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Treatment The Role of ‘Tough Love’ in Recovery

Jabberwocky

Frumious Bandersnatch
Joined
Nov 3, 1999
Messages
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I’d like to know people’s experience with their family applying ‘tough love’ to them in an effort to stop their addiction or drug-related behaviour.

By tough love I mean drawing very hard boundaries about what is required to be welcome in the family home or receive any kind of support from the family. This includes the withdrawal of any kind of material or emotional support that might enable the addict to continue their adiction.

I also mean unambiguosly placing responsibility for the addicts problems on the shoulders of the addict and denying them any status as victim. That is, telling them they’ve fucked up their life and it’s on them to turn it around.

It’s different to just kicking the addict out and abandoning them. Rather it offers help but makes it highly conditional and not-negotiable.

Have you been subject to tough love or ever applied it yourself to someone close to you? How did it play out in the end?
 
@Atelier3
My sister applied it to me when i was kicked out rehab.
My mum wouldn't take me back. My dad couldn't. So my younger sister took me in but there was plenty boundries;
No getting fucked at the house
No coming back to the house fucked
No bringing sluts back
No more than 1 SOBER friend back if I wanted to ie play ps4 with them
No smoking inside
No sleeping in all day
No loud music
Chip in for bills/food/internet
Etc
It sucked but it worked for a bit. Then i became disrespectful and rebelled and started using while she was at work, she worked a few night shifts so perfect opportunity to cook k in her glass bowl in the microwave, then hide all evidence like it was a murder scene.
Or going out getting fucked when i knew she had work early so she'd be sound asleep by 11pm and I'd come back at 1-3am and tip toe in then carry on sniffing in my room and pissing in bottles until i heard her leave at 6am.
If she'd have found out i would have been homeless.

I started seeing a girl and was spending alot of time staying at hers and staying at my mates. Then after a year or so my sister moved from the city to the countryside and i had to move back to my hometown with my mum whose boundries were even stricter ie no friends back or nothing and she'd be welll on my case, if I even blew my nose she'd give me 100 questions. Wouldn't lend me money, would ask what was in my bag if i came home with a backpack, walk into my room fast without knocking, etc (rehab told her to do all of this).

It was hard but I still found a way to use. Mainly by staying out at friends places.
Then i moved in with a girl and lived there for 2 years. Left her in May this year and was forced to move back to mothers where the same boundries apply and if i got caught using id be homeless, but i still occasionally use when shes asleep.
Even needles. I have to be so careful though. If she came downstairs after hearing me say fall off my seat or knock something over after an IV hit (which has happened plenty of times) and saw me unresponsive with a needle in my hand or still in my arm if she didnt die from a heart attack (shes not a user shes straight edge as fuck) she'd kick my ass then kick me out regardless!

So yeah, in the end it didn't work for me it just made me have to work harder at hiding my use, and lie more.
 
why the fuck not getting fucked , i want to be fucked , natural rewards will give me some relive from depression that will make me relapse on drugs
I just took that test in your signature and aparantly i need medication 🤔
 
my parents applied tough love after the softly softly approach failed.

i'd lost my job and they'd been paying my mortgage and bills for months because they just didn't know what they could do and thought making me homeless would make things worse (which it would have). then my mum went to a support group and told her they were enabling me, which to be fair they were.

so they booked me into rehab and changed the locks to my house. if i'd have been renting they couldn't have done that and i'm not sure how they would have made me go to rehab if they hadn't had that amount of leverage over me, cos i just didn't want to go. i didn't think i was bad enough to need rehab and i didn't want to stop anyway cos i was convinced that not using would feel like when you've already been waiting for the dealer for 10 mins, forever with no relief.

even at that point the only reason i went rather than fending for myself on the streets was cos i was prostituting myself from my home, which is far safer and more lucrative than doing it off the street. so i wouldn't be able to make anywhere near as much money and the idea of having to use so much less felt almost as bad as not using at all.
 
I'm dubious about it. On the one hand it's essential for the loved ones of an addict to draw boundaries to stop themselves from being manipulated or hurt by the addict. That's just them taking care of themselves and not letting the addict ruin their life as well. However, tough love for its own sake - interventions etc - I think will rarely, if ever, work and actually are probably counter-productive. We all remember what it's like to be an addict who doesn't want to stop. When someone tries to intervene with some "tough love" and try to tell us that we can't do what we're doing, how would we react? I know I for one would immediately think "fuck you!" and do it anyway. I don't think anyone else can give someone the desire to change if they don't want to. When I was sent to rehab since it was the only alternative to homelessness, I had 7 months of being completely immersed in recovery, but since I wasn't really ready I relapsed at the first opportunity. If the addict wants recovery then the "tough love" doesn't serve a purpose except maybe upsetting them/making them defensive which could lead to them using, and if the addict doesn't want recovery then "tough love" isn't going to change that - they will either get defensive or just hide their use, which is totally counter-productive. Considering that, what's the point of it?
 
If the addict wants recovery then the "tough love" doesn't serve a purpose except maybe upsetting them/making them defensive which could lead to them using, and if the addict doesn't want recovery then "tough love" isn't going to change that - they will either get defensive or just hide their use, which is totally counter-productive. Considering that, what's the point of it?
I agree
 
Only love can save you from addiction, depending on which kind of substance you're taking. As difficult as stopping taking drugs is to find a truly supportive surrounding environment.
 
My mother became an alcoholic when I was about 6. My father was always one, he left my mother when I was 3 and moved to London. Great in a way because I got 6 yearly trips to the capital which I enjoyed very much. Bad because it’s what broke my mother the most I think.

She used to leave me alone at 6 and sneak out of her bedroom window at night to go drinking. I’m an only child and although family were living in the same town they were more than a short walk away. We had landlines but no numbers written down and I knew not to call the police because I was afraid she would get in trouble. So I played piano until she came stumbling in through the door whenever that may have been.

That continued through my life whilst living with her, she drank during the day, hid the booze in water bottles etc etc etc made a fool of herself, got so many DUIs she was told she was never allowed to drive again in her lifetime. Came home with busted lips, noses, concussions. Came home with random men (who I chased, duh).

I was left to look after my grandmother who was bedbound because my mother was too inebriated to carry out any proper care. I learnt how to change a colostomy bag at 9 and change over a catheter at 12 out of necessity. Which I didn’t mind of course, my grandmother was everything to me and although she had dementia she knew who I was.

My aunts didn’t know what to do with my mother, they sent her to rehabs, they moved me from one aunt to the other when she was being physically abusive to me during her blackouts but she never could stop drinking. With everything laid out, she never stopped.

It got to the stage where she attempted suicide every time she binged at the weekends. I was around 14 when she first tried to kill herself, I came home and found her passed out in the hallway and found the 20 packets or so of APAP along with the 3 bottles of vodka. That became a common occurrence until I left at about 17. I think it was the third or fourth time she did that that my brain just said enough. I grieved for her even though she was still alive, my brain literally did that out of necessity, to protect itself because I don’t think I could have taken seeing her near deaths door again and still been sane, if that makes sense.

My mother had so many opportunities to recover. We aren’t poor so she had the best therapists, the best rehabs. We tried loving her, giving her boundaries, tough love in regards to taking away her right to see me and her mother, none of it worked. I had her declared unfit and I took control of the estate, she was given a weekly allowance and moved to a property more suiting to her whims, meaning she loved smashing things up.

I always kept in contact with her, even though when she was drinking she was a very twisted horrible person that started seeping out into her everyday being. I called most days, visited every week a few times and made sure she had something to recover for. When my son was born I was sure she would want to recover so that she could enjoy being a granny and for a while she seemed to pull herself together. Of course it didn’t last long.

So I guess here’s where the real tough love came along. Emotionally I was already disconnected from her, I didn’t want to see my son have to witness her drunk or worry about her the way I used to as a child. She was given an ultimatum. Either she go to a rehab and stop drinking or I and my son would no longer be a part of her life and she would essentially be dead to me. She chose the latter.

She’s probably lonely and sad and in pain and sick but she’s not my problem anymore. I gave decades of my life trying to help her and picking up the pieces and it didn’t work.

My father died when he was 53 from alcoholism, he literally shat out his insides, he haemorrhaged to death from his back passage. A proper drinkers death and I can still smell it sometimes if I think about it hard enough. Nothing we tried to get him help worked either, even cutting him off.

I think there will always be addicts that will stay the course. Tough love won’t work, being loving and kind won’t work, nothing will work and they are destined to have their drug of choice end their lives. How sad that is and I’m not ignorant to the fact that my mother and father must have been so broken and sad to have chosen alcohol over facing their issues and I do wish I had found a way to help them but that’s life.
 
My mother became an alcoholic when I was about 6. My father was always one, he left my mother when I was 3 and moved to London. Great in a way because I got 6 yearly trips to the capital which I enjoyed very much. Bad because it’s what broke my mother the most I think.

She used to leave me alone at 6 and sneak out of her bedroom window at night to go drinking. I’m an only child and although family were living in the same town they were more than a short walk away. We had landlines but no numbers written down and I knew not to call the police because I was afraid she would get in trouble. So I played piano until she came stumbling in through the door whenever that may have been.

That continued through my life whilst living with her, she drank during the day, hid the booze in water bottles etc etc etc made a fool of herself, got so many DUIs she was told she was never allowed to drive again in her lifetime. Came home with busted lips, noses, concussions. Came home with random men (who I chased, duh).

I was left to look after my grandmother who was bedbound because my mother was too inebriated to carry out any proper care. I learnt how to change a colostomy bag at 9 and change over a catheter at 12 out of necessity. Which I didn’t mind of course, my grandmother was everything to me and although she had dementia she knew who I was.

My aunts didn’t know what to do with my mother, they sent her to rehabs, they moved me from one aunt to the other when she was being physically abusive to me during her blackouts but she never could stop drinking. With everything laid out, she never stopped.

It got to the stage where she attempted suicide every time she binged at the weekends. I was around 14 when she first tried to kill herself, I came home and found her passed out in the hallway and found the 20 packets or so of APAP along with the 3 bottles of vodka. That became a common occurrence until I left at about 17. I think it was the third or fourth time she did that that my brain just said enough. I grieved for her even though she was still alive, my brain literally did that out of necessity, to protect itself because I don’t think I could have taken seeing her near deaths door again and still been sane, if that makes sense.

My mother had so many opportunities to recover. We aren’t poor so she had the best therapists, the best rehabs. We tried loving her, giving her boundaries, tough love in regards to taking away her right to see me and her mother, none of it worked. I had her declared unfit and I took control of the estate, she was given a weekly allowance and moved to a property more suiting to her whims, meaning she loved smashing things up.

I always kept in contact with her, even though when she was drinking she was a very twisted horrible person that started seeping out into her everyday being. I called most days, visited every week a few times and made sure she had something to recover for. When my son was born I was sure she would want to recover so that she could enjoy being a granny and for a while she seemed to pull herself together. Of course it didn’t last long.

So I guess here’s where the real tough love came along. Emotionally I was already disconnected from her, I didn’t want to see my son have to witness her drunk or worry about her the way I used to as a child. She was given an ultimatum. Either she go to a rehab and stop drinking or I and my son would no longer be a part of her life and she would essentially be dead to me. She chose the latter.

She’s probably lonely and sad and in pain and sick but she’s not my problem anymore. I gave decades of my life trying to help her and picking up the pieces and it didn’t work.

My father died when he was 53 from alcoholism, he literally shat out his insides, he haemorrhaged to death from his back passage. A proper drinkers death and I can still smell it sometimes if I think about it hard enough. Nothing we tried to get him help worked either, even cutting him off.

I think there will always be addicts that will stay the course. Tough love won’t work, being loving and kind won’t work, nothing will work and they are destined to have their drug of choice end their lives. How sad that is and I’m not ignorant to the fact that my mother and father must have been so broken and sad to have chosen alcohol over facing their issues and I do wish I had found a way to help them but that’s life.

Jesus man, that's really tough. It sounds like you've made peace with your past though and have a really mature & sensible perspective on it. Since both your parents were alcoholics, what is your relationship with alcohol like? Do you have their addictive tendencies?? I imagine coming from that environment and with their genes would make you hyper aware of the risks of alcoholism, but unfortunately that doesn't stop many alcoholics who grew up watching parents drink themselves to death from following the same path. My uncle is going through that right now - both his parents were also alcoholics and were killed by it, and he's a serious alcoholic in denial. His denial bizarrely extends now to denying that his parents were ever alcoholics - he has retconned his own memory and when it's bought up he now just claims his parents (who both died from liver failure) just "liked a drink". I guess he's so similar to them now that he can't admit the obvious.
 
Jesus man, that's really tough. It sounds like you've made peace with your past though and have a really mature & sensible perspective on it. Since both your parents were alcoholics, what is your relationship with alcohol like? Do you have their addictive tendencies?? I imagine coming from that environment and with their genes would make you hyper aware of the risks of alcoholism, but unfortunately that doesn't stop many alcoholics who grew up watching parents drink themselves to death from following the same path. My uncle is going through that right now - both his parents were also alcoholics and were killed by it, and he's a serious alcoholic in denial. His denial bizarrely extends now to denying that his parents were ever alcoholics - he has retconned his own memory and when it's bought up he now just claims his parents (who both died from liver failure) just "liked a drink". I guess he's so similar to them now that he can't admit the obvious.
I went through a lot of therapy to deal with my childhood and I don’t dwell on it now at all. I was adopted so I don’t have those genes and I was never a big drinker. I had my years drinking during my 20s like everyone but I am not a fan of alcohol now. I’ll take a few drinks but I won’t get to that drunk stage. I’ve always been careful with alcohol and drugs due to my parents. I thankfully don’t have an addictive personality.
 
@Rio Fantastic I didn't read the OP as suggesting forcing people into recovery as 'tough love' though my initial response probably makes it look that way. i completely agree that the motivation ultimately has to come from the addict. in my case i think i got lucky that things had been shit enough for long enough by the time i was given an ultimatum that my life was significantly better by like week 3 of rehab, so i came out after 2 months willing to put the work in.

@MsDiz that was quite a harrowing read but it sounds like you made the right decision.

my boyfriend has been through similar, he found out his mum was an alcoholic when he didn't get picked up from school one day, not sure how he got home but when he did he found her passed out and thought she was dead. being in the house when she'd been bingeing for a few months was like being in a house where someone has just died, can't imagine having to live with it. he had the same indecision about whether to cut her out or not. in the end he didn't which is for the best cos she is now in long term recovery and (don't tell AA) is even able to have the odd drink without it spiralling- before she'd do 6 months to a year sober then have one glass of something then it'd be another 6 months to a year of 2 bottles of whisky a day, until she was close enough to death that paramedics would take her to detox. they never tried tough love with her, to get back on topic, unless you count imprisoning her to force her into withdrawals so the NHS had to help.
 
I have had some success with tough love.

Had a mate who became violent every time he drank. So we all stopped meeting up with him. We'd go drinking without him, etc. Then started the stories of how he missed all his crew. Then came.....well then, all of a sudden he had learnt how to behave when having a few pints! He has now actually stopped drinking, a few years later due to creeping liver issues. Almost completely. Still drinks a few pints on special occasions, but for someone who drank every single day of their life since 15 years of age, I'm fucking proud of him.
Still knows how to behave as well, when he does drink.

Then I have an ex-bf who became addicted to meth right after I moved in with him. I tried for months to get him to give it up as it caused him to fail school, he didn't have a job, etc. Then I started doing it myself. Well, once I was finally able to snap myself out of it, 8 months later, I gave him an ultimatum: stop now or I'm out. He quit right then and there......until years later. Now, he's using again, or was in the last few years, I've been told. He has severe PTSD from childhood so he's a bit of a work in progress. Mixed result, at best.

Another friend has been psychologically destroyed by meth abuse for almost a decade now. She's bipolar and is in near-constant manic psychosis. When she first started getting really bad, a bunch of us tried helping her. Nothing crazy....we were all drug users as well. No advice helped. Slowly, we tried to get tougher on her. Simply by telling her honestly what a mess her life had become. This didn't help, obviously. I'm not sure what others of our crew did and said but I know that I told her a few things to try and set some boundaries.

First, I told her that it was extremely disrespectful of other people's time for her to show up everywhere hours late. She was insulted by this.
Then I told her that she really needed to stop using as she was becoming a mess. Her romantic relationships were an abusive horror show. Please stop.
Nothing.
Lastly, I told her that I couldn't have her psychosis in my own life as I had my own mental health problems that took serious work to keep suppressed and being around someone like her was detrimental to my mind and soul. Not least of all because it reminded me of my ex-bf who was psychosis city back when.

Anyway, she got horribly offended and what ended up happening was she gravitated towards her new friends who all enabled her behaviour, seeing her manic psychosis as exuberance, I fucking kid you not.
A year later, a few our mates found her in a park, nake, bloody and with no recollection that her landlord had locked her out a week prior due to her having failed to pay the rent for months.

She ended up in hospital that day. Stayed for a month. Got out. Seemed to be doing well for a couple of years, only for us to recently learn that she has been using the whole time and kicked it up a notch last spring. Becoming homeless again by October.
Back in March I told her to reconsider and reminded her about what happened last time and that I couldn't have someone like that in my life for the sake of my own wellness. She's still upset at me.
Tough love fail.

TLDR: Tough love kinda works sometimes, maybe, I guess.
 
I'm dubious about it. On the one hand it's essential for the loved ones of an addict to draw boundaries to stop themselves from being manipulated or hurt by the addict.
That's been the main purpose of it in my life, I think. I mean, I obviously care about the person I've tried setting boundaries with, but I've always done it with self-preservation in mind, coming from a place of depression and suicidal ideation myself.


If the addict wants recovery then the "tough love" doesn't serve a purpose except maybe upsetting them/making them defensive which could lead to them using, and if the addict doesn't want recovery then "tough love" isn't going to change that - they will either get defensive or just hide their use, which is totally counter-productive. Considering that, what's the point of it?

See above. ;)


The "tough love" I gave both people in my meth abuser examples was more along the lines of being honest with them about how fucked up they were, in the hopes that might kindle some bit of introspection on their part. As well as asserting boundaries for myself.
Addicts can bring down those around them quite easily, given half the chance.
 
Tangentially related:

I just got back from driving my mate from downstairs to the hospital. One of my best mates.....he's been the main one I've spent time with since the plague started because we live in the same apartment block.
He's been short of breath and coughing for three weeks. Condition kept worsening. Today, he said he had a hard time walking and talking because of shortness of breath. Dude's got lung disease and asthma and is diabetic and overweight. Has smoked meth on and off longer than I've known him (16 years).
I've been telling him to go see a doctor since three weeks ago. He finally went and got a plague test this past week, but still didn't go see a doctor.
We have public health insurance.

What I'm saying is: no matter how much you try, it's just impossible to help people sometimes. You can implore. You can reason. Nag. Cajole. Threaten. Doesn't matter, sometimes people just have different priorities for themselves and ultimately it's up to each individual to want to help themselves before any change can be affected. I guess.

I don't know, I've had so much "carnage" around me the last 15 years. Overdose deaths, psychotic breaks, severe mental illness, homelessness. It's depressing....and moreso when you try to help but they don't take the advice/help/suggestions/pointers in right directions....and even moreso when you have your own mental health fragilities.
 
I think tough love comes about as protective mechanism from an addict’s behavior, as described in the posts above so eloquently. I don’t think it is a successful tactic to get an addict to quit anything, but it is more about someone ‘quitting’ the addict and getting away from their destructive arc.
 
The worst tough love i have seen or exp was my mate ( and me ) getting tazed by the cops, locked up. Appearing in the court the next day and given the choice of either 1 year rehab or 2 years jail time. My mate took the first option, Till today he doen't want to talk to any of his family members or friends as he feels super betrayed and especially by me.. But fuck i got tazed and locked up with him. So it was a very uncomfortable and physical night in the cells with him but it was for the best. Guess that qualifies as tough love. Whether it worked or is working will have to see. His been in rehab for about 4 month's now and still refuses any connect with anyone. I just pray and hope for the best for him.
 
I think tough love comes about as protective mechanism from an addict’s behavior, as described in the posts above so eloquently. I don’t think it is a successful tactic to get an addict to quit anything, but it is more about someone ‘quitting’ the addict and getting away from their destructive arc.
I think this is true. I rationalised my eventual throwing my kid out of home and cutting off all financial support as an effort to not provide anything that would enable his addiction(s). However, as I thought about it more I realised I had just really got to the point where I needed to protect my own mental health. Both for my own sake and so I could be the best parent possible for my other much younger kid. It took many years of endless love and support before I got to that point though and meanwhile he just used that love and support as fuel for his addictions and delinquency.
 
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