# the NBA playoffs



## axl blaze

can't believe a thread hasn't already been started, I know BL's basketball heads run deeper than that.

an interesting story has emerged in the East. will Boston even be able to beat a Chicago Bulls team that finally has the size below to go along with Derrick Rose? it seems that without Keving Garnett, the Celtics look sluggish and old. if you win the first game in a NBA playoff game, the chances of you winning that series are greatly increased. can the Celtics-without-KG beat empirical evidence?

staying with the East, the top dogs look to be the Orlando Magic and the Cleveland Cavs. both are doing as expected, so early in the playoffs. LeBron James and Dwight Howard are the most entertaining athletes to watch in this conference.

what is missed is the kill or be killed, fierce basketball styles shown off by Kevin Garnett. any word when he will be back?

in the West, the Rockets look very solid, and they are without star Tracy McGrady. look how good they are when Yao Ming isn't injured.

above all, the Lakers look like the team to beat in both conferences. they are relatively healthy and playing good basketball all around the board.

but this is the NBA playoffs. and the beauty of this sport on such an elevated professional level, is that momentum and "getting hot" are the ultimate playoff monkeys.

catch these monkeys and you've got the whole season... 

who does everybody have? the Lakers, the Cavs, the Magic, and maybe even the Rockets all have viable shots.

in my opinion.


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## nowdubnvr6

im pullin for the jazz only cause i went to junior high and high school with ronnie brewer. But if they dont got it the Cavs are just maming people this year


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## axl blaze

yeah, I kinda forgot about the Jazz. they are a presence to be reckoned with in the West, and an impressive home court winning percentage. 

I don't think the Cavs are such a sure lock - despite as much of a Cavs fan that I am.

they have a good chance, though. is getting Mo Williams all Cleveland needed to do to be championship caliber team?


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## nowdubnvr6

I dunno if it was just Mo williams or Lebron developing other parts of his game. Ive never seen him play as much strong D as this year. Illgauskas is playing great ball too snagging a lot of boards and being a strong low post player on offense. I think its maturity as a team.


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## jeef

the jazz are impressive at home, but 1-19 on the road is horrible and wont get them very far in the playoffs. im a huge lakers fan so ive obviously picked them to win, but even tho they look fierce and determined at times, they tend to lose focus a lot and allow their opponents to come back into the game. for that reason, im a little bit doubtful theyll take it all. hopefully last years ass-whooping by the celtics will remind them to play hard at all times.

as much as i want to see the lakers get revenge on the celtics, i dont see them making it back to the finals w/o KG...and holy shit derrick rose was amazing in game1 ! especially for a rookie...in his first playoff game...against a team that prides itself on defense (although im sure the results wouldve been different if KG had been there). right now tho, its looking like a lakers-cavs finals matchup. it doesnt really seem like anyone can challenge the lakers or the cavs until then, but im ok with that. kobe vs bron is a matchup i would love to watch.

...as for KG, ive heard multiple things about the injury. it seems like theres a very small chance hell be back in time for the playoffs, and he might even get surgery and for sure miss them altogether. either way, the celtics are definitely missing that craziness and fierce competitiveness that he brought. kinda makes u wonder if someone other than pierce deserved that finals mvp...


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## papa

the spurs and the mavericks played game one saturday. the spurs lost   

they play game 2 tonight at 8:30 central time.  What if the mavericks beat them again tonight?  I really think that is possible. I live in san antonio  and I like the spurs, but they are weak without manu ginobli.


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## deeCee

As people would know, I freeking love the Jazz, but I just can't see them pulling a game in LA. Especially playing a team with a star SG, we just can't defend that position very well.


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## L O V E L I F E

axl blaze said:


> *
> is getting Mo Williams all Cleveland needed to do to be championship caliber team?*



No.

Spending the summer playing with Kobe each and every day taught LeBron that he owes it to HIMSELF to try his absolute hardest ALL THE FUCKING TIME.

THAT is BY FAR the biggest reason LeBron has improved so much, AND why the Cavs have a legitimate shot to win it all, despite LeBron having a pedestrian (VERY cohesive, but NOT particularly talented) supporting cast.

I *STILL* say that Kobe is slightly better than LeBron, and I *STILL* say that the Lakers are better than the Cavs.

But with that said, compiling a 66-16 record, with Mo Williams as your second best player, is an absolutely INCREDIBLE accomplishment for LeBron - more impressive to me than the Oscar Robertson-like stats - even more impressive than the NBA MVP he's sure to win.

Will the Cavs win it all this year?

Perhaps.

But one thing which I *CAN* confidently say NOW, which I could NOT honestly say a year ago is this:

Over the course of his career, LeBron is going to lead whatever team(s) he ends up playing for to SEVERAL titles . . . now that he has FINALLY learned to try his hardest at all times.


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## L O V E L I F E

WOW!

What a fucking game in Boston in Game Two!

Seriously, including context (the defending champions facing going down 0-2, HEADING TO CHICAGO, WITHOUT KEVIN GARNETT), this was one of the best fourth quarters I've seen in a long time.

I love this game!


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## Johnny blue

L O V E L I F E said:


> WOW!
> 
> What a fucking game in Boston in Game Two!
> 
> Seriously, including context (the defending champions facing going down 0-2, HEADING TO CHICAGO, WITHOUT KEVIN GARNETT), this was one of the best fourth quarters I've seen in a long time.
> 
> I love this game!



Word! Great game. Ben Gordon is a beast. What he have 44? Dude was lights out in the forth but, so was my boy Ray Ray. 

I'm worried about Rondo in the next game. I think he might have burnt himself out but, we'll see.

If the Celtics lose I'd like to see the bulls in the finals. Realistically I'd love to see king James beat kobe though.


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## papa

I missed a great game between the Mavericks and the Spurs.  It was on too late for my old ass to watch the whole thing.  I'm glad to see they won and they won big. But, from what I see on the sports report. the Mavericks were cold shooting all night.  A win is a win. game three in Dallas.


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## oldhead

The Sixers coming back from 18 down will be their swan song in these playoffs. No way they win this series.

GO LAKERS!!


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## axl blaze

L O V E L I F E said:


> But one thing which I *CAN* confidently say NOW, which I could NOT honestly say a year ago is this:
> 
> Over the course of his career, LeBron is going to lead whatever team(s) he ends up playing for to SEVERAL titles . . . now that he has FINALLY learned to try his hardest at all times.



interesting to hear this coming from you, of all people.

I did not know that he trained with Kobe in the offseason, though it does make sense because LBJ has developed an intangible, killer instinct this year. for the city of Cleveland's championship draught and because LBJ is an all around awesome human being, I really do want the Cavs to win.

hot damn this Boston VS Chicago series is going to be one of those great first round match-ups. Jesus Shuttleworth straight stuck Chicago with a dagger last night, making that last second three point shot and all.

Derrick Rose is going to be a future All-Star, with him shining in his first playoff appearance. does he have a shot to be the best point guard in the NBA in a couple years? I still think Chris Paul is such a magical type PG, but Derrick Rose is faster and looks to have a little more muscle.


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## L O V E L I F E

chris Paul is the greatest point guard I've seen (and I'm old enough that I've seen magic and isiah, the two best BEFORE Paul, for their entire respective careers).

Paul led the Hornets to 10 more wins than Rose "led" the Bulls to, in a MUCH better conference, and he DIDN'T have Ben Gordon on his team.

Players like Paul come around once-a-decade AT most.

Comparing Rose (even if he gets exponentially better over the course of the next few seasons) to Paul is truly insulting, and almost comical.


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## L O V E L I F E

And, Axl - LeBron played with Kobe on the Olympic team in 2008, remember?

He's been quoted as saying that "playing with the world's greatest and most intense player day in and day out" helped finally show him about how HE (LeBron) needs to step it up if he wants to take it to the next level.

And, in fairness, throughout this REGULAR SEASON, he certainly has.

Can't wait till June.

I love this game!


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## EnYAY

lakers  willwin itall


I think it will come down to the LAKERS and the CAVS

and if this does happen, i think it might be one of the BEST playoffs we have seen in MANY years.


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## Johnny blue

Well I agree it'll be a great series but, there was nothing better than watching kobe cry last year and it was my Celtics that did it. I'm a witness though and I don't see the celts making it this year so go cavs


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## Tomer

L O V E L I F E said:


> chris Paul is the greatest point guard I've seen (and I'm old enough that I've seen magic and isiah, the two best BEFORE Paul, for their entire respective careers).
> 
> Paul led the Hornets to 10 more wins than Rose "led" the Bulls to, in a MUCH better conference, and he DIDN'T have Ben Gordon on his team.
> 
> Players like Paul come around once-a-decade AT most.
> 
> Comparing Rose (even if he gets exponentially better over the course of the next few seasons) to Paul is truly insulting, and almost comical.



Dude, you should seriously just stop talking.  

I am as big a fan of the NBA as there is as anyone in this country, and your comments are absurd.  Isiah and Magic are two of the greatest point guards to ever play, and they won countless championships.

Chris Paul has won jackshit.  He is a great player, but he has a long way to go before being compared to Zeke or Magic.  Stop pretending to know the sport.


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## Tomer

And, yes, Derrick Rose is an unreal talent, and it's not that outlandish to already compare him to, dare I say, Chris Paul?  Paul is arguably the best guard in the league today, but the buck stops there.  Rose, Deron Williams, Paul, Devin Harris, Nash ( he's declining, though), these are the top guns.  But, by no means is Paul head and shoulders above them.


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## L O V E L I F E

Tomer said:


> *
> Dude, you should seriously just stop talking.
> 
> I am as big a fan of the NBA as there is as anyone in this country, and your comments are absurd.  Isiah and Magic are two of the greatest point guards to ever play, and they won countless championships.
> 
> Chris Paul has won jackshit.  He is a great player, but he has a long way to go before being compared to Zeke or Magic.  Stop pretending to know the sport.*



Sorry - I thought that watching every single play-off series that Magic and Isiah EVER played in the NBA (in addition to watching each of their respective NCAA title runs), AND watching Chris Fucking Paul **LIVE** as a Wake Forest grad almost every single game he played at Wake make me somewhat educated to the point where my opinion has some merit.

Deron Williams and Derrick Rose are both VERY VERY VERY good, Devin Harris is very good, but a shade behind the other two, and Nash, if you remove the D'Antoni seven-seconds-or-less-style and account for his utter lack of defense, shouldn't even be in the discussion.

Look at CP3's stats - he's done things that NO ONE - NOT MAGIC - NOT ISIAH - NO POINT GUARD ***EVER*** has ever accomplished in his first four seasons.

He single-handedly took a dead franchise in a dead city and revived them both, with almost no help. 

Take Paul off of the Hornets, and they're literally the WORST team in the league.

Do you even know about what he did in his last ever high school game?

Why don't YOU do some research, and come back to me with a real analysis.

If, hypothetically, the Nets called up the Hornets, and offered them Harris, Carter, and two unprotected first round picks in exchange for Paul, the Hornets brass would be laughing harder at that offer than I am currently laughing at your ignorance.


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## L O V E L I F E

22.8 PTS  (LEAGUE LEADER AMONG POINT GUARDS)	
11.0 AST (LEAGUE LEADER AMONG *EVERYONE*)
 4.7 REB
2.8  STL  (LEAGUE LEADER AMONG *EVERYONE*)

.503	FG pct (as a BARELY 6 foot point guard!)
.364 3 pt pct 
.868 FT pct

PLUS AMAZING LEADERSHIP SKILLS

PLUS THE RESPECT OF HIS TEAMMATES & COACH.

C'mon - tell me why exactly he's incomparable to Young Magic or Young Isiah (who were both AMAZING).

And Deron Williams and Derrick Rose and Devin Harris and Steve Nash?

You're embarrassing yourself.


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## Tomer

Dude, you embarrass yourself with your arrogant, ignorant views every time I see you post on these boards.  

I don't give a shit what CP3's stats are; he doesn't hold a candle to Zeke or Magic. Find me at the end of his career and then we can talk.  As of now, it's way too premature.  Do you see me saying he CAN'T exceed their dominance?  NO.  I'm just saying, at the given moment, it's a completely asinine comment to be making.

If you have been watching the game for as long as you have said you have, you clearly don't have a very good understanding of it.  Or, is it that you're a NYer and you're jaded by a Piston and Laker having infinite amounts of success?  Which is it?  

It looks like you have an obvious bias.  Well, for your sake, I hope you do.  Your knowledge is sub par.


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## L O V E L I F E

Tomer said:


> *
> Dude, you embarrass yourself with your arrogant, ignorant views every time I see you post on these boards.*




Examples, please.  



> *
> I don't give a shit what CP3's stats are; he doesn't hold a candle to Zeke or Magic.*



Why don't you care what his stats are?

How else, other than watching them and acknowledging that even with bigger, faster, quicker, stronger players guarding Paul than those who guarded young Isiah (whom I *LOVED* by the way), Paul STILL put up superior numbers *AND* lifted his putrid team even more than Isiah did his.

I'm not saying that if Paul, hypothetically, gets hit by a bus tomorrow, that his career is more impressive than Isiah's - that would be ridiculous.

I *AM* saying that through four NBA seasons, it is AT LEAST ARGUABLE that Paul is every bit as great as Magic and Isiah were THROUGH THEIR RESPECTIVE FIRST FOUR SEASONS - that's all. 

And that comparing Deron Williams/Devin Harris/Steve Nash to Paul is utterly per se RIDICULOUS!



> *
> Find me at the end of his career and then we can talk.
> 
> As of now, it's way too premature.
> 
> Do you see me saying he CAN'T exceed their dominance?
> 
> NO.
> 
> I'm just saying, at the given moment, it's a completely asinine comment to be making.*



See above.



> *
> If you have been watching the game for as long as you have said you have, you clearly don't have a very good understanding of it.*



I would *LOVE* to hear what this ridiculous statement is based upon.

Please elaborate.



> *
> Or, is it that you're a NYer and you're jaded by a Piston and Laker having infinite amounts of success?
> 
> Which is it?
> 
> It looks like you have an obvious bias.
> 
> Well, for your sake, I hope you do.*



I like and respect Magic - ALWAYS rooted for him and the Lake Show against Boston - it isn't as if the 1980's Lakers dynasty was actually the Knicks' "rival."  



> *
> Your knowledge is sub par.*



You pick the venue.

You pick the stakes.

You pick the Moderator.

I'll go mano-a-mano with you with respect to NBA knowledge anytime, anyplace, anywhere!


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## papa

tonight the spurs play the mavs in game three in dallas.  this should be a good one.  if the spurs lose this game, it will be hard for them to come back to win the series.


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## cravNbeets

you guys (mostly elle elle) really think that lebron gives his all 100% of the time?  hard to quantify i know, but i still dont get the impression that he has the competitive drive of kobe or jordan.

.02


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## GingaNinja420

Cavs are my squad and of course I want them to go all the way...Lebron James and Mo Williams? Forget about it!

Although Miami is doing their thing right now too, I got decent ambitions for them.


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## deeCee

John Stockton anyone? lol


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## L O V E L I F E

cravNbeets said:


> *
> you guys (mostly elle elle) really think that lebron gives his all 100% of the time?  hard to quantify i know, but i still dont get the impression that he has the competitive drive of kobe or jordan.
> 
> .02*



I largely agree with you, but I was:

(1)  Acknowledging that LeBron has made HUGE leaps in the Eye Of The Tiger Department;

(2)  Trying to be nice.

OF COURSE Kobe's still the best!

We'll revisit this thread in June, no doubt!


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## L O V E L I F E

deeCee said:


> *John Stockton anyone? lol *



Fourteen points a game, and ZERO titles in two decades, playing alongside another overrated Hall Of Famer!

Sign me up!


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## axl blaze

GingaNinja420 said:


> Cavs are my squad and of course I want them to go all the way...Lebron James and Mo Williams? Forget about it!



it seems like a lot of hoop heads have jumped on the Cleveland Cavs bandwagon. I don't care, it doesn't make me bitter. as someone who has followed the Cavs since a youngster, and someone who is usually prone to pretension and being jaded - I knew once Cleveland acquired someone with the hype (and the skill to back it up) like LBJ this was going to happen. I hate those type of Cleve-O fans who are like "I despise anybody who is an LBJ fan and not a Cavs fan." 

it is not the worst thing to deal with if you are a Cleveland sports fan. in fact, as a Cleveland sports fan you should be simply happy and grateful that you are getting some media attention on a national scale, and you have a player who has the ability to bring in a Championship, something that Cleveland fans can hardly even imagine.



GingaNinja420 said:


> Although Miami is doing their thing right now too, I got decent ambitions for them.



meh, as much as I like Dwayne Wade, I don't think that they can get past the Atlanta Hawks this round. the Hawks are a young team that are experiencing a resurgence, and on top of it all I think that the Miami coach is young, inexperienced, and prone to making mistakes.

today was an interesting day. the Celtics made the Bulls look young and the Mavs ripped the Spurs in half (unusual, because San Antonio is so clutch this time of the year).

god damn I love pro basketball. I am very happy to see this thread getting some love.


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## axl blaze

tonight, the NBA just got a little more interesting.

Kobe missed a lot of shots and looked very... well, _human_. the Lakers lost at Utah, and I know the Jazz have one of the best home advantages in the NBA (maybe just below the Cavs), but now I am kinda wondering if the Lakers are so easily the best of the best in the NBA.

I know LA is without Bynum, but now the West looks as if you are playing your best basketball, then you could possibly get by the Lake Show. the Denver Nuggets, I am looking in your direction. any pedestrian NBA fan would have picked LA to win it all - but after Kobe's rather dismal performance I think that if a West team has the momentum then they can win the series.

thoughts?


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## jeef

^the lakers do have bynum, he just fouled out on some calls that always go the jazz's way when playing in utah (yes im a bitter laker fan...congrats jazz fans, good game). 

anyways, after horrible shooting nights like that one, kobe ALWAYS comes back with a monster game. or at least an efficient one. everybody has a bad game every once and a while. wade had a horrible game1 vs atlanta but came back strong in game2. its what players like kobe or wade or lebron do. rarely have i ever seen kobe have two horrible shooting games in a row during the regular season, let alone the playoffs. aslo, gasol had a bad game too, which is pretty rare as well. hes been the most consistent laker throughout the season IMO.

either way, as long as the lakers keep playing well at home it wont really matter until the finals.


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## nowdubnvr6

My home boy Brewer shut down Kobe the other night but damn tonight he got hussled...


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## L O V E L I F E

God dammit!

I swore to myself I'd stop sucking Kobe's metaphorical cock so much this year, but I just can't - he's THAT great.


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## deeCee

That's Utah fucked


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## yearofthaboomerang

*The real question is...*

If the Cavs win it all, does LeBron still leave for the Knicks in 2010?


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## axl blaze

good question.

as a huge LBJ and Cleveland Cavs fan, as soon as I heard the initial Knicks trade rumors I thought LeBron was going to be gone.

however, if you look at the Cavs these days, they are above and beyond the most fun team in the NBA to watch. the Cavs can make taking a timeout look interesting and fun to watch. the reason for this, is that the team has developed a great chemistry.

you can tell that they enjoy one another's company and they play hard and then play around and have a good time. I think that the Cavs will win it all this year, which will of course be a huge factor in LBJ's career decision (it has been noted that above all else he wants to win Championships, something he wants to do even more than making his name a "global brand").

team chemistry counts. I don't want to be as naive as to say that LBJ will stay with the Cavs only because of chemistry and team friendship, but I am sure these are variables that will affect the outcome of his choice. 

the Cavaliers organization have built a great team from the ground up, starting with LBJ as the base. when Cleveland got swept by San Antonio in the Finals a couple years ago, it was because the offensive burden was entirely on LBJ's shoulders. a couple guys could shoot, but he was the only player that could get consistent penetration.

NBA Coach of the Year Mike Brown has put Mo Williams and Delonte West simultaneously in the starting 5, which is a decision I love, because now those two get constant penetration.

the entire roster of the Cavs are so brilliantly unselfish, and this starts with LeBron James. even if the three don't score when getting some penetration to the basket - they can be sure to kick it out to someone who can.

that was a very long post to a very short question. to sum my thoughts up, I think LBJ will stay. I was so convinced that he was going to jump ship, but gradually I have changed my mind to the other extreme.

what do my other hoop homies have to say about the most electrifying player in the NBA and his career, in a couple years?


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## jeef

axl blaze said:


> what do my other hoop homies have to say about the most electrifying player in the NBA and his career, in a couple years?



most electrifying player...hmm...i'd say in a couple years we'll be looking back and saying, "man, kobe was awesome!"

but seriously, lebrons only getting better. his jumpshot has definitely improved, even though he can still be a bit streaky. hes gonna be scary good in a couple years and as long as the cavs are legit contenders, i have a feeling he'll stay in cleveland...for now kobes still the best player tho, even if lebrons this years mvp

kinda off topic, but still hilarious...if you go to espn.com right now (not sure how long this is gonna work), and enter the old konami code (up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B, A, ENTER) ponies and rainbows pop up on the screen every time you press enter.

edit: code doesnt work anymore ...but if you're really interested you can go to the google cached page and it still works - http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:ssdn4F46EEYJ:espn.go.com/+espn.com&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us


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## cravNbeets

its forgone conclusion that he will be out if they win it all this year.... and pretty likely even if they dont.  innit?


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## fatallyflawed

axl blaze said:


> I know LA is without Bynum, but now the West looks as if you are playing your best basketball, then you could possibly get by the Lake Show. the Denver Nuggets, I am looking in your direction. any pedestrian NBA fan would have picked LA to win it all - but after Kobe's rather dismal performance I think that if a West team has the momentum then they can win the series.



Well at least in the final game of that series, Lakers looked really good. Odom made some nice slams with force to!


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## cravNbeets

denver almost doubles up on new orleans.  yikes.


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## papa

the spurs are finished.  no, wait,......they can beat the mavericks 3 in a row.

Can the San Antonio Spurs beat the Dallas Mavericks three games in a row?

Y[ ]     N[ ]


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## yearofthaboomerang

axl blaze said:


> good question.
> 
> as a huge LBJ and Cleveland Cavs fan, as soon as I heard the initial Knicks trade rumors I thought LeBron was going to be gone.
> 
> however, if you look at the Cavs these days, they are above and beyond the most fun team in the NBA to watch. the Cavs can make taking a timeout look interesting and fun to watch. the reason for this, is that the team has developed a great chemistry.
> 
> you can tell that they enjoy one another's company and they play hard and then play around and have a good time. I think that the Cavs will win it all this year, which will of course be a huge factor in LBJ's career decision (it has been noted that above all else he wants to win Championships, something he wants to do even more than making his name a "global brand").
> 
> team chemistry counts. I don't want to be as naive as to say that LBJ will stay with the Cavs only because of chemistry and team friendship, but I am sure these are variables that will affect the outcome of his choice.
> 
> the Cavaliers organization have built a great team from the ground up, starting with LBJ as the base. when Cleveland got swept by San Antonio in the Finals a couple years ago, it was because the offensive burden was entirely on LBJ's shoulders. a couple guys could shoot, but he was the only player that could get consistent penetration.
> 
> NBA Coach of the Year Mike Brown has put Mo Williams and Delonte West simultaneously in the starting 5, which is a decision I love, because now those two get constant penetration.
> 
> the entire roster of the Cavs are so brilliantly unselfish, and this starts with LeBron James. even if the three don't score when getting some penetration to the basket - they can be sure to kick it out to someone who can.
> 
> that was a very long post to a very short question. to sum my thoughts up, I think LBJ will stay. I was so convinced that he was going to jump ship, but gradually I have changed my mind to the other extreme.
> 
> what do my other hoop homies have to say about the most electrifying player in the NBA and his career, in a couple years?




I think it's 60/40 he leaves, which is a great increase compared to say two years, when I'd say it was 99%. He has said he wants to be sports first billionaire, and being in NYC nearly all the time would certainly help him reach that goal. He also has to look at the Cavs current roster and decide whether he thinks they can keep it together for the long haul; He can't want to go the D-Wade route and win one then two years later be the lone star player surrounded by mediocre talent. 

IMO:

Pros to staying:

He grew up nearby
Beloved in Cleveland
Championship contender for at least 2 years beyond 09
Loves his teammates  

Cons:

Small market
Cavs have some older players(Wallace,Big Z)
Wally will walk, Varejo may leave as well
Uncertain future

Pros to leavingfor NYC)

Biggest market in the U.S.
Gets to play at The Garden
Would be biggest story in basketball in the last 20+ years
Would make so much endorsement money it's not even funny
(Rumored) $50 million dollar bonus from Nike
(Rumored) Agreement with Wade and/or Bosh to play together
Knicks would do whatever he wants
Knicks have three good young players(Lee,Chandler,Robinson)
Donnie Walsh is a very respected team builder
Could draw a veteran free agent for cheap

Cons:

Would be see as the ultimate villain in Cleveland 
If Walsh can't shed salary, could be stuck in rebuilding mode
No guarantees the Knicks will be any good
Still will play in the inferior conference(same with the Cavs, but you know what I mean)



The 2010 list of free agents is nuts:

Joe Johnson
Ray Allen
Manu
Camby
T-Mac
Shaq
Rip Hamilton
Nash
Boozer
Okur
Turkoglu

These players can opt in 2010 too:
Yao
Amare Stoudemire
D-Wade
Bosh
Nowitzki
Josh Howard 
Tyson Chandler


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## fatallyflawed

i think Lebron still wants one ring before he goes to the knicks and voids any more chances.


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## axl blaze

from what I can gather on the city of Cleveland, they won't be *that *resentful of LBJ if - before he leaves, he wins the city a Championship.


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## fatallyflawed

if they get up in arms over it, there is seriously something wrong


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## Johnny blue

Wow! Rondo playing lights out again last night. Other than ripping a tooth from millers face he played great basketball. I thought we were fucked when Ray Allen fouled out with 55 seconds left in regulation but pierce decided to show up. 

Chicago is a much stronger team than I thought. Everytime Ben fucking Gordon shoots in the 4th I cringe. They could definitely use some defense though. 

Almost forgot. Stephon Marbury needs to pull the fucking trigger! Dude is so afraid to shoot I don't even know why they guard him. I gotta say he played great D and I'm sure that's why Doc had em in but, come on "Starbury"! Take the open shots man!


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## axl blaze

besides the beautiful point guard play of Derrick Rose and the sometimes off but sometimes on shooting of Ben Gordon, make no mistake that the Chicago Bulls are a mediocre team.

I just think that nobody realized how mediocre the Boston Celtics, when without KG, are. KG truly injects a rabid defensive/offensive basketball playing style.


----------



## Johnny blue

axl blaze said:


> besides the beautiful point guard play of Derrick Rose and the sometimes off but sometimes on shooting of Ben Gordon, make no mistake that the Chicago Bulls are a mediocre team.
> 
> I just think that nobody realized how mediocre the Boston Celtics, when without KG, are. KG truly injects a rabid defensive/offensive basketball playing style.



Derrick Rose? Did you watch that game? Fuck his "beautiful" playing. If I'm not mistaken rondo has had a triple double every game of the series. KG has been far from great this year anyways and I think they did pretty good considering they lost what 2 home games? I really don't see the outcome changed by much because KG is out. Ya they are down a big guy but game 3 was a complete beating. I don't think they are winning another championship this time but this is playoff basketball we are talking about here, everyone plays balls out. Its the big three after all not the big one and when you're best performer is a role playing guard I'd say that was pretty good.

On another note the Lebrauns *cough* I mean the Cavs are sick. I'm happy that the Celtics aren't playing them next. Orlando is no walk in the park either but, who wants to play him?


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Johnny blue said:


> *
> On another note the Lebrauns *cough* I mean the Cavs are sick.
> 
> I'm happy that the Celtics aren't playing them next. Orlando is no walk in the park either but, who wants to play him?*



Kobe Fucking Bryant is already secreting pre-cum, that's how excited he is to potentially win the title against LeBron.

Remember that ONE regular season game that LeBron played and lost at home ALL SEASON?

Remember who hit a fall-away jumper that almost hit the ceiling to clinch the win over Cleveland, despite playing the entire game with the flu?

I agree that LeBron's scary, but Kobe Bryant would, hypothetically, play an in-his-prime MJ and bet his life on it.

And being the gambling addict he is, MJ would probably be up for the wager as well.

I don't even know who would win THAT dream match-up, but with that said, Kobe Bryant CERTAINLY isn't scared of ANYONE.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

axl blaze said:


> *
> besides the beautiful point guard play of Derrick Rose and the sometimes off but sometimes on shooting of Ben Gordon, make no mistake that the Chicago Bulls are a mediocre team.*



Without its two best players, EVERY TEAM is a mediocre (AT BEST) team.


----------



## nowdubnvr6

^^ good point and that game was fucking awesome tonight. Who knew Ray allan was gonna put up 51 or Brad miller hitting a 3 pointer?!@#>34


----------



## Johnny blue

Celtics v bulls, wow. I don't care who you are or what you think of either team, what a great series. 
Did you know that Ben Gordon beat Scottie Pippen's 3 pt record for the bulls? I didn't until last night.


----------



## smotpoker

Go Cavs. King James MVP!


----------



## carl

Johnny blue said:


> Celtics v bulls, wow. I don't care who you are or what you think of either team, what a great series.



This series is nothing short of fantastic. Each and every game (I've watched 2-6) has been great, and games 5 and 6 are two of the best I've ever watched. I'm torn between watching tonights fight, and this game.


----------



## fatallyflawed

that little phillipino guy is gonna knock the other dude out.

And I am sure there will be a huge brawl at some point between Celtics and Bulls


----------



## carl

Nice on the Celtics. Now let's see the Heat put the Hawks down...


----------



## fatallyflawed

well even though the Rockets beat the Lakers, I am not worried.

Rockets where on fire, lakers where rusty from not playing and Kobe was really off.

Next game should be turned around fo sho!


----------



## EnYAY

Lakers lost 

what a sad game..... but like pullstring said, i am not worried.

i feel guilty for saying this, but i actually for a second hoped YAO's knee was done. lol but i applaud his athleticism and his determination.


----------



## Pander Bear

carl said:


> Nice on the Celtics. Now let's see the Heat put the Hawks down...



lol


I'm not laughing about the cavs though. I just want my team to play with their chins held high, and hopefully grind out a win or two (or four...whatever)


----------



## fatallyflawed

EnYAY said:


> Lakers lost
> 
> what a sad game..... but like pullstring said, i am not worried.



a shit hot rockets team kept getting knipped at the heels by a more than obvious "these are not the lakers we have seen this season.;"


----------



## EnYAY

Kobe reminded me of epic fail guy.

Artest was actually good tonight. turns out hes a descent player when he shuts up and shoots. lol


----------



## cravNbeets

lakers faithful shouldnt panic after 1 game, but i'd be a little concerned after watching houston weather the storm that was kobe heating up in the 3rd.  im a little torn.  i dont hate the lakers but i do feel compelled to root for the team that outed the blazers.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Wow, the Hawks look like they are out of their league with the Cavs.

Lebron got to practically sit the second half and just watch!


----------



## yearofthaboomerang

damn I really want one of those Witness MVP shirts. Fucking sick!


----------



## jeef

^am i the only one who reads that as "mv-penis" when read top to bottom?


----------



## Pander Bear

pullstring said:


> Wow, the Hawks look like they are out of their league with the Cavs.
> 
> Lebron got to practically sit the second half and just watch!



James really does exemplify grace and power on the court. Still, I have to say-- the games the hawks lost to Miami, they lost big, too. I hope they can get it together when they come to Atlanta (but... im realistic).


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Orlando Magic! i know they lost last night but taking game one in boston was crucial in swaying home court advantage away from them.....gunna be a hell of a series...... Hopefully Rafer Austin doesnt get suspended from fridays game for that stupid little slap he hit eddie house with.....If hes out our point guards dont go very deep....


----------



## cravNbeets

he will definitely be suspended as well as derek fischer and possibly kobe... playoffs are gettin chippy


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

yeah ALOT of heart and emotion being put into these playoff games this year...what else can i say I LOVE THIS GAME


----------



## axl blaze

I love this game, as well.

the Cleveland Cavaliers look like the only sure-fire championship caliber team. lets hope I don't eat my words in a couple hours when this game (Cavs VS Hawks) is done. Atlanta has a capable Big 3 with Bibby, Johnson, and Smith and I could see them winning a game or two.


----------



## EnYAY

GO LAKERS!!!


D Fisher layed that guy out last night.  His face afterwards was priceless. 

He got the one game suspension, but i dont think it will mess them up too much, shannon brown takes over. were all good.

kobe and artest got fines ( technical 1) i think?  

Artests attitude annoys me, hes like the 9yo brother that just wont stop bugging you.


GOO LAKERS


----------



## undead

lulz!!! i love ron artest. his cockiness totally makes me laugh. normally that kind of attitude bugs me, but there's something about the way he does it that makes me like him.

"i had to have a talk with kobe... i just had to remind him who he hit... this is ron artest."

that's not word for word, but it was something like that during the post game interview. his smug laugh afterward is what got me laughing.

but man was that game rough last night. fisher looked like albert belle when he ran over fernando vena (cleveland indians vs. milwaukee brewers WAY back in the day). it was br00tal, but yeah, the way he scratched his head and acted puzzled after that was hilarious. the lakers looked to be in rare form in game 1.

as for the cavs game tonight. they could be up by 20+ by half time. they're just clicking on all levels so far this post season!


----------



## undead

wooooow... btw, anyone who says lebron ISN'T clutch... watch him... he's getting there.

i admit he hasn't been THAT clutch in the past, but man has he come a long way. that buzzer beater at the end of the second from 2 steps over the half court line was fucking SICK!


----------



## fatallyflawed

ryanlaughlin said:


> "i had to have a talk with kobe... i just had to remind him who he hit... this is ron artest."
> !



And thats what I hate about him, he thinks people are fucking idiots. Oh ya I am sure you meant it in a none violent retaliating way douchebag! FUCK OFF!! 

And the Hawks need to hang it up. They are getting owned! And you can say it's in Clevland for an excuse if you like, but Lebron isnt playin half the game right now cuz the bench is fucking them over!


----------



## jeef

ryanlaughlin said:


> wooooow... btw, anyone who says lebron ISN'T clutch... watch him... he's getting there.
> 
> i admit he hasn't been THAT clutch in the past, but man has he come a long way. that buzzer beater at the end of the second from 2 steps over the half court line was fucking SICK!



i think clutch usually refers to crunch time at the end of the game when the pressures on...but that shot was awesome either way.


----------



## undead

when i say clutch, i'm referring solely to the fact that it's clutch. i know what you mean though and theoretically being that the cavs were already up by about 20 points it could be argued that that shot wasn't clutch because it was unnecessary, but then we're just arguing semantics. point being, what i meant by clutch is that he hits the big shots at the big moments. clutch isn't always at the end of a game.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Clutch is nothing short of who do you want to have the ball when you have 5 seconds when you are behind by 1.

Who will you give the ball to?

Lebron is not quite there. Kobe, yes.

Just like Jordan,bird,elway and Montana.


----------



## axl blaze

LeBron James might not have the clutch attack of Kobe Bryant's shot.. but can Kobe play defense, consistently, like LBJ can? is being "clutch" int the NBA just limited to your shot and drive to the basket?

notice how the rest of the NBA teams left in the playoffs are getting in constant fisticuffs, while the Cavaliers are just winning and looking like they are having a damn good time while doing it. Delonte West said that he thinks every player on this team was a class clown back in their younger days, and the chemistry is fun to watch.


----------



## fatallyflawed

axl blaze said:


> LeBron James might not have the clutch attack of Kobe Bryant's shot.. but can Kobe play defense, consistently, like LBJ can? is being "clutch" int the NBA just limited to your shot and drive to the basket?
> .



I think defense is pretty much a team effort, every one has to do their part, except that bastard from the Steelers (Polyalmu) 

I agree on the Calvs pwning its ridiculous. But the lakers play like they did Wednesday, I will assume they are in the Finals with them.


----------



## jeef

the cavs are definitely playing really well. they look impressive, even with LBJ on the bench...but their competition hasnt really been that tough. the difference between the top 3 teams and the bottom 5 in the east is huge.

...and if we're talking about crunch time, kobe can play consistent D. he only slacks off when he doesnt respect the player he matches up against, and he often defends the best perimeter player at the end of close games.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Orlando vs Boston tonight ESPN home game


----------



## fatallyflawed

I think the Lakers will have it for sure now.

Under shooting bad, and the rockets cant keep fast pace.

For starters, the flagrant on Vujovic was BS! Whats his nuts fucking ram jumped into HIM!! He would have went right by him, but he checked him.

And Artest (as much as I hate the bastard) did not deserve that ejection. That was bare;y flagrant 1, let alone no where near a 2.


----------



## axl blaze

the Lakers got punked today by a Houston team without T-Mac and Yao Ming. I didn't see this one coming; but the Rockets played (at least this game) like a team desperate to win while the Lakers were just going through the motions. the defensive play by L.A. just needs more effort.

Orlando VS Boston tonight. who you guys got?


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

The home team of course, although the game in the first half has been very very slow paced and ticky tack fouls abound.


----------



## undead

oh snap! sick buzzer beater by big baby! did anyone see him push the orlando towel boy out of the way after he sank that shot! LMFAO!!!! it was fucking hilarious. wait til that shot hits youtube, then pay attention after he makes the shot. :D


----------



## axl blaze

what a game.

I don't really like the Celtics, from my time spent living in Boston and their all-of-a-sudden return to greatness while I was there. I found myself jumping on the Orlando Magic wagon last year, because watching Dwight Howard as the NBA's premier big man and then watching that whole team chuck 3 point shots relentlessly is fun. also, growing up who didn't like Penny and Shaq? 

I was really hoping Boston would lose, but they are such a solid team defensively, even without their defensive leaders KG and Leon Powe. the Celtics are not dangerous because of one player, they are dangerous because they play like a team and have great coaching.

that being said, I think both of these teams this year are without a couple important factors that will render them unable to reach the NBA Finals.

back to the game. it was a very good game, getting close at the end and then it was surreal watching both teams grind to a near halt in point production in the last three minutes.

of course, the whole gym imagined that the ball would be going into Boston Celtic Ray Allen's hands, only to see him get the ball, penetrate and dish it out to "Big Baby" Glen Davis (whom isn't quite known for his shooting prowess. the Boston Celtics are so god damned lucky, it can drive a non-fan sick sometimes.



ryanlaughlin said:


> oh snap! sick buzzer beater by big baby! did anyone see him push the orlando towel boy out of the way after he sank that shot! LMFAO!!!! it was fucking hilarious. wait til that shot hits youtube, then pay attention after he makes the shot. :D



yeah! I saw that, too. is his big ass blind or something?

initially, he almost plows into the ref; and then he takes out some unsuspecting and completely innocent towel boy.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

ouch big baby hurts!  anyway that was a hell of a game either way you slice it. Too bad my team lost but oh well boston played very well last night witht here backs against the wall...i dont have much time to type here but i disagree witht he fact that orlando cannot wina  championshiop.....when they are on they are probably one of the best teams in the NBA...the one thing they lack is consistensy....which every team needs.....gunna be very interesting to see how this series plays out....being how orlando is a better road team then they are a home team...anyway was a great game and it was hilarious seeeing big baby throw that poor little towel boy out of the way....


----------



## EnYAY

Andrew Bynum has completely failed the lakers in my opinion.  Mentally he is not in the game, he is extremely intimidated in the paint and he has no confidence in his game.  the look on his face shows fear and hesitation.  The lakers paid for a superstar but got a unprepared bench warmer.

His actions PRIOR to the finals was a precursor to his behavior and play during the finals.  On the night before the start of the finals, Andrew Bynum was seen out on a date with singer RIHANNA.  this is not what a star player should be doing right before the biggest games of his career.  Coincidentally, his flings naked pictured surfaced on the internet on Saturday.  If Bynum is associated with Rihanna, then his mind must have been cluttered with his girlfriend's pictures all over the internet and how hurt he was about it.


I am disappointed in Bynums performance on and off the court.  Mitch cupchek should realize whats going on and get rid of the cancer that is Andre Bynum.

He has failed the lakers on all aspects.  Behavior, esteem, composure, actual play time.  he is a complete failure.


----------



## jeef

i think its too soon to call bynum a complete failure. he was out for half the season and was only able to play a couple games before the playoffs (where he got very limited minutes against utah). he really has been disappointing lately, but before he went down he had some really solid games (did u see that 40 pt game??). he just needs some time to readjust himself into the offense, work on his defensive timing, etc.

that said...he has been completely useless in the playoffs so far and most likely wont help much at all for the rest of the post season. i think he has a good future ahead of him (if he can avoid more serious injuries) but right now the lakers cant afford to try and take the time to work bynum back into things.


----------



## axl blaze

I wouldn't give up on Bynum so soon, either.

does he have toughness problems (both mentally and physically)? absolutely. but at times he can score ruthlessly in the paint, against very good defensive teams.

it was nice to see Cleveland sweep the Atlanta Hawks today, so they can get some rest against either Orlando or Boston. the Cavs shot horrible today, and it might just be because Atlanta finally played defense for most of the game. 

the Hawks should be content with the direction of their franchise, with their first playoff series win in ten years. however, they have a lot of questions to be answered as Zaza Pachulia, Joe Smith, and Mike Bibby are all going to be able to leave the franchise, one way or another. Zaza has emerged as one of my favorite Hawks - he plays basketball like a bulldog.

tonight Denver will also be trying to sweep Dallas. Detroit really looks like idiots for trading Chauncey Billups, huh? I know it seemed as if Rodney Stuckey would be more than adequate at PG, but I wouldn't be very eager to let such a great scoring PG as Billups go.


----------



## EnYAY

Mark Cuban is having a field day. 

Wow your team avoided the sweep! lol


----------



## yearofthaboomerang

Can you believe the dad of the kid that Big Baby ran into is demanding an apology? The kid must be embarrassed for having such a pussy as a father.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

what if it was your kid that was rudely pushed over by a "profesional" basketball player?


----------



## L O V E L I F E

EnYAY said:


> *
> Mark Cuban is having a field day.
> 
> Wow your team avoided the sweep! lol*



Yeah - what a loser.

An innovative self-made billionaire who owns a professional sports team and actually gives a shit.

I'm sure you wouldn't trade lives with him.


----------



## Too many doses

How the fuck did Orlando give up a two digit lead to lose game 5? That shit is absurd, I thought they could give the cavs a series but this game shows how little experiance they have. Just my rant on the game.


----------



## fatallyflawed

mental toughness of the celtics is all.


----------



## EnYAY

L O V E L I F E said:


> Yeah - what a loser.
> 
> An innovative self-made billionaire who owns a professional sports team and actually gives a shit.
> 
> I'm sure you wouldn't trade lives with him.



what does trading lives with him have to do with anything?

My remark was made about Cuban celebrating like his time won the championship when they just avoided getting sweeped. why are you so happy Mark?

THE GUY IS A FUCKING IDIOT, he went up to a players mother ( i forget who) and made some uncalled for remarks. A PLAYERS MOTHER! hes too much of a fucking pussy to go and handle his shit on his own.

matter of fact. I WOULDN'T TRADE LIVES WITH HIM.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Too many doses said:


> How the fuck did Orlando give up a two digit lead to lose game 5? That shit is absurd, I thought they could give the cavs a series but this game shows how little experiance they have. Just my rant on the game.


i agree on so many levels bro.......the last five minutes of that game made me sick to my stomach and i bashed my head on the wall when hedo turkoglu went in and tried to get the foul call and nothing happend.......magic showing immaturity..... i might agree with you now after these last two games axl blaze......it hink another year of playing together and having Jameer Nelson back in the lineup would do orlando good.......im not giving up on the magic just yet though....game 6 in orlando


----------



## undead

yearofthaboomerang said:


> Can you believe the dad of the kid that Big Baby ran into is demanding an apology? The kid must be embarrassed for having such a pussy as a father.



for anyone interested (which is probably few people), the father (who demanded the apology) of the kid who big baby pushed... retracted his statements and admitted that he was acting irrationally. he actually apologized for getting so upset and caught up in the moment. he mentioned that he was looking at it from a father's point of view and acted unprofessionally in demanding an apology. gotta respect him for manning up like that.


----------



## GlassAss420

The celtics blow.. bulls coulda had it..


----------



## undead

if the celtics blow and the bulls got beat by them in a 7 game series, wouldn't that mean the bulls blow too?


----------



## sssssssssss

nah the bulls just got unlucky ha.


----------



## axl blaze

the Bulls were just a very young team.

if Derrick Rose works hard in the offseason, then they will be a force to be reckoned with in the Eastern Playoffs next year.

the Celtics, however, are more mentally tough but they are getting older.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Shane Battier has the highest basketball IQ of anyone I've seen since Larry Joe Bird.


----------



## poopie

dude, i woulda been a bit pissed if someone ran into my kid and didn't apologize. but mostly, i'd be pretty sore over that *FUCKING* game.

fuck davis! goddamnit!

thank god for tonight.

i might actually be able to see orlando live in the play-offs this sunday. *crosses fingers* i wonder how much those tickets are going for.


----------



## EnYAY

Im actually thinking the lakers dont have what it takes to win the championship this year. its sad, but there are much better teams who deserve it for stellar play, unlike the lakers.


----------



## Pander Bear

Cavs, no question.


----------



## EnYAY

Pander Bear said:


> Cavs, no question.



Agreed.

I feel like im turning my back on the lakers, but Cavs play is unquestionable.

i hope Lakers turn it around and I have to bite my words


----------



## Pander Bear

I just hope they give em a good series.


----------



## stinkfoot

poopie said:


> dude, i woulda been a bit pissed if someone ran into my kid and didn't apologize.




maybe the kids' dad should keep the kid off of the court.

btw, davis didn't run into the kid. he did give him a small backhand push though.


----------



## jeef

the cavs have been the only consistent team and have looked very impressive. i'm still not 100% convinced though...we'll get to see them face a challenge in the ECF against the celtics or magic.

the lakers have looked completely uninspired and lethargic. its been pretty painful to watch as a laker fan. but who knows...the celtics struggled early in the playoffs last year and look what happened...


----------



## axl blaze

the Cavs have had a truly dominant season, but come on people, it's not like they are unbeatable.

the best way to beat the Cavs is to have consistent dominant play at center (defensively speaking, and getting rebounds - can't let LBJ control that) and to have a good night concerning your shots. because of these two factors - I think that the Magic would pose a bigger threat to the NBA's beloved Cavaliers, this year, in the East.

the Lakers are really sputtering, but Houston is finding themselves offensively. instead of just feeding Yoa Ming the ball every play, and instead of Yoa and the person who is guarding him blocking the lane when a Houston Rocket is trying to penetrate - the Rockets are rotating the ball and playing good offense. Shane Battier can hit the shots, along with Scola and Artest.

also, Aaron Brooks is providing to be a good leader. and he also looks damn respectable rocking the bow-tie.

what a treat! we get to watch Boston/Orlando and LA/Houston in two Game 7 matchups.

this is one of the best NBA basketball postseasons because the guard seem to be switching from some major franchises. where are the Chancey Billups-less Pistons and the aging, injured San Antonio Spurs?

as much as the LA Lakers are proven winners, NBA playoffs is a game where momentum is the ultimate monkey. you have to give that to the Denver Nuggets and the Cleveland Cavaliers, so far and so balls deep in the post-season.

I will always love this game.


----------



## jeef

just out of curiosity, what do you guys think of the officiating so far?
...i dont think i've ever seen this many blown calls/no calls in a single post-season before.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

There is no unbeatable team this season.

The Lakers are the most talented, but have been playing like shit.

The Cavs have a bona fide superduperstar in LeBron, and they play very hard and very cohesively; with that said, from a talent standpoint, their 2nd through 12th best players are pretty pedestrian for a championship caliber team.

The Magic have a puncher's chance based on Dwight Howard being BY FAR the best big man remaining in the play-offs, along with having two clutch dead-on shooters.

The Celtics have a teeny weeny chance based on a combination of factors, most importantly, Paul Pierce having an incredibly high ceiling in big games.

The Nuggets also have a small chance to win the whole thing, largely due to Billups' clutchness.

In fact, this is, imo, the most wide-open play-offs in quite a while.

I, too, love this game.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

orlando handles boston in boston........


----------



## L O V E L I F E

I think that all of the many people in the "Cavs are gonna steamroll through the play-offs" camp  are gonna be in for a rude awakening these next two weeks.

MAGIC IN 6.

- LL


----------



## poopie

FUCK YES!



looking forward to this!

ll, i sure hope you're right!


----------



## axl blaze

I have been scared of Orlando all year, because all year they have proven they could beat the Cavs. it's like I don't know what I want, all playoff long I've been rooting against the Boston Celtics because I just wanted to see them lose, but now that they have lost, I just wish that they would have taken care of business against the Magic.

Dwight Howard is a playa, and he is going to give the Cavs a hard time with his inside presence. the Magic can absolutely smoke you when they are hitting their treys - but when they are not, they look pretty mediocre.

the key to stopping Dwight Howard is getting him to the free throw line, because he can't really shoot free throws that well.

I will take the Cavs in 6, just because the Orlando Magic are a good team, but one All Star away from being a great team.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Yeah and that all star is on the bench......Jameer Nelson LOL...but really though orlando in six.......i notice people jumping on the orlando wagon now that didnt give them a chance in boston for game 7..LOL.....I live in orlando and this town hasnt been as excited for our home team since back in 1995  MAGIC MANIA BABY!


----------



## axl blaze

Liquid1nsanity said:


> Yeah and that all star is on the bench......Jameer Nelson LOL...



that was exactly my point. the Blue and White are multi-talented, but they almost lost to an impotent Boston team that the Cleveland Cavaliers would have smoked (due to KG's absence).

Orlando will be just like what Boston is now - one player away from being a true championship caliber team.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

True so are you saying that when Jameer Nelson is back next year they will be more of a contender than they are now?I don't want to curse my team but we've been in a little bit of a slump since the last 6 games of the regular season to almost now. The real Magic started playing sometime around game 6 of the Boston series. I've mentioned my thoughts of there inconsistensy before in this thread, but i hope that we have put this behind us. Lets not forget Dwight Howard is still very very young, and so are the rest of the magic. JJ Reddick was one of the best shooters in all of college basketball, and this is only his second year of trying to get his NBA legs under him. Rashard Lewis has proven that he is deadly from beyond the arch, and can drive you to the hole. Hedo Turkoglu has been streaky but as far as clutch you've got to give it to him. In game 6 he had missed all his three point shots all night, but when the game was on the line he stepped up no hesitation and buried a 3 to maintain orlandos lead over boston. Dont get me started on the bench. Courtney Lee was a starter until dwight howard dropped the peoples elbow on his face in a playoff game against philly, but he was one of our best producers in games 1-3 of the philly series. Martin Gordtat has put in BIG minutes filling in for dwight howard, even carrying the team without howard after yet another elbow from howard that got him suspended. Lets also not forget through two playoff games we had players suspended. The magic have played there asses off and deserve to be where they are right now. Id take the magic full strength vs boston full strength any day of the week. I guess my little rant here is to say i think orlando HAS what it takes to win it all right now, even though they are short handed. I guess im just trying to say that I believe in magic.


----------



## axl blaze

you should believe in the Magic, they are your team and they have gotten you this deep in the playoffs by beating a competitive Boston Celtics team. however, Orlando relied on their deep ball too much for the win. 

above all, I don't think that they can with a Championship this year because of their foul shot percentage. isn't their percentage of made foul shots one of the worst in the league?

and you are right, I am saying that when they have Jameer Nelson in their lineup they have more of a chance. anytime you are missing an All-Star is a bad time, unless you are Yao Ming or Allen Iverson, to the Houston Rockets and the Detroit Pistons, respectively.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Yeah it really sucked when we lost Jameer for the year as he was on his way to an all star season, but I feel that Rafer Austin had done a decent job. He's no Jameer but hes gotten the job done. We will see how the cards play out, but I am very happy with my team this year, and they have come a very long way since getting swept by detroit last year in round two.


----------



## fatallyflawed

I think Cavs & Magic will be good match up.

Cavs should squeak by.

And I think my Lakers are gonna steamroll Denver. Kobe likes to play the other stars hard.


----------



## johanneschimpo

The way I see it is if the Lakers take out the Nuggets in a strong fashion, say 5, maybe 6 games tops, they can and probably will win it all. 
If they have to go to 7 games, I don't know if they'll have enough momentum to contend with the Cavaliers. However, they do have finals experience, and the Magic could take the Cavs to a long series as well. The Cavs aren't going to sweep this round.
Finally, the Kobe-Pau tandem is a force to be reckoned with. As are several other Lakers (Ariza is on fire right now).


----------



## axl blaze

ex-Lakers GM Jerry West just announced the other day that LeBron James was a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant.

this must be a tough pill to swallow coming from the guy who is the much heralded architect of every single Laker team you Lakers fans have probably seen, and the guy who brought Bryant in himself, nonetheless.

thoughts on this? source = http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4178437



johanneschimpo said:


> Finally, the Kobe-Pau tandem is a force to be reckoned with. As are several other Lakers (Ariza is on fire right now).



change of subject, I agree. Pau Gasol is so good I hate him for being good. does anybody else notice that when he is slacking, it seems like his whole team follows suit and becomes lethargic?

during that Houston Game 7 he really dominated the boards and played solid defense. of course Bynum was a factor, but I think Gasol is twenty times more a factor.


----------



## fatallyflawed

farmar


----------



## L O V E L I F E

axl blaze said:


> *
> ex-Lakers GM Jerry West just announced the other day that LeBron James was a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant.
> *



(1)  As an EX-Laker executive, he's clearly NOT unbiased;

(2)  Even WITH his likely bias, he STILL conceded that in the closing moments of an important play-off/Finals game, he would trust Kobe over LeBron.

(3)  So far, in five full seasons, LeBron James' teams have won as many NBA Finals *GAMES* as has an aborted fetus. 

Keep hating on Kobe.

The Kobe-MJ debate will be interesting for years to come.

LeBron hasn't yet proven he's one of the twenty best players ever yet.

Not saying he won't ever be - but comparing his accomplishments to Kobe's at this point is downright laughable.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Dwight Howard just PWND that shot clock lol....


----------



## undead

L O V E L I F E said:


> (1)  As an EX-Laker executive, he's clearly NOT unbiased;
> 
> (2)  Even WITH his likely bias, he STILL conceded that in the closing moments of an important play-off/Finals game, he would trust Kobe over LeBron.
> 
> (3)  So far, in five full seasons, LeBron James' teams have won as many NBA Finals *GAMES* as has an aborted fetus.
> 
> Keep hating on Kobe.
> 
> The Kobe-MJ debate will be interesting for years to come.
> 
> LeBron hasn't yet proven he's one of the twenty best players ever yet.
> 
> Not saying he won't ever be - but comparing his accomplishments to Kobe's at this point is downright laughable.



how is it laughable? i'd say it's legitimate and FAR from laughable. you may not agree that LBJ is as good as kobe, but you can't honestly deny that lebron james is in the same vicinity as kobe bryant. i just don't see how being able to hit the shots in the closing moments automatically makes kobe SO MUCH BETTER than lebron when lebron has the ability to dictate the pace of a game every bit as much as kobe bryant does.

i understand that winning a championship is the ultimate goal, but there ARE great players in sports that haven't won championships or at least haven't won one in 10 or more years. after all it IS a team sport not an individual sport and one player alone can't win a championship.

if you want to compare individual career averages, lebron leads in field goal %, rebounds per game, assists per game, blocks per game, and points per game. lebron was the youngest player ever to: record 10,000 career points (and everything from 1,000-12,000 for that matter), record a triple double, score 30 points in a game, score 40 points in a game, score 50 points in a game, score 2,000 points in a season, record 30 PPG for a season, be named the all star game MVP, and be named rookie of the year.

and while all that still doesn't mean he's better than kobe necessarily, how can you say it's laughable to compare his accomplishments to kobe?


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

SO....uhhhm about the magic now? We played a MONSTEr game and counteracted an almost 50 point performance by lebron james........Tonight we put cleveland into a spot theyre not used to being in....Get used to it cleveland fans....Rashard lewis stepped up big and hit the game winner....


----------



## L O V E L I F E

He has ZERO Finals WINS.

I'm not talking titles.

I'm saying that the ONE time the Cavs made the Finals, they got their doors blown off 4-0 by about 20 points a game.

Kobe, on the other hand, was a HUGE reason that the 2000-2002 Lakers were one of the only teams in recent sports history to three-peat, and nearly notched a fourth title last season.

And Kobe's only 30 years old - he has PLENTY more opportunities to challenge MJ's 6 titles in his career.

The Lakers brass thought SOOOOOOOOO highly of Kobe three years ago, that EVEN THOUGH HE'S AN ASSHOLE, there were willing to part with Shaq, one of the greatest centers EVER *AND* one of the greatest coaches EVER, Phil Jackson, just to keep Kobe.

You think Cleveland would give up Red Auerbach AND Hakeem Olujuwon in his prime to keep nail-biting LeBron?


----------



## poopie

fuckin' magic!

that was awesome...

that jump ball shot was a little too close for comfort...but seeing as they already had that miraculous 3 right before the half-time buzzer, it seemed their luck had run out!

first, the shot clock got owned, then...

:D


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Ahem.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Ya well Lebron's muppet makes me laugh harder than Kobe's muppet in the Nike commercials


----------



## undead

L O V E L I F E said:


> He has ZERO Finals WINS.
> 
> I'm not talking titles.
> 
> I'm saying that the ONE time the Cavs made the Finals, they got their doors blown off 4-0 by about 20 points a game.
> 
> Kobe, on the other hand, was a HUGE reason that the 2000-2002 Lakers were one of the only teams in recent sports history to three-peat, and nearly notched a fourth title last season.
> 
> And Kobe's only 30 years old - he has PLENTY more opportunities to challenge MJ's 6 titles in his career.
> 
> The Lakers brass thought SOOOOOOOOO highly of Kobe three years ago, that EVEN THOUGH HE'S AN ASSHOLE, there were willing to part with Shaq, one of the greatest centers EVER *AND* one of the greatest coaches EVER, Phil Jackson, just to keep Kobe.
> 
> You think Cleveland would give up Red Auerbach AND Hakeem Olujuwon in his prime to keep nail-biting LeBron?



i understand what you're saying, believe me i do. and i know you're a die hard lakers/kobe fan so your opinion will be just as biased as my cavs/lebron fandom. it is what it is. but the fact is, you can't honestly deny that LBJ's accomplishments SO FAR do in fact begin to compete with kobe. kobe's been in the league 12 full years and has 3 rings. lebron's been in the league 5 full years and yes has 0 rings, but should they win this year. that's one in 6 years. do you really think with a franchise who's willing to build around lebron that we won't get more chances should he stay here (and yes... he IS saying he'll be staying here... not going to NY or NJ despite popular belief).

the cavs have been playing some amazing ball this season. they intend to bring in chris bosh in the 2010-2011 season... all parties involved. bosh, lebron, and the cavs organization are interested in this and bosh himself has expressed huge interest. now that cleveland has begun to build a team AROUND lebron... lebron has come out and said that cleveland is the best fit for him and he intends to win multiple championships here.

now the point of mentioning all that is that we'll be an even more dominant team than we were this season! we'll be a team that's ready to hang. perennial no shows in the finals won't happen. the cav's are building a powerhouse team with a solid foundation as we speak.

but still... i'm saying... can you HONESTLY say that lebron's accomplishments are laughable in comparison to kobe? be honest, man. all bias aside. we're talking individual performance.


----------



## undead

oh and yes, they got their doors blown off 4-0, but the team this year is much different than the team that year. dynamics are different, the chemistry is different, the ability to work AS A TEAM is different. and hell... the make up of the glue that holds the squad together... is different. point being... 1 finals... swept... fuck it... that won't happen this year.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

The Cavs  are currently 1-4 in games THIS SEASON against Orlando and the Lakers - two of the losses were blowouts, another was with Kobe playing with the flu, and their ONLY win came in OT.

Could it be that LeBron and a cohesive bunch of role players were good enough, when trying their hardest, to demolish all of the scrubby teams in the NBA, but aren't quite talented enough to do the same to Orlando, or to Los Angeles, as they have NO answer for the Top Three of each of those two superior (talent-wise) teams?

Or are you gonna remain stubborn and contribute to the public's collective thinking that LeBron plus a bunch of  well-behaved cohesive-playing scrubs are unbeatable, and to the thinking that, in a week or two, when LeBron eventually chokes AGAIN in an important play-off series, that this "unbelieveable" Cavs loss will be considered 'The Biggest 'Upset' In The NBA Play-Offs Since 2004?"


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

ryanlaughlin said:


> oh and yes, they got their doors blown off 4-0, but the team this year is much different than the team that year. dynamics are different, the chemistry is different, the ability to work AS A TEAM is different. and hell... the make up of the glue that holds the squad together... is different. point being... 1 finals... swept... fuck it... that won't happen this year.



First you have to make it to the finals......


----------



## undead

ok... here's what i'm going to do.

i'm going to shut up. because the only way anyone will come off their high horse is if lebron james and the cleveland cavs win the finals. so i'm not gonna continue to argue because i'm ALWAYS wrong apparently.

i bet you even if the cavs end up winning the next 4. get to the finals and sweep whoever's there. the haters will STILL say it's a fluke. so whatever. my arguing skills and basketball knowledge aren't enough to continue. eh, it is what it is.


----------



## axl blaze

don't give in to LL's man crush on Kobe and the insane luck the Magic have for all things three points, just yet, ryanlaughlin.

the Magic are good, and are playing better right now than I ever thought. Dwight Howard doesn't get enough pressure from Z and the Cavs backcourt in Mo Williams and Delonte West (who have usually been on fire) are not making any shots. LeBron James is by far the best player in the NBA this year (even LL has to defer to this statement) and he is playing like it by dropping 50 points like it ain't no thang.

this is why I didn't want to play Orlando. they aren't the best basketball team, but they get hot and they can smoke teams by all of a sudden igniting their three point attack.

Cleveland needs adversity. Los Angeles had none last year and that allowed them to get stomped in the Finals. 



Liquid1nsanity said:


> First you have to make it to the finals......



the Cavs under LBJ have already made it to the Finals, before.


----------



## cravNbeets

ll remind me again how many titles kobe has since he parted ways w/ that 7ft irishman


----------



## LapDawg

Lebron James is the best stat machine in the NBA...it's just too bad he's only made one game-winning buzzer-beater in his NBA career and passed up yet another opportunity to do so last night. He sure loves passing in those critical moments in the playoffs...  Hopefully that changes...because if it doesn't...he doesn't deserve to be in the same category as Kobe imo.


----------



## undead

i respect you guys, LL and lapdawg (miss ya buddy!) but i can't 100% agree on that. i'm sure if you looked it up, you would also find that kobe gets the opportunity for a game winning buzzer beater far more often too. he'll definitely hit them more often than lebron, but when you're blowin teams out left and right, you aren't gonna be hitting game winning buzzer beaters that often. 

and btw, LL you never did address my point that it's far from laughable to compare accomplishments. again i'm not saying LBJ is a better player because he's got years to go, but laughable? come on man, you know, yourself, that that's not true.


----------



## LapDawg

It's not that he's had more opportunities ryan...it's that he seizes the moment and makes it his own. That's what the truly great ones do. Lebron's done it once every blue moon...but in order to establish that assassin ability, you have to take every opportunity to make it happen. I just haven't seen Lebron do that enough...and last night was just another example of him willing to pass it off rather than be the one to make the most critical shot of the game.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Kobe is a proven winner.

LeBron, while absolutely scarily talented, is not.

I've got plenty more ammunition to defend Kobe as the UNQUESTIONABLY greatest non-center EVER not named Michael Jordan, but I'll save it until LeBron leads his team to a victory in a SINGLE GAME in the Finals.

Until then, he's a very rich man's Tracy McGrady.

Dwayne Wade has a better argument that he's in Kobe's class than LeBron does.

Winning titles matters more than stats.

A lot more.


----------



## undead

you're completely batshit crazy bro.

i'm not discussing championships, i'm discussing individual talent. so i'll take your saying lebron is scarily talented as all the validation that i needed. thank you. finally.


----------



## undead

LapDawg said:


> It's not that he's had more opportunities ryan...it's that he seizes the moment and makes it his own. That's what the truly great ones do. Lebron's done it once every blue moon...but in order to establish that assassin ability, you have to take every opportunity to make it happen. I just haven't seen Lebron do that enough...and last night was just another example of him willing to pass it off rather than be the one to make the most critical shot of the game.



oh i and i feel ya, but i meant it more tounge-in-cheek saying we blow teams out, so the game winners aren't necessary. :D


----------



## L O V E L I F E

ryanlaughlin said:


> *
> i'm not discussing championships*



Those four words alone illustrate how little you know about what's important in sports.


----------



## relaxwv

missed free throws are killing den and cle


----------



## undead

L O V E L I F E said:


> Those four words alone illustrate how little you know about what's important in sports.



i'm totally biting the bait dude, but you're so good at it. 

anyways, that narrow minded conclusion shows how little you care about details.

the ultimate goal is to have a team of great players who play great together... which gives you a championship. lebron is one of those great players, unfortunately he's had less than great to work with. while the team around him is beginning to get better, his supporting cast is still no LA lakers. kobe bryant is great and the team around him could be easily argued is better than the cavs. and again i never said that lebron was better than kobe, which would even mean that the fulcrum point on our team is less than that of yours.

there are discussions inside sports that actually don't involve talking about championships. there are other details in sports that LEAD to championships, but we were discussing those details not the championships themselves. now we're discussing semantics. what's the point?

this is why i should just drop it because arguing with you about it is like arguing with my wife (if i were married that is ) because i'm never right, i'll never be right, and nothing i ever say is important because the baby didn't come out of MY vagina. god forbid i didn't rage my sports boner by talking about the zero trophies LBJ's brought us in his 5 full seasons, when kobe had 2 by that time and was on his way to a third. in three years, if the cavs won this and the next 2... you'd still chastise LBJ because it took him longer to do it.

i like you LL... you're a good dude, but i'm certainly not worried about not knowing whats important in sports. i've played them long enough and have been a contributing factor on good baseball teams and soccer teams and i was a good cross country runner also (varsity on the only undefeated team in our school's history) (i know... gaaaaay), so trust me, i KNOW how important winning a championship is.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

I like and respect you, too, ryan.

And, for the record, if, hypothetically, LeBron helps his team win ONE championship, I'll start to consider that he's in Kobe's league.

But he's not.

Yet.

Peace (and a sincere "good luck" to your Cavs - I honestly hope they win, so that we, the fans, get to enjoy the best Finals possible) - and I'm not even a Lakers fan - I'm a broken-hearted Knicks fan who simply LOVES THIS GAME! 

Peace On You, Ryan,

LL


----------



## undead

awww... peace on me? naw man, we aren't done being friends if the argument dies. :D

now i wanna keep arguing damn it!

i think i've come to the conclusion that we're just TWO different types of sports fans. you've got those 3 championships and by that if nothing else gives you a better perspective of what it takes to get a championship.

i just think you seem more like a big picture kind of guy because you've got the championships and you've got a basis for arguement where i'm more of a micromanage kind of guy because i'm still trying to see what it takes for CLEVELAND to win a championship. both effective (fanwise), just that my way may take lots of time. plus... maybe if it never happens. you'll forget by then.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Congrats, Denver.

Excellent comeback.

Billups is one clutch motherfucker.

Looks like BOTH of these Conference Finals might go 7.

I love this game.


----------



## axl blaze

L O V E L I F E said:


> Until then, he's a very rich man's Tracy McGrady.
> 
> Dwayne Wade has a better argument that he's in Kobe's class than LeBron does.



oh man! that first one was below the belt. you don't really believe that do you?

and D-Wade had the help of the man who let Kobe Bryant ride on his back... need I even say his name? 

you should be the World's Biggest Shaq-Fu Fan than Kobe.


----------



## undead

oh and btw, i just added two and two... sorry bout your knicks brother, but then do you still consider the 3 championships "yours" so to speak? or no. either way... i think my previous point still stands, because you've been watching kobe for YEARS, eh?


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Shaquille O'Neal, after his TENTH season, having played alongside All-American Chris Jackson at LSU, and with First Team All-Star Penny Hardaway:

"I've won at every level except college and pro."

Funny?

Yes.

Can win a title without MASSIVE help from Kobe/Wade?

Hasn't EVER done it.


----------



## axl blaze

I have always been a Chauncey Billups fan, with me being so close to the D. most Cavs fans despise Detroit, but I liked the way the Bad Boys played basketball. it reminded me of how we all played basketball, growing up as kids, at the park. it is just how the game is played, and that's how the game was played.

just think about how many hard fouls Jordan collected in his day. now think about how our modern superstars would do if confronted with such hard fouls. it would definitely change the landscape of scoring.

here I go, rambling about basketball again. I could sit here all day and wax poetic about this game.

LL: I kinda forgot but couldn't one say Wade and Bryant are several steps up the basketball skill-set totem poll?


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

axl blaze said:


> don't give in to LL's man crush on Kobe and the insane luck the Magic have for all things three points, just yet, ryanlaughlin.
> 
> the Magic are good, and are playing better right now than I ever thought. Dwight Howard doesn't get enough pressure from Z and the Cavs backcourt in Mo Williams and Delonte West (who have usually been on fire) are not making any shots. LeBron James is by far the best player in the NBA this year (even LL has to defer to this statement) and he is playing like it by dropping 50 points like it ain't no thang.
> 
> this is why I didn't want to play Orlando. they aren't the best basketball team, but they get hot and they can smoke teams by all of a sudden igniting their three point attack.
> 
> Cleveland needs adversity. Los Angeles had none last year and that allowed them to get stomped in the Finals.
> 
> 
> 
> the Cavs under LBJ have already made it to the Finals, before.



yeah im aware of that lol, everyone saw them get spanked last year by boston i was referring to this year.....


----------



## Benefit

Wowzers. Maybe Lebron doesn't like taking those last second shots, but that was a real humdinger. He's starting to creep on Kobe. I don't think even the biggest Kobe apologists can deny that for much longer. 

After having watched Kobe Bryant for basically his entire career, I no longer believe you can make the case he's in the same league as Michael Jordan. Is he better than Lebron? I don't know. That's one of those stupid arguments like Kirk vs. Picard. I'm not even going to weigh in on it. 

I'll tell you one thing though. Lebron's teammates genuinely love the guy. I don't think you should dismiss that fact - it's important, because they'll play hard for him and go to bat for him. And Kobe's teammates I think genuinely fucking hate him. As big of a Kobe fan as I am, he is a big whiny arrogant asshole who constantly complains and as soon as he passes the ball he will immediately demand it back which is very weird... that kinda shit is not going to endear him to people. Maybe that is why you're seeing such inconsistency from the Lakers; it sometimes seems like they don't really like each other. Bill Simmons, who I think is a dingbat, said that all the "camaraderie" of the Lakers seems excessively forced and I could not agree more. When Kobe says "My teammates are like brothers to me" you just KNOW that is not true in any way. It sounds exactly like a forced line from one of those stupid NBA public service announcement commercials that the players are contractually obligated to appear in. 

Just listen to Smush Parker bad mouth Kobe now that he's better known as a valet punching wino than a guy with one of the dumbest nicknames in the NBA. That's the mothafuckin truth.


----------



## L2R

wow, what a climax. just wow. 

made me literally LOL


----------



## LapDawg

Benefit said:


> Wowzers. Maybe Lebron doesn't like taking those last second shots, but that was a real humdinger. He's starting to creep on Kobe. I don't think even the biggest Kobe apologists can deny that for much longer.
> 
> After having watched Kobe Bryant for basically his entire career, I no longer believe you can make the case he's in the same league as Michael Jordan. Is he better than Lebron? I don't know. That's one of those stupid arguments like Kirk vs. Picard. I'm not even going to weigh in on it.
> 
> I'll tell you one thing though. Lebron's teammates genuinely love the guy. I don't think you should dismiss that fact - it's important, because they'll play hard for him and go to bat for him. And Kobe's teammates I think genuinely fucking hate him. As big of a Kobe fan as I am, he is a big whiny arrogant asshole who constantly complains and as soon as he passes the ball he will immediately demand it back which is very weird... that kinda shit is not going to endear him to people. Maybe that is why you're seeing such inconsistency from the Lakers; it sometimes seems like they don't really like each other. Bill Simmons, who I think is a dingbat, said that all the "camaraderie" of the Lakers seems excessively forced and I could not agree more. When Kobe says "My teammates are like brothers to me" you just KNOW that is not true in any way. It sounds exactly like a forced line from one of those stupid NBA public service announcement commercials that the players are contractually obligated to appear in.
> 
> Just listen to Smush Parker bad mouth Kobe now that he's better known as a valet punching wino than a guy with one of the dumbest nicknames in the NBA. That's the mothafuckin truth.



Is it Kobe's fault that Pau is a total softie, or that Bynum is inconsistent as hell?

As a natural leader I agree Lebron is more like Jordan than Kobe is, however. Kobe leads in his own way and that may not endear him to his teammates, but if it can lead to a championship, that's all that needs to be said.

Helluva shot by Lebron. Pure rhythm. 

WTF was Rashard doing? He's 7 inches shorter than you dude...get your ass in front of Moe so he can't make an easy direct pass to Lebron...ridiculous.


----------



## Max Power

I don't know why LeBron wasn't double teamed on the last possession in game 2.

Why was Lewis even worrying about the guy throwing the ball in?! Who cares about that guy, there isn't enough time for him to do anything. Double team LeBron!!!


----------



## axl blaze

to Orlando's defensive credit, Mo Williams was regarded as the best shooter on the Cavs all year and would usually take those kind of shots all season.

and to their credit, saying there needs to be two guys on the best all-around athlete in the NBA is a lot easier said than done.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Benefit said:


> *
> Wowzers. Maybe Lebron doesn't like taking those last second shots, but that was a real humdinger. He's starting to creep on Kobe. I don't think even the biggest Kobe apologists can deny that for much longer.
> 
> After having watched Kobe Bryant for basically his entire career, I no longer believe you can make the case he's in the same league as Michael Jordan. Is he better than Lebron? I don't know. That's one of those stupid arguments like Kirk vs. Picard. I'm not even going to weigh in on it.
> 
> I'll tell you one thing though. Lebron's teammates genuinely love the guy. I don't think you should dismiss that fact - it's important, because they'll play hard for him and go to bat for him. And Kobe's teammates I think genuinely fucking hate him. As big of a Kobe fan as I am, he is a big whiny arrogant asshole who constantly complains and as soon as he passes the ball he will immediately demand it back which is very weird... that kinda shit is not going to endear him to people. Maybe that is why you're seeing such inconsistency from the Lakers; it sometimes seems like they don't really like each other. Bill Simmons, who I think is a dingbat, said that all the "camaraderie" of the Lakers seems excessively forced and I could not agree more. When Kobe says "My teammates are like brothers to me" you just KNOW that is not true in any way. It sounds exactly like a forced line from one of those stupid NBA public service announcement commercials that the players are contractually obligated to appear in.
> 
> Just listen to Smush Parker bad mouth Kobe now that he's better known as a valet punching wino than a guy with one of the dumbest nicknames in the NBA. That's the mothafuckin truth.*



GREAT post, Benefit.

Especially the part about Bill Simmons being a dingbat.

He's a good but not great writer, he certainly knows his pop-cultural references, and I give him tremendous credit for having a great business plan back in the 90's, when no one really knew how many outside-of-the-box opportunities would be created by the invention of internet.

That said, he's CONSISTENTLY one of the biggest homers/sore losers I've ever read - I don't care if he says he's "writing from the fans' perspective" - man up, Billy,  and say that you're writing from the "Boston sports fans' perspective," and I'll at least give you some credit for being honest.

And worse yet, his complete lack of understanding of math, logic, odds and gambling are bad enough; the fact that he holds himself out to be a guru at these subjects, when he couldn't pass Stats 101 at a Community College (judging by some of the non-logic he regularly spouts on these subjects) is despicable.

And, yes, I've written him to correct his complete lack of understanding of simple mathematical concepts, and shockingly, that name-dropping megalomaniac didn't answer or address a single one.

I haven't met him, but based on his columns, I respect a lot of things about his talents, but that said, he seems like a complete douchebag.


----------



## axl blaze

Bill Simmons is your stereotypical Boston bias sports fan, whose logic seems to be affected heavily by that dirty water. he can be fun to read, as long as you preface each column he authored with these thoughts.


----------



## LapDawg

axl blaze said:


> to Orlando's defensive credit, Mo Williams was regarded as the best shooter on the Cavs all year and would usually take those kind of shots all season.
> 
> and to their credit, saying there needs to be two guys on the best all-around athlete in the NBA is a lot easier said than done.



I'm sorry axl...this doesn't really make much sense to me...

Mo was inbounding the ball...so that's not Orlando gaining any defensive credit there. 

Lebron wasn't even close to being double-teamed...nor was it in their mind to do so, as Van Gundy said he was trying to defend a lob pass to Lebron to tie it up (which would've been a lot better than giving up the 3 mind you). 

So...c'mon dude...you can't give ANY credit to Orlando for what they did defensively at the end there. It was a hack job that led to a great Lebron moment because of Orlando's ineptitude at defense. All you need to do is look to the other Conference finals and see how vitally important it can be to guard the inbounds pass.

Way to go Master of Panic...


----------



## axl blaze

LOL @ "Master of Panic"

yeah, I just realized Mo Williams inbounded the pass a couple minutes ago watching the clip.

obviously, they were attempting a lob pass and initially it was well defended by Turkoglu. while there wasn't a double team on LBJ in the most strict definition, there was some help defense by another Magic defender (Rashard Lewish, maybe?). I remember watching two pairs of hands going up.

I love berating Stan Van Gundy as much as the next guy, but I wouldn't quite put this entirely on his shoulders. how can you coach somebody like Hedo to D up on someone like LBJ? I'm sure SVD warned about the lob pass, and then what? would you have preferred he told his team to foul or something (not effective coaching plan for buzzer beaters IMO)?


----------



## LapDawg

^Well I would've definitely liked the Master of Panic to tell Rashard to guard Moe much closer, rather than pretend he's guarding him. Odom's affected two inbounds passes against the Nuggets in critical moments...Rashard had the same advantage with his length like Odom did against Carter in game 1...instead Rashard basically gave Moe 5 feet to make a clean bullet pass to Lebron.

I have no problem w/ Hedo's defense...but that second pair of hands was Rashard, and he wasn't even close to Lebron after his buffoonery at guarding the inbounds pass.

Stan said he blames himself...and so I blame him too heh.


----------



## undead

wow... clearly the better team won tonight. the cavs absolutely sucked. i could have made more shots than that with both hands bound behind my back. further validating all the naysayers. for shame cavs... for shame.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

TOMORROW NIGHT is the type of game the all-time (I'll speak for who *I've* seen - mid 70's till now) clutch players (like Kareem, Dr. J, Moses, Magic, Bird, Isiah, Bernard, MJ, Reggie, Hakeem, Kobe and Wade) come through in the clutch - when they convinve not only themselves, but their TEAMMATES that 

"We're the heavily favored team;

we played better than them ALL YEAR LONG, 

and even though we've played like shit all week, 

if EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US gives it our all tomorrow night, 

and plays like this game as if it is the game of our lives, 

then we can go back home, with momentum on our side AND with home court advantage.  

If we lose tomorrow night. . . we're in big fucking trouble.  

Let's fucking win!" 

And then walk the walk.

Let's see if LeBron's ready to join them.

And even though I'm unabashedly a huge Kobe fan, 

as a fan of the sport, I am actually rooting for LeBron to do just that tomorrow night.

I love this game!


----------



## LiLCv2

Orlandos got this shit on wax, it should just be dwight howard and lebron james in a 1 on 1 game for the conference title.


----------



## undead

**



L O V E L I F E said:


> TOMORROW NIGHT is the type of game the all-time (I'll speak for who *I've* seen - mid 70's till now) clutch players (like Kareem, Dr. J, Moses, Magic, Bird, Isiah, Bernard, MJ, Reggie, Hakeem, Kobe and Wade) come through in the clutch - when they convinve not only themselves, but their TEAMMATES that
> 
> "We're the heavily favored team;
> 
> we played better than them ALL YEAR LONG,
> 
> and even though we've played like shit all week,
> 
> if EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US gives it our all tomorrow night,
> 
> and plays like this game as if it is the game of our lives,
> 
> then we can go back home, with momentum on our side AND with home court advantage.
> 
> If we lose tomorrow night. . . we're in big fucking trouble.
> 
> Let's fucking win!"
> 
> And then walk the walk.
> 
> Let's see if LeBron's ready to join them.
> 
> And even though I'm unabashedly a huge Kobe fan,
> 
> as a fan of the sport, I am actually rooting for LeBron to do just that tomorrow night.
> 
> I love this game!



i'm so butthurt for you right now.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Yeah cleveland bettere do something after that very sub par game....GO MAGIC


----------



## axl blaze

Cleveland got straight outplayed last game. my hat goes off to the Magic.

the Cavs have to be feeling pretty good, because despite playing a horrible (shot-wise) basketball game, they almost won. Orlando was hot and cold again with their shots, but mostly missing their shots for the first three quarters. they hit them when they needed to.

the only reason why Cleveland was still in the ball game because of their solid defensive play.

if the Cavs lose this game it is pretty much over. LBJ can't do much more, but he needs to keep on stepping up and hopefully inspire Delonte West and Mo Williams a little more (offensively).

Thieveland needs to take advantage of Orlando's sloppy home play.

we'll see tonight, the pressure's on, adversity is in full affect for the the Cavs. I love this game.


----------



## Max Power

Who was it that missed the game winning shot just now?

Oh wait, was that LeBron?


----------



## undead

it's not like he was even given a decent look at the basket. that was just a fugly game by the cavs. they had, once again, no business winning that game. again they played like shit. lebron played decently, west played decently, but the cavs consistently failed to convert on turnovers and never made the shots they needed. lebron shouldn't have even been in the position to take that shot. the game shouldn't have been that close. the cavs (as a team) let lebron down. they're still expecting him to carry the load.

what a fucking joke.

i'm not ruling the cavs out yet, but down 3-1 against the magic is a TERRIBLE place to be if you're the cavs. this series is all but over and it makes me sad to say that.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

GOOO MAGIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Where yall cleveland fans at now huh? What was that about free throws? Magic proving all the naysayers wrong....


----------



## poopie

lovin' dwight and rashard right now!!!


----------



## undead

as a cavs fan, i've not been comfortable with the free throws from our side. had lebron made those two toward the end of the game we may have never been in OT in the first place. so it was a DAMN good thing he made the two to tie it up.

point being. the cavs free throwing was a huge downfall for us tonight. we'd have been better from the line, we may have won the game easily.


----------



## undead

oh and not to discredit the magic. they played great tonight. their outside shooting was as usual, deadly tonight. you try to stop them in the paint and they kick it out and around the perimeter to put up the open 3... they've always got good 3 point shooters. or so it seems that alston, pietris, and lewis can't miss. when turkoglu runs that pick and roll he either gets the open shot every time or has that man to kick it out to... we NEVER play well off that shit.

magic are just too much for the cavs to handle.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

ryanlaughlin said:


> as a cavs fan, i've not been comfortable with the free throws from our side. had lebron made those two toward the end of the game we may have never been in OT in the first place. so it was a DAMN good thing he made the two to tie it up.
> 
> point being. the cavs free throwing was a huge downfall for us tonight. we'd have been better from the line, we may have won the game easily.



Come on bro we could have said that about the magics loss but we didn't. The magic stepped up tonight big time and put the Cavs in their place. I am very proud of Dwight Howard for making his free throws when he needed to. I don't believe that the tecnical foul Dwight Howard was assesed with should stand under review,because flexing after you convert an and one should not be taunting, after all he is SUPERMAN !


----------



## Max Power

Exactly. 

You can play "what if" on BOTH sides all day.

What if LeBron doesn't get that bullshit call at the end of the game against Peitrus? Then he doesn't even go to the line to win. 

What if Howard gets the call against Varejo at the end of regulation? Then he hits just one free throw and its over.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

What if Lebron missed that last second three pointer in our loss? SERIES OVER lol......We could do this all day.....


----------



## undead

hey BFQ's... you may have missed this post. the magic did their part and contained the cavs as well as hit their shots. good on them, they played well, i'm not denying that.



ryanlaughlin said:


> oh and not to discredit the magic. they played great tonight. their outside shooting was as usual, deadly tonight. you try to stop them in the paint and they kick it out and around the perimeter to put up the open 3... they've always got good 3 point shooters. or so it seems that alston, pietris, and lewis can't miss. when turkoglu runs that pick and roll he either gets the open shot every time or has that man to kick it out to... we NEVER play well off that shit.
> 
> magic are just too much for the cavs to handle.


----------



## johanneschimpo

That's fine with me. If the Magic represent the East, that's just an easier team for the Lakers to play in the finals. (They'll also have homecourt!)


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Ladies and Gentleman, your 2009 World Champion Los Angeles Lakers!


----------



## axl blaze

basketball is a great game of "what ifs." it's just better to not even go there.

looks like Cleveland is down and out. I give props to the Orlando Magic. what else can I say when my beloved Cleveland Cavaliers fall short by just about one point each game? Cleveland doesn't match up well against Orlando, we all knew this coming in. LeBron James is the best player in the league but even he can't beat a team that hits their 3s so consistently.

all I ever wanted was the downtrodden city of Cleveland to win a championship. I hate the Cleveland Browns, so this was the only ticket for the city of rock n roll to obtain a championship. this is my sob story, but I am sticking to it.

looks like I have to WITNESS another Los Angeles Lakers championship.


----------



## smotpoker

dude don't count the cavs out yet. Gotta win 3 straight, but 2 of those will be at home. One game at a time is all it is!


----------



## L O V E L I F E

smotpoker said:


> *
> dude don't count the cavs out yet. Gotta win 3 straight, but 2 of those will be at home. One game at a time is all it is!*



I actually like your reasoning.

Providing that the team who is down 1-3 is actually the superior team.

But in this case, alas, all of the relevant evidence points to the idea that AT BEST, these teams are about equal (and, to be honest, the MOST important piece of evidence is "who has been controlling this series?" - and the answer to that question is unquestionably the Magic.

As a sports fan, I hope that I am forced to eat my words, but to be honest, I think it's even more likely that the Magic close this one out IN CLEVELAND tomorrow night in 5, than it is that the Cavs "magically" become significantly better overnight and win the series.

I hope I'm wrong, but in this case, I'm pretty sure I'm not.


----------



## Max Power

johanneschimpo said:


> That's fine with me. If the Magic represent the East, that's just an easier team for the Lakers to play in the finals. (They'll also have homecourt!)



No one gives the Magic ANY CREDIT!

I heard everyone talk about how the Cavs were going to sweep Orlando. At best, they'll win maybe one game tops. Cavs are going to dominate.

Yeah, we see how that worked out.

And now the Lakers are a sure bet to win it all!? As far as I know, that Nuggets/Lakers series is faaaar from over!!

You guys crack me up. 8)

Nuggets/Magic finals. 

Magic win it all.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

agreed MaxPowers, here we go with the Magic hate train again lol


----------



## axl blaze

who said that the Cavs were going to sweep the Magic?

any Cavs fan worth their salt KNOWS that the Orlando Magic match up horrible against the Cavs.  Cleveland has two guys who are 6'2" for chrissake in their starting lineup. 

nobody gives the Magic credit because their coach is sub-par, and people think that they get lucky with those three point shots. you could argue the case for both of those statements.

I suppose I shouldn't count out Cleveland just yet. I still believe that the Cavs are the better team, it's just difficult to compete against Orlando who is a team that has all the momentum and is a team that literally throw up the most hideously fugly three point shot from downtown - only to have it hit the backboard and go in (I still say that they should have to call "glass" in the NBA).   after all, anything can happen in the NBA playoffs, especially when you have LeBron James on your team.



MaxPowers said:


> Who was it that missed the game winning shot just now?
> 
> Oh wait, was that LeBron?



and you seriously want to go there? that shot would have been near impossible for even the best athlete in modern sports to make. I know we are all used to LBJ making those kinds of god-like shots, but I doubt even the best NBA shooters could have hit that.


----------



## poopie

magic's three point percentage was a ridiculous ~48% last night!

i was hoping they'd rescind that tech against dwight, but...

and i think i'd rather see orlando go up against la, than denver. chauncy knows his way around the magic, i think.

i think that people are really surprised by the magic. during these playoffs it seems that "good" teams have gotten beat by the very "lucky" magic. but, it's the magic playing as a true team, utilizing awesome bench points and not just depending on one key player.

dude...game 5!


----------



## Max Power

I heard friends, strangers, radio hosts, and a couple ESPN commentators say Cleveland was going to sweep the Magic.

Maybe no one here said it, maybe no one you know said it.

Hey, I thought they were crazy to say that too.




But anyway, yeah I seriously wanna go there!

Some people think because he made that one shot at the end of game two that he is now a clutch player who is known for making those game winning shots.

Truth of the matter is, that was the first of his career (speaking strictly of the playoffs)

It's just ONE SHOT. That's it. All of a sudden they want to crown him for being Reggie Miller or Robert Horry.

No.

It was ONE SHOT.

That's why I was laughing when he missed the three last night. I hope that shut the nut huggers up.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

L O V E L I F E said:


> Ladies and Gentleman, your 2009 World Champion Los Angeles Lakers!



Little early? ;-)


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Dwight Howard's ridiculous technical foul from last night was rescinded, so he has 2 more to give. That's a lot better than 1 lol, so mabey we'll see Dwight on his best behavior from here on out in the playoffs. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed Dwight being grabbed, pulled, pushed, clawed, attempted MMA Takedown, everything! It's not suprising he reacts the way he does.....


----------



## poopie

i'm totally biased, b/c i  dwight, but i agree.

williams was getting so aggressive with him!

he looks like he tries to take it all in stride, but dude, the man is gonna get frustrated. hedo's got 4 too!

i am so happy to hear about the tech. being lifted! i mean, gortat was great in a pinch against philly, but can't risk that anymore!


----------



## axl blaze

poopie said:


> magic's three point percentage was a ridiculous ~48% last night!
> 
> i was hoping they'd rescind that tech against dwight, but...



Orlando has been essentially on fire all the way until that last win in Boston.

in today's sports news, I believe that the league took away the tech awarded to Dwight Howard. I agree with this decision; because he wasn't taunting or being malicious in any way. nothing wrong with a player making a play and getting hyped up about it. this is the NBA - not the more strict NFL. hell, I just saw Andrew Bynum fist pump an attendee at the Staples center just now.



MaxPowers said:


> I heard friends, strangers, radio hosts, and a couple ESPN commentators say Cleveland was going to sweep the Magic.
> 
> Maybe no one here said it, maybe no one you know said it.
> 
> Hey, I thought they were crazy to say that too.



ok  today, I was thinking a lot about the Cleveland/Orlando series so far. the Orlando Magic have been playing their hearts out, and getting hot with their three point shots. the Cleveland Cavs have been pretty stagnant and mediocre at times.

however, every game the Cavs are only a shot away from winning. how are they so close when the Magic are playing so cohesive and Cleveland is reverting back to its LeBron James 1 VS 5 offense?

these facts comfort me. it makes me think that Cleveland can be the 9th team in NBA history to come back and win the series after down 3-1.



poopie said:


> and i think i'd rather see orlando go up against la, than denver. chauncy knows his way around the magic, i think.



I've said it before many times and I will say it again, the Denver Nuggers and George Carl got a steal in Chauncey Billups.

myself being a respectable Midwestern Hoops Gentleman; I have always loved Billups in Detroit.

are their any Nuggets fans repping in Bluelight? I know we have tons of those stoner, skiing types here. they have to get down and smoke headies and watch the Nug-Nugs at their resort in the mountains?

Birdman is a pimp, BTW. anybody who fails so many drug tests for cocaine is okay in my book.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Love my Lakers........

But damn Birdman is awesome


----------



## LapDawg

L O V E L I F E said:


> Ladies and Gentleman, your 2009 World Champion Los Angeles Lakers!



Hahaha...well hey, while I live in LakerLand...I think Orlando is the tougher matchup. Even though it was just the regular season, the Magic swept the Lakers. Yes, so did the Bobcats, but when you see Dwight as determined as he's been...the Laker bigs must be concerned. The Thuggets are a nice test as they're deeper at the position, but I have a feeling Dwight will be given superstar status in the Finals.

Rashard has done a lot of growing up in these playoffs...but can he do it in the Finals? Experience may be the ultimate decider...but the Magic are a very balanced squad that the Lakers have yet to figure out this season. 

Sounds like a great NBA Finals should it happen...


----------



## L O V E L I F E

^^^^^^^

reverse-jinx / false humility!

You know it's over, brother!


----------



## axl blaze

LapDawg said:


> Rashard has done a lot of growing up in these playoffs...but can he do it in the Finals? Experience may be the ultimate decider...but the Magic are a very balanced squad that the Lakers have yet to figure out this season.



Rashard Lewis is tall and can bomb the threes, but he isn't the guy who stepped up the most in these NBA Finals.

Rafeer Alston, or "Skip to my Lou," was probably perceived as the weakest link in the Magic starting lineup. he has been anything but that, changing his attitude and gameplay after the Magic almost got upset by the lowly 76ers in the first round. Rafeer Alston pisses me off, as he is probably the only AND 1 basketball player who has translated well into the NBA (I still think they should give The Professor a chance).

sometimes I think that the Magic are just destined to win this series. an example of this was last Cavs/Magic game when Dwight fucking Howard dropped a three point shot. that is just ugly luck.

if the Cavs somehow make it past this huge road block; I would want them to play the LA Lakers.

the Denver Nuggets pose a much more versatile threat with great down court play from Nene, Birdman, and Kenyon Martin. Chauncey Billups is always a factor too.

you just don't know what you are going to get with the Lakers. every time they have lost in these playoffs they have lost BIG. they have easily the most talent in the NBA, but half the time they play uninspired and lethargic basketball.

just like the advertising agencies are pushing; I am also hoping for a Cleveland/LA Finals.


----------



## axl blaze

LapDawg said:


> ... The Thuggets...



I think you have been hanging with Marc Cuban too much. he's rubbing off on you!


----------



## fatallyflawed

The nuggets are also a very good transition team, I do not think the magic are close in that respect.

But I comment no more as we still need one more.


----------



## LapDawg

axl blaze said:


> I think you have been hanging with Marc Cuban too much. he's rubbing off on you!



If only I was hanging with Cuban...that'd be fun. 

The Nuggets thrive on their thug/punk attitude. Example: game 4 against the Lakers. It was getting ridiculous how outlandish they were acting. 

I much preferred when the Warriors were the punks in the playoffs...at least Cuban respected them heh.

And yes, Alston has been a savior to the season in covering for Nelson pretty well. However, Rashard always had a rep for being a 4th quarter dud, and he's changed that this year...hence his growth as a player.


----------



## Max Power

If the Magic don't win tonight, I swear I'll cut LOVELIFE's 2 inch dick off in anger!!!


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Wow...such hostility......In other news i know its only half time but how did Cleveland blow a 22 point lead that quick?


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Good game cleveland, they stepped up tonight big time and won there second game of the series. Looks like we are going to have to take this one at home.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

MaxPowers said:


> *
> If the Magic don't win tonight, I swear I'll cut LOVELIFE's 2 inch dick off in anger!!!*



Don't worry, Kid.

I was so impressed wit the Cavs ability to almost try to lose a game tonight, a game that David Stern and the NBA were bending over backwards to let them win, that I immediately became flaccid.

So now, you can try cutting off my ONE inch cock - it's no longer hard.


----------



## axl blaze

the David Stern excuse is a double edged sword for a bandwagon Laker fan, my man. he wants Kobe just as much in the Finals as LeBron.

looks like the Cleveland LeBrons did it again. that was one of the most dominant performances I have seen in basketball since LBJ did it against Detroit (when they were good) in 06.

normally I wouldn't give much teams any chance when they are facing elimination in the next two games. however, when LeBron is on your team (or is the whole team) anything can happen.

in other news, it was great to have another player besides The King score more than 20 points this series. props to Mo Williams.


----------



## smotpoker

Told you all not to give up on the Cavs! The barely got beat last time in Orlabdo, so I don't think anyone doubts they can get the win Saturday night. And if they win Saturday, I would then say the chances are on their side!

But win or lose Saturday, you gotta tip your hats to both teams for one helluva series. I normally don't care about the NBA at all, but this series has made me a fan of the whole league.

And isn't  it comical when people come on here and try to blame the refs for whether or not teams lose? (Talkin to u Lovelife   )

Oh well, excuses don't get u anywhere.
Go Cavs!


----------



## axl blaze

officiating in the NBA is universally horrid, it is just something you have to accept and adapt to. there really is no use in complaining about it because you know how it is going to be.


----------



## fatallyflawed

^ya with the mafia deciding whats a foul or not


----------



## Benefit

I have noticed something tonight that is very interesting. 

When Kobe doesn't take all the shots, and instead involves his teammates, the Lakers are really good.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Kobe as of last year for the most part has been that way. He has not be such a I am a superstar suck my nights guy like hat anymore.

When you think he is handling the ball to much is when everyone else cant do shit and he has no choice!


----------



## L2R

one hour till game sicks

i don't manage to catch many games due to the time differences so i enjoy whichever ones i do. not rooting for anyone but the underdogs.


----------



## JV

i dont pray, but i am praying the cavs can pull one out in orlando tonight.

GO CAVS!


----------



## Max Power

JV said:


> i dont pray, but i am praying the cavs can pull one out in orlando tonight.
> 
> GO CAVS!



proof praying never works.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Goooooooooo Magic!!!!! Great series cleveland, you"ve brought the very best out of my beloved hometown team.....


----------



## fatallyflawed

Well I think that the transition of the Lakers will be a bit much for Magic

Lakers win 4-2


----------



## grimble crumble

im going to the finals for one of the games at the staples center!!! 

lakers in 7

lakers definetily need production from odom. Its a good sign the last two games hes really started to play the way hes capable with 20 points and 14 rebounds. I think that back injury affected him a little more then he let on.

also bynum really needs to stay out of foul trouble so he can be a presence on defence, and help with howard and rebounds.

the magic cant play kobe the way they defended lebron because kobe has a team around him that will score if hes doubled.


----------



## fatallyflawed

but I think the Lakers can play a fast paced ball and lose them in the transition much like they started doing to Houston till Yao got hurt.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Without getting any of you lakers fans all riled up and hating on me, I dont think that this series will be so cut and dry..... Does anyone else feel that Lebron James showed unsportsmanlike conduct when he walked off the court saturday night, didnt shake any of the magics hands, say congratualtions, or even attend the post game press conference? The guys on Pardon The Interuption were just debating it, was wondering how everyone felt about it.....


----------



## axl blaze

^ not the most classy move for LeBron James, but hey, at least he didn't rape anybody.

he was probably raging, his Cavs were easily the favorite and they got up-ended by what was a vastly inferior opponent (according to the experts before the series). he just wants to win a title so hard. also, I think it's hilarious coming from a Magic/Dwight Howard fan. how many Ts does Superman have? how many Ts has LBJ EVER had?

I suspect that he can pay the fine the NBA will drop on him :D


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

It really wasnt about the technical foul, it was more of being a bad sport..... I still like the guy though. Anyone else notice when he was interviewed today he had a NY hat on?


----------



## Max Power

I have no respect for LeBron James.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

axl blaze said:


> *
> ^ not the most classy move for LeBron James, but hey, at least he didn't rape anybody.*



Kobe Bryant has been convicted of rape AT MOST the exact same amount of times as you have.

On the bright side, LeBron James has won EXACTLY as many GAMES in The NBA Finals in his entire career as you have.

You're in good company, Sir.


----------



## axl blaze

^ hehe - I was half-joking, but in all seriousness how do you know if I have been convicted of rape or not? 



Liquid1nsanity said:


> It really wasnt about the technical foul, it was more of being a bad sport..... I still like the guy though. Anyone else notice when he was interviewed today he had a NY hat on?



it's no secret that LBJ loves the Yankees. in fact, while attending an Indians/Yanks game he sported a NY hat (which I'm sure most of you know of), much to the dismay of Cleveland fans everywhere. the only thing that I do not like about LBJ, is much like LL, he is the premier bandwagon sports fan.

example, his favorite teams in all sports are the Chicago Bulls, the Dallas Cowboys, and the New York Yankees. all of these teams were balls-deep in dynasty mode in the 90s when an aspiring LBJ was growing up. at least pick your favorite sports teams on what colors look the best, at least that adds some idiosyncracy to it. 



MaxPowers said:


> I have no respect for LeBron James.



no surprise here. a true lover and scholar of the game of basketball undeniably is compelled to love LBJ on the court. his off-court presence truly does not ignite any disrespect, so I am assuming you are talking about his on-court prowess.

eh, I am being kinda mean. I just wrote a five page paper and I am still disgusted over the Cavs loss. I still think you all are a-okay, I promise.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Liquid1nsanity said:


> Without getting any of you lakers fans all riled up and hating on me, I dont think that this series will be so cut and dry..... Does anyone else feel that Lebron James showed unsportsmanlike conduct when he walked off the court saturday night, didnt shake any of the magics hands, say congratualtions, or even attend the post game press conference? The guys on Pardon The Interuption were just debating it, was wondering how everyone felt about it.....



He was mad, so what. I would have been pissed to losing my chance at the title this year and being so close.


----------



## fatallyflawed

axl blaze said:


> example, his favorite teams in all sports are the , *the Dallas Cowboys*,



Name your place!


----------



## forgotmypen

When you're Lebron, of course you can't pick your nose outside of your house. If fucking Vladimir Radmanovich stormed off the court and ditched the media after a loss, not a soul would notice. Does that make it ok, though? Up for debate, but it's the very same action. When you're paid superspacebucks, you just can't do shit like that. He's supposed to be the babyface. Not shaking a dude's hand after losing, meh, whatever. But not having the business-sense to own up to it the morning after? He's gotta get a new PR guy. But who give's a shit anyway about "class" or "respect" or the guy's personality? If he keeps making shots, everyone gets paid. He's a basketball player.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

axl blaze said:


> *
> ^ hehe - I was half-joking, but in all seriousness how do you know if I have been convicted of rape or not?*



You're right.

Since I don't know you personally, I can't be 100 percent certain that you haven't been convicted of rape negative one times.


----------



## Max Power

axl blaze said:


> no surprise here. a true lover and scholar of the game of basketball undeniably is compelled to love LBJ on the court. his off-court presence truly does not ignite any disrespect, so I am assuming you are talking about his on-court prowess.
> 
> eh, I am being kinda mean. I just wrote a five page paper and I am still disgusted over the Cavs loss. I still think you all are a-okay, I promise.



Actually, to be honest, I do respect his game. He's a good player.

He's severely overrated and his off court attitude is disgusting though.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

pullstring said:


> *
> I would have been pissed to losing my chance at the title this year and being so close.*



They had a great season, sure.

But "so close" to winning the Title?

They got DOMINATED for six games  by the same team who's an almost 3 to 1 underdog to lose to the Lakers.

The Cavs were a paper tiger.

LeBron's great - there's no denying it.

But he's NOT Super-clutch YET, and his teammates suck my balls.

2 0 1 0 I N M A D I S O N S Q U A R E G A R D E N ! ! !


----------



## undead

MaxPowers said:


> Actually, to be honest, I do respect his game. He's a good player.
> 
> He's severely overrated and his off court attitude is *disgusting* though.



how do you come to that conclusion? he got pissed off after a series where he got little to no help from his teammates and walked off the court ONE time, he was clearly frustrated and had every right to be, not necessarily at the magic, but at his team and even at himself. i'll not deny that he didn't make any friends or gain any fans during this whole thing and it certainly wasn't good sportsmanship, but the dude's 24 years old. i'm 26 and i'm only STARTING to come into my perfection. he's done so much right in his time in the NBA already, but you can't expect him to do everything right.

that said, we all know he acted like a baby and BELIEVE ME, the cleveland sports media is all over it. there will be enough backlash from this that if he doesn't learn anything from it THEN i'll be fine with you saying his off court attitude is disgusting, but until now, what's he done to make you feel so harshly about him?


----------



## Max Power

His head has gotten too big. If you pay attention to his interviews he's beginning to act as if he's bigger than the game of basketball.

I don't blame him. The media talks about him as if he's the offspring of Jordan and Jesus.


----------



## fatallyflawed

L O V E L I F E said:


> They had a great season, sure.
> 
> But "so close" to winning the Title?
> 
> They got DOMINATED for six games  by the same team who's an almost 3 to 1 underdog to lose to the Lakers.
> 
> The Cavs were a paper tiger.
> 
> LeBron's great - there's no denying it.
> 
> But he's NOT Super-clutch YET, and his teammates suck my balls.
> 
> 2 0 1 0 I N M A D I S O N S Q U A R E G A R D E N ! ! !



yes so close. 

There is only one team in their conference who is getting closer, and 2 frome the West. It was the Conference Finals, all you can get to closer IS the finals!

And I am gonna be hesitant at that 3:1 things. I think it's 2:1


----------



## L O V E L I F E

2.8 to 1.

For entertainment purposes only, of course.


----------



## smotpoker

I guess to appease the sportswriters and media, Lebron should have done what's expected of him and shaken hands. But I do kinda wonder why its always been customary to shake people's hands after you compete against them. I've never understood what the point of doing this is. It's doesn't accomplish anything.

Plus it's not a surprise that the media is making a big deal about this. For some reason Lebron James has a bullseye on his back. Anything and everything he does will be criticized by the media, including something uneventful such as this.

Now let the bashing and all the "smart" people on BL get on my case.


----------



## smotpoker

Funny someone said they got dominated  in 6 games but if they got "dominated", as some guy says, they wouldn't have won 2 games. See, domination would be 4 games to 0, not 4 to 2. You need recheck what domination means.


----------



## jeef

the handshake thing is just good sportsmanship. brons got some serious skills but he needs to learn to be respectful. even kobe stayed to give the celtics props after getting spanked by 39 in game 6.

...i hope ur joking about lebron having a target on his back. the media has done nothing but praise him as possibly being the greatest player ever.

and i agree that they didnt get dominated by the magic. every game except for game6 was really close and couldve gone either way.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Okay, Jameer Nelson is back on the Orlando roster for the finals a little birdy told me, could this be the difference maker? All star point guard Jameer Nelson and rafer austin handling the team, I think that DEFINETLY brings the odds up a little bit more......


----------



## undead

MaxPowers said:


> His head has gotten too big. If you pay attention to his interviews he's beginning to act as if he's bigger than the game of basketball.
> 
> I don't blame him. The media talks about him as if he's the offspring of Jordan and Jesus.



we'll have to agree to disagree (like we usually do :D). again, with the exception of this incident (and the interview that followed it), the only way he's really conducted himself differently in interviews is that he's given off more of a leader presentation than a student presentation. you could say that his head's gotten bigger based on that or you could say that he's been carrying himself more confidently. i think it comes down to how you look at it, realistically. he knew his place when he came into the league and didn't step on toes in cleveland. you can't blame him for being more outspoken now than he was before because, plain and simple, he's the cavs' most notable representative.



			
				smotpoker said:
			
		

> I guess to appease the sportswriters and media, Lebron should have done what's expected of him and shaken hands. But I do kinda wonder why its always been customary to shake people's hands after you compete against them. I've never understood what the point of doing this is. It's doesn't accomplish anything.
> 
> Plus it's not a surprise that the media is making a big deal about this. For some reason Lebron James has a bullseye on his back. Anything and everything he does will be criticized by the media, including something uneventful such as this.



i've never really questioned the shaking hands at the end of a game, but as an athlete (not that it needs mentioning as i'm sure everyone here knows) it's just always been customary. granted i'm not playing at the professional level or anything, but with few exceptions, when the final whistle blows, the personal shit goes right out the window even if only for a moment. i've always been a practitioner of settling my differences on the field (or court, whatever) and even the most intense rivalries or personal vendettas can be cast aside while i shake hands because after all, what's done is done.

that said, i do condone being a good sport, but shaking hands should be a show of personal respect for your opponent not a requirement of the game, IMO. emotions run high in competition and the more intense the competition is the more intense the emotions are gonna be, sometimes they get the better of you... that's all this is. lebron james respects the orlando magic 99% of the time, but that's boring, the 1% is what everyone wants to talk about.


----------



## Max Power

ryanlaughlin said:


> we'll have to agree to disagree (like we usually do :D). again, with the exception of this incident (and the interview that followed it), the only way he's really conducted himself differently in interviews is that he's given off more of a leader presentation than a student presentation. you could say that his head's gotten bigger based on that or you could say that he's been carrying himself more confidently. i think it comes down to how you look at it, realistically. he knew his place when he came into the league and didn't step on toes in cleveland. you can't blame him for being more outspoken now than he was before because, plain and simple, he's the cavs' most notable representative.



You're right, I guess it's a matter of perspective. Personally, I view his comments not as a sign of leadership/confidence but rather sheer arrogance.

C'mon, mate. It's rubbish. Oi.


----------



## fatallyflawed

L O V E L I F E said:


> 2.8 to 1.
> 
> For entertainment purposes only, of course.



Love to see them do it.

But I think the games will be relatively close


----------



## Benefit

Liquid1nsanity said:


> Okay, Jameer Nelson is back on the Orlando roster for the finals a little birdy told me, could this be the difference maker? All star point guard Jameer Nelson and rafer austin handling the team, I think that DEFINETLY brings the odds up a little bit more......




Hahaha. Yeah... guy's been out of the game for 4 months... recovering from shoulder surgery.... out of shape.... and he's going to come into the Finals and contribute in any meaningful way?? What planet are you on dude? Seriously... most bizarrely out of touch idea I've ever heard. A premature return means he will miss probably every shot he takes while getting burned on defense. 

God I hope they are stupid enough to try and put him back in. Although that would take some of the fun out of it. Like Michael Jordan torching Grant Hill with a bum ankle. At some point, it just became spiritually saddening.


----------



## L O V E L I F E

The ONLY way the Lakers lose if you beat the fuck out of Kobe.

I mean, literally physically abuse him.

The Celtics, in 2008, were, with Garnett, Pierce, and with the help of a few bangers off the bench, able to physically punish him, and to their credit, the 2008 Celtics are within the miniscule minority of NBA teams who win The Finals despite their opponent having CLEARLY the best player on the court at all times.

Not sure the Magic's style is conducive to that.

Howard sure as hell is gonna punish him when he drives into the paint, but I don't see any of the Magic smaller players doing much to rattle him.

Lakers in FOUR.

Re-read my post BEFORE THE FACT about the Magic being almost 5 to 1 underdogs against the Cavs being one of the most inaccurate lines in recent memory.

This Lakers (-275) Magic line is just about right, IMO, but I happen to think that the added rest, coupled with a relatively faster pace (READ: ADVANTAGE LAKERS) will lead to this series being an anticlimactic coronation for Kobe and Phil.

While, LeBron getting ousted, despite playing like Hercules throughout certain stretches, sadly, was the apex of the excitement of this year's play-offs.

Unless you ask Bill Simmons, who will tell you that Bulls-Celtics Round One was a better series than Ali-Frazier.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Benefit said:


> Hahaha. Yeah... guy's been out of the game for 4 months... recovering from shoulder surgery.... out of shape.... and he's going to come into the Finals and contribute in any meaningful way?? What planet are you on dude? Seriously... most bizarrely out of touch idea I've ever heard. A premature return means he will miss probably every shot he takes while getting burned on defense.
> 
> God I hope they are stupid enough to try and put him back in. Although that would take some of the fun out of it. Like Michael Jordan torching Grant Hill with a bum ankle. At some point, it just became spiritually saddening.



 Jameer has been working out with the team since the begining of the playoffs, so I highly doubt he is out of shape....... Oh and btw the planet im on is earth welcome ....Would you miss your chance to play in the finals? Some players may never get a chance again and i think he is seizing the oppurtunity.
As far as him being still injured, how do you know that? I LIVE in orlando and follow the sports media here very closely, and if you pay attention Jameer has been saying he's ready to go since the boston series..... It's cool Lakers fans y'all can keep going on and on about how your team is going to destroy mine, I distinctively remember people saying the same thing about Boston and Cleveland LMAO!


----------



## fatallyflawed

L O V E L I F E said:


> Unless you ask Bill Simmons, who will tell you that Bulls-Celtics Round One was a better series than Ali-Frazier.



Ya I remember that comment,

and he's a fucking idiot


----------



## undead

Liquid1nsanity said:


> Jameer has been working out with the team since the begining of the playoffs, so I highly doubt he is out of shape....... Oh and btw the planet im on is earth welcome ....Would you miss your chance to play in the finals? Some players may never get a chance again and i think he is seizing the oppurtunity.
> As far as him being still injured, how do you know that? I LIVE in orlando and follow the sports media here very closely, and if you pay attention Jameer has been saying he's ready to go since the boston series..... It's cool Lakers fans y'all can keep going on and on about how your team is going to destroy mine, I distinctively remember people saying the same thing about Boston and Cleveland LMAO!



no offense to ya, but i have to agree with benefit on this one. though i wouldn't have been as much of a dick about it. :D

the thing is, the lakers are a better team than the celtics and the cavs are. i really don't think there's much to deny there. that doesn't mean the magic doesn't have a chance because they do, IMO. if they can hit 3's like they did against cleveland... i have no doubt that they'll at least hang with the lakers at the very least.

the reason though that i say i agree with benefit... you said most players would seize the opportunity to play in the finals, well while true, unfortunately it's not nelson's choice, it's van gundy's and if nelson's not performing, he's not getting minutes, simple as that. and while working out since the playoffs began may be fine for people like us, it's not for someone at the NBA level. you don't miss 4 months after shoulder surgery then work out for a couple weeks and compete against the LA lakers without some decline in performance. the fact remains the same, jameer nelson can say he's ready as much as he wants, but it's not his call.


----------



## poopie

there's no way jameer is going to be starting, but i don't think it's terrible to believe he might put up some bench points.

i'm afraid the chemistry/teamwork of orlando might be disturned if returns during the finals, though. so much pressure! and the magic have obviously been doing amazing without him- they've found a great rhythm. the man is an all-star though! but, i don't think he should have a sizeable presence (if at all).

plus, i wouldn't want him to get hurt again.

omg. i cannot wait until thursday.

oh, and fuck all those kobe/lebron commercials. adidas (or someone) needs to come out with one w/dwight, mocking the other two.

BAH!

p.s. anyone else catch dwight's impression of van gundy?? :D


----------



## undead

dwight's done many impressions of van gundy and all are hilarious!!! :D he's pretty good at it really.

i think it's nike that does the lebron/kobe commercials too. they've totally ridden the wave of argument from the fans, no question, but i doubt they'd consider a superman commercial unless they beat the lakers in the final. not that he doesn't deserve one, but there are TONS of eccentric fans fighting over who's better, lebron or kobe, and until dwight howard enters that battle, he (and everyone else for that matter) will be left out. again, not that he's not among one of the bests, but the lebron vs. kobe issue has become a monster entity in itself.


----------



## fatallyflawed

would you go as far as to say Howard better than Shaq??


----------



## L O V E L I F E

Dwayne Wade and Chris Paul are as comparable to LeBron as LeBron is to Kobe.

Stats ain't everything, and if you take away stats, LeBron's merely a very very talented young POTENTIALLY All-Time great.

Kobe is entering MJ territory this very week.

If, hypothetically, he gets killed by a bus three weeks from now, millions of idiots would actually be happy, but more importantly, he'd go down as somewhere between the 2nd and 5th greatest players EVER, without having played one nanosecond past his 31st Birthday.

If, on the other hand, LeBron gets killed by a bus three weeks from now, by 2100, he'll have a lower Q rating than Justin Timberlake.


----------



## grimble crumble

pullstring said:


> would you go as far as to say Howard better than Shaq??



no way in hell. although I would rather have howard as my center if I was building a team right now because of his youth and the fact that he hasnt reached his full potential yet. when all is said and done though and both players are retired shaq will go down in history as a better bigman than howard and easily as one of the best big men to ever play the game especialy since the time after the 3 second rules were established in the league


----------



## fatallyflawed

The one thing I wish Howard would do (but do not think he has the size to really) is get the Shaq "get the fuck out of my way" back to the rim step. Shaq would MOVE you to dunk. As well as Kobe, who took MAJOR advantage of it when he had it, knew he could just lobe the ball anywhere near it to get Shaq an Alley-oop.

Do not see Howard get alot of Alley's


----------



## grimble crumble

^^^ yeah theres not too many people in the world that could out muscle shaq for position. attribute that to his amazing size. I mean just think about how dominant Howard is and then think that when shaq was in his prime he was 2 inches taller and 60 pounds heavier then howard and still had decent quickness and footwork.

one thing about howard I can really see happening though is his shot and freethrows improving in coming seasons. if he can raise it even to the mid 70's that will make quite a difference in his game.


----------



## fatallyflawed

his free throws I thought are in the low 70's??


----------



## grimble crumble

pullstring said:


> his free throws I thought are in the low 70's??



they have been for the play offs but for the season he was a 60 percenter if im not mistaken.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Ya me thinks you right.

I remember that was the problem when Shaq was at his peak with hack a Shaq. He was still strong enough to hold onto the ball and dunk it. But he could never capitalize on the free bee.

Howard has some great athleticism.

Shaq was just a fucking BEAST!!


----------



## undead

L O V E L I F E said:


> Dwayne Wade and Chris Paul are as comparable to LeBron as LeBron is to Kobe.
> 
> *Stats ain't everything, and if you take away stats, LeBron's merely a very very talented young POTENTIALLY All-Time great.
> 
> Kobe is entering MJ territory this very week.*
> 
> If, hypothetically, he gets killed by a bus three weeks from now, millions of idiots would actually be happy, but more importantly, he'd go down as somewhere between the 2nd and 5th greatest players EVER, without having played one nanosecond past his 31st Birthday.
> 
> If, on the other hand, LeBron gets killed by a bus three weeks from now, by 2100, he'll have a lower Q rating than Justin Timberlake.



well if you take away stats then that includes, but is not limited to, 3pt shooting, game winning shots, last minute points, and yes... finals wins. unless, that is, you're only picking and choosing which stats to throw out.

so how are you gonna throw away lebron's stats and then in the very next sentence cite that kobe's entering MJ territory this very week... which i'm assuming you're basing on stats?

it's contradiction at it's finest.


----------



## grimble crumble

ryanlaughlin said:


> well if you take away stats then that includes, but is not limited to, 3pt shooting, game winning shots, last minute points, and yes... finals wins. unless, that is, you're only picking and choosing which stats to throw out.
> 
> so how are you gonna throw away lebron's stats and then in the very next sentence cite that kobe's entering MJ territory this very week... which i'm assuming you're basing on stats?
> 
> it's contradiction at it's finest.



isnt this topic title NBA playoffs. lets keep the talk about the teams that are actually in the finals instead of a player whos never even been to one. Kobe over lebron anyday and this year will be the fourth ring to prove it


----------



## undead

which of those two have never been to one?

and i wasn't the one that brought it up... since you bring it up.


----------



## undead

grimble crumble said:


> isnt this topic title NBA playoffs. lets keep the talk about the teams that are actually in the finals instead of a player whos never even been to one. Kobe over lebron anyday and this year will be the fourth ring to prove it



oh and if you wanna be a dick about it, then didn't you just finish a conversation about shaq? he's not in the playoffs. doesn't it hurt your feet jumpin off your high horse?


----------



## Max Power

omg i luv lebron lolz










ugh.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

pullstring said:


> The one thing I wish Howard would do (but do not think he has the size to really) is get the Shaq "get the fuck out of my way" back to the rim step. Shaq would MOVE you to dunk. As well as Kobe, who took MAJOR advantage of it when he had it, knew he could just lobe the ball anywhere near it to get Shaq an Alley-oop.
> 
> Do not see Howard get alot of Alley's



  Hmmm you must not watch a lot of magic basketball, because alley oops are dwights favorite play.....


----------



## cravNbeets

grimble crumble said:


> isnt this topic title NBA playoffs. lets keep the talk about the teams that are actually in the finals instead of a player whos never even been to one. Kobe over lebron anyday and this year will be the fourth ring to prove it



lebron and the cavs had the dubious honor of getting rocked by the spurs way back in 07.

im hoping for a good series or failing that, some good van gundy pressers.


----------



## axl blaze

the highlight of the NBA playoffs this year was the Cleveland Cavs getting knocked out. it seems like not a whole lot of the sports media are interested in this year's Finals, and I can't blame them.

there was a poll on ESPN.com asking the world if the Cavs beat the Magic, if they could beat the Lakers. the answer was a unanimous yes - and I still think that is the Cavs could have somehow beaten Orlando they would have walked all over a lethargic Los Angeles.

however, LA matches up better against Orlando and I see LA winning this one in 7.

good for Kobe, he can finally prove that he is his own NBA superstar, even without Shaq leading the team.

if Kobe drops the Finals this year, LA is going to be viewed as the Atlanta Braves, Bufallo Bills, or the Ohio State of the NBA (being able to get to the Finals but not winning).

I just hope to see some good basketball. if the Lakers lose again, that would be quite funny, in a sadistic sort of way.


----------



## Max Power

Pietrus and Alston need to have a monster series.

Hedo and Lewis need to keep doing what they've been doing.

Howard just needs to be Howard.

If the above three things happen, the Magic will win. 

It's not asking too much.



p.s. fuck maurice clarett


----------



## grimble crumble

ryanlaughlin said:


> oh and if you wanna be a dick about it, then didn't you just finish a conversation about shaq? he's not in the playoffs. doesn't it hurt your feet jumpin off your high horse?



wow one post about shaq when lebrons been all over the last 3 pages. all im saying is theres already thread titled kobe vs lebron. we dont need this one dominated up with all the "king james" lovers ... king of what exactly i will never know. King of not making it to the nba finals???


----------



## fatallyflawed

Liquid1nsanity said:


> Hmmm you must not watch a lot of magic basketball, because alley oops are dwights favorite play.....



not since the playoffs and I have seen highlights but they are not as abundant as the Shaq days

face it, Kobe would score 40 and Shaq 30 in a game. Kobe would make the play or kick it for a Shaq-tastic dunk.

The howard=oops I have seen seem to have to be precise and no room for era. Ball just above rim and room for him to jump.

I remember quit a few times Kobe would backwards lob the ball and Shaq would jump and have to extend arms out fully to get it and then throw it down.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

pullstring said:


> not since the playoffs and I have seen highlights but they are not as abundant as the Shaq days
> 
> face it, Kobe would score 40 and Shaq 30 in a game. Kobe would make the play or kick it for a Shaq-tastic dunk.
> 
> The howard=oops I have seen seem to have to be precise and no room for era. Ball just above rim and room for him to jump.
> 
> I remember quit a few times Kobe would backwards lob the ball and Shaq would jump and have to extend arms out fully to get it and then throw it down.



 So you're basing your opinion on only watching the magic playoff games? Not a very solid ground to base your opinion on. I would bet everything i own that Dwight got WAAAAY more ups than Shaq now, Shaq earlier, Shaq whenever. Has shaq ever enterd a slam dunk contest? We all know Dwight can dunk 13 feet with ease....So basically your whole post is based on watching highlights? hmmmmmmmm....... Anyways good luck tonight lakers, it is my belief that we are about to be "Witness" (LOL) to one of the best finals in history. I may eat my words ina  couple days, but at least im not jumping on the same bandwagon everyone in America is.......


----------



## fatallyflawed

Apparently you are since you forgot Shaq gave your Magic some great times.

And ya, since jumping 13 ft towards the basket is REAL useful when you have 9 other players in the way.

Enjoy the Staples center!


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

hahahah


----------



## fatallyflawed

pullstring said:


> Apparently you are since you forgot Shaq gave your Magic some great times.
> 
> And ya, since jumping 13 ft towards the basket is REAL useful when you have 9 other players in the way.
> 
> Enjoy the Staples center!



as i said before

you can not dunk 13 feet away with people in your way.

Slamdunk contests are fun and all......but do not mean shit in the game.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

Good reply to my post......LOL... didnt answer anything....Yeah I haven't forgotten about what Shaq tried to do for us, I also haven't forgot how he ditched us one year after making it to the finals..... but I'm not bitter, I wish Shaq all the best in his old man days, but its time to move over for Superman 2...... oh and by 13 feet, i meant 13 feet high not 13 feet away from the basket, mabey you didnt see the dunk contest........


----------



## fatallyflawed

no I did not,

like I said I do not care to watch it, it has nothing to do with how you play the sport.

I really am not sure what you want me to answer, I watch my Lakers play and thats it. I do not usually have the time to watch both the TNT doubleheader games.


----------



## Liquid1nsanity

It doesnt matter, good luck this is going to be a hell of a series!


----------



## undead

grimble crumble said:


> wow one post about shaq when lebrons been all over the last 3 pages. all im saying is theres already thread titled kobe vs lebron. we dont need this one dominated up with all the "king james" lovers ... king of what exactly i will never know. King of not making it to the nba finals???



i'll only be this blunt once, then i'll drop it because a.) i'm willing to be the bigger man, and b.) it's not worth arguing.

you're fucking retarded.

that said, LBJ was dominating the last 3 pages because at the time it was relevant as he was both still in the playoffs, then freshly removed. your conversation was about 6 posts of banter back and forth. the point is... i don't care, that conversation is fine, but if you're gonna say my conversation isn't relevant to this years playoffs, then yours is FAR from relevant.

now that we're just arguing semantics, i'll move on. let's be friends, we're both here for the same reasons, right?


----------



## L O V E L I F E

For those of you who aren't watching the game, here's the score midway through the third quarter:

Kobe 26
LeBron 0

OK - Gotta go back to fucking my Kobe blow-up doll.


----------



## LapDawg

Well how about that...Kobe scores 40 and the Lakers win. Poor Lebron only wishes his team could've done the same.


----------



## forgotmypen

such a beautiful final score as well. Nice and tidy.


----------



## fatallyflawed

Liquid1nsanity said:


> It doesnt matter, good luck this is going to be a hell of a series!



I hope its better than this


----------



## L O V E L I F E

LapDawg said:


> *
> Well how about that...Kobe scores 40 and the Lakers win. Poor Lebron only wishes his team could've done the same.*



Don't worry - last summer he learned from Kobe, at the Olympics, that he needed to rev up his work ethic by a factor of about 100.

Maybe this summer, he'll get Grant Hill to teach him sportsmanship.

LeBron can't yet do the same things as Kobe can do (and that MJ used to be able to do) because LeBron doesn't yet have as broad of an overall basketball PLUS life skill set to be the best player in the NBA.

Without LeBron learning several more important lessons, it is my position that Dwayne Wade is closer to being MJ's (and then Kobe's) heir apparent than is LeBron.

LeBron's got a bigger more imposing body than Wade does, but LeBron doesn't have Wade's leadership skills/clutchness/maturity *or* Kobe's killer-instinct/clutchness/work ethic. 

Good luck, Cavs fans - you very likely have exactly ONE more opportunity to win a championship for perhaps the next fifty years.


----------



## undead

*<-----------*

*times LL mentioned kobe's name:* 3
*times LL mentioned lebron's name:* 6

if you're trying to hide your boner for lebron by bashing him endlessly, you're not doing a very good job of it. i can see right through your facade like they're sweatpants. i know you're sporting full wood for kobe, but obviously you're gettin hard just thinking of LBJ as well... i mean jesus, that's ALL you talk about.

and you better knock off that lebron/kobe debate because ole what's his name already gave me shit about it. then again, i suppose it's ok to derail threads if you're a lakers fan?


----------



## Max Power

this is now the LeBron thread.


----------



## LiLCv2

dwight howard ftw


----------



## Ressur

Lee Anderson.  LA's new hero.


----------



## LiLCv2

Rashard lewis would kick Lee andersons ass anyday anytime :D


----------



## LapDawg

ryanlaughlin said:


> *times LL mentioned kobe's name:* 3
> *times LL mentioned lebron's name:* 6
> 
> if you're trying to hide your boner for lebron by bashing him endlessly, you're not doing a very good job of it. i can see right through your facade like they're sweatpants. i know you're sporting full wood for kobe, but obviously you're gettin hard just thinking of LBJ as well... i mean jesus, that's ALL you talk about.
> 
> and you better knock off that lebron/kobe debate because ole what's his name already gave me shit about it. then again, i suppose it's ok to derail threads if you're a lakers fan?



Just wait until LeBron goes to New York...you'll be seeing the biggest LeBron fan ever in LL..."Prove me wrong LeBron...PROVE ME WRONG!"

:D


----------



## L O V E L I F E

LapDawg said:


> Just wait until LeBron goes to New York...you'll be seeing the biggest LeBron fan ever in LL..."Prove me wrong LeBron...PROVE ME WRONG!"
> 
> :D



Haha!

I swear on the eyesight of my hypothetical children that WHEN LeBron is wearing New York's Orange and Blue, I shall be rooting for him to help win the Knicks a championship.

That said, unless he does a whole lot more than just that, I will try to remain as objective as possible, and I am confident that objectively, I shall still maintain that he's WAY more than one title away from being deserving of being mentioned in the same sentence as MJ or Kobe.

I do hope that I am eventually proven wrong, just as throughout the 90's (particularly in 1994), I hoped that I would be proven wrong about my assertion THEN that Ewing wasn't even in Olajuwon's class.

Unfortunately for me as a lifelong Knicks fan, I wasn't wrong then.

We shall see if I'm proven wrong this time.

With all of that said, so far, as far as scoring guards in the modern era being instrumental in helping their respective teams win games in The Finals, it's:

Jordan 24
Kobe 17
D-Wade 4
LeBron ZERO

Anyone who argues that LeBron is ALREADY better than Kobe should be banned from debating basketball with all of the sane people who don't allow their personal distaste for the "selfish, greedy, immature, ball-hog, quitter, accused-rapist" and who instead open their eyes and recognize that we are currently witnessing history - and who realize that said history would be occurring even if LeBron James was never born.


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## grimble crumble

was at game 2 people. in the section right above the floor seats! what a crazy game. I almost shit my pants when lee went for that layup for the game winner but luckly he missed and the lakers played better in overtime. That game was all odom and gasol. fish made some BIG plays to.

amazing game, one of the best times of my life.

go lakers


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## undead

i know you're a lakers fan, but you gotta hand it to lee and the magic on that last play. they put forth a valiant effort. a couple people i know said he blew the game by missing a 2 foot lay up, maybe they didn't see the same game i did, but i thought that he did a tremendous job just getting the shot off as cleanly as he did considering he was in a dead sprint, practically past the basket and already in the air when the ball got to him.

either way, it was a good game to watch. either team could have won it.


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## L O V E L I F E

Anyone got a broom I can borrow?


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## undead

i've got a spare one laying around that you can borrow. it was given to me as a gift in 07.


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## Liquid1nsanity

L O V E L I F E said:


> Anyone got a broom I can borrow?



 Not just yet bud, Magic playing better with each game. This is slowly turning into a good series!


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## L O V E L I F E

^^^^^

Agreed.

I still think the Lakers are a near shoe-in to win the series.

With that said, I sincerely applaud the Magic.

They played a GREAT game tonight, a won fair and square - they were (slightly) the better team tonight.

Bravo.

Fun series. 

But for by love of Kobe, and my desire for him to win one for his legacy, I would probably be rooting for the Magic - they're a fun-to-watch excellent, likable, well-coached team.


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## grimble crumble

ryanlaughlin said:


> i know you're a lakers fan, but you gotta hand it to lee and the magic on that last play. they put forth a valiant effort. a couple people i know said he blew the game by missing a 2 foot lay up, maybe they didn't see the same game i did, but i thought that he did a tremendous job just getting the shot off as cleanly as he did considering he was in a dead sprint, practically past the basket and already in the air when the ball got to him.
> 
> either way, it was a good game to watch. either team could have won it.



definetily gotta give the magic credit, they played a great game and things just didnt go their way that game. tonight they also played a great game but the difference was they closed it out. It looks like this is going to be a tougher series then us laker fans thought.

I still think the lakers will win it all but it will be no easy task. it may even go 7


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## D1G1TAL

Im rooting for the Lakers all the way! but Dwight Howard is beastly!


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## Liquid1nsanity

D12 4 Life!


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## johanneschimpo

shaq > howard


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## D1G1TAL

johanneschimpo said:


> shaq > howard



You cant really compare them.. dwight had a much better season that shaq.. yet shaq has been playing for ever.


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## johanneschimpo

Ignoring the 14 year age difference. Think of Shaq when he was younger, or Howard when he is much older. I don't know what the Finding Nemo-pink sweater-DH is doing, but "dominating" isn't one of them, not in my book at least. When its all said and done, and both have retired, so everything can be compared, people will see that DH had nothing on Shaq.

I'm 5'10 and white, and I have better post moves than Dwight Howard.


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## Liquid1nsanity

Shaq also got mad experience on his game in college unlike Howard, Howard is only in his fifth season out of high school. I'm not saying one is better than the other, I think that Dwight has a way to go, but to deny that he will probably be the most dominating center in the league someday is ludicrous. Once he develops his post game a little bit more he will be nearly unstoppable if he can consistently hit  his sky hook, and free throws.


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## johanneschimpo

^You could say that same thing about most any center. "He would be unstoppable if he could consistently hit his sky hook and free throws." 

Anyway, I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just stating my opinion. I don't think Howard will ever achieve the same success as the good old Shaq.



P.S.   GO LAKERS!!! UP 3-1!!!


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## grimble crumble

great game tonight. youve got to give the magic credit for an amazing effort. they are a very tough team but their not quite at the champion playing level that the lakers are right now. 

how bout fisher everyone. once again in his career he makes some huge shots. I got flashbacks of that shot he made against the spurs years back.


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## Liquid1nsanity

Good game lakers, they played very hard. I think Kobe got away with a game changing offensive foul when he elbowed jameer nelson in the face and sent him to the floor. I guess if you're Kobe Bryant you dont have to worry about it when you elbow a guy in the face and send him to the floor. God forbid if Dwight Howard would have done that.....


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## D1G1TAL

Liquid1nsanity said:


> Good game lakers, they played very hard. I think Kobe got away with a game changing offensive foul when he elbowed jameer nelson in the face and sent him to the floor. I guess if you're Kobe Bryant you dont have to worry about it when you elbow a guy in the face and send him to the floor. God forbid if Dwight Howard would have done that.....



Lol! 
God watching that game last night.. i was wondering what the refs were thinking..


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## AmorRoark

I agree completely with liquid. Dwight Howard basically gets called for breathing on someone. It's incredibly annoying. However, Lakers just outplayed Magic last night. I think the series is basically done for.


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## Average Whiteboy

Even though Kobe did hit Nelson in the face that wouldn't have mattered if Howard, or even Turkoglu, made their free throws. Don't they teach you that shit in middle school? Unbelievable.


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## grimble crumble

yeah kobe's elbow hit nelson but one could argue nelson ran into it just as much as kobe stuck it out. Its not like Kobe went crazy and decided to wack the guy, nelson played his part to and thats why there wasnt a call. In a regular game nelson would have gotten the call but in the final seconds of the nba finals theyre not going to give that to a guy if he ran into it even a little bit.

as a laker fan would I be mad if the roles were switched and Kobe was the one who caught an elbow? yes, BUT listen up magic fans.

1. regardless of what your stance is, the elbow definetily wasn't hard enough to knock nelson on the floor. this is the nba finals, now is not the time to hope the ref gives you the call, you play through it and you contest the pass. Thats what nelson should have done and thats what Kobe would have done. Thats where the inexperience of the magic comes into play a little bit. the lakers have all been to the finals they know this.

2. there were about 3 fouls on Lakers in overtime that the magic commited that the refs also didnt call. why? because the finals are not about fouls theyre about talent and heart. When its overtime in champioship games fans want to see the players play not the refs. the magic wouldnt have even been in that situation if the lakers didnt outscore them 30-14 in the third quarter. I mean you guys got your calls, all 3 of our bigmen didnt even play most of the first quarter because all three were in foul trouble

3. the very bottom line is fisher still had to make the 25 footer. give the man credit.

when 4 games are played in a row and one team wins 3 out of those 4 they are the better team theres no gettin around that. the magic are great but the lakers are playing like champions.


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## LapDawg

For anyone who watched game 4 in its entirety and saw how it was officiated, there is no reasonable way to believe the refs should've called an offensive foul on Kobe's elbow. Just look at how ridiculous it got in the 4th and OT...19-2 FT differential in favor of Orlando...unbelievable when you also consider the two for the Lakers were at the end of the game and didn't matter. 

Kobe may have went 11-31...but man...at least 5 of those shots were attempts where he was clearly fouled and nothing was called. I guess that's nothing new when it comes to NBA refs, but I always find games Bennett Salvatore is involved in particularly outrageous regarding the calls.


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## axl blaze

as a Cavs fan, it sure sucks to see the Magic starting to miss these shots that they drained throughout the entirety of the playoffs before. I suppose Orlando just peaked too early and used up all their juice to beat Cleveland.

congrats L. A. the worst thing about this is that Shaq or myself can't diss Kobe anymore for not winning a title without him.


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## grimble crumble

^^^ dont congratulate them yet thats bad karma. you might jinx them before its over.

I think part of the reason the magic have been missing there shots more against LA then when they played the cavs is because LA is just a much bigger team. Its harder to shoot over bigger players. Weve got 7 foot Gasol, 7 foot Bynum, 6'10 Odam, and 6'8 Ariza

also Stan van gundy threw off Alston's rythym a little with the whole Nelson situation.


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## axl blaze

grimble crumble said:


> I think part of the reason the magic have been missing there shots more against LA then when they played the cavs is because LA is just a much bigger team. Its harder to shoot over bigger players. Weve got 7 foot Gasol, 7 foot Bynum, 6'10 Odam, and 6'8 Ariza
> 
> also Stan van gundy threw off Alston's rythym a little with the whole Nelson situation.



both statements are very true and good observations.

it's difficult to beat such tall guards when you start two guards who are my height, 6'2".


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## L O V E L I F E

How much emotional pain do you think Shaq is experiencing right now?

Eat *MY* ass, "Superman!"


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## LapDawg

Congrats to Kobe and Co. A new Kobe Dynasty may just be beginning...


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## grimble crumble

LapDawg said:


> Congrats to Kobe and Co. A new Kobe Dynasty may just be beginning...



yeah it looks like theyre gunna pull this one out unless the magic can pull  miracle out of their ass. 

for next year if the lakers can manage to sign both Lamar and Ariza, theres a good chance they cany repeat. Odom has already said he would take a pay cut to stay with the lakers to.


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## grimble crumble

Lakers are the 2009 NBA champs!


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## L2R

pretty conclusively too.


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## poopie

it sucks to see orlando get so flustered, so early. things heated up, and *sigh* they just couldn't do it. but, just to make sure you didn't turn the game off and avoid the ugly defeat, they nail a couple of pointless 3's in the last 5 minutes.

many contributing factors- the biggest being how unstoppable kobe et al is. can't argue that. the whole team seemed to follow dwight's mood. but, i really think bringing jameer back in was all wrong. our boys had some great momentum and the teamwork was amazing.

hedo and gortat prolly won't be there next year either. who else?

congrats to the lakers!

(but, i swear to god, if i see one more kobe/lebron commercial, i'm gonna put an axe through my television!)


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## L O V E L I F E

LapDawg said:


> *
> A new Kobe Dynasty may just be beginning...*



Congrats, Jefe!

And who in the world would have predicted that it was inevitable that this Kobe dynasty that IS happenING would eventually happen, a mere four seasons ago when Kobe "broke up the Lakers?"

Oh yeah - WE DID! 

Dig up all the old threads on this subject - the multitude of haters have finally been proven wrong.

I would still MARGINALLY consider MJ to be the greatest ever - if Kobe were to get hit by a bus tomorrow.

Barring a freak bus accident, however, Kobe's status of G.O.A.T. shall be cemented by the end of Obama's first term.

Now where the fuck is poste?!


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## Average Whiteboy

L O V E L I F E said:


> I would still MARGINALLY consider MJ to be the greatest ever - if Kobe were to get hit by a bus tomorrow.
> 
> Barring a freak bus accident, however, Kobe's status of G.O.A.T. shall be cemented by the end of Obama's first term.



You're kidding, right?


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## L O V E L I F E

^^^^^^^^

Not one bit.

If the Lakers win the title in two of the next three seasons (which, with Kobe still in his prime, ditto Gasol, and with Odom willing to play for free so he stay near the beach, and with the greatest coach of my lifetime steering the ship, is certainly doable), then Kobe will have tied MJ with 6 career titles, two-upped him with 8 conference championships, and will STILL have 5 to 7 years of productive ball left in him, with which I fully expect him to obliterate several all-time NBA statistical records.

Add to that Kobe's vastly superior jump shot, his 81 point game, and a whole host of other accomplishments that MJ never even sniffed, and YES, Kobe will be considered the greatest ever.

Except by the same stubborn haters who are ignorant enough to think that LeBron is actually the most valuable player in the NBA right this second.


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## LapDawg

One step closer from potential to reality, LL. :D


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## Average Whiteboy

L O V E L I F E said:


> If the Lakers win the title in two of the next three seasons (which, with Kobe still in his prime, ditto Gasol, and with Odom willing to play for free so he stay near the beach, and with the greatest coach of my lifetime steering the ship, is certainly doable), then Kobe will have tied MJ with 6 career titles, two-upped him with 8 conference championships, and will STILL have 5 to 7 years of productive ball left in him, with which I fully expect him to obliterate several all-time NBA statistical records.
> 
> Add to that Kobe's vastly superior jump shot, his 81 point game, and a whole host of other accomplishments that MJ never even sniffed, and YES, Kobe will be considered the greatest ever.



You're forgetting another accomplishment Kobe has that MJ doesn't: Kobe has lost in the Finals...twice. MJ never did.

Not to mention, if Jordan doesn't retire the first time the Bulls win eight straight.

Kobe is one of the greatest players ever, and certainly better than LeBron, but I don't think he can top Jordan. Maybe it's nostalga, but MJ is the best ever.


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## L2R

speaking as an officially recognised and certified whore for the jordan brand sneakers, i'm gonna hafta agree with AW. 

but that fade away jump shot kobe pulled out his arse in the fifth game was reminiscent of jodan magic. it was beautiful. but it was the only one in the whole game. he nailed many beauties but only one truly magical shot. 

mj floated like that all the time.


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## axl blaze

archived. it was a beautiful year for the NBA this year and I am jonesing for my basketball fix until next year. playing streetball on my block just isn't the same


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