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Advice How do you decide whether to have children or not?

Avoided it like the plague šŸ˜‚
Deep down I want to be a mother I started feeling it a couple of years ago it's a distinct feeling because my circumstances aren't right... but I'm glad I've put my selfishness aside cause I wanna at least know someone an wouldn't have kids with someone for the sake of it etc. Never wanted to be an 'older mum' but I'd love that now. If I can't I suppose that's my fate. But I have a feeling it's not. Definitely wanna be financially stable also.
 
negrogesic said:
how wise is it to bring a human into existence given the state of things?
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Has it ever been wise? Sure, shit is going south fast in our day and age, but I doubt having a kid during medieval times was a walk in the park?
Or any other time, for that matter.

I'm not taking a jab at you @negrogesic - I'm just "thinking" out loud here - if anything, you have my respect for thinking one step further than "babies are so f***** cute", which seems to be how the reasoning generally goes.

I'm yet to hear a single good argument for creating a human life.
 
I'm yet to hear a single good argument for creating a human life.
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That sentence reeks of depression. If we stop reproducing, the human race will die. Do you want the human race to die?

If sustaining our species is not a good reason, not sure what else I can say about that.

I said having kids is one of the most selfless things, but I don't mean the act of reproduction. I mean the amount of money and time (and brain cells) you must sacrifice in order to be a good parent.

Most of us had parents growing up. We had people that made sacrifices for us. If you chose not to have kids, you are (most likely) not paying that forward, so to speak.

I care more about my family than I do every other species on the planet combined. That is healthy. We are supposed to care more about human babies than sharks.

I am not concerned about the population. I don't see humans as a negative force in the universe. On the contrary, we are extraordinarily beautiful.

The simplicity of nature appeals to us, because we are so complex... but it is not more important than us. We are not evil. We are incredible.
 
birdup.snaildown said:
That sentence reeks of depression. If we stop reproducing, the human race will die. Do you want the human race to die?

If sustaining our species is not a good reason, not sure what else I can say about that.

I said having kids is one of the most selfless things, but I don't mean the act of reproduction. I mean the amount of money and time (and brain cells) you must sacrifice in order to be a good parent.

Most of us had parents growing up. We had people that made sacrifices for us. If you chose not to have kids, you are (most likely) not paying that forward, so to speak.

I care more about my family than I do every other species on the planet combined. That is healthy. We are supposed to care more about human babies than sharks.

I am not concerned about the population. I don't see humans as a negative force in the universe. On the contrary, we are extraordinarily beautiful.

The simplicity of nature appeals to us, because we are so complex... but it is not more important than us. We are not evil. We are incredible.
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The only thing I could spot in here that supports your case, being "having kids is one of the most selfless things", is: kids need a lot of resources, providing for them is selfless.

And even that, would you provide for kids in need other than your own? How selfless is that? The rest you wrote is pretty anthropomorphic too, to avoid the use of the word selfish/self-centered. Same as saying 'this reeks of depression', I could say 'this reeks of a lot of ego'.

But I'm not interested in arguing, just wanted to point that out. Looks like it's a matter of ones horizon/worldview; we/most people are just too close to this topic for a discussion to be productive I feel. Not unlike to faith, there is a shitload of uncouscous stuff going on, and basic biology too in this case..
 
this world is not over yet and not by a long shot.

yes its getting pretty stuffed up with pollution and people struggling for the same resources

but we are not over yet.

what ever you choose do it with all of your heart.
 
bongdong said:
would you provide for kids in need other than your own?
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No. I didn't say it's the most selfless thing you can do. Sacrificing a substantial amount of money and time for poor children in Africa is more selfless. I'm not denying that.

I worry about the world when so many intelligent people are honestly arguing against the continuation of our own species.

I didn't want to get into an argument either.

You're right. I could have worded it better. When I described being a (devoted) parent as selfless, I didn't intend the sentence to be deconstructed. I couldn't be bothered rewording it.

I think you get my point.

Saying there is no reasonable argument for the continuation of our species is depressing. There are billions of reasonable arguments.
 
birdup.snaildown said:
That sentence reeks of depression.
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I don't even know what to answer to this. Good to know where you set the bar though. And yet you couldn't offer up a single reason?
birdup.snaildown said:
If we stop reproducing, the human race will die. Do you want the human race to die?
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For the sake of every other life, sure. But honestly, I don't care one way or the other. I'm guessing you do.
birdup.snaildown said:
If sustaining our species is not a good reason, not sure what else I can say about that.
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Same here.
birdup.snaildown said:
I said having kids is one of the most selfless things, but I don't mean the act of reproduction.
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It's a very selfish act. To believe it is something else is to be deluded.
birdup.snaildown said:
I mean the amount of money and time (and brain cells) you must sacrifice in order to be a good parent.
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Are you saying that spending time and money on a kid you created yourself is selfless? Puh-lease, that's the bear minimum to be a parent.
birdup.snaildown said:
Most of us had parents growing up. We had people that made sacrifices for us. If you chose not to have kids, you are (most likely) not paying that forward, so to speak.
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Continuing to do something because it's tradition or because "that's how it's always been" is the worst reason to do something.
birdup.snaildown said:
I care more about my family than I do every other species on the planet combined. That is healthy. We are supposed to care more about human babies than sharks.
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Same here. I would kill everyone else on the planet for my family, in case it was a competition of who loves their family the most.
birdup.snaildown said:
I am not concerned about the population. I don't see humans as a negative force in the universe.
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Me neither. I don't see us as positive or negative. We just are.
birdup.snaildown said:
On the contrary, we are extraordinarily beautiful.
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Agree to disagree.
birdup.snaildown said:
We are not evil. We are incredible.
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Agree to disagree.
 
assclass said:
Having kids and stealing them are two different things.
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Of course. Having kids is creating a need instead of taking care of an existing one.
assclass said:
I also want to raise my biological offspring to be assassins'. Kidnapping doesn't solve all my problems.
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Cool. You'll be good parent, I can tell these things. Kidnapping rarely solves any problems. Good luck getting your assassins.
 
tubgirl.jpg said:
It's a very selfish act.
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I've never heard a parent say that. It's just something people who don't have kids tell themselves. Try actually raising a child and then tell me it's selfish.

It is unlikely - if you don't have any kids - that you're never going to make the same sacrifices for someone else's kids. Some people do. Those who devote decades to charity. They are far and few between.

Have you devoted unpaid decades of your life to someone else?

What do you do for other people? Most people I know who don't want kids just live life for themselves... Maybe you're one of the exceptions?

I know a lot of people who have children with major disabilities. Their sacrifice is often extraordinary. I've known many mothers, in particular, who continue to care for their disabled children until they are so old they physically can't do it anymore. I guess you think these people are selfish?

Continuing to do something because it's tradition or because "that's how it's always been" is the worst reason to do something.
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That's not at all what I was saying. You can pay it forward in other ways. But, like I said, most people don't.
 
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Maybe if i were a guy i would not think so much of it - they generally dont, thats facts.
Being the one that will have to sacrifice her freedom and her body for it makes me think twice about it
Especially since i arrived at a third world country where people with five mental disorders think its no biggie to bring five poor souls over, while being single parents, that they will never be able to raise right since they cant even raise themselves
Even 1 percenters have kids indiscriminately as if they were adopting a hampster - just give them food, water, and a roof, let the little pricks raise themselves lol - humans are not pets.
 
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