this stuff is toxic. It's just that people are different. Some get the side effects from the first time they try it, some may use it a long time with no problems, and then suddenly- bang, you have purple knees. And from the reports I've read, manufacturers and batches don't seem to have anything to do with it. Some people have friends doing from the same batch with no side effects, then their frends give them the meph and they get blue knees. 

Until some serious research is done on this substance I would advise everyone to stay far away from mephedrone. 

And very probably after that research as well.


----------



## nuke

...I wouldn't really be all that surprised if this stuff is a strong neurotoxin, too.


----------



## nolys

at this stage its too hard to tell what effects it has on the human body and also why it has those effects....we are the guinea pigs and anything that will be researched on mephedrone will come from our experiances and the effects it has on us. it will be at least 10 years before there is any hard evidence on the short + long term side effects of taking this drug. for all we know we could be shortening our lives every time we take it... we could be developing mental illnesses, we could be being poisoned and not even know. this is the danger with mephedrone and all other designer drugs. take it at your own risk


----------



## ColtDan

ive had a few weeks break, definitely feeling better for it. energy levels are much higher, don't feel so shit all the time. my emotions felt fucked up for ages. this stuff is hard on the body for sure. started getting paranoid i was going to get purple knees etc, fuck that

a word to the wise, if your going to take it, don't take the stuff that smells. its bad, it gave me a strange heavy heart beat which lasted for days. ive found the stuff that doesn't smell strange doesn't make my heart race as bad.

whatever the stuff is in the smelly batches, is probably some very nasty stuff


----------



## nolys

i think thats because of the way its been processed and filtered, i heard it has some sort of impurity that causes the smell and alters the high, not sure if this is true though


----------



## stardust.hero

Some people just must be much more sensitive to the chemical than others..


----------



## hugo24

nolys said:


> .. it will be at least 10 years before there is any hard evidence on the short + long term side effects of taking this drug. for all we know we could be shortening our lives every time we take it...



I prefer to shorten my life with other drugs.


----------



## nolys

lol  wat im saying is that we are the guinea pigs, it could be killing us and we wont know for years. to be honest i think this is worth the risk, i enjoy mephedrone alot


----------



## ColtDan

i doubt we would even know if its from mephedrone, if we get heart problems etc whos to say it was down to meph?


----------



## ebola?

> ...I wouldn't really be all that surprised if this stuff is a strong neurotoxin, too.



Why's that?  Analogy with 4-methyl-amphetamine?  Have we established that the latter is significantly worse than MDMA?  I mean, I wouldn't be surprised either. . . 

ebola


----------



## lenses

I was pretty gung-ho about acquiring some MEPH before all these negative reports starting coming out. In the last month the popularity has seemed to surged and more people have been dosing. 

The main problem with it for me is that it seems to be a vasoconstrictor , and a fairly potent one at that.  I hate vasoconstrictors personally , they seem to leave me unable to breathe well. Also, the mechanism of action , pharmacokinectics, and metabolites produced seem to be unknown... 

Until I know the pharmacology more , and we get some proof it's not toxic, i'm gonna stay away...

Sucks!

-lenses


----------



## Meow101

Anyone had any experiences with Mephedrone playing with your mind? I had about half a gram this weekend over the space of two nights but I had a lot of alcohol, some powdered E that was very weak and I think I may have done some weed and Ket but I was very drunk so I'm not sure. Anyway I did this on Saturday it's not Tuesday and I've barely slept, I feel so emotional, sad and paranoid and I feel like I've created problems that weren't there before. What I dislike about this drug is how open it makes you. I pretty much told a bunch of people I barely knew all my darkest secrets. I've had very few physical side effects other than the night after I felt so shaky and had no appetite for two days after. But I feel like I am going insane, at night before I go to sleep I keep imagining lots of different people saying my name over and over again, it's not that I'm hearing voices, just that i'm creating them in my head which is really really weird. I'm also losing perspective of things. Anyone reacted this way?


----------



## ColtDan

lol that is quite a mix of substances. why are you blaming the meph?

this drug doesn't make me that open, even when combined with booze i just chat about random shit, i always feel in control

however meph has played some mind games, i get quite emotional for a few days afterwards, some levels of guilty, paranoid, obsessive thoughts and generally feeling unmotivated and feeling like shit

will be giving this shit a break after my fingers and side of my foot turned quite red the other day. ive even cut down to only doing it once every 2 weeks but my come downs are still being harsh. tried different batches as well

wont forget how good it made me feel though, watching people dance in lights at a rave with some awesome beats blasting was beautiful, it felt heavenly just to stand there and watch them. teeth grinding euphoria


----------



## Meow101

ColtDan said:


> lol that is quite a mix of substances. why are you blaming the meph?
> 
> this drug doesn't make me that open, even when combined with booze i just chat about random shit, i always feel in control
> 
> however meph has played some mind games, i get quite emotional for a few days afterwards, some levels of guilty, paranoid, obsessive thoughts and generally feeling unmotivated and feeling like shit
> 
> will be giving this shit a break after my fingers and side of my foot turned quite red the other day. ive even cut down to only doing it once every 2 weeks but my come downs are still being harsh. tried different batches as well
> 
> wont forget how good it made me feel though, watching people dance in lights at a rave with some awesome beats blasting was beautiful, it felt heavenly just to stand there and watch them. teeth grinding euphoria



Because of all the substances I did, I did meph the most and I'm blaming the combination of alcohol and meph most. I'm not sure if I did Ket but I suspect I did, I know that I had a few puffs of weed but not sure how much as my memory has blacked out a lot of the night. 
The powdered E was sooo weak it pretty much did nothing to me, I can remember everything from that, it had no effect on me so yeah I'm blaming meph.

I love this substance but I hate how it's made me tell people my secrets and it made me chat about all my insecurities and now I realise just how insecure I am. And yeah I chat a lot of shit on it too lol. I felt in control the first time I did it but then when I topped up my dose although I felt in control, the next morning I realised I wasn't in control at all.

Yeah I had one of the best experiences on it, the first time I saw it I saw one of my favourite dance bands live and it made the music sound so good. Also meph is such aphrodisiac I find, I've gotten with four people in one night, one of them being girls when I am straight but it makes you INCREDIBLY horny. I think at one point I suggested a foursome with my friends, two of us were girls the other two were boys, sheesh even when I'm drunk i'm not that crazy but the stuff I was on last weekend was so pure, I only did one line and it was the most fucked i'd ever gotten from meph and it lasted about 4 hours. 

I'm not sure I'm gonna do it again though because like you said:* 'however meph has played some mind games, i get quite emotional for a few days afterwards, some levels of guilty, paranoid, obsessive thoughts and generally feeling unmotivated and feeling like shit'*

I feel exactly like this right now and I need to pass my A Levels and get into university so I've gotta stop taking meph. I've only had it four times and I can feel how much of a hold it has on me, it's also gotten me to try drugs I would have never considered trying. Meph was the first drug I ever tried purely because all I knew was that it was 'legal' so therefore it must have been fine. Only after I had taken it and researched did I realise how toxic it was. I really shouldn't have been so naive.


----------



## theWorldWithin

Meow101 said:


> I really shouldn't have been so naive.



Case in point my friend. You did way too much and now you are paying the price. This can happen with any drug or drugs. It is just way easier to go overboard with dangerous stimulants like this one. 


Although I must say it is tragic that a drug that makes girls beg for foursomes will soon be made illegal because of gross irresponsibility on the part of users.


----------



## QuasiStoned

> Although I must say it is tragic that a drug that makes girls beg for foursomes will soon be made illegal because of gross irresponsibility on the part of users.


Hah!  Glad I read that.


----------



## qnibb

theWorldWithin said:


> Case in point my friend. You did way too much and now you are paying the price. This can happen with any drug or drugs. It is just way easier to go overboard with dangerous stimulants like this one.
> 
> 
> Although I must say it is tragic that a drug that makes girls beg for foursomes will soon be made illegal because of gross irresponsibility on the part of users.



Didn't he say he did a half gram spread over a few days? Another guy said he had bad side effects after doing 400mg in one day. That doesn't really sound like much to me. Kind of worries me since I was planing on trying it...


----------



## Meow101

qnibb said:


> Didn't he say he did a half gram spread over a few days? Another guy said he had bad side effects after doing 400mg in one day. That doesn't really sound like much to me. Kind of worries me since I was planing on trying it...



Yeah I did half a gram spread over a two nights, also the night I asked my friends for a foursome was the night I only did one line, the previous night I did more but the stuff I did that night was pure white and I did quite a big line whereas the previous night the meth had bits of grey in it. Haha I didn't beg for a foursome I just suddenly mentioned it and then all the guys were like 'sure ' and my friend (female) was like 'YEAH I WANT A THREESOME' and then we lost our trails of thought and decided to watch a horror movie but we couldn't concentrate.


----------



## ColtDan

this drug should be ok in serious moderation in my opinion. i haven't quite yet payed the price for doing it once a week (or not that im aware of) but ive only just recovered from my last meph encounter and i did that on saturday night. seriously physically exhausting (i always mix with booze though)

great at the time but never worth abusing it. i really dont know how people are taking this shit every day.

saying that im ment to be going to a 12 hour rave soon, if i drink just booze ill end up falling asleep. music doesn't sound that good on booze either. if only i could find some decent MDMA, for fuck sake


----------



## Meow101

ColtDan said:


> this drug should be ok in serious moderation in my opinion. i haven't quite yet payed the price for doing it once a week (or not that im aware of) but ive only just recovered from my last meph encounter and i did that on saturday night. seriously physically exhausting (i always mix with booze though)
> 
> great at the time but never worth abusing it. i really dont know how people are taking this shit every day.
> 
> saying that im ment to be going to a 12 hour rave soon, if i drink just booze ill end up falling asleep. music doesn't sound that good on booze either. if only i could find some decent MDMA, for fuck sake



How the hell do you do it every weekend?! Yeah I did some last weekend and I too have only just recovered and I ended up skipping two classes to recover too. I mean I would love to do the stuff every weekend if a) I could afford to b) it had no negative effects such as telling people all my secrets c) it didn't physically exhaust me to the extent I couldn't do any work. I mean do you have a job or are you in school/university? Cos I would have to be on a gap year doing nothing but having fun to get away with that, my body just wouldn't be able to take it, having said that I have the autoimmune disease hypothyroidism that means you metabolise everything really slowly which might be why I react quite crazily to these drugs.


----------



## ColtDan

i do a very physically demanding job, been doing it for 6+ years, get out of bed 4:45am every day and work 8/10 hour days lifting steel around, on my feet all day. believe me when im coming down going to work is a massive challenge, the job is hard on its own. and i also have to drive 40 minutes each way to get there

i dont do a massive amount when i do it, 400/500mg in the space of 8 hours, also get drunk as well. so it is taking a considerable toll on my body. never used to get come-downs like i do now though.

how old are you? are you healthy? was the meph you did the smelly stuff? im pretty fit and healthy which is good, if i was unhealthy i think this stuff would keep me in bed all day on a come down


----------



## Meow101

ColtDan said:


> i do a very physically demanding job, been doing it for 6+ years, get out of bed 4:45am every day and work 8/10 hour days lifting steel around, on my feet all day. believe me when im coming down going to work is a massive challenge, the job is hard on its own. and i also have to drive 40 minutes each way to get there
> 
> i dont do a massive amount when i do it, 400/500mg in the space of 8 hours, also get drunk as well. so it is taking a considerable toll on my body. never used to get come-downs like i do now though.
> 
> how old are you? are you healthy? was the meph you did the smelly stuff? im pretty fit and healthy which is good, if i was unhealthy i think this stuff would keep me in bed all day on a come down



I'm 18 and female, I'm physically fit, I run about 5-6 times a week and walk everywhere, I guess I am mostly healthy except that I have an hypothyroidism but I'm on a 50mg drug of levothyroxin hormone and I take that daily, I'm also a smoker but i've only been smoking regularly for three or four months so not that long, my diet is usually healthy but I tend to skip a lot of meals and don't always eat enough or enough protein etc. Other than that I guess I'd be classified as healthy no? I get run down very easily though because of this autoimmune disease has buggered up the strength of my auto immune system and it takes very little for me to get ill. 
The first night I don't remember it ever being smelly, but last friday the stuff I did was quite clumpy and had bits of grey in it and then on the saturday night the stuff I did was pure bright white and had no smell and was fine powder. I have to admit that I mixed it on both occasions with a lot of alcohol, firstly because I found it improves the experience and makes the drug last longer but I also drank so that I didn't have to feel the comedown.

ALSO...WOW, I could never ever in a million years get out of bed and do such a physically demanding job after a comedown or a night of meth, I was pretty much having a nervous breakdown in a french class and this was at least over a day I'd had the meth. Your body can clearly take more than mine. I'd say I did about a third of a gram over that weekend which really isn't a lot of meph but obviously there are the other drugs to take into account...


----------



## ColtDan

yeah mixing it with booze is a good experience. felt so good.

could be something to do with your autoimmune disease i guess,

the first come down i ever encountered from a 2 day experience + drinking was severe....i dunno how i got through that day....never felt so bad in all my life. never tried doing it 2 days in a row again. saying that the come-downs i get now are almost just as bad, no motivation whatsoever, just literally wanna curl up and die. lol!


----------



## pofacedhoe

with these terrible comedowns and wallet draining addictive nature is this drug worth doing?


----------



## vortex30

pofacedhoe said:


> with these terrible comedowns and wallet draining addictive nature is this drug worth doing?



It provides pretty much the best euphoria I've ever felt its first few uses, and yes I've done pure MDMA, plenty of opiates and Cocaine/Speed before so its not like I don't have benchmarks to compare. Trippy edge to the euphoria too. Worth it though? Probably not, as euphoria is not too great after about 5 or 6 sessions and it is fucking addictive that you keep coming back once a week hoping you've got enough Serotonin/Dopamine stored up and alas, you never do...  Plus, there seems to be loads of acute and possibly long term nasty side effects. Worth it seems totally subjective though, even after abusing it like I have it all still seems 'worth it', I had a good summer, lots of fucked up nights and I'm still alive with only the slightest vasoconstriction coming up on the last time I did it ('cold' hands and feet, feet were a bit pale, hands a bit red) and some very sporadic heart pains that seem to be getting much better with exercise and lack of Mephedrone/stimulants. So it was worth it, for me, it may not be for you because you may lose a hand or something if this is such severe vasoconstriction occurring in some people.


----------



## pofacedhoe

vortex30 said:


> It provides pretty much the best euphoria I've ever felt its first few uses, and yes I've done pure MDMA, plenty of opiates and Cocaine/Speed before so its not like I don't have benchmarks to compare. Trippy edge to the euphoria too. Worth it though? Probably not, as euphoria is not too great after about 5 or 6 sessions and it is fucking addictive that you keep coming back once a week hoping you've got enough Serotonin/Dopamine stored up and alas, you never do...  Plus, there seems to be loads of acute and possibly long term nasty side effects. Worth it seems totally subjective though, even after abusing it like I have it all still seems 'worth it', I had a good summer, lots of fucked up nights and I'm still alive with only the slightest vasoconstriction coming up on the last time I did it ('cold' hands and feet, feet were a bit pale, hands a bit red) and some very sporadic heart pains that seem to be getting much better with exercise and lack of Mephedrone/stimulants. So it was worth it, for me, it may not be for you because you may lose a hand or something if this is such severe vasoconstriction occurring in some people.



quoted for truth! amen!

yep amazing at first but after the honeymoon it bcomes compulsive, boring and leads to excessive masturbation and porn use followed by massive guilt, a smaller wallet, strange chest pains and a slow gradual return to dignity over time.

i want my heart to be fine when i'm older and considering i've probably used over 80grams of this stuff (in the last year) i think the 5ht2b effects might be beggining to take hold (just a guess) at this level of frequency.

either way i want a better high and i'm looking towards amt as an occaisional replacement


----------



## fastandbulbous

> all I knew was that it was 'legal' so therefore it must have been fine.



A common mistake, after all alcohol is legal and so are cigarettes and look at the dfamage they cause


----------



## pofacedhoe

to assume that something is safe because it is legal is ridiculous. do you think the government care about your health? no- cos if you die rather than need an operation it saves them money. its cost benefit analysis-hence alcohol and tobacco which bring in huge quantities of tax that balances out the damage they cause.

when you put something into your body the onus is on you to judge its safety and that is called being responsible for your own health.

too many people nowadays think the nanny sate is there to think for them (as well as pay their rent). i dont trust government and i will look after myself. i did a lot of mephedrone in the last year and i knew it was unhealthy and risky and i did it anyway (and wanked myself silly). i have cut it out but cant be sure i wont relapse although my honeymoon is most definitely over. i never thought it was safe but couldn't help my greedy nose with this extremely addictive hard drug and thats simply that

in fact the stupidest example of this drug (and its crazy behaviour in its users) was with a guy i met in brighton who had little clue what it was, bought it on the street and called it megatron


----------



## ebola?

> all I knew was that it was 'legal' so therefore it must have been fine.



To echo others, I would henceforth assume that legal means "relatively uncharted territory" when it comes to 'research chemicals'.

ebola


----------



## phillop

> all I knew was that it was 'legal' so therefore it must have been fine.









Methylated spirit is legal too, wanna try somma that? 8)


----------



## matterofperception

^ HAHA nice one:D


----------



## wigglebum

Swim hasnt being using mephedrone very long, swim started a few months ago and liked it up until recently the past few times swim has taken it they have had purple knees.

The first time swim experienced discolouration to the knees they had not taken alot of meth, they had done under half a gram, snorting 50mg lines every 30-40mins along with taking 1mg of gbl every 1h-1h30, swim started to notice knees turning purple and knuckles turning dark redish/brown swim stopped taking meth and went to bed, the next day swim knees and knuckles were back to normal colour.

Swims most recent experience was a few days ago it started about 8pm with 2x50mg lines but effects seemed to last longer than normal 

swim redosed at 9pm with 2x50mg lines

swim redosed again around 10:30pm with 1x70mg line and a 1mg of gbl which gave me the eye wiggles again effects lasted longer :D 

at around midnight swim mixed 250mg into water and drank it aswell as 1x1mg gbl and was up for around 2-2h30 

swim then noticed discolouration of knees and and veins were more prominent on legs and hands, but stupidly swim carried on sniffing swim never usually feinds but once the 250mg mixed in water wore off swim carried on doing 2x50mg lines every hour with 1x1mg gbl but effects seemed to be wearing off quicker this carried on right up until 11pm the next night when swim took 1mg gbl and went to sleep.

The next day swim experienced occasional heart pains and knees were still darker than normal, not purple but dark red, skin was also very blotchy, hearts pains stopped by the end of the day and veins had gone back to normal, swim  me noticed slight pains around the knee area aswell.

This experience has scared swim from using mephedrone again even though swim loves the feeling and will find it hard to resist.


----------



## ebola?

We don't go SWIMming here.  Otherwise, this appears a useful report, particularly in terms of the illustration that continued redosing despite noted alarming symptoms provides.


----------



## Captain.Heroin

nolys said:


> at this stage its too hard to tell what effects it has on the human body and also why it has those effects....we are the guinea pigs and anything that will be researched on mephedrone will come from our experiances and the effects it has on us. it will be at least 10 years before there is any hard evidence on the short + long term side effects of taking this drug. for all we know we could be shortening our lives every time we take it... we could be developing mental illnesses, we could be being poisoned and not even know. this is the danger with mephedrone and all other designer drugs. take it at your own risk



Yeah, but then there's also drugs where we all know the risks and yet people continue to use it.  Alcohol and tobacco being excellent examples.  

People will still abuse 4-MMC in the future as long as online vendors sell it at prices where a gram of it is cheaper than a pack of cigarettes.  



hugo24 said:


> I prefer to shorten my life with other drugs.



LOL, well said.  



lenses said:


> I was pretty gung-ho about acquiring some MEPH before all these negative reports starting coming out.



Welcome to Substance D.  



pofacedhoe said:


> with these terrible comedowns and wallet draining addictive nature is this drug worth doing?



I would guess not.

However you could probably say the same thing about heroin, and for about a year I would have said "yes it is worth doing - give me the dope, here's the money!".  Now I'm 15 months clean.

There's a reason people go through drug experiences in their lives, whether they are positive or negative or mixed.  So I won't judge people who choose to use 4-MMC but I don't think it's a smart decision, at least until we know more definitively about the long term effects.  

Anything should be taken in moderation, but a lot of people don't follow this popular mantra, sadly.  



vortex30 said:


> It provides pretty much the best euphoria I've ever felt its first few uses, and yes I've done pure MDMA, plenty of opiates and Cocaine/Speed before so its not like I don't have benchmarks to compare.



I have also tried MDMA (at 200mg orally), done plenty of heroin and speed balls too, I recently tried meth as well (did crack once and hated it), but specifically the most euphoric experience I have had is IV MDA at 100mg.  

I don't think I would like mephedrone, I don't normally like stimulants.  I have only done MDMA a handful of times, and it pales in comparison to the single MDA experience I have had.  I prefer intense psychedelic experiences, and while mushrooms and LSD last a long time, they aren't as intense as IV'd MDA in my opinion (they can be similarly intense but you'd have to take a lot to get there, I prefer taking smaller doses and getting a lot out of it still).


----------



## fastandbulbous

> I don't think I would like mephedrone, I don't normally like stimulants.



I do, in fact I'd go as far as to say I love stims, but I'm still not putting any of this stuff in my body. There's a risk/assessment line I will not cross and mephedrone is on the other side IMO


----------



## been head

^ you consider mdpv alot safer than meph then ?


----------



## ebola?

Sort a qualitative difference.  Our knowledge of MDPV is backed by a few studies showing it to likely be physically benign-ish compared to other DARIs.  However, it has a high propensity to induce compulsive binges that end in train-wrecks, inordinate anxiety, and the like.

Mephedrone appears more cardiovascularly toxic than other really dangerous stimulants, and as of yet lacks clinical research into its effects, barring 1 study showing it to metabolize to something very dangerous in vivo.

If you dislike getting injuries or dying, you should be able to tell which one's safer. 

ebola


----------



## been head

methylone is supposed to be alot safer than meph apparantly but i dont seem to get any bad side effects from meph atall and with m1 i do. maybe its down to the individual.

ive never done over 700mg of meph in a nite tho so maybe thats why i havnt  had any negative side effects, plus im 13 stone so maybe i can just handle more ?


----------



## ebola?

There's idiosyncratic variation, but it's 'Russian Roulette'...and people tend to begin to experience more nasty reactions after several uses.


----------



## pofacedhoe

ebola? said:


> There's idiosyncratic variation, but it's 'Russian Roulette'...and people tend to begin to experience more nasty reactions after several uses.



yep, i tend to get far worse short term effects off methylone (intense psychosis and terrible rough stomach) but the weird blue vassoconstriction is mephedrone specific (breathless, blue knees etc.) i seem to get is less than a lot of peopelbut still its very odd and feels toxic (skin peeling off your lips towards end of binge)

just plain wrong ( and i've probably had over 200grams in the last two years so i have a fair personal experience to base this on)


----------



## MeDieViL

Yeah methylone is capable of making you feel completely psychotic, mephedrone feels alot more benign, but then again if meph induces some weird side effects it seems there to stay (blueness returning when taking another stim) while after a day, your fully recovered from the methylone.


----------



## ebola?

how much methylone do you guys take?
I've seen jittery and fiendy, but psychotic?

I also feel fine the next morning from either (with 250 mg the limit for a 'sitting').


----------



## MeDieViL

ebola? said:


> how much methylone do you guys take?
> I've seen jittery and fiendy, but psychotic?
> 
> I also feel fine the next morning from either (with 250 mg the limit for a 'sitting').



I took too much (1 gram) fiending phase and not feeling much effects from it anymore led me to taking that much. I know its allright if you stick to low doses but it gets sketchy pretty fast.


----------



## Coolio

I actually enjoy the methylone high the whole way through, I can redose for a total consumption of 1g to 1.5g over 12 hours and I feel euphoric until I fall asleep.


----------



## MeDieViL

Coolio said:


> I actually enjoy the methylone high the whole way through, I can redose for a total consumption of 1g to 1.5g over 12 hours and I feel euphoric until I fall asleep.



Do you keep on taking the same dose or take more/less after some redoses?


----------



## fastandbulbous

been head said:


> ^ you consider mdpv alot safer than meph then ?




Way safer - as a rule psychological fuck ups can be made right again, not so much for physiological fuck ups


----------



## Coolio

MeDieViL said:


> Do you keep on taking the same dose or take more/less after some redoses?



I think I usually take the same dose, 250mg, over and over. Sometimes I'll boost >300mg at once in the middle of a binge.


----------



## nolys

i would normally sniff 150mg or so, then another 200, then the rest of the bag.... so 150,200,650... roughly...

and refering to long term progress reports... im starting to get slightly paranoid, not the "everybodys out to get me" paranoid but i feel like im not safe sometimes which is not like me AT ALL. Prior to using mephedrone, ive never been properly paranoid for as long as i can remember... im not 100% sure that its the meow but i think its more than likely


----------



## pofacedhoe

ebola? said:


> how much methylone do you guys take?
> I've seen jittery and fiendy, but psychotic?
> 
> I also feel fine the next morning from either (with 250 mg the limit for a 'sitting').



probably the last time i had it half a gram over three nights in tiny (25mg or less) snorted doses every so often. yes it can send you psychotic (i have bipolar). feindy and paranoid beyond belief.

most stim's seem to send me a little crazy yet i love them, and downers dont seem to satisfy me at all


----------



## nolys

pofacedhoe said:


> probably the last time i had it half a gram over three nights in tiny (25mg or less) snorted doses every so often. yes it can send you psychotic (i have bipolar). feindy and paranoid beyond belief.
> 
> most stim's seem to send me a little crazy yet i love them, and downers dont seem to satisfy me at all




25mg does something to you? :S


----------



## pofacedhoe

nolys said:


> 25mg does something to you? :S



it was like a line of coke


----------



## enduin

I was quite unsure if to post this here on in "how toxic is meph" thread, decided for this hoping I chose right.

I'd basically like to share my experience, and comment on a few hypotesis that have been made over time in different threads, please bear with me.

I used meph 3 times, first time it was crystally stuff from a super reputable vendor, insufflated 100mg, best high with an incredible rush, yet not the strongest, side effects were some gurning, dry mouth, everything as expected from the kind of substance, and next day mouth nevralgia that lasted couple of days (likely I was clenching all night).
Second time it was fluffy stuff from another vendor and was after 2 months; this was the strongest high but not the best, with no rush but a building up high which culprit was a moment I suddenly got covered by sweat from head to toe and felt outrageously high. I'm sure if it wasn't for the unbeatable sense of wellbeing and euphoria I'd had freaked out. Side effects were a super gurning to the point I couldn't finish even one sentence without chewing my jaws in the middle, dry mouth like never before, breathlessness. Amounts were 100mg insufflated, 150mg bombed, 30mg insufflated. Oddly enough after the first line the bomb didn't have any effect. after I got home at early morning my BP was quite normal like 140/70 but HR was 136. I got some light gurning and dry mouth the following day as well, and fatigue and breathlessness for up to a week.
Third time was crystally stuff but from again a different vendor, and a month after the second experience. Amounts were 100mg, then other 100mg, then 30mg all insufflated and well spaced. The high was nice but the lightest, gently rising; the gurning was stronger than the first but much less than the second and so the dry mouth, so still quite in a normal range. after the second line I noticed some palpitations, like I did strongly feel my heart pounding, even if it wasn't racing. No big after effects in the following days, but this weird heart "awareness" started showing up many times, in particular while tripping on a blotter which resulted in a bad trip 
So when I got home from vacations and having this thing for a week long I went to a cardiologist to get checked. He's been very accurate, measured everything, made an echography of my heart, checked chambers, valves, etc. It was all damn right. I also have to add that everytime I used to get this palpitations I checked my values and both BP and HR were perfectly normal. 
Also I noticed there were some particular times where the issue was more likely to show up like after lunch and when going to bed or waking up in the morning, and that for two times it was triggered and lasted few days after using some nasal decongestant (one based on ephedrine and the other on tramazoline). I also noticed that caffeine didn't result in anything, but didn't feel like to make experiments with other stronger stimulants cause I think that understanding is a good thing but trying to recover is better.
I went under a one month cycle with body building arginine on november (last meph intake has been in august) with no real improvements, and I'm undergoing a month with another pharmaceutic arginine supplement now that resulted in a very noticeable improvement: even tho these events were very slowly getting rarer month by month, I now am palpitantion free since I started and somehow feel my heart is "healtier". I know this is not scientific stuff, but I can't explain it any better.
Now I've been reading of many hypotesis, the 4-methylephedrine vasocostrictive issues, and recently the dermatomyositis one. I think that while probably both vasocostrictive metabolites and immune issues plays a role, it's more about a receptors upregulation of some sort. I have to add that I have autoimmune disease and got blood tested two weeks after the last experience with nothing out of ordinary concerning the immune system.
This heart issue I had really felt like my heart was hyperexcitable, and was reacting to things (meals, changing of standing/laying positions, small doses of vasocostrictors in the for of nasal decongestants) that usually don't make the difference. If I had to guess I'd point on 5-ht receptors, but I have no chemistry/biology knowledge, so I'm just guessing based on what I read here and on the web. Btw my buddy used my same amounts the same times but didn't experience any heart issue or anything other than than the transitory ones, and since I notice there's a big variance of side effects between different people, I'm led to think that the receptors upregulation hypotesis can work since everyone's receptors respond differently to different substances. 
There's one last thought, a little OT but still: At beginning of 2009 people were all raving about how amazing meph is, only few morons who went on week binges reported purple knees, ect. Now There's plenty of people that get problems even with single doses, or a moderate use. I can't help but thinking that like it happens with everything the increased request for meph led to a decrease in quality in order to make more available, in spite of most thinking now the meph is better cause it's cristally, and some unknown impurities could be even more responsible than meph itself for most side effects and long lasting problems. But this is just IMHO.


----------



## Coolio

Which impurity do you think would cause side effects?


----------



## vortex30

I'm going to speculate here. Yes, obviously meph is vasconstrictive in itself and will cause some redness, blue, purple, whatever, low blood flow. BUT ADDITIONALLY, let's look at pseudoephedrine (everyone looks at ephedrine, would meph not be metabolized into pseudoephedrine as well?). 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudoephedrine#Adverse_effects



> ...as well as severe skin reactions known as recurrent pseudo-scarlatina, systemic contact dermatitis, and nonpigmenting fixed drug eruption.



Do you guys think that many reports of severe vasoconstriction may actually be something like this? Especially in the people reporting it after a single dose, I think it may be more their sensitivity to pseudoephedrine, than to mephedrone itself.

Not that this makes it safer at all, but just saying, it seems the metabolites, and not mephedrone itself, are really responsible for most of the side-effects we're seeing. Ephedrine and Pseudoephedrine possess no serotonergic activity, am I right? And Mephedrone has an extremely short duration/half-life before being metabolized, so I hypothesize, that if para-methyl ephedrine is not serotonergic at all, then mephedrone's 5ht-2b agonism, MAY not be as brutal as some people predict? So long as sessions aren't going days long, and/or many times a week, it really may not be enough to cause any significant agonism.

I'm in no way well-educated on this I know there's mistakes and leaps and I can't prove none of this. But you crazy amazing ADD users, does any of this that I'm saying hold any water at all?


----------



## vecktor

^ we know it metabolizes in man to  paramethylephedrine and that it is likely that the metabolites are a mixture of optical isomers (there is little data on whether the metabolism is selective), so expect to find paramethyl*pseudo*ephedrine is found as well as paramethyl_ephedrine._
the other metabolites are the various isomers of paramethylnorephedrine (PPA) where the methyl on the nitrogen is lost. the metabolism will not generate plain ephedrine or pseudoephedrine (without the methyl)

there is little evidence of 5-ht2b  agonism by either mephedrone or its metabolites at present.
The adrenergic agonism could account for most of the issues.

on the side issue of impurities:
Some commercial methedrone appears to contain ring brominated impurities, some material also contains novocaine or similar local anaesthetic -caine which is a major concern. 
There is unfortunately few people willing to analyze the stuff, people do not want to be associated with purchasing mephedrone from commercial vendors, especially as the substance will be scheduled in June or July and and it is likely that the police will most likely seize the vendor transaction records as an easy way to find people to target.


----------



## ebola?

Good.
Then maybe people will stick to doing safer things like snorting coke or smoking meth.


----------



## Fourth_Drive

Hi, new to Bluelight (have been lurking for a couple of weeks) and have a question.  Hope I've found the right thread for this.

I discovered mephedrone a month or so ago, have taken it either orally or rectally on 6 or 7 different occasions, typically at 125mg dose.  Have never redosed or binged.  Was thrilled when I first found it - not enormously experienced with drugs due to difficulty of supply due to location / lifestyle.  But having found Bluelight and read up on it, I've become aware of all the issues with Mephedrone.  

One in particular that I've experienced is vasoconstriction - no blue joints or anything (!) but have noticed cold hands / feet when taking it.

Another drug (if you can call it that) that I often use is Iso-Butyl Nitrite (Amyl, Poppers, Rush) which I use as a sex aid with my girlfriend and for wanking - fun for orgasms.  It's a vasodilator.  Any thoughts on whether this could be used to "treat" the effects of vasoconstriction in the short term in someone who has taken Mephedrone and is experiencing the severe vasoconstriction being talked about here?  Would there be bad interactions, or would the blood-pressure dropping effects of Amyl offset the high blood pressure of Mephedrone?


----------



## growit&smokeit

Just heard someone I know of has been to the doctor and has discovered his BP is really high and he has damaged his kidneys. By the sound of it he has been caning it, but still. Coke would be a hell of a lot safer. I wouldn't touch this shit with a barge pole.


----------



## Coolio

Do not mix poppers and mephedrone, please. You'll end up with the flu or something. Both suppress the immune system (no evidence of that with mephedrone but it should, based on similar drugs).


----------



## hamhurricane

vecktor said:


> Some commercial methedrone appears to contain ring brominated impurities, some material also contains novocaine or similar local anaesthetic -caine which is a major concern.



would i be correct in assuming that 4-Br-MCAT ("Brephedrone") is going to be horrendously neurotoxic? when i first heard about Brephedrone and Clephedrone that was when i really knew things were getting into dangerous territory, forget PMA analogs, 4-Br-MCAT has got to be one of the most dangerous RCs of all time.
also where are you getting this info on impurities, is it publicly available?



> There is unfortunately few people willing to analyze the stuff, people do not want to be associated with purchasing mephedrone from commercial vendors, especially as the substance will be scheduled in June or July and and it is likely that the police will most likely seize the vendor transaction records as an easy way to find people to target.



is there any precedent for targeting personal users in the US or UK, im aware of OWT, but those PEAs were already controlled under UK law - this is different.


----------



## boohigh

I think that these bromniaqted impurities are a-Br-4-methylpropiophenone



hamhurricane said:


> would i be correct in assuming that 4-Br-MCAT ("Brephedrone") is going to be horrendously neurotoxic? when i first heard about Brephedrone and Clephedrone that was when i really knew things were getting into dangerous territory, forget PMA analogs, 4-Br-MCAT has got to be one of the most dangerous RCs of all time.
> also where are you getting this info on impurities, is it publicly available?
> 
> 
> 
> is there any precedent for targeting personal users in the US or UK, im aware of OWT, but those PEAs were already controlled under UK law - this is different.


----------



## hamhurricane

vektor said they were ring brominated, is a-Br-4-Me-bk-PEA even active?


----------



## dread

hamhurricane said:


> vektor said they were ring brominated, is a-Br-4-Me-bk-PEA even active?



It would not be a PEA, what they're talking about is unreacted alpha-bromo-4-methylpropiophenone, ie. mephedrone with a bromine in place of the methylamine, not mephedrone with a bromine _and_ an amine.

I don't know the details of mephedrone synthesis, but IIRC the non-ring-methylated version (a-bromopropiophenone) can be used to make methcathinone. So if mephedrone is similarily made from the 4-methyl version, it would be reasonable to assume that unreacted paramethyl-alphabromo-propiophenone would be in the product as an impurity after a sloppy synth.

I don't think it would be psychoactive, but very probably toxic.


----------



## hamhurricane

ah thanks for the clarification i recall alpha brominated precursers being used to make certain psychedelic PEAs (i can look for the ref if that sounds off)


----------



## ebola?

> would i be correct in assuming that 4-Br-MCAT ("Brephedrone") is going to be horrendously neurotoxic? when i first heard about Brephedrone and Clephedrone that was when i really knew things were getting into dangerous territory, forget PMA analogs, 4-Br-MCAT has got to be one of the most dangerous RCs of all time.



Given that the cathinone series has tended to be less serotonergic than their corresponding phenethylamine counterparts, we might not necessarily expect the same specific neurotoxicities that we see with 4-Br-amp or 4-Cl-amp.  On the other hand, at equistimulating doses, methcathinone appears to exert neurotoxicity similar to methamphetamine, so who knows (vektor 2009).  I sure as hell wouldn't ingest 'brephedrone' or the like sans a wealth of studies demonstrating a lack of toxicity.

ebola


----------



## vecktor

hamhurricane said:


> would i be correct in assuming that 4-Br-MCAT ("Brephedrone") is going to be horrendously neurotoxic? when i first heard about Brephedrone and Clephedrone that was when i really knew things were getting into dangerous territory, forget PMA analogs, 4-Br-MCAT has got to be one of the most dangerous RCs of all time.
> also where are you getting this info on impurities, is it publicly available?
> 
> 
> 
> is there any precedent for targeting personal users in the US or UK, im aware of OWT, but those PEAs were already controlled under UK law - this is different.



the Scottish police used the records from that certain vendor to pay people visits. though there was little they could do because mephedrone is still not explicitly scheduled, once it is scheduled they can have much more options.

impurity information was a private communication, from initial work it doesn't seem to be the alphabromo propiophenone rather it seems to be brominated on the ring. the complete information will be published in due course.


----------



## enduin

Btw as an update those "palpitations" I talked about showed up a couple days after I posted (I know it's fucking odd), and repeated randomly in the last week. 
I still noticed that they are likely to go back to normal after eating my daily arginine supplementation (before bedtime). Weird.

Also I noticed that tramazoline is an adrenergic agonist, so it's likely that the "supposed upregulation" involved adrenergic receptors like vektor said and not 5-ht ones.


----------



## vortex30

Since the start of the New Year my Mephedrone use has been as follows:

3 day binge mid-January

1 night on the stuff late January

2 day huge binge early February (5 days before the doctor's appointment)

I've probably used 6-8g or so over these 3 'sessions'. 

I had a doctor's appointment last week and my blood pressure was 140/90, whereas I have always been up to a year ago when my last check up was and when I first started taking Mephedrone a healthy 120/80.  I even stupidly had 200mg a few nights later...

Done, done, done now. I didn't quit smoking cigarettes to have my long-term health compromised by this nasty shit.


----------



## MikeHawk

vortex30 said:


> Since the start of the New Year my Mephedrone use has been as follows:
> 
> 3 day binge mid-January
> 
> 1 night on the stuff late January
> 
> 2 day huge binge early February (5 days before the doctor's appointment)
> 
> I've probably used 6-8g or so over these 3 'sessions'.
> 
> I had a doctor's appointment last week and my blood pressure was 140/90, whereas I have always been up to a year ago when my last check up was and when I first started taking Mephedrone a healthy 120/80.  I even stupidly had 200mg a few nights later...
> 
> Done, done, done now. I didn't quit smoking cigarettes to have my long-term health compromised by this nasty shit.



Well this is certainly interesting and important information.  This could potentially be clear evidence that Mephedrone is toxic even in small quantities.  We need more BP readings from people who use this stuff.


----------



## nolys

i thought meph was supposed to be fine when it came to blood pressure?


----------



## MikeHawk

nolys said:


> i thought meph was supposed to be fine when it came to blood pressure?



From what I've read it appears the bluing is not correlated with anomalous BP.  This doesn't mean that long-term abuse cannot lead to increased BP.  The 5HT2b agonism could potentially cause cardiovascular issues such as those described in his post.

Still, there's not enough anecdotal information to draw any real conclusions yet.


----------



## vecktor

nolys said:


> i thought meph was supposed to be fine when it came to blood pressure?



if ephedrine is anything to go by then excessive and prolonged mephedrone use will have serious chronic effects including enlarged heart, increased blood pressure, kidney damage etc etc. 

I have pretty much given up posting about this,  nobody pays the slightest bit of attention and just continue to fuck themselves up.


----------



## vortex30

MikeHawk said:


> Well this is certainly interesting and important information.  This could potentially be clear evidence that Mephedrone is toxic even in small quantities.  We need more BP readings from people who use this stuff.



Well I better clear this up, that isn't my life-time Mephedrone use, that's just since the New Year when I 'cut back' but really still used Mephedrone more than it should be used. I have 10 months of once a week use, sometimes lasting 2-3 days before the New Year. I've certainly over-used this one for about a year now.

vecktor - When you say chronic, do you think the fact that my blood pressure was 140/90 5 days after a binge may last well into my future? Even if I take the steps I'm currently taking of:

Cutting back on drugs big time, especially stimulants, NO Mephedrone/sketchy RC stimulants

Exercise, focusing on cardio work outs

Getting full nights' sleep regularly

Healthy diet high in vegetables, fruits and protein/vitamins, not excessive in any way of eating fatty/processed foods (though I do from time to time of course)

I'm only 20, I'd be damned pissed off if I've done irreversible damage...  AFAIK, it is common/normal for athletes to have big hearts, so if I were to just take up an active lifestyle (quite natural for me, I've only been inactive for 2-3 years, always was active as a child), this should become less of a concern as my body will have use for this excess heart muscle? I sure hope I can turn this all around...To be honest, this concern is probably a blessing in disguise, I've learned a lot about the importance of good health and respecting my body through abusing Mephedrone.


----------



## MikeHawk

I know this doesn't really fit in with the rest of the thread.  But I've noticed that I have an almost permanent feeling of bronchodilation.  My resting heart rate is also a lot lower than I remember it to be.  I'm not sure if this is because I've discontinued Mephedrone or if it's done something unusual to my heart.


----------



## nolys

MikeHawk said:


> I know this doesn't really fit in with the rest of the thread.  But I've noticed that I have an almost permanent feeling of bronchodilation.  My resting heart rate is also a lot lower than I remember it to be.  I'm not sure if this is because I've discontinued Mephedrone or if it's done something unusual to my heart.



are you doing any running or gym training? or have you stopped smoking recently?? that could be th cause


----------



## MikeHawk

nolys said:


> are you doing any running or gym training? or have you stopped smoking recently?? that could be th cause



I've been doing pushups every other day however I didn't expect such radical results.  I've only been doing it for a week and a bit.  Being able to completely satisfy my thirst for oxygen in one fast breath is really pleasurable.  I think working out combined with no Mephedrone has made the results more obvious.


----------



## nolys

MikeHawk said:


> I've been doing pushups every other day however I didn't expect such radical results.  I've only been doing it for a week and a bit.  Being able to completely satisfy my thirst for oxygen in one fast breath is really pleasurable.  I think working out combined with no Mephedrone has made the results more obvious.



yeah thats probably your reason then  the working out has made your body realise it needs to work at a higher level to satisfy your oxygen needs + the mephedrone has mabey worn out of your system making you feel fresher and fitter? 

thats my opinion anyway :D


----------



## Dondante

vortex30 said:


> I'm only 20, I'd be damned pissed off if I've done irreversible damage...  AFAIK, it is common/normal for athletes to have big hearts, so if I were to just take up an active lifestyle (quite natural for me, I've only been inactive for 2-3 years, always was active as a child), this should become less of a concern as my body will have use for this excess heart muscle? I sure hope I can turn this all around...To be honest, this concern is probably a blessing in disguise, I've learned a lot about the importance of good health and respecting my body through abusing Mephedrone.



You'll be fine if you cut out mephedrone and keep use of less toxic stimulants to a minimum.  However, I'd recommend cutting out all stims at least until your BP returns to normal.  

The effect of NE-releasing stimulants on heart is that they often cause cardiac muscle hypertrophy that out paces the ability of new blood vessels to form.  If prolonged, this may cause small areas of ischemia, leading to contraction band necrosis, a common finding in chronic cocaine users...and likely chronic mephedrone users as well.  The mild cardiac hypertrophy that occurs in some athletes is completely benign because normal physiologic processes result in muscle enlargement, and there is no corresponding pathologic increase in blood pressure.


----------



## vecktor

^ thanks for posting that, saved me having to post


----------



## PerfectBlue

Hi guys,

Firstly, could I say thank you to Vecktor. Whilst you may not feel that people appreciate your advice, having followed the thread I value your thoughts on the topic.

I personally have my own worries about Mephedrone use. About a week ago I checked myself into A & E after experiencing a very high heart rate, chest pains, a tightness (which I now recognise as vasoconstriction) down my arms and a feeling of pins and needles in my face. Upon arrival I received an ECG which showed normal signals and also a blood test and chest x-ray. 
Since then the chest pains have subsided, though I still have the occasional pain at my fingertips or in my hands, and I'm incredibly paranoid about the potential damage I may have done to myself. I'm hoping deeply that this may be psychosomatic, as I have read a number of long term symptom and side effect threads, and the talk of it being a 5-HT2B agonist or causing irreversible valve damage scares the shit out of me.
Aside from shooting pains, I have felt occasionally light headed. If these persist then I'll try and get them checked out, but I have no idea how they would be able to check for heart damage besides the test I have already had. I'll be sure to update with BP readings if so.


----------



## toocoolforschool

*yes there is such thing as clean meph now how the hell do i clean this shit?*



Riklet said:


> Used mephedrone once, around 400mg in January; two bombs and a line.  Had a blast, drank a lot with it and smoked cannabis too.
> 
> Started noticing heart/chest weirdness the next few days, combined with dizziness, fast and then slow pulse and things.  The chest "tension" and the feeling that my heart was closer to the surface to my chest continued for several weeks, in some ways it's never completely disapeared, especially if I hammer stimulants I can feel it a little bit.  At the time it was pretty scary, I was getting anxiety too and finding it hard to go to sleep.  I noticed it got worse at night, and it inspired me to try and go to bed earlier, as well as to drink less and to stop smoking cigarettes (mostly).
> 
> 
> I don't feel like i've done serious serious damage to myself, but 8 months later I still feels like i'm feeling the repercussions of meph use.



I have used the substance three times all from the same supplier the first two times there were no ill effects and i was able to sleep in about an hour and a half the third time it was different. quite similar to the expierence mentioned above. the expierence lasted 40hrs+ and honnestly im still not completly "normal" yet

deffinantly changed my life style but i'm stuck with 3 grams of this dirty stuff. 
has any one had any sucess cleaning dirty meph? and what would one sugest for a house hold chemest to try and atempt this?


----------



## enduin

PerfectBlue said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Firstly, could I say thank you to Vecktor. Whilst you may not feel that people appreciate your advice, having followed the thread I value your thoughts on the topic.
> 
> I personally have my own worries about Mephedrone use. About a week ago I checked myself into A & E after experiencing a very high heart rate, chest pains, a tightness (which I now recognise as vasoconstriction) down my arms and a feeling of pins and needles in my face. Upon arrival I received an ECG which showed normal signals and also a blood test and chest x-ray.
> Since then the chest pains have subsided, though I still have the occasional pain at my fingertips or in my hands, and I'm incredibly paranoid about the potential damage I may have done to myself. I'm hoping deeply that this may be psychosomatic, as I have read a number of long term symptom and side effect threads, and the talk of it being a 5-HT2B agonist or causing irreversible valve damage scares the shit out of me.
> Aside from shooting pains, I have felt occasionally light headed. If these persist then I'll try and get them checked out, but I have no idea how they would be able to check for heart damage besides the test I have already had. I'll be sure to update with BP readings if so.



Relax man, being paranoid and anxious will only worse your problems. If you've been checked it means there's nothing serious going on with your heart, meaning you are not gonna die. Stop any stimulant, eat healthy, exercise and be patient, it'll go away or improve greatly over time. This is the mantra any new guy panicking because of meph side-fx is being told. You can take some arginine supplement if you feel you still have vasocostriction, it helped me somehow.


----------



## geebiequeen

well i have stupidly took ridiculous amount over past 3 weeks im talking about every day and last few days i stopped taking it i have 3 numb fingers i can harly bend and are a bit swollen on my left hand thats dont seem to be getting any better its only been 3 days , do you think it will clear on its own? also is ther anything i can take to make it go quicker its really scaring me...ive read that magnesium supplements and L-arginine can help have u heard of this?


----------



## enduin

Relax man, arginine can help with vasocostriction, and avoid any kind of stimulats from now on. It'll go away eventually, but hope this served as a lesson for fuck sake!


----------



## blobbymahn

One thing I noticed after some serious Mephedrone abuse was a pretty swollen throat. 

If I pressed down on my adams apple, I could feel it squelching about. This went after about 3-5 days of abstinence.

Anybody else get this? 

Seconding the high blood pressure too. For about a week or two after Mephedrone I'd have stage 1 hypertension, about 150/90. Usually it's around 120/60. Pulse rate wasn't effected after, but when intoxicated it lay at 130bpm, normally 60.

Been a pretty heavy user, 1-3g a weekend for the last year or two. Noticed I was getting cravings through the week, so given up now. Perfectly in time with the UK ban too.


----------



## melange

check for hyperthyroidism


----------



## blobbymahn

melange said:


> check for hyperthyroidism



I've had a Thyroid check a few months back, came back normal. I'm going to the docs in a few days about my eye, so I'll ask him again. 

I've developed a black spot in my left eye that's been there about a month now. Hopefully this isn't a retina problem caused by hypertension/drug abuse, I vaguely remember getting an angle grinder spark in there though so hopefully it's that :D

Oh, Hi by the way. Been lurking on this forum for years - just never had anything to add really. Just read everybody elses discussions


----------



## Si Dread

I've used Drone a few times... I find it to be a powerful stimulant with empathogenic qualities. It is similar in feeling to mdma & cocaine & speed. But it ISN'T mdma, cocaine or speed, it's a new chemical, unresearched & unregulated in it's production & it should be treated with the utmost repsect! I'm using only a few lines in an evening, for a couple, maybe three hours at most... My lines are tiny 10 or 15 mg's & the effects are subtle & pleasant, enhancing music & other sensory activity. I feel an increased heart rate & general energy. However, anxiety increases as redosing continues which is why I'm inclined to keep my sessions short & dosage low. I also noticed coldness in my extremities but no discolouration or anything. I cant stand that sketchy comedown shit so normally take small doses of valium post-mdma/coke/speed so it wasnt difficult to control excessive stimulation as the drone wore off.

Just thought I'd post my experiences up to now, a few weeks after my first Mephedrone hits... I havent got thru the first gram yet... my gf has had a little bit, less than me.


----------



## MikeHawk

Well, my knees always have a red tint to them now, and if I use Mephedrone or any other stimulant this comes out more fully.  I still enjoy what I have left of these drugs, but I'm glad they're leaving the scene, they weren't good for me.


----------



## MikeHawk

I guess I didn't stop early enough.  I quit yesterday and got rid of all my supply, however my heart is genuinely screwed up.  I've not had any tests yet but I will do and I'll post the results.  I feel hugely unwell physically, well, that's what I get!


----------



## scoxx

All significant side effects seem to be after 2+ day binges rather than singular, 'sensible' use for me. Usually going through around a gram per day of the session. 

The first time this happened on day 3 I had to go to work (I'd not slept for 2 days and felt physically exhausted but mentally fine..no 'crash'). For around 3 hours at work I was breathless just sat down not moving, my heart was racing but I couldnt feel palpitations, it just felt very fast when I checked my pulse. I wasnt breathless in the respect of feeling the need to go to A&E, I was just breathing much more rapidly and it felt more of a mild annoyance than a concern - although I'm sure it wasnt good! I've had this a couple of times since and have now knocked mephedrone on the head...

That's the main issue for me, I havent had any of the purple knees etc but I have noticed some tingling/numbness in my extremities the days/week after a session. 

I also get really bad stomach discomfort especially when taken orally. This feels like severe bloating/acid and I've literally been doubled up with it before. Also had some nausea and vomiting on a couple of the comedowns.

This isnt really a significant side effect but I've noticed I get really bad gurning and eye wiggles on mephedrone. I never really got much of either on mdma or other drugs but meph turns me into a complete mess.


----------



## MikeHawk

I'd love to say this is due to a binge, but I was getting mildly hypoxic last night, I feel pretty ashamed about this all, I will try and get an EKG done.  Last night I was getting mild heart pains, shooting pains down arms, numbness etc.  These are all symptoms of pretty serious heart issues and I will be going to the doctors soon.  I didn't call an ambulance because quite frankly, I really don't think I could put my family through that.  I'm just telling everyone here as advice.


----------



## greenberryhaze

Thought I'd add my 2 cents to this thread.

Earlier in the month I had what I would consider a binge on this substance. I consumed maybe 5g in 7 days, with two 24 hr. breaks near the beginning. By this point I had definitely noticed some persistent vasoconstrictive side-effects such as coldness of the extremities / decreased capillary response. Nothing alarming, though I noticed the effects seemed greatly potentiated by nicotine and other stimulants, particularly mephedrone itself. 

The next night, having consumed ~1g the previous day, I took a single oral dose of 175mg and relaxed into a bath to wait for the onset. At about T+20 min., I began to feel a little dizzy and noticed some changes in my vision. I do usually get some slight visuals at the beginning of a meph session, but this time everything seemed unusually blurry. The effects worsened over the next 2 min or so, and I was starting to get more dizzy and confused. I started to get a bit worried and tried to take my pulse, but it was too uncoordinated to count. I decided to get out of the bath and find my wife, who is a nurse, in case I lost consciousness or something. 

She laid me down and listened to my heart in about 2 dozen places before proclaiming "you have an S3 gallop." Peak HR was about 160, BP was not taken. I didn't get much more out of her as she was trying to change the subject to calm me down. By this point, I was feeling significantly better and coming down a bit. My pulse was starting to even out, and HR was around 110. I was pretty relieved, but too shaken to redose and just rode out the rest in bed and fell asleep. Felt reasonably normal the next day...

Anyways, I did some research and learned that the S3 gallop sound is not good at all. If chronic, it is a sign of impending heart failure and can be acutely caused by, among other things, fluid overload. I certainly didn't overload on fluids and my only guess is that the vasoconstriction was severe enough to significantly raise the fluid volume in my heart and larger blood vessels. 

Despite the scare, I still managed to talk myself into dosing again 48 hrs. later, and ended up consuming another g in < 12 hrs, finishing off my stash. Now I would like to think I've sworn off the substance for good, but I don't honestly know if I could consistently pass up the opportunity to do it again. Brain likey mephedrone. Heart not so much...


----------



## melange

I think if people are worried about "longterm" damage to their heart, they might should complete a cardiac stress test.


----------



## Nexus298

I used 150 mg one time and felt like had I taken 200 mg would have over dosed. I felt the strongest rush I've ever felt, It is my opinion that it is working as a releasing agent while inhibiting reuptake. I could feel The toxicity happening in my brain. I was scared to death for about 20 mins. I flushed the rest of what I was given. Mephedrone is not fit for human consumption.


----------



## EFC18

The amazing euphoria of the first 5 or 6 times I will never recapture, and that's the worst thing about it. I've never gone more than a week, for 5 months, without having at least half a gram. Over the past month it's usually been as frequent as every 2 or 3 days. 

Financially I simply can't afford to go on, especially now that it has become illegal in the UK and prices have tripled. I don't consider this drug particularly addictive...but I did find its lure hard to resist when I had it in my posession. It will be a sad day when I finish off what I've got, but it's definitely for the best. All my sessions have been insufflated and my nose and sinuses have been raw for a long time.


----------



## melange

efc18 said:


> the amazing euphoria of the first 5 or 6 times i will never recapture, and that's the worst thing about it.* i've never gone more than a week, for 5 months, without having at least half a gram. Over the past month it's usually been as frequent as every 2 or 3 days. *
> 
> financially i simply can't afford to go on, especially now that it has become illegal in the uk and prices have tripled. *i don't consider this drug particularly addictive*...but i did find its lure hard to resist when i had it in my posession. It will be a sad day when i finish off what i've got, but it's definitely for the best. All my sessions have been insufflated and my nose and sinuses have been raw for a long time.



orly?


----------



## ebola?

Hahahahah...


----------



## hamhurricane

against my best judgement (and for odd ethical reasons too involved for me to explain here) i decided to take a 100mg dose of mephedrone intranasally to evaluate its effects. before and after i ingested a smorgasbord of antioxidants including acetyl-l-carnitine, alpha lipoic acid, COQ10 and melatonin as well as 5mg tadalafil to combat the anticipated vasoconstriction. 

the material was crystaline and smelly. i found it to be very MDA like, some visual distortion, warm "softening" effects and quasi-psychedelic ideation. it was highly entactogentic and sex on it was transcendently good, the only drug that has been better is LSD. otherwise it felt toxic and uninteresting. the euphoria was really brutal i could not even stand up - the idea of taking this in a crowded club or bar seems insane - i would have doubtlessly vomited. the only thing it had in common with cocaine was an unreal hangover, slept for 12 hours and felt unmotivated and depressed for an entire day. i would bet my life this stuff is having a significant effect on serotonin receptors. i hope the various prophylactic measures i took prevent any long term damage.

after seeing how strong this stuff is i feel much worse for the people who are consuming multiple grams in a night


----------



## enduin

An euphoria so strong you can't stand seems too much for just 100mg, but everyone's different right?

Anyway just wanted to update saying that after basically almost 1 year from the last of 3 meph sessions (consisting in 250mg over the night) in which I abstained from everything except kratom, last week after consuming some raw cacao nibs along with the kratom I woke up the next day with arrythmia, maybe an extrasystole. Now I can't of course blame meph for this and everything that happens involving the ticker, but it still sounds weird that the caffeine in the cacao nibs caused this. Also have to add that after this for a couple days I got again the palpitations I experienced after meph. Now the whole thing is subsiding, but still present in the morning when I wake up.

And yes, that meph is fucking hit and miss, this is a matter of fact.


----------



## Savagehenry

I have been taking 4mmc for over a year now, quit when the ban came in, to avoid dangerous street cuts like ket and god knows what other possible contraindications, seem to be left with short term memory loss, tooth enamel erosion, weight loss and a serious dent in my bank balance, never experienced any purple joints or pronounced vasoconstriction though, maybe thats why it dragged out so long...


----------



## HorseyP

Savagehenry said:


> I have been taking 4mmc for over a year now, quit when the ban came in, to avoid dangerous street cuts like ket and god knows what other possible contraindications, seem to be left with short term memory loss, tooth enamel erosion, weight loss and a serious dent in my bank balance, never experienced any purple joints or pronounced vasoconstriction though, maybe thats why it dragged out so long...



This is pretty much my situation also. I hope that the damage i have done to myself isn't permanent.


----------



## fastandbulbous

> The amazing euphoria of the first 5 or 6 times I will never recapture, and that's the worst thing about it. I've never gone more than a week, for 5 months, without having at least half a gram. Over the past month it's usually been as frequent as every 2 or 3 days.




If that's not addictive behaviour I must have a different dictionary


----------



## MikeHawk

It's not physically addictive but it's by far the most addictive substance I've encountered in my life.  More addictive than MDMA, Cocaine, Opiates, Benzos.  I've tried the lot.  Nothing has given me more of a desire to recapture the high.


----------



## hamhurricane

i remember there was a rumor in the late 90's that if you had sex on ecstasy it would be the greatest pleasure humanly possible and you would never be able to attain that level again, so effectivly the rest of your life would be downhill. i had no interest in ecstasy or drugs in general but just that _idea_ scared the shit out of me, of course it is not true. but on mephedrone - i actually felt that way, it was laughable.

im having so many bizarre side effects (perhaps the most severe of which is hypochondria) but the roof of my mouth is covered in agonizing cuts which will not heal, i have horrible throbbing sensations in my legs and feel generally shitty. i have also been not sleeping (not this was after only one dose of 100mg)


----------



## 360-12

hamhurricane said:


> against my best judgement (and for odd ethical reasons too involved for me to explain here) i decided to take a 100mg dose of mephedrone intranasally to evaluate its effects. before and after i ingested a smorgasbord of antioxidants including acetyl-l-carnitine, alpha lipoic acid, COQ10 and melatonin as well as 5mg tadalafil to combat the anticipated vasoconstriction.
> 
> the material was crystaline and smelly. i found it to be very MDA like, some visual distortion, warm "softening" effects and quasi-psychedelic ideation. it was highly entactogentic and sex on it was transcendently good, the only drug that has been better is LSD. otherwise it felt toxic and uninteresting. the euphoria was really brutal i could not even stand up - the idea of taking this in a crowded club or bar seems insane - i would have doubtlessly vomited. the only thing it had in common with cocaine was an unreal hangover, slept for 12 hours and felt unmotivated and depressed for an entire day. i would bet my life this stuff is having a significant effect on serotonin receptors. i hope the various prophylactic measures i took prevent any long term damage.
> 
> after seeing how strong this stuff is i feel much worse for the people who are consuming multiple grams in a night



Are you sure it was mephedrone?! It's never come close to "transcendentally good" imho. Perhaps your "smorgasbord" of defences reacted in some unanticipated way to enhance the effect.


----------



## Raymonde

I've only started taking meph this year, but I've got myself quite into it.  Got to the point where I was spending three days awake on it once a week for several weeks, but I've stopped doing more than a one-nighter since a 4-day session broke me more than anything else ever.

I've not had many of the side-effects noted above, when I'm on it I feel completely fine physically and mentally.  However, if I go more than 24hrs without it, I get anxious, very emotionally sensitive (feeling like crying if I read sad news, or even something hopeful), and also palpitations.  These are best described as feeling my heart beat in hands, legs, neck and occasionally elsewhere, usually also felt in my head and causing temporary (for the duration of the throbbing) fatigue feelings.  These feelings all go if I have a small dose (for me about 80mg).

I'm taking up to a gram a day, and feel a lot of need to do it at work (I work in a call centre, so the ability to talk freely and good-naturedly is far preferable to anxiety and self-consciousness), usually 250-400mg over an 8-hour workday.

I should point out that I don't get gurning, eye twitching or any other physically obvious reactions except increased sweating, and the need to hold little bits of tissue under my nose if I can't be bothered to bomb it .

Of the three main withdrawal symptoms I get, the first two seem explainable by psychological factors/serotonin levels, but the palpitations make me worry that the addiction may also be physical.  I'm not aware of any physically addictive uppers though, so is this more likely a vasoconstriction side-effect, and if so why does redosing make it go away?

I'm aware that I really do need to stop taking this stuff with any sort of regularity, but I feel I'd need at least two days off it (and maybe quite a few benzos) to break the symptoms well enough to ride it out, but work being as it is, getting this time off to coincide with when there's no parties I want to go to is proving problematic.

Mind you, it's now become almost impossible to get hold of so probably I'll soon have to have an enforced withdrawal.  I'm not looking forward to that (and the anxiety I feel when my supply's almost gone) makes me think it'll be best in the long run.

In reply to the posters who've mentioned sore throats, this is clearly caused by the caustic nature of the drug, so it's best to only snort it occasionally.  Gel caps or Rizla bombs are both perfect for eating purposes, but this can just defer the problem elsewhere.  I have quite a sensitive stomach (due to having a bit of a tantrum and taking 30 aspirin tablets a decade or so back), and I get nasty acid stomach after 3 pints of cider/more than 12 hours drinking anything alcoholic, having an empty stomach for too long and also from bombing meph.

Of course, if I've been bombing meph for a while it's pretty likely my stomach's fairly empty and there's been sustained drinking, so I whether this stomach burn is a universal thing is not known.

Of course, if you want to go as long as possible on it without getting chemical burns anywhere, you could always go for #1 up the nose, #2 down the throat and #3 up the Gary (definitely use a gel cap here).  Repeat until you're a screaming mass of whole-body burns.  Ladies can get 33% more fun by using their jacky danny for #4.


----------



## Reds2daHeads

this thread is scaring me away from tring flephedrone...


----------



## MeDieViL

Reds2daHeads said:


> this thread is scaring me away from tring flephedrone...



Why? Flephedrone doesnt have the same issues as mephedrone, its metabolites arent a problem.


----------



## ebola?

I thought that 4-fluoro-ephedrine was also confirmed highly toxic (that is, with a therapeutic index worse than ephedrine's), but we haven't seen any nightmares with it due to people taking on more conservative dosing regimens with flephedrone in comparison to mephedrone.

ebola


----------



## InternetMuse

hamhurricane said:


> im having so many bizarre side effects (perhaps the most severe of which is hypochondria) but the roof of my mouth is covered in agonizing cuts which will not heal, i have horrible throbbing sensations in my legs and feel generally shitty. i have also been not sleeping (not this was after only one dose of 100mg)



Sorry mate, but I'd say that with a 100mg dose causing those kind of effects - you've got some other issues going on....the stuff only really begins to be active at that amount.

Having said that, I'm glad the 'era' is over as it certainly is very psychologically addictive (never really felt it physically, as after 24 hours awake I'm just over it tbh and stop).  It was fun whilst it lasted and I'm forced to stop now which I'm quite happy about!


----------



## enduin

I'd tend to be wary with ever beta-ketone as they all seems to be not very favorable in the costs/benefits ratio compared to their amphetamine analogues. This can perfectly be BS, it's just a gut feeling.


----------



## grue

> Sorry mate, but I'd say that with a 100mg dose causing those kind of effects - you've got some other issues going on....the stuff only really begins to be active at that amount.



I don't agree.  Psychostimulant sensitivity has a quite wide range of variation, and a dose of e.g. amphetamine that is mild for some can produce toxic effects in a few others.  I don't think he's a wild outlier either.


----------



## fuckmcat

Another bad experience with mephedrone here from me. Total usage 2.25g I reckon over 5-6 or 7 sessions, sometimes weeks apart. 

Last time I tried it I insuffated about 50-100mg roughly (3 months ago roughly) before I noticed I had slightly blue fingers and feet and slightly itchy skin, also redder skin overall. The next day the blueness was gone bur I had a quite noticable tanning / skin darkening effect. 

Since then I have been getting red/blushing skin on my hands, forearms, feet and lower legs. I have always been slightly blushy and had reddish palms, it definitely seems more pronounced now though and this has me fairly worried. No heart palpitations or any other symptoms apart from redness really. Still looking quite tanned, although I have dark hair and tan easily. 

As for more background info I seem to have somrt sort of inflammatory problem in my back that flares up occasionally, (possibly have Anklyosing Spondylitis although docs are leaning away from that now) and get regular acid reflux / heartburn. I lift weights at the gym 3 times a week (no steroids) and have just started running, overall slim/athletic, fit and healthy (good diet, multivitamin). 

I took some suppliments that are supposed to help cirulation but it didn't seem to help, these were: Ginko bilboa (dry pill form) L-arginine, a vitamin B complex and magnesium. 

Any help or advice would be appreciated, or this info could just be useful info to someone else perhaps.

I thought the effects were going away but it stills seems noticable occasionally. The problem is I never paid much attention to it before and I may have been like this often before trying meph, only now I am concious of it and notice it more. I am almost certain i'm redder overall and blood returns to pressed skin slightly slower than before however. 

Has anyone who has had the blushing/vasoconstrictive reaction actually had it go away at all? Thanks


----------



## invert

fuckmcat said:


> Another bad experience with mephedrone here from me. Total usage 2.25g I reckon over 5-6 or 7 sessions, sometimes weeks apart.
> 
> Last time I tried it I insuffated about 50-100mg roughly (3 months ago roughly) before I noticed I had slightly blue fingers and feet and slightly itchy skin, also redder skin overall. The next day the blueness was gone bur I had a quite noticable tanning / skin darkening effect.
> 
> Since then I have been getting red/blushing skin on my hands, forearms, feet and lower legs. I have always been slightly blushy and had reddish palms, it definitely seems more pronounced now though and this has me fairly worried. No heart palpitations or any other symptoms apart from redness really. Still looking quite tanned, although I have dark hair and tan easily.
> 
> As for more background info I seem to have somrt sort of inflammatory problem in my back that flares up occasionally, (possibly have Anklyosing Spondylitis although docs are leaning away from that now) and get regular acid reflux / heartburn. I lift weights at the gym 3 times a week (no steroids) and have just started running, overall slim/athletic, fit and healthy (good diet, multivitamin).
> 
> I took some suppliments that are supposed to help cirulation but it didn't seem to help, these were: Ginko bilboa (dry pill form) L-arginine, a vitamin B complex and magnesium.
> 
> Any help or advice would be appreciated, or this info could just be useful info to someone else perhaps.
> 
> I thought the effects were going away but it stills seems noticable occasionally. The problem is I never paid much attention to it before and I may have been like this often before trying meph, only now I am concious of it and notice it more. I am almost certain i'm redder overall and blood returns to pressed skin slightly slower than before however.
> 
> Has anyone who has had the blushing/vasoconstrictive reaction actually had it go away at all? Thanks


Hey there, this sounds similar to my experiences of long-term negative effects of using mephedrone and methylone. After a few months of intermittent and sometimes more chronic and excessive use, even a tiny amount of either (say around 15 mg) set off this reaction, with apparent vasoconstriction (which I've never really had otherwise before, except around the time before I gave up cannabinoids - temporarily - and nicotine - permanently) in the form of pain and cold in the extremeties, very dry skin and bluing  and vascular weirdness.

Yes it did go away mostly after  a period of time (of non-use of the relevant substances) similar to the period responsible for it (i.e. a matter of weeks to months to return to baseline sensitivity). 

I'd be curious to know what explanations there are for enhanced sensitivity to a stimulant. Are there cardiovascular functions that should counter the stress of stimulants but which are semi-permanently damaged or down-regulated by the use of these drugs?

ETA: @fuckmcat You say you still get these symptoms sometimes. Is there any chance this is related to the use of other stimulants (e.g. caffeine, nicotine)? Personally, I find that a sufficient dose of coffee can be sufficient to produce similar (if usually milder) symptoms.


----------



## MeDieViL

I think that mephedrone somehow upregulates the alpha 2 andronergic receptors leaving you permanently alot more sensitive to the vasoconstriction by other stims.


----------



## fuckmcat

@invert

I actually am getting bad acid reflux (unrelated to drugs or anything else) right now so am not consuming caffiene at all or any other stimulants I can think of. Part of me thinks I had the same redness before but never took any notice, another part does feel that it is deffinitely more noticable and has lingered since taking mephedrone. I am still more tanned than I would expect considering i've not been in the sun for months and months. I have taken no other drugs since (and won't either) and have been very clean / healthy.


----------



## Adapt

*My experience*

Hi guys,

Just wanted to do a quick post on mephedrone use as I wanted to warn people about the effects its had on me.

I have used it for about a year, about 12 times in total and I have some very alarming symptons associated with its use. After the second to last time I used it I found that I had problems with speech, and couldn’t remember words correctly. Following on from that, I tried it once more, and now have ‘tremors’ associated with the early onset of Parkinsons. These occurred right after the last time I took it (the next morning), and get better or worse, so sometimes I won’t have any, and sometime’s they’ll be all the time. I also feel like my cognitive functioning has been impaired and I make mistakes that I would never previously have made. 

This statement 

“There may be a large number of people out there with half the nerve cells they're supposed to have." In ten or 15 years, he predicts, as these addicts continue to lose substantia nigra cells as part of the normal aging process, California may become the scene of a Parkinson's epidemic.”
From this website : 

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101850408-141542,00.html#ixzz0qT4p5cOb

 …Really scares the shit out of me. I feel like I’ve ruined my whole life. It was my fault, I know, I am responsible for what I put in my body, and I’d just feel like I should do my bit to make other people aware so they can make an informed decision. I’m shaking just writing this post right now thinking about what might become of me. I don’t really know who to turn to, or if anything can be done for me. I’m pretty scared.


----------



## lineartransform

Adapt - 

First off, relax. There's no point in worrying about possible effects 20 years down the road - you might get hit by a bus tomorrow and then you won't have to worry about a damn thing. 

Using mephedrone less than 20 times puts you squarely in the weekend warrior category, and there are people who have used literally 10 to 100 times what you have. We don't see a corresponding increase in these symptoms.

The major issue with mephedrone is the anxiety ridden days after that many do not relate directly to use. This causes a ridiculous amount of worry, and freakouts over small things. I have experienced the speech issues and memory problems - so I stopped using it forever. And the problems have gone away completely.

Exercise, eat well, get good sleep, and remember that it's pointless to wonder what coulda shoulda woulda been - and just live your life with lessons learned from now on.


----------



## adder

What's with this "flephedrone is not like mephedrone"? These are the last methcathinone analogs I took. I don't care if there'll be some mephedrone isomer with again great effects "similar to cocaine and MDMA" (well, it's one or another... or what? I can say that none of people who stated mephedrone is similar to cocaine or MDMA ever took either). And by the way, I just can't believe this dosage you present. Your vendors (this isn't directed to anyone in particular but to all people who took/take 500mg-1000mg) make a damned idiots out of you. I remember taking it in a much lower dose and it was already dirty to me. I do have experiences with cocaine, methamphetamine, methcathinone (pure >99%, lab grade), or 4-methylaminorex (also lab grade). 500mg is a ridiculous dose as a starter for mephedrone. No wonder it happens to show its toxicity so fast in so many users. Anyway, I've never been addicted to aforementioned stimulants so I didn't develop tolerance.


----------



## Adapt

lineartransform said:


> Adapt -
> 
> First off, relax. There's no point in worrying about possible effects 20 years down the road - you might get hit by a bus tomorrow and then you won't have to worry about a damn thing.
> 
> Using mephedrone less than 20 times puts you squarely in the weekend warrior category, and there are people who have used literally 10 to 100 times what you have. We don't see a corresponding increase in these symptoms.
> 
> The major issue with mephedrone is the anxiety ridden days after that many do not relate directly to use. This causes a ridiculous amount of worry, and freakouts over small things. I have experienced the speech issues and memory problems - so I stopped using it forever. And the problems have gone away completely.
> 
> Exercise, eat well, get good sleep, and remember that it's pointless to wonder what coulda shoulda woulda been - and just live your life with lessons learned from now on.



Thanks mate, I spoke to a friend today, and he said a similar thing. To be fair, I live a very hectic lifestyle, and my sleep patterns leave a lot to be desired. I'm going to go to the docs anyway, and have myself checked out, but you know how it is when you're having a little panic. I'm a level headed person generally, but sometimes its just hard to keep these things down. I'm never going to touch the stuff again whatever happens! This amount of stress is not worth the fun! Either way, I'll keep posting back here after I go to the docs.


----------



## daftpunk1991

i have taken mephedrone ... and blow out of the shops i prefered blow and 

me and my mates took it for 3 months till it was banned .... 

we would stay up friday to sunday without sleep 

and would take it once of twice durin the week  also..

all i have gotton was 

weight loss 
hands would be cold when i was on it 
spots on body

thats it never anything els really ....

i also found blow to be way harder on your body than mephredrone


----------



## Adapt

amanitadine said:


> I tried it one evening, and the physical effects were pronounced and of concern but i swear I could even *feel* my neurons sizzling......that was enough for me!




- I felt this! I felt like I was actually doing damage to my brain, and had to reign it in!

Maybe thats why my brain feels so screwed up 6 months later!


----------



## enduin

From a one time use?


----------



## Adapt

enduin said:


> From a one time use?



I’d probably used it 10 - 15 times over about 14 months, haven’t done it for 6 months now, and won’t again.

Dose was about 3 caps (they are about 250mg a cap right?), maybe more on one or two occasions 

Always done on one night, then nothing for a few weeks. No other drugs taken in the meantime.


----------



## enduin

That's 750mg-1g in a session, one session a month. Well that makes more sense to justify your feeling damaged


----------



## Adapt

hmmm yes, I wonder if it'll fix itself over time or if I'll be a mess forever 

Any ideas anyone?


----------



## enduin

It's very likely that I'll heal over time, everyone who got side effects report they improved over time. It can take a lot, but it'll eventually get better. 
I still have the impression the my heart is more sensible but the palpitations decreased a lot and now I get them more and more sparingly.
If you are concerned the advise is alwas the same: stop using any drug, eat healthy, exercise, in your case some vinpocetine, piracetam and choline supplementation can be useful. And try to not be anxious about it.


----------



## simstimstar

Captain.Heroin said:


> Welcome to Substance D.
> /QUOTE]
> 
> Hahaha! Excellent comparison.  I am guessing you have read ' A Scanner Darkly'
> After a week long 10g binge not too long ago, It really could be substance D.  A high so good that does, permanent damage, but as long as you are using it you don't notice the damages in you cognitive abilities and the changes to your personality.    Just like substance D.  I dunno if it could cause split personality like substance d but it def has most of the other side effects (Not unexpected, as Philip K Dick was an amphetamine addict and many side effects such as sleep deprevation psychosis and longer lasting possible neurosis should be expected of any centrally acting stimulant).
> 
> Slightly off topic - everyone here should check out the album 'Substance D' by  Dieselboy, Especially the track 'Warning label'!
> 
> Cheers!


----------



## stevein7

Impotence may be a long term consequence.  Maybe the meph will only be a contributing factor.


----------



## saxondale

Ok... I started using Mephedrone since early 2008 , and now have no more in my possession (I decided from the beginning that the notion of 'stocking' up when the ban came  into effect in the UK was just a non starter) .. havent had any for 7 weeks, but prior to that used approx 1 gram on average every weekend for 2 years...
The good news is , is many of the negative effects associated with use (mouth ulcers, itchy skin rashes, slight loss of weight, palpitations, increasingly fragile mood swings being the main ones) have nearly disppeared. My appetite has increased, skin rashes/irritations have susbsided, moods feel a bit more stable.  
The first week without Meph is without doubt the hardest, and to be honest for the first 3 weeks without usage my mood just felt flat. Life seemed to be just a drudgery that I had to face , but this time without any blanket of comfort. It took all told then , about 3 weeks before I felt any mental or physical improvements...
I do miss it a bit , but this has been dampened by the awareness of the problems meph bought... If i could find an RC which is only half as good as Mephedrone, but with less than half the side effects of Meph then I would happily settle for that as a kind of play off re: cost/benefits analysis of using Meph.
Of course like others here I worry a bit about possible long term damage I might have caused myself, but in the here and now I feel absolutely fine.


----------



## cjtb666

Adapt said:


> - I felt this! I felt like I was actually doing damage to my brain, and had to reign it in!
> 
> Maybe thats why my brain feels so screwed up 6 months later!



how do you mean your brain feels screwd up? because i think i have done some damage to mine and i have only done the drug maybe 8 times over 6 months, but my problems started after i took it on a night out and i have not felt the same since, i have being to a+e 3 times because i thought iwas having a heart attack i have a constant headache for over 2 months now and i just feel like nothing seems normal or real any more and things seem to move all the time and i have being having a lot of panic attcks and for 4 weeks after taking it i kept re experiencing the effects of taking it.


----------



## Adapt

cjtb666 said:


> how do you mean your brain feels screwd up? because i think i have done some damage to mine and i have only done the drug maybe 8 times over 6 months, but my problems started after i took it on a night out and i have not felt the same since, i have being to a+e 3 times because i thought iwas having a heart attack i have a constant headache for over 2 months now and i just feel like nothing seems normal or real any more and things seem to move all the time and i have being having a lot of panic attcks and for 4 weeks after taking it i kept re experiencing the effects of taking it.



Essentially, I forget stuff, fail to notice things that I previously would have picked up on, spell things incorrectly (ie: writing ‘brake’ where I should have written ‘break’), have speech problems (can’t get out what I want to say, or say things in the wrong order or use the wrong words). I know what you mean about nothing seeming real, do you feel like your inside your body looking out while the world just goes on around you or something else?

Also, I randomly have involuntary movements. Its hard to say if I’ve experienced any anxiety/depression associated with it, as the above symptoms cause quite enough of that on their own.

I can’t say I’ve experienced any problems with heart rate etc

Great fun!

If its anything like MDMA/Pills I hope these things will heal themselves over time, fingers crossed.


----------



## ebola?

_Off-topic:_


> Slightly off topic - everyone here should check out the album 'Substance D' by Dieselboy, Especially the track 'Warning label'!



Heh...It's a fun album, but frankly, I prefer the Dick book and movie adaptation.


----------



## Adapt

cjtb666 said:


> how do you mean your brain feels screwd up? because i think i have done some damage to mine and i have only done the drug maybe 8 times over 6 months



Also: what was the name of the mephedrone you were taking?


----------



## cjtb666

Adapt said:


> Also: what was the name of the mephedrone you were taking?



the person who gave me it said it was methedrone/mcat. and  i only had i'd say 200mg of it but as soon as i had it i tripped out everything was moving all over it was not like pervious times on it, it was like i'd just had loads of acid tabs. the thing about things not seeming real yes it's how described but i think that is a thing called depersonalization/derealization which is linked to anxiety which does go away after time. i have a constant headache since aswel which ive being reffered to a neurologist so hopefully he can give me some answers


----------



## Adapt

cjtb666 said:


> the person who gave me it said it was methedrone/mcat. and  i only had i'd say 200mg of it but as soon as i had it i tripped out everything was moving all over it was not like pervious times on it, it was like i'd just had loads of acid tabs. the thing about things not seeming real yes it's how described but i think that is a thing called depersonalization/derealization which is linked to anxiety which does go away after time. i have a constant headache since aswel which ive being reffered to a neurologist so hopefully he can give me some answers



Cool man, I'm going to get some blood tests done, and then hopefully onto a neurologist. Stay in contact and let me know what the results are will you? A lot of my symptoms suggest damage to the basal ganglia but since thats my own diagnosis and I'm not doctor we'll wait and see what they think.

A lot of the symptoms you're reporting seem to subside after a period of time according to others who have reported it. It might take a while though. In the meantime refer to the previous posts where people have replied to me, particularly to the parts about trying not to be anxious.


----------



## cjtb666

Adapt said:


> Cool man, I'm going to get some blood tests done, and then hopefully onto a neurologist. Stay in contact and let me know what the results are will you? A lot of my symptoms suggest damage to the basal ganglia but since thats my own diagnosis and I'm not doctor we'll wait and see what they think.
> 
> A lot of the symptoms you're reporting seem to subside after a period of time according to others who have reported it. It might take a while though. In the meantime refer to the previous posts where people have replied to me, particularly to the parts about trying not to be anxious.



yea i'll let you know what happens, im going to see a cardiologist in 2 week and the neurologist is 3 weeks. i think once i have being to see them and if they says everything is ok then that should calm my anxiety down


----------



## Adapt

Hi there people,

Just wanted to update you all on where I am.

Right now, its been 6 months since I had a heavy Mephedrone sesh, but really about 2.5 months since I last did it (a tiny amount). I don’t want to speak too early, but I have to say that my memory problems, and speech problems, as well as feelings of depression have noticeably subsided. That’s not to say they are gone, but they are definitely much improved. The sun seemed to help!

Unfortunately the involuntary movements are still occurring. I went to the docs, but he palmed me off about it, I’m still going to push to see a neurologist in the near future though just to be sure. That said, their frequency has lessened.

I’ll keep you all updated over the next 6 months.


----------



## MeDieViL

Maybe lions mane could be of use as it stimulates NGF wich regrows nerves.


----------



## Adapt

MeDieViL said:


> Maybe lions mane could be of use as it stimulates NGF wich regrows nerves.



Hi mate,

What is that and where can I get it from?


----------



## MeDieViL

Take a look at those threads in the imminst forum, dont know what brands and stuff are good, but its been discussed there.

http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=18730&hl= lion&st=0

http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=37707


----------



## raylang555

*Hi*

Great  to be here,  and I want to know more information ..


----------



## El_Toro

fuckmcat said:


> Another bad experience with mephedrone here from me. Total usage 2.25g I reckon over 5-6 or 7 sessions, sometimes weeks apart.
> 
> Last time I tried it I insuffated about 50-100mg roughly (3 months ago roughly) before I noticed I had slightly blue fingers and feet and slightly itchy skin, also redder skin overall. *The next day the blueness was gone bur I had a quite noticable tanning / skin darkening effect. *
> Since then I have been getting red/blushing skin on my hands, forearms, feet and lower legs. I have always been slightly blushy and had reddish palms, it definitely seems more pronounced now though and this has me fairly worried. No heart palpitations or any other symptoms apart from redness really. Still looking quite tanned, although I have dark hair and tan easily.
> 
> As for more background info I seem to have somrt sort of inflammatory problem in my back that flares up occasionally, (possibly have Anklyosing Spondylitis although docs are leaning away from that now) and get regular acid reflux / heartburn. I lift weights at the gym 3 times a week (no steroids) and have just started running, overall slim/athletic, fit and healthy (good diet, multivitamin).
> 
> I took some suppliments that are supposed to help cirulation but it didn't seem to help, these were: Ginko bilboa (dry pill form) L-arginine, a vitamin B complex and magnesium.
> 
> Any help or advice would be appreciated, or this info could just be useful info to someone else perhaps.
> 
> I thought the effects were going away but it stills seems noticable occasionally. The problem is I never paid much attention to it before and I may have been like this often before trying meph, only now I am concious of it and notice it more. I am almost certain i'm redder overall and blood returns to pressed skin slightly slower than before however.
> 
> Has anyone who has had the blushing/vasoconstrictive reaction actually had it go away at all? Thanks



Please have the tanning taken a look at. I am reading through the thread and this sign reminded me of Cushing's syndrome in which cortisol is elevated. Moreover, reports of increased blood pressure to hypertension level are akin to those of Cushing's syndrome and being mephedrone a stimulant, I would not be suprised if dangerously elevated cortisol due to mephedrone use was one of the keys here.


----------



## simstimstar

I think all the people whose hands, feet, and knees are turning blue, and the effect is lasting long after the drug exits the system, should go out and get checked for vasculitis.  I have not seen this idea proposed anywhere else yet, but I believe it may fit the bill. Vasculitis can be caused by amphetamines and cocaine so it seems likely to me that mephedrone use could cause it, in those who are susceptible.  It also seems very likely that mephedrone in immunosuppresant and vasculitis is an immune system problem.

Just my .02USD.  I have some bad blood vessels in my left leg anyway that have been there a long time, but since I had a heavy mephedrone binge a couple weeks ago it feels like the blood vessels in both legs have been  feeling inflamed, but it could also be shin splints.  The feeling is not new, but seems more noticeable so  I am thinking about going to a doc to see about getting checked for both, just in case.  I have pretty large order on the way as well and don't want to be using this crap like I was, maybe get it down to once or twice a week, instead of 6-7 days no sleep binge.  I am looking forward to it's arrival, though!

Cheers,
-SimStim


----------



## MikeHawk

simstimstar said:


> I think all the people whose hands, feet, and knees are turning blue, and the effect is lasting long after the drug exits the system, should go out and get checked for vasculitis.  I have not seen this idea proposed anywhere else yet, but I believe it may fit the bill. Vasculitis can be caused by amphetamines and cocaine so it seems likely to me that mephedrone use could cause it, in those who are susceptible.  It also seems very likely that mephedrone in immunosuppresant and vasculitis is an immune system problem.
> 
> Just my .02USD.  I have some bad blood vessels in my left leg anyway that have been there a long time, but since I had a heavy mephedrone binge a couple weeks ago it feels like the blood vessels in both legs have been  feeling inflamed, but it could also be shin splints.  The feeling is not new, but seems more noticeable so  I am thinking about going to a doc to see about getting checked for both, just in case.  I have pretty large order on the way as well and don't want to be using this crap like I was, maybe get it down to once or twice a week, instead of 6-7 days no sleep binge.  I am looking forward to it's arrival, though!
> 
> Cheers,
> -SimStim



A big order coming through?  You make it sound as though it's still legal and can be bought online.

I think you may be on to something RE vasculitus.  I have pain in my right leg blood vessels from time to time and it's really quite painful.  I haven't had any Mephedrone in about 2 months though.


----------



## Coolio

MikeHawk said:


> A big order coming through?  You make it sound as though it's still legal and can be bought online.



You make it sound as though only legal things can be bought online; or as though only product sold via the internet would come through as a shipment.


----------



## psychenaut87

So without bullshitting anyone since that wont help me find answers heres my problem. I recently had an extremely large amount of mephedrone and proceeded to binge on it like it was coke. yes this is a stupid thing but for about a week i was blowing at least a gram a day and that was a small amount if only limited to a gram. i stopped as of yesterday and have had extreme paranoia, a light headed tingly sort of electric shock through face and hands, can feel heart beat through chest without touching and other bad heart and body sensations. does anyone know what i could potentially have? can time solve these problems or should i seek immediate medical help?


----------



## vortex30

psychenaut87 said:


> So without bullshitting anyone since that wont help me find answers heres my problem. I recently had an extremely large amount of mephedrone and proceeded to binge on it like it was coke. yes this is a stupid thing but for about a week i was blowing at least a gram a day and that was a small amount if only limited to a gram. i stopped as of yesterday and have had extreme paranoia, a light headed tingly sort of electric shock through face and hands, can feel heart beat through chest without touching and other bad heart and body sensations. does anyone know what i could potentially have? can time solve these problems or should i seek immediate medical help?



Sounds like a normal reaction to a heavy mephedrone binge to me. Keep off the stuff a few more days, eat well and hydrate and sleep lots. You'll be alright, can tell you I've been in a similar state at least 15-20 times in the past year and at the moment I'm 2 months off the meph, I feel back to normal health just about I'd say.


----------



## MikeHawk

psychenaut87 said:


> So without bullshitting anyone since that wont help me find answers heres my problem. I recently had an extremely large amount of mephedrone and proceeded to binge on it like it was coke. yes this is a stupid thing but for about a week i was blowing at least a gram a day and that was a small amount if only limited to a gram. i stopped as of yesterday and have had extreme paranoia, a light headed tingly sort of electric shock through face and hands, can feel heart beat through chest without touching and other bad heart and body sensations. does anyone know what i could potentially have? can time solve these problems or should i seek immediate medical help?



Wowza.  You should be fine but I recommend being careful over the next few days.  I also recommend using some l-tyrosine as that's been shown to relieve a lot of the symptoms of Mephedrone withdrawal.


----------



## ColtDan

ok i did meph a week ago...and i just drank some alcohol and noticed my left kneecap has turned a bit red/blue with some cold feelings in my feet. what the fuck. i also noticed i woke up earlier with pins and needles in my hands, etc. nasty stuff i need to stop doing it. this isnt the first time ive had numb feet/hands and pins and needles etc.


----------



## EFC18

Extreme light headedness when sitting up quickly; vision blurs head feels numb
sharp black "swirls" almost, moving at high speeds in my vision
changes to smell of urine


apparently both these are indicators of hypotension (low blood pressure) and normally plague me the day after larger sessions. Anything to this?


Also nasal septum has become thinner, nostrils themselves really thin.


----------



## pofacedhoe

EFC18 said:


> Also nasal septum has become thinner, nostrils themselves really thin.



this will be very difficult to tell unless someone else looks up your nose (for holes in the septum), still sounds like you need to cut out the meph


----------



## EFC18

pofacedhoe said:


> this will be very difficult to tell unless someone else looks up your nose (for holes in the septum), still sounds like you need to cut out the meph



Agree, you have to tilt to an uncomfortable angle for it to be noticeable but it's definitely gone beyond a hypochondriac phase, starting to really feel the affects now. 

Right now for example the black swirl things are back. Further evidence (possibly) that blood pressure been raised significantly.


----------



## PandorasBox

enduin-
I have had very similar effects.  I've used less than 5 grams over about 7 sessions, one time using a gram and two other times 500 mg.  About a week after the last time I started having breathing difficulty and chest pain.  I went to the ER and had a full workup and everything came out fine.  I have also had palpitations and chest pain frequently over the following two weeks which have slowly gotten better but sill happen 2-3 times a day.  I usually take stimulants for ADD but I am now unable to take them, or at least take at most a third of what I did with out problems previously, because of some frightening cardiovascular effects.  Chest pain, anxiety, palpitations, tachycardia.  
I went to another doc, who seemed unsure if she could hear a murmur, but knowing I was worried about the effects has referred me to a cardiologist.  I didn't tell either the ER or the other doc about the drug use.  
Now about three weeks later, the palpitations have improved but I still have very high anxiety levels, which is unusual for me, and frequent rapid heart rate.  My heart rate shoots over 100 and stays there probably 3-5times a day.  The palpitations have improved but still occur, especially when laying down.  

I'm not sure what's going on, but it is frightening.  It has gotten better incrementally so far and I can only hope it will continue to do so.  I used to think I knew a lot about drugs and pharmaceuticals (while I don't rival some of the admins here, I know a pretty good bit), but this experience has really shown that the unknowns are really really dangerous.  When I first heard this was in town I refused to try it, calling my friends dumb for trying it.  Then I tried it, liked it, used it a few times, felt the overwhelming compulsive nature of the drug, unlike anything I have experienced, and also caused my body some harm.  Wish I hadn't tried the stuff.  I've tried several RCs in the past, and vie been following the scene for years, but Im done now.  
One benefit I'm trying to draw out of it though is a new found health consciousness.
Enduin, how are things now, have you noted an improvement over the past month or so?  I believe these acute issues may be due to an impurity, as the last 3 times I used it were different in character, (less euphoria, less potency, more cardio effects, severe hyperthermia on one occasion, and are the proximal cause of these toxic symptoms).

I'm interested to hear of anyone else with similar cardio toxicity.




enduin said:


> I was quite unsure if to post this here on in "how toxic is meph" thread, decided for this hoping I chose right.
> 
> I'd basically like to share my experience, and comment on a few hypotesis that have been made over time in different threads, please bear with me.
> 
> I used meph 3 times, first time it was crystally stuff from a super reputable vendor, insufflated 100mg, best high with an incredible rush, yet not the strongest, side effects were some gurning, dry mouth, everything as expected from the kind of substance, and next day mouth nevralgia that lasted couple of days (likely I was clenching all night).
> Second time it was fluffy stuff from another vendor and was after 2 months; this was the strongest high but not the best, with no rush but a building up high which culprit was a moment I suddenly got covered by sweat from head to toe and felt outrageously high. I'm sure if it wasn't for the unbeatable sense of wellbeing and euphoria I'd had freaked out. Side effects were a super gurning to the point I couldn't finish even one sentence without chewing my jaws in the middle, dry mouth like never before, breathlessness. Amounts were 100mg insufflated, 150mg bombed, 30mg insufflated. Oddly enough after the first line the bomb didn't have any effect. after I got home at early morning my BP was quite normal like 140/70 but HR was 136. I got some light gurning and dry mouth the following day as well, and fatigue and breathlessness for up to a week.
> Third time was crystally stuff but from again a different vendor, and a month after the second experience. Amounts were 100mg, then other 100mg, then 30mg all insufflated and well spaced. The high was nice but the lightest, gently rising; the gurning was stronger than the first but much less than the second and so the dry mouth, so still quite in a normal range. after the second line I noticed some palpitations, like I did strongly feel my heart pounding, even if it wasn't racing. No big after effects in the following days, but this weird heart "awareness" started showing up many times, in particular while tripping on a blotter which resulted in a bad trip
> So when I got home from vacations and having this thing for a week long I went to a cardiologist to get checked. He's been very accurate, measured everything, made an echography of my heart, checked chambers, valves, etc. It was all damn right. I also have to add that everytime I used to get this palpitations I checked my values and both BP and HR were perfectly normal.
> Also I noticed there were some particular times where the issue was more likely to show up like after lunch and when going to bed or waking up in the morning, and that for two times it was triggered and lasted few days after using some nasal decongestant (one based on ephedrine and the other on tramazoline). I also noticed that caffeine didn't result in anything, but didn't feel like to make experiments with other stronger stimulants cause I think that understanding is a good thing but trying to recover is better.
> I went under a one month cycle with body building arginine on november (last meph intake has been in august) with no real improvements, and I'm undergoing a month with another pharmaceutic arginine supplement now that resulted in a very noticeable improvement: even tho these events were very slowly getting rarer month by month, I now am palpitantion free since I started and somehow feel my heart is "healtier". I know this is not scientific stuff, but I can't explain it any better.
> Now I've been reading of many hypotesis, the 4-methylephedrine vasocostrictive issues, and recently the dermatomyositis one. I think that while probably both vasocostrictive metabolites and immune issues plays a role, it's more about a receptors upregulation of some sort. I have to add that I have autoimmune disease and got blood tested two weeks after the last experience with nothing out of ordinary concerning the immune system.
> This heart issue I had really felt like my heart was hyperexcitable, and was reacting to things (meals, changing of standing/laying positions, small doses of vasocostrictors in the for of nasal decongestants) that usually don't make the difference. If I had to guess I'd point on 5-ht receptors, but I have no chemistry/biology knowledge, so I'm just guessing based on what I read here and on the web. Btw my buddy used my same amounts the same times but didn't experience any heart issue or anything other than than the transitory ones, and since I notice there's a big variance of side effects between different people, I'm led to think that the receptors upregulation hypotesis can work since everyone's receptors respond differently to different substances.
> There's one last thought, a little OT but still: At beginning of 2009 people were all raving about how amazing meph is, only few morons who went on week binges reported purple knees, ect. Now There's plenty of people that get problems even with single doses, or a moderate use. I can't help but thinking that like it happens with everything the increased request for meph led to a decrease in quality in order to make more available, in spite of most thinking now the meph is better cause it's cristally, and some unknown impurities could be even more responsible than meph itself for most side effects and long lasting problems. But this is just IMHO.


----------



## bpaddy32

*bollox*

Foot off pal. eb]verything you have posted is absolute balls.I did the shi, about a gramm every day, up to two.for six months and never had an issue with me feet. maybe its cause i wash every now and then or change me socks orcause i live i  a relatively cool place, then again maybe noit. Is this site fullof crappers like , trying to puts us alloff having a good time or what. Cop on and get a fukin life or do some drugs. U wanker


----------



## bpaddy32

Calm down pal. I did at least a gramm a day from mid January till end of June, plenty o days doing two. And it was that brill pure gold brand.Cant do it now cause the law chaned here end June, (OIRELAND).I'll be 51 in a couple o months, that ,makes me a 1959 model, which i'd bet is a tad older than ur guud seld. U got a fit o young dude paranoia,probably cause ur also smokin big reefers and downing quarts o alco for fun everybweekend. Calm fukin down, ur fine. 
Paddy


----------



## Aldousage

I've enjoyed mephedrone several times (maybe 7 or 8 over a year). I never exceeded 400mg each time, and always waited at least two weeks between experiences (not always easy with such a euphoric drug...).

I think the major problems with stims like this one are that young, "immortal" users take excessive amounts, use too frequently, and/or take alcohol and other drugs simultaneously.

Due to recent legal restrictions on mephedrone, I've just ordered some flephedrone. I'm hoping it will be very similar.


----------



## vortex30

Hahaha, I've just read 2 posts from the most immature 50+ I've ever met... 

BUT

I oddly agree. People need to try not to focus on these side effects as they go about their day to days. You're alive and you've got your whole life ahead of you to fix these issues which have only recently shown up. This is the long-term effects thread, now it's good to hear EVERYTHING we can, and I'm not saying don't post about them, definitely not. What I'm saying is you need to start taking actions now to make amends with your body and fretting over these side effects day to day will just cause them to be more pronounced. I'm almost 4 months clean after 1.25 years of once a week or more with 4 months of binging 2-4 days a week on the stuff pretty much weekly. Am I cured, after 4 months no mephedrone, minimal stims, exercise and other health conscious actions taken? Nope, but I'm much better than I was when I stopped. 1-2 weeks of heart issues is very common with this drug it seems. Mephedrone is obviously one to avoid and I wish that I had. But he's got a point, try to chill out on the worrying day to day. Things will improve with time; it's inevitable. You probably haven't done long-term damage with a few sessions on it, so just focus on a fast recovery. I worry I've done some level of long-term damage but I'll wait for the one year mark and see how my health is then.

This stuff takes time...

EDIT

As far as progress has gone. I can smoke cigarettes without them increasing my anxiety. My heart only rarely has a shooting pain and it almost always follows an awkward movement of some sort, so this side effect may be entirely gone. But my heart still feels slightly 'numb' constantly, or, maybe it's not numb at all, it's that I can actually feel it pumping in my chest? Whatever it is, my heart doesn't feel the way it used to, haha. My heart feels good when I run, it's not in pain...My lungs on the other hand (smoker   ). My knuckles are still a bit pink on index and middle fingers but my knees have returned to normal colour. I haven't had sleep paralysis once since quitting (fingers crossed). Overall I feel a lot healthier, but there's still some issues. Pins and needles in my arms and hands from time to time and this constant feeling of being just a bit on edge, like I can't fully relax (mild hypertension?). Thinking of the past 2 years and all the damage I have done really brings me down and thinking of specific, very long binges makes me feel temporarily like I did the days following them. I smelt an old bag that had 100g of Mephedrone in it at one time several months ago. My face and spine started to tingle and I had a moment of utter shock just from the smell. My nose...Still not in great shape, but getting better. I seem to have a deviated septum, curving into the right nostril. My left nostril is still fairly 'floppy' if I breathe in hard, but it's SLOWLY getting stronger, the right nostril is fine (I snorted mostly with the left, as the right would often be clogged from just a few lines). My GABAergic use has not surprisingly decreased loads thanks to quitting. No more terrible comedowns to deal with and I can sleep just fine at night.


----------



## EFC18

vortex30 said:


> Hahaha, I've just read 2 posts from the most immature 50+ I've ever met...
> 
> BUT
> 
> I oddly agree. People need to try not to focus on these side effects as they go about their day to days. You're alive and you've got your whole life ahead of you to fix these issues which have only recently shown up. This is the long-term effects thread, now it's good to hear EVERYTHING we can, and I'm not saying don't post about them, definitely not. What I'm saying is you need to start taking actions now to make amends with your body and fretting over these side effects day to day will just cause them to be more pronounced. I'm almost 4 months clean after 1.25 years of once a week or more with 4 months of binging 2-4 days a week on the stuff pretty much weekly. Am I cured, after 4 months no mephedrone, minimal stims, exercise and other health conscious actions taken? Nope, but I'm much better than I was when I stopped. 1-2 weeks of heart issues is very common with this drug it seems. Mephedrone is obviously one to avoid and I wish that I had. But he's got a point, try to chill out on the worrying day to day. Things will improve with time; it's inevitable. You probably haven't done long-term damage with a few sessions on it, so just focus on a fast recovery. I worry I've done some level of long-term damage but I'll wait for the one year mark and see how my health is then.
> 
> This stuff takes time...
> 
> EDIT
> 
> As far as progress has gone. I can smoke cigarettes without them increasing my anxiety. My heart only rarely has a shooting pain and it almost always follows an awkward movement of some sort, so this side effect may be entirely gone. But my heart still feels slightly 'numb' constantly, or, maybe it's not numb at all, it's that I can actually feel it pumping in my chest? Whatever it is, my heart doesn't feel the way it used to, haha. My heart feels good when I run, it's not in pain...My lungs on the other hand (smoker   ). My knuckles are still a bit pink on index and middle fingers but my knees have returned to normal colour. I haven't had sleep paralysis once since quitting (fingers crossed). Overall I feel a lot healthier, but there's still some issues. Pins and needles in my arms and hands from time to time and this constant feeling of being just a bit on edge, like I can't fully relax (mild hypertension?). Thinking of the past 2 years and all the damage I have done really brings me down and thinking of specific, very long binges makes me feel temporarily like I did the days following them. *I smelt an old bag that had 100g of Mephedrone in it at one time several months ago. My face and spine started to tingle and I had a moment of utter shock just from the smell. *My nose...Still not in great shape, but getting better. I seem to have a deviated septum, curving into the right nostril. My left nostril is still fairly 'floppy' if I breathe in hard, but it's SLOWLY getting stronger, the right nostril is fine (I snorted mostly with the left, as the right would often be clogged from just a few lines). My GABAergic use has not surprisingly decreased loads thanks to quitting. No more terrible comedowns to deal with and I can sleep just fine at night.



Great post, agree with all you're saying and although I'm not at the stage you are just yet (well done btw) I'm getting there and I am going through all the symptoms you're merely reflecting upon.
Quick note on the bit I bolded, so true...whenever I can smell it, often opening up the baggy with it in, my mouth will start to salivate and I'll feel very strange - I don't think it's the kind of salivation as a result of something appetising either, almost like my body is preparing it's self defense mechanisms, it's very strange. 
I still enjoy that moment though.


----------



## fastandbulbous

bpaddy32 said:


> Foot off pal. eb]verything you have posted is absolute balls.I did the shi, about a gramm every day, up to two.for six months and never had an issue with me feet. maybe its cause i wash every now and then or change me socks orcause i live i  a relatively cool place, then again maybe noit. Is this site fullof crappers like , trying to puts us alloff having a good time or what. Cop on and get a fukin life or do some drugs. U wanker



Yeah the place is full of people trying to stop you having a good time 8)8).

In future, before opening your mouth and letting the diarrhoea pour out, read a bit about pharmacology - drugs effect people in different ways, some badly, some hardly at all


----------



## AlkaloidsEye

f a b   That's one of the very positive highlights i'm really enjoying about bluelight.  The fact that everyone can come up here and post what's going on with them.  It's useful to have some basic generalizations about how drugs work, but getting this field data back is much more real.  

 As for mephedrone smell?  I have a feeling that if you use it more than once or twice you will recognize the smell always.    At least it's that way for me.  I can smell it on people's money sometimes.  lol


----------



## vortex30

EFC18 said:


> Great post, agree with all you're saying and although I'm not at the stage you are just yet (well done btw) I'm getting there and I am going through all the symptoms you're merely reflecting upon.
> Quick note on the bit I bolded, so true...whenever I can smell it, often opening up the baggy with it in, my mouth will start to salivate and I'll feel very strange - I don't think it's the kind of salivation as a result of something appetising either, almost like my body is preparing it's self defense mechanisms, it's very strange.
> I still enjoy that moment though.



Thanks man! That is EXACTLY it, my mouth salivated too, but it's like my body is preparing to purge something awful out of it or setting up it's defenses or something as you said. I oddly enjoyed it too, lol, but that's my self-destructive side coming out, wanting me to do more and I now know consciously that the stuff is just filthy and I don't want any part of it anymore. Was a freaky moment though, smelling mephedrone after 3 months clean, not seeing it or smelling it once in that time and immediately getting hit by this weird sort of rush. I don't think this particular side-effect will ever go away, it's too strongly ingrained in my mind/memory now I feel.


----------



## ColtDan

been doing it for around a year now. 500mg every weekend, or every other weekend. i think severity of side effects seem to depend on the quality of the meph. 4 months into its use i decided to do it 2 days in a row... bad idea... it gave me one motherfucker of a comedown which lasted for days, huge lack of motivation, heart palps, depression, etc. ever since then i get bad come downs, heart palps, all the bad effects basically. pins and needles, numbness, red knuckles, hot/cold hands... you name it. 
recently though, the side effects seem to have gotten less worse... no idea why. i never increase my useage, which is good as some people binge on this stuff like something crazy. and i only take meph after a few pints. promised myself i would give this stuff up months ago... but its too damn good. especially at music events. had some of the best times of my life on meph. never been on a massive binge, 500mg over 8/10 hours isnt so bad i suppose. i eat healthily, get loads of exercise, and try and be as healthy as possible during the week. the heart palps can be very worrying sometimes... never had any pain as such though, just a strange heavy heartbeat and it feels like my heart flutters. also get paranoid on the come downs, and question myself, who i am etc. then i wonder if my judgement is correct about the paranoid feelings... or if its the come down which is making me think like it. pretty shit. guess i have a love/hate relationship with this stuff


----------



## EFC18

Colt I have been feeling the paranoia at times too. Unlike most people who say that was never an aspect of their personality though, I do often worry alot about the kind of perception I've given off to people, and it's not hard for me to think I've given a bad impression, made a fool of myself, or I'm boring someone when talking to them and shit, like a search for validation. Mcat definitely magnifies that definitely, I remember getting the bus back to my house yesterday and I did look rather scruffy as you do after a night on it, but I was convinced everyone was looking at me and talking about me, I just convinced myself to ignore it and it passed. 
Every time I have taken it too far I've always felt so guilty in the aftermath, but I've always managed to convince myself "Oh you exaggerated, you werent that bad, you haven't fucked yourself up, just live a little" so I've only had a couple of hours sleep since tuesday, like a 4-something day binge, when you get to a stage where that is acceptable...



vortex30 said:


> Thanks man! That is EXACTLY it, my mouth salivated too, but it's like my body is preparing to purge something awful out of it or setting up it's defenses or something as you said. I oddly enjoyed it too, lol, but that's my self-destructive side coming out, wanting me to do more and I now know consciously that the stuff is just filthy and I don't want any part of it anymore. Was a freaky moment though, smelling mephedrone after 3 months clean, not seeing it or smelling it once in that time and immediately getting hit by this weird sort of rush. I don't think this particular side-effect will ever go away, it's too strongly ingrained in my mind/memory now I feel.




Haha rather similar to me then, you never want to be the first one to suggest calling it a night, I always want to just keep going. I've got quite a few sensible mates but I went out recently with my more laid back mates and we were so bad, just kept on encouraging and enabling each other. "Yeah might as well have another line", "just finish this gram" sort of like massaging each other's guilt. 
I mean right now, since Tuesday, I have only had bout 7 hours sleep. That was on Thursday I slept in the daytime, 10am - 7pm then went out again that night. I mean I started Uni in two weeks thats why I've got this free time now, and I have just taken it to ridiculous levels. You are right you've really got to keep jabbing the self-destruct button to get to these levels with mephedrone, the progession has been very steady from "a line a night, only with x mate", "couple of lines", "half a gram", "only once a week", "only when I'm out in town", "only when I'm with my mates", "only when I'm drinking" and then just now, really just fucking myself up for no reason. Anyway this has taken a long time, I started using round new year. Health effects that I've noticed is high blood pressure, which manifested itself in these black dots flying through my vision like the day after a session, happened once or twice recently,  I think it is called hypertensive retinopathy. I haven't had this checked my a Doctor for obvious reasons! I don't get the blue knees or hands or anything like most have mentioned and I never have done. I've never felt like I'm going to collapse, but my main health concern I've put at the bottom of this post. 



AlkaloidsEye said:


> f a b   That's one of the very positive highlights i'm really enjoying about bluelight.  The fact that everyone can come up here and post what's going on with them.  It's useful to have some basic generalizations about how drugs work, but getting this field data back is much more real.
> 
> As for mephedrone smell?  I have a feeling that if you use it more than once or twice you will recognize the smell always.    At least it's that way for me.  I can smell it on people's money sometimes.  lol



Yeah. It is very recognisable once you've been around it long enough - but yes I do agree with you too, the feedback and sharing of tales can be rather therapeutic. Obviously got to take the anecdotal evidence with a bit of salt but you can still learn things from it and occasionally there are some budding chemists with surprisingly advanced pharmacological knowledge who actually understand the substances we kind of ingest without much thought. 




*Erectile Dysfunction* 
Needed to bold this bit to bring the focus to my biggest concern (and thought it would make for a nice ironic bit of humour ) at the moment. Obviously shrivelled dick when on it everyone is aware of, but now day or two after its really hard to get motivated and also, physically, it just doesn't seem to go beyond a semi. this is really fucking worrying me as there is a girl I have been making moves on, and getting very good responses, it would be a hell of a way to spoil it for myself as she doesn't even do drugs either. 
But yes this seems to be a problem for me, hard to judge whether it is long term or permenant because I have literally been binging these last two weeks. 
I expect nothing but condemnation obviously, I'm more aware than anybody that my antics have been self-destructive, I'm hoping for some leniency amongst my fellow fiends in this thread...
thanks anyway guys


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## LukeAngelo

I took Mephedrone for about 9 months, basically every weekend. Dosing from about 2 to 11 grams in a weekend. I was experiencing a lot of nasty side effects. Anxiety, depression, memory loss, problems with speech etc., So I decided to stop. After a month of not using meph I came up with a skin rash which has covered my whole body. I have a constant throbbing sensation in my legs. 4 months on with out taking it, I'm still experiencing these sensations, getting better over time though. I had 4 high blood pressure readings from the doctor and I had around 12 blood tests to find the cause, including the throbbing legs. They checked my Liver, Kidneys, etc. Every result came back normal. They said the blood pressure readings may be due to Meph. I've had a cough for about 4 months as well, gradually getting better overtime. One of the worst side effects is now being a hypochondriac. I had a skin rash and was certain it was HIV. Was tested and came back negative. Never had any of these side effects from Ecstasy with regular use. Worst drug I've ever taken.


----------



## FUSIONZ

*hey read this*

Well,
   I am one of those morons who didn't do any real research,  as there really is no long term information about mephedrone.  Needless to say, since April of this year I have done 150 grams of mephedrone.  That's 150 divided by roughly 180 days.  I have stopped doing it for almost a month now.  The first three days I got KILLER brain zaps and felt as if I was really tired.  After two weeks I was pretty much fine.  And today a month later,  I don't feel any different and have recently got a physical and have checked out 100 percent fine.  The lady even went on to say that my blood pressure was great and my standing pulse rate was perfect.  I AM NOT ADVOCATING mephedrone use in any way.  It is a nasty gross drug.  It is addicting as fuck,  and it messes with you big time.  Strangely,  I have felt no depression whatsoever.   Kindly drop in with your 2 cents as to what you think of this...
                   FUSIONZ


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## puasoton

Was using about half a gram every weekend from Jan-April.

Stopped after the ban.

I now have short-term memory problems.  Example:

I go into my room from the kitchen to get something, by the time I get to my room (5 seconds later) I've forgotten why I went in there.  I then have to think really hard to remember what I went in there for.

I am 28 and otherwise healthy, had no such memory problems prior to starting to use meph


----------



## theotherside

^^^That pretty much describes the way you feel after quitting smoking weed/drinking alcohol/doing MDMA/etc.etc. You should recover fine.


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## pofacedhoe

its a rough ass drug but since not having had a binge since jan 8months later (minus one 250mg bomb in may) i notice no side effects. 

a nasty drug we can do without


----------



## cardozoj

I had the peripheral hypoxia symptoms (what is mostly being referred to as vasoconstriction here, but I have seen theories in other threads suggesting another process could be involved, perhaps in combination with vasoconstriction).  This was about 16 hours into a binge of 1.5 grams, mostly insufflated, of a white, pure-looking powder (not saying it _was_ pure, just distinguishing it from the yellowish-looking stuff that has been referenced).  My feet started to change color towards gray-ish blue, I then began to experience some tingling and then numbness in the feet.  20 minutes or so later this spread to my fingers and to a lesser extent hands.  

This symptoms were somewhat subtle when they began, although they got bad enough within 20 minutes that it would have been hard not to notice.  Because I had been reading up and was on the lookout for this, I immediately stopped redosing, drank a couple cups of water, and had an aspirin (thinking was to thin the blood and enhance circulation--just a hunch, I have no scientific basis for thinking it would help).  I found that changing positions frequently seemed to enhance the circulation.  The symtpoms peaked around 1 hour after the last dose I had insufflated, and resolved entirely within a couple hours.  BUT TO ANYONE THINKING ABOUT GOING ON A MEPH BINGE -- JUST BECAUSE I WAS LUCKY, DON'T ASSUME YOU WILL BE.

I went to bed, felt fine the next day except for a general hangover not dissimilar from other stim binges I have been on.  Several days later now, I have no lingering symptoms. 

I may have dodged a bullet, and thanks to everyone who has been posting information on this.  I do not endorse going on a binge like I did, but if one finds themselves in that situation, be on the lookout for this known and poorly-understood side effect, and STOP DOSING if you get symtpoms.  The drug definately compels one to do more, but the risk of having one's extremeties die of lack of oxygen while still attached to their body should be a deterrent...


----------



## vvz

Is it possible to avoid these effects by using vaso-expanding drugs?


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## MikeHawk

vvz said:


> Is it possible to avoid these effects by using vaso-expanding drugs?



Probably however the fact that effects persist for months indicates there's more at work than just simple vasoconstriction.


----------



## vvz

MikeHawk said:


> Probably however the fact that effects persist for months indicates there's more at work than just simple vasoconstriction.


Could this be due to hormonal changes or toxicity to certain types of receptors?


----------



## theotherside

9 months into my mephedrone taking career and not one negative report. I've binged on it, mixed it, not one blue toe or knee. Clean bill of health as I have to go to the doctor for checkups as I am a "researcher" and by simply not sitting still for 4 hours you can avoid many of the problems. Progress report is not one bad thing.........I even go on a jog the day after for god's sake.


----------



## Thisisnew

Can someone (and I know this will be difficult, if not impossible) compare the danger level of using (or abusing) this versus a more common drug? i.e. should it be treated like mdma and no more than once a month? or is it so much worse that it should be avoided at all costs?


----------



## theotherside

^^^It has a cardio-toxic metabolite that can mess with your heart valves, but a drug like MDMA more than likely is neuro-toxic(so many studies, so many results) so it is hard to compare. Most people encounter problems, and we don't know the long term effects other than what I mentioned above. I take an aspirin before dosing, and never sit in one spot too long, hence I haven't had any v.c. problems...no blue limbs, or even red hands.


----------



## Captain.Heroin

willow11 said:


> Anyway, F&B's refusal to take it has largely prompted my own desicison..



Reading about some people's negative experiences, coupled with expert opinions, also lead me to the conclusion that it's better not to take 4-mmc.


----------



## ebola?

> I take an aspirin before dosing, and never sit in one spot too long, hence I haven't had any v.c. problems...no blue limbs, or even red hands.



Or it could just be that you're lucky (although you gave good advice).

ebola


----------



## melange

ebola? said:


> Or it could just be that you're lucky (although you gave good advice).
> 
> ebola



nevertheless aspirin is a very good choice


it can only be beneficial


----------



## simstimstar

melange said:


> nevertheless aspirin is a very good choice
> 
> 
> it can only be beneficial



The only time i got serious chest pains on meph was when I combined it with Adderall aka amphetamine salts (very bad idea btw, I have combo'd addies with MDMA and/or meth many times and it was never scary like adderall and meph).  I took a 350mg aspirin and the pains subsided.

It can literally save your life, but seeing a doc is probably advisable when you start getting chest pains...

Cheers,
-SSS


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## melange

yeah man

thumbs up for aspirin


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## tvas22

has anyone had any positive effects using ginkgo biloba during or after a binge? it is supposed to be a vasodilator i think...


----------



## theotherside

^I take ginko as a part of my daily vitamin regimine, not sure how much it helps me when I take meph though.


----------



## MikeHawk

Anything as powerful as Mephedrone is unlikely to be countered by anything but a strong vasodilator.


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## tvas22

Hmm, your probably right. Still, it is also a mild anticoagulant, maybe that's worth thinking about... still... I found these earlier. Might be of a vague relevance for people willing to try anything to help side effects... 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17564952

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16451753

The second one seems more interesting. "The results suggested that Ginkgo enhanced endothelium-dependent vasodilation and elevation of the endothelial intracellular Ca(2+) level in SHR, resulting in hypotension."


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## Xamkou

I hate the cold hands/feet side-effect. It's going to be problematic this winter!


----------



## PandorasBox

Its a couple months later- and I am feeling much better.  I've actually forgotten about the post on the previous page.  I still occasionally worry about my heart- but I don't know that its any different than its always been.  A few things are different- Im much more sensitive to the sympathetic side effects of stimulants now.  I had to cut my daily amphetamine dose  in half- which is strange and worth noting.  Suggests some sort of long term change.  I still worry ab what kind of long term damage I did to my brain- but I think the biggest thing I was experiencing at that time was normal worry about what an unknown chem did to my body and most importantly anxiety and paranoia precipitated by the drug. 
That created a feedback loop of negative, occasionally irrational thoughts. So, I think to others- its definitely worth noting the anxiety and paranoia that follow binges, and how destructive they can be to your mental health.

 Interestingly- I started taking bupropion (for its lesser stimulant effect and treatment of ADHD), and I noticed that its a cathinone analogue.  That means that some drug company somewhere probably has a library of data on a whole library of cathinone analogues.  I would love to get my hands on that.  I used to work for a small drug company in drug discovery- and I remember going over those animal study reports and trying to figure out a way to justify moving it to human trials.


----------



## EFC18

Psychological problems are unavoidable with heavy usage, it has all finally caught up with me. Decreasing purity, increasing tolerance and other factors have contributed to it now becoming a wholly unsatisfying experience.

Fuck it.


----------



## ColtDan

^ agreed. the meph down here is now absolutely bollocks. ive given up trying to find any decent stuff now, few people i know who havent been doing meph long keep railing the shit stuff thinking its good, and im just like, this stuff is bollocks. complete waste of time



Xamkou said:


> I hate the cold hands/feet side-effect. It's going to be problematic this winter!



it is. i work in a big warehouse full of steel, it reaches -10 sometimes in the winter. ive experienced all the numb hands/pins and needles/red fingers/cold hands side effects and i had the side effects quite bad last winter from doing meph quite a lot. combine this with working in very cold conditions all day it makes your fingers feel feeling horrible, my fingers started to hurt pretty badly


----------



## mark87

i was taking mephedrone once a week every week but started getting really bad comedowns. i've now not taken it or any other drug for about 5 weeks and still my head doesn't feel right.

 i used to be happy and enjoy life but now i feel depressed, miserable, confused, forgetful, less able (physically and mentally) and paranoid. i have little to no self worth or confidence. my brain feels cloudy and dumb. i've lost all feeling and emotion and no longer enjoy things i used to. i'm seriously worried these effects may be permanent.

what should i do?

thanks


----------



## brandy42

I'm not sure if this is helpful or not.

But I will say that I was taking mephedrone 3 times a week for six months (Dec 09 to June 10).

I stopped taking it because if found myself sitting up for 20 hours or more.

Coincedentally after stopping it I started posting on Bluelight.

If you read my posts, around July 2010 that will give some idea of the strangeness.

I would suggest you stop it now.


----------



## wrxya33

MikeHawk said:


> Well this is certainly interesting and important information.  This could potentially be clear evidence that Mephedrone is toxic even in small quantities.  We need more BP readings from people who use this stuff.



6-8 grams of mephedrone in a 2 week period is not a small quantity. Especially since he did this amount in only 3 sessions. So thats a minimum of 2 grams a session. Thats a huge amount. 

I just started doing mephedrone about 2 months ago and im on my 4th gram ever and i normally do 400-600mg over a 12 hour period. I have had zero issues other then normal stimulant anxiety and edginess when im coming down.


----------



## theotherside

^^Trust me, if you really start using mephedrone 2 grams in a session is normal  I started out a year ago thinking, "Wow what  a wonderful substance, I only need 500mg's a night"...fast forward a year later and it has made my g'/f and I  fight when we couldn't get any one weekend. We are lucky to do less than 5 grams between the two of us in a weekend session.  We almost always have to combine with it with other cathinones to get the same high.One of the greatest highs of all time but also a terrible drug(up there with coke although not as addicting physically).


----------



## MeDieViL

MikeHawk said:


> Probably however the fact that effects persist for months indicates there's more at work than just simple vasoconstriction.



I would gues the metabolite somehow upregulates the alpha adrenergic receptors leading to increased sensivity to vasoconstriction caused by other stimulants, im just figuring out i may have gotten this issue last summer with flephedrone, however i didnt have any issue for months since i was taking cardiovascular meds to block amphetamine induced anxiety lately i ran out of them and started getting those symptons again, i first didnt know what was going on untill after a few times a took a big dose of amphetamine and turned purple, get severe chestpains, severely fast heartrate etc, then i started looking at my veines and fist didnt find them, then suddenly saw they looked like the smallest wires i ever saw immediatly knew what was going on, i even had 2 spots on my skin turning grey but i was right in time, i took some aspirin, nac and viagra with diluted my veins quite a bit, viagra works in the coronary veins, but its mostly selective.

After that i restarted my supplement curcumin with my arb blocker candesartan and the problem has immediatly cleared up, both have vasodilative effects, just like anyone posted here before, i couldnt even take normal doses of dexedrine anymore, they felt extremely unpleasant, wich i first didnt connect with severe vasoconstriction.

Without stimulants i dont have any issue feel completely normal, but i seem to have gotten a ton more sensitive to the vasoconstrictive effect of stims.

That said i would highly suggest caution by adding cardiovascular meds, its still unclear what causes the long term increased sensivity to vasonstriction.


----------



## pofacedhoe

theotherside26 said:


> ^^Trust me, if you really start using mephedrone 2 grams in a session is normal  I started out a year ago thinking, "Wow what  a wonderful substance, I only need 500mg's a night"...fast forward a year later and it has made my g'/f and I  fight when we couldn't get any one weekend. We are lucky to do less than 5 grams between the two of us in a weekend session.  We almost always have to combine with it with other cathinones to get the same high.One of the greatest highs of all time but also a terrible drug(up there with coke although not as addicting physically).



its way more addictive than cocaine, i can stop taking coke in a binge with a bit of effort but with mephedrone its almost impossible and you end up going for days.

i wont touch that dirty shit now


----------



## vortex30

theotherside26 said:


> ^^Trust me, if you really start using mephedrone 2 grams in a session is normal  I started out a year ago thinking, "Wow what  a wonderful substance, I only need 500mg's a night"...fast forward a year later and it has made my g'/f and I  fight when we couldn't get any one weekend. We are lucky to do less than 5 grams between the two of us in a weekend session.  We almost always have to combine with it with other cathinones to get the same high.One of the greatest highs of all time but also a terrible drug(up there with coke although not as addicting physically).



Neither one is physically addictive. I must say Mephedrone has caused me way more serious side-effects and addictional challenges than cocaine, but that may mostly come down to price. I'm over 7 months off the stuff now. After 16 months of using it at least once a week, at least a gram in a session, usually binging for 2-4 days for 5 months of that period.


----------



## melange

ok I feel like an idiot because everyone on here, knows that I have a little common sense

I got 250mg of very pure meph recently(this is my only second time doing it)


I have adhd, and stims affect me very differently than most people

I barely did half of the 250mg in a night and my heart rate was pounding hard(but I already have a panic disorder) - the tachycardia felt no different than from when I smoke really good weed(in fact I have had weed skyrocket my hr to 180)

so to be safe, I went to the emergency room, and got a script for xanax

now they did ekg's chest xrays, blood work, all the shit and said I was fine(ruled it out as axiety/panic attacks, since my vitals weren't too bad - like heart rate 120-135, bp was like 135/90, so nothing serious

I am asking if xanax would be useful If I wanted to do the rest(don't have much left;meph that is); I assume it would help greatly

I am really sensitive to stims, I hear all these people doing fucking grams and grams in a night, which like I said earlier in this thread, was the real culprit behind the negative side effects, overdoing it

I mean this 250 lasted me like 3 days

but like I said I am sensitive to stims(because of anxiety problems)


----------



## melange

oh and just for the record, I have usually always made it a rule of thumb to never do stims without some depressant near by(preferably opiates or alcohol)


I even have a shitload of trazodone and tegretol if I need it


----------



## melange

if i ever do stims again(not very often) i wanna have atenelol/clonidine/amyl nitrite/aspirin nearby


that is just because I am a scientist/health nerd


and I know a lot about medicine and healthcare

shit, I am such a hypochondriac, might aswell have some sodium nitroprusside



hypertensive crisis's do not sound fun


----------



## pr0d1gy

melange said:


> if i ever do stims again(not very often) i wanna have atenelol/clonidine/amyl nitrite/aspirin nearby
> 
> 
> that is just because I am a scientist/health nerd
> 
> 
> and I know a lot about medicine and healthcare
> 
> shit, I am such a hypochondriac, might aswell have some sodium nitroprusside
> 
> 
> 
> hypertensive crisis's do not sound fun



I think that people self administrating Beta blockers and vasodialators (especially ones as strong as SNP) is a bad idea. Mixing certain beta blockers with mephedrone could cause vasospasms. If the vasoconstricitve side effects from mephedrone use are so strong you feel that you need a beta blocker or especially SNP, you should be in the ER.


----------



## pofacedhoe

if you have a panic disorder dont take mephedrone


----------



## Elieseweiland

I need to strongly caution anyone using to stop as soon as possible. 
once you start... its a hard habit to break
it gets worse trust me... 
I'm only a week sober so I'm not sure yet what all of my medical issues are going to be but I can tell I have a long road ahead of me.
If anyone wants to seriously talk about their addiction I offer my support to you.  
symptoms:
-vomiting blood
-shortness of breath
-abnormal heartbeat
-loss of feeling to certain parts of my body 
-excessive weight loss (over 20 pounds in one month)
-cant tell when i'm hungry or when I get full (really not sure what this is about would appreciate any insight) 
-loss of empathy (think thats the right word but basically I get confused when people express emotion, I cant tell emotions apart all the time)
-Paranoia  
-aggression 

and man thats just the tip of the ice berg it seems... I didnt list most of my mental symptoms cause its just too much. I have never had issues with addiction before.. I didnt even really like doing drugs. thats why this drug is so scary... if you dont have limits you wont stop... I was using roughly a gram a day... every day for a month at the end. Even with all the health issues I would talk myself into it being ok. 

Please use me as an example I need everyone to know how dangerous it is!!


----------



## sackynut

Ill add my two cents I guess. This stuff is nasty. I got it from a very reputable source and binged for 3 days straight on two separate occasions. The first time wasnt as bad, but the second....but the end my lungs felt like someone was sitting on them. My heart still hurts after a few days sober, my body aches, and I cant tell when Im hungry or full either. But at the same time Im losing weight. Definitely am not going to fuck with this stuff anymore.


----------



## melange

amphetamine is better imo


----------



## Lady Codone

I'm trying a one month on, one month off thing with mephedrone right now after going through 3 grams in December.  (January is my "off" month).  My most terrifying side effects were nosebleeds that would leave me so dizzy and nauseous I blacked out temporarily.  And then I learned to crush the little crystals before snorting, which helped immensely.  (Meph is the only thing I've snorted so it didn't occur to me).  

Seems like a lot of the more frightening side effects I see are with people who completely binged out beyond what could ever be considered moderate.  Are there any stories of severe side effects with low-to-medium doses (no more than a gram per week)?


----------



## Coolio

Has anyone here had any problems with the injection site from IV use of 4-methylmethcathinone?

I've done a bunch of shots recently and the needle fell out of the vein for the end of some of them, leading to a bit going in via subcutaneous or intramuscular or whatever. There's now some soreness/bruising in the area.

I wonder what kind of tissue damage this is, and how it will heal.


----------



## DJ 303

melange said:


> ok I feel like an idiot because everyone on here, knows that I have a little common sense
> 
> I got 250mg of very pure meph recently(this is my only second time doing it)
> 
> 
> I have adhd, and stims affect me very differently than most people
> 
> I barely did half of the 250mg in a night and my heart rate was pounding hard(but I already have a panic disorder) - the tachycardia felt no different than from when I smoke really good weed(in fact I have had weed skyrocket my hr to 180)
> 
> so to be safe, I went to the emergency room, and got a script for xanax
> 
> now they did ekg's chest xrays, blood work, all the shit and said I was fine(ruled it out as axiety/panic attacks, since my vitals weren't too bad - like heart rate 120-135, bp was like 135/90, so nothing serious
> 
> I am asking if xanax would be useful If I wanted to do the rest(don't have much left;meph that is); I assume it would help greatly
> 
> I am really sensitive to stims, I hear all these people doing fucking grams and grams in a night, which like I said earlier in this thread, was the real culprit behind the negative side effects, overdoing it
> 
> I mean this 250 lasted me like 3 days
> 
> but like I said I am sensitive to stims(because of anxiety problems)



Jesus Melange!
Take care of yourself man!
This is not healthy.

Somebody in your situation ought to deal with their anxiety disorder and stay well well clear of mephedrone or any dopamine heavy stimulants.
I have a lot of experience with neurosis, psychosis, and panic/anxiety disorders, and the results are not pretty if you don't address some basic fundamental truths and begin the process of cognitive therapy.

Man I know what it feels like to have a panic attack. It is the most terrifying thing in the world and nothing, absolutely nothing can prepare you for it the first time it happens.
Surely you want to be free of that don't you? What a burden that is on your life!
I am an individual who has fully recovered from mental illness through a long process of cognitive therapy, initially needing a hell of a lot of medication, but now I know that I do not need and will never need medication again. I will never have another panic attack as long as I live. I know this at a fundamentally deep, unshakeable and confident level. But it took years to get there.
And mesing around with even small amounts of mephedrone and stims with symptoms as acute as yours, let alone beta blockers and other self-medication, reflects a slightly worrying failure to deal with the matter at hand, and to treat yourself.

do look after yourself man.
Cause life is short and hard like a body building elf, and you only get one crack at it!
treat yourself with the respect you deserve and you'll thank yourself later in life i swear!

Peace and positively soothing vibrations,...

DJ


----------



## Eyes On the Roll

from reading what many people have to say about this dirty substance, i'm glad that i decided to buy 5g's of methylone instead of mephedrone.


----------



## sighhill

*Mephedrone Questions...*

A friend of mine took Mephedrone 2 nights ago and is wondering how long it is thought of to stay in your system. I gave her the amount of time I remembered reading, on average, from internet resources. 

Any suggestions on how long Mephedrone stays in the system?


Facts on subject: Female, mid-20's, 140lbs., took no more than 500mg no less than 400mg measured out by .001 scale, throughout a duration of 13.5 hours. First and largest dose at once being 104mg, meausred out by scale, taken in gelcap anally. One other dose anally through oral suringe water/mephedrone mix aprox. 3.5 hours after first dose. The rest of the doses were no more than 25mg (eyeballed) at once, sniffed, and randomly done throughout the duration time. Used .75 mg of xanex for sleep aid last night. Has gotten around 10.5 hours of sleep since last dose of mephedrone.
Second time user of Mephedrone.

This being the second day after the use and is observed or said of feeling the side effects, I've read about numerous times, such as being easily agrrovated, impatient, easily angered, short term memory loss (constantly forgeting what she's doing in the middle of a task,) anxiety, depression, sleeplessness, paranioa, easily annoyed, sensitivity to loud noises, more sensitive emotionally than normal and has an impulse of  continuosly squeezing her hands to a fist follwed by stretching the hands back open as far as she could to the point that it hurts. 
Currently having most of these effects along with noted strong anxiety. She also says these negitive effects felt are in waves, mostly last night and tonight  Not of emergency status, of course.

 I have read through internet referance's to similar situations and told her what I thought. Any opionion on how long these feeling will last and/or suggestions of what could help?

Any advice is appreciated, besides simply to not do Mephedrone again (think she's learned her lesson.) Maybe even suggestions of switching forums or posting a thread elsewhere would be apreciated.


----------



## AlkaloidsEye

EFC18 said:


> Colt I have been feeling the paranoia at times too. Unlike most people who say that was never an aspect of their personality though, I do often worry alot about the kind of perception I've given off to people, and it's not hard for me to think I've given a bad impression, made a fool of myself, or I'm boring someone when talking to them and shit, like a search for validation. Mcat definitely magnifies that definitely, I remember getting the bus back to my house yesterday and I did look rather scruffy as you do after a night on it, but I was convinced everyone was looking at me and talking about me, I just convinced myself to ignore it and it passed.
> Every time I have taken it too far I've always felt so guilty in the aftermath, but I've always managed to convince myself "Oh you exaggerated, you werent that bad, you haven't fucked yourself up, just live a little" so I've only had a couple of hours sleep since tuesday, like a 4-something day binge, when you get to a stage where that is acceptable...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Haha rather similar to me then, you never want to be the first one to suggest calling it a night, I always want to just keep going. I've got quite a few sensible mates but I went out recently with my more laid back mates and we were so bad, just kept on encouraging and enabling each other. "Yeah might as well have another line", "just finish this gram" sort of like massaging each other's guilt.
> I mean right now, since Tuesday, I have only had bout 7 hours sleep. That was on Thursday I slept in the daytime, 10am - 7pm then went out again that night. I mean I started Uni in two weeks thats why I've got this free time now, and I have just taken it to ridiculous levels. You are right you've really got to keep jabbing the self-destruct button to get to these levels with mephedrone, the progession has been very steady from "a line a night, only with x mate", "couple of lines", "half a gram", "only once a week", "only when I'm out in town", "only when I'm with my mates", "only when I'm drinking" and then just now, really just fucking myself up for no reason. Anyway this has taken a long time, I started using round new year. Health effects that I've noticed is high blood pressure, which manifested itself in these black dots flying through my vision like the day after a session, happened once or twice recently,  I think it is called hypertensive retinopathy. I haven't had this checked my a Doctor for obvious reasons! I don't get the blue knees or hands or anything like most have mentioned and I never have done. I've never felt like I'm going to collapse, but my main health concern I've put at the bottom of this post.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah. It is very recognisable once you've been around it long enough - but yes I do agree with you too, the feedback and sharing of tales can be rather therapeutic. Obviously got to take the anecdotal evidence with a bit of salt but you can still learn things from it and occasionally there are some budding chemists with surprisingly advanced pharmacological knowledge who actually understand the substances we kind of ingest without much thought.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Erectile Dysfunction*
> Needed to bold this bit to bring the focus to my biggest concern (and thought it would make for a nice ironic bit of humour ) at the moment. Obviously shrivelled dick when on it everyone is aware of, but now day or two after its really hard to get motivated and also, physically, it just doesn't seem to go beyond a semi. this is really fucking worrying me as there is a girl I have been making moves on, and getting very good responses, it would be a hell of a way to spoil it for myself as she doesn't even do drugs either.
> But yes this seems to be a problem for me, hard to judge whether it is long term or permenant because I have literally been binging these last two weeks.
> I expect nothing but condemnation obviously, I'm more aware than anybody that my antics have been self-destructive, I'm hoping for some leniency amongst my fellow fiends in this thread...
> thanks anyway guys



  Been a while, but i wanted to report on my experiences with 4-MMC a bit more.  Specifically the erectile dysfunction aspect of it.  I should add that, for unknown reasons, i do not appear to encounter erectile dysfunction on MDMA.  I have also noted that while on 4-MMC i, likewise, seem to function as i normally would, if not a bit more sexually energized.

  I have much compassion for those who are experiencing negative side effects.  Please be as safe as you can.

  The only time i encountered any form of erectile "dysfunction", if you would call it that,  was after somewhere around 5 hours of relatively physically intense sex , several hours of dancing and  about 12 hours after first ingestion.  It appears to have been related to my dehydration more so than any direct effect of the drug itself.  


  To date i have found 4-MMC to be a compound that, while not a "true" aphrodisiac it does seem to amplify any sexual attraction that does already exists.

  It won't make you sexually attracted to someone you would not normally find appealing, but if you are attracted to something before hand it will probably turn up the heat some.  

  I do urge, as a final cautionary note, to try and keep your intake infrequent and on the low end of things.  So maybe 1 g or less per session and for no more than 12 hours.  While i have not noted any negative side effects, i do personally know people who have when they have done large amounts or done it very often.  I am keeping my use to once every 3-6 months at most, however i can see how some folks might find it very difficult to control dosing.  It can be quite seductive, so pay attention to yourselves and your f(r)iends!  

  When i had a recent health check-up my blood pressure was considered very healthy as well as all other health indices.  I'm not drawing any firm conclusions from that, but nothing acute for me at least.

sighhill   is your friend experiencing -all- of those side effects? Is she on any other medications?  Do any other drugs?  This might help.  4-MMC is water soluble and leaves your system pretty quick.  There should not be any measurable amounts with a few days at most.  Deep breathing is very helpful for high anxiety situations.  Maybe have her look into pranayama as well.


----------



## sighhill

Yes Alkaloid, my friend experiences ALL of those sides.  Both days she felt those effects except I do not recall her saying or noticed anything about sensitivity to sound the day after the session. 
Also, I observed, she seemed to have problems with self control during fits of anger and remorse the night after the use. She became angry because she felt the way she did and knew what mainly caused it. (I don't know what to call it so I'm going to say delusions, so correct me please) She seemed to have delusions of words said and actions and at times I think she didn't know what was real. I observed this in what she mentioned earlier in waves through out the day after.  I didn't see that so much of that today.

She takes two daily prescribed medications but  I'm not sure of  the names and rather have her consent to name them (so I might be editing if she's ok with naming them.) I do believe they might have been contributing factor. 
I suggested her to call her doctor tomorrow to ask questions and atleast make an appointment at the end of the week just in case. She agreed to.

Currently sound asleep, so that's good. I will pass along your advice and it is well appreciated.


----------



## Lady Codone

Good to know, Glenjih.  Seems binging is the norm with this one.  

The only time I ever experienced chest/arm pain and slight discoloration of the knees was when I downed a bunch of caffeine with meph, though it doesn't appear to mix well with weed either (for me).  I'd caution against mixing it with ANY other stimulants or anything that makes the heart beat faster.


----------



## Noxxxway

i still didnt recover from one time meph use, have chest pains arm pains, faster heart rate increases while changing position, anxiety, cant breath normal it has passed 5 months now
I  got little better since then but not completly.
i really believe that it has messd up with my adrenergic receptors, becouse my heart rate is wierd, cant breath ( feels like I dont have to breathe, or like i dont breath any air), chest pains etc, 


first i thought i have heart problems, but i made ecg, echo of my heart and its ok for now.
i hope i wont have permanent problem with this and  will recover.
i didnt use any drogs since then, 
one time i drunk a lot of vine and next day i talmost went to ER becouse my heart was racing all day over 120bpm, benzos didnt help eather

 i will start do a lot of exercises and hopefully get better
i dont want to live like this till the end of my life, 

 I have suecidel thoughts everyday. 

doctors are telling me i have vegetative nervous system bad and im i think the same now,, i stoped being hypohondric about my heart problems, and im little better
i would cry like a baby if i would wake up one day and feel normal, 
now im waking up like someone has beated  my chest at night, almost everyday, i get  depresed. 
(sorry 4 my bad english!)


----------



## egg_stacy

Hi,

I've never found mephedrone to be too bad a substance healthwise either..  The binging is terrible and can knock your body off kilter for a day or two but as far as long term effects I havent noticed anything.

I was taking mephedrone from the start (about 2 - 2.5 years ago - all powder no crystal back then I seem to recall) and during my peak was easily going through over a gram a day, followed by weekly binges of upto 6/7g over the couse of a couple of days.  This persiod of heavy usage lasted around 3 months.

I did notice through to lack of sleep I would get a kind narcolepsy randomly during the day when I would totally blank out and and immediately enter almost enter a deep sleep.  I had to snap myself out of bigtime when at work!!

Another type of sleep disorder I developed was waking up totally paralysed and unable to move.  These night tremors were quite scary and after some research I found out they can be quite common with people who starve them selves of sleep due to amphetamine abuse.

Also used to notice some strange visual distortions for the day following a big binge..  The center of my vision  would 'swirl around' and become very out of focus, and at the edges of my vision there would be some fractal patterns fading in an out of site.

I have now been off the mcat for around 6 months and didnt have no problems really with quitting it.  My supply was getting a bit poor, and I felt it was right to quit - so I did.  Had a few sleepness nights, and a few close calls where I nearly got some but apart from that pretty easy sailing.


----------



## EFC18

In my opinion the most addictive aspect if Mcat is the price. When legal in this country, if you bought bulk, you could get 80% pure for £3 a gram which is just an insane price, very much like when coke first came onto the scene decades ago. It's very very difficult to resist when it's sitting there waiting for you.


----------



## AlkaloidsEye

hey there sighhill  any more reports on your friend?  Hopefully she is doing alright.

  I'm in agreement with lady codone.  I would not mix mephedrone with other stimulants.  Some of the speed freaks might be ok with combinations, but i do recommend against that course of action.


----------



## biocloudy

Had a interesting reaction to 4-mmc recently. I am 90kg, consumed 450mg 4-mmc orally and am fairly experienced with 4-mmc and other stimulants. Within two hours I developed uvulitis (the ball in your throat, extremely swollen). The next day the uvulitis persisted and I assumed it was related to dehydration. After treating for dehydration for two days the uvulitis did not pass. NSAIDS helped, but did not quite solve the issue. I tested my  blood counts to ruled out infection. After three days of uvulitis I started myself on a regime of Prednisone and the uvulitis subsided immediately. I am of the opinion that the uvulitis was viral and unrelated to the 4-mmc, but wanted to see if anyone else had similar experiences.


----------



## biocloudy

Follow up to my last report regarding uvulitis. After a week all symptoms passed and medication was discontinued. 4-MMC was tested again, same dose and similar conditions did not result in a recurrence.


----------



## commanderK-hole

ive recently had 60 day binge on 4-MMC (i realize my irresponsibiliy and i plan on never touching the substance again) and its been about four days since i last dosed....I want to say first that i have never had discolouration, but i did strain a jaw muscle and had to recover from that for three weeks, my muscles ache and i fainted once from a massive dissasociating vasospasm, i also shit blood on the last day of my binging as my favorite way to consume drone is to eat it(i also plugged about 8times and it was beautiful)  that is not to say though ihadnt snorted massive amounts. Sometimes 600mg at once went up my nose and i have discoverd a hole inside my left nostril, its healing nicely... but my largest concern is that the last four days of my binge my spine and joints began to ache and so far my spine has been killing me. it feels like the discs between my vertabrea have worn down almost like they are grinding..ive had back pain issues all my life but this is keeping me from sleeping through the night..ive made arrangements to see my Doctor this week though im not sure she will be able to do much.

side note: i reccomend anybody wanting to try this substance to seriously reconsider..


----------



## ColtDan

60 day binge.. what the fuck.

people need to develop some control and self respect for their well being. thats stupid crazy behavior. wouldn't be surprised if your heart is fucked after that


----------



## pofacedhoe

think about it- that would mean no sleep, what is more likely was excessive daily use. even speed freaks take breaks to sleep and eat.

still 600mg in one go is brutal

all in all a really nasty drug


----------



## Xamkou

I'm sure 60 days was a typo and he meant 6. :D


----------



## EFC18

commanderK-hole said:


> ive recently had 60 day binge on 4-MMC (i realize my irresponsibiliy and i plan on never touching the substance again) and its been about four days since i last dosed....I want to say first that i have never had discolouration, but i did strain a jaw muscle and had to recover from that for three weeks, my muscles ache and i fainted once from a massive dissasociating vasospasm, i also shit blood on the last day of my binging as my favorite way to consume drone is to eat it(i also plugged about 8times and it was beautiful)  that is not to say though ihadnt snorted massive amounts. Sometimes 600mg at once went up my nose and i have discoverd a hole inside my left nostril, its healing nicely... but my largest concern is that the last four days of my binge my spine and joints began to ache and so far my spine has been killing me. it feels like the discs between my vertabrea have worn down almost like they are grinding..ive had back pain issues all my life but this is keeping me from sleeping through the night..ive made arrangements to see my Doctor this week though im not sure she will be able to do much.
> 
> side note: i reccomend anybody wanting to try this substance to seriously reconsider..



60 day binge?
that is just insane


----------



## sackynut

^yeah after like 30 hours of no sleep i start to just fall asleep uncontrollably, regardless of how many lines of drone i take.


----------



## elpango

*this shit*

My mate and i took it for about 4-5 months at least twice a week and a few nights ago we got on it, and he had about a gram snorted in to his body, ended up having a seizer and taken to hospital. They said he was close  to have a heart attack and hes a healthy young guy were never doing it again every one needs to sort it out.


----------



## sarinana

Hi!!
It's been 8 months or so since Ive seen meph last but i still get random patches of skin that turn pink, especially my knuckles. Has anyone experienced this? 
Also I experience dull aching pain in the left side of my chest and armpit. Ive seen a doctor 6 months ago because I kept feeling lightheaded at work and because of my chest pain. Had blood test done said I have thick blood but everything else was fine. Didn't take any other test cause according to my doctor if the pains were serious I'd definitely be in a hospital already and she diagnosed me with anxiety. Has anyone experienced anything similar? not sure what to do. Probably gonna go to see GP again and this time ask for a ultrasound and other tests myself... Im 20 and used to be a very healthy female before touching that s***...


----------



## Nagelfar

Xamkou said:


> I'm sure 60 days was a typo and he meant 6. :D



I can confirm individual's staying up on N-methylamphetamine 22 days to a month straight. By "binge", a session followed through completely while awake may not be what's meant. Though I myself have personally done so upwards of ten days in a row on two separate occasions with no sleep whatsoever. I doubt I ever recovered fully, but it is possible. 60 does seem excessive though.



sackynut said:


> ^yeah after like 30 hours of no sleep i start to just fall asleep uncontrollably, regardless of how many lines of drone i take.



Nasal absorption is compromised after some while, but if one were mainlining it, I could imagine a month gone without sleep, I've seen it done on other substances. Such might require some sensitization to sleep deprivation however.


----------



## CharlotteDuffy93

I don't know about anybody else, but the more that I do Drone over time, my memory has been effected and my concentration span. At the end of a night on it, I chose one of my friends films to take home and watch for the comedown, I picked up 'The Others' to take back with me being totally convinced that it was 'The Sixth Sense', got home, put the film on and half an hour into it I turned to someone and said 'well where is Bruce Willis then', and until he told me it wasn't the film I thought, I had no clue it was The others ha. And on other occasions I get confused with my speech and my thought trails are just non-existant ha, that, or it takes me absolutely ages to think of a particular word I want to use. Weird. Just wondering if anyone else becomes as brain dead as me?? :L


----------



## Br1tannia

CharlotteDuffy93 said:


> I don't know about anybody else, but the more that I do Drone over time, my memory has been effected and my concentration span. At the end of a night on it, I chose one of my friends films to take home and watch for the comedown, I picked up 'The Others' to take back with me being totally convinced that it was 'The Sixth Sense', got home, put the film on and half an hour into it I turned to someone and said 'well where is Bruce Willis then', and until he told me it wasn't the film I thought, I had no clue it was The others ha. And on other occasions I get confused with my speech and my thought trails are just non-existant ha, that, or it takes me absolutely ages to think of a particular word I want to use. Weird. Just wondering if anyone else becomes as brain dead as me?? :L


I used mephedrone a couple times a week for a few months back when it was legal and my memory is really terrible. 2 years later and it hasnt improved in the slightest, really evil drug


----------



## Br1tannia

I still suffer from poor memory and HPPD from mephedrone use over 2 years ago, get random patches people talk about on my hands and stuff too. My friend almost died from snorting 1g within the space of around 1- 2 minutes, stupid dose i know but its fucking pure evil this drug. never take it, the side effects out weigh the negatives a billion to one


----------



## CharlotteDuffy93

Really, not at all an improvement? Care to elaborate?


----------



## itsallamyth

right, honest and i mean honest report here, been on this shit for about 3 years now, so far no negative side effects apart from the binging addictiveness it has, but i always eat when on it and always stick to one night seshs, but done nd seen done many a time 2 to 3 gram lines with hardly any effect , dont even no why i still take it apart from the stimmy effect i need to stay awake, apart from that its now shit drug with no euphoria just awakeness


----------



## Heroic

A common misconception with 4-mmc is the factor of smell. Most people assume that the stronger the smell - the better the batch. Wrong. The ideal batch would have a really weak or hardly any smell at all, the strong smell comes from residual bromine left in the synthesis, that WILL fuck up your heart and increase the compulsive redosing.

Basically - Less Smell = Safer and more controllable.


----------



## pofacedhoe

Heroic said:


> A common misconception with 4-mmc is the factor of smell. Most people assume that the stronger the smell - the better the batch. Wrong. The ideal batch would have a really weak or hardly any smell at all, the strong smell comes from residual bromine left in the synthesis, that WILL fuck up your heart and increase the compulsive redosing.
> 
> Basically - Less Smell = Safer and more controllable.



or its just a drug that is bad for your heart generally/ the metabolites produced...


----------



## sn23

Sniffing pure bromine will really get you hooked 

Yes, smells are often an indicator for dirty / badly neutralized compounds. But people seem to love their stuff reeking of solvents, amines and whatnot...


----------



## sekio

Given that the smell of meph is often described as "fishy" or "pistachio" like, I would wager what you're smelling is either left over _methylamine_ (fishy-smell) or _4-methylpropiophenone/4-methylbenzaldehyde_ (pistachio). Elemental bromine wouldn't hang around in the end product - and it stinks in a totally different way from MeAm and the ketones. Think like chlorine or iodine.

But as Heroic says, pure mephedrone shouldn't have a smell.


----------



## aattc

*long term side effects*



sarinana said:


> Hi!!
> It's been 8 months or so since Ive seen meph last but i still get random patches of skin that turn pink, especially my knuckles. Has anyone experienced this?
> Also I experience dull aching pain in the left side of my chest and armpit. Ive seen a doctor 6 months ago because I kept feeling lightheaded at work and because of my chest pain. Had blood test done said I have thick blood but everything else was fine. Didn't take any other test cause according to my doctor if the pains were serious I'd definitely be in a hospital already and she diagnosed me with anxiety. Has anyone experienced anything similar? not sure what to do. Probably gonna go to see GP again and this time ask for a ultrasound and other tests myself... Im 20 and used to be a very healthy female before touching that s***...



long term side effects i got and still have:
ANXIETY
DEPRESSION
MEMORY LOSS (forgotten child hood memories, stuff that happened during the time i was taking the drug, and stuff that happens now)

2 years later... still got all of the above.
and i dont react the same to other drugs any more, which is also a shame.

and i also agree with the guy below who said he feels like he doesn't have to breathe, or like he doesn't breath any air.
also when i start drinking even after just one drink my heart will be beating really fast, for hours and i'll be really shakey.


----------



## haveyoufoundgod

me and a few of my friends used to buy this shit a couple years back in packages of two 1g capsules of a white powder called 'plant food' when mephedrone was in the area. one of my friends with a mild heart murmur did a few lines and i watched as her motor coordination and ability to form a coherent sentence rapidly deteriorated over the next few hours. she stayed with a friend till he left for school then got dropped off at her house and entirely lost the ability to move and probably on the verge of heart failure or heart attack or something and was like that for an hour before her mom came in to say goodbye before work and got her medical attention.
i personally have blown up to roughly 2g in a night and been physically fine for the most part, i did have realistic hallucinations that my two friends were sitting behind me murmuring things about whatever came on tv in a language i recognized as english but when i tried to listen it was distorted and mostly meaningless. i would be genuinely surprised when i turned to ask them what they were saying and there was nobody there, even though i came home alone.


----------



## MeDieViL

Its clear that the blue knees have nothing to do with vasoconstriction as confirmed by hospitals, it looks like exactly like lupus, i wonder wheter it brings out underlying lupus (wich flephedrone did for me, witch as result that every stim brings up a flare up) or wheter its specific drug induced lupus that only occurs with meph and resolved after a weeks.

There are some indications that benzo's can reverse lupus, this is confirmed by me and a few other anecdotal reports as they allow the body to deactivity the excessive immume cells, after taking seroquel i noticed that benzo's did not help (it causes drug induced lupus) and further research indicates its indeed caused by a differened mechanism.
In my experience quercetine dramatically reduces the lupus i get from stims too so thats worth a try.


----------



## rizmatter

I was a major stoner from age of 15. Then late in my 17th year as a human being i found meph..
I Can't smoke weed anymore - it reacts horribly with my head. The veins on my temples (running past my ears) feel very uncomfortable, suicidal thoughts ('i should just kill myself') intermittently come and go and my hearing gets worse.
All in all just a very disagreeable experience.
Anyone else? i only smoked the dankest of the dankest buds but i'm sure it'd happen with any old thai too.

P.s I never get suicidal thoughts


----------



## AminoAcid

haveyoufoundgod said:


> on the verge of heart failure or heart attack



Not surprising, the second most commonly reported negative effect of mephedrone (first is headaches) is heart palpitations. 

Meet 4-methylephedrine (a well known cardiotoxin):






Now compare that to mephedrone:






Fun times.


----------



## Heroic

^That's somewhat disturbing, but even small differences can make a, well, difference. Not saying it isn't true though.

What I've noticed is the light-headedness and heart racing out of nowhere. But still I can't attribute all of it to mephedrone in specific, since I was abusing both MDMA and street amphetamine at that period. No good either way.

Months after, I feel normal. And it feels weird.


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## pillboxskid

Basicly my experience with the old drone was one of talkative sense of well being. A marked increase in sexual arousel.The only thing that stopped me using was the comedowns.Unless i had opiates to hand and i mean plenty the comedown was to depressing and anxiety provoking.Benzo.,s qwelled the comedown a little but the negatives out weighed the posotives come the end of a session im afraid.


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## hjalmar

nuke said:


> I really don't think this drug is safe.  Not sure why it was ever chosen to be produced.  I'm sure the person who discovered this and mass marketed it is out there on the internet since that's where it's mostly available, so tell us some day.



I can answer that question.The person who discovered it had nothing to do with its marketing. It was back in the days of the Hive, around 2003, a young British chemist was bored and decided to synthesize a legal cathinone derivative from a common solvent that he had at hand as the precursor. He tried it and reported on it, you can find it back in the Hive archives, his user name was Kinetic. I remember him telling me on irc that it was a "boring stimulant" but he couldn't stop binging on it, sometimes for days on end.

About five years later some entreprising vendor must have remembered Kinetic's reports and started selling it, opening Pandora's box.

EDIT:
here it is, you need Tor to access:
http://y47ylcppnh3afqk4.onion/the-hive.ws/novel/000423945.html


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## hjalmar

dread said:


> It would not be a PEA, what they're talking about is unreacted alpha-bromo-4-methylpropiophenone, ie. mephedrone with a bromine in place of the methylamine, not mephedrone with a bromine _and_ an amine.
> 
> I don't know the details of mephedrone synthesis, but IIRC the non-ring-methylated version (a-bromopropiophenone) can be used to make methcathinone. So if mephedrone is similarily made from the 4-methyl version, it would be reasonable to assume that unreacted paramethyl-alphabromo-propiophenone would be in the product as an impurity after a sloppy synth.
> 
> I don't think it would be psychoactive, but very probably toxic.



Alpha-bromo/chloroketones are powerful lachrymators (think MACE, or alpha-chloroacetophenone) so one would notice even small amounts of this compound as an impurity. They would indeed be toxic due to the fact that they are alkylators, eg they can react with DNA. But I somehow doubt its presence, as it is easily removed from the end-product.


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## Professer

Heroic said:


> ^That's somewhat disturbing, but even small differences can make a, well, difference. Not saying it isn't true though.
> 
> What I've noticed is the light-headedness and heart racing out of nowhere. But still I can't attribute all of it to mephedrone in specific, since I was abusing both MDMA and street amphetamine at that period. No good either way.
> 
> Months after, I feel normal. And it feels weird.



I did MDMA the other night, then some mephedrone throughout the next day. Eventually was getting weird light-headed mini waves of energy/rushes.

Huh.


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## sekio

> Eventually was getting weird light-headed mini waves of energy/rushes.



Did you eat anything during your little binge? Sounds to me like your blood sugar was so low you couldn't maintain a stable blood pressure.

"Light headed mini waves of energy" are usually a sign of e.g. postural hypotension or acute vasodilation associated with, for instance, cannabis consumption (causing "rushes" etc). In more severe cases they lead to whiteouts/fainting.


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## Professer

I tried to eat. Didn't manage much.


This was my first time trying mephedrone. Seemed alright, kind of an enjoyable stim by my standards. Didn't do more than 500-600mg over the night via repeated rectal doses. Would maybe try it once more. Not too fond of some of the possible metabolites and neurotoxicity I've been reading about.


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## Limpet_Chicken

Aren't alpha-alkyl halides, fluorides excluded, being such a molecular thylacoleo of the halogen world, and with such a death-grip formed by the C-F bond, are as sekio said alkylating agents, and worse, scarily close to nitrogen mustards?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlormethiazole Even this, an alky terminal ethyl chloride is pretty scary looking in a bioactive molecule used as a medication. It looks carcinogenic, or hepatotoxic. Yet apparently via cytochrome P450-2e1 acts to counteract  oxidative EtOH induced stress by inhibitor at this antitarget.

How does this occur? acting as a scavenger? does the relocation of beta to alpha carbon chain halide drastically decrease alkylating, mustard agent type potential? I thought the opposite was true for at least the SAR of nitrogen mustards.

Chlormethiazole does work wonders for seizures though, almost completely suppresses my myoclonic seizures.


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## sekio

Primary alkyl halides are reactive, sure, but they aren't anything like nitrogen mustards. Especially the larger alkyl groups.

Nitrogen and sulfur mustards are especially toxic because the presence of a tertiary amine or sulfide can make a reactive intermediate. Plain old alkyl halides need a bit of effort to make them react.

Also, primary alkyl halides are the most stable. Stability is usually F >>> Cl >> Br > I and reactivity goes the opposite way.


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## EarthBounded

Had awful thought process for months after 2 month binge... About 3 years clean completely normal


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## EarthBounded

I once saw Drone temporarily cure a Lazy eye also it was the wierdest thing in the world dude was super happy for about 23 minutes.

Wierdest shit I ever saw


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## Limpet_Chicken

Yes, I know. IIRC the vesicant properties of sulfur, nitrogen and   oxygen mustards depend on being able to produce a highly reactive cyclic onium ion that can alkylate DNA and other tissue left right and center.


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## rickolasnice

MeDieViL said:


> Its clear that the blue knees have nothing to do with vasoconstriction as confirmed by hospitals, it looks like exactly like lupus, i wonder wheter it brings out underlying lupus (wich flephedrone did for me, witch as result that every stim brings up a flare up) or wheter its specific drug induced lupus that only occurs with meph and resolved after a weeks.
> 
> There are some indications that benzo's can reverse lupus, this is confirmed by me and a few other anecdotal reports as they allow the body to deactivity the excessive immume cells, after taking seroquel i noticed that benzo's did not help (it causes drug induced lupus) and further research indicates its indeed caused by a differened mechanism.
> In my experience quercetine dramatically reduces the lupus i get from stims too so thats worth a try.



I know this is an old post but.. no way..

I experience blue / purple knees on most stimulants but only after i've been up for 2 or more days.. My experience of purple knees sounds nothing like lupas.. I get none of the lupas symptoms.. It's clearly a circulatory issue.


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## pofacedhoe

rickolasnice said:


> I know this is an old post but.. no way..
> 
> I experience blue / purple knees on most stimulants but only after i've been up for 2 or more days.. My experience of purple knees sounds nothing like lupas.. I get none of the lupas symptoms.. It's clearly a circulatory issue.



MeDieViL is no fan of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor thought you would have noticed by now

what i mean is its not enough to have a simple obvious explanation (vassoconstriction), a far more extreme one must be concocted though i would love to measure oxygen saturation when someone has had a three day meph binge as breathlessness was a huge syptom of mine. my guess is it would be abnormally low. am i a hypocrite? hehehehehe...


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## MeDieViL

Im not referring to the normal vasoconstriction after a amp binge wich i get too, i refer to hospitalised ppl where no oxygen issues are found with semi permanent blue knees after taking mephedrone, should have been more clear.

^^Are your knees still blue? well thats why you had vasoconstriction otherwise it wouldnt make sense, thats all im saying


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## Catfish92

I'm really not surprised that people that people are having such negative effects to drone by looking at the posts on the thread, I mean weekly binges of 2-3 days is brain numbingly stupid. I use drone occasionally and have had no negative effects other than the day proceeding. I treat drone like MDMA and leave month gaps between sessions, 3 weeks minimum, and this isn't every month, or every three weeks. I get really high quality drone and use between 300-600mg over a 10-12 hour session. I know how moreish it is and that is why I never buy too much at once and by the time we have run out it is 6 in the morning and a stupid time to call our guy. When I start coming down (due to it all being used) I crave more, but unlike a lot of people on this thread I have self control. Deal with the comedown, a few beers a bit of weed and a cup of tea and the craving stops and sleeping becomes a possibility. Also when the comedown is in full swing the next day I treat it just like I do on a MDMA comedown, I eat as soon as I get up, which I know is the last thing you wanna do on drone or md, but it really sorts you out, I stay hydrated and stay active, by doing this my drone comedowns only last until mid afternoon (same with md). What  am really getting at is if you use it responsibly and have some self control, it really isn't that bad.


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## ebola?

Yeah...everyone here knows this.  The question is, why does mephedrone have a set of unique after-effects when compared to other stimulants used in excess?

ebola


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## Catfish92

ebola? said:


> Yeah...everyone here knows this.  The question is, why does mephedrone have a set of unique after-effects when compared to other stimulants used in excess?
> 
> ebola



Yes I know, but a lot of people are acknowledging the unique after effects from excess use and therefore concluding that people should stay away from it entirely. I have a friend who takes way too much of this stuff and the effects on occasion have been horrible, anyone who has done or is doing drone in excess needs to kick it. My scientific ability is terrible so I can't really go into that. However if this is any help a lot of the mental effects excess drone use has had on my friend are similar to excess use of mdma. The same friend went on a week long binge on mdma, which is foolish I know. These effects being depression (as severe as threatening suicide), inability to feel happy and a self destructive attitude. The mental effects on my friend have been much more severe than the physical ones, he has suffered from discoloured joints, and weight loss, but the mental effects seem much more severe on his account. This is the only reason I was pointing out/recommending treating drone like MDMA if people are going to use it.


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## Si Dread

I'm reckon even without obvious health risks (& I'd dispute that), with a drug as compulsive as Mephedrone, the "stay away entirely" advice is pretty good advice.


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## Catfish92

Si Ingwe said:


> I'm reckon even without obvious health risks (& I'd dispute that), with a drug as compulsive as Mephedrone, the "stay away entirely" advice is pretty good advice.



For some I would completely agree, but for people who have used other substances and found it easy to keep the usage of these other substances in moderation the 'stay away completely' advice is maybe a bit too forward. I would never recommend drone being a first stimulant for somebody to try, it was my first, but thankfully I haven't got an addictive personality when it comes to drugs and alcohol.


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## Si Dread

but I am afraid that describes my pre-meph drugs life perfectly. I was convinced I did not have an adictive personality. I had no compulsion to use ANY drug I ever came across regularly until I came across Meph. I wont ever take it again!


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## pofacedhoe

MeDieViL said:


> Im not referring to the normal vasoconstriction after a amp binge wich i get too, i refer to hospitalised ppl where no oxygen issues are found with semi permanent blue knees after taking mephedrone, should have been more clear.
> 
> ^^Are your knees still blue? well thats why you had vasoconstriction otherwise it wouldnt make sense, thats all im saying



no that resolved itself when the drugs effect wore off.

other people i know had it resolve as well.

^^ meph is the most addictive drug i have ever tried and it really is bad for you


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## theonlyfox

I know this thread is old but it seems somewhat active still. 

Had about 1-2g to myself in one night and my friend had about 3-6g spread across a couple days. 

No side effects that I've never seen before with other drugs, just slight shallow breath, dilated pupils, sweats, cold, and the fucking pain from snorting it haha, except I was smoking MPA with weed (legal mdma) yeah I know it's BS but it's all we had and I was fine, it was a weird mix because I don't know if the feed was being intensified by this legal MDMA or what and I was also told not to smoke weed with meph but again, no issues. 

Going to sleep was a bit weird and I suppose I was seeing weird stuff in my head. 

But it's been a couple weeks now and I find that I'm not as hungry as I usually am, although I haven't been to the gym in maybe 2 weeks so that May have something to do with it because I'm used to getting hungry from my workouts.


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## SONN

so whats the consensus, it's less neurotoxic than MDMA? worse for you than amphetamine? methamphetamine?

fun?


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## Burn it up

Apparently mephedrone is non neurotoxic [1][2].

Regarding if it is "worse" for you than meth or amp it all depends on the consumption pattern, though it seems to have some concerning peripheral effects at high doses or chronic use.

And yes, it is fun.


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## klfiend

Your articles states that mephedrone is not neurotoxic to dopaminergic neurons.  I would still wager mephedrone bitch slaps the serotonergic neurotransmission system.


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## MagickalKat777

klfiend said:


> Your articles states that mephedrone is not neurotoxic to dopaminergic neurons.  I would still wager mephedrone bitch slaps the serotonergic neurotransmission system.



As would I, especially since mephedrone brings out the brain zaps just like SSRI discontinuation syndrome and over doing MDMA.

In regards to overall toxicity, 4-methylephedrine is pretty bad for your heart and its the primary metabolite of mephedrone if I remember correctly.

On the same token though, mephedrone leads to binging like no other... I mean I went on multi-day binges with the stuff when I had pretty much unlimited access to the 99% cylinder crystal that was going around. In that respect, it was less of an overall effect than MDMA as I would have been in a world of hurt very quickly with too much MDMA.


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## EarthBounded

4 Years clean off Mephedrone myself, I ingested about 14 grams within a month or two which was pretty low compared to what I saw others taking. The side effects hit about a month after I quit and lasted for one year it was fucking awful, I can see how someone would actually kill themselves after to much drone.

After 4 years I feel zero side effects remain


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## Originaldetangler

This is such an old thread, so no idea If anyone will reply .  Been using mephedrone for the last year about 3 times a month. Bombing 200mgish a time probably getting through a gram Initially cos was the nicest feeling I had ever experienced , and it still is , but then started to experience palpitations and panic as the drug was wearing off. . My HR would go up to around 100bpm so not crazy fast but would get worried and also seemed to correspond with really tight stomach bloating . I wonder if bombing was causing the stomach upset and that was contributing to the palpitations.  But also just a real belief that I will die at that moment . Altho no chest pain or breathlessness , just a dread and palpitations.
Also sort of feel like I'm now super sensitive to stims. Altho have had ekg and doctors visits and everything is fine . Most likely thing is I've just exacerbated my existing anxiety, but have this preoccupation that I've sort of given myself some sort of heart problem. Has anyone had any experience of directly related heart issues from mephedrone use ?
The memory thing too I get.
My other feeling is that prolonged meph use just messes with your head and makes you a sort of hysteric hyperchodriac .
I mean now I just sit around googling "mephedrone + palpitations " or "mephedrone + panic " .
Has anyone experienced anything similar? It used to be perfect when I did it . No real comedown,  would be able to be social.  But then I spose in lockdown it became more of a thing where would do it with my gf and think you tend to redose more with other people! And feel like once it started to make me worry it's just game over for it . Hopefully this makes some sense,  I'm quite tired !

EDIT :

I've had periods of obsessively worrying about my memory before so I could imagine this is just anxiety.  I spose the only thing is the palpitations,  which I've never had from stims before.  Or at least ever like meph.  Not even wild ones , just the fact that they sort of come on with a sense of dread when I'm sobering up. Lots of sort of 7am quielty drinking a cup of tea whilst my gf speaks in soothing tones . They're made better completely by 5mg of valium but always worry about mixing stims with valium


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## plumbus-nine

Originaldetangler said:


> but then started to experience palpitations and panic as the drug was wearing off. . My HR would go up to around 100bpm so not crazy fast but would get worried and also seemed to correspond with really tight stomach bloating .


This is from a metabolite (4-methylephedrine maybe), with 3-mmc it's even worse.. like an overdose on nasal decongestants. Might be possible to directly antagonize the effects with an alpha blocker or even clonidine but my last time mephe is years ago - I liked it as much as I hated the after effects so switched to another, very addictive and possibly toxic drug class, the dissociatives..


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## Zephyn

Ten years later and im still not right. There was maybe 6 years i felt decent in between, but then I met other hard-core stimulants, but I bet I'm more prone to the side effects from them from my mephedrone days, I spent at least 4 years, 2 of which were very bad,, seriously suffering from mephedrone abuse


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## Originaldetangler

plumbus-nine said:


> This is from a metabolite (4-methylephedrine maybe), with 3-mmc it's even worse.. like an overdose on nasal decongestants. Might be possible to directly antagonize the effects with an alpha blocker or even clonidine but my last time mephe is years ago - I liked it as much as I hated the after effects so switched to another, very addictive and possibly toxic drug class, the dissociatives..


I had been just telling myself it was anxiety because it didnt used to happen and seemed to correspond with when I became more anxious in life, but this sort of worries me and def puts me off trying it again.  Hope I havent wrecked my heart . Can never tell how afraid of palpitations to be .



Originaldetangler said:


> I had been just telling myself it was anxiety because it didnt used to happen and seemed to correspond with when I became more anxious in life, but this sort of worries me and def puts me off trying it again.  Hope I havent wrecked my heart . Can never tell how afraid of palpitations to be .


I mean cos it didnt used to have that effect,  hence why worrying I've ruined myself somehow . Altho also might have just been using less beforehand


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## Ganjcat

Just putting this question out their for my own curiosity it might also help it might also sound a bit weird but have any past or present mephedrone users had any trouble with a painful stinging sensation when peeing? Or just not being able to go and peeing causing some sort of pain since using this drug?


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## Tramalala

Originaldetangler said:


> This is such an old thread, so no idea If anyone will reply .  Been using mephedrone for the last year about 3 times a month. Bombing 200mgish a time probably getting through a gram Initially cos was the nicest feeling I had ever experienced , and it still is , but then started to experience palpitations and panic as the drug was wearing off. . My HR would go up to around 100bpm so not crazy fast but would get worried and also seemed to correspond with really tight stomach bloating . I wonder if bombing was causing the stomach upset and that was contributing to the palpitations.  But also just a real belief that I will die at that moment . Altho no chest pain or breathlessness , just a dread and palpitations.
> Also sort of feel like I'm now super sensitive to stims. Altho have had ekg and doctors visits and everything is fine . Most likely thing is I've just exacerbated my existing anxiety, but have this preoccupation that I've sort of given myself some sort of heart problem. Has anyone had any experience of directly related heart issues from mephedrone use ?
> The memory thing too I get.
> My other feeling is that prolonged meph use just messes with your head and makes you a sort of hysteric hyperchodriac .
> I mean now I just sit around googling "mephedrone + palpitations " or "mephedrone + panic " .
> Has anyone experienced anything similar? It used to be perfect when I did it . No real comedown,  would be able to be social.  But then I spose in lockdown it became more of a thing where would do it with my gf and think you tend to redose more with other people! And feel like once it started to make me worry it's just game over for it . Hopefully this makes some sense,  I'm quite tired !
> 
> EDIT :
> 
> I've had periods of obsessively worrying about my memory before so I could imagine this is just anxiety.  I spose the only thing is the palpitations,  which I've never had from stims before.  Or at least ever like meph.  Not even wild ones , just the fact that they sort of come on with a sense of dread when I'm sobering up. Lots of sort of 7am quielty drinking a cup of tea whilst my gf speaks in soothing tones . They're made better completely by 5mg of valium but always worry about mixing stims with valium


Sorry you got those effects mate. Obviously you should quit doing it for atleast a long time and probably better forever. I don't know why you would be worried about mixing stims with valium though. Ofcourse benzos are addictive in their own right but if you use stims sporadically and then use a benzo for the comedown you should be completely fine. People experiencing a stimulant overdose actually get benzos in the hospital. I'd argue it's better to use a benzo on the comedown than not. The overstimulation from the metabolites are probably giving you the anxiety and putting strain on your heart, valium will prevent a part of that atleast!


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## Tramalala

Are you using an old mephedrone batch @Originaldetangler or is there still mephedrone being produced and sold? I was under the impression most of that died down when it got banned. Same for Methylone.


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## Originaldetangler

Tramalala said:


> Are you using an old mephedrone batch @Originaldetangler or is there still mephedrone being produced and sold? I was under the impression most of that died down when it got banned. Same for Methylone.


Its allegedly mephedrone ! And recently produced . I've got two sources of what purports to be mephedrone which was using, and both gave me no bother in the slightest until last October when I got palps and a panic attack , and then ever since then I've always had this palpitation / panic thing . Its like everything is fine and then the palps start. But not like sweating or weird breathing.  Still feel fairly chilled in my body . Just sort of trembly and palpitationy.  Reminds me of the feeling of having done too many blasts on my asthma inhaler . Also seemed to correspond really directly with a change in my stomach, that started the same week in october I got the first panic attack. Not sure if at that point
A) the meph changed (unlikely )
B) I tipping point fucked my heart and mechanism (what I'm most worried about)
C) I had such a traumatic panic attack that the sense memory of it sets off the palps now every time, even when I'm trying to keep calm at all costs . It was a horrible horrible experience the panic attack in October. Was trying to find a room in the flat that I thought would be the least sad for my body to be discovered in, so was just walking up and down the hall on the phone to the doctor and then the ambulance,  although when they got there my heart rate was only like 107.


Yeah probably best thing is to lay off for a good stretch / forever , which I'm doing . Don't really like the wonderful mcat experience being concluded with a sort of woozy terror section! Just annoying that it seems to be something that wont work itself out , and probably spells the end of doing mcat for me. Which I spose is no great shame! I think the problem probably was also exacerbated by the fact that I used to do quite small amounts socially.  Noone would even know I was on it tbh just a nice warm glow,  but then in lockdown got into redosing more. Just a shame cos I feel like I've sort of "ruined it". Altho maybe with things like this you will always reach a point where it's best to knock it on the head ! 
Maybe I'll try and again with a small amount next winter.  Altho I spose maybe I'll find a different way to feel happy and calm and warm and pleasant by then !


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## Gaffy

Nuke


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