# Thinking about steroids? Here are some tips.



## theartofwar

If you think that steroids are going to help you get bigger, get stronger, get leaner. Overall improve your physique - give you that extra edge maybe. Well their is a good chance you are correct. 

Here's the thing, everything I just mentioned, without the proper diet - steroids are going to do two things 1) give you some strength and size you wouldn't have had 2) become a crutch. 

When I say crutch - I mean those of us who paid our dues , for years lifting naturally , eating whatever we could clean , going hard n heavy. Steroids have changed my lifting, they have not changed my goals and desires (contrary I want them more). But I have seen full well a month of my own running of a cycle where I did shit all except fuck around and party (yea I'm a human being and fuck up). It was an utter joke. Without food in me, enough water, my gains - might as well have no showed up practically. 

Things I've been reading: 
I've tried this prohormone etc , I want to try this steroid. - BAD reason. First of all , steroids should be taken for 2 reasons 1) You know the dude on mens health with his abs and all that good shit ? Fuck that, if you juice you should be getting as big as fucking possible. You don't need anything but a little disicipline to look like that pencil on those magazine covers.
2) Steroids should be treated with the UTMOST respect, this is why I cannot stress this enough ****FIRST CYCLES***** RUN TEST / ANY FORM OF TEST - ALONE.

why? Simple answer is this, test is the best . Ok that's not enough you want to try tren, you've heard it's amazing (it is). Well guess what when you are in week 8 and your nipple gets puffy - do you need cabor, bromo, letrozole ? What's going on progestorone gyno ???? Gyno from test ??? Have fun trying to explain it to the surgeons and insurance company. Not a fun deal. 

Test is also the absolute corner stone to stacking and running steroids. Without test you are simply shutting yourself down (no test now produced) and running another compound that simply put ... while it will give you results ... it's not going to help your body deal with the fact it HAS NO TEST. I ran tren once for 6 weeks (tren ace 100mg eod) when I was young and stupid. I honestly am glad I didn't run tren for years later. Without a test best, the crash on tren is beyond words. You must start your base w/the multivitamin of steroids - testosterone - i don't care if you want aquatest, just get your damn test levels up !!!! 

*Needles*
Ok, it took me about 3 seconds to plunge 2 1/2 CC's into my quad last shot - swab of the alcohol pad stick that fucker in there asp, plunge. Pull out, ya ya some blood oh no. My white boxers turned into dartboards over the years. My point?? I used to think needles were awful, I hated IM shots as a HEROIN addict. Now I look at an IM shot and laugh when a doc wants to give me one - they suck ass at it I do it for them (shit half time they dont asperate ) and they leave me knotted up.

GET OVER THIS FEAR , OR LEAVE GEAR. 

simple as that. You gonna run primo, var, maybe throw in other orals along the way your whole lifting career ? Come on guys , blood sweat and tears. BLOOD was part of that. 

Eat big , train heavy , if you're going to juice - do it fucking right - and stop with the bullshit kleenex moments. This is a steroid section, I speak in many other places on BL and I am a kind guy. But w/juice their is simply no in between - either do it right and do it REAL right , or fucking leave it alone. I'm so fed up with the shit that gets posted on here. 

I'll gladly help anyone w/any cycle questions - and I don't mind reading the questions, it's the stubborn "well I'm gonna just run orals for awhile to see how my body responds" ... okay ??? READ - RESEARCH. 

I'm going to try to host the anabolics2009.pdf and update this thread.. those of you with 698 pages of reading ability who care about your bodies and steroids... this shit is crucial.

No matter what , above all else, please be safe, these are not your 1-ad tabs. I'm not saying you'll get huge , turn into a nutcase , but look - I've done things on test / tren / dbol / drol - that I wouldn't have done otherwise ... that's a fact. And I've been around gear a long ass time. Be safe, be wise, read a lot.


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## shiznik

Intense.


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## theartofwar

Just fed up with bullshit. I'm 25 with problems due to steroid abuse at certain ages (health wise) - I do have to be safe (esp comparatively) - people just have no fucking clue. 

Few days back a girl sheepishly asked me at a party if it was true that I had taken "steroids" and I told her, "I had". And she goes "You do realize how horrible a thing to your body you are doing" - i asked her to name one steroid, she stammered and screamed off about how she just cared for me. 

shut the fuck up with ignorance... no sympathy in the game of bodybuilding , powerlifting , and juice. PERIOD.


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## Parallel*

Also....



> Here’s some info for guys who want to gain 20-25lbs on a cycle.
> 
> 
> Everyone wants to know how to gain high poundages on a cycle. We’ve all got a “friend” in a gym somewhere that gained 25lbs on his last cycle and we want to do the same. We ask ourselves…What is his secret? Is the juice he’s taking that good? Is it a good diet in conjunction with the test.. is that what is responsible? Well, here’s the answer.. NO, his particular anabolic compound of choice be it Sustanon, Winstrol, Dbol, Tren, etc… isn’t so great that whoever takes one of those compounds will grow.. nor is his diet so “on” that he will gain more than us.
> 
> Here’s the truth.. and some of you won’t like it.. Some of you may even get pissed off.. The reason these guys grow so much on their cycles is because they shouldn’t even be using steroids to begin with… And that’s the truth… That may sound a bit confusing.. yes? Well allow me to elaborate…
> 
> You take a 20 yr old male. He has been lifting on and off for six months or so… He’s about 6 foot tall maybe a little shorter.. 5’10” or so.. He weighs about 165lbs.. He’s got a little bit of definition.. nothing big.. when his shirt is off people can tell he’s been working out.. He decides one day that he wants to take steroids, He sees the really big guys in the gym and he wants to be like them right now.. he doesn’t want to wait any longer.. in his mind six months has been long enough.. ******************** .. he reads a little .. finds a hook up.. and decides to run 250mg of test and 300mg of deca for two months and ends up weighing around 185 or 190.. All of his friends are amazed.. he’s amazed He’s put on some size.. he looks like a weight lifter.. he doesn’t look like someone who could compete.. but he looks like he’s finally arrived on the Body building scene… His closest friends are so impressed that they want to run the exact same cycle .. He tells them exactly what he did.. how he ate etc… Now, a few months go by.. all of a sudden the kid is back to around 165 maybe 170.. He thinks.. “Oh man.. I’ve got to get back on cycle.. I need those drugs to be big.. if I don’t.. I just can’t grow… Steroids require that I stay on all the time to maintain the kind of size that I want”… I guess that’s what he has to do; huh; stay on all the time?
> 
> Now, here’s the reason he gained 25lbs on his cycle.. He was so far from his genetic potential that once the anabolic compounds were introduced into his system he grew like a weed.. His body didn’t need to struggle to put on that mass, because it was quite capable of adding that much mass naturally.. The steroids just sped it up..
> 
> it is for lack of a better or more accurate word.. a short cut to get to where he could have gotten natural anyway. His inevitable weight loss after coming off his "super" cycle wasn’t from the lack of steroids.. it was from a lack of a proper foundation.. a Lack of proper training skills, and a lack of muscular maturation…
> 
> Here’s the deal.. guys who need steroids aren’t the guys who are growing 25+lbs per cycle.. they are gaining 10lbs and hopefully keeping 5-8.. They are struggling to even do that.. I’ll tell you from personal experience.. I am 30 yrs old 6’2” .. I am 284lbs currently.. I am 17% BF (I’m a power lifter/strongman.. so I keep a little extra fat on me)…If I wanted to keep the same body fat % I have now and weigh 300lbs.. I would have to run a very long cycle. or in all honesty it will take me two full cycles to get to 3 bills..
> 
> An average cycle for me is about 750mg Test, 450mg Deca, 300mg EQ and Some Dbol in the front and at the end… Those are some fairly heavy dosages...Why don’t I gain 25lbs per cycle?
> 
> Because No matter how much gear I take.. no matter how much I eat.. my body is so far beyond it’s genetic potential that I simply can’t add that kind of radical mass anymore..
> 
> My body does a fairly good job of maintaining mass when I’m not on cycle.. but I do drop weight regardless.. and in truth, the only reason my body maintains it’s size as well as it does is because of Muscle maturation.. My body is used to carrying around that muscle.. it’s not a shock to my body to carry it around.. And I built a solid mass foundation naturally years ago.. I reached my genetic potential before I started using juice.. Lifting was a habit and a lifestyle for me because I played football from Junior high through College.
> 
> I’ve worked out in gyms all over the country.. and I have been doing so for the better part of a decade.. and I'll tell you, I have seen a lot of little guys blow up for a couple of months from a cycle only to deflate a couple of months later. It's the truth.. Muscle Maturation plays a huge key in keeping mass... that and proper training skills.. (and no hitting bench 3 days a week and squatting once every few months doesn't count)
> 
> So in truth, when you hear about some guy who gained 25-30lbs off of a cycle.. Please keep in mind that he is probably some impatient tiny punk that could have easily gained the same amount of muscle had he just been a little more patient.. If he had just been focused on learning how to train.. focused on how to eat…
> 
> This is a lifestyle.. there are no short cuts if you want to be the real deal.... There will never be a fly by nighter even win the smallest amateur comp in booney freaking Iowa if he hasn't been serious for years...
> 
> It's important that you guys learn that Juice may seem like the best short cut in the beginning... but whenever you add that much mass that quickly from gear.. Your body isn’t going to be ready for it.. it will literally fight you to keep it.. the sudden size and strength will stress the ligaments, tendons, bones and central nervous system and Your body will do everything that it can to shed those rapid muscle gains.. Decent muscle mass is only kept through time and hard work (cough.. cough.. it's a cliché.. but it's still true).. and it's important that your gains aren't so fast that the body can't adjust healthfully to it’s new weight gain..
> 
> I'll tell you, 80% of the people are wannabes and posers.. they are guys who won’t even be working out six months from now.. They are impatient and are looking for the shortcut.. they may even get a few short term results.. but in the long run they will come out behind everyone else (and when I say long run.. i mean less than a year or two)
> 
> These kind of guys will never be anything more than a hobbyist.. and in truth...that is probably the case in every other aspect of their lives as well, not just weight lifting..
> 
> So in the end my advice is this.. if you are wanting to add some mass. and you’re stuck.. learn a different training method.. change your diet.. and if you’re a good size.. (that’s when everyone who is in the room with you knows you’re a weight lifter.. if you walk in a room, and everyone in there doesn’t know that you lift… you are not ready for steroids) then come and sit down.. and we’ll talk about steroids.. until then… Learn how to train.. learn how to eat.. and spend some time in the gym.. you’ll be so much better off in the end…


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## auhsoJ

Great reads. The both of you. I'm going to declare "I'm perhaps maybe but who knows really - not one of them" simply because I have no other life outside of lifting and reading about it. Sure I enjoy a burrito from time to time but hey - who doesn't love burritos. 

I always wondered why these guys claimed to have gained so much weight so suddenly. Made me wonder if I was doing something wrong (as far as being on anything). I guess it's like all the crybabies on YouTube who claim to pull 500 at 14.


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## theartofwar

* Just a side note: You think you're ready to bodybuild ? Ready to bring 10 meals with you everywhere, clean meals. 2 Gallon jugs , you kno  that drill. 

Well good, just remember  that you get married ? The girl wants to have a special night with you ? Guess what you fucked up. That deca, deca dick is no joke ... trust me I was on spring break and was like wow , fucking I couldnt even get up the week we went partying out on vacation. Try explaining to the girl you took it's not her fault you can't get hard..... Steroids are great with the right goals. diet. training. But understand them and respect. welll then you are on your way - these are for people who want to fucking be FREAKS. Big n swole !!! *


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## Space invader

Good post art, good post.


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## Yellowcabs

Good thread


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## Matsuo Munefusa.

theartofwar said:


> No matter what , above all else, please be safe, these are not your 1-ad tabs. I'm not saying you'll get huge , turn into a nutcase , but look - I've done things on test / tren / dbol / drol - that I wouldn't have done otherwise ... that's a fact. And I've been around gear a long ass time. Be safe, be wise, read a lot.


yep, no roid rage BS but they are powerful neurotransmitters...they can change your behavior and your body and mind.


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## theartofwar

Let me be totally blunt - I have a court case monday , and it's utter bullshit. I would've reacted the same way I like LIKE to think - but frankly at the time ... I am not sure. I was running 1.35 grams of supertest, 600mg tren e , 25mg dbol bluehearts , and around 800 mg EQ + peptides.


Look dbol makes me feel like I'm a god, tren makes me want to do horrible things to horribly ugly people. And I still manage just laugh it off... ah it's the sauce.

Well I was putting gas in my car and a dude (less than 2 months after i was in ICU for being hit by a car) "jokingly" are his words swerved to pretend hit me. I punched through his window and grabbed him, it got ugly. I cannot say more on the forums sorry. But look I've ran this stuff for awhile - bad day - maybe goin over board w/my doses (admittedly)did me in. Bottom line is I lost control of myself and if i had gone further (I cage fight and box) I could've been the asshole who ruins steroids because he flipped out in public .....

JUST BE SAFE. Ths shit isn't pez candy. God damnit, eat a lot before you even look at ap lunger. I mean a fucking lot.


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## VictorZ06

Very good read!



/V


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## theartofwar

Gotta love the real ramblin freak, no synthol either brother... hahahaha


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## ArCi

lol good read


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## AlmostFamous

auhsoJ said:


> I'm going to declare "I'm perhaps maybe but who knows really - not one of them" simply because I have no other life outside of lifting and reading about it. Sure I enjoy a burrito from time to time but hey - who doesn't love burritos.
> 
> I always wondered why these guys claimed to have gained so much weight so suddenly. Made me wonder if I was doing something wrong (as far as being on anything). I guess it's like all the crybabies on YouTube who claim to pull 500 at 14.




Never had libido problems from nandrolone or any aas for that matter. Libido has always been anywhere from elevated to outrageous.


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## crazycatman

About the needle thing... lots of current ug labs make high concentration gear which is quite thin. This means you can use 1ml syringes (unless you're going for huge doses) and thinner needles 27-29g (the narrower barrell of a 1ml syringe makes injecting with a 27-29g easy). Most 27-29g needles are still long enough to reach the muscle on many places on the body (pecs are my favourite, easy to hit and painless). Oh, you still draw with a 21g and then switch to the smaller one. And trust me, 29g is practically painless compared to 25g.

I have injected quite a few 400-500mg/ml blends from various labs with the method described without any problems.


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## AlmostFamous

crazycatman said:


> About the needle thing... lots of current ug labs make high concentration gear which is quite thin. This means you can use 1ml syringes (unless you're going for huge doses) and thinner needles 27-29g (the narrower barrell of a 1ml syringe makes injecting with a 27-29g easy). Most 27-29g needles are still long enough to reach the muscle on many places on the body (pecs are my favourite, easy to hit and painless). Oh, you still draw with a 21g and then switch to the smaller one. And trust me, 29g is practically painless compared to 25g.
> 
> I have injected quite a few 400-500mg/ml blends from various labs with the method described without any problems.




Consider yourself lucky. Last fall, I tried a high concentrated Test E @ 600mg/ml, and the oil was like syrup. 25g was the smallest you could push the oil through. I tried this right before I started seeing the test E/C/Decaonate type high concentrated blends hit the market so maybe it has gotten better. The pip was outrageous too if it wasn't stacked with something else.


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## YELLOWBUTTHOLE

Who the hell wants to be a professional body builder these days? I guarantee you that the majority of them are homosexual...


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## crazycatman

AlmostFamous said:


> Consider yourself lucky. Last fall, I tried a high concentrated Test E @ 600mg/ml, and the oil was like syrup. 25g was the smallest you could push the oil through. I tried this right before I started seeing the test E/C/Decaonate type high concentrated blends hit the market so maybe it has gotten better. The pip was outrageous too if it wasn't stacked with something else.


May well be that my body doesn't mind high mg/ml blends or maybe yours wasn't made as well as it could be.
I'm not mentioning any labs until a mod clarifies if that's allowed, but I had 500 mg/ml test ( 100mg test e, 200mg test c and 200mg test d) which was really smooth and went through thin needles without a problem (still had to draw with a bigger one but injections were doable with a 2.5ml barrel + 27g needle if you had a minute or so and were really fast with a 25g, 1ml barrel + 29g needle also worked really well). Also had 400mg/ml test (200mg test e, 200mg test c with the same properties). Neither left any pip either. The worst pip I ever got was from normal 100mg/ml prop ... like being hit with a baseball bat... me and prop? Never again.



YELLOWBUTTHOLE said:


> Who the hell wants to be a professional body builder these days? I guarantee you that the majority of them are homosexual...


There's a huge difference between a couple of 500mg test per week cycles and professional bb territory.


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## flyhighk

YELLOWBUTTHOLE said:


> Who the hell wants to be a professional body builder these days? I guarantee you that the majority of them are homosexual...


Doing gay for pay doesn't necessarily mean that you're homosexual.


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## bass face

Glad I found this thread.


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## onetwonine

>I cage fight and box

You're a pampered pussy that wants desperately to be tough and gritty. 

Fixd. 

>I could have flipped out in public

Sounds like you did.. 

Nobody is "ruining" steroids' name. The public at large doesn't know of our existence so don't worry about that. 

You just made yourself look bad. Which from the sounds of things is probably fairly easy to do.


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## onetwonine

theartofwar said:


> If you think that steroids are going to help you get bigger, get stronger, get leaner. Overall improve your physique - give you that extra edge maybe. Well their is a good chance you are correct.
> 
> Here's the thing, everything I just mentioned, without the proper diet - steroids are going to do two things 1) give you some strength and size you wouldn't have had 2) become a crutch.
> 
> When I say crutch - I mean those of us who paid our dues , for years lifting naturally , eating whatever we could clean , going hard n heavy. Steroids have changed my lifting, they have not changed my goals and desires (contrary I want them more). But I have seen full well a month of my own running of a cycle where I did shit all except fuck around and party (yea I'm a human being and fuck up). It was an utter joke. Without food in me, enough water, my gains - might as well have no showed up practically.
> 
> Things I've been reading:
> I've tried this prohormone etc , I want to try this steroid. - BAD reason. First of all , steroids should be taken for 2 reasons 1) You know the dude on mens health with his abs and all that good shit ? Fuck that, if you juice you should be getting as big as fucking possible. You don't need anything but a little disicipline to look like that pencil on those magazine covers.
> 2) Steroids should be treated with the UTMOST respect, this is why I cannot stress this enough ****FIRST CYCLES***** RUN TEST / ANY FORM OF TEST - ALONE.
> 
> why? Simple answer is this, test is the best . Ok that's not enough you want to try tren, you've heard it's amazing (it is). Well guess what when you are in week 8 and your nipple gets puffy - do you need cabor, bromo, letrozole ? What's going on progestorone gyno ???? Gyno from test ??? Have fun trying to explain it to the surgeons and insurance company. Not a fun deal.
> 
> Test is also the absolute corner stone to stacking and running steroids. Without test you are simply shutting yourself down (no test now produced) and running another compound that simply put ... while it will give you results ... it's not going to help your body deal with the fact it HAS NO TEST. I ran tren once for 6 weeks (tren ace 100mg eod) when I was young and stupid. I honestly am glad I didn't run tren for years later. Without a test best, the crash on tren is beyond words. You must start your base w/the multivitamin of steroids - testosterone - i don't care if you want aquatest, just get your damn test levels up !!!!
> 
> *Needles*
> Ok, it took me about 3 seconds to plunge 2 1/2 CC's into my quad last shot - swab of the alcohol pad stick that fucker in there asp, plunge. Pull out, ya ya some blood oh no. My white boxers turned into dartboards over the years. My point?? I used to think needles were awful, I hated IM shots as a HEROIN addict. Now I look at an IM shot and laugh when a doc wants to give me one - they suck ass at it I do it for them (shit half time they dont asperate ) and they leave me knotted up.
> 
> GET OVER THIS FEAR , OR LEAVE GEAR.
> 
> simple as that. You gonna run primo, var, maybe throw in other orals along the way your whole lifting career ? Come on guys , blood sweat and tears. BLOOD was part of that.
> 
> Eat big , train heavy , if you're going to juice - do it fucking right - and stop with the bullshit kleenex moments. This is a steroid section, I speak in many other places on BL and I am a kind guy. But w/juice their is simply no in between - either do it right and do it REAL right , or fucking leave it alone. I'm so fed up with the shit that gets posted on here.
> 
> I'll gladly help anyone w/any cycle questions - and I don't mind reading the questions, it's the stubborn "well I'm gonna just run orals for awhile to see how my body responds" ... okay ??? READ - RESEARCH.
> 
> I'm going to try to host the anabolics2009.pdf and update this thread.. those of you with 698 pages of reading ability who care about your bodies and steroids... this shit is crucial.
> 
> No matter what , above all else, please be safe, these are not your 1-ad tabs. I'm not saying you'll get huge , turn into a nutcase , but look - I've done things on test / tren / dbol / drol - that I wouldn't have done otherwise ... that's a fact. And I've been around gear a long ass time. Be safe, be wise, read a lot.



>if you juice you should be getting as big as fucking possible

No. If you juice you should do exactly what you feel is right for you. 

If you want to get as hyooge as possible that's on you and whatever gaping hole in your life you are trying to make up for. 

If you want to look like dude on men's health, that's perfectly fine. Steroids will get you there quicker and are a great tool for your needs.  Please don't buy into this shit and do as you please. 

Steroids are just drugs. There are guidelines but nothing close to the rules someone like OP would have you believe.


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## PrizeFighter

So found this post very interesting and upon vast amounts of research I decided that the disadvantages to PHs are drawling me more towards the juice. I've done 2 successful cycles of Super DmZ countering with Nolvadex and my own combo for cycle support . Idk if you can PM here but if you have it know a lot about the juice send me a message the info would be yearly appreciated !


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## Genetic Freak

PrizeFighter said:


> So found this post very interesting and upon vast amounts of research I decided that the disadvantages to PHs are drawling me more towards the juice. I've done 2 successful cycles of Super DmZ countering with Nolvadex and my own combo for cycle support . Idk if you can PM here but if you have it know a lot about the juice send me a message the info would be yearly appreciated !



Private Messaging is generally not recommended on here for advice on AAS or PH's..... There are members on here with many decades of compound experience, myself included.. We would be more than happy to answer any question you have on diet, nutrition, training methodology, hormones & peptides...

Any idiot could give you bad or potentially dangerous advice via PM, when kept on open forum there is a greater likely-hood incorrect advice will be picked up and corrected either by a senior member or our very experienced Moderator Guido...


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## -Guido-

PrizeFighter said:


> So found this post very interesting and upon vast amounts of research I decided that the disadvantages to PHs are drawling me more towards the juice. I've done 2 successful cycles of Super DmZ countering with Nolvadex and my own combo for cycle support . Idk if you can PM here but if you have it know a lot about the juice send me a message the info would be yearly appreciated !



Nobody is going to PM you so you can ask for a source so you are dick out of luck.


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## deansmatthew

hello. im 29 y/o, 215 pounds ,jog regulary and gym 4 times a week. is test the best for me as a beginner and can i do oral or should i do injections?


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## OverDone

*Read This*


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## jrc828

I was thinking about juiceing this would be my first time wat should i start out on
Am 45 .250 pounds.6ft 3


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## Genetic Freak

jrc828 said:


> I was thinking about juiceing this would be my first time what should i start out on
> Am 45 *.250 pounds.6ft 3*



Cricky, at 250lbs do you need anything.? What's your body-fat%..?


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## rakketakke

Hello, I want to use steroids at later ages in my life to improve health

Anyone have any interesting links containing health benefits towards, tendons, muscle, blood. Not really interested in bulking, how I see it, i'll use doses for up to two weeks which translates to one daily dose bodybuilders take... Thanks in advance;


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## nolys

Can you clarify what you mean by your dosages? Are you talking about injectable testosterone?

Steroids aren't exactly used to improve your health unless you are a male with a below normal testosterone level. Have you been checked by your gp for a hormone panel?

I wouldn't bother if your not looking to gain weight or have normal hpta function. Benefits are muscle gain, weight loss, increased sexual drive...
More negative outcomes at bodybuilding doses than benefits for somebody not looking to bulk or cut


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## Genetic Freak

rakketakke said:


> Hello, I want to use steroids at later ages in my life to improve health
> 
> Anyone have any interesting links containing health benefits towards, tendons, muscle, blood. Not really interested in bulking, how I see it, i'll use doses for up to two weeks which translates to one daily dose bodybuilders take... Thanks in advance;



Here's a few studys showing the health benefits of AAS, and negatives of low testosterone:

Aversa A, Bruzziches R, Francomano D, et al. Effects of testosterone undecanoate on cardiovascular risk factors and atherosclerosis in middle-aged men with late-onset hypogonadism and metabolic syndrome: results from a 24-month, randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled study. The journal of sexual medicine. 2010;7(10):3495-3503.

Bhasin, S., et al., Testosterone therapy in men with androgen deficiency syndromes: an Endocrine Society clinical practice guideline. J Clin Endocrinol Metab, 2010. 95(6): p. 2536-59.

Boyanov MA, Boneva Z, Christov VG. Testosterone supplementation in men with type 2 diabetes, visceral obesity and partial androgen deficiency. The aging male : the official journal of the International Society for the Study of the Aging Male. 2003;6(1):1-7.

Buvat, J., et al., Endocrine aspects of male sexual dysfunctions. J Sex Med, 2010. 7(4 Pt 2): p. 1627-56.

Buvat, J., et al., Testosterone deficiency in men: systematic review and standard operating procedures for diagnosis and treatment. J Sex Med, 2013. 10(1): p. 245-84.

Frederiksen L, Hojlund K, Hougaard DM, et al. Testosterone therapy increased muscle mass and lipid oxidation in aging men. Age (Dordr). 2012;34(1):145-156.

Hackett G, Cole N, Bhartia M, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy with long-acting testosterone undecanoate improves sexual function and quality-of-life parameters vs. placebo in a population of men with type 2 diabetes. The journal of sexual medicine. 2013;10(6):1612-1627.

Haider A, Yassin A, Doros G, et al. Effects of Long-Term Testosterone Therapy on Patients with ?Diabesity?: Results of Observational Studies of Pooled Analyses in Obese Hypogonadal Men with Type 2 Diabetes. International journal of endocrinology. 2014:Article ID 683515.

Harkonen, K., et al., The polymorphic androgen receptor gene CAG repeat, pituitary-testicular function and andropaGloball symptoms in ageing men. Int J Androl, 2003. 26(3): p. 187-94.

Kalinchenko SY, Tishova YA, Mskhalaya GJ, et al. Effects of testosterone supplementation on markers of the metabolic syndrome and inflammation in hypogonadal men with the metabolic syndrome: the double-blinded placebo-controlled Moscow study. Clinical endocrinology. 2010;73(5):602-612.

Kapoor D, Goodwin E, Channer KS, et al. Testosterone replacement therapy improves insulin resistance, glycaemic control, visceral adiposity and hypercholesterolaemia in hypogonadal men with type 2 diabetes. European journal of endocrinology / European Federation of Endocrine Societies. 2006;154(6):899-906.

Khaw, K.T., et al., Endogenous testosterone and mortality due to all causes, cardiovascular disease, and cancer in men: European prospective investigation into cancer in Norfolk (EPIC-Norfolk) Prospective Population Study. Circulation, 2007. 116(23): p. 2694-701.

Kvorning T, Christensen LL, Madsen K, et al. Mechanical muscle function and lean body mass during supervised strength training and testosterone therapy in aging men with low-normal testosterone levels. Journal of the American Geriatrics Society. 2013;61(6):957-962.

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## metallos23

can you plese send me a website that I an order cyponate legititmately please I really need help I would appreciate this favor so much.


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## Genetic Freak

metallos23 said:


> can you please send me a website that I an order cypionate legitimately please I really need help I would appreciate this favor so much.



Sorry, we can't advise on here, its against the rules.... If its for hormone replacement, go see your Dr...!!


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## nolys

Gf would you agree supplementing aas with normal hpta function for health benefits is a waste of time?


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## Philosoraptor

Roid rage is a laughable myth.


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## Genetic Freak

nolys said:


> Gf would you agree supplementing aas with *normal hpta function* for *health benefits* is a waste of time?



If you are showing normal levels, you should be experiencing health benefits associated with normal function... Any addition of AAS would likely stimulate some negative feedback to your HPTA... You might be able to lessen or negate feedback by careful timing of testosterone-no-ester injections or fast acting orals to co-incide with the bodies natural pusile release of test, may-be as low as 5mg/day... Would be an interesting experiment, but could involve a cost prohibitive amount of blood tests to prove of disprove.. Anyone here with normal HPTA function...lol..?


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## Genetic Freak

Philosoraptor said:


> *Roid rage is a laughable myth*.



As someone who has been through the court system many time for offences against the person whilst on AAS, I might be inclined to disagree.. 
I believe it has been shown "roid rage" can be person dependant, the more you are disposed towards violence without AAS the more you are likely to be whilst taking them, IMO...


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## Scottish Stu

I've been in prison/court 2many times for fighting
So I'm keeping an eye on my temper!!


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